BIOSHOCK - Gen. Discussion & Info

[PyroGamer]

Are there any little sisters left to harvest/save after Point Prometheus?

I have gotten all on this level but haven't gotten the achievement (Harvesting/Saving All Little Sisters) yet. Do I have to beat the game first?
You should get the "Deal With Every Little Sister" achievment the minute you deal with every little sister. The "beat the game without harvesting any little sisters" achievment requires you to beat the game first.

There are no harvestable/savable little sisters after point promethius. Point Promethius is the very last level.

You probably missed a little sister earlier in the game.

[asianxcore]

You probably missed a little sister earlier in the game.

That's what I'm guessing.

Is taking the Bathysphere to each level and hitting start to check how many little sisters are left a good way to make sure I got them all?

I only ask because I hear either the harvesting or saving is glitched somehow.

[Surferflames]

Not sure, but I know that if I tried leaving a level without dealing with them all, it would warn me. Maybe try hoping around various levels and see if you get a message.

[asianxcore]

Not sure, but I know that if I tried leaving a level without dealing with them all, it would warn me. Maybe try hoping around various levels and see if you get a message.

Thanks. I checked the start menu on every level before the one that I'm on and it shows that I've harvested all of them.

Now I need to decide if it's worth wandering around each level or just forgetting about it and finishing the game.

It's annoying to find this out when I'm so far into the game.

[SoulReaver]

Question about how far I am from the end

I'm at the Olympus Heights (I think that's it's name) and I'm near the goal for finding the cure for the mind control plasmid. How far am I from the end? I've explored and hunted down all the tapes and occasionally went back to previous levels just to make sure I got everything and I'm clocking about 10 hours so far. I'm moving and have to pack up my 360 soon, am I close enough to the end where I can beat the game before needing to pack it up? I hear people talking about 18-20 hours but it seems like some major plot stuff just happened so I think I'm near the end.

I'd say if you try to explore everywhere and beat the game it'll take an additional 4 hours, maybe an hour or two more or less depending on how fast you go through everything.

[whiptcracker]

I'd say if you try to explore everywhere and beat the game it'll take an additional 4 hours, maybe an hour or two more or less depending on how fast you go through everything.

Thanks!

[brandonabley]

Thanks. I checked the start menu on every level before the one that I'm on and it shows that I've harvested all of them.

Now I need to decide if it's worth wandering around each level or just forgetting about it and finishing the game.

It's annoying to find this out when I'm so far into the game.

I believe that each area has several levels in it, and each of those levels has a seperate tally for Little Sisters. Levels are separated by those locking doors with big spinning wheels and provoke loading sequences (is anyone else impressed by how little loading you deal with, even though loading segments are very long?) You'll have to hoof it to each section and double-check that way -- the Bathyspheres only take you to different areas and not different levels.

I got the achievement for dealing with every little sister the moment I saved the last little sister in the game, so I can definitely comfirm that you would know if you had found every one.

[Apossum]

It's not a heating problem. After I first starting getting the freezing, it now does it even when the 360 is freshly turned on. The problems with me started with missing textures about halfway through the game and things got steadily worse.


I don't think it's a software problem though. on my old 360, the demo froze up quite a bit. on my newer one, I experienced 2 glitches in the whole game-- one where the "burnt corpse" texture disappeared off the bodies leaving behind some weird basic textures, and one other right after Atlas tries to give you heart attack where the screen filters were messed up for a few seconds.


not a single freeze, not a single frame rate hitch (I was playing with the framerate unlocked.)

[Phorty Ounce]

I don't think it's a software problem though. on my old 360, the demo froze up quite a bit. on my newer one, I experienced 2 glitches in the whole game-- one where the "burnt corpse" texture disappeared off the bodies leaving behind some weird basic textures, and one other right after Atlas tries to give you heart attack where the screen filters were messed up for a few seconds.


not a single freeze, not a single frame rate hitch (I was playing with the framerate unlocked.)

Damn. What is the Lot # of your new 360?

I am playing on a LOT #7722 model.

[asianxcore]

I have a launch 360 (day and date) and I have not had any problems running this game. I believe I am on the last hour or so of the game.

Thanks to everyone who gave me ideas on how to remedy my harvesting problem. I don't feel like going back to every level to check, so I'll just keep a save on the side in case I do sometime.

[R1V3R5]

Only problem I've had was when about 9 splicers were chasing me through a doorway, one of which threw those explosive cocktails, and he accidentally set the whole crowd on fire. Then the frame rate dropped to about 2fps until the crowd was extinguished.

Also, while I'm enjoying the game, there were some things that remind me of Half-Life 2. And they would have been much cooler had I not already experienced them in Half-Life 2. This does not make the game bad, it just makes it better for those who haven't played Half-Life 2 yet.

Overall, I'm enjoying it but can't imagine I'd play through again once I complete it.

[PyroGamer]

Overall, I'm enjoying it but can't imagine I'd play through again once I complete it.
The rehashed "scavenger hunt" gameplay of this game gets pretty old later on in the game.

It's a 20 hour, linear FPS with open map design. It's amazing for a play-through, but after that the (bio)shock wears off. That's the way it was made, and that's why I just rented it.

Also, while I'm enjoying the game, there were some things that remind me of Half-Life 2.
Wrench + Telekinisis = Unavoidable comparison.

Funny to note Half Life 2 used to be on the top 10 reviewed videogames of all time list until BioShock knocked it off.

As I said before: I guess there's not room enough in this town for two wrench-toting FPS's.

[darthbudge]

So who else has ordered the Coffins for your broken Big Daddy? I ordered mine today and I hope that it will come quickly and I will get my new Big Daddy equally as quick.

[Damian]

So who else has ordered the Coffins for your broken Big Daddy? I ordered mine today and I hope that it will come quickly and I will get my new Big Daddy equally as quick.
I ordered mine a couple days ago. I'm sure you'll get the coffin and art bookj pretty quick, but I wouldn't hold your breath on the Big Daddy. They need to do another production run in China. Probably a couple months when all is said and done.

[MemphisGun]

Love it but i have to say...its quite redundant! oohhh weird guy zap shoot zap shoot. OOOhhh BIG DADDY freze freze shoot shoot buck shoot. i have to take a brake for a week or so!

[KwanzaaTimmy]

Definately an Amazing game-- I'll go through Hard difficulty run (and get the 1000/1000) at a later date. I tried playing it last night, and still enjoyed it-- but since I had just finished everything was already out of the bag, so i didn't have the same drive as I did the first time through.

Great stuff though- and certainly a great barn burner for what looks like an Amazing Fall.

[red flare graf]

Love it but i have to say...its quite redundant! oohhh weird guy zap shoot zap shoot. OOOhhh BIG DADDY freze freze shoot shoot buck shoot. i have to take a brake for a week or so!

Well, yeah, if that's how you decide to take them down. There's way too many plasmids to be doing the same thing every time, that's your own fault.

[Jedi1979]

if i see too many big daddys walking around i would just use the enrage plasmid to make them fight each other...somewhat amusing but not as destructive as i hoped:)

[Apossum]

You should get the "Deal With Every Little Sister" achievment the minute you deal with every little sister. The "beat the game without harvesting any little sisters" achievment requires you to beat the game first.

There are no harvestable/savable little sisters after point promethius. Point Promethius is the very last level.

You probably missed a little sister earlier in the game.


I actually got that achievement before the last sister. I think it was because I got the mysterious 4th sister in Neptune's Bounty

[creeeaature]

Absolutely loved the game through and through, but I'm very glad I just rented it isntead of paying $60. I honestly can't see myself going back and playing it ever again.

[doc_zaius]

I'm definately playing through a second time just to try it "evil" and harvest all the little sisters.


this is one that will stay in my collection even after I'm done with it, I think it's pretty groundbreaking in a lot of ways and I'd like to have it around in case I want to introduce it to friends who aren't hip to it.

[asianxcore]

Just finished the game tonight.

I really enjoyed the game. I loved the atmosphere of the game.

The only problems I had with it were the repetitive nature at times. Also the story was told really well but in the end I personally thought it was a little predictable.

I kept a couple saves near the end of the game in case I wanted to go back and finish some achievements. I might have to find that 4th Little Sister at Neptune that Apossum mentioned. Maybe that'll finally give me the "Harvesting/Rescuing Sisters" achievement.

[DomLando]

Just finished the game tonight.

I really enjoyed the game. I loved the atmosphere of the game.

The only problems I had with it were the repetitive nature at times. Also the story was told really well but in the end I personally thought it was a little predictable.

I kept a couple saves near the end of the game in case I wanted to go back and finish some achievements. I might have to find that 4th Little Sister at Neptune that Apossum mentioned. Maybe that'll finally give me the "Harvesting/Rescuing Sisters" achievement.
I also just finished the game today. I agree with the game getting a little bit repetitive at times. The "fetch" missions got on my nerves. But the atmosphere and story made up for everything. I will go back and beat this one on hard.

[Mojimbo]

I've put like 16 hours into it and I'm barely at the start of Fort Frolic, anyone have a ballpark of how far I am?

[doc_zaius]

halfway-ish.

[Callandor]

LOL at today's (http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2007/08/29) Bioshock PA strip.

[PyroGamer]

Also ctrl-alt-del:

http://www.ctrlaltdel-online.com/comic.php?d=20070829


And myextralife:

http://myextralife.com/archive.php?date=2007-08-29

[AshesofWake]

And myextralife:

http://myextralife.com/archive.php?date=2007-08-29


:rofl:

[A Happy Panda]

That ctrl-alt-del comic was hilarious.

[Maynard]

While I am behind you guys due to a backlog. I just got the telekinesis plasmid I know most of you probably dont, but I recommend going through FPS games on Hard. I always do and it makes it intense, but man this takes the cake. This game is scary as shit on hard. For example in the dentist office practically no health and I hear guys everywhere on my surround system. If that doesn't get your adreline going I dont know what does :)

[PyroGamer]

Yeah, you really need to be scared of dying in this game. The best parts are when you're low on health and ammo and dying for a med-pack.

I regret not playing on Hard the first time through.

[LinkinPrime]

For those of you that were interested in getting the exclusive gamerpics and themes from "The Cult Of Rapture" enter my contest here:

http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3295542#post3295542

[infamyRISE]

For those past Hephestus - One thing I didn't understand:

The scene in Ryan's office....why the hell did he command me to kill him? Why would he try to stop me the entire game and then when I get there, he lays down like a dog when he could have said "Would you kindly leave"?

[Rei no Otaku]

For those past Hephestus - One thing I didn't understand:

The scene in Ryan's office....why the hell did he command me to kill him? Why would he try to stop me the entire game and then when I get there, he lays down like a dog when he could have said "Would you kindly leave"?
At that point he had lost. Even if he told you to leave, or killed you, Fontaine still won. You had taken out all the defenses he had around himself. All Fontaine had to do was send some splicers in there, or march in himself. Also that's assuming Fontaine didn't have a more powerful control over your mental conditioning.

As for why Ryan said to kill him, he said it himself. He was going to die like a man, not a slave. He chose his way to die, and he went out on his own terms. At that point the only thing he had left was the choice on how to die. His dream was in ruins, and Fontaine had taken over.

[help1]

Can you guys tell me about how far I am in the game percentage wise?

I am currently working on Sander Cohens masterpiece.

[zewone]

Can you guys tell me about how far I am in the game percentage wise?

I am currently working on Sander Cohens masterpiece.
Half or a little more than half way.

[help1]

Half or a little more than half way.

Sweet! I just want to beat this game one time and sell it. I think GOW and the CoD 4 beta will last me until Halo 3.

[Danimal]

I have a question. I'm still early on into the game. When I got to the part where you make your first choice whether to save or harvest a Little Sister, I chose to save her. So now shortly after that, I have my first battle with a Big Daddy, but after I take him down, I can't find the Little Sister. There's another Big Daddy and Little Sister roaming around now, but I can't find the one that went with the BD I killed. But it also looks like I've got 80 Adam again, the same as I got when I saved the first LS. Did the game automatically choose to save this LS for me as well? Or am I supposed to hunt around for her after I kill the Big Daddy?

Any spoiler-free help would be much appreciated.

[Damian]

Any spoiler-free help would be much appreciated.
Big Daddies respawn. Little Sisters do not. You will often see a BD roaming without a LS.

[Moxio]

I have a question. I'm still early on into the game. When I got to the part where you make your first choice whether to save or harvest a Little Sister, I chose to save her. So now shortly after that, I have my first battle with a Big Daddy, but after I take him down, I can't find the Little Sister. There's another Big Daddy and Little Sister roaming around now, but I can't find the one that went with the BD I killed. But it also looks like I've got 80 Adam again, the same as I got when I saved the first LS. Did the game automatically choose to save this LS for me as well? Or am I supposed to hunt around for her after I kill the Big Daddy?

Any spoiler-free help would be much appreciated.

Sometimes after you kill BD and wait too long the Sister will go to another BD (who assumingly respawn).

