50GB HD-DVD announced; 200GB Blu-Ray Disc annoucned

[djkunai]

http://blogs.pcworld.com/staffblog/archives/003423.html

Credit to Ruined.

[GizmoGC]

Sony is planning on announcing a 51GB disc soon. They gotta 1up Toshiba somehow.

[dpatel]

this format war needs to end already. this news will just drag it out longer.

[Graystone]

this format war needs to end already. this news will just drag it out longer.

I agree this format war has just turned into a clusterfuck, and it needs to end.

[cochesecochese]

That's awesome. Glad to see major corporations aren't above acting childish.

[btw1217]

Yeah, I hate it when companies try to improve formats. I mean, you really can't even notice a difference between VHS and DVD, or 8-track and CD. It was all just a waste of time and money.

Sony's goes to 50GB, Toshiba's only went to 30GB. Shame on Toshiba for wanting to improve. It's not childish, people. It's called competition.


Seen as the pillar of capitalism in that it may stimulate innovation, encourage efficiency, or drive down prices, competition is touted as the foundation upon which capitalism is justified. According to microeconomic theory, no system of resource allocation is more efficient than pure competition. Competition, according to the theory, causes commercial firms to develop new products, services, and technologies. This gives consumers greater selection and better products. The greater selection typically causes lower prices for the products compared to what the price would be if there was no competition (monopoly) or little competition (oligopoly).

[djkunai]

Yeah, I hate it when companies try to improve formats. I mean, you really can't even notice a difference between VHS and DVD, or 8-track and CD. It was all just a waste of time and money.

Sony's goes to 50GB, Toshiba's only went to 30GB. Shame on Toshiba for wanting to improve. It's not childish, people. It's called competition.

I was ready to smack you until I found the sarcasm. ;)

[Vinny]

Well, it's only a matter of time before Sony releases the quad layer BD disc... which will hold 100GB. But as far as I know, that's not rewritable and it hasn't passed real world tests yet (meaning it's only worked in the labs thus far).

It's odd to see a 51GB HD DVD disc... I thought they could only increase the capacity by increments of 15.:-k

[ITDEFX]

the day Paramount announces the star trek series (any) on 1 of these discs (1 season per disc?), i will be a very happy camper! :)

[rickonker]

the day Paramount announces the star trek series (any) on 1 of these discs (1 season per disc?), i will be a very happy camper! :)
I'd like that too but they won't do it that way (1 season per disc).

[-Never4ever-]

Yeah, I hate it when companies try to improve formats. I mean, you really can't even notice a difference between VHS and DVD, or 8-track and CD. It was all just a waste of time and money.

Sony's goes to 50GB, Toshiba's only went to 30GB. Shame on Toshiba for wanting to improve. It's not childish, people. It's called competition.

We're just tired of this HD/BD fued. Both need to seriously die.

[Michaellvortega]

I wouldn't mind having a lot of DVD's with HD content on them. So what if 1 DVD equaled one episode of show.

[RedvsBlue]

I wouldn't mind having a lot of DVD's with HD content on them. So what if 1 DVD equaled one episode of show.
Its not just the disc though. Its the player itself that can't process a 1080p signal. There's a reason why there's a pentium 4 processor in the HD-DVD drives.

[zewone]

the day Paramount announces the star trek series (any) on 1 of these discs (1 season per disc?), i will be a very happy camper! :)
All the episodes would fit on one disc if it was still in 640x480, but since the resolution is 1920x1080 it takes up a lot more disc space meaning that you're unlikely to see anything like this for awhile, if ever.

To all the people wanting the HD-DVD/Blu-Ray war to end, none of the investors are just going to give up this early in the game. There is a lot of money to be made. Right now it's a 50/50 chance of who's going to come out on top. Even if you are all satisfied with DVD, sooner or later there is going to be a lot more HDTVs on the market and there will be a natural switch to high definition movies at home. It's still years off, but it will happen.

[Kaijufan]

All the episodes would fit on one disc if it was still in 640x480, but since the resolution is 1920x1080 it takes up a lot more disc space meaning that you're unlikely to see anything like this for awhile, if ever.

