Xbox 361, who's buying? (Link added with additional pics)

[jmiller80]

http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/05/the-second-xbox-360-revealed-codename-zephyr/

Rumored cooler chip, bigger hard drive, HDMI. Hopefully, this means the lawnmower of next gen will be quieter, but that means a different DVD drive.

I'm a little ambivalent about a console upgrade so soon, but maybe I could get a higher trade-in value for the current 360. Thoughts?

Is anyone interested? What else would you want to justify the "upgrade?" Built in HD-DVD?


DaPhatty Edit: More Pictures. Seems like the proof is in the pudding.

http://www.xbox-scene.com/xbox1data/sep/EEylpyZkVpwzemjZKk.php

J Edit:
As noted in the second link, the pictured device is some sort of dev kit build.


J Edit:
Confirmed by MS employee.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6163965.html

GS: What can you tell us about the HDMI-enabled Xbox 360 rumors that have been going around?

CS: We're always working on prototypes and new technologies and just playing with stuff in Redmond to see what's interesting. I think at the moment we have the widest available connections on the system. If you want to get great HD, I think we've got a good solution for that. In the future it's interesting to see where standards evolve to. I think one of the problems that the whole industry, us and entertainment, are facing at the moment is we're in this world where standards are evolving very quickly.

We have different high-definition standards for discs that we know are competing at the moment. We think HD-DVD is going to be the right way to go, but really it's all about choice in that system so that's why we're offering these sort of services with downloads--skip that whole "format wars" problem. With other standards, audiovideo standards, they're evolving very quickly as well. We're obviously keeping an eye on that and saying, "What are the future standards and how do we give consumers the right choice for that?"

At the moment, everything you might have seen is just looking at our experimentation back in Redmond, not really a product that we're thinking about announcing.

As expected, they play it off as MS just trying some new stuff, which is plausible. That fails to explain why one of their trial units got in the hands of someone who would post pictures of it online.

[Indiana]

Well if this is true I want my money back for my 360. This new system better cost more than $399 otherwise I feel like MS sold me up the river. What the hell ever happened to a console is a console. Sure there were like 7 versions of the PS2 but they never ADDED new stuff to the console to make it better, if I can't do 1080p on this version of the console but it will be possible on that version then they need to accept the systems for exchange.

[Cormier6083]

Too late. I already bought mine. Though built in HD-DVD would be very nice.

Sure there were like 7 versions of the PS2 but they never ADDED new stuff to the console to make it better.

Umm... SCPH-5001 added built in IR

[Purkeynator]

I was wondering when they would release this. Now the question is whether they would put in an integrated HD-DVD drive. I would bite on that. I have also heard from a monster rep at Circuit city that they would be releasing an HDMI cable for the current Xbox 360. Whether that is true or not I am not sure.

[mykevermin]

Well if this is true I want my money back for my 360.

Bingo. The fact that Microsoft was already willing to sell you a console that couldn't play all games to full capacity (the Core) indicates to me that, if this system is not rumor (and I'm not buying completely into it based on one photograph), then in the years to come Premium 360 users could just as easily find themselves unable to play certain software.

[javeryh]

I'd probably bite eventually on an integrated HD-DVD drive and a cooler box with less chance of breaking.

[mykevermin]

I was wondering when they would release this. Now the question is whether they would put in an integrated HD-DVD drive. I would bite on that. I have also heard from a monster rep at Circuit city that they would be releasing an HDMI cable for the current Xbox 360. Whether that is true or not I am not sure.

Well, if they do release one with an internal HD-DVD drive, that would do Sony a massive favor. There's no way they could add HDMI, HD-DVD, and a larger (100GB or so) HDD and stay at $400 MSRP. It would do Sony a favor by alleviating the "holy shit that's expensive!" factor when it comes to buying a PS3.

[Indiana]

Too late. I already bought mine. Though built in HD-DVD would be very nice.



Umm... SCPH-5001 added built in IR

Yeah but that didn't make the games look better or add High Def movies.

[Indiana]

Well, if they do release one with an internal HD-DVD drive, that would do Sony a massive favor. There's no way they could add HDMI, HD-DVD, and a larger (100GB or so) HDD and stay at $400 MSRP. It would do Sony a favor by alleviating the "holy shit that's expensive!" factor when it comes to buying a PS3.

I agree if they release a $599 Xbox 360 with HD-DVD, 120GB drive and HDMI they would be helping Sony.

[LV-426RS]

Hopefully it's true and it's the only model they make. I've got a non-sensing IR sensor that's been like that since launch, I'd love to trade it in for a box with more features.

[mykevermin]

I agree if they release a $599 Xbox 360 with HD-DVD, 120GB drive and HDMI they would be helping Sony.

It's quite a conundrum for 360, really. They've pledged to embrace the HD-DVD format, and that's fine (esp. since the player is both optional and reasonably priced). However, they've also pledged (and I don't really fully believe this for the long-term future of the 360) that the HD-DVD will only be used for movies, and never for games.

If they choose to integrate it, and add the other things people want, they've easily constructed a $500 console (I'd say it's premature to say it would be $600 - especially b/c MS can weather losses better than Sony, and they're well aware of the backlash of pricing a system that high). Anyway, if they integrate it and allow it to be used for games, they've alienated the just-shy-of-10-million people who currently own a 360, and shown that consumers can't rely on a 360 for the duration of its lifespan based on on the system itself, but the bureaucratic decisions of the company.

OTOH, if they merely integrate it as a movie player (just as likely), they have a system that's closer in price to the PS3, but gives Sony the size advantage because that storage can be used for the PS3 titles, but not the 360.

It's a major catch-22. Personally, I'd like a larger HDD for the 360 and that's about it. I don't see why HDMI is so bloomin' necessary, since the 360 *could* feasibly achieve 1080p over component (it does already for games, doesn't it?). Moreover, if they're committed to not using HD-DVD as a gaming format, it may not serve them well to integrate it (unless the end strategy is to create three-tiers of consoles for consumers to purchase from - yikes).

[jmiller80]

This definitely one to file under the rumor heading.

The picture lends credibility (if authentic), but doesn't say much other than that this is one possible direction they are working on (as you would expect). Remember all those cosmetic design iterations for the 360? This could be the same thing on the nuts-and-bolts hardware side. Or it could be a new devkit.

MS isn't alone in this endeavor/folly. See the PS3.5 or PS3X comments, as it were.

http://www.joystiq.com/2006/12/20/ken-kutaragi-talks-av-centric-ps3-uh-psx3-ps3x/

[CrimsonPaw]

It's quite a conundrum for 360, really. They've pledged to embrace the HD-DVD format, and that's fine (esp. since the player is both optional and reasonably priced). However, they've also pledged (and I don't really fully believe this for the long-term future of the 360) that the HD-DVD will only be used for movies, and never for games.

If they choose to integrate it, and add the other things people want, they've easily constructed a $500 console (I'd say it's premature to say it would be $600 - especially b/c MS can weather losses better than Sony, and they're well aware of the backlash of pricing a system that high). Anyway, if they integrate it and allow it to be used for games, they've alienated the just-shy-of-10-million people who currently own a 360, and shown that consumers can't rely on a 360 for the duration of its lifespan based on on the system itself, but the bureaucratic decisions of the company.

OTOH, if they merely integrate it as a movie player (just as likely), they have a system that's closer in price to the PS3, but gives Sony the size advantage because that storage can be used for the PS3 titles, but not the 360.

It's a major catch-22. Personally, I'd like a larger HDD for the 360 and that's about it. I don't see why HDMI is so bloomin' necessary, since the 360 *could* feasibly achieve 1080p over component (it does already for games, doesn't it?). Moreover, if they're committed to not using HD-DVD as a gaming format, it may not serve them well to integrate it (unless the end strategy is to create three-tiers of consoles for consumers to purchase from - yikes).
Well spoken; I would think that this is something MS would want to put under their hat for the next generation of XBox. Right now their foot hold is still blossoming, to introduce new "standards" will send a rift through their market and possibly splinter the relationship not only with the "long term" owners (those that were able to get a console in the first six months) but also those of us who have just recently made the switch over.

I agree that a larger hard drive would be nice, but let's be realistic, the thing needs to be released at the SAME price the 20 GB is at now. I can't see where anyone will want to spend $200 on a 100 GB HDD ... I'll just clean mine off when it gets to capacity thank you.

As for the HD-DVD, if they want to make this a standard format they're going to NEED to drop the price of the add-on unit. Again, I spent $400 on my box already, I'm not ready to drop another $200 to play the newest games; they might as well call it a PC then.

Also, 1080P is achieveable and looks damn good from my understanding. A guy at work just got a 360 and a 56" 1080P DLP and all he could do is roll his eyes back when describing how beautiful the pciture was.

Finally, IMO, the one thing MS should be doing to get more people into the 360 ... SUPPORT KB/MOUSE!!! You have the USB ports and the ability to update the system, PLEASE add this support in, I can only image how sweet the FPSs would be.

There you go, my $.02 with a $.01 tip.

[ArthurDigbySellers]

Seems like this is going to be the new trend...the Appleization of consoles. Release a new update every year or so with just enough new features to woo new buyers and get current owners to rebuy, but not enough new features to alienate those who purchased the now outdated version.

The PS3 and the Wii are getting the same treatment as well.

I don't think Microsoft is stupid enough to start using HD-DVD as their media of choice for games, however. As others have stated, forcing someone to buy the $200 HD-DVD drive just to play games in the future would not sit will with most 360 owners.

Microsoft has being very clear about the HD-DVD drive. They want it to be optional and they want it only for movies. Recent Microsoft comments about not wanting to force people to buy something (HD-DVD drive) that might become the next Betamax is a pretty good indication of what their stance is on the HD-DVD player.

"Betamax" comment linked: http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/360/microsoft-rep-says-hddvd-the-next-betamax-226205.php

[ncibob]

I wonder if this is why there has been a delay for the release of the 65nm chip model?

[mykevermin]

I agree that a larger hard drive would be nice, but let's be realistic, the thing needs to be released at the SAME price the 20 GB is at now. I can't see where anyone will want to spend $200 on a 100 GB HDD ... I'll just clean mine off when it gets to capacity thank you.

If they can drop the price of the 20GB to $50 (because let's face it: people can make due with the 20GB very easily), and sell the 100GB for $100 (I don't know if that's even reasonable for the size drive, really), they'll be in a nice spot - a fully functional 360 can be had for $350 (Core+20GB HDD), and people who really want to use the space can upgrade to the 100GB for the same cost as the old drives.

[jmiller80]

I think an integrated HD-DVD would work along lines of the Blu Ray drive in the PS3 with one difference. The drive can read both DVD and HD-DVD. Games would only come on DVD. HD-DVD would be for movies only.

MS might be able to do a software update to add HD-DVD game support a year later -- but I think printing DVDs is more cost effective than switching to HD-DVD games. Need more space? Use multiple discs or dump some uncompressed data to a bigger hard drive. Even if there were HD-DVD games, I don't think MS would leave us out to dry. It would be silly, but they could print games in two formats -- multiple DVDs and single HD-DVDs (like PC games during the CD --> DVD era).

360 games currently output at 1080p over component. My TV will tell me the resolution and it is 1920x1080. Technically, I think it is rendered in 1080i and upscaled to 1080p, so I'm not sure whether the system can render games in 1080p. The horsepower is probably there, but it might take some programming tricks.

[chakan]

This is exactly what I've been waiting for before buying a 360. That and the fact that I have a huge backlog of last-gen games.

[Cormier6083]

Yeah but that didn't make the games look better or add High Def movies.

Yes but it made my girls gone wild DVD's easier to watch

[peteloaf]

This is very, very funny to me. If this were Nintendo, most people would be lining up to pay full price for a new console just because it's: smaller, in color, a different color, different shape, different cartridge slot, front lit, back lit, has a pokemon sticker, etc. I'm not bashing anybody posting complaints about this, it's just highlighting the difference between Nintendo fans and other fans. Personally, I think it's shitty to re-release a console and expect the early adopters to pay full price, even though we are the reason the consoles are selling. It almost makes me feel as if we paid full price to beta test the hardware.

[neocisco]

Too late. I already bought mine. Though built in HD-DVD would be very nice.



Umm... SCPH-5001 added built in IR

Plus the network adaptor.

[jmiller80]

It almost makes me feel as if we paid full price to beta test the hardware.

Hmmm, I was just thinking the same thing the other day about another console:

http://www.cheapyd.com/forums/showthread.php?t=122803

[DCriminal]

The lack of optical out makes me think that this is a fake. HDMI carries sound, but users need the ability to connect their surround sound system.

[Kendro]

It almost makes me feel as if we paid full price to beta test the hardware.

Bingo.

[ryanbph]

if they released one with hdmi output and the current model doesn't offer hdmi out, then yes I would buy one

[jmiller80]

The lack of optical out makes me think that this is a fake. HDMI carries sound, but users need the ability to connect their surround sound system.

The proprietary top connection has an optical out on the end of the cable that connects to the system. Take a look at the current 360 HD cables -- that's how I have mine outputing 5.1.


Edit:
I think I see your point now. That doesn't solve the problem for people who bypass the receiver and run the HDMI straight to the TV. That's what I'd have to do because my receiver was from before the dawn of HDMI. Perhaps it's time to buy a new receiver, too...

[doubledown]

This WOULD be total BS on Microsofts part. They better give me an upgraded system too. However, I'm perfectly happy with mine now. My TV that I have the 360 on does NOT have HDMI, so not a big deal. The HDD would be nice though and I have HD-DVD already.

[anomynous]

This WOULD be total BS on Microsofts part. They better give me an upgraded system too. However, I'm perfectly happy with mine now. My TV that I have the 360 on does NOT have HDMI, so not a big deal. The HDD would be nice though and I have HD-DVD already.
How old is your TV?

[nintendokid]

I think an integrated HD-DVD would work along lines of the Blu Ray drive in the PS3 with one difference. The drive can read both DVD and HD-DVD. Games would only come on DVD. HD-DVD would be for movies only.

MS might be able to do a software update to add HD-DVD game support a year later -- but I think printing DVDs is more cost effective than switching to HD-DVD games. Need more space? Use multiple discs or dump some uncompressed data to a bigger hard drive. Even if there were HD-DVD games, I don't think MS would leave us out to dry. It would be silly, but they could print games in two formats -- multiple DVDs and single HD-DVDs (like PC games during the CD --> DVD era).

360 games currently output at 1080p over component. My TV will tell me the resolution and it is 1920x1080. Technically, I think it is rendered in 1080i and upscaled to 1080p, so I'm not sure whether the system can render games in 1080p. The horsepower is probably there, but it might take some programming tricks.

Integrated HD-DVD/DVD drive would not work. HD-DVD is still not the base format and still fighting a war with Blu-Ray. It would be costly and risky to integrate a HD-DVD/DVD drive into 360s.

1) the console would no longer be $400 because HD-DVD drives are not cheap to produce.
2) the drive will probably not be as fast as the current DVD drives in 360s right now.
3) printing games in two formats is suicide; regular DVD games would be $60. What should HD-DVD "enhanced" games price for? $70? $80? Absurd.

There is no problem with DVD storage. No developer has ever complained about DVD storage. In-Game graphics are so good now that CG and FMV are no longer needed. They simply use the same graphics engine to produce cutscenes. THere is no longer a need for multple-disc games. Gears of War is the first title to prove that. I would be very suprised if developers are even using 75% of DVD capacity at the moment.

[anomynous]

Integrated HD-DVD/DVD drive would not work. HD-DVD is still not the base format and still fighting a war with Blu-Ray. It would be costly and risky to integrate a HD-DVD/DVD drive into 360s.

1) the console would no longer be $400 because HD-DVD drives are not cheap to produce.
2) the drive will probably not be as fast as the current DVD drives in 360s right now.
3) printing games in two formats is suicide; regular DVD games would be $60. What should HD-DVD "enhanced" games price for? $70? $80? Absurd.

There is no problem with DVD storage. No developer has ever complained about DVD storage. In-Game graphics are so good now that CG and FMV are no longer needed. They simply use the same graphics engine to produce cutscenes. THere is no longer a need for multple-disc games. Gears of War is the first title to prove that. I would be very suprised if developers are even using 75% of DVD capacity at the moment.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: What world do you live in?

[Punk_Raven]

I don't find HD that important seeing as I don't have an HDTV yet (on an xbox 360, but I'm planning on getting one sooner than the HDTV ) but I do support console longevity. One thing they need to add is the four rubber bumpers (http://www.llamma.com/xbox360/news/Xbox-360-Game-Disc-Scratched.htm) on ALL of the DVD drive lids. They were the things that were causing the problem with the 360 scratching game discs. Yeah you shouldn't be moving it in game, but come on people.