[Danimal]

Big Daddies respawn. Little Sisters do not. You will often see a BD roaming without a LS. I think he may have just finished helping the LS up into her hidey-hole when I opened fire on him, so maybe that's it, and he was just alone. Fortunately, I had saved right before I attacked him, so I just loaded the game back to that point, fought him again, and this time the LS was there after I finished him off.

Thanks Damian and Moxio.

[help1]

I have a question. I'm still early on into the game. When I got to the part where you make your first choice whether to save or harvest a Little Sister, I chose to save her. So now shortly after that, I have my first battle with a Big Daddy, but after I take him down, I can't find the Little Sister. There's another Big Daddy and Little Sister roaming around now, but I can't find the one that went with the BD I killed. But it also looks like I've got 80 Adam again, the same as I got when I saved the first LS. Did the game automatically choose to save this LS for me as well? Or am I supposed to hunt around for her after I kill the Big Daddy?

Any spoiler-free help would be much appreciated.

Whoa, you can get adam for killing a big daddy that doesn't have a little sister?

[Trakan]

I think he may have just finished helping the LS up into her hidey-hole when I opened fire on him, so maybe that's it, and he was just alone. Fortunately, I had saved right before I attacked him, so I just loaded the game back to that point, fought him again, and this time the LS was there after I finished him off.

Thanks Damian and Moxio.

You can just wait for the Big Daddy to respawn and pound on the wall and call the little sister out again.

[pinebarrens]

I have a question. I found and saved 4 little sisters in Fort Frolic even though it says there are only 3 possible in Fort Frolic. It lists it as 4 out of 3 little sisters saved. Has this happened to anyone else?

[SoulReaver]

I have a question. I found and saved 4 little sisters in Fort Frolic even though it says there are only 3 possible in Fort Frolic. It lists it as 4 out of 3 little sisters saved. Has this happened to anyone else? Yeah, its a bug.

[PKRipp3r]

I have a question. I'm still early on into the game. When I got to the part where you make your first choice whether to save or harvest a Little Sister, I chose to save her. So now shortly after that, I have my first battle with a Big Daddy, but after I take him down, I can't find the Little Sister. There's another Big Daddy and Little Sister roaming around now, but I can't find the one that went with the BD I killed. But it also looks like I've got 80 Adam again, the same as I got when I saved the first LS. Did the game automatically choose to save this LS for me as well? Or am I supposed to hunt around for her after I kill the Big Daddy?

Any spoiler-free help would be much appreciated.

slight If you watch them, they push the little sisters up into the exit vents or whatever those things are, if things get too crazy. then later they will walk up to another vent and bang on it... then a little sister comes out.

the best thing to do is to wait for a BD to walk up to a vent and as soon as he hits it, fire four or five heat seeking missles and frag grenades at his head.

also helps if you have some trip wires and prox mines set. :)

but if you hit him as soon as he picks up his lil sis, then she's more likely to be hangin around after he goes down for the count

[A Happy Panda]

I just put in about 4 1/2 hours straight. Only stopped because my head was starting to hurt.

Question:

I'm at the part where I'm about to face off against Cohen Sanders. Now I remember reading how people had a chance to kill him or let him live, what should I do? I also remember something about his apartment? And, the achievement for finishing Cohen's Masterpiece? Is that just something I get along the story mode?

[zewone]

I just put in about 4 1/2 hours straight. Only stopped because my head was starting to hurt.

Question:

I'm at the part where I'm about to face off against Cohen Sanders. Now I remember reading how people had a chance to kill him or let him live, what should I do? I also remember something about his apartment? And, the achievement for finishing Cohen's Masterpiece? Is that just something I get along the story mode?
You don't face off with Cohen, he just comes out and gives you a reward for completing the masterpiece. Yes, the achievement for the masterpiece is just part of the story mode.

Just don't kill him now, take the reward. Find his apartment later in the game and kill him then.

[A Happy Panda]

Cool. Thanks Zew.

[Graystone]

How much adam do you get for harvesting a LS? I'm getting 80 for each one saved. Also trying to get the achievement for not harvesting any, but curious.

[A Happy Panda]

How much adam do you get for harvesting a LS? I'm getting 80 for each one saved. Also trying to get the achievement for not harvesting any, but curious.

160 I believe. But with all the gifts you get from Tenenbaum, I think it evens itself out in the end . At least that's what I read on a FAQ.

[$hady]

Yea what he said don't harvest them! It all evens out and you miss 100 achievement points the first time you harvest..

I had a Bioshock marathon yesterday and finished the game FINALLY because my Blockbuster rental is up tomorrow. :( I ended up with 800 achievement points and will probably pick it up again sometime to finish the points and beat it on hard. GREAT GAME!! :D

[strdr4]

Yea what he said don't harvest them! It all evens out and you miss 100 achievement points the first time you harvest..

I had a Bioshock marathon yesterday and finished the game FINALLY because my Blockbuster rental is up tomorrow. :( I ended up with 800 achievement points and will probably pick it up again sometime to finish the points and beat it on hard. GREAT GAME!! :D

I had a marathon with it myself. Played it about 4 hours each day then beat it on the 3rd day of 8+ hours. :) I just couldn't put the controller down, but now I'm just bioshocked out. I can't even get myself to continue playing on hard because I'm just burnt. Just need some time off.

[$hady]

I had a marathon with it myself. Played it about 4 hours each day then beat it on the 3rd day of 8+ hours. :) I just couldn't put the controller down, but now I'm just bioshocked out. I can't even get myself to continue playing on hard because I'm just burnt. Just need some time off.
Hard would have taken FOREVER if you were playing through that way the 1st time and trying to find all diaries and everything! :hot: Playing back through wont be near as bad since you know where everything is and how to beat stuff. Now back to my NCAA Dynasty. :D

[SteveMcQ]

Is there a compilation somewhere of the actual era music not just the score? The song when you first enter the lighthouse is catchy and some of the background music is pretty enjoyable, too.

[Damian]

Is there a compilation somewhere of the actual era music not just the score? The song when you first enter the lighthouse is catchy and some of the background music is pretty enjoyable, too.
Not an official one that you can buy or download as a compilation, no. On the 2k forums some members came up with a list of all the licensed music in the game though, and created an iTunes mix. You can also seek the music out yourself with the list.

http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10122

[SteveMcQ]

Not an official one that you can buy or download as a compilation, no. On the 2k forums some members came up with a list of all the licensed music in the game though, and created an iTunes mix. You can also seek the music out yourself with the list.

http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10122Very nice. That's what I was looking for. Thanks.

[AshesofWake]

hey anybody have this problem. I loaded my end game save right before the final hurrah. And then i went back to pick up missing diaries, weapon upgrades and such. But holy shit, the game keeps freexing randomly ever 10 seconds. It freezes, then it's okay, it freezes, then it's okay, it freezes, then it's okay. It's the most annoying shit ever and all im doing is walking around. I loaded a new game, and no problems there at all. It's only my end game save that is doing this. Anybody else have this problem? Im really starting to get pissed..... :bomb:

[$hady]

hey anybody have this problem. I loaded my end game save right before the final hurrah. And then i went back to pick up missing diaries, weapon upgrades and such. But holy shit, the game keeps freexing randomly ever 10 seconds. It freezes, then it's okay, it freezes, then it's okay, it freezes, then it's okay. It's the most annoying shit ever and all im doing is walking around. I loaded a new game, and no problems there at all. It's only my end game save that is doing this. Anybody else have this problem? Im really starting to get pissed..... :bomb:

Mine started doing that crap CONSTANTLY from the start of the next to last level. It was annoying as hell! The sound and everything played fine but the video lags.. I remembered someone saying to go into options and turn of the frames per second lock but that had no effect on or off.... I just learned to deal with. :bomb:

[AshesofWake]

ARGHGHGHHG FUCK this game... *esplodes*

[Moxio]

Never happened to me... overheating Xbox?

[AshesofWake]

but a new game doesn't do this...., it's only a save at the end of the game that does this. if it was overheating it should be throughout no matter what save it is. I'm playing it again on Hard and everything is fine. when i load my normal save, shits-a-hoy

[doubledown]

Just curious, how long does this game take o beat/finish? (Not all achievements, just an overall finish the game).

I rented it and I am enjoying it....just curious how long it takes...thanks!

[daroga]

Did anyone watch the Bonus Round with the BioShock guys? Just curious how much of a spoiler-filled event it is if you're at the end of Neptune's Bounty.

[KwanzaaTimmy]

Just curious, how long does this game take o beat/finish? (Not all achievements, just an overall finish the game).

I rented it and I am enjoying it....just curious how long it takes...thanks!

Took me about 12 hours, and I didn't rush.

[zewone]

Just curious, how long does this game take o beat/finish? (Not all achievements, just an overall finish the game).

I rented it and I am enjoying it....just curious how long it takes...thanks!
Took me about 8 or 9 without rushing.

[A Happy Panda]

Took me about 8 or 9 without rushing.

WTF? Did you explore every part of the map? I call shenanigans.

[zewone]

WTF? Did you explore every part of the map? I call shenanigans.
Just a rough guesstimate, the game doesn't keep track of your playtime (unless I missed it).

But, yeah, I explored everywhere, I got every diary except one (in the area where you meet Ryan that you can't return to :bomb: )

[A Happy Panda]

Just a rough guesstimate, the game doesn't keep track of your playtime (unless I missed it).

But, yeah, I explored everywhere, I got every diary except one (in the area where you meet Ryan that you can't return to :bomb: )

How do you know you got every diary? Is there an in-game counter? I couldn't get the one Underneath the staircase outside of that one guy's office as you're building the bomb

9 hours is impressive....I put in about 14 hrs and I'm just getting into Apollo Square.

[zewone]

How do you know you got every diary? Is there an in-game counter? I couldn't get the one Underneath the staircase outside of that one guy's office as you're building the bomb

9 hours is impressive....I put in about 14 hrs and I'm just getting into Apollo Square.
You can check all the diaries you've collected when you press the back button and go to diary section, then you just compare it with audio diary FAQ (at GameFAQs) which tells you how many each area has.

[KwanzaaTimmy]

How do you know you got every diary? Is there an in-game counter? I couldn't get the one Underneath the staircase outside of that one guy's office as you're building the bomb

9 hours is impressive....I put in about 14 hrs and I'm just getting into Apollo Square.

Thats good-- the game is excellent, you'll wish there was more when you finish, honestly. Take your time.

[menikmati]

Just picked this up today, 10% off coupon and $25 in BB GC's ($15 thanks to the GH80's deal) made this $33 after tax.

Let's see how much of a pussy I am when it comes to this game, I'm still playing RE4 on the Wii and the Regenerators/Iron Maidens are freaking me out, the MUSIC/BREATHING makes me uneasy.

[A Happy Panda]

Just picked this up today, 10% off coupon and $25 in BB GC's ($15 thanks to the GH80's deal) made this $33 after tax.

Let's see how much of a pussy I am when it comes to this game, I'm still playing RE4 on the Wii and the Regenerators/Iron Maidens are freaking me out, the MUSIC/BREATHING makes me uneasy.

It's actually not that bad. I won't touch RE4, and I thought Bioshock would make me poo my pants, but after like an hour or so, it gets pretty easy to handle. There ARE a couple of parts that made me go "Oh What the fuck!? Die!"

[menikmati]

There ARE a couple of parts that made me go "Oh What the fuck!? Die!"

Thankfully this game isn't controlled by the Wiimote or I would throw my hands up in the air at moments like those.

Good to see other CAGers that know how it feels :applause:

[Halo05]

I probably took around 15 hours to finish it. I explored heavily early on but as school was getting harder and harder, I pushed myself through the last two areas pretty quickly. I haven't checked to see what I missed but I know I didn't take nearly enough pictures and missed an audio log somewhere.

Well worth the price of admission. Almost certainly my vote for GOTY for 2007 as of right now. Mass Effect could well take it's place.

[red flare graf]

Mass Effect will take its place.

Definitely, but Bioshock is still damn awesome.

[SteveMcQ]

I think I spent over two hours in the first level just looking around and staring at all the little details. I'll probably push through the later levels a little quicker, though, but I love searching every nook and cranny of the world.

[red flare graf]

I've had it since launch and I'm only in Arcadia.. I'm fucking slow.

[menikmati]

Just beat the first Big Daddy at the Medical Plaza, going to play some of the CoD4 MP beta to calm my senses now.

[Damian]

I've had it since launch and I'm only in Arcadia.. I'm fucking slow.
Me too, don't worry about it.

[jovherye]

Okay. So now I beat Bioshock! Is there any reason to keep it? Any downloads in the future? Or should i trade it in for store credit for either Mass Effect or Halo 3? I know GS has an add 20% towards Halo 3. Help please.

[Moxio]

It's actually not that bad. I won't touch RE4, and I thought Bioshock would make me poo my pants, but after like an hour or so, it gets pretty easy to handle. There ARE a couple of parts that made me go "Oh What the fuck!? Die!"

When you're in the dentist office to the side and the steam comes down and you turn around and there's a guy there? I almost shit my pants, mang!

