UPDATE: -PS2- AND PS2 HDD ridiculously cheap at Target

[damack]

I apologize if this has been posted before (or if I am in the wrong forum), but I thought I'd share this experience.

I went to Target yesterday to pick up a raincheck in order to purchase Spider-Man 2. Transformers was out of stock, so the raincheck was for 41%. Rather than grabbing Spider-Man 2, I grabbed the PS2 HDD with Final Fantasy XI and took it to the cashier. She rang up the substitution with no problems and I bought the $100 device for $58 plus tax.

Technically, I don't think they would allow this if they realized that you buy the HDD and the game comes free, but the packaging looks like you're buying a game, so there was no problem with the sub. I suppose that makes it YMMV, but certainly worth a try, if you're looking for the HDD.

UPDATE:
I mentioned this whole experience to a buddy of mine and he figured he'd give it a shot at the PS2 Online Combo pack (PS2, plus Network Adapter plus a game). He just called me to let me know that he took it to the register with the raincheck, the cashier asked her manager, and her manager said, "Oh yes! This can definitely be done because the game and the console are both in the same department." So he walked out of there with a brand new PS2 Online Combo pack for $88.

[Jaket]

im there... once i get my rainchecks (thanks ikill2game!) i will check that out myself!

[racerman8]

That is almost the price at Fry's a few weeks ago at $59.99. That is good becuase most people don't have a Fry's near them.

[damack]

Yeah, I don't have a Fry's nearby at all. I also don't have a lot of use for FFXI, but having just picked up ESPN NFL 2k5, I couldn't pass that deal up. The HDD will get great use between 2k5 and NBA Ballers.

[Sk]

I apologize if this has been posted before (or if I am in the wrong forum), but I thought I'd share this experience.

I went to Target yesterday to pick up a raincheck in order to purchase Spider-Man 2. Transformers was out of stock, so the raincheck was for 41%. Rather than grabbing Spider-Man 2, I grabbed the PS2 HDD with Final Fantasy XI and took it to the cashier. She rang up the substitution with no problems and I bought the $100 device for $58 plus tax.

Technically, I don't think they would allow this if they realized that you buy the HDD and the game comes free, but the packaging looks like you're buying a game, so there was no problem with the sub. I suppose that makes it YMMV, but certainly worth a try, if you're looking for the HDD.
I've done that with game sharks before at target. PS1s were 19 something and the ps2 ones were like 30 something.

[epobirs]

Yeah, I don't have a Fry's nearby at all. I also don't have a lot of use for FFXI, but having just picked up ESPN NFL 2k5, I couldn't pass that deal up. The HDD will get great use between 2k5 and NBA Ballers.

At that price it's worthwhile just for the memory card offloading capacity.

[ex0]

I saw this at Fry's for 59 a few weeks back and still couldn't convince myself to buy it.

[hoshi]

Yeah, I don't have a Fry's nearby at all. I also don't have a lot of use for FFXI, but having just picked up ESPN NFL 2k5, I couldn't pass that deal up. The HDD will get great use between 2k5 and NBA Ballers.

At that price it's worthwhile just for the memory card offloading capacity.

Hey, wait... Explain this to me. The PS2 HDD can actually be used to store memcard saves (even if games can't save to the HDD directly)?

-Hoshi

[red flare graf]

Yeah, I don't have a Fry's nearby at all. I also don't have a lot of use for FFXI, but having just picked up ESPN NFL 2k5, I couldn't pass that deal up. The HDD will get great use between 2k5 and NBA Ballers.

At that price it's worthwhile just for the memory card offloading capacity.

Hey, wait... Explain this to me. The PS2 HDD can actually be used to store memcard saves (even if games can't save to the HDD directly)?

-Hoshi

Yes. You copy them from your memory card to the hard drive just like you would copy from memory card to memory card.

[hoshi]

Oh bloody hell.. I have to try this raincheck crap right now.

-Hoshi

[gokou36]

How do you get rainchecks from them? Is it hard or easy?

[Defensor]

Worth it alone to use with the HDLoader.

[pimp tyranny]

yeah, i need to try this raincheck deal out too. do you just find an OOS discounted game or something?

[dracula]

the price on the ffxi is dropping so fast, soon i bet some store will mark it to clearance to 40 to 45ish. That would be enough to get me to get one. Square really overpriced the hard drive(it is NOT a $50 item, it is more like a $20 item) and so now stores like frys are marking it down.

I bet target will clearance this item after christmas to under $30. Before you say "bullshit that will never happen!" remember target was selling the psone with lcd screen for $27 earlier this year.

[gokou36