While they're in there, maybe they could come up with a better cooling system too. My only problem is if this will be exclusive to premiums and not cores. The core should be able to get just as much technical advancements as the premium, specifically if they promote console longevity.

And yes, 360 owners did get fucked, bad. Microsoft rushed the 360 and are now supposedly putting out a new better one? I know people would be pissed, especially if they last alot long than the old 360s. It is like you beta tested the 360, which sucks. balls. It's a good thing I didn't get one.

Oh and, uh...persoanally..seeing as not alot of people have HDTVs in the first place they should make making sure that the console lives more than it does now a top priority rather than putting in HDMI.

[javeryh]

I just thought of something.... if this new 360 ditches the DVD tray and replaces it with a front loading slot like the Wii then I'm sold. IMAGINE A GREEN LED AROUND THE SLOT!!!!! HOLY SHIT THE NEXT NEXT GEN IS HERE!!!!! Woo hoo!!!!

[Cormier6083]

Plus the network adaptor.


That was SCPH-70001

[CAG 79]

I don't think that they're going to integrate the HD-DVD or a new bigger Hard Drive. They will probably just add the HDMI port and the new chipset and still sell it for the same price that way nobody loses.

[jkam]

It figures...I just bought a 360. I was at first holding out for a newer model but I did get a free 1-year Product Replacement Plan from Gamestop so if it goes maybe I would get the new upgrade. Honestly though I am happy with the system and I don't really see these enhancements effecting me so I'm not too worried about it. I would see the need for a smaller, quieter, and more efficent XBOX360 (2) down the line but it doesn't look like they will take that approach if they add more to the system. As long as I can play the new games that come out I'm cool.

[nintendokid]

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: What world do you live in?

A world in which RPGs have stayed the same-length as 10 years ago. A world in which we almost no longer see CG cutscenes as these take much man power, storage, and money, which could be used in other areas of game production. A world in which we work with what we have. A world in which the Nintendo DS, a cartridge (HEAVEN FORBID?! Cartridge with paltry storage?) system sells like hotcakes. A world in which smartasses like you give cocky one sentence comments which make no argument whatsoever. A world in which people are smart enough to be able to -right- "anonymous" :rofl:

[Zen Davis]

Hahahahaha. Called it. ^_^

[un_plug]

The revised xbox360 will have 1. a cooler processor, 2. a bigger hard drive, 3. probably have HDMI. 3.
It will not have 4. HD-DVD built in. And games will not be made in HD-DVD.

Reasons.
1. It runs too hot. We know it. They know it. Strictly for more reliability they will do it.
2. Now that they have started music, tv and movie downloads a 20gb drive is not going to come close to cutting it. Hard drive prices are so cheap the cost difference to include a larger drive would be small.
3. I say probably, because everyone wants it to have it, and it is becoming standard on all the new HDTVs. The question is how much it would cost to modify the board to include this. If it doesn't cost too much they will do it, cost too much they won't.

And 4. They won't include HD-DVD because it would be too expensive. They are at a good price point with Sony right now and they know it. Nobody really cares about HD-DVD or Blue-Ray yet. It's true. Also because modifications 1-3 might piss current owners off, but not that much. Including an HD-DVD would make them furious.
And they definitely would never make HD-DVD games. They have 4 million+ units out there now- they are not gong to say "sorry you can't play the new HD-DVD games". And no publisher is going to cut 4 million possible purchasers out. It is the same reason a hard drive is not required for any game.

If anything my guess is that they will eventually get rid of the core unit.
One with a small HD will be the core. And then one with a bigger HD and maybe HDMI( or the HD-DVD bundled- I doubt it) wold become the new premium.

[MadFlava]

Well if this is true I want my money back for my 360. This new system better cost more than $399 otherwise I feel like MS sold me up the river. What the hell ever happened to a console is a console. Sure there were like 7 versions of the PS2 but they never ADDED new stuff to the console to make it better, if I can't do 1080p on this version of the console but it will be possible on that version then they need to accept the systems for exchange.

Uh, actually they did. Later down the line, the PS2 outputed DVD playback in 480 progressive while the early/launch PS2 only did 480i. Not much of an upgrade unless you had an HDTV and component cables for the thing.

Anyway, I hope MS does do this, this will justify them keeping the price at the $300 or $400 range against the PS3 and not have to do a price drop to spur sales.

[GeorgeCostanza]

Lucky I picked up my 360 from costco. I can just swap them out if these do come out.

[mykevermin]

Lucky I picked up my 360 from costco. I can just swap them out if these do come out.

???

[anomynous]

A world in which RPGs have stayed the same-length as 10 years ago. A world in which we almost no longer see CG cutscenes as these take much man power, storage, and money, which could be used in other areas of game production. A world in which we work with what we have. A world in which the Nintendo DS, a cartridge (HEAVEN FORBID?! Cartridge with paltry storage?) system sells like hotcakes. A world in which smartasses like you give cocky one sentence comments which make no argument whatsoever. A world in which people are smart enough to be able to -right- "anonymous" :rofl:
Ahem. Nearly every developer out there has complained about DVD's storage space. The Ninja Gaiden guy, Itaki or what ever his name is, has complained about DVD's storage space, especially for DoA4. All the Sony 2nd parties and 1st parties complain about DVD's storage. EA has complained about DVD storage space. Bethsheda has complained about DVD storage space. And my user name is the same as my gamertag, because when I tried for anonymous on XBL, it wasnt available. You are wrong. Developers have complained about storage space. :rofl: at you

[BattleChicken]

I'm not completly sure what the big deal here is personally..

The slim PS2 had built in IR, and network adaptor. It was also smaller and less prone to the same kinds of defects as the original while costing the same amount.

I don't really see a difference, it's not a company trying to 'screw you', or offend their consumers by delivering a better product -- it's a hardware revision thats an IMPROVEMENT.

I personally would rather have a company incrementally improve the product (bigger HDD, new input types), as opposed to keeping it artificially in the past to keep everything 'equal' .. a 20 gig HD is already a bit on the small side, in three years, it will be flat out tiny. In a year or two, HDMI may be the norm.

I just picked up my Xbox 360 a month ago, so I could theoretically understand a bit of frustration if you had JUST bought it yesterday, and this came out tomorrow -- but by the time this thing theoretically comes out, I will most likely have my machine for another six months or a year.. To me, it's worth having the 360 now, and when I inevitably HAVE to buy a different one (when it's most likely a lot cheaper), I can get the updated unit then.

edit: took out a reduntant 'smaller' in the 1st paragraph

[KaneRobot]

I wouldn't flip out too much yet. We've seen "evidence" of a 360 with an included HDMI port (including photos) in the past. This time the rumor has a bit more juice behind it thanks to the mysterious "new chipset" that will be coming soon/spring/summer/fall/2007/whatever, but I'm not ready to bite yet.

I bet before the day is out someone from MS will deny this and call it bogus. Whether they are lying or not is another story.


We'll also find out whether they blatantly lied regarding the 360's HDMI capabilities in the first place. I have no problem paying an extra 10 or 20 bucks for an HDMI adapter/cable for the 360, since I've had the thing for almost a year now. However, if they have it ONLY available on the new console, then we have a problem. While I suppose it's an arguable point, I'd wager (and hope people would be smart enough to realize) that an HDMI port is a bigger deal than an IR add-on like the updated PS2 had.


Somewhat off-topic, the new Sharp LCDs coming out supposedly this month have a DVI-I port, so perhaps my prayers of a high quality, affordable LCD TV that can pull off the 360's asinine bend-over-backwards requirements for 1080p/upconverting DVD will finally come true. A VGA-to-DVI adapter technically should (I'm crossing the fingers) work with it, as Sharp's most recent sets have accepted 1080p via analog and digital inputs in the past.

[ncibob]

Is this engadget site a credible source? We all know there is a new chip coming out, but all this? Seems to be more of a photshop prank more than anything. How come none of the other bigger sites, IGN, teamxbox and other haven't jumped all over this news?

[hufferstl]

They should bundle halo 3 with the "required" 100 gig hard drive for $100.

[Mr Unoriginal]

???

Costco pretty much lets you return anything for any reason up to 3 years after purchase. I'm guessing he will just tell them his is broken and when they replace it he will get the new one. (Assuming the new one has the same SKU)

[62t]

with PS2, the earlier model doesnt have progress scan built in

[Vergeofinsanity]

Relax ppl.. this things a rumor and if it wasn't your not seeing this for atleast another year or so.. thats when most hardware revisions take place anyhow. And big deal it has HDMI.. i dont even have a 1080p set. And i doubt most of you ppl do either.

[anomynous]

Relax ppl.. this things a rumor and if it wasn't your not seeing this for atleast another year or so.. thats when most hardware revisions take place anyhow. And big deal it has HDMI.. i dont even have a 1080p set. And i doubt most of you ppl do either.
Most HDTVs have HDMI now, regardless if its 1080p

[Vinny]

While I'm glad to see a bigger HD and HDMI and smaller/cooler CPU... but this really sucks for people who already have a 360. Oh well, I really don't need any of those features.

[trip1eX]

I welcome improvements. Those who complain must have liked the current model enough to shell out $$$$ for it and a new model ain't going to affect how their old one plays.

I mean it almost seems like current owners would rather see worse versions come out so they feel even better. That seems a bit backwards to me.

[Chacrana]

My 360's under warranty at BB, so hopefully I can return it since I have gotten some DRE's and pay the difference to step up to this model. If it's true, then it's a complete dick tactic on MS' part. It's not like offering a smaller version of a system like what Sony or Nintendo does -- this is a big step up to something better and (supposedly) more reliable. It's basically a giant "Fuck you" from MS to all the people who've supported the system thus far.

[Chacrana]

I welcome improvements. Those who complain must have liked the current model enough to shell out $$$$ for it and a new model ain't going to affect how their old one plays.

No, people who bought the system earlier didn't realize that there'd be a new version of the 360 that didn't sound like a goddamn airplane.

[rabidmonkeys]

Well if this is true I want my money back for my 360. This new system better cost more than $399 otherwise I feel like MS sold me up the river. What the hell ever happened to a console is a console. Sure there were like 7 versions of the PS2 but they never ADDED new stuff to the console to make it better, if I can't do 1080p on this version of the console but it will be possible on that version then they need to accept the systems for exchange.

You know that your current xbox 360 displays 1080p right?

[rabidmonkeys]

it's also bullshit that Nintendo does this time and time again with every system they've ever released minus the fucking virtual boy and no one bitches, but when M$ wants to upgrade the product they are "dicks" and "assholes"

[ryanbph]

I don't see what the big deal is...some of us have had it for up to a year and have played some great/solid games with it...a bigger hard drive is coming at some point...hdmi would be great, but it isn't necessary to play the games...i am sure the premium will drop in price, I would imagine this alleged new model will come out at the $399 price. Also what the hell is the problem with the core. Yes, it does suck, but get over it. It wasn't designed for us, it was designed primarily for europe and people that aren't as likely to spend so much money on a new console. Members from msft have said repeatedly that it is the system that will get them to the $99 price point the quickest. Is it really effecting anyone, are the load times bad on any of the 360 games? IMO it was stupid to offer 2 sku's that possibly could change the way we play. But all the games I have played so far have had decent/great load times.

[Chacrana]

it's also bullshit that Nintendo does this time and time again with every system they've ever released minus the fucking virtual boy and no one bitches, but when M$ wants to upgrade the product they are "dicks" and "assholes"

The only difference is typically that the new system is smaller. And yeah, they added a backlight to the GBA SP which was a big change, but that system is inexpensive -- the 360 is a $400 proposition and getting screwed over with a clearly inferior product is ridiculous.

[hufferstl]

If the product that you bought wasn't worth the $400, then you shouldn't have purchased it.

Does the person who bought a 2006 Camry get mad when the 2007 comes out with a few "modifications"?

As long as they don't make HD-DVD games, I don't think Microsoft is screwing anyone.


The only difference is typically that the new system is smaller. And yeah, they added a backlight to the GBA SP which was a big change, but that system is inexpensive -- the 360 is a $400 proposition and getting screwed over with a clearly inferior product is ridiculous.

[Vergeofinsanity]

Most HDTVs have HDMI now, regardless if its 1080p


I understand, but just saying majority of ppl dont have a 1080p capable HD set. Mine only goes up to 720p/1080i. I just dont understand why everyones making a big deal out of this. I'd only be pissed if they dont release some sort of adapter for HDMI for current gen systems and make you buy this new console to get the 1080p output.

[Chacrana]

If the product that you bought wasn't worth the $400, then you shouldn't have purchased it.

Does the person who bought a 2006 Camry get mad when the 2007 comes out with a few "modifications"?

As long as they don't make HD-DVD games, I don't think Microsoft is screwing anyone.

That analogy is completely irrelevant. You know that a new model of a car is going to come out. A system revision with this many significant changes is completely unprecedented.

[ncibob]

This is still just a huge ass rumor. It's now been four hours since that article was posted on the engadget site and nobody else has picked up this story yet. I think alot of people are getting upset over nothing here.

[Purkeynator]

I am thinking they will drop the core completely, drop the current premium down to $300 and release a new premium pack for $400. Both will probably have the HDMI and the new premium will probably have the bigger hard drive. I could see them releasing regular games on DVD and perhaps Collector's editions of big games on HD-DVD.

[BULL_Ship]

That analogy is completely irrelevant. You know that a new model of a car is going to come out. A system revision with this many significant changes is completely unprecedented.

Actually its not as its been previously mentioned that the ps2 and ps1 had several revisions and the gameboy with its revisions.

(Now you will arbitrarily define these as insignificant in order to support your own point.)

[ryanbph]

That analogy is completely irrelevant. You know that a new model of a car is going to come out. A system revision with this many significant changes is completely unprecedented.

well you know at some point a new system is going to come out...

and the argument is relevant...lets say the 2008 model of the car changes the body design, as soon a new body desin comes out, it lowers the value of the models with the older desin. Or what if the newer model came with and extra foot of leg room in the front and backseat.

It isn't unprecedented...the ds to the ds light was a major change

[Chacrana]

Actually its not as its been previously mentioned that the ps2 and ps1 had several revisions and the gameboy with its revisions.

(Now you will arbitrarily define these as insignificant in order to support your own point.)

Oh ho! On to my logic, are you? You're absolutely right -- I do think the PS1 and PS2 revisions were insignificant! I mean, how could a change in size not be the most significant thing ever? It directly affects the system's functionality! And those version changes were pretty damn significant too! Since I can't seem to say anything to your cunning logic, I guess I'll arbitrarily decide that you don't know what the hell you're talking about.

[Boeing 747]

This is very, very funny to me. If this were Nintendo, most people would be lining up to pay full price for a new console just because it's: smaller, in color, a different color, different shape, different cartridge slot, front lit, back lit, has a pokemon sticker, etc. I'm not bashing anybody posting complaints about this, it's just highlighting the difference between Nintendo fans and other fans. Personally, I think it's shitty to re-release a console and expect the early adopters to pay full price, even though we are the reason the consoles are selling. It almost makes me feel as if we paid full price to beta test the hardware.

Has Nintendo ever re-released a home console? Not that I remember.

Handhelds normally have shorter life span because of how they are used, they get beat up more.. I couldn't care less about the DS Lite while I have my DS Phat still working great. It's an optional upgrade, that just helps out sales for people who don't have it.

Theres no way I'd jump out to grab a new brighter screen and tiny model.

Consoles of course are for the most part stationary, besides the occasional moving to/from a friends house and stuff like that.. it's not going to take that much physical damage.

I guess I'll hold off on buying a 360 untill this is cleared away.

[Vergeofinsanity]

To add.. as a Long time PC gamer myself.. this is NOTHING new.. new tech comes out almost every 3-6 months.. I must have gone through atleast 2-3 videocards.. 1 mobo switch..etc etc.. quit whining.

If you want to play the latest and greatest you gta pay. HD gaming costs money. Period.

[jmiller80]

Nintendo does seem the king of "Malibu Stacy" activity. But their overwhelming source of revenue is games and consoles, so I can't blame them. They need to stay relevant and keep making desirable products.

The curious thing is disparate customer reaction. Nintendo didn't target the early adopter with the "latest and greatest" as much as Sony and MS did. If the "latest and greatest" doesn't have legs, some of the best customers get burned.

Also, many gamers just can't stay angry with the guys that made Mario and Zelda (and stole my childhood).