[red flare graf]

When you're in the dentist office to the side and the steam comes down and you turn around and there's a guy there? I almost shit my pants, mang!

I wish that wasn't scripted.. Random events like that would be ass-kickery.

[A Happy Panda]

When you're in the dentist office to the side and the steam comes down and you turn around and there's a guy there? I almost shit my pants, mang!

For real. That motherfucker.

And The part where the Splicers first start playing dead and jump out at you. I just fucking knew something was gonna happen in that room because the lights went out and all you would hear are feet shuffling and evil laughter. I shoot every corpse I see now before approaching it. Shit has made he jump a few times.

[magiic]

Fuck Im loving this game but holy crap the big daddy's are hard to kill. Is there any real strategy to them so I dont get ass raped everytime I face one

[RedvsBlue]

Fuck Im loving this game but holy crap the big daddy's are hard to kill. Is there any real strategy to them so I dont get ass raped everytime I face one

Best strategy is to have a plan to kill them before you piss them off and to also avoid fighting them in the open as their most powerful attack is that running tackle manuever.

[SteveMcQ]

Do Big Daddies attack you on sight or only if you attack them? I've become accustomed to the regular enemy "see you and attack" AI.

[Damian]

Do Big Daddies attack you on sight or only if you attack them? I've become accustomed to the regular enemy "see you and attack" AI.
Only if you provoke them. Keep in mind this can happen accidentally as well though. Just be careful when they're in the area.

[Halo05]

I've accidently provoked them by telekinesis throwing things at nearby enemies. I don't know if I even hit the Big Daddy, he just didn't like all the noise I was making.

Later in the game, they get easier thanks to newer weapons and plasmids. Early on, they're a nightmare.

[A Happy Panda]

Fuck Im loving this game but holy crap the big daddy's are hard to kill. Is there any real strategy to them so I dont get ass raped everytime I face one


If it's early in the game, you're going to use up a lot of ammo, it's just how it is. Also, use tons of electric buck and anti-armor rounds. They can hardly move with the shock from the electric buck. And depending on what plasmids you can, it can be easier.

But they get a lot easier later on. I killed a Big Daddy literally within 3 seconds because of the traps I set. Pissed me off too, I went back to a section and he was all up on my ass for some reason, he probably walked into a mine or a trap bolt that I set and forgot about. I thought that was really cool though, the AI still goes on by itself despite you not even being in the same level.

[slickkill77]

Explosive bucks and Electric Bucks are your friend

[Nelo Ice]

anyone kno what a good weapon to upgrade 1st is?
im thinkin of raising machine gun dmg or something with shotgun

i just beat peach wilkens

[Callandor]

Fuck Im loving this game but holy crap the big daddy's are hard to kill. Is there any real strategy to them so I dont get ass raped everytime I face one

Electric gel from the chemical thrower can also work wonders once you have the research damage bonuses (and the consumption upgrade). Just keep inventing electric gel. Use a combination of that and electric buck, and the big daddies are just too easy.

[SteveMcQ]

When do you get an upgrade for more powers (I forget what they're called...the ones mapped to LT). I've only got two slots now for four powers and unless there are tons of gene banks in the second level, it's gonna be slightly annoying having to switch back adn forth at one.

[Damian]

When do you get an upgrade for more powers (I forget what they're called...the ones mapped to LT). I've only got two slots now for four powers and unless there are tons of gene banks in the second level, it's gonna be slightly annoying having to switch back adn forth at one.
You're so early in the game do you really want to be told?

You have to spend your Adam to buy extra slots at a Gatherer's Garden.

[bortle]

hey anybody have this problem. I loaded my end game save right before the final hurrah. And then i went back to pick up missing diaries, weapon upgrades and such. But holy shit, the game keeps freexing randomly ever 10 seconds. It freezes, then it's okay, it freezes, then it's okay, it freezes, then it's okay. It's the most annoying shit ever and all im doing is walking around. I loaded a new game, and no problems there at all. It's only my end game save that is doing this. Anybody else have this problem? Im really starting to get pissed..... :bomb:

Use the hard drive cache clearing trick mentioned somewhere in this thread. I did that and it fixed the problem for me.

[AshesofWake]

Use the hard drive cache clearing trick mentioned somewhere in this thread. I did that and it fixed the problem for me.


oh really? ok cool. ill try it out..now to find the method...lol

[lordwow]

Just finished my first playthrough on medium or whatever it's called. Got 790 pts on one playthrough without really searching for everything. Going to start playing again tomorrow on Hard to get the last of the achievements.

Definitely the best game since like OOT. I gave it a 9.7, which places it only below OOT, LTTP, and Warcraft 2 in my book, and about equal with Starcraft.

[A Happy Panda]

Ah. Just beat the game. 810 points, not too shabby. After a lot of bickering back and forth, and even saying that this game doesn't deserve the tens well...it doesn't. But its very fucking close. I think you have to finish the whole game to fully see what the game has to offer. I watched the ending, and just thought to myself what an incredible experience that was. Seriously, I'll eat my words, one of the best games I've played.

I LOVED the ending Watching the Little Sisters jump all Fontaine, oh man that was awesome. Hearing them yell "Kill him!" in their cute little voices, actually brought a smile to my face. Sick I know.

But.. Fontaine was fucking weak. I beat him in literally less than 60 seconds. With all that build-up and that was it. Lame. Still, amazing game.

[lordwow]

But.. Fontaine was fucking weak. I beat him in literally less than 60 seconds. With all that build-up and that was it. Lame. Still, amazing game.

I agree. I was expecting a second fight after you sucked out all the adam (maybe there is one if you don't save the girls?)

Either way, the ending cinematic was beautiful.

[zewone]

I agree. I was expecting a second fight after you sucked out all the adam (maybe there is one if you don't save the girls?)

Either way, the ending cinematic was beautiful.
Nope. Same crappy endboss fight. The ending was okay, but I wish it had cinematics (like the bad ending), instead of still pictures.

[A Happy Panda]

I agree. I was expecting a second fight after you sucked out all the adam (maybe there is one if you don't save the girls?)

Either way, the ending cinematic was beautiful.

Totally agree. It was a weird feeling. I felt really good inside. IDK it's weird having such a sense of moral vindication from a videogame. I was genuinely happy to see the girls grow up and experience life, and it was very sweet for them to show up on your death bed.

[SteveMcQ]

All these damn spoiler tags are getting to me. I've barely scratched the surface of the game, but I don't have much time to play. Ugh. It's like holding a bat in a fine china shop. I wanna do it, but I know it's wrong.... Must find time to play through this game.

[RollingSkull]

Well, my post-game conclusions. (These are OMEGA-CLASS SPOILERS)

The good ending was one of the most awesome good-guy moments in all of gaming. Watching the girls come to grab your hand as you lay in your death-bed was the most good guy awesomeness I've gotten in video games since saving Christmas in EBA.

Of course Fontaine was weak. System Shock 2's final bosses were equally unimpressive.

Really, when you get right down to it though... wasn't that the absolute most ridiculous, dumbest, most completely absurd plan known to mankind? I almost didn't believe the "Would you kindly" bit because it was so moronic. You want to kill Ryan, so the only way you can do it is to clone his child, accelerate his growth, send him BACK TO THE SURFACE, have him CRASH AN AIRPLANE AT PRECISELY THE RIGHT TIME (He'd be lucky to survive!), find his way through Rapture, marvel at the fake death of your fake family, and kill Ryan, even though you could have just said "Would you kindly kill Ryan?," even though RYAN WAS IN A FUCKING UNDERSEA TIN CAN THAT COULD HAVE BEEN PENETRATED IN ANY THOUSAND LESS STUPID WAYS?!

In the end, a really, really stupid story told really, really well. A worthy sequel to Bioshock, but the less time spent actually thinking about the sequence of events in the plot vis-a-vis Fontaine and Ryan, the better. Which is probably why the endings were FMVs completely to that central struggle.

[A Happy Panda]

Well, my post-game conclusions. (These are OMEGA-CLASS SPOILERS)

The good ending was one of the most awesome good-guy moments in all of gaming. Watching the girls come to grab your hand as you lay in your death-bed was the most good guy awesomeness I've gotten in video games since saving Christmas in EBA.

Of course Fontaine was weak. System Shock 2's final bosses were equally unimpressive.

Really, when you get right down to it though... wasn't that the absolute most ridiculous, dumbest, most completely absurd plan known to mankind? I almost didn't believe the "Would you kindly" bit because it was so moronic. You want to kill Ryan, so the only way you can do it is to clone his child, accelerate his growth, send him BACK TO THE SURFACE, have him CRASH AN AIRPLANE AT PRECISELY THE RIGHT TIME (He'd be lucky to survive!), find his way through Rapture, marvel at the fake death of your fake family, and kill Ryan, even though you could have just said "Would you kindly kill Ryan?," even though RYAN WAS IN A FUCKING UNDERSEA TIN CAN THAT COULD HAVE BEEN PENETRATED IN ANY THOUSAND LESS STUPID WAYS?!

In the end, a really, really stupid story told really, really well. A worthy sequel to Bioshock, but the less time spent actually thinking about the sequence of events in the plot vis-a-vis Fontaine and Ryan, the better. Which is probably why the endings were FMVs completely to that central struggle.

I was actually going to post a question to try and clear up the story for me. I personally didn't like the diary story-telling system. A lot of the time I'd start playing one, then completely stop paying attention, or if Atlas or whoever said something to me over the radio, again, sometimes I would stop listening since you CAN just keep playing. But, with the diaries, I would usually find a corner and start playing one.

But the radio messages are scripted for certain points in the game, and at times, you're fighting, just finished a fight, or are about to get into a fight, thus not allowing yourself to give full attention to the person talking to you.

If Bioshock 2 comes along, I'd love to see a mix of cutscenes AND diaries. I thought the cutscene where you first get a plasmid was great. It was very well done, and hardly took you out of the gameworld, which I think is a BS excuse BTW. But anyways, I wasn't able to think too much about the story after I beat it since I had to run over to my friend's house immediately after.

Thanks for clearing it up for me. That's actually what I thought the story was, but I was like, no, it can't be that stupid. This game is too smart for that. I guess not. I was more confused than anything when they showed that short sequence of the player as a baby...I actually thought the story wasn't told all that great, again, mainly because of the radio messages and diaries. But the story itself is fine, though still retarded.

And I totally agree about the "would you kindly" shit. I actually went "pfft" and snickered when I heard it explained. But after that, I actually felt bad about killing Ryan...especially with a golf club, Jeez. He was a very gray character where I wasn't even sure why he should die or why he should live. Good stuff there.

And yes, if you read my post. The good guy ending is AMAZING.

And also actually I watched the "evil" ending on youtube. Jeez. I'm pretty sure if I got that ending, I'd be calling this game the most overrated piece of trash to grace gaming. Because if you couple that bullshit ending with the pretty retarded story (that still works)...you got bad news

And to SteveMcQ - I know how you feel. I haven't been able to play videogames just about all summer because of work and other stuff. But since my internship ended last Thursday, it's been Bioshock constantly. I played the games throughout 4 days total. The first day I played about 4 hours, and didn't get back to it until a week later when work ended for me. Then it was 2 days straight, 4 1/2 hour and 6 hour sessions, then Labor Day, whereI wasn't quite sure how long I played, but I think in the 4-5 hour range.

[RollingSkull]

I was actually going to post a question to try and clear up the story for me. I personally didn't like the diary story-telling system. A lot of the time I'd start playing one, then completely stop paying attention, or if Atlas or whoever said something to me over the radio, again, sometimes I would stop listening since you CAN just keep playing. But, with the diaries, I would usually find a corner and start playing one.

But the radio messages are scripted for certain points in the game, and at times, you're fighting, just finished a fight, or are about to get into a fight, thus not allowing yourself to give full attention to the person talking to you.
The radio messages are archived in the Back menu.

The diary story-telling was a LOT better fleshed out in System Shock 2. There was lots more in the way of actual story-telling. Would the two lovers make it out safely? What is up with the weaselly Korenchkin and the gruff, glory-hound Diego? Exactly how apeshit is security chief Bronson going? Will you finally meet Delacroix? Is she a pawn of the villain?


Thanks for clearing it up for me. That's actually what I thought the story was, but I was like, no, it can't be that stupid. This game is too smart for that. I guess not. I was more confused than anything when they showed that short sequence of the player as a baby...I actually thought the story wasn't told all that great, again, mainly because of the radio messages and diaries.

And I totally agree about the "would you kindly" shit. I actually went "pfft" and snickered when I heard it explained. But after that, I actually felt bad about killing Ryan...especially with a golf club, Jeez. He was a very gray character where I wasn't even sure why he should die or why he should live. Good stuff there.

And yes, if you read my post. The good guy ending is AMAZING.
Ryan had to die. He whacked the only likeable, self-aware member of the cast: Crazy plant lady. Not to mention the folks he butchered in his war with Fontaine.

Really, I think the diaries succeeded in places. The story of Ryan's mistress was told nicely, even if it lacked an ending. Only slight problem is precisely how much time had passed between your getting here and the events on the diaries. How many of these folks actually coexisted with the monsters you end up fighting?