To all the people wanting the HD-DVD/Blu-Ray war to end, none of the investors are just going to give up this early in the game. There is a lot of money to be made. Right now it's a 50/50 chance of who's going to come out on top. Even if you are all satisfied with DVD, sooner or later there is going to be a lot more HDTVs on the market and there will be a natural switch to high definition movies at home. It's still years off, but it will happen.
From what I understand of Trek the Orginal Series was shot on film, and has be upgraded to HD with new CGI special effects (I've seen a few episodes of it, the new effects look great). However, TNG, DS9 and Voyager could be upgraded to HD, but the special effects and masters are on tape, so they would have to go back and redo all the speical effects and remaster the shows if they wanted anything better then upconverted 480p (which I doubt would be cost effective). Enterprise is HD.

[naes]

Fuck, that's like an eighth of my hard drive...

[ITDEFX]

From what I understand of Trek the Orginal Series was shot on film, and has be upgraded to HD with new CGI special effects (I've seen a few episodes of it, the new effects look great). However, TNG, DS9 and Voyager could be upgraded to HD, but the special effects and masters are on tape, so they would have to go back and redo all the speical effects and remaster the shows if they wanted anything better then upconverted 480p (which I doubt would be cost effective). Enterprise is HD.


to be honest, it would be nice just to have all episodes of a season on 1 disc. I understand not all of trek was shot on hd, except enterprise season 4. But to anyone who has owned the series, those box sets can be combersome and it would be nice just to have a season disc where you sit down hit play all and watch a 23 hr season marathon without having to swap discs or use a 5 disc changer. :)

To redo all of trek in HD and the special effects would cost Paramount just way too much money.

[Strell]

Yes, but it can't defeat the quadlaser.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/Einzell/quadlaser.png

It is over now.

[Kayden]

Well... only if it doesn't know how to sidestep. :lol:


Yes, but it can't defeat the quadlaser.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/Einzell/quadlaser.png

It is over now.

[Strell]

Well... only if it doesn't know how to sidestep. :lol:

HD-DVDs know how and are able to sidestep?

The bullet is enormous, there is no escaping!
Jumping....is useless!

[TimPV3]

Sony is planning on announcing a 51GB disc soon. They gotta 1up Toshiba somehow.They already developed the 100GB

[Kayden]

HD-DVDs know how and are able to sidestep?

The bullet is enormous, there is no escaping!
Jumping....is useless!
You and your third dimension. Its cute, really. I have five... ...thousand. Don't question it!

[Strell]

You and your third dimension. Its cute, really. I have five... ...thousand. Don't question it!

Then pick up that rack of DVDs and sink it deep within your body.

[Kayden]

Then pick up that rack of DVDs and sink it deep within your body.
And then their DVDs shall become mine through the course of my actions, and I shall smoke while doing it. 8-)

[Strell]

And then their DVDs shall become mine through the course of my actions, and I shall smoke while doing it. 8-)

We will acquire some wine on the way to the mall, and get tow up.

[Kayden]

We will acquire some wine on the way to the mall, and get tow up.

Whatever, just stay in your laser prison.

[Chacrana]

While this discussion is completely irrelevant as far as gaming goes,

http://gear.ign.com/articles/753/753812p1.html

[dpatel]

Yeah, I hate it when companies try to improve formats. I mean, you really can't even notice a difference between VHS and DVD, or 8-track and CD. It was all just a waste of time and money.

Sony's goes to 50GB, Toshiba's only went to 30GB. Shame on Toshiba for wanting to improve. It's not childish, people. It's called competition.

If that was directed at me, let me explain:

The longer the two try and remain competitive to one another, the longer this meaningless format war will go on. This is one of the instances where competition actually hurts the consumer. It splits the fanbase and slows the reduction of manufacturing costs, as well as the penetrate rate of the formats. Keep in mind that these two formats still have to overcome the DVD which has just recently overtaken VHS. With the two constantly competing, they are only hurting each others chances against DVD.

I know why Toshiba wanted to improve, and it makes sense from a business standpoint. But the sooner one format dies out, the better it will be for all of us. Each format has done fine without any competition (I realize that formats initially had competition, but one eventually and inevitably dies out, leaving one format as the standard for the next several years).

And I was gonna post the 200GB Blu-ray disc, but Chacrana beat me to it. Because of Blu-ray's potential and current support, I really hope it is HD-DVD that bites the dust, and I hope it is soon.