[mykevermin]

Costco pretty much lets you return anything for any reason up to 3 years after purchase. I'm guessing he will just tell them his is broken and when they replace it he will get the new one. (Assuming the new one has the same SKU)

Danke. I figured it was something shady like that.

OT (it's me, so go figure), I recall that Costco got a lot of shit from shareholders because stocks weren't performing up to their expectations (poor babies didn't get big enough dividends); when they suggested that Costco should pay their employees less (Costco is notorious for treating its employees quite well, I believe, relative to other retail shops) to increase the stock value, and thus influence the dividends positively, the management at Costco told the shareholders, more or less, to go fuck themselves sideways.

They could surely help dividends, however, by eliminating such a massive invitation for consumer fraud as a 3-year window for returns.

[jmiller80]

They could surely help dividends, however, by eliminating such a massive invitation for consumer fraud as a 3-year window for returns.

As I recall, Costco excludes PC purchases from this policy to limit fraud incentive from a rapidly depreciating product.

[SpecTrE3353]

Does the person who bought a 2006 Camry get mad when the 2007 comes out with a few "modifications"?

Worst.

Analogy.

Ever.

[Chacrana]

Has Nintendo ever re-released a home console? Not that I remember.


Well there was the toploader NES and the revised SNES... and a shitload of color variations, though those don't really count. And I guess there's the Q Gamecube that came out in Japan if you wanna count that. But the changes in those systems were almost all just cosmetic.

[terribledeli]

So the whole article is on the strength of one picture and the news story of the smaller chip?

Right. I'll await CES before crapping my pants.

[mykevermin]

As I recall, Costco excludes PC purchases from this policy to limit fraud incentive from a rapidly depreciating product.

It's a start. I would hope they would do this for electronics. You could have bought a launch PS2 and returned it in mid-to-late 2004. That's absurd.

[Rasen]

Has Nintendo ever re-released a home console? Not that I remember.

They sure have. There's a v2 of the NES(I think it was top-loading) and SNES(freakishly light and somehow adorable. Similar to the Japanese version) out there.

[mikeohara]

that's the main thing I want also ... is a bigger HD. I hate the fact I do have to go in from time to time and delete demos that are a gig plus. That's also a reason I've not embraced the Video Marketplace either is because of the fact there's no larger storage device available for the 360 ... if there were say a 250gb HD available for the 360, I'd purchase one and transfer all of my stuff over and start using more of Microsoft's services.

[Chacrana]

and the argument is relevant...lets say the 2008 model of the car changes the body design, as soon a new body desin comes out, it lowers the value of the models with the older desin. Or what if the newer model came with and extra foot of leg room in the front and backseat.


Buying a console is not the same as buying a car. I'm sorry, but it's just not. There's not big annual updates like with a car and the value of the older system isn't the concern here. It's that MS' tactic is screwing over consumers who bought the older system with absolutely no knowledge that a functionally superior version would be coming out. And considering the reliability problems that the current version has and the undeniable fact that the thing is obnoxiously loud, this comes off as even more of a slap in the face since these problems will be alleviated. MS essentially made early adopters the beta testers.

[ryosnk]

If this new revamp does come out microsoft better give a nice gift to the rest of us who purchased their dated system at $400. If not, I will not be getting their next generation system when ever that comes out.

[slickkill77]

I dont need a biggger hdd...What are you guys storing on these things anyway....I also dont need a hd-dvd drive...My launch console works just fine

[jmiller80]

Has Nintendo ever re-released a home console?

Ignoring handhelds, I can't remember any major console revisions hitting retail. I also remember seeing pictures of the NES toploader, but I never saw it in stores.

Nintendo did remove the digital 480p connector from later Gamecube models, but they were clearly the third horse in sales by that time. That was just a business decision to remove a feature that few used to cut costs (and price) to the bone.

[neocisco]

That was SCPH-70001

OK, I was thinking more about all of the total additions.

[ryanbph]

Buying a console is not the same as buying a car. I'm sorry, but it's just not. There's not big annual updates like with a car and the value of the older system isn't the concern here. It's that MS' tactic is screwing over consumers who bought the older system with absolutely no knowledge that a functionally superior version would be coming out. And considering the reliability problems that the current version has and the undeniable fact that the thing is obnoxiously loud, this comes off as even more of a slap in the face since these problems will be alleviated. MS essentially made early adopters the beta testers.

You have had the system for up to a year, how is it a slap in the face...you didn't realize that at some point there would be updates? It happens with just about every product out there, razr phone then they come out with the chocolate...I bought a sony 50 inch tv last febuary, come this summer the same model got a major update, get over it. Yes the system is loud, but is it really a problem for you playing. I don't even notice it, and I never hear anyones system making a shit load of noice over xbox live. MSFT owes you nothing, you bought the system that was available, you played there games. It isn't like this system won't work afterwards, you still can play xbox 360 games with it. The system comes out and people bitch about the noise, lack of disk space, and the lack of hdmi. Now there is an "alleged" rumor that they will come out with a system like that and people bitch saying how msft lied to them

[Walt Jay]

Looks like they took a page out of Nintendo's book. I hope anyone complaining about MS potentially redesigning and improving their console and selling it for the same price doesn't own a DS Lite and a DS Phat. No double-standards please!

[camoor]

It almost makes me feel as if we paid full price to beta test the hardware.

M$oft has always done this, and still people line up like Charlie Brown trying to kick that football.

Better you then me.

[SpecTrE3353]

You have had the system for up to a year, how is it a slap in the face...you didn't realize that at some point there would be updates? It happens with just about every product out there, razr phone then they come out with the chocolate...I bought a sony 50 inch tv last febuary, come this summer the same model got a major update, get over it. Yes the system is loud, but is it really a problem for you playing. I don't even notice it, and I never hear anyones system making a shit load of noice over xbox live. MSFT owes you nothing, you bought the system that was available, you played there games. It isn't like this system won't work afterwards, you still can play xbox 360 games with it. The system comes out and people bitch about the noise, lack of disk space, and the lack of hdmi. Now there is an "alleged" rumor that they will come out with a system like that and people bitch saying how msft lied to them

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[apokalipze2]

You have had the system for up to a year, how is it a slap in the face...you didn't realize that at some point there would be updates? It happens with just about every product out there, razr phone then they come out with the chocolate...I bought a sony 50 inch tv last febuary, come this summer the same model got a major update, get over it. Yes the system is loud, but is it really a problem for you playing. I don't even notice it, and I never hear anyones system making a shit load of noice over xbox live. MSFT owes you nothing, you bought the system that was available, you played there games. It isn't like this system won't work afterwards, you still can play xbox 360 games with it. The system comes out and people bitch about the noise, lack of disk space, and the lack of hdmi. Now there is an "alleged" rumor that they will come out with a system like that and people bitch saying how msft lied to themNicely said. I can't believe some of you people are actually bitching about being beta testers :lol: :lol:

[KingDox]

I'm glad this is comming out.

I don't care, about the new ports or bigger HD. I'm never going to Download an HD movie.

I hope that this makes MS sell more consoles and that's better for ALL 360 owners. More consoles means more games.

[Morpheus]

Oh ho! On to my logic, are you? You're absolutely right -- I do think the PS1 and PS2 revisions were insignificant! I mean, how could a change in size not be the most significant thing ever? It directly affects the system's functionality! And those version changes were pretty damn significant too! Since I can't seem to say anything to your cunning logic, I guess I'll arbitrarily decide that you don't know what the hell you're talking about.

Chacrana, that's not the only thing that changed in the PS2 from the original launch version. PS2 slim includes the internet adapter (lets you go online to play online games and I had to buy it seperately hiking up cost of the older console model), removing the harddrive slot (screwing old owners of any future support of HDD in games), having the IR (which launch models did not have and had to buy a seperate adaptor for IR), the switch to a smaller chipset (I don't know when this started but I know my PS2 doesn't have the smaller chip), better disc drive (less chance of DRE from original old batch of PS2s), etc.

Then theres the GBA. Lets see. GBA not backlit. GBA SP clamshell design helps protect the screen and side lit. GBA SP v2 adds backlit. GBA micro shrinks it all down into this ridiculously small package (minus clamshell design). Original GBA owners should feel the most burn.

Gameboy, Gameboy pocket (much better screen with less motion blur and smaller in size, Gameboy Color (can you say color). Another mess.

Lots have upgraded in the past (I didn't list all, even the Intellivision had multiple versions). As long as Microsoft offers an option to buy a HDMI cable adapter for the older 360's I don't see a big problem with what they are offering if this turns out true. Its been pretty obvious that there would be a bigger HDD at some point. Same goes for a smaller chip that runs cooler (Microsoft has mentioned this many times in interviews from various MS employees). HDMI a lot of people speculated about.

[M12]

That analogy is completely irrelevant. You know that a new model of a car is going to come out. A system revision with this many significant changes is completely unprecedented.

Bigger HD, HDMI and possibly HD DVD are NOT significant changes.


HD can be easily upgraded.
HDMI is not that huge of an upgrade and doesnt effect gameplay. It may look slightly better but Im pretty sure most people will not notice.
HD DVD built in is not a huge upgrade since it only effects movie playback.

[jmiller80]

Yes the system is loud, but is it really a problem for you playing. I don't even notice it, and I never hear anyones system making a shit load of noice over xbox live.

My 360 is better than the original Xbox's high-pitched Thomson drive whine that was audible regardless. 360 DVD whir is what I would expect for a ~$300 piece of consumer level hardware, so my complaints do amount to nitpicking. Truth be told, I notice it during quiet scenes and when I'm on Live because I can't blast the speakers and voicechat.

[Rasen]

Ignoring handhelds, I can't remember any major console revisions hitting retail. I also remember seeing pictures of the NES toploader, but I never saw it in stores.

It did indeed hit retail. I don't know how well it did(probably not ver), but it was in stores. And the v2 of the SNES, one of my dormmates had one, so it too was sold.

[anomynous]

Bigger HD, HDMI and possibly HD DVD are NOT significant changes.


HD can be easily upgraded.
HDMI is not that huge of an upgrade and doesnt effect gameplay. It may look slightly better but Im pretty sure most people will not notice.
HD DVD built in is not a huge upgrade since it only effects movie playback.
How are they not significant changes? HD DVD added in would be one of the biggest significant changes MS could do

[pop311]

fuck, screw you microsoft. I wish I could pay $75-$150 to microsoft, send them my console, and have them upgrade it. But alas, that will never happen. I also JUST got my 360. I don't want to shell out $400-$600 again to buy another.

[anomynous]

fuck, screw you microsoft. I wish I could pay $75-$150 to microsoft, send them my console, and have them upgrade it. But alas, that will never happen. I also JUST got my 360. I don't want to shell out $400-$600 again to buy another.
then dont buy it

[D4rkN1ght]

everyone needs to quit bitching, there was nothing hidden when you opened the box, when you brought your 360 home and opened it up did you say "WHAT NO HDMI?"

no, so you bought it, thats your bad, as did i, its not a big deal, stop crying

LMAO to those of you that think your being scammed into being beta testers... what a joke.

[M12]

How are they not significant changes? HD DVD added in would be one of the biggest significant changes MS could do

MS is not going to release games in HD DVD.

The only thing that integrating the HD DVD adds:

1) Saves space
2) You can display your movies over HDMI

[dafoomie]

PS2 got progressive scan, networking, and IR in later revisions.

PS1 went from a 1x drive in the 3av launch systems to a 2x drive that was more reliable, while dropping the av ports and later dropping the serial port.

This is not unprecedented. Wouldn't you rather have MS fix deficiencies in their system as time goes on?

[jmiller80]

I wish I could pay $75-$150 to microsoft, send them my console, and have them upgrade it. But alas, that will never happen. I also JUST got my 360. I don't want to shell out $400-$600 again to buy another.

Anyone feel like starting a console leasing business? ~$25/mo for the latest console rev.

Gamefly? Cheapy?

[D4rkN1ght]

Anyone feel like starting a console leasing business? ~$25/mo for the latest console rev.

Gamefly? Cheapy?

you swear like these things are rolling out every week.

[daroga]

Wow, a lot of hate around here. As a primarily Nintendo consumer, you know what I've done in the past to "upgrade" when they shill out revisions that I think are worth-while? Sell my old one to pay for the new one. It's turned out to be about 10-20% of the total MSRP of the new unit to do it that way, which I then weigh if the upgrade it worth it. If whatever addition are "necessary" for you, sell your current 360 and get it (this logic works best if the units are the same price as the ones they're replacing, but can still work for a more expensive system).

I'm not wild about HDMI (I've only got DVI on my TV and my DVD player is using an HDMI->DVI cable to use up that port). But if this means that the current $400 system might come down to a $300 MSRP, and I could get in on that with a deal via CAG to knock it down even lower, I'll be amongst you 360 owners as fast as I can get to the store.

[LinkinPrime]

If it supports HD sound formats when using HDMI I'll definately have to upgrade, not at launch but eventually.

[mykevermin]

To be fair, there are some pretty good arguments to the significance of some prior system upgrades, particularly for the PS2 and, to a lesser extent IMO, the Game Boys.

Console manufacturers are always revising hardware - to parlay piracy, to build a cheaper and/or more reliable console, and for other reasons (but mostly cost and theft issues).

Now, one thing to consider is that the price stayed the same with these revisions on the PS2 and Game Boys. Never once did a change cause the cost of the system to go up in price.

I can live with an HDMI-enabled 360, even though I won't own one. I can output 1080p over component, so it's really not a major difference, IMO. It's completely reasonable to see the same 360 we all have, with an added HDMI port, be released for the same price as the current system is selling. If this rumor turns out to be true, I speculate that this is the most likely scenario.

Now a larger HDD, which must be on the horizon (to reduce reluctance to buy XBL media content over space concerns)...I'm not convinced that we would see a 360 with HDMI and a larger HDD retail for the same price. It sure isn't out of the question, but it could go one way or another.

Add an internal HD-DVD, and you have a console that is inconceivable to sell at the current MSRP of the 360, coupled with HDMI and the HDD. Moreover, this presents Microsoft with the same conundrum I mentioned on the first page here (you can go read it there if you want). They have a sweet spot in price, partially because the competition looks absurdly expensive. They can't afford to drive up the price of a console at a time when a looming price drop would give them significant leverage over the other consoles of this generation.

[likeaphoenixignition]

The only part I'm pissed about is a bigger hard drive. I paid 80 bucks for a 20 gig one that should cost 40 dollars.

[hhhdx4]

im pissed at the larger hard drive, because i know it will cost no less than $120 separate.

[mykevermin]

im pissed at the larger hard drive, because i know it will cost no less than $120 separate.

The only part I'm pissed about is a bigger hard drive. I paid 80 bucks for a 20 gig one that should cost 40 dollars.

Why? That's like being pissed that you paid $300 for a PS2 in 2000 instead of $130 today. You're not losing or gaining functionality; the console is being changed to suit the needs of the consumer. Moreover, prices of commodities, especially electronics, decrease over time. That's always been the case.

If you wanna be pissed, buy a 60GB PS3, realize you aren't going to use the wifi, don't care for the card reader, and thus paid $100 more for 40-goddamn-GB of storage.

[ryanbph]

I think they could offer it for substantially cheaper then a ps3 if they included the hd dvd player. They are making roughly $75 a unit now. I am sure they are making money on the hd dvd player, as everything currently is processed on the xbox 360. Assuming this isn't released untill next holiday season, when there parts would cost them even less, they probably could go with a $200 core, a $300 premium, and a $400 or $450 hdmi 100gb hd, hd player included supersytem

[hhhdx4]

Why? That's like being pissed that you paid $300 for a PS2 in 2000 instead of $130 today. You're not losing or gaining functionality; the console is being changed to suit the needs of the consumer. Moreover, prices of commodities, especially electronics, decrease over time. That's always been the case.

If you wanna be pissed, buy a 60GB PS3, realize you aren't going to use the wifi, don't care for the card reader, and thus paid $100 more for 40-goddamn-GB of storage.


Well I just bought my 360 last week so yeah.

[Graystone]

If these do come out. Then I'll simply sell my older one, and buy this one. I'll have to buy a memory card so I keep my saves, and profiles transfered to the new HD. The HDMI port is awesome my new tv has an HDMI port, whenever I get it.

I don't care about the bigger hard drive. I'm only using 2 gigs of space now on a 20 gig. I have a tv show, 5 live games, couple of cds, 6 expansion/add-on packs, plus countless free downloads, and 60 game saves. Still only using 2 gigs. So I'm not understanding why everyone is after the bigger hard drive.