Additional observations:

I'm glad the Randianism wasn't preachy, but Ryan's death was stupid as hell as well, even independent of the plot twist.

Also, seriously, where did Fontaine get all the adam he stuck himself with for the boss battle? That part was stupid as well

[mr ryles]

hopefully I will beat this game today, can finely read whats behind all these spoiler tags.

[RollingSkull]

hopefully I will beat this game today, can finely read whats behind all these spoiler tags.
Really, if you've gotten to Andrew Ryan, you've seen everything in the spoiler tags except the bits about the ending.

Also, yes, Happy Panda, I agree with you completely about the evil ending. Hell, I'll say it outside of spoiler tags. Everyone playing should shoot for the good ending.

[A Happy Panda]

Really, if you've gotten to Andrew Ryan, you've seen everything in the spoiler tags except the bits about the ending.

Also, yes, Happy Panda, I agree with you completely about the evil ending. Hell, I'll say it outside of spoiler tags. Everyone playing should shoot for the good ending.

Yes agreed. Get the good ending. Start over if you have to (not really...well maybe) Just watching the evil ending on youtube made me go WTF, can't imagine how I would've reacted if I actually spent 20 hours to get that garbage.

Also I felt bad for Ryan mainly because he was your typical character who wanted to do good and change the world, but of course loses their way along the way.

Yeah I know the messages are achived. But IDK, I don't feel I should have to put effort into re-reading the story, but I probably will.

[doubledown]

I am still playing through this....I think I am getting near the end. Had a few late nights with my rental copy. Overall, pretty fun game...I want to keep seeing "What is next", although, it was a bit repetitive.

I just became a BIG DADDY, so not sure how much more I have to go

[PyroGamer]

I just became a BIG DADDY, so not sure how much more I have to go
One more level and the endboss. It was about thirty minutes from there, for me.

Also, yes, Happy Panda, I agree with you completely about the evil ending. Hell, I'll say it outside of spoiler tags. Everyone playing should shoot for the good ending.
If you would actually even consider harvesting a little sister, then you fucking deserve the crappy ending you sack of shit.

[buttasuperb]

If you would actually even consider harvesting a little sister, then you fucking deserve the crappy ending you sack of shit.

I've been harvesting those whores with no remorse. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v423/buttasuperb/28.gif

[whiptcracker]

I thought the good ending was too sappy.

Good game, but I don't think I'll play it through again. Needed more mission variety in the levels.

[moojuice]

I don't know if this has been posted before, but:

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s268/Marcus_J_Reyner/SPDOJIMOPYP74QI7JJ2WC4HWYMRJQJMO.pngNot a spoiler, but its just for the element of suprise



(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s268/Marcus_J_Reyner/SPDOJIMOPYP74QI7JJ2WC4HWYMRJQJMO.png)

[lordwow]

I don't know, reading a bunch of today's posts I'm beginning to wonder about the 9.7ish score I gave it. The game is amazing, and clearly in 9.0+ territory, but a lot of people pointed out some pretty big flaws.

A few end thoughts:

I thought the "would you kindly" thing was pretty clever. I noticed him saying it, but didn't think of that.

I feel like an idiot for not realizing Atlas = Fontaine until the twist. I knew something was up when the tape right before you meet Ryan, Atlas doesn't have his accent, and instead has his Fontaine voice. But from the earlier audio clips I thought Ryan had killed him.

Also, I don't know how you can become a Big Daddy and not have the sweet claw or rail gun thing.

Loved the period music in the game, too bad it's not on the actual soundtrack.

And I think Ryan was a far better villain than Fontaine. The whole story built up to the confrontation with Ryan, and ultimately he should be the main villain of the game. He's a tragic character, he attempted to make this utopian society but ended up being basically a dictator. I find Ryan to be a well-developed and thought out character, and comparatively, Fontaine was pretty stupid.

That's all I can think of at the moment

[KwanzaaTimmy]

I've been harvesting those whores with no remorse. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v423/buttasuperb/28.gif

Ditto on my first time through. If they would have fleshed out the evil ending a bit more, I could see it being as awesome.

[Darkside Hazuki]

I thought the "would you kindly" thing was pretty clever. I noticed him saying it, but didn't think of that.

I feel like an idiot for not realizing Atlas = Fontaine until the twist. I knew something was up when the tape right before you meet Ryan, Atlas doesn't have his accent, and instead has his Fontaine voice. But from the earlier audio clips I thought Ryan had killed him.

Also, I don't know how you can become a Big Daddy and not have the sweet claw or rail gun thing.

Loved the period music in the game, too bad it's not on the actual soundtrack.

And I think Ryan was a far better villain than Fontaine. The whole story built up to the confrontation with Ryan, and ultimately he should be the main villain of the game. He's a tragic character, he attempted to make this utopian society but ended up being basically a dictator. I find Ryan to be a well-developed and thought out character, and comparatively, Fontaine was pretty stupid.

That's all I can think of at the moment

That's the irony! For all of his intelligence and lofty ideas, Ryan was destroyed by a con man and thug. Speaking of "irony", that's one of the best achievements in any game.

[Rei no Otaku]

That's the irony! For all of his intelligence and lofty ideas, Ryan was destroyed by a con man and thug. Speaking of "irony", that's one of the best achievements in any game.
Not to mention the irony of Fontaine staying more true to Ryan's ideals than Ryan himself.

[lordwow]

Not to mention the irony of Fontaine staying more true to Ryan's ideals than Ryan himself.

Ya, that's a good point. I think I need to let this game digest a bit more

[A Happy Panda]

I just thought of something....why would a city have vending machines for ammo? Maybe I missed a diary about this?

Also regarding the story Like some of you said, I would agree Ryan was a more fleshed out character. Again, the scene were you kill him, I was both shocked and thinking how gray the whole situation was. After Atlas revealed himself as Fontaine, and hearing his radio messages, it was pretty clear to me that he had to die. Still, the overall story is pretty....uh, ridiculous.

Still one of the best games I've played in a long time, but yeah, I'm re-thinking the statement about it being damn close to a 10. A 9 is a more suitable score for me now that I've finished the game and had time to think about it.

[zewone]

I just thought of something....why would a city have vending machines for ammo? Maybe I missed a diary about this?

Also regarding the story Like some of you said, I would agree Ryan was a more fleshed out character. Again, the scene were you kill him, I was both shocked and thinking how gray the whole situation was. After Atlas revealed himself as Fontaine, and hearing his radio messages, it was pretty clear to me that he had to die. Still, the overall story is pretty....uh, ridiculous.

Still one of the best games I've played in a long time, but yeah, I'm re-thinking the statement about it being damn close to a 10. A 9 is a more suitable score for me now that I've finished the game and had time to think about it.
Agreed; there are people in this thread who say it's one of the best stories they've ever experienced, I'd love to know what about it makes it so great.

[Mojimbo]

Without spoilers, can anyone tell me what the point of no return is? Basically, I'd like to know precisely when to save my game where I can still go back and look for missed diaries and research and such.

Thanks!

[zewone]

Without spoilers, can anyone tell me what the point of no return is? Basically, I'd like to know precisely when to save my game where I can still go back and look for missed diaries and research and such.

Thanks!
Right before going up the elevator in Proving Grounds.

[$hady]

Without spoilers, can anyone tell me what the point of no return is? Basically, I'd like to know precisely when to save my game where I can still go back and look for missed diaries and research and such.

Thanks!
Don't worry right at the end you'll have a autosave and then you'll go just a bit farther and before the final fight it'll say no more saves from here on out blah blah blah and then you go do your thing. You can always just go back and do what you need from that last autosave point.

Edit: Was there an autosave or did I just save right before going up the elevator? I forget now..... lol save often!

[A Happy Panda]

Right before going up the elevator in Proving Grounds.

It's pretty fun to go back as a Big Daddy The splicers leave you alone, making the search for diaries and power to the people stations much easier. I'm not sure if the cameras detect your not.

However, be aware that there are at least 2 diaries that if you miss, you cannot go back to get them. At least 2 I know of, there may be more, check a FAQ. If you missed them originally, you have to restart the game.

Are you sure Shady? I'm pretty sure it auto-saves in the elevator right before Fontaine . I always had 2 saves, one auto, and one I did myself whenever I felt like it. I don't think I ever loaded my game from an auto-save.

[$hady]

about the It's pretty fun spoiler above ^ Yea cameras don't detect you when you are a big daddy. That sucked for me BECAUSE I have EVERYTHING researched fully besides cameras and I was going back through the game looking for the ones I didnt destroy.... Pain in my ass!

[A Happy Panda]

about the It's pretty fun spoiler above ^ Yea cameras don't detect you when you are a big daddy. That sucked for me BECAUSE I have EVERYTHING researched fully besides cameras and I was going back through the game looking for the ones I didnt destroy.... Pain in my ass!

Eh, sucks even more for me. I hacked or destroyed just about every piece of security related hardware. No research achievement for me. Oh well.

[RollingSkull]

Bioshock is a very up front game; It WILL TELL YOU STRAIGHT UP what the point of no return is before you hit it.

And, I kinda disagree with you, Rei, vis-a-vis Ryan and Fontaine. I don't like arguing this on Bioshock's terms, because it is obvious the story was contrived, but Fontaine bested Ryan by providing a more effective brutal exploitation of capitalism than Ryan, and, as Atlas, a more effective populist/socialist appeal than Ryan. Granted, then he bested Ryan with a stupid plot device: you. Still, it is hard to look at Fontaine as a petty thug and con artist. That's just what the game presented him as, but he was a petty thug and con artist who crafted ADAM through his own capital and managed to run a good deal of the underworld in Rapture... supposedly. Even though he is supposed to be thuggish compared to Ryan's eloquence and almost ridiculous flair for the dramatic, it is hard to take that as believable.

Also, Ryan actually murdered a GREAT many more people than Fontaine. He deserved the golf club for the murder of crazy flower lady alone.

[slickkill77]

If you think about the story it was actualy really good. The boss fight not so much but the story was good if you were paying attention

[AshesofWake]

Agreed; there are people in this thread who say it's one of the best stories they've ever experienced, I'd love to know what about it makes it so great.


Rapture.

[slickkill77]

http://my.opera.com/noisewar/blog/2007/09/01/bioshock-explained

read Spoilers ^^^^ Basically the whole game

[Damian]

http://my.opera.com/noisewar/blog/2007/09/01/bioshock-explained
read
Whoa, don't read unless you're done with the game or want serious spoilers.

[strdr4]

http://my.opera.com/noisewar/blog/2007/09/01/bioshock-explained

read


Wow, that was a very informative read. That's way too info than I would get into about the game, but it gives a great amount of detail about some gaps that I had, especially the trio's relationship.

[daroga]

So, I've been playing this very casually, and am just curious how far along I am.

I saved just after Ryan killed the scientist who was going to raise trees back from the dead and now I have to make the Lazarus somethingorother.

[Rei no Otaku]

So, I've been playing this very casually, and am just curious how far along I am.

I saved just after Ryan killed the scientist who was going to raise trees back from the dead and now I have to make the Lazarus somethingorother.
About the halfway point.

[mr ryles]

damn, after beating the game all the way I missed one weapons upgrade station and am missing like 8 audio diaries. I explored every part of them map corner to corner, so I'm surprised I missed so much. I can't get the historian achievement since apparently one of the ones I missed I can no longer get, but I'll go back later and try to find the last weapon upgrade station.

[Liquid 2]

Any news on the doll's action figures' coffins?

[mr ryles]

http://my.opera.com/noisewar/blog/2007/09/01/bioshock-explained

read

the ending he described would have been so bad ass.


As Atlas lies defeated before Jack, you are given a minute to choose to kill him or save him while he utters the last words "Would you kindly save me?" Failing to choose and he dies. Choosing to let him to die carries out revenge fantasies for "the good guys." Choosing to save him means doing his bidding. Which choice you consider to be truly free will always be subjective. Here, I would turn off the game, and start playing this wonderful tale all over again.

[lordwow]

the ending he described would have been so bad ass.


As Atlas lies defeated before Jack, you are given a minute to choose to kill him or save him while he utters the last words "Would you kindly save me?" Failing to choose and he dies. Choosing to let him to die carries out revenge fantasies for "the good guys." Choosing to save him means doing his bidding. Which choice you consider to be truly free will always be subjective. Here, I would turn off the game, and start playing this wonderful tale all over again.




I agree, despite flaws, I think if that was an ending, the game might have gotten a perfect 10 from me.

[daroga]

About the halfway point.That's kinda what I was assuming. Thanks for the confirmation :)

[SynGamer]

Alright...how long until the movie comes out for "Rapture"? Seriously, i don't think i've seen a better setting in a game for a movie translation. Follow the same story as the game (not strict, but not loose)...only question i can think of is CG or Live Action?

[RollingSkull]

the ending he described would have been so bad ass.