[Chacrana]

And I was gonna post the 200GB Blu-ray disc, but Chacrana beat me to it. Because of Blu-ray's potential and current support, I really hope it is HD-DVD that bites the dust, and I hope it is soon.

I'm still convinced that both formats will fail. Sure, they're finding ways to up the size of both formats, but what does that mean to the vast majority of consumers? Absolutely nothing. They don't know the difference between this and DVD other than the fact that these next gen things are much, much more expensive. You can't sell these formats to the people who just bought $30 DVD players at Wal-Mart and unfortunately, that's most of the consumers out there.

[dpatel]

I'm still convinced that both formats will fail. Sure, they're finding ways to up the size of both formats, but what does that mean to the vast majority of consumers? Absolutely nothing. They don't know the difference between this and DVD other than the fact that these next gen things are much, much more expensive. You can't sell these formats to the people who just bought $30 DVD players at Wal-Mart and unfortunately, that's most of the consumers out there.

Yea. The majority of DVD sales came when DVD players were dirt cheap. The early adopters make up a small portion of the population. I don't think both will fail. I think one will succeed, it will just take a LOT longer than most think. I don't think we will see a clear winner between hd-dvd/blu-ray until about 4-5 years from now. Once that is determined, the format still has to work its way into the mainstream to beat DVDs.

[Chacrana]

Yea. The majority of DVD sales came when DVD players were dirt cheap. The early adopters make up a small portion of the population. I don't think both will fail. I think one will succeed, it will just take a LOT longer than most think. I don't think we will see a clear winner between hd-dvd/blu-ray until about 4-5 years from now. Once that is determined, the format still has to work its way into the mainstream to beat DVDs.

Man, a CAG with a plausible view on what could happen with the next gen formats... far too rare. Glad to finally see something that's not just "ZOMG teh Sony formats is ghey."

[whoknows]

As far as gaming goes I don't give a fuck about a 50GB HD-DVD when the 360 uses standard DVD's. Blu-Ray does matter to me though, because with the high capacity discs they are coming out with there will never be an excuse to have a multi-disc PS3 game.

[zewone]

As far as gaming goes I don't give a fuck about a 50GB HD-DVD when the 360 uses standard DVD's. Blu-Ray does matter to me though, because with the high capacity discs they are coming out with there will never be an excuse to have a multi-disc PS3 game.
Awesome! Too bad the article said nothing about the 360, so where did this shite come from?

[whoknows]

Awesome! Too bad the article said nothing about the 360, so where did this shite come from?
I said as far as gaming goes, I'm not referring to the next gen format with movies. Sorry I offended you by almost insulting a video game system you like.

[zewone]

I said as far as gaming goes, I'm not referring to the next gen format with movies. Sorry I offended you by almost insulting a video game system you like.
None taken, I'm just wondering how your thought process works that you thought what you posted was a coherent contribution to the discussion?

[whoknows]

None taken, I'm just wondering how your thought process works that you thought what you posted was a coherent contribution to the discussion?
Because I was thinking on how the news would affect gaming?

[dpatel]

Man, a CAG with a plausible view on what could happen with the next gen formats... far too rare. Glad to finally see something that's not just "ZOMG teh Sony formats is ghey."

Its a shame at how many fanboys have come to this site now. I've been coming here for a while, and I do remember a time when there were very few fanboys. I guess they are the result of a website that is getting larger by the day. I still prefer this forum over any other, but the recent increase in fanboys makes me sick.

[Jeoff]

I'm not buying anything HD-DVD or Blu-Ray until a unified format is declared. Screw them and their shit.

[Inf^Shini]

As far as which can progress more, I'd take blu-ray all the way obviously. TDK's 200 GB disc o_O...that's already 2/3 my current HD >.>

I'm curious, compared to blu-ray players, how does the PS3's blu-ray player compare? I have yet to play any movies, but I'm curious if it matches or exceeds blu-ray players that are out right now.

Well, after reading the article, I can see Sony pushing a step-up of the PSP in the future. A mini-disc blu-ray playing hand-held...my my, that would be something...

[Apossum]

As far as gaming goes I don't give a fuck about a 50GB HD-DVD when the 360 uses standard DVD's. Blu-Ray does matter to me though, because with the high capacity discs they are coming out with there will never be an excuse to have a multi-disc PS3 game.