I'm personally more excited about the smaller chip, and HDMI.

[KingDox]

The the change does end up being a big diffference then I'll wait for a Price drop and for a new Color to come out.

You know there is going to be a green one once Halo 3 comes out.

[shrike4242]

Why? That's like being pissed that you paid $300 for a PS2 in 2000 instead of $130 today. You're not losing or gaining functionality; the console is being changed to suit the needs of the consumer. Moreover, prices of commodities, especially electronics, decrease over time. That's always been the case.

If you wanna be pissed, buy a 60GB PS3, realize you aren't going to use the wifi, don't care for the card reader, and thus paid $100 more for 40-goddamn-GB of storage.
Don't forget those chrome accents. ;)

[crystalklear64]

Sweet. I'm considering buying one now that I have some extra cash. Now I can wait a little longer and see if this is true.

[ryanbph]

Sweet. I'm considering buying one now that I have some extra cash. Now I can wait a little longer and see if this is true.

well i hope for your sake if you plan on waiting, that they make an announcement at ces. I am pretty sure bill gates is a keynote speaker

[getmyrunon]

Announcing a revision at this point would completely nuke their sales, unless it's right around the corner. We're not going to know if this is true or not until shortly before these units begin to ship.

The only way this makes a difference to me is if they embrace HD-DVD as a game format. Even if they say they won't do it now (while the war is still up in the air), you can bet they'll do it later (if HD-DVD is victorious) if it'll net them more money.

[likeaphoenixignition]

Because I just bought one before Christmas.. anyways I haven't even used it yet, I'll just return it to Amazon if it gets released anytime soon.

Why? That's like being pissed that you paid $300 for a PS2 in 2000 instead of $130 today. You're not losing or gaining functionality; the console is being changed to suit the needs of the consumer. Moreover, prices of commodities, especially electronics, decrease over time. That's always been the case.

If you wanna be pissed, buy a 60GB PS3, realize you aren't going to use the wifi, don't care for the card reader, and thus paid $100 more for 40-goddamn-GB of storage.

[anomynous]

http://www.dustincorreale.com/images/catpray.gif

[sarausagi]

Yes but it made my girls gone wild DVD's easier to watch

How does an HD-DVD drive or a 360 make it easier to watch girls gone wild DVD's?

Mmm, sluts.

[gunm]

Meh, this was in the works for a while now.

Some reasons why I can't and won't get riled up about this:

1) I don't need an HDMI port right now because my HD-TV only supports component inputs.
2) The unit works fine and I have computers that are just as loud.

And finally,

3) I already have an HD-DVD add-on and I don't believe the next redesign will have this built-in. I would be very surprised, but still unaffected if they do.

[CaseyRyback]

I don't really care about the movie or TV service so I am content with my 360, but if they go adding a steam like service they better let us hook up our own external hard drives or do something along those lines or I will be pissed off. 20 GB was too small when the console first came out and now its way too small and they should do something to appease the customers who already bought their console.

[tekkenlaw]

Hopefully this comes out within a year. Could I cash in on my free gamestop warranty to change my current 360 for one of these? They wont keep making normal 360's so what would they do if it costs the same?

[RelentlessRolento]

being an owner of an SDTV, all I really care about is the 120 HDD... but knowing me, I'll have to have the newer 360 once I go HDTV eventually.

[elsnow77]

I don't really care about the movie or TV service so I am content with my 360, but if they go adding a steam like service they better let us hook up our own external hard drives or do something along those lines or I will be pissed off. 20 GB was too small when the console first came out and now its way too small and they should do something to appease the customers who already bought their console.
way too small? how do you figure, what do you want to put on there that you cant do now??

[CrimsonPaw]

Add an internal HD-DVD, and you have a console that is inconceivable to sell at the current MSRP of the 360, coupled with HDMI and the HDD. Moreover, this presents Microsoft with the same conundrum I mentioned on the first page here (you can go read it there if you want). They have a sweet spot in price, partially because the competition looks absurdly expensive. They can't afford to drive up the price of a console at a time when a looming price drop would give them significant leverage over the other consoles of this generation.
I would tend to agree, but what if they dropped the current price of the premium 360 to $350; hell, let's say $325 for grins. Now you have the bar set at $325 for this next gen console.

Around Christmas you bring out this "new" console for $450 that includes this stuff mentioned. Yeah the HD-DVD is $200 retail, but the production costs are constantly lessening so they may be able to produce it for around $75 (plus they won't have to add the standard DVD to it). The larger HDD, let's be honest, doesn't cost all that much to produce, I'll give it $50 (they're making a killing selling the current 20 GB @ $100). With advances in the circuit technology and production, it's very feasible that they could send an "updated" unit out the door for a little more than what we're currently paying for a premium system now.

What's more, I could see MS scrapping the core system and having the current premium system become the "economy" system.

Yeah it sucks, but I suppose it's no different than those of us who bought the PS2 network adapter getting the shaft with the new PS2.
way too small? how do you figure, what do you want to put on there that you cant do now?
Well, for starters some of those demos are rather large, I've pulled some down that are damn near a gig in size. Add that to the large file sizes for some of the game trailers and your 20 GB drive is now at half capacity. Combine that with a FEW HD movies and you're hosed.

[sonicfreak5]

im actually happy about buying this, i recently sold my broken 360 to ebgames for some $$$ and bought a PS3. So, i would definetly pick this up when it comes out.

[Weedy649]

Changes are unprecedented? ok lol

My first ps2 died to DRE, second one i gave away for christmas because a newer version was coming out.

The last fat PS2 had a + on the corner that indicated it had these new features:

Built in IR reciever

DVD Progressive Playback

DVD-RW/+RW Playback (NO ONE MENTIONED THIS!!!!)

Lower Noise Operation


The IR Reciever was a nice addition, especially since they released a new dvd remote that could turn off the ps2 instead of having to get up and do it. Thats all fine and dandy unless you had the original remote, meaning you ended up paying twice the amount for the right version.

The added network adapter wasnt new to this version, but i was one of the people who shelled out $40 for an adapter when it was released, and after those "beta testers" were done, they bundled it onto the ps2.

Then i bought the HDD for $100 only to have the last version of the ps2 remove the use of it, support for it officially died right there.

So in changes, lost $40 on the adapter which they built in. $20 on the old remote that got revised for the new ps2, and support lost for the $100 hard drive. Unprecedented my ass.

[AdultLink]

If they do this, are they gonna rename the other two Xbox 360's to:

Xbox 360 Basic
Xbox 360 Premium

And the new one will be Xbox 360 Ultimate?

[propeller_head]

Bingo. The fact that Microsoft was already willing to sell you a console that couldn't play all games to full capacity (the Core) indicates to me that, if this system is not rumor (and I'm not buying completely into it based on one photograph), then in the years to come Premium 360 users could just as easily find themselves unable to play certain software. yay! the fanboy strikes again!

yer wrong on all counts.

- the core will be able to play all games (except Live! Arcade) for the life of the system. also, its EAAAAASILY upgradeable. the HDD just pops on the top, my dog sparky could do it. but then again sparky can also operate a space shuttle. dont pretend like some1 buys a core and its set in stone for eternity.

- premium 360s will be able to play all software titles for the life of the product. if there are 360 games which are actually written for 1080p native ; the hardware scaler chip will scale it to any resolution. though im about 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999% sure that they will also be optimized for 720p and 480i/p as well. theres also the fact that you wont be seeing many 1080p games period either on the PS3 or the 360. the hardwares just not strong enough this gen, despite what sony says. devs have said repeatadly that 720p is the sweet spot this gen because it allows for all the fancy-shmancy fx. and that to push out the polygons for 1080p the games would have to either be stipped down and plain, or suffer laggy framerates. just look at marvel ultimite alliance for the ps3 at 1080p, can you say slideshow? on the other hand the 360 version when scaled w/ the dedicated scaler chip to 1080p over the VGA cable suffers no framerate problems because the game is redering it internally 1st at 720p. see some people see 1080p HDMI on the ps3 and think, "wow it must be much more powerful to play at that resolution", fact of the matter is the 360s xenos GPU is stronger than the ps3's RSX. it's just marketing for blu-ray. dont believe me? go ask on Beyond3D.com

oh and the larger HDD? that wasnt predicated on games. it was predicated on the popularity of Live!s new HD Video marketplace.



- then thers the question of if it indeed is a seperate output like the picture & not just a firmware update w/ a different cable. the question is, does their propietary port have digital capability as well as analog & optical. since optical is really digital; there's a strong possibility.;)


lastly & not leastly. i cant believe people would actually complain about getting more for less. current 360s may not have HDMI standard and a larger HDD, but people have had them and been playing them for over a year. its not like they're going up in price, in fact theyll be going down. watch for it this summer. :bouncy:

[propeller_head]

to the ppl considering if it will have HD-DVD drive built in. IT WONT. HD-DVD and Blu-Ray drives are significangly slower at reading standard DVDs.

plus MS has said w/o a doubt it will never come w/ a HD-DVD drive internal. that it will always be external.

they could possibly bundle the external HD-DVD drive w/ it, that's an option.

but it will never, i repeat never ever, come w/ an internal HD-DVD drive.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/73/The_More_You_Know.jpg

[mykevermin]

- the core will be able to play all games (except Live! Arcade) for the life of the system. also, its EAAAAASILY upgradeable. the HDD just pops on the top, my dog sparky could do it. but then again sparky can also operate a space shuttle. dont pretend like some1 buys a core and its set in stone for eternity.

Well, if you have to use the word "except," then you can't use the word "all," can you? In addition to XBLA, there are a handful of games that require the HDD (Final Fantasy XI, and I believe 99 Nights, or Enchant Arms...some of those games I haven't yet played). Not to mention any game demos/DLC.

My point wasn't that you, as a consumer, are stuck for life with the inability to play game X or game Y. My point was that MS was selling a console that, out of the box, can not play all 360 gaming content. As a result of their willingness to sell you a product that, de facto, cannot play all content, it stands to reason they could certainly try that yet again. Is the likelihood of it small? You bet. However, if MS is willing to sell you an "incomplete" system, what makes you so confident that your premium console will be able to play all 360 games for the duration of software releases?

[mercilessming]

Since this means probally no real price drop, I hope that the core get cheaper or they introduce this "NEW" version minus the harddrive for say 50 dollars less, or pack in a 2 games or 2 controllers.

I only need the core at the point, and am waiting for the hopefully eventual price drop or extra more for you money. I don't need a harddrive don't have old games, sold them with my xbox long time ago, don't really care about playing online, I just want some choice games out or comeing out that I cann't have on Wii or PC or prefer to play on console over PC.

[Dante Devil]

How many are willing to trade in your Xbox 360 for the newest version?

[panasonic]

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: What world do you live in?

he lives in fantasy world where chewicorns run around and devs only use 75% of dvd discs

[panasonic]

i hope this fix happens very soon i need to replace my 360 at bestbuy before 2nd year aniversary. My 360 freezes often, rarely but sometimes gives graphic glitches where red dots are all over the screen, and disc tray does not open anymore. I guess the drive shifted because i have to move it when opening it or it won't come out.

[SpecTrE3353]

How many are willing to trade in your Xbox 360 for the newest version?

Lot's of people on these boards probably would, but they only account for about %0.0001 of the XBox360 population so it doesn't really mean much.

[edzz]

Just Purchased my 360 from best buy 3 days ago.
Should i return it and wait for the new one?
Do you think its going to be soon enough for me to
return and wait??

[Ub3rChief]

WTF? There's way more than .0001% of the 360 user population that would trade-in, myself included.

When the new system comes out, it won't cost any more than $400, I believe. I'll get at least $200, maybe $250 if they have a trade-up deal, leaving me to only pay $150 or so for the new 360. No problems here.

Besides, it isn't like MS will continually do this. This will probably be a one time deal, and there won't be any internal HD-DVD support. That would screw MS by not allowing them to use the expanded disc capacity for games (since it would screw the consumers by not allowing them to play the new games without an HD-DVD drive). MS already said they wouldn't use HD-DVD for games, and that's that.

[tekkenlaw]

I hope I can tell gamestop that my 360 broke and then get this new one.

[greedycheese]

It will be YEARS before an HD-DVD drive exists that can read dvds at 12x. No way microsoft releases a 360 with a drive that can't play 360 games. HD-DVD will stay as an add on for a good while, probably forever.

[Cormier6083]

How many are willing to trade in your Xbox 360 for the newest version?


No.

[propeller_head]

Well, if you have to use the word "except," then you can't use the word "all," can you? In addition to XBLA, there are a handful of games that require the HDD (Final Fantasy XI, and I believe 99 Nights, or Enchant Arms...some of those games I haven't yet played). Not to mention any game demos/DLC.

My point wasn't that you, as a consumer, are stuck for life with the inability to play game X or game Y. My point was that MS was selling a console that, out of the box, can not play all 360 gaming content. As a result of their willingness to sell you a product that, de facto, cannot play all content, it stands to reason they could certainly try that yet again. Is the likelihood of it small? You bet. However, if MS is willing to sell you an "incomplete" system, what makes you so confident that your premium console will be able to play all 360 games for the duration of software releases? oh give me a fucking break

cant say all if you say except? really?

all NFL teams can play in the superbowl, except those that lose qualifying.
all things cost money, except things that are free.
all your base are belong to us, except when 'Zig' moved & taken off.

youre just BSing. your argument is completely innocuous.

the core is EXACTLY the same as the premium. you can easily go out and buy accessories at any time to upgrade it. MS simply gave people a CHOICE. no1 was forced at gunpoint to go buy a core.

you just want something to whine about cause your a fanboy. admit it.:hot:

people are getting a bigger HDD (2x as big as the $600 PS3 model) & HDMI as a bonus. & it will start AT MOST the same price as the current premium. which is still $200 cheaper than the PS3. put that in your pipe and smoke it.
(yes i know the PS3 drive is user upgradable & i applaud sony for that, 1 of the things they did right:applause:)

it also drives down the price of the other models for people who dont have 1080p TVs w/ HDMI 1.3 (aka 95% of every1 w/ a HDTV).

chances are stratospherical theyll make the 120GB drive available as an accessory. for about the same price as the 20GB, $100. not a bad deal.

cliff notes: youre a negative nancy & are looking for excuses to put down a good thing. more for less. and this makes you a fanboy because if it was the PS3 that was getting more features for less money you would go off the walls about how awesome sony is.

bottom line, sony waited and put it all in at a high price point. MS released a year earlier for less $ and made it user customizable. the addition of HDMI wont make any games unplayable. it's techologically impossible, it will be able to output component, optical, vga, as well as HDMI. all the previous are perfectly fine for almost all the HD market.

explain how exactly the addition of hdmi would make any game unplayable on say a 360 bought a year ago? im dying to know.:booty::bomb::hot:

[millrat1030]

I get the feeling I'm one of the few who feel's like M$ is screwing current 360 owners. Yes these features don't do much for gameplay, but upgrading a system thats less than 2 years old! Come on that's a total screw job. I can live with it when it comes to my PC, that's expected. No console has ever spit in the faces of its customers like this. Yes the PS2 got upgraded years after its original release and after a price drop. So if M$ offers this 360v2 for $299, and lets us trade our old 360s for a good buck maybe just maybe it wouldn't be that bad. The one thing that sticks in my mind though is how long before they do it again? Will we have to start buying new 360s every couple of years? That's going to hurt them in the long run. Average joe's like me, as well as parents out there, don't want to be buying new consoles every 2 years. I understand that the upgrades are not that big, unless HD drive is added, but it still sucks. What is M$ saying to the 2+ million people who bought 360s during the Holiday season? Believe me this is going to swing alot of Sony bashers to Sony praisers.