As Atlas lies defeated before Jack, you are given a minute to choose to kill him or save him while he utters the last words "Would you kindly save me?" Failing to choose and he dies. Choosing to let him to die carries out revenge fantasies for "the good guys." Choosing to save him means doing his bidding. Which choice you consider to be truly free will always be subjective. Here, I would turn off the game, and start playing this wonderful tale all over again.



Eugh. No! You have no reason to want to save Fontaine. He tried to kill you at least twice, claimed he would murder Tenenbaum and the Little Sisters. I mean, Fontaine's opportunism did not kill nearly as many people as Ryan's "For your own good" brand of tyranny, but Fontaine was still a bastard. To cast that as a "free will... or is it?" strikes me as just an intellectually weak attempt at shoving Randianism down our throats; something Bioshock miraculously avoided.

I am usually never convinced by these sorts of video game analysis...essisisi...sii?... While this one was better than most, it still really didn't touch on the focal point of the game's morality and the sole decider in the game's denouement; the Little Sisters. Maybe in an earlier draft, you might have been a slave to Tenenbaum as well, but Tenenbaum is the only person in Bioshock who deals straight with you... or at least LIVES long enough to do so. Her every action now is predicated on the plight of the Little Sisters she created. That's obvious. Considering how, depending on your outlook, the Little Sisters are either the only route you have to power, or the only compassion you may show, the analysis is flawed in not discussing their impact on the story. The author also touched on the Fontaine/Atlas dichotomy but didn't really catch it, only misattributing capitalism to Fontaine, while not really exploring the socialism/populism of Atlas. I hate to be a pedant, but I don't think you CAN analyze Bioshock without addressing that multi-faceted approach. Hell, if you listened to his logs, Ryan was all for free-market capitalism as well, claiming that he cannot regulate the ADAM market and saying that if his folks want to stop it, they should offer a better product.

How quickly all THAT changed.

[AshesofWake]

i think the movie would work if it was based right before the game starts, like Rapture in its prime.

[SynGamer]

i think the movie would work if it was based right before the game starts, like Rapture in its prime.

Yeah, i was thinking prequel that acts as a compliment to the game. People play the game then watch the movie to see Rapture go from thriving underwater Utopia to a chaotic underwater grave...or watch the movie and then people want to play the game ;)

[RollingSkull]

Suggestion: Change the topic to "Bioshock - WELCOME TO THE CIRCUS OF VALUES HA HA HA HA"

[A Happy Panda]

Suggestion: Change the topic to "Bioshock - WELCOME TO THE CIRCUS OF VALUES HA HA HA HA"

I personally liked the ammo one.

"HOLA AMIGO! blah blah blah AMMO"

This thread is getting too advanced for me. And I think a movie using the game's plot would be retarded. They'd have to change a few things.

Genetically modifying a baby, implanting memories and commands into it's head, letting it live on the surface, then have it hijack a plane and crash it exactly where Rapture lies, then use it to do your bidding seems a bit much.

[BREVITY]

Just beat the game and I got to say THANK GOD I stayed away from all these spoilers and all the pod casts mentioning this game b/c it was sooo nice being suprised by some things in this game. It was just by chance that I got the full ending b/c I didnt know how to gun for it.

Anways good stuff and I hope there are more great games like this comming out this year. I am about 2min away from starting Metroid 3, I cant wait. I love all this FPS action we have going on atm.

[SteveMcQ]

Got a Live update for BioShock. Anyone know what it's for?

[slickkill77]

I was wondering the same. Maybe to update the physics. I only played a few minutes but I didnt see any funny physics so maybe

[elsnow77]

can anyone tell me if one of the little sisters dying at the end (during the escort mission) will affect the dont kill any lil sisters achievement?

^^^ endgame spoiler (sorta)

[zewone]

can anyone tell me if one of the little sisters dying at the end (during the escort mission) will affect the dont kill any lil sisters achievement?

^^^ endgame spoiler (sorta)
No.

[elsnow77]

No.
thanks for the quick response, i was worried there for a second

[slickkill77]

A live action movie would only work if that guy that made batman begins made it. HE obviously knows what makes a good movie. They could have fun with it though. I would make it a blend of the Utopia Rapture and then crap Rapture.

My movie idea/spoilers

They could start it with the plane thing extended then when he crashes they could go to a flash back of Jack as a baby in Rapture. Build the story from there and then when he reaches proper age go back to the main story. Or they could start with him as a child build the story and then go to the plane begining. The only problem is that near the end when Fontain tells you he made you it may ruin it. The only other thing I could think of is during the random parts where jack has a flashback of pictures they could show childhood scenes

[SynGamer]

A live action movie would only work if that guy that made batman begins made it. HE obviously knows what makes a good movie. They could have fun with it though. I would make it a blend of the Utopia Rapture and then crap Rapture.

My movie idea/spoilers

They could start it with the plane thing extended then when he crashes they could go to a flash back of Jack as a baby in Rapture. Build the story from there and then when he reaches proper age go back to the main story. Or they could start with him as a child build the story and then go to the plane begining. The only problem is that near the end when Fontain tells you he made you it may ruin it. The only other thing I could think of is during the random parts where jack has a flashback of pictures they could show childhood scenes
I think the best route they could go for a movie would be a prequel to the games story. I like the idea of starting with the plane crash and then flash back to the early days. I would really love to see the 40's and 50's. The director/writers would have to do a good job of pacing the movie from when the city first 'opens' to the slow progression to chaos that we know as Rapture in the game...how about;

Opening - big ballroom with music, dancing, everybody is enjoying themselves, it is the Utopian city everyone had hoped for. Cut to family, father and mother arguing when all-of-a-sudden the mother cracks and takes a frying pan to the fathers head. Blood splatters on the wall as we see a shadow on the wall repeatedly pound the piss out of the fathers head, more and more blood splattering against the wall.

Cut again to a mob that is now terrorizing a a section of the city. Citizens still sane have blocked the mob from getting into that section any further. The mob grows, and the citizens holding the blockade(s) are frantically trying to figure out what to do. Zoom to a man in a corner a short distance away from the sane citizens, knees to his chin, arms covering his head. He stands up, pulls out a gun from coat pocket, points it at the crazed mob...then quickly points it at another man among the sane and pulls the trigger. Seconds later the mob breaks the blockade down, women scream, guns going off left and right.

Blood all over. Bodies are scattered on the floor(s). A few people are aimlessly wandering the halls, all is very quiet. This is where the movie introduces the main characters for this prequel; a man and woman, both desperately looking for loved ones - the man looking for his wife and daughter, the woman looking for her fiance. This prequel tells the story of these two characters, their journey through the city of Rapture, and ultimately their demise...all leading up to the plane crash.

[Damian]

My movie idea/spoilers
If only there were some sort of tag to conceal those.

[F8X]

And I think a movie using the game's plot would be retarded. They'd have to change a few things.

Genetically modifying a baby, implanting memories and commands into it's head, letting it live on the surface, then have it hijack a plane and crash it exactly where Rapture lies, then use it to do your bidding seems a bit much.
I tell you what I bet John Woo would love to do the Bioshock movie. I mean remember the inspiration for Hard-Boiled was a Japanese madman who went around killing babies.

[red flare graf]

Spoiling asshat.

[Damian]

Got a Live update for BioShock. Anyone know what it's for?
It appears to exist solely to cause constant stuttering a second long freees. My game ran flawlessly until I got it tonight. Not long after I hit Fort Frolic though, so perhaps the new area is to blame. Not sure why though, it doesn't seem significantly different. In any case, it's extremely aggravating.

[SpecTrE3353]

Suggestion: Change the topic to "Bioshock - WELCOME TO THE CIRCUS OF VALUES HA HA HA HA"

After the last week of hearing me playing every night, my wife was freaking out telling me she was hearing that in her dreams.

[Mojimbo]

Finally beat the game yesterday, took me something like 30 hours over two weeks but I was able to get all the achievements except two in one playthrough.

Here's a really good guide for getting all the diaries, it's got maps plus explanations for all of them.

*SPOILERS, OBVIOUSLY*
http://xbox360achievements.org/forum/printthread.php?t=36010&pp=40

[Immortal fWd]

It appears to exist solely to cause constant stuttering a second long freees. My game ran flawlessly until I got it tonight. Not long after I hit Fort Frolic though, so perhaps the new area is to blame. Not sure why though, it doesn't seem significantly different. In any case, it's extremely aggravating.

I am noticing the same thing after the update.

[RelentlessRolento]

watch midway on the vid... Bioshock on 103inch HDTV... >_<

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/usermovies/100411.html

[getmyrunon]

watch midway on the vid... Bioshock on 103inch HDTV... >_<

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/usermovies/100411.html

And this is why I tell everyone I know to get a projector :) They've gotten really cheap and they're absolutely out of this world awesome to game on.

edit: there was a point to this message. After you beat the game once (I harvested all the Little Sisters, so I know I'm going to get the bad ending), can you re-play using your existing file (and so it'll maybe save the diaries you already picked up?) Or do you have to start afresh.. ).

[Corvin]

A live action movie would only work if that guy that made batman begins made it. HE obviously knows what makes a good movie.

Christopher Nolan is amazing. Batman is good but his reigning achievement is Memento. The Prestige is not far behind. I'd put Begins third on his list of films only topping Insomnia, which is also a good flick.

All in all, he hasn't made a bad movie yet. I could get behind him on Bioshock.

[lordwow]

And this is why I tell everyone I know to get a projector :) They've gotten really cheap and they're absolutely out of this world awesome to game on.

edit: there was a point to this message. After you beat the game once (I harvested all the Little Sisters, so I know I'm going to get the bad ending), can you re-play using your existing file (and so it'll maybe save the diaries you already picked up?) Or do you have to start afresh.. ).

no

[regisphilbi0]

I finally played the demo last night... Holy...Crap.. That was the most intense 45 minutes of gameplay I've had in a long time. Wow. I NEED to get this game now!

[ThatDamnDave]

After I played for a bit, I went back to get a diary list to make sure I picked them all up.

Of course I missed one of the two at the very beginning that you can only get right then. Bah.

[pittpizza]

I just got rick roll'd. It was fuckin hilarious.

So on topic: Bioshock or Metroid Prime 3??? Anybody....anybody...???

[mcgavin27]

I just got rick roll'd. It was fuckin hilarious.

So on topic: Bioshock or Metroid Prime 3??? Anybody....anybody...???
bioshock. I have never been much of a fan of the prime series, the aiming always seemed wonky to me.

[LinkinPrime]

Possible Plasmids coming soon through DLC:

A forum member by the name of Zemlor has unearthed (http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=192113&postcount=1) some good evidence of possible downloadable content, entitled Plasmid Pack 1, in the install files of the PC (http://www.xboxic.com/news/3620#) version. Examine a part of the code below: ;Downloadable content announcement
ManualTopicName=PlasmidPack1
—–
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
;Downloadable content announcement
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
[PlasmidPack1]
TopicType=Gene Tonics Unlocked!
FriendlyName=(Downloaded Content)
bHidden=true
Entry=\nNEW FROM RYAN INDUSTRIES!
Entry=\nHaving concluded clinical trials on four new Genetic Improvements, Ryan Industries is proud to announce the general release of their newest products:
Entry=\nMachine Buster
Entry=Vending Expert
Entry=Sonic Boom
Entry=EVE Saver
Entry=\nLook for them at a Gatherer’s Garden near you!


If you don’t feel like looking at it closely, the pack includes the following plasmids: Machine Buster, Vending Expert, Sonic Boom, and EVE Saver. That’s not all though, as the scavenger also ran into a galore of other unused plasmids and descriptions. Even more downloadable packs planned for release in the future? It certainly looks like it. Please do know that none of this has been confirmed and could just as well be some useless “junk code”. Nonetheless, if nothing else, it sure gives us hope that somewhere down the line downloadable content might become available for one of the biggest hits of this year.
http://www.xboxic.com/news/3620

[Mr Unoriginal]

Would DLC really be that worth it? I can't picture myself going through the entire game again just to try a new Plasmid.

[Halo05]

Same here. I might play through it one more time to see the other ending/see what is different when you're evil but unless those add-ons come out soon and are free, I can't see myself bothering.

[A Happy Panda]

Same here. I might play through it one more time to see the other ending/see what is different when you're evil but unless those add-ons come out soon and are free, I can't see myself bothering.

The evil ending blows beyond belief. And NOTHING is different except the ending movie.

[PKRipp3r]

The evil ending blows beyond belief. And NOTHING is different except the ending movie.

that's too bad

i kinda liked the 'good' ending, even if it was predictable and a little cheesy

was hoping the other side would be cool too

[lordwow]

I was kinda hoping there was an evil ending achievement. Oh well.

[Halo05]

So wait a sec, in the "evil" ending... Tenenbaum is still all, "Go! Save Rapture! Here, let the Little Sisters help you!" I was hoping the whole last 1/4 - 1/5 of the game would be different. Poo.

[A Happy Panda]

So wait a sec, in the "evil" ending... Tenenbaum is still all, "Go! Save Rapture! Here, let the Little Sisters help you!" I was hoping the whole last 1/4 - 1/5 of the game would be different. Poo.

Yep.