If they leave a lot of sound and video uncompressed to take full advantage of blu-rays capabilities in a huge rpg, they may need to use a second disc.

[Maynard]

Sony is planning on announcing a 51GB disc soon. They gotta 1up Toshiba somehow.

If theres anyone who's going to throw in his two fanboy cents its gonna be you isn't it?

Actually Sony announced a 200 gig disk for blu - ray so they sort of took a big giagantic steamer on your chest. Lets just let HD-DVD die already. Toshiba has had chances again and again to merge with Bluray and all Sony wanted was them to use their disks and Toshiba could keep their HD-DVD name. Toshiba still refused because they think that HD-DVD is a better format. Now even you yourself should be smart enough to realize that Bluray is a BETTER format man. Even if bluray is supposedly not selling as much as HD-DVD. I can tell you from my experience that more customers are coming in asking about Bluray than HDdvd. They all see Bluray as a technical winner with its technology and potential. Lets face it the only thing HDdvd has going for it is its name.

[dpatel]

As far as which can progress more, I'd take blu-ray all the way obviously. TDK's 200 GB disc o_O...that's already 2/3 my current HD >.>

I'm curious, compared to blu-ray players, how does the PS3's blu-ray player compare? I have yet to play any movies, but I'm curious if it matches or exceeds blu-ray players that are out right now.

Well, after reading the article, I can see Sony pushing a step-up of the PSP in the future. A mini-disc blu-ray playing hand-held...my my, that would be something...

I remember reading that the PS3 blu-ray player is actually slightly better than most current standalone players. Although, I would imagine that will change soon once more standalone players are released. Still, at least it isn't what the PS2 DVD player was to DVDs.

[xghostsniperx]

I saw the Sopranos Season 6 boxset at Best Buy yesterday for $129.99 on both formats. I will never bother to look in the Blu-Ray/HD-DVD section ever again.

[erehwon]

200GB blu-ray discs sound nice once the burners become available. They would be nice for backing up my hard drive. I have half a TB.

[Michaellvortega]

Are current bluray players capable of reading a 200GB disc?

[Kaijufan]

If theres anyone who's going to throw in his two fanboy cents its gonna be you isn't it?

Actually Sony announced a 200 gig disk for blu - ray so they sort of took a big giagantic steamer on your chest. Lets just let HD-DVD die already. Toshiba has had chances again and again to merge with Bluray and all Sony wanted was them to use their disks and Toshiba could keep their HD-DVD name. Toshiba still refused because they think that HD-DVD is a better format. Now even you yourself should be smart enough to realize that Bluray is a BETTER format man. Even if bluray is supposedly not selling as much as HD-DVD. I can tell you from my experience that more customers are coming in asking about Bluray than HDdvd. They all see Bluray as a technical winner with its technology and potential. Lets face it the only thing HDdvd has going for it is its name.
I would hate to see Blu Ray win. The DRM Blu Ray uses is far worse then HD DVD's DRM.


Are current bluray players capable of reading a 200GB disc?
I doubt it, since a 200 GB disk is 8 layers. I would imagine the Blu Ray movie spec will be limited to 50 GB double layer disks, and only burners would use the 8 layer disks.
Does anyone know if triple layer 50 GB HD DVDs are going to be added to the movie spec? Could it be possible the firmware on all current HD DVD player could be updated to allow the lasers to access the third layer?

[zewone]

Because I was thinking on how the news would affect gaming?
That still doesn't make sense. Just think about if it was worded this way:

As far as gaming goes I don't give a fuck about a 50GB HD-DVD when the Wii uses standard DVD's.

or

As far as gaming goes I don't give a fuck about a 50GB HD-DVD when the SNES uses standard cartridges.

How stupid are those statments?

What the fuck do those systems have to do with a 50GB HD-DVD discs?

Nothing. Same shit as the 360, which confused me as to why you would throw that in to the discussion.

[Michaellvortega]

All HDDVD players have a Ethernet port for upgrades and content so I guess you could upgrade it to read the new discs if they didn't meet spec, within reason.

[Chacrana]

All HDDVD players have a Ethernet port for upgrades and content so I guess you could upgrade it to read the new discs if they didn't meet spec, within reason.

They wouldn't make new, higher capacity discs for a format unless they met spec.