[anionyx]

I agree with you guys. Why can't Microsoft make an HDMI cable that goes through the video slot in the back of the console? Why would they make us buy a system with a bigger hard drive and built in HD-DVD(which I doubt since they have said that they would not support HDDVD if it failed). I understand the smaller chips, the PS2 went thru that and even a slimmer model in a year or two I would buy a la PS2 slim but can't they just make the hard drive an enclosure and allow us to put our own drives in it a la PS3. I am loyal to MS and Nintendo this generation (so far) but if this X361 does come to fruition then I will trade in my X360 for a PS3 and toss in a 750GB hard drive and just call it a day

[propeller_head]

Just Purchased my 360 from best buy 3 days ago.
Should i return it and wait for the new one?
Do you think its going to be soon enough for me to
return and wait??
its not going to come out till the summer. since thats whem MS is releasing the 65nm 360s.

if there are no games in the next 6 months you want to play. and you have a 1080p HDTV w/ HDMI 1.3. and you can see any diff between HDMI and component. then wait. if not, just get it and be happy w/ it.

i have a theory that they will offer a service which will map whats on a current 20GB drive and just automate the DL of an image of everything you have (or choose) on a new 120GB drive. after the system has been powered down & drives switched of course ;)

[greedycheese]

I get the feeling I'm one of the few who feel's like M$ is screwing current 360 owners. Yes these features don't do much for gameplay, but upgrading a system thats less than 2 years old! Come on that's a total screw job. I can live with it when it comes to my PC, that's expected. No console has ever spit in the faces of its customers like this. Yes the PS2 got upgraded years after its original release and after a price drop. So if M$ offers this 360v2 for $299, and lets us trade our old 360s for a good buck maybe just maybe it wouldn't be that bad. The one thing that sticks in my mind though is how long before they do it again? Will we have to start buying new 360s every couple of years? That's going to hurt them in the long run. Average joe's like me, as well as parents out there, don't want to be buying new consoles every 2 years. I understand that the upgrades are not that big, unless HD drive is added, but it still sucks. What is M$ saying to the 2+ million people who bought 360s during the Holiday season? Believe me this is going to swing alot of Sony bashers to Sony praisers.

Honest question. Would you rather have Microsoft not improve its product?

[anionyx]

Wait!! Didn't they all just extend our warranties? You think if our 360 v 1.0 "happen" to break they would replace them or allow us to put them towards the 361. Damn you M$ we should have never trusted you. I should have remembered the Windows...the Windows......

[sblymnlcrymnl]

I don't care about the rest of it but I am waiting on the new chip, at the very least.

[anionyx]

It is okay to improve a product to lessen their expense. That is just streamlining and improving their profitability that is okay but the point of a console is that when you buy it you can keep playing it till the end of that console life. I have friends who still have their phat PS2's and they play just fine. I hope this is a rumor. This X361 reminds me of Sega dumping their Saturn for the Dreamcast. Remember that you guys?

[alongx]

Yeah but that didn't make the games look better or add High Def movies.

High def movies aren't added in this iteration, and they likely never will be. HD-DVD is never going to be used for games, so it doesn't make sense to have it built in. As far as "looking better", the 360 now can do full 1080P (same as HDMI will be capable of) over VGA.

These additions are like the PS2's late addition of a built in ethernet port: previously, you could buy accessories to add the functionality that now is standard.

That said, if this comes out by the end of the year, I may very well buy one. Fall 2007 I should be buying my own place and building a theater setup, and a new souped-up 360 would compliment that nicely.

Edit: Why have numerous idiots claimed that the supposed Xbox "361" would include a built in HD-DVD? The original report from Engadget and all of its subsequent coverage has indicated: 5X harddrive space, cooler running CPU, HDMI port. Never has HD-DVD been mentioned.

[Michaellvortega]

What are you bitches complaining about? Sony came out with the PSX,remember that? So yes Sony has done this before and they said they planned to make another PSX type model with the PS3. Secondly what MAKES you screwed over by a newer 360? Do you absolutely need to have HDMI? No, do you have to absolutely need to have a built in HDDVD drive? No, do you absolutely need a bigger hard drive? No. Does this prevent you from playing 360 games only the ultimate model can? NO. If this rumor was true(and this has been around years before 360 launch) then the higher model is to satisfy the people that have to have best of the best with extra features. It would not be able to play any games that a regular 360 cant and if you believed otherwise you are STUPID. Don't ever buy anything electronics or a car again if thats your frame of thinking.


OH NOES PS2 with DVR+more!
http://img393.imageshack.us/img393/7725/280pxpsx5100iu8.th.jpg (http://img393.imageshack.us/my.php?image=280pxpsx5100iu8.jpg)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSX_(DVR)

[propeller_head]

I agree with you guys. Why can't Microsoft make an HDMI cable that goes through the video slot in the back of the console? Why would they make us buy a system with a bigger hard drive and built in HD-DVD(which I doubt since they have said that they would not support HDDVD if it failed). I understand the smaller chips, the PS2 went thru that and even a slimmer model in a year or two I would buy a la PS2 slim but can't they just make the hard drive an enclosure and allow us to put our own drives in it a la PS3. I am loyal to MS and Nintendo this generation (so far) but if this X361 does come to fruition then I will trade in my X360 for a PS3 and toss in a 750GB hard drive and just call it a day
there will never be a built in HD-DVD. EVER. MS has said this w/ finality. theyre just too slow reading standard dvds.

btw, the PS3 drive is a 2.5" laptop model. there are no 750GB drives for it.
it goes up to (a toshiba) 200GB atm, but a 200GB drive is $250 OEM. it's also 4200rpm while the PS3s is 5400, not sure if that makes any dif for it.

a $120GB drive is about $95 OEM atm. which is what i suspect the accessory to be since it's the price of the current 20GB model.

im more curious as to the seperate HDMI though. i have a sneaking suspicion that the current port is HDMI capable and that there will be a cable down the line that current owners can buy. reason being, the port is capable of outputting a digital signal as well as an analog.

[Punk_Raven]

I'm guessing Microsoft didn't sell the consumer a console that isn't capable of playing all games intentionally. They were just looking for it to be like a PS2. They did forget that the hardrive is a big part of the experience, whereas everything included in the PS2 package is all you need.

Firstly, everyone who is complaining about recently buying a 360, stop complaining. Please. Ok, so becuase you just bought a 360 you want to hold everyone else up from a redisign because you feel ripped off. Deal with it. Technology advances. If they would have waited another year everyone would have bitched about it. You all knew that it had some problems and room for improvement in the first place and you took that risk.

And yes, it is like you were beta testing the console. And again you took that risk when you decided to buy it early on. It's not like you didn't get anything out of it though. You got good games before everyone else did. It's just a redisign guys.

How the hell can you ( somebody) compare this to when Sega dropped the Saturn for the Dreamcast? No. Just no. It's not a new console. It's just a redisign.

[propeller_head]

It is okay to improve a product to lessen their expense. That is just streamlining and improving their profitability that is okay but the point of a console is that when you buy it you can keep playing it till the end of that console life. I have friends who still have their phat PS2's and they play just fine. I hope this is a rumor. This X361 reminds me of Sega dumping their Saturn for the Dreamcast. Remember that you guys?
but the saturn and DC were completely different systems.

this is exactly the same. only it has 1 additional output and a larger HDD which youll be able to buy and just put on your existing 360. you dont have to, but if you wanted to; like you DLed a bunch of HD movies, you can.

its not like all of a suddon games wont work on other 360s, or they wont look as good or play the same etc.. all it is, is MS adding more stuff for less money to sucker punch Sony. the PS2 walked all over the xbox last gen & MS is pulling out all the stops to prevent it from happening again.

[SpecTrE3353]

Mountains out of molehills.

[daroga]

Mountains out of molehills.That's what keeps the internet going!

[F8X]

I just purchased a 360 like 5 days ago, not the news I wanted to hear. But, It would be sweet if the 360 had a hdmi imput and a larger hard-drive(but 20gigs actually is enough(for now at least)

[ragnahrok]

All this talk but what if...
It only costed $400?

[GizmoGC]

How easy/hard is it to transfer XBL games over to a new system? I would have to have my original HDD, right?

I could sell my 360 with 30+ XBL games on it for easily the same price as the newer 360. I wonder if this one can still be modded to play backups...hmmm....

[seanr1221]

I wonder what this means if you have a Gamestop/EB warranty. Just say this new system did come out, and it was 500.00, I wonder if you could throw in an extra 100.00 using your warranty and get the new system.....hmmm...

[Michaellvortega]

How easy/hard is it to transfer XBL games over to a new system? I would have to have my original HDD, right?

I could sell my 360 with 30+ XBL games on it for easily the same price as the newer 360. I wonder if this one can still be modded to play backups...hmmm....

XBL Games are linked to your Gamertag. You could sell your original system and re download them at no extra cost, unlike the Wii

I wonder what this means if you have a Gamestop/EB warranty. Just say this new system did come out, and it was 500.00, I wonder if you could throw in an extra 100.00 using your warranty and get the new system.....hmmm...

Im sure that wouldnt be a problem at 99% of the GS/EB's

[GizmoGC]

XBL Games are linked to your Gamertag. You could sell your original system and re download them at no extra cost, unlike the Wii

Interesting. So all I would lose is the ability to play burned games...hmmm. I guess we will find out the details soon enough.

At the current moment its not possible with the Wii. A quick phonecall to Nintendo and you can.

[Sir_Fragalot]

Whats probably going to happen is Microsoft doesn't drop the 360's price, but instead includes a free 20 gig hard drive in the core package which right there would kill the PS3 because thats all you need to get online besides a live account and a ethernet cable. The $400 premium gets the 100 GB HD and all the extras, and for $500 you get the added in HD-DVD player. All models have HDMI and the quiter chips. Thats what I think will happen, nothing too major but just enough to get those people who were thinking about it, make it happen.

[Diiz]

If they release this relatively soon, back to Costco my 360 goes.

[lilboo]

I'll get one if Microsoft allows some FAIRway to upgrade our systems.

[millrat1030]

Greedycheese, I don't mind a upgrade to a system. I have a problem with doing it in a way that causes you to buy a completely new system. I am very suprised in the number of people who are not bothered by this. Not one M$ fanboy wants to commit on what comes next. What if next year they decide they need the extra room of HD or Blu-ray discs? Now they want us to buy another new system? All I'm saying is this seems crazy when you take into consideration the price of these consoles. I agree that it has room for improvements, all consoles do. It just seems like M$ is trying to compare to the PS3. This funny, especially after comeing out and saying the current 360 is better than the PS3. For those who say that's what we get for being early adapter, BULL__IT!!! I just bought my 360, I waited a year for them to work the bugs out, how long should you wait to buy a console? Give me a break. I for one will never buy another M$ machine again, if this turns out to be true. I guess some of you have the money to burn on these new consoles every year. But my question to you is if have this much money why are you here at CAG? I give one thing to M$ they have done a good job of brain washing you fanboys into spending your every penny on their products. First add ons, now new systems. Where does it end?

[Punk_Raven]

1st off, they never even said anything aobut adding an internal HD DVD player. An external one is a more sensible decision, seeing as the war isn't over yet....(not at millrat)

Second. Stop fucking whining. Please. Good god. You make it seem as if this is the worst thing in the world. You can still play Xbox 360 games in HD, if it means anything to you. Just stop. Waiting a year and then buying it STILL makes you an early adapter. console generations can last up to 6 years or so....

" how long should you wait to buy a console?" Now that you have the console could you just enjoy it and stop bitching? " I guess osme of you have the money to spend on buying these consoles" " If you do then you shouldn't be here at CAG" Whatever the fuck, man. A good 50 percent of the people in the thread have said that they only care about the harddrive and the other half have said that they are for it. What's wrong with wanting the best you can get? And if you notice, alot of the people here at CAG have huge collections. Does that make them rich? No. They just know how to bargain shop. Hence the name.

The upgrade isn't neccesary. HDMI isn't even important to the America that only has 11 percent of households with HDTVs. I don't know about you, but i'm worried about console longevity. The new harddrive is ( depending on who you talk to ) but the new smaller processor ( or more internal things to fix problems....i'd hope ) aren't. People have been going fine with 360s from launch. It's just that more people talk about problems than good things generally. So you don't need any of the things that you'd need the new console for...


Just admit it : you're pissed off becuase you bought something at the wrong time. It's not anyone's fault, it's pure coicidence. It's ok to be pissed about it, I just hate the other bullshit that you're coming out with.

P.S. I'm not a M$ fanoby I don't even have an Xbox 360 yet. Uh..better you that me? (kidding).

[Morpheus]

Interesting. So all I would lose is the ability to play burned games...hmmm. I guess we will find out the details soon enough.

At the current moment its not possible with the Wii. A quick phonecall to Nintendo and you can.

You would also lose the capabilty to play offline with the XBLA games, downloadable content you paid for, and anything else you downloaded. I'm going through the circle jerk with customer service about this since I realized I couldn't play any of my DLC offline on my refurbished console that I got from MS repair center. I'll let you know how it goes if you want?

[Duo_Maxwell]

XBL Games are linked to your Gamertag. You could sell your original system and re download them at no extra cost, unlike the Wii


IIRC all you have to do is call Nintendo and then you can redownload the VC games, kin of a pain but still a rather easy fix. Also, I've hears stories where some people have had to have Ms credit them points on dummy accounts to rebuy games because of the DRM scheme having some kind of crazy mojo in it. So, at least from what I've heard, it's not always that easy as you make it seem.

To be honest, I like iTunes setup of things. I just started using it, but already I've authorized 3 computers (desktop, laptop, and work) to access my account. If it were up to me every next gen console would follow the same model (authorizing more than one machine at a time that is).

[Morpheus]

IIRC all you have to do is call Nintendo and then you can redownload the VC games, kin of a pain but still a rather easy fix. Also, I've hears stories where some people have had to have Ms credit them points on dummy accounts to rebuy games because of the DRM scheme having some kind of crazy mojo in it. So, at least from what I've heard, it's not always that easy as you make it seem.

To be honest, I like iTunes setup of things. I just started using it, but already I've authorized 3 computers (desktop, laptop, and work) to access my account. If it were up to me every next gen console would follow the same model (authorizing more than one machine at a time that is).

The dummy account scheme is what MS CS had me do. I'm still waiting for the points to arrive. Hence the circle jerk continues.

[elsnow77]

Whats probably going to happen is Microsoft doesn't drop the 360's price, but instead includes a free 20 gig hard drive in the core package which right there would kill the PS3 because thats all you need to get online besides a live account and a ethernet cable. The $400 premium gets the 100 GB HD and all the extras, and for $500 you get the added in HD-DVD player. All models have HDMI and the quiter chips. Thats what I think will happen, nothing too major but just enough to get those people who were thinking about it, make it happen.
so you think people will pay 100 dollars extra just for 80 more gigs?? i doubt it

[Duo_Maxwell]

The dummy account scheme is what MS CS had me do. I'm still waiting for the points to arrive. Hence the circle jerk continues.

See I find that to be rediculous. Yes it is a fix, but you as the subscriber to their service shouldn't have to jump through hoops and create dummy accounts (something you'd think MS would stop people from doing).

[Sir_Fragalot]

so you think people will pay 100 dollars extra just for 80 more gigs?? i doubt it Well you get a wireless controller, headset, ethernet cable, component cable, 80 gig hard drive maybe a hdmi cable. I am sure if someone who wants to download HD movies would go for the extra $100 system.

I could see someone spending the extra $100, maybe if they add some points or something too .

[derder]

I have a launch 360 and a 2 year BB warranty. Hopefully it'll be released by nov 22 or I get the shaft.

[Punk_Raven]

Yes, people will. But adding more things in the box just to charge 100 dollars more is just absurd IMO.

[Duo_Maxwell]

Am I the only one that's actually pretty surprised that they would put a universal HDMI port on the 360?? I mean if you think about it they stand to make much on accesorices sales if they made a propitery cable using the AV out on there now. That makes me think they lack the ability to do that (contrary to some claims put ou tealier by them apparently).

[mykevermin]

the core is EXACTLY the same as the premium. you can easily go out and buy accessories at any time to upgrade it. MS simply gave people a CHOICE. no1 was forced at gunpoint to go buy a core.

The point stands even if nobody in the history of mankind ever bought a single core system: Microsoft released a console that, out of the box, was unprepared to play all of the gaming content released for it thus far (beyond save games, of course, lest you want to bring the PS1 and PS2 into the equation).

The core system is out there whether you bought one or not, and that's the root case on which I build my point. Sales are ultimately irrelevant.

people are getting a bigger HDD (2x as big as the $600 PS3 model) & HDMI as a bonus. & it will start AT MOST the same price as the current premium.

Now, one thing to consider is that the price stayed the same with these revisions on the PS2 and Game Boys. Never once did a change cause the cost of the system to go up in price.

I can live with an HDMI-enabled 360, even though I won't own one. I can output 1080p over component, so it's really not a major difference, IMO. It's completely reasonable to see the same 360 we all have, with an added HDMI port, be released for the same price as the current system is selling. If this rumor turns out to be true, I speculate that this is the most likely scenario.

Now a larger HDD, which must be on the horizon (to reduce reluctance to buy XBL media content over space concerns)...I'm not convinced that we would see a 360 with HDMI and a larger HDD retail for the same price. It sure isn't out of the question, but it could go one way or another.

cliff notes: youre a negative nancy & are looking for excuses to put down a good thing. more for less. and this makes you a fanboy because if it was the PS3 that was getting more features for less money you would go off the walls about how awesome sony is.