Just found this hilarious video review from Digg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IBkT0Oi97E

(waits for angry mob)

And FYI, I loved playing through Bioshock, so don't take this as flamebait.

[Halo05]

Pretty hilarious review. Predictable PC elitism abounds however; I'd love to see the reviewer try to handle something like Guilty Gear XX or Ikaruga. Touting complexity as a necessary ingredient in worthwhile games also seems like he's bagging on the entire history of videogames which speaks volumes about his videogame knowledge in general.

Anywho, I can't imagine he has much fun playing games seeing as how his "Gallery of worthy FPS RPGs" consists of a whopping 3 titles. I don't know how many times one can play through System Shock 2, Deus Ex and Stalker but I hope for his sake, it's dozens. Each. Into infinity.

[Nelo Ice]

anyone kno the next best weapon to upgrade?

im in fort frolic on my 4th power to the people machine

ive already upgraded the shotty fully and nade launcher immunity

[Halo05]

I had good results with the powered up machine gun. Ammo's cheap both to buy and invent.

[slickkill77]

Shotgun and Rocket Launcher

[SpecTrE3353]

I used the machine gun by far the most throughout the game (w/ antipersonnel ammo it is fantastic) and the upgrades for it are a must (especially the reduced recoil one).

[LinkinPrime]

Bioshock update out now.

Hey guys,

the XBL update improves stability when loading autosaves and overall game stability, corrects audio during title menu loading, and addresses AI behaviors regarding use of health stations.
http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=196420&postcount=6

[torifile]

Bioshock update out now.


http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=196420&postcount=6
No widescreen fix? Boo.

[Damian]

No widescreen fix? Boo.
Widescreen isn't "broken". If they do change it it's only because people cried about it so much. The developers decided that a certain field of view was ideal for gameplay. Since they decided black bars weren't good because it would reduce the actual playable game area, they decided to trim the top and bottom from widescreen because it had little affect on gameplay.

[thrustbucket]

One question:

Where the hell is the chemical thrower? I have maxed out it's ammo but still don't have it. I'm about 2/3 through Arcadia.

Also, isn't it kind of gay that electro bolt interacts with water but winter freeze doesn't?

[A Happy Panda]

One question:

Where the hell is the chemical thrower? I have maxed out it's ammo but still don't have it. I'm about 2/3 through Arcadia.

Also, isn't it kind of gay that electro bolt interacts with water but winter freeze doesn't?

You're pretty close to getting it. I remember thinking the same thing.

Also, seeing splicers or Big Daddies slipping on ice would be hilarious.

Oh and 2k, how about an update to sync up the damn audio and subtitles?

[getmyrunon]

Just finished the game -- here's my review:

I've got mixed feelings about it - on the one hand, it does a lot of things right - the environments, the enemy models and animations, the AI and the audio were all highlights for me, some of the most impressive I've seen in any game. I really loved the art style, the painstaking details on every nook and cranny of the diverse environments, and the way the splicers moved and dressed gave me the creeps. I'm actually excited to take the game to school with me to watch someone else play it so I can soak in the environments without sweeping the room on high alert.

Other atypical elements like the hacking minigame, plasmids, the decisions around upgrading, and the inclusion of money were hit or miss. I loved being able to commandeer turrets and cameras and watching them take out my enemies (and I think a mini-game makes sense there), but I got unbelievably bored of it about halfway through the game after hacking my 500th vending machine. I eventually started an autohack/replenish at u-invent station combo but that isn't really a sustainable solution until the later stages of the game, and by then I was already sick of them.

Searching bodies for loot was entertaining at first, but similarly, after my 500th cavity search it became painfully tedious and I started double-tapping A without even reading (which led to me getting drunk a few times, but there was no real penalty for it -- I would just stand there and wait it out, so what was the point?)

The concept of plasmids is a fun one (and there were moments when they worked to perfection), and I only wish I had more opportunities to use more obscure ones. As it stood, I only used electric shock/telekenesis/enrage because with limited ammo stores I went for the most effective kill combinations first. I felt like I was stuck in too many situations with all the wrong ammo (the game is suspiciously devoid of auto-anti-p ammo later on in the game) and had to resort to stunning, wrenching, and telekenesising my way out of things because I was afraid to use other ammo lest I need it more a little later on.

Finally, some things were just outright disappointing, the story being the biggest letdown of all. I found the combination of radio chatter and recorded diary method of revealing the story to be a little awkward. I appreciated the individual character storylines, but the game never really gave you enough to be invested in them, and in the end they were sort of lost in the shuffle.

I'm not even going to talk about the ending - I got the "bad" one (and was so unsatisfied I proceeded to watch the "good" one on youtube and unfortunately I think that one sucked too). If anything it serves to reinforce how weak the overall plot was to begin with. I can certainly appreciate a "wtf" or "out there" type of story (I think MGS2 has one of the best videogame plots of all time), but this one just fell flat on its face.

I think that the best videogames are a combination of two criteria: riveting story and exciting gameplay. While Bioshock failed to some degree at delivering the former, it succeeded admirably at the latter, and that's all I needed to keep playing with a smile on my face. I found myself thinking the same thing I thought while playing Gears - I don't really know or care why I'm shooting these things, but I sure am having a good time. The flaws I mentioned above keep me from giving it "true classic" status, but it has to be at least in the running for GOTY at this point, and I'm quite glad that I got the chance to play it.

[2Fast]

For some reason the Hypnotize Big Daddy plasmid never works for me, I have no clue why.

[A Happy Panda]

For some reason the Hypnotize Big Daddy plasmid never works for me, I have no clue why.

That's lame. Maybe glitched? Try upgrading it and see if that works.

Also I found that plasmid to be both a gift and a nightmare. I had that electric shock tonic on me where if I got hit, I'd emit electricity. Man. You could imagine the look on my face when I hypnotized a Big Daddy, get hurt, and then see his eyes turn red and rushing at me...not fun.

As a result, I hardly used it unless I really needed the help.

[lordwow]

That's lame. Maybe glitched? Try upgrading it and see if that works.

Also I found that plasmid to be both a gift and a nightmare. I had that electric shock tonic on me where if I got hit, I'd emit electricity. Man. You could imagine the look on my face when I hypnotized a Big Daddy, get hurt, and then see his eyes turn red and rushing at me...not fun.

As a result, I hardly used it unless I really needed the help.

Yep.

It doesn't work if he's already red. And if you hit him at all when he's hypnotized, he turns on you.

[2Fast]

I figured it out, the Big Daddy was already red when I tried it on him.

I'm in Neptune's Bounty and there is a Big Daddy that's pretty much after me. I can't beat this particular one for some reason. Help!

[captainfrizo]

I finished the game yesterday and my feelings are kind of mixed. My "review" follows:

The style and presentation are simply incredible. I feel Bioshock as set the new watermark. The first several hours were some of the coolest and at times most intense experiences I've encountered in a game. I'll always remember my first battle with a Big Daddy, watching in terror as everything I threw at it did little to no damage. The first half or so of this game was one hell of a ride and something everyone should experience. However, the experience is not perfect.

The biggest problem I had with the game is about 3/4 of the way through I had simply stopped caring. I knew how to defeat the enemies, the hacking mini-game lost all appeal and went from being one of the coolest parts of the game to being the most tedious, and even the battles with the Big Daddies became quite repetitive. Through the first half of the game I'd avoid them unless I had a ton of health times, ammo, and/or turrets, security drones, etc. The second half of the game I no longer feared them but instead looked to cause the most carnage as possible before I took everything out.

The majority of the plasmids were very well done although a few them (hypnotize Big Daddy and the swarming bees) I never bothered with or felt I didn't have much reason to.

The final battle was also a bit of a let-down. I much rather would have battled two or three Big Daddies at once.

Overall I can't say Bioshock is the best game on the 360 or even its best shooter (that honor still goes to Rainbow Six Vegas as far as I'm concerned), but the overall experience is still one extremely worthwhile, even with some of its flaws.

[catapult37]

I've been been finished with it for a while. I have to say the scene with andrew ryan was one of the most powerful things I have ever witnessed in a game. All of the sudden you had to re-evaluate everything that came before -- but it wasn't just a plot twist, it was a twist on you as the main character and even you as the player. Not only have you been manipulated emotionally, but suddenly the whole concept of "objectives in a video game" has been subverted. You have been laboring under the *delusion* of free will, only to realize you had none all along. That really affected me, and I tried desperately to alter the outcome of the golf club scene, only to be unable to control my own actions. I was as helpless as Jack himself. I saved the game after that and went to bed, amazed at how the game communicated those feelings of betrayal, helplessness, and frustration, and pondering the meaning of free will both in and out of the game.

Unfortunately, the last third of the narrative utter failed to explore the philosophical and emotional themes that were so effectively conveyed in that scene. It was an incredible letdown from a story perspective. I thought they were on to something with the horror of transforming yourself into a big daddy, but that action had almost no consequences other than leading to the (admittedly memorable) little sister protection scenes. I was really dreading the whole thing, especially when fontaine talked about how it was a one-way street and suchong's diary mentioned how the suit fuses with skin and organs. But there were no ramifications whatsoever to that decision to basically desecrate your own body. (of course, this is the same main character who has inexplicably been splicing himself up the entire time without a thought of the fate suffered by other splicers).

One article I read suggested a nice twist on the ending (if you had to keep more or less the same ending) -- fontaine should have said "would you kindly save me?" Forcing you to either Rescue or Harvest him, and forcing you to come to terms with your free will -- is it still free will if you respond to the "would you kindly" and do the "good" thing and save him?

I loved the game, but in retrospect, I have some issues with it. I guess that's what you get when a world and story is so incredibly realized -- you start to see the shortcomings in greater focus.

BTW, I heard an interview with Tim Levine where he admitted he had not even considered the possibility that people might feel remorse for killing the big daddies. After seeing the facilty (and going through the process) where normal people become those monstrosities, I can't imagine how it never occurred to him.

Finally, a question I could never figure out: what the heck was in the submarine? I remember at the time not being sure if I could trust Atlas and being quite anxious about what might really be in there. After Atlas is revealed to be Fontaine, I really wondered. ? Any thoughts?

[Halo05]

If you haven't finished the game, avoid this spoiler. It refers to the post above mine.

I have no clue who could've been in the submarine. I thought about it after Atlas is revealed as Fontaine but I figured the sub was probably empty and had been used by Fontaine as bait to make Ryan more despicable to the main character.

[Plac1d]

Just finished the game -- here's my review:

I've got mixed feelings about it - on the one hand, it does a lot of things right - the environments, the enemy models and animations, the AI and the audio were all highlights for me, some of the most impressive I've seen in any game. I really loved the art style, the painstaking details on every nook and cranny of the diverse environments, and the way the splicers moved and dressed gave me the creeps. I'm actually excited to take the game to school with me to watch someone else play it so I can soak in the environments without sweeping the room on high alert.

Other atypical elements like the hacking minigame, plasmids, the decisions around upgrading, and the inclusion of money were hit or miss. I loved being able to commandeer turrets and cameras and watching them take out my enemies (and I think a mini-game makes sense there), but I got unbelievably bored of it about halfway through the game after hacking my 500th vending machine. I eventually started an autohack/replenish at u-invent station combo but that isn't really a sustainable solution until the later stages of the game, and by then I was already sick of them.

Searching bodies for loot was entertaining at first, but similarly, after my 500th cavity search it became painfully tedious and I started double-tapping A without even reading (which led to me getting drunk a few times, but there was no real penalty for it -- I would just stand there and wait it out, so what was the point?)

The concept of plasmids is a fun one (and there were moments when they worked to perfection), and I only wish I had more opportunities to use more obscure ones. As it stood, I only used electric shock/telekenesis/enrage because with limited ammo stores I went for the most effective kill combinations first. I felt like I was stuck in too many situations with all the wrong ammo (the game is suspiciously devoid of auto-anti-p ammo later on in the game) and had to resort to stunning, wrenching, and telekenesising my way out of things because I was afraid to use other ammo lest I need it more a little later on.

Finally, some things were just outright disappointing, the story being the biggest letdown of all. I found the combination of radio chatter and recorded diary method of revealing the story to be a little awkward. I appreciated the individual character storylines, but the game never really gave you enough to be invested in them, and in the end they were sort of lost in the shuffle.

I'm not even going to talk about the ending - I got the "bad" one (and was so unsatisfied I proceeded to watch the "good" one on youtube and unfortunately I think that one sucked too). If anything it serves to reinforce how weak the overall plot was to begin with. I can certainly appreciate a "wtf" or "out there" type of story (I think MGS2 has one of the best videogame plots of all time), but this one just fell flat on its face.