[rodeojones903]

I saw the Sopranos Season 6 boxset at Best Buy yesterday for $129.99 on both formats. I will never bother to look in the Blu-Ray/HD-DVD section ever again.

You can find it for cheaper if you look online.
http://www.buy.com/prod/Sopranos_6th_Season_Part_1_Blu_ray/q/loc/322/203531361.html

Last time I was at BB they had the DVD set for $84.

[whoknows]

That still doesn't make sense. Just think about if it was worded this way:

As far as gaming goes I don't give a fuck about a 50GB HD-DVD when the Wii uses standard DVD's.

or

As far as gaming goes I don't give a fuck about a 50GB HD-DVD when the SNES uses standard cartridges.

How stupid are those statments?

What the fuck do those systems have to do with a 50GB HD-DVD discs?

Nothing. Same shit as the 360, which confused me as to why you would throw that in to the discussion.

Doesn't matter with the Wii since its so far back technology wise compared to the PS3/360. And the point is that the 360 chose to use standard DVD's instead of HD-DVD when games on the 360 will eventually be on more discs due to lack of space. Doesn't really matter with the Wii since their games are more last gen graphics wise.

So yes, it does make sense. You just choose not to acknowledge it because 360 is teh r0xx0z

[zewone]

I hope you're kidding. That's fucking retarded logic.

[ryanbph]

Actually Sony announced a 200 gig disk for blu - ray .

I know this was a problem over the summer and early fall, but has sony figured out a way to read the 2nd layer on a blue ray disc yet. I know they were having problems with it a couple months back, but really haven't heard any updates on it since.

[whoknows]

I hope you're kidding. That's fucking retarded logic.
Really? The logic that by Microsoft choosing to stick with standard DVD's is going to eventually hurt them is retarded? Were you/are you still in a special ed class at school? I didn't mention the Wii in my original post for a reason, but Microsoft, supporting HD-DVD only with movies on the 360 isn't going to help them.

[zewone]

Really? The logic that by Microsoft choosing to stick with standard DVD's is going to eventually hurt them is retarded? Were you/are you still in a special ed class at school? I didn't mention the Wii in my original post for a reason, but Microsoft, supporting HD-DVD only with movies on the 360 isn't going to help them.
I'm not arguing over the size of disc space in gaming (which has nothing to do with this topic and hasn't proven to be worth the $200+ premium PS3 owners have had to pay, but that's neither here nor there); I'm talking about the fact that you turn Toshiba's announcement of 51GB HD-DVDs into a discussion about Microsoft and the 360. Tard.

[whoknows]

I'm not arguing over the size of disc space in gaming (which has nothing to do with this topic and hasn't proven to be worth the $200+ premium PS3 owners have had to pay, but that's neither here nor there); I'm talking about the fact that you turn Toshiba's announcement of 51GB HD-DVDs into a discussion about Microsoft and the 360. Tard.
How dare I relate the topic to gaming :roll:

I'm not going argue about this though, it's pointless and you can go ahead and think whatever you want.

[millrat1030]

I believe the 51gb HD discs are just a concept right now. I know TDK showed off the 200gb Blu-ray disc at CES a few days ago. They also showed a 16gb mini Blu-ray disc for new HD camcorders. This war might be over sooner than later though if rumors are true that Universal Studios is going to start making Blu-ray movies. For those of you who don't know they are the only studio exclusive to HD dvd. And as us gamers know exclusives make or break you. Just my 2 cents.

[Cao Cao]

:roll:
HD-DVD may have its 50GB disk.
Blu-Ray may have its 200GB disk.
But only DVD has THIS:
http://gear.ign.com/articles/754/754184p1.html

[naes]

200GB Blu-Ray disc... That's my hard drive...

[superstevedogg]

Format war at the electronics store I work at.

Blu Ray-1
HD DVD-0

[Mid Boss]

And suddenly these advancements seem so insignificant for both formats:

Ritek boasts TEN layer Blu-ray AND HD-DVD discs (http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/12/ritek-boasting-ten-layer-hd-dvd-blu-ray-discs/)

That brings the capacity to 250GB for Blu-ray and 170GB for HD-DVD now. Sure no HD-DVD or Blu-ray player can actually read a ten layer disc yet, but it sure sounds good, doesn't it?