I think you need to pore through this thread and reread the things I've had to say before determining that I am an eternal pessimist. I can see from your other posts that you've decided to single me out to get a rise out of me, and in doing so, seem to have intentionally ignored the very rational, and very reasonable, posts I've made thus far in this very thread. Par for the course, no?

bottom line, sony waited and put it all in at a high price point. MS released a year earlier for less $ and made it user customizable. the addition of HDMI wont make any games unplayable. it's techologically impossible, it will be able to output component, optical, vga, as well as HDMI. all the previous are perfectly fine for almost all the HD market.

I'm only quoting this because I was the one you called "negative." :rofl:

explain how exactly the addition of hdmi would make any game unplayable on say a 360 bought a year ago? im dying to know.:booty::bomb::hot:
Your reading comprehension needs to be reexamined, because I said nothing of the sort. If you think so, I can dig up a few ninth grade grammar texts for you to peruse.

[SpikeSpiegel]

The inclusion of an HD-DVD drive is really the only thing that bothers me. I don't need a bigger HDD, and if I decide to get an HDTV I have other options than HDMI.

[propeller_head]

Greedycheese, I don't mind a upgrade to a system. I have a problem with doing it in a way that causes you to buy a completely new system. I am very suprised in the number of people who are not bothered by this. Not one M$ fanboy wants to commit on what comes next. What if next year they decide they need the extra room of HD or Blu-ray discs? Now they want us to buy another new system? All I'm saying is this seems crazy when you take into consideration the price of these consoles. I agree that it has room for improvements, all consoles do. It just seems like M$ is trying to compare to the PS3. This funny, especially after comeing out and saying the current 360 is better than the PS3. For those who say that's what we get for being early adapter, BULL__IT!!! I just bought my 360, I waited a year for them to work the bugs out, how long should you wait to buy a console? Give me a break. I for one will never buy another M$ machine again, if this turns out to be true. I guess some of you have the money to burn on these new consoles every year. But my question to you is if have this much money why are you here at CAG? I give one thing to M$ they have done a good job of brain washing you fanboys into spending your every penny on their products. First add ons, now new systems. Where does it end? geez. they want you to buy a billion new systems, but they know it's not going to happen.

you dont have to buy a new 1. its no different than any of the 1s out now except it has a HDMI port (that's if it really wont just be a new cable).

the large hard drive will be available seperately. its an easy swap.

THEY WILL NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER E V E R release a version w/ HD-DVD or BR internal. BR cant read DVDs. and HD-DVD read them MUCH slower than normal DVD drives.

the console will play the exact same games, the output will look exactly the same, it will just be cheaper and come w/ more stuff.

get over it. consoles have price drops. its the way its always been. and them offering HDMI now doesnt make the 1 you bought any different than it was when you bought it.

you dont suddenly think your car is shit because the next model year comes w/ running lights do you? OMG i will never buy another Honda Accord. i bought my EX and Honda just announced the 2k7 model has running lights? THOSE BASTARDS! :rofl:

honestly. ..

[propeller_head]

The point stands even if nobody in the history of mankind ever bought a single core system: Microsoft released a console that, out of the box, was unprepared to play all of the gaming content released for it thus far (beyond save games, of course, lest you want to bring the PS1 and PS2 into the equation).

The core system is out there whether you bought one or not, and that's the root case on which I build my point. Sales are ultimately irrelevant.







I think you need to pore through this thread and reread the things I've had to say before determining that I am an eternal pessimist. I can see from your other posts that you've decided to single me out to get a rise out of me, and in doing so, seem to have intentionally ignored the very rational, and very reasonable, posts I've made thus far in this very thread. Par for the course, no?



I'm only quoting this because I was the one you called "negative." :rofl:


Your reading comprehension needs to be reexamined, because I said nothing of the sort. If you think so, I can dig up a few ninth grade grammar texts for you to peruse.
blah de blahblahblah. ever heard of the saying K.I.S.S. keep it simple stupid. trying to sound like youre from scottland yard doesnt make the points you try to raise any more legitimate.

youre right not many ppl did buy the core system. but they did offer it and again ITS NO DIFFERENT FROM THE PREMIUM except it doesnt have a HDD or a wireless controller. big whoop. there are 3 probably shitty games you cant play w/o the HDD. people can always buy the HDD at any time.

take for instance some1 bought a core because they didnt have the money for the premium. they play it and enjoy it for a few months & have the money for the HDD so they add it. is that worse than not playing it for a few months and then buying a premium? cause thats what youre implying. that giving people the option is somehow jipping them.

i called you negative because that's what you are. i was simply pointing out THE OBVIOUS FACT. are you going to deny that sony waited a year so they could incorporate BR? that the inclusion of BR raised the price CONSIDERABLY despite being a year later & technically equiv to the 360? Dragnet style. just the facts. if you consider the facts negative, its only because youre inherently defensive of sony & reactionarily see their faults being illustrated as attacks instead of what they are.

YOU SAID QUOTE "in the years to come Premium 360 users could just as easily find themselves unable to play certain software."

THEN you argued by saying people who bought the core couldnt play all the games and listed 1 you knew for sure and 2 you were unsure of (all of which suck according to reviews, i looked to see if they really did require HDD. FFXI is the only 1 i found that said it did).

YOURE TRYING TO PAINT THE PICTURE THAT MS IS CONTUNALLY ROLLING OUT REVISIONS THAT MAKE OLDER MODELS OBSOLETE.

THAT IS CLEARLY NOT THE CASE AND YOU KNOW IT. ITS THE SAME fuckING CONSOLE, JUST HAS A BIGGER HARD DRIVE (which will be available to any1 who already has a 360) AND HDMI AS STANDARD.

YOU DONT NEED TO BE STEVEN fuckING HAWKING TO GRASP THE CONCEPT:dunce::shame:

[brokelikejoke]

If my system breaks i expect them to replace it with the new one(if it does exist) for free... but i wont go as far as forking out for second system just for 1080p i wont notice (unless i fork out 4 G's for a 1080p projector) and a 100GB of extra space i wont use... (thanks to media connect) .... id rather spend that dough on a Wii and a HD DVD...

[imascrub]

THEY WILL NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER E V E R release a version w/ HD-DVD or BR internal. BR cant read DVDs. and HD-DVD read them MUCH slower than normal DVD drives.


What I don't get is where people are getting the idea that BluRay can't read DVDs? Do you mean that they use different laser heads whereas hd-dvd uses the same laser to read hd and regular dvds? (I know nothing about if this is correct or not, maybe somebody can source me on this one)

I can play dvds fine with my ps3. In fact it has the DVD logo right next to the BluRay logo right on the side of the ps3.

[getmyrunon]

Searching for two phrases that will give his most recent posting an air of legitimacy all its own, propeller_head settles on "Scottland[sic] Yard" and "Steven[sic] Hawking", confident that their inclusion will leave others confident of his genius.

You should probably take your own advice about simplicity and avoid referencing random nouns you believe to be associated with intelligence if you can't even spell them correctly.

Oh yeah, the rest of your post was garbage too.

[JaytheGamefan]

I'm definitely buying the revamped 360, as I held off on asking for one this Christmas because I was expecting this to happen, and wanted to get the most reliable 360 hardware available. I hope this hits stores before Forza 2 - I doubt I'll have the willpower to hold off on buying that game for a while.

[Final Starman]

About the earlier discussion on whether or not future versions of the 360 would have integrated HD DVD drives, I think this article from joystiq may help.
http://www.joystiq.com/2007/01/05/microsoft-hd-dvd-might-be-next-betamax-switch-to-blu-ray-sti/

[javeryh]

More proof and a video. (http://www.xbox-scene.com/xbox1data/sep/EEylpyZkVpwzemjZKk.php)

[mykevermin]

blah de blahblahblah. ever heard of the saying K.I.S.S. keep it simple stupid. trying to sound like youre from scottland yard doesnt make the points you try to raise any more legitimate.

youre right not many ppl did buy the core system. but they did offer it and again ITS NO DIFFERENT FROM THE PREMIUM except it doesnt have a HDD or a wireless controller. big whoop. there are 3 probably shitty games you cant play w/o the HDD. people can always buy the HDD at any time.

take for instance some1 bought a core because they didnt have the money for the premium. they play it and enjoy it for a few months & have the money for the HDD so they add it. is that worse than not playing it for a few months and then buying a premium? cause thats what youre implying. that giving people the option is somehow jipping them.

You're, yet again, missed my point. If you'd like me to "Keep it Simple Stupid," let me do so, for the fifteenth time.

With everything that comes in the box, the Core Xbox 360 can not play certain games, and can not utilize others to their full extent (playing DLC, playing online).

What don't you get about that? Again, you're using the same grammatical error ("all...except") by saying it's "ITS NO DIFFERENT FROM THE PREMIUM except it doesnt have a HDD or a wireless controller."

Well, the reason I pointed your first usage of it out is that the use of "except" renders the use of "all," or "no different," neutered. If you have to list exceptions, then it is no longer the case that "all" games work, or that it is "no different." By making specifications about what the core is, in fact, you're reminding me precisely that it *is* different from the premium console.

Somehow, I'm keeping it very simple, and you're not figuring it out. I refuse to take the blame for that.

i called you negative because that's what you are. i was simply pointing out THE OBVIOUS FACT. are you going to deny that sony waited a year so they could incorporate BR? that the inclusion of BR raised the price CONSIDERABLY despite being a year later & technically equiv to the 360? Dragnet style. just the facts. if you consider the facts negative, its only because youre inherently defensive of sony & reactionarily see their faults being illustrated as attacks instead of what they are.
Where are you pulling this from? You're putting a lot of words in my mouth, and making a great deal of assumptions, in order to portray me as "negative." I've never said, nor denied, anything in the above quotes, Senator McCarthy, so you can keep your self-righteous diatribes.

YOU SAID QUOTE "in the years to come Premium 360 users could just as easily find themselves unable to play certain software."

THEN you argued by saying people who bought the core couldnt play all the games and listed 1 you knew for sure and 2 you were unsure of (all of which suck according to reviews, i looked to see if they really did require HDD. FFXI is the only 1 i found that said it did).

YOURE TRYING TO PAINT THE PICTURE THAT MS IS CONTUNALLY ROLLING OUT REVISIONS THAT MAKE OLDER MODELS OBSOLETE.

THAT IS CLEARLY NOT THE CASE AND YOU KNOW IT. ITS THE SAME fuckING CONSOLE, JUST HAS A BIGGER HARD DRIVE (which will be available to any1 who already has a 360) AND HDMI AS STANDARD.

YOU DONT NEED TO BE STEVEN fuckING HAWKING TO GRASP THE CONCEPT:dunce::shame:
Actually, the argument I'm making is that, based on the business model Microsoft chose, some users don't get to use all of the content of their 360 if they rely strictly on what they get out of the box (my rather rudimentary argument about the capabilities of the core system). As a result, I argue, I would not be surprised to find that Microsoft would do that again in the future. You're willfully misinterpreting the things that I say to suit your definition of me as a foaming-at-the-mouth fanboy, and if that suits you, fine.

Let me quote myself, and how I was pointing out the pitfalls of MS including an internal HD-DVD, which is not something I forsee them doing in the future. Nevertheless, that's at the root at some of the claims/guesses I make that seem to have gotten your ire. Let me post them here to test your reading skills.

It's quite a conundrum for 360, really. They've pledged to embrace the HD-DVD format, and that's fine (esp. since the player is both optional and reasonably priced). However, they've also pledged (and I don't really fully believe this for the long-term future of the 360) that the HD-DVD will only be used for movies, and never for games.

If they choose to integrate it, and add the other things people want, they've easily constructed a $500 console (I'd say it's premature to say it would be $600 - especially b/c MS can weather losses better than Sony, and they're well aware of the backlash of pricing a system that high). Anyway, if they integrate it and allow it to be used for games, they've alienated the just-shy-of-10-million people who currently own a 360, and shown that consumers can't rely on a 360 for the duration of its lifespan based on on the system itself, but the bureaucratic decisions of the company.

OTOH, if they merely integrate it as a movie player (just as likely), they have a system that's closer in price to the PS3, but gives Sony the size advantage because that storage can be used for the PS3 titles, but not the 360.

It's a major catch-22. Personally, I'd like a larger HDD for the 360 and that's about it. I don't see why HDMI is so bloomin' necessary, since the 360 *could* feasibly achieve 1080p over component (it does already for games, doesn't it?). Moreover, if they're committed to not using HD-DVD as a gaming format, it may not serve them well to integrate it (unless the end strategy is to create three-tiers of consoles for consumers to purchase from - yikes).

[help1]

I dont care about the DVI or the cooler chip or quietness, I care about the bigger HDD... I hope that part is BS, or the consoel costs 450 or something.

Another question... if you have a warranty, and your XBOX breaks and you send it in, couldn't you possibly recieve one of these?

[slickkill77]

Doubt it....They may get a lot of the older ones and send you an older one...i dont really care...they will not include the hddvd drive

[Masterkyo]

Suprised! I am still waiting for newest XBOX 360 version & hope it little cheaper compared with PS3.

[Brian9824]

geez. they want you to buy a billion new systems, but they know it's not going to happen.

THEY WILL NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER E V E R release a version w/ HD-DVD or BR internal. BR cant read DVDs. and HD-DVD read them MUCH slower than normal DVD drives.


Can you at least get basic facts right before you try to act like a know it all. Majority of Blu-Ray players can play dvd's. It's up to the manufacturer of the player if its supported much like today's dvd players that can play cd's. You can't even get basic information like that and you act like you know everything.

As everyone else has previously said Microsofts decision to make their core system was a MUCH poorer decision then Sony's because the Core system shipped incomplete. You weren't able to do 95% of the things on XBL, couldn't play xbox games, couldn't even save your games!

Sony's model was fully functional out of the box which everyone aggrees.

[Zen Davis]

See. This new one is the one I would buy. Between everyone who has deluded themselves in believing that Microsoft wouldn't do this to them, I'm just shaking my head at you. Realistically, Microsoft just owned you for your blind fanboyism.

And Blu-Ray can read DVDs.

[millrat1030]

I give up. I'm not crying about this, I'm just angry. No matter what anybody says you fanboys attack them, even with made up facts. It seems most of the spoiled brats whos mommy and daddy's buy their systems run this thread. Hope M$ gives it to you as hard as you like it. I've just became a Sony fanboy for life.

[Brian9824]

The worst part about this change is the speed in which they did it. Imagine the outrage if they released a slim ps2 a year after launch of PS2. For the most part console changes are relatively minor and are done more to reduce costs then add new features.

[Punk_Raven]

You can put it that way, ahmed. It just happens that way all of the time. People who bought the PS2 in the first year got shafted with DREs and people who bought the Gamecube got shafted the entire time with terrible support.

and mykevermin, yes. That is true. But the Core was a mistkae, or atleast I think it was. To me, when you say that they've released a console that is incapable of playing some games, you make it seem so negative. Theoretically, if whomever got the core wanted to buy a game that needs a harddrive, they could just buy it. Just like with the PS2. However harddrives can be used for much more on the 360. But yeah, I don't see it as something that they would do again. I see it as something that they overlooked. I mean, lets face it, microsoft rushed the console out there to get that PS2 head start, and copied the ps2 model with the core deliberately. They screwed up alot during that time. Now that the rush is over, and they've sold their conforatable 10.4 million consoles, they can stop dicking around. They know what's wrong with it, they know what the consumer wants, it's a new year, they can do it. Hopefully they won't screw up again.

I give up. I'm not crying about this, I'm just angry. No matter what anybody says you fanboys attack them, even with made up facts. It seems most of the spoiled brats whos mommy and daddy's buy their systems run this thread. Hope M$ gives it to you as hard as you like it. I've just became a Sony fanboy for life.

I don't even have a 360, man. And most of the people in this thread are trhing to figure out if they can trade theirs in for the new version. Be a sony fanboy for life. Go ahead, do it. Rush out and buy a fucking PS3 and complain about the problems with that. I'm not assuming that becuase it's a launch console it has problems, it's just that usually do have problems. You made that choice, you flew that flag, you wanted the experiences. So either trade it in and wait or shut up and play games.

[hufferstl]

Anyone remember the Duke Controller with the original X-Box??? Microsoft didn't send all the early adopters S-Controllers when they realized they needed a change.