I think that the best videogames are a combination of two criteria: riveting story and exciting gameplay. While Bioshock failed to some degree at delivering the former, it succeeded admirably at the latter, and that's all I needed to keep playing with a smile on my face. I found myself thinking the same thing I thought while playing Gears - I don't really know or care why I'm shooting these things, but I sure am having a good time. The flaws I mentioned above keep me from giving it "true classic" status, but it has to be at least in the running for GOTY at this point, and I'm quite glad that I got the chance to play it.
QFT

I'm on the boat with everyone else, so I don't have much to add. Completing much of the campaign, you couldn't ask for a better experience from such am immersive environment. Then by 3/4 through, the game's prime disolves and the repetitive nature dulls the gameplay moderately. The Fontaine boss battle felt misplaced and was just a diservice to rest of the game. That said, the game still deserves the collosul feedback from everyone and their mother.
I found the combination of radio chatter and recorded diary method of revealing the story to be a little awkward. I appreciated the individual character storylines, but the game never really gave you enough to be invested in them, and in the end they were sort of lost in the shuffle. I liked listening to the radio chatter and hunting for diaries in the game, but them used to supplement characters and story archs in the game that could have otherwise been there to interact with was a *huge* dissapointment.

I'm sad the game didn't include
- Any sort of swimming/underwater elements in the game. Swimming away from the plane wreck in the begining was present, so you know the developers had the architecture to incorporate that into the game if they wanted to. For a city completly underwater and falling to disrepair, I'm still scratching my head why the water levels barely made your boots wet.
- Visual sequences between levels when transporting in the submarine from one part of the city to another.

[A Happy Panda]

I've been been finished with it for a while. I have to say the scene with andrew ryan was one of the most powerful things I have ever witnessed in a game. All of the sudden you had to re-evaluate everything that came before -- but it wasn't just a plot twist, it was a twist on you as the main character and even you as the player. Not only have you been manipulated emotionally, but suddenly the whole concept of "objectives in a video game" has been subverted. You have been laboring under the *delusion* of free will, only to realize you had none all along. That really affected me, and I tried desperately to alter the outcome of the golf club scene, only to be unable to control my own actions. I was as helpless as Jack himself. I saved the game after that and went to bed, amazed at how the game communicated those feelings of betrayal, helplessness, and frustration, and pondering the meaning of free will both in and out of the game.

Unfortunately, the last third of the narrative utter failed to explore the philosophical and emotional themes that were so effectively conveyed in that scene. It was an incredible letdown from a story perspective. I thought they were on to something with the horror of transforming yourself into a big daddy, but that action had almost no consequences other than leading to the (admittedly memorable) little sister protection scenes. I was really dreading the whole thing, especially when fontaine talked about how it was a one-way street and suchong's diary mentioned how the suit fuses with skin and organs. But there were no ramifications whatsoever to that decision to basically desecrate your own body. (of course, this is the same main character who has inexplicably been splicing himself up the entire time without a thought of the fate suffered by other splicers).

One article I read suggested a nice twist on the ending (if you had to keep more or less the same ending) -- fontaine should have said "would you kindly save me?" Forcing you to either Rescue or Harvest him, and forcing you to come to terms with your free will -- is it still free will if you respond to the "would you kindly" and do the "good" thing and save him?

I loved the game, but in retrospect, I have some issues with it. I guess that's what you get when a world and story is so incredibly realized -- you start to see the shortcomings in greater focus.

BTW, I heard an interview with Tim Levine where he admitted he had not even considered the possibility that people might feel remorse for killing the big daddies. After seeing the facilty (and going through the process) where normal people become those monstrosities, I can't imagine how it never occurred to him.

Finally, a question I could never figure out: what the heck was in the submarine? I remember at the time not being sure if I could trust Atlas and being quite anxious about what might really be in there. After Atlas is revealed to be Fontaine, I really wondered. ? Any thoughts?

I actually felt bad about killing the Big Daddies. They were simply doing their job, a noble one at that, protecting the Little Sisters. Here I was just completely fucking them up. And for what? Well it depends, you could've killed the Big Daddies out of complete selfish-ness and harvested the Little Sisters, or saved them. I did the latter, so I kind of rationalized it. Also it's Ken Levine.

[RollingSkull]

I've been been finished with it for a while. I have to say the scene with andrew ryan was one of the most powerful things I have ever witnessed in a game. All of the sudden you had to re-evaluate everything that came before -- but it wasn't just a plot twist, it was a twist on you as the main character and even you as the player. Not only have you been manipulated emotionally, but suddenly the whole concept of "objectives in a video game" has been subverted. You have been laboring under the *delusion* of free will, only to realize you had none all along. That really affected me, and I tried desperately to alter the outcome of the golf club scene, only to be unable to control my own actions. I was as helpless as Jack himself. I saved the game after that and went to bed, amazed at how the game communicated those feelings of betrayal, helplessness, and frustration, and pondering the meaning of free will both in and out of the game.

I don't get that. Ryan a scoundrel and a murderer. You'd seen him murder at least one person, and read logs of him killing countless more. He deserved to die.

Plus, seriously, exploring free will in the conext of a video game? It has been done, and done to death. Even once was enough to make the entire philosophical discussion tedious. You cannot use the predetermined structure of a video game and then try to pull the rug out from under the gamers with a stupidly thought out jab at "free will." It is like making the gamer play Twister and then making a philosophical comment about how easy it is to lose one's balance or how the gamer is participating as a voyeur and hoping the whole thing becomes an orgy. It is both a cheap shot and not particularly impressive one.

Plus, Ryan could have easily made you his slave. The illogic of him not doing so was kinda silly.

Unfortunately, the last third of the narrative utter failed to explore the philosophical and emotional themes that were so effectively conveyed in that scene. It was an incredible letdown from a story perspective. I thought they were on to something with the horror of transforming yourself into a big daddy, but that action had almost no consequences other than leading to the (admittedly memorable) little sister protection scenes. I was really dreading the whole thing, especially when fontaine talked about how it was a one-way street and suchong's diary mentioned how the suit fuses with skin and organs. But there were no ramifications whatsoever to that decision to basically desecrate your own body. (of course, this is the same main character who has inexplicably been splicing himself up the entire time without a thought of the fate suffered by other splicers).

One article I read suggested a nice twist on the ending (if you had to keep more or less the same ending) -- fontaine should have said "would you kindly save me?" Forcing you to either Rescue or Harvest him, and forcing you to come to terms with your free will -- is it still free will if you respond to the "would you kindly" and do the "good" thing and save him?

I loved the game, but in retrospect, I have some issues with it. I guess that's what you get when a world and story is so incredibly realized -- you start to see the shortcomings in greater focus.

Its free will if you kill the bastard who tried to kill you twice, who has promised to murder the Little Sisters and Tenenbaum... Anything else is intellectual masturbation.

But, yeah, the Big Daddy thing was kinda weak, as was the complete disconnect between the splicers and your own injections of Adam. We don't even KNOW how the splicers got from where you are to where they are.

Finally, a question I could never figure out: what the heck was in the submarine? I remember at the time not being sure if I could trust Atlas and being quite anxious about what might really be in there. After Atlas is revealed to be Fontaine, I really wondered. ? Any thoughts?

That's the dumbest part of the whole narrative. Ryan makes it clear that he doesn't want you escaping like thieves. Fontaine already had you under mind control, WHY GO THROUGH THAT STUPID CHARADE? It can't have been to make Ryan look more evil. Ryan already was a brutal murderer, who would already kill at least one more person in front of you before the end of it. He was already trying to kill you two. Fontaine could have just said "Kill Ryan, would ye kindly?" and that would have been that. This is just a bad plot device.

[A Happy Panda]

To RollingSkull

IDK if this is what you mean or not. But the splicers got where they are because of the lack of Adam. It was in one of the diaries that stated the lack of Adam started to cause them to deform and go absolutely insane.

[RollingSkull]

To RollingSkull

IDK if this is what you mean or not. But the splicers got where they are because of the lack of Adam. It was in one of the diaries that stated the lack of Adam started to cause them to deform and go absolutely insane.

Well, that helps, but at what point do you become DEPENDANT on the stuff?

[getmyrunon]

Plus, Ryan could have easily made you his slave. The illogic of him not doing so was kinda silly.


Someone else explained this well in a few posts above (or maybe it was another forum altogether). To paraphrase - Ryan was pretty screwed at that point - his defenses were breached and Fontaine was going to get him one way or another, so he decided to exercise the choice of electing to have someone kill him, thereby making him not a slave. Sloppy, but it works.

[A Happy Panda]

Well, that helps, but at what point do you become DEPENDANT on the stuff?

Well I think that's part of the whole atmosphere of Rapture. Adam is what ultimately ruined the city I think, not necessarily the war between Fontaine and Ryan, that was a mere part of it. People used Adam for power initially, to better themselves, which was the mantra of Rapture. Unfortunately, as seen in the game, this didn't turn out well...at all. Then the side effects came with the Adam, deformation, and really the loss of sanity. People began to see this, and the desperate search for Adam began. However, they had already lost their sanity, and their deformed faces had already come about. People started to kill their friends and family for Adam in a futile effort to sustain whatever human face they had left and whatever sanity they could hold on to. But of course in reality, they had already lost their minds since they were indeed killing their peers and loved ones.

Adam was essentially a drug, much like heroin for example. People become dependent on it. Like heroin, your appearance changes greatly, and your mind alters. Unlike heroin, Adam makes those changes irreversable.

EDIT: Added more.

[Kayden]

Someone else explained this well in a few posts above (or maybe it was another forum altogether). To paraphrase - Ryan was pretty screwed at that point - his defenses were breached and Fontaine was going to get him one way or another, so he decided to exercise the choice of electing to have someone kill him, thereby making him not a slave. Sloppy, but it works.

And what was he saying as you beat him down?
"A man chooses"
He was asserting that it was his wish to let you kill him as opposed to Fontaine actually winning.

[catapult37]

Either I'm not playing the right games, or I just missed the ones where the theme of free will was fully explored to the point of banality. I agree that.. Ryan fully deserved his brutal death when it was finally given to him. However, my conflict at that point was between the desire to see him dead and the desire to a) exercise my own free will and b) not kill him on "his terms" as he forces you to. In the end his death became his victory over you, a subtlety which is somewhat shocking for a video game (especially after you spend the first four hours on a mission to kill the man). I'm a fairly intelligent person, and I believe that the theme was, at this point in the game (certainly not later), both well-executed and thought-provoking.

[Kayden]

I think you're in the minority there. Most everyone else probably thought it was just really cool to see a putter sticking out of his dome.

Is it just me or did the usage of "FUCK" explode in the last 1/5th of the game?

Either I'm not playing the right games, or I just missed the ones where the theme of free will was fully explored to the point of banality. I agree that.. Ryan fully deserved his brutal death when it was finally given to him. However, my conflict at that point was between the desire to see him dead and the desire to a) exercise my own free will and b) not kill him on "his terms" as he forces you to. In the end his death became his victory over you, a subtlety which is somewhat shocking for a video game (especially after you spend the first four hours on a mission to kill the man). I'm a fairly intelligent person, and I believe that the theme was, at this point in the game (certainly not later), both well-executed and thought-provoking.

[slickkill77]

Do we really need all these "spoilers"

[elsnow77]

Do we really need all these "spoilers"
yes

[captainfrizo]

Do we really need all these "spoilers"

If we don't put spoilers in then those who haven't finished the game will piss and moan about how we're ruining it for them.

So, rather than put up with them we put anything plot revealing (or overly long) in spoilers. That way everyone wins, unless that half-second needed to reveal the "spoiler" is really that important to you.

[getmyrunon]

If we don't put spoilers in then those who haven't finished the game will piss and moan about how we're ruining it for them.

So, rather than put up with them we put anything plot revealing (or overly long) in spoilers. That way everyone wins, unless that half-second needed to reveal the "spoiler" is really that important to you.

Well, some people just hate having to click past the tags :)

[A Happy Panda]

Well, some people just hate having to click past the tags :)

LOL. That was an awesome post.

[Rei no Otaku]

Ryan makes it clear that he doesn't want you escaping like thieves. Fontaine already had you under mind control, WHY GO THROUGH THAT STUPID CHARADE? It can't have been to make Ryan look more evil. Ryan already was a brutal murderer, who would already kill at least one more person in front of you before the end of it. He was already trying to kill you two. Fontaine could have just said "Kill Ryan, would ye kindly?" and that would have been that. This is just a bad plot device.
Rather than having Jack fight him the whole way, he tricked him with the charade. Someone who genuinely feels he's doing right and has what he considers a noble cause will fight harder than a slave. Why risk having Jack fight the mind control in the slightest? Put on a little show (which he had been doing for awhile as Atlas anyway) and give Jack something to fight for.

[getmyrunon]

Rather than having Jack fight him the whole way, he tricked him with the charade. Someone who genuinely feels he's doing right and has what he considers a noble cause will fight harder than a slave. Why risk having Jack fight the mind control in the slightest? Put on a little show (which he had been doing for awhile as Atlas anyway) and give Jack something to fight for.

Agreed - to that point, all Jack had to go on to that point was Atlas/Fontaine's word that Ryan was bad -- this provided "evidence." My question is - what did Ryan say over the radio at this point? I remember him talking, but I can't remember what it was.