I haven't bought a 360 yet because I am a cheapass and I'm waiting for a price drop. This (rumored) upgraded system reward me being a better cheapass than you people. Thanks Microsoft!!!!!

This whole hard drive issue would clear itself up if they just made Halo 3 hard drive dependant and included the new 120 gig HD in with Halo 3 for $100.

[seanr1221]

The only upside I could see to a 120GB HDD is you could have a bunch of music/tv shows and demos on your console. People need to get their panties out of a wad, this isn't a huge deal.

Cooler chip-sets? Duh, that was expected, if you're system works, who cares if it's a little loud?

HDMI? Does this matter to that many people? I have two HDMI inputs on my tv, but I wont notice that much of a difference on a 30inch tv to go out of my way to use it.

HD-DVD drive? It WONT be used for games. It would be gaming suicide to exclude 9 million customers.

If I can use my gamestop warranty and exchange my console for the new one, if not, oh well. Stop whining and just play some games. It's that simple.

[ncibob]

NONE of this is fact right now. We have a picture and a video. Both could have been doctored to apear to have HDMI and that it works. There is no proof of the HD-DVD or a larger hardrive. Alot of finger pointing and laughing right now by those who don't own the system. Well I point my finger and laugh at you because I do have one and you don't.
Yes changes are made to the systems over time, nothing to get upset about it. The games will still play the same. We have know about the 65nm chip and it running cooler since last April yet so many sound surprised by it.
Until it is made offical by MS, take it all as a rumor. I'm sure we will get a answer tomorrow at CES.

[Punk_Raven]

We'll see at CES. Then I can finally point my finger in laugh back ( if this is true) :).

BTW, real mature.

[rabidmonkeys]

Well there was the toploader NES and the revised SNES... and a shitload of color variations, though those don't really count. And I guess there's the Q Gamecube that came out in Japan if you wanna count that. But the changes in those systems were almost all just cosmetic.

You have no clue what you are talking about.

NES -> Top-loader nes (redesigned, reliable system, new controller 'no blink guarantee')
GameBoy -> Gameboy color (gameboy color games were not playable oon the gameboy)
Gameboy advance -> gameboy sp, (smaller, backlit, new batterylife)
gameboy sp (complete redesign, 4x brighter screen, new batterylife)
ps2 -> ps2 slim (network adaptor INCLUDED, REMOVED expansion port, so NO HDD)
GameCube -> GameCube NO component (nintendo removed the component out ports)
Gamecube -> Panasonic Q (gamecube with dolby 5.1 instead of prologic and played Dvds)

I could go on and on, comparing Genesis to their 3 releases + 2 different controllers (jumping from 3 buttons to 6), Sega Cds 2 releases, + the CDX, 3 different 3DOs, multiple variations of Xbox with better drives, Duke controllers vs. S controllers, PS1's dual shock introduction, the N64 RAM add-on, etc... but I think the point has been made that anyone that bitches about a game company improving their product only shows their fanboy-ism, lack of common sense and selective short-term memory.

[TimPV3]

See. This new one is the one I would buy. Between everyone who has deluded themselves in believing that Microsoft wouldn't do this to them, I'm just shaking my head at you. Realistically, Microsoft just owned you for your blind fanboyism.

And Blu-Ray can read DVDs. Same here, it's a good thing I held off.

It's amazing though. I assumed Microsoft would get more shit for supporting 1080p, HDMI, and now a bigger harddrive just because Sony did it, and basically fucking over anybody who bought a Premium before this came out (if it's the same price. If not, ignore this whole post I guess). I'm pretty sure everybody got pissed when Sony added motion sensing to the controller, yet Microsoft does this and it's all fine and dandy.

[GizmoGC]

You would also lose the capabilty to play offline with the XBLA games, downloadable content you paid for, and anything else you downloaded. I'm going through the circle jerk with customer service about this since I realized I couldn't play any of my DLC offline on my refurbished console that I got from MS repair center. I'll let you know how it goes if you want?

My 360 is always online, so not playing the XBL games offline wouldn't matter. Sounds like an awesome way to get a new 360.

[TimPV3]

blah de blahblahblah. ever heard of the saying K.I.S.S. keep it simple stupid. trying to sound like youre from scottland yard doesnt make the points you try to raise any more legitimate.

youre right not many ppl did buy the core system. but they did offer it and again ITS NO DIFFERENT FROM THE PREMIUM except it doesnt have a HDD or a wireless controller. big whoop. there are 3 probably shitty games you cant play w/o the HDD. people can always buy the HDD at any time.

take for instance some1 bought a core because they didnt have the money for the premium. they play it and enjoy it for a few months & have the money for the HDD so they add it. is that worse than not playing it for a few months and then buying a premium? cause thats what youre implying. that giving people the option is somehow jipping them.

i called you negative because that's what you are. i was simply pointing out THE OBVIOUS FACT. are you going to deny that sony waited a year so they could incorporate BR? that the inclusion of BR raised the price CONSIDERABLY despite being a year later & technically equiv to the 360? Dragnet style. just the facts. if you consider the facts negative, its only because youre inherently defensive of sony & reactionarily see their faults being illustrated as attacks instead of what they are.

YOU SAID QUOTE "in the years to come Premium 360 users could just as easily find themselves unable to play certain software."

THEN you argued by saying people who bought the core couldnt play all the games and listed 1 you knew for sure and 2 you were unsure of (all of which suck according to reviews, i looked to see if they really did require HDD. FFXI is the only 1 i found that said it did).

YOURE TRYING TO PAINT THE PICTURE THAT MS IS CONTUNALLY ROLLING OUT REVISIONS THAT MAKE OLDER MODELS OBSOLETE.

THAT IS CLEARLY NOT THE CASE AND YOU KNOW IT. ITS THE SAME fuckING CONSOLE, JUST HAS A BIGGER HARD DRIVE (which will be available to any1 who already has a 360) AND HDMI AS STANDARD.

YOU DONT NEED TO BE STEVEN fuckING HAWKING TO GRASP THE CONCEPT:dunce::shame:Settle the fuck down cuntscab, and go back to Gamefaqs

[Zen Davis]

Settle the fuck down cuntscab, and go back to Gamefaqs

There were better ways to handle that....

[DeathDealer]

So about the Core/premium debate. Did it occur to anyone that maybe the core is perfect for someone that doesnt have an internet connection? You say "oh well they cant have dlc or xbla without the hd so you cant play everything on it." well youre also not getting on live without the hard drive so you dont have access to that stuff. again, without a internet connection, a premium really isnt needed. I just got internet at home about a month ago, so does that mean my premium couldnt play all the games? or was "broken" no. It plays the games I see at the store and buy. The games that are publicized on tv. The games most of my friends would be playing and talking about.
Anyway point being you can play any game that you buy at the store. the store you bought your 360 at. Live is awesome yes, but its an added bonus of being a 360 owner. some people dont even know what live is. they see the consoles, they see the games. they buy the consoles, they buy the games.

[Zen Davis]

So about the Core/premium debate. Did it occur to anyone that maybe the core is perfect for someone that doesnt have an internet connection? You say "oh well they cant have dlc or xbla without the hd so you cant play everything on it." well youre also not getting on live without the hard drive so you dont have access to that stuff. again, without a internet connection, a premium really isnt needed. I just got internet at home about a month ago, so does that mean my premium couldnt play all the games? or was "broken" no. It plays the games I see at the store and buy. The games that are publicized on tv. The games most of my friends would be playing and talking about.

But you'd have to beat all your games in one sitting unless you wanted to spend $40 on the memory card. I remember last year - moms were asking if you could 'complete' the Core version into the Premium version.

[propeller_head]

Settle the fuck down cuntscab, and go back to Gamefaqs :hot:fuck you you fuckity fuck fuck fucker fuckface:hot:

:booty::booty::booty:
:applause:

http://www.penny-arcade.com/images/2004/20041103h.jpg

:lol:

[propeller_head]

Can you at least get basic facts right before you try to act like a know it all. Majority of Blu-Ray players can play dvd's. It's up to the manufacturer of the player if its supported much like today's dvd players that can play cd's. You can't even get basic information like that and you act like you know everything.

As everyone else has previously said Microsofts decision to make their core system was a MUCH poorer decision then Sony's because the Core system shipped incomplete. You weren't able to do 95% of the things on XBL, couldn't play xbox games, couldn't even save your games!

Sony's model was fully functional out of the box which everyone aggrees.
nope BR cant read DVDs. thats a FACT. the diode WONT. it needs a seperate laser. HD-DVD doesnt need a seperate laser. neither of them can read DVDs at 16x. they can play DVD movies fine. & wouldnt have trouble w/ a ps2 or xbox game either. but 360 games require much more data fetched fast.

fully funcional....... and almost twice the cost. you try to make it sound like sony provided more for the money.

as i keep trying to point out. MS offered it as an option to people who want to play it now and complete it later. its not like if you buy a core, its a core forever. do you not grasp the concept? thats a rhetorical question. of course you do. whether you admit you do is another story:booty:

[Cormier6083]

:hot:fuck you you fuckity fuck fuck fucker fuckface:hot:





http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/9593/imageqd8.gif

[propeller_head]

Same here, it's a good thing I held off.

It's amazing though. I assumed Microsoft would get more shit for supporting 1080p, HDMI, and now a bigger harddrive just because Sony did it, and basically fucking over anybody who bought a Premium before this came out (if it's the same price. If not, ignore this whole post I guess). I'm pretty sure everybody got pissed when Sony added motion sensing to the controller, yet Microsoft does this and it's all fine and dandy.
- the 360 supports 1080p right now. just not over HDMI

- we still dont know if its a new port or a cable for the existing one

- this isnt effecting the playability of any of the games in any way, shape, or form. they will continue to be built around 720p & component will continue to look identical to HDMI. 720p is the sweet spot this gen. the 360s GPU (xenos) is actually stronger than the RSX & the CPU is much easier to program for than the Cell yet devs for it think 1080p would cause them to give up much of the eye candy. so sharper for the 5% of ppl who have 1080p sets w/ HDMI 1.3. more sterile for every1 else. not a good compromise.

- this is a purely paper move. to lessen the distinction between the PS3 and the 360. so casual shoppers comparing specs side by side at the store see 1 less difference.

again w/ the car analogy. you buy a car for 20 grand. next year the same car comes w/ running lights standard for 20 grand. does that mean your car no longer drives you anywhere? :dunce:

[propeller_head]

http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/9593/imageqd8.gif

:lol:

kermit dont play around :rofl:

[Brian9824]

nope BR cant read DVDs. thats a FACT. the diode WONT. it needs a seperate laser. HD-DVD doesnt need a seperate laser. neither of them can read DVDs at 16x. they can play DVD movies fine. & wouldnt have trouble w/ a ps2 or xbox game either. but 360 games require much more data fetched fast.

fully funcional....... and almost twice the cost. you try to make it sound like sony provided more for the money.

as i keep trying to point out. MS offered it as an option to people who want to play it now and complete it later. its not like if you buy a core, its a core forever. do you not grasp the concept? thats a rhetorical question. of course you do. whether you admit you do is another story:booty:

Once again you are wrong http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-BD-P1000-Blu-Ray-Disc-Player/dp/B000F99FDE/sr=8-1/qid=1168108199/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-3735617-0571238?ie=UTF8&s=electronics
"Backwards compatible with current DVD and CD formats; upconverts DVD movie discs to near high-definition"

http://www.amazon.com/Sony-BDP-S1-Blu-ray-Disc-Player/dp/B000DZS0G8/sr=8-2/qid=1168108199/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2/002-3735617-0571238?ie=UTF8&s=electronics

http://www.amazon.com/Philips-BDP9000-Blu-Ray-Disc-Player/dp/B000H92QXI/sr=8-3/qid=1168108199/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3/002-3735617-0571238?ie=UTF8&s=electronics

Thats just the first few. Each one is fully backwards compatible with cd's and dvds. Let me know when your done showing your ignorance okay.


Also how the hell is the PS3 twice the cost? Premium 360 has the same features as the core PS3 minus the bluray player and the PS3 only costs $100 more. You keep saying random ass stuff and don't even get basic parts of it correct.

Premium 360 = $399
Core PS3 = $499

$499 - $399 = $100 Difference

Finally for the fiftieth time you can't even SAVE games with the Core system without spending another $40 so the system is unuseable as its sold. It's not a matter of allowing you to upgrade it.

[Cormier6083]

Funny mein furline can play DVD's on her Blue Ray playah

[KaneRobot]

:hot:fuck you you fuckity fuck fuck fucker fuckface:hot:

:booty::booty::booty:
:applause:

(insert ha-ha hilarious comic here)

:lol:


nope BR cant read DVDs. thats a FACT. the diode WONT. it needs a seperate laser. HD-DVD doesnt need a seperate laser. neither of them can read DVDs at 16x. they can play DVD movies fine. & wouldnt have trouble w/ a ps2 or xbox game either. but 360 games require much more data fetched fast.

fully funcional....... and almost twice the cost. you try to make it sound like sony provided more for the money.

as i keep trying to point out. MS offered it as an option to people who want to play it now and complete it later. its not like if you buy a core, its a core forever. do you not grasp the concept? thats a rhetorical question. of course you do. whether you admit you do is another story:booty:

You're off to a roaring start here, I see. But more on that below.

The core was "offered" as a way to milk/fool people, and that is all. It wasn't released out of the kindness of Microsoft's heart.

You're twisting what he said to try to make yourself look intelligent by copying whatever little nuggets of info you pulled off wikipedia, and it's not working. He said "the majority of Blu-Ray players can play dvd's." This is true - is there any Blu-Ray player that doesn't? You're getting into the lasers used, which is irrelevant to what was said before. No one is impressed.


I was wondering why I hadn't noticed this goof before, then I noticed he just recently signed up. You've already hit most of the major points - hilarious typos due to your furious little fingers flying over the keys at an alarming rate of speed, overuse of smileys, posting giant graphics that you think reenforce your point.

I look forward on what's sure to be a long and meaningful run for you here. We recently lost our village idiot with the departure of RegalSin and you may be able to fill the spot nicely.

[Cormier6083]

I look forward on what's sure to be a long and meaningful run for you here. We recently lost our village idiot with the departure of RegalSin and you may be able to fill the spot nicely.

I miss Regal.... was he banned?

[Brian9824]

Yeah so far every post he's done has been ripping on the PS3. He's already had the mod's pop into his last major topic telling him to stop getting off track and spouting random stuff. Theres plenty of valid reasons to bash the PS3 yet he chooses the most stupid points possible and has to say everyone else is wrong

[propeller_head]

Once again you are wrong http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-BD-P1000-Blu-Ray-Disc-Player/dp/B000F99FDE/sr=8-1/qid=1168108199/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-3735617-0571238?ie=UTF8&s=electronics
"Backwards compatible with current DVD and CD formats; upconverts DVD movie discs to near high-definition"

http://www.amazon.com/Sony-BDP-S1-Blu-ray-Disc-Player/dp/B000DZS0G8/sr=8-2/qid=1168108199/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2/002-3735617-0571238?ie=UTF8&s=electronics

http://www.amazon.com/Philips-BDP9000-Blu-Ray-Disc-Player/dp/B000H92QXI/sr=8-3/qid=1168108199/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3/002-3735617-0571238?ie=UTF8&s=electronics

Thats just the first few. Each one is fully backwards compatible with cd's and dvds. Let me know when your done showing your ignorance okay. might wanna reread my post BR itself CANT. it needs an additional DVD laser. the HD-DVD diode can so it doesnt. its not a hard concept to grasp. also like i said the dual format drives are fine for playing last gen & movies. but not good enough for the 360 to read games off of. THAT WAS MY POINT:fridge:

btw, the samsung & sony players absolutely suck. if you have to have BR, get a PS3, its the best 1 out atm. the load times on those are horrendus and they produce blocky pictures.

though even w/ component the HD-DVD produces a better picture:hot:
http://www.gamescentral.com/blogs/tek_jansens_explosive_gaming_experience/archive/2006/12/26/ps3-blu-ray-vs-xbox-360-hd-dvd-vs-dvd.aspx

and before you call that guy a fanboy, you might wanna read his review on the PS3 and installing LInux on it.

[Brian9824]

might wanna reread my post BR itself CANT. it needs an additional DVD laser. the HD-DVD diode can so it doesnt. its not a hard concept to grasp. also like i said the dual laser drives are fine for playing last gen & movies. but not good enough for the 360 to read games off of. THAT WAS MY POINT:fridge:

btw, the samsung & sony players absolutely suck. if you have to have BR, get a PS3, its the best 1 out atm. the load times on those are horrendus and they produce blocky pictures.

though even w/ component the HD-DVD produces a better picture:hot:
http://www.gamescentral.com/blogs/tek_jansens_explosive_gaming_experience/archive/2006/12/26/ps3-blu-ray-vs-xbox-360-hd-dvd-vs-dvd.aspx

and before you call that guy a fanboy, you might wanna read his review on the PS3 and installing LInux on it.

Might want to re-read my post then too, I said repeatedly "Majority of Blu-Ray players can play dvd's." i never said a blu ray laser could read it. yet you seem to randomly spout information for no reason. Who has even said anything about playing 360 games using a dual laser drive?

[propeller_head]

You're off to a roaring start here, I see. But more on that below.

The core was "offered" as a way to milk/fool people, and that is all. It wasn't released out of the kindness of Microsoft's heart.

You're twisting what he said to try to make yourself look intelligent by copying whatever little nuggets of info you pulled off wikipedia, and it's not working. He said "the majority of Blu-Ray players can play dvd's." This is true - is there any Blu-Ray player that doesn't? You're getting into the lasers used, which is irrelevant to what was said before. No one is impressed.


I was wondering why I hadn't noticed this goof before, then I noticed he just recently signed up. You've already hit most of the major points - hilarious typos due to your furious little fingers flying over the keys at an alarming rate of speed, overuse of smileys, posting giant graphics that you think reenforce your point.

I look forward on what's sure to be a long and meaningful run for you here. We recently lost our village idiot with the departure of RegalSin and you may be able to fill the spot nicely.
its not irrelevant because it had a point. they wouldnt be able to match the seek speed of the dedicated DVD drive in the 360 right now. thus it wouldnt be internal. and for the record, wikipedia is a horrible place to quote info from, any1 can change it.

again like i said earlier, no1 put a gun to any1s head and forced them to buy it. they were never misled what was in the core. it says right on the box. it was an alternative to those who CHOSE it. and if you think people are that stupid as to not read the box, well.. thats your issue. you act like some1 who wants to blame the homeowner for shooting the burgler.

as for my extremely weird sense of fervant humor :bouncy::bouncy::bouncy::bouncy::bouncy: welcome to my world. it's fun, you should come and play \\:D/:-\":rofl::booty::wave::beer:

[propeller_head]

Might want to re-read my post then too, I said repeatedly "Majority of Blu-Ray players can play dvd's." i never said a blu ray laser could read it. yet you seem to randomly spout information for no reason. Who has even said anything about playing 360 games using a dual laser drive?
the whole point of it, was to dispute the elusion being made that MS will down the line incorporate a HD-DVD drive or Blu-Ray drive into it in another revision.

MS has said flat out over and over w/ emphatical certainty, the DVD drive would stay the same for the life of the system.:bomb::hot:

dont believe me, go read ars tecnica's opposible thumbs
http://arstechnica.com/articles/headstart.ars/1

might also wanna read this 1 too while youre at it
http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2007/1/6/6504

[Cormier6083]

Ah shit a 120 GB HDD?!?!?!?!? WTF I FEELL RIPPPPPPEEEEDDDD!!!!!

[Punk_Raven]

Yeah, this is seeming more and more confusing. It's hard to belive anything Xbox Scene, a website that talks alot about modding consoles, says. And why would they even get this imformation along with engadget? None of this even makes since, and if it's a hoax we all got worked up for nothing.

[daphatty]

the whole point of it, was to dispute the elusion being made that MS will down the line incorporate a HD-DVD drive or Blu-Ray drive into it in another revision.

MS has said flat out over and over w/ emphatical certainty, the DVD drive would stay the same for the life of the system.:bomb::hot:

dont believe me, go read ars tecnica's opposible thumbs
http://arstechnica.com/articles/headstart.ars/1

might also wanna read this 1 too while youre at it
http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2007/1/6/6504

They also said that they weren't going to include an HDMI port.

Regardless, this news disappoints me. As an early adopter I put my faith in MS to follow the path of video game console common sense. Every instance in gaming history where a console has received a major physical upgrade has turned into a disaster, either in public perspective, sales revenue, or both. Anyone want to buy my 360?

[Just Josh]

They also said that they weren't going to include an HDMI port.

Regardless, this news disappoints me. As an early adopter I put my faith in MS to follow the path of video game console common sense. Every instance in gaming history where a console has received a major physical upgrade has turned into a disaster, either in public perspective, sales revenue, or both. Anyone want to buy my 360?

Every instance? What about the new slim PS2 or the new DS Lite? Granted, the changes were mostly cosmetic but they were upgraded nonetheless.

[daphatty]

Every instance? What about the new slim PS2 or the new DS Lite? Granted, the changes were mostly cosmetic but they were upgraded nonetheless.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt because you know damn well what I meant. :booty:

[propeller_head]

They also said that they weren't going to include an HDMI port.

Regardless, this news disappoints me. As an early adopter I put my faith in MS to follow the path of video game console common sense. Every instance in gaming history where a console has received a major physical upgrade has turned into a disaster, either in public perspective, sales revenue, or both. Anyone want to buy my 360? ill be your butler for a month if you can find me a quote where MS says there will never be HDMI.

here's 1 where they say they can implement HDMI when they see a market for it.
IGN: Can the X360 send out a digital signal now, or ever?

Microsoft Xbox 360 currently doesn't include a digital out connection for video. Our platform is flexible enough to allow support of a digital connection in the future should we choose to do so. When the Xbox 360 was being developed HDMI was nascent and with our current connections we support what the overwhelming majority of consumers have available to them. It's important to note that the market penetration of 1080p displays is in the single digits. Regardless, for those early adopters who have displays and projectors that support 1080p over VGA and component we have a solution and it is a free upgrade for them. We are watching the market closely and will continue to evaluate our solution in the face of consumer demand, but have no announcements regarding additional cables or connections. http://gear.ign.com/articles/735/735860p1.html


p.s. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6759620933099471522

[DFC222]

I got my box from costco, whenever this comes out, i will return my current box and get this one

[ranthum]

I can't believe how much people are bitching in this thread. Your current 360 will continue to work fine. People that buy early always end up paying more and or getting less. It's the way the world works. Do you bitch at honda for releasing a 2007 civic after you bought a 2006? Every other console has at least slightly upgraded models and nobody jumps down their throat. It's a good way to keep an older product fresh and new. About the integrated HD-DVD, I don't think it'll happen because I don't think they'll be able to get the DVD read speed high enough.

[Michaellvortega]

Oh noes Im selling my 360 for something else :roll: STFU!

A: This wouldn't be the first time a company has done this. I don't see people raise pitchforks every time Nintendo redesigns a gameboy with a brighter screen or makes it micro. In fact bitches run to preorder it and sell the old units at a loss.

B: Do even 1/4th the people complaing 1(own a HD tv) 2 (have a HD TV with HDMI)

C: Where is the solid proof that this is real? The video on Xbox-scene fails to go to the dash board showing HDMI in the video options(Hmm I wonder why) and I didn't see the guy put a HDDVD movie in the tray, he plays Kameo :roll: great way to show off a new model 360 :roll:
::EDIT:: I had to add the fucking Noob uses a DVI/HDMI adapter to a DVI/VGA adapter! WTF is the piont of that bullshit?

Save this shit for Gamefaqs

[pimpinc333]

Hmmm. Well if it is True. I most likely will buy a new 360 for HDMI. I have an empty HMDI on my TV that I want to use :)

[Trakan]

Oh noes Im selling my 360 for something else :roll: STFU!

A: This wouldn't be the first time a company has done this. I don't see people raise pitchforks every time Nintendo redesigns a gameboy with a brighter screen or makes it micro. In fact bitches run to preorder it and sell the old units at a loss.

B: Do even 1/4th the people complaing 1(own a HD tv) 2 (have a HD TV with HDMI)

C: Where is the solid proof that this is real? The video on Xbox-scene fails to go to the dash board showing HDMI in the video options(Hmm I wonder why) and I didn't see the guy put a HDDVD movie in the tray, he plays Kameo :roll: great way to show off a new model 360 :roll:
::EDIT:: I had to add the fucking Noob uses a DVI/HDMI adapter to a DVI/VGA adapter! WTF is the piont of that bullshit?

Save this shit for Gamefaqs

Looks like just a HDMI>DVI adapter to me. Looks like the DVI cable goes right into the monitor.

I don't think an HD-DVD drive inside is part of this particular rumor. It's just the HDMI port, the quieter chip, and the bigger harddrive.

[OwlBoy]

Seems like this is going to be the new trend...the Appleization of consoles. Release a new update every year or so with just enough new features to woo new buyers and get current owners to rebuy, but not enough new features to alienate those who purchased the now outdated version.


Appleization? hmm. All MP3 player companies come out with new players each year. All Computer companies come out with new computers each year. what the fuck makes apple unique?

-Owl

[Michaellvortega]

Looks like just a HDMI>DVI adapter to me. Looks like the DVI cable goes right into the monitor.

I don't think an HD-DVD drive inside is part of this particular rumor. It's just the HDMI port, the quieter chip, and the bigger harddrive.

I watched it again, your right. I must have seen too many of those adapters today and said "oh no not adapter on adapter BS again' when I saw the video.


Still the legitimacy IMO is 20/80 fake/real. I want to see the dashboard settings before I make a true judgment. If I had a dev kit why would I hang out at Xbox-scene? a site primarily devoted to modding show a xbox-scene tshirt, a possible identifiable tattoo on his/her wrist(a bitch tattoo at that) and show a video of something that could have been made pretty easily by the talent those guys have. If some one can make case mods for fun how hard would it be for them to do that. The Xbox with built in optical component a VGA outputs they made was awesome too but it doesnt mean its real.

[propeller_head]

well know tommorow if it's fake.

This Guy is gunna hold a press confrence at CES 6:30PM in Las Vegas

http://cache.kotaku.com/assets/resources/2006/06/bill_gates_halo_3.jpg

[porieux]

Another thing to make me glad I bought my 360 at Costco.

[scottman]

This will have to have built-in HD-DVD, 120gb, have a majority of games that run in 1080p, and be much cooler and quieter while still costing $400 to make me regret already buying one. (I only payed $200 for my 360 last month from TRU (wishlist and $100 gift card deal)).

I doubt most early adopters will even replace their HDTV's with 1080p sets before the next gen console comes out.

[MetalGator]

As an owner of 1080p Samsung DLP and a first year 360, HDMI is the only rumor getting my attention. I can use VGA and get 1080p, but I'd hate to get screwed out of HDMI.

[Punk_Raven]

This will have to have built-in HD-DVD, 120gb, have a majority of games that run in 1080p, and be much cooler and quieter while still costing $400 to make me regret already buying one. (I only payed $200 for my 360 last month from TRU (wishlist and $100 gift card deal)).

I doubt most early adopters will even replace their HDTV's with 1080p sets before the next gen console comes out.

No. Nobody even said that.

Don't they already upscale to 1080p?

We don't even know that, or if it exists.

Who knows what could happen by that time. I just hope that they run through this slowly to try to get people into HD first before constantly advancing it. Not only are they expensive, but they are a little conplicated. It's almost like they're forcing you to become an AV dork just to watch TV. Well, become an AV dork and pay alot of money.

[greedycheese]

Well, if you have to use the word "except," then you can't use the word "all," can you? In addition to XBLA, there are a handful of games that require the HDD (Final Fantasy XI, and I believe 99 Nights, or Enchant Arms...some of those games I haven't yet played). Not to mention any game demos/DLC.

My point wasn't that you, as a consumer, are stuck for life with the inability to play game X or game Y. My point was that MS was selling a console that, out of the box, can not play all 360 gaming content. As a result of their willingness to sell you a product that, de facto, cannot play all content, it stands to reason they could certainly try that yet again. Is the likelihood of it small? You bet. However, if MS is willing to sell you an "incomplete" system, what makes you so confident that your premium console will be able to play all 360 games for the duration of software releases?

Games that require addiyioal hardware to play are hardly new. Duck Hunt, DDR, Eyetoy, Guitar Hero, FF11 on PS2. So I don't see how big mean M$ is taking advantage of you.

And Live Arcade games are playable with a memory unit. Its the reason for the 50MB size limit that bugs me to no end.

[sj41]

As an owner of 1080p Samsung DLP and a first year 360, HDMI is the only rumor getting my attention. I can use VGA and get 1080p, but I'd hate to get screwed out of HDMI.I also have a 1080p Samsung DLP and a near launch 360. I expected the new CPU and a bigger hard drive to come eventually, but I am suprised about the HDMI, although none of this makes me regret getting my 360. I'm very happy with it now, and maybe I'll try to sell my current one and get this new system a year or two from now.

[greedycheese]

This should prove once and for all that this is not a hoax.
http://www.xbox-scene.com/xbox1data/sep/EEylpyZkVpwzemjZKk.php

full video and high res pics

oops ltoo late. will keep the link here just so its on this page

[Brian9824]

What people keep glossing over is the timeframe issue. if this change had occured 2 years from now people wouldn't be as angry. Just look at how many years between the PS2 and Slim version. Also the cost was MUCH less then the 360. With a gaming system thats supposed to have a life of 5 years drastic changes like this less then a year after launch aren't very good. Especially when you consider that they had to have been working on this new design for several months. So less then a year after their system came out they are already planning a better version that will be superior in every way to their loyal fans who supported them by buying it at launch. Even if technically there is hardly a difference its not very good from their customer's perspective.

I will also say it was a pretty drastic oversight which they are finally correcting with the inclusion of a bigger HD for the 360. 13 Gig's doesnt cut it when they want the 360 to be used as a Media center. The question is what will the new HD cost by itself? If we go by the pricing of their 20 GB HD it would cost around $500.......

[Wolfpup]

I mainly just want a QUIET 360 and a fixed d-pad on the controller. I'll trade in my 360 in a second if I can get a quiet one.

I don't know why anyone's that upset about not having HDMI. It's nice, but I doubt most of us can tell the difference between analog and digital connections for games anyway. (And the 360 doesn't render at 1080p for games, so that's a moot point too.)

If it's THAT important to you you can always trade in your current model towards a new one.

with PS2, the earlier model doesnt have progress scan built in

The DVD player dosen't. The original model would work for the few games that support it. (Moot point as on my TV 480i and p look basically identical).

[anomynous]

For the last time, the 360 can already do games in 1080p through component or VGA

[friedram]

This WOULD be total BS on Microsofts part. They better give me an upgraded system too. However, I'm perfectly happy with mine now. My TV that I have the 360 on does NOT have HDMI, so not a big deal. The HDD would be nice though and I have HD-DVD already.


Better call the WAAAAbulance.

This is why I wait 2-3 years before picking up the console- that and I don't pay full price for the games, just buy them when they are under 30 bucks. Why the hell should I start buying the newest damned stuff when as a PC gamer, I have over 100 PC games in backlog. LOL. I look forward to buying one of these. =D

Thanks to everyone who beta tested the old ones for me!

[greedycheese]

For the last time, the 360 can do games in 1080p

Yeah but didn't you hear? This new one can do 1090P!

[pimpinc333]

For the last time, the 360 can already do games in 1080p through component or VGA

If you can provide some evidence on this that would be great. I am not aware of the 360 being able to do 1080p over component. I thought it was only VGA.

[zewone]

If you can provide some evidence on this that would be great. I am not aware of the 360 being able to do 1080p over component. I thought it was only VGA.
Games only (no DVD) 1080p over component, and your HDTV has to accept 1080p over component as well.

[Sporadic]

Better call the WAAAAbulance.

Better call in the lame, unoriginal lingo to complete the internet douchebag stereotype.

L33TPWN3DFTWLOLROLF

[anomynous]

If you can provide some evidence on this that would be great. I am not aware of the 360 being able to do 1080p over component. I thought it was only VGA.
Here's your proof:

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/x/xbox360componenthdcable/


Again, your TV has to accept 1080p through component for it to work

[doubledown]

Better call the WAAAAbulance.

This is why I wait 2-3 years before picking up the console- that and I don't pay full price for the games, just buy them when they are under 30 bucks. Why the hell should I start buying the newest damned stuff when as a PC gamer, I have over 100 PC games in backlog. LOL. I look forward to buying one of these. =D

Thanks to everyone who beta tested the old ones for me!

Who says I pay full price for this you unoriginal douchebag. I got my 360 with credit and never paid $60 for a game....

Go play your illegal PC games now.

[Michaellvortega]

If you can provide some evidence on this that would be great. I am not aware of the 360 being able to do 1080p over component. I thought it was only VGA.

WTF? Where the fuck have you been? I hope that was a joke.