[Rei no Otaku]

I also think that Ryan didn't realize that Atlas=Fontaine until you're about to meet Ryan. I think it wasn't until that point that he finally figured out who was pulling the strings. Which is another reason why Fontaine kept up the Atlas facade. To not only trick you, but Ryan as well.

[Kayden]

Ryan kills Dumbledore

[RollingSkull]

Rather than having Jack fight him the whole way, he tricked him with the charade. Someone who genuinely feels he's doing right and has what he considers a noble cause will fight harder than a slave. Why risk having Jack fight the mind control in the slightest? Put on a little show (which he had been doing for awhile as Atlas anyway) and give Jack something to fight for.

No, that still doesn't fly. That's the most ridiculous charade Fontaine could have possibly chosen. It required exposing himself, sending Jack the completely wrong direction, and risking both their lives senselessly. I guess if we allow for typical video game over-the-top-ness it could fly, but Bioshock can't have its narrative cake and eat it too by playing off of video game conventions as a plot device and then turn around and use them as an excuse for what is a stupidly risky and, well, not even measurable benefit. Fontaine put the childhood memories in Jack's head, he could have just as easily put a history of sexual abuse by Ryan in his head. Who, honestly, outside of storybooks, logically thinks "I have a slave who will do whatever I want, but I must put on an elaborate dog and pony show to make him WANT to kill Ryan first to eek out that last 100 horsepower of killing power!" Fontaine was a smart cookie, but he never seemed to think in such abstract terms. If he can command you to die, he can damn well make you kill Ryan.

[RollingSkull]

Either I'm not playing the right games, or I just missed the ones where the theme of free will was fully explored to the point of banality. I agree that.. Ryan fully deserved his brutal death when it was finally given to him. However, my conflict at that point was between the desire to see him dead and the desire to a) exercise my own free will and b) not kill him on "his terms" as he forces you to. In the end his death became his victory over you, a subtlety which is somewhat shocking for a video game (especially after you spend the first four hours on a mission to kill the man). I'm a fairly intelligent person, and I believe that the theme was, at this point in the game (certainly not later), both well-executed and thought-provoking.

Well, it only takes one or two to reach banality, because they all explore it the same damn way. Video game conventions: discrete objectives, plot that usually doesn't provide 100% exposition, and so you reach the end of the game to find out that you've been manipulated all along. Post-modern questions about the nature of information you are fed might be raised, free will usually comes up... blegh. MGS2 was a huge offender. If memory serves, KotOR2 might have touched on it. By the time Breakdown used that sort of thing as a movie-style plot device rather than "raising any questions," I was sick of the motif, for reasons already given.

And, frankly, if Ryan calls his appointment in hell a victory, well, more power to him. I don't see the removal of free will, ESPECIALLY in a video game, where you don't have it to begin with, to do something I would have done myself, BETTER than I could have done it otherwise (There's no weapon slot for the putter. :( ) as an issue that provokes thought.

[R1V3R5]

Just finished it (as I got distracted by school and the COD4 beta) and the ending was totally lame. I realize I got the bad ending and there are multiple endings but I just don't think I'll play through again for the alternate endings. Overall I really enjoyed the game.

[NWgamer666]

I really appreciate the Spolier tags, as someone who hasn't finished the game yet. Thanks guys, I didn't get one single clue.

I did come in here to bitch about the "title update" which has totally destroyed this game for me. The hickups come every fucking 30 seconds. I demand an unpatch. Things were working great before. Just unupdate the shit. Anyone heard from 2K on this? Is anyone not effected by it? Is this a ploy to force people to hold on to the game, rather than trade it in, so as to force them to wait for a playable update? Maybe snide suspicions, but this game is now seriously fucked. I dare you to go back and replay it and not throw your controller at the TV.

[camoor]

Does this game remind anyone else of "Sky Captain and the World of Tommorrow"

From what I've seen, the thematic elements of the plot and Art Deco style seem very similar.

[Damian]

I did come in here to bitch about the "title update" which has totally destroyed this game for me. The hickups come every fucking 30 seconds. I demand an unpatch. Things were working great before. Just unupdate the shit. Anyone heard from 2K on this? Is anyone not effected by it?
It seems to have fied the hiccups for the people that had them, and introduced them for people that didn't. I was the latter, but clearing the cache worked for me. Immediately after you launch the game hold down LB+RB until the red @k log comes up.

[Surferflames]

I really appreciate the Spolier tags, as someone who hasn't finished the game yet. Thanks guys, I didn't get one single clue.

I did come in here to bitch about the "title update" which has totally destroyed this game for me. The hickups come every fucking 30 seconds. I demand an unpatch. Things were working great before. Just unupdate the shit. Anyone heard from 2K on this? Is anyone not effected by it? Is this a ploy to force people to hold on to the game, rather than trade it in, so as to force them to wait for a playable update? Maybe snide suspicions, but this game is now seriously fucked. I dare you to go back and replay it and not throw your controller at the TV.

Haven't heard about this but if you google "clear xbox cache" it will tell you how to clear ou the cache, which basically deletes all patches/updates. You will have to re-download them for any games, and as long as you don't let bioshock update when it tries again you will stay with the old version. It won't erase your saves, don't worry, but if the update did alter save files you may need it to play them.

[AshesofWake]

I really appreciate the Spolier tags, as someone who hasn't finished the game yet. Thanks guys, I didn't get one single clue.

I did come in here to bitch about the "title update" which has totally destroyed this game for me. The hickups come every fucking 30 seconds. I demand an unpatch. Things were working great before. Just unupdate the shit. Anyone heard from 2K on this? Is anyone not effected by it? Is this a ploy to force people to hold on to the game, rather than trade it in, so as to force them to wait for a playable update? Maybe snide suspicions, but this game is now seriously fucked. I dare you to go back and replay it and not throw your controller at the TV.


that has nothing to do with he patch, i had that problem before it and after it. Clear the cache on your HD and see what happens

[Damian]

Haven't heard about this but if you google "clear xbox cache" it will tell you how to clear ou the cache, which basically deletes all patches/updates. You will have to re-download them for any games, and as long as you don't let bioshock update when it tries again you will stay with the old version. It won't erase your saves, don't worry, but if the update did alter save files you may need it to play them.
That's a different cache clearing than I suggested. Clearing the Bioshock cache fixed the problem for me, it wasn't necessary to clear everything out.

[NWgamer666]

Ah thanks guys. I read about the cache clearing earlier and forgot all about it. I'll do it next time I play. Something like both bumper buttons at the title screen?

[A Happy Panda]

that has nothing to do with he patch, i had that problem before it and after it. Clear the cache on your HD and see what happens

Apparently it does. Tons of users have been experiencing the problem after the patch, it was posted on either Joystiq or Kotaku, I forget.

[slickkill77]

The patch did screw with some things

[AshesofWake]

Apparently it does. Tons of users have been experiencing the problem after the patch, it was posted on either Joystiq or Kotaku, I forget.


the hell...

[mtxbass1]

the hell...

http://kotaku.com/gaming/a-little-give-and-take/bioshock-update-gives-with-one-hand-taketh-with-other-297316.php

I literally just put this game in for the first time myself and am staying far away from that patch until they fix this.

[LinkinPrime]

http://kotaku.com/gaming/a-little-give-and-take/bioshock-update-gives-with-one-hand-taketh-with-other-297316.php

I literally just put this game in for the first time myself and am staying far away from that patch until they fix this.

I haven't really had a chance to play till now and the patch fucked mine up too. I'll try the "hold both bumpers" thing to clear the games cache and see what happens. Thanks for the link.

[RollingSkull]

Just a statement about the plot. Minor spoilers, but these are close to the end. Suchong had the greatest death evar.

[A Happy Panda]

Just a statement about the plot. Minor spoilers, but these are close to the end. Suchong had the greatest death evar.

How did he die?

[SpecTrE3353]

How did he die?

There is a really funny audio log you find in the kitchen of his apartment (I think thats where I found it). It has him talking and being interrupted a few times by a little sister trying to get his attention. He finally gets pissed and you hear him slap the little sister and then you hear a big daddy roar and start beating him to death. It was very amusing.

[lordwow]

There is a really funny audio log you find in the kitchen of his apartment (I think thats where I found it). It has him talking and being interrupted a few times by a little sister trying to get his attention. He finally gets pissed and you hear him slap the little sister and then you hear a big daddy roar and start beating him to death. It was very amusing.

Ya, that was pretty awesome.

[RollingSkull]

There is a really funny audio log you find in the kitchen of his apartment (I think thats where I found it). It has him talking and being interrupted a few times by a little sister trying to get his attention. He finally gets pissed and you hear him slap the little sister and then you hear a big daddy roar and start beating him to death. It was very amusing.
The best part was the irony. He was at the time griping that he could not get the Big Daddies and the Little Sisters to make the protective bond. You find him lying on a table with a Big Daddy drill sticking out of his torso, blood everywhere.

That's one thing that can be said for the *Shock narrative style: Bastards get their comeuppance. So do the good people, but the bastards get it too.

[hollowfreak]

The best part was the irony. He was at the time griping that he could not get the Big Daddies and the Little Sisters to make the protective bond. You find him lying on a table with a Big Daddy drill sticking out of his torso, blood everywhere.

That's one thing that can be said for the *Shock narrative style: Bastards get their comeuppance. So do the good people, but the bastards get it too.

Yes the best part was IRONY ... After Sander Cohen, the guy that makes you take pictures of the splicers you kill, rambled on about how I wasn't good enough to get what ever was in the locked case. I shot him, a small fire fight ensued and for the hell of it I took a picture of him ...

[Halo05]

Yes the best part was IRONY ... After Sander Cohen, the guy that makes you take pictures of the splicers you kill, rambled on about how I wasn't good enough to get what ever was in the locked case. I shot him, a small fire fight ensued and for the hell of it I took a picture of him ...

Oooooh, that's how you get that. I wonder if I've killed him yet. I finished the game but I don't remember if he got taken out. Does he just go back to his apartment?

[SpecTrE3353]

Oooooh, that's how you get that. I wonder if I've killed him yet. I finished the game but I don't remember if he got taken out. Does he just go back to his apartment?

He does talk to you and tell you not to disturb the dancing splicers via your radio when you enter his apartment later on, but I do not recall actually seeing him again in person after Fort Frolic.

That also reminds me... I loved that part after you took the 2nd or 3rd photo for him where he goes nuts and sends all the splicers after you to the tune of The Nutcracker. There was something very right about that tune playing as I watched like five splicers running around on fire and being thrown through the air by my cyclone traps.

[catapult37]

Oooooh, that's how you get that. I wonder if I've killed him yet. I finished the game but I don't remember if he got taken out. Does he just go back to his apartment?

Yes, and you want to have two save games for this because if you do not leave him alive, you cannot get into his apartment later, therefore missing a Power to the People machine.

[Callandor]

Yes, and you want to have two save games for this because if you do not leave him alive, you cannot get into his apartment later, therefore missing a Power to the People machine.

Actually, just let him live. You can kill him in his apartment later, take a pic of his corpse there, and still get the "Irony" achievement along with the one for his apartment.

And I killed the dancing splicers before I heard him, and he still opened the apartment to come kill me. Crossbow headshots are fun, lol.

[Mr. Anderson]

Hmm, you get an achievement for taking a picture of Cohen's body? I wonder if it'll still be there if I go back to his apartment... (I've already finished the game).

[mr ryles]

Hmm, you get an achievement for taking a picture of Cohen's body? I wonder if it'll still be there if I go back to his apartment... (I've already finished the game).

Nope you missed the opportunity.

[mr ryles]

and out of curiosity, what is in the box he has locked up? i tried killing him, but died and then he was gone.

[thrustbucket]

Not that I'm complaining but maybe something like "Heavy spoiler tag/plot discussion" should be added to the title, since that's what this thread has turned into now that most people have beat it.

[paz9x]

mine still hasnt arrived, should get it tomorrow.

[SpecTrE3353]

mine still hasnt arrived, should get it tomorrow.

Then please... don't read this thread :)

[Plac1d]

Yes, and you want to have two save games for this because if you do not leave him alive, you cannot get into his apartment later, therefore missing a Power to the People machine.

Ah, that's the one I missed. :-?
Thanks!

[thrustbucket]

Pretty funny "review" of bioshock:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/editorials/zeropunctuation/1394-Zero-Punctuation-BioShock

Hope this hasn't been posted already, I've purposely been skimming through this thread so as not to see spoilers.

[Damian]

Hope this hasn't been posted already
It has been, sorry.

[A Happy Panda]

He does talk to you and tell you not to disturb the dancing splicers via your radio when you enter his apartment later on, but I do not recall actually seeing him again in person after Fort Frolic.

That also reminds me... I loved that part after you took the 2nd or 3rd photo for him where he goes nuts and sends all the splicers after you to the tune of The Nutcracker. There was something very right about that tune playing as I watched like five splicers running around on fire and being thrown through the air by my cyclone traps.

Totally. The fight made me feel like I was in a movie, really cool.

[Moxio]

and out of curiosity, what is in the box he has locked up? i tried killing him, but died and then he was gone.

Nothing good... I think it was a lot of money and some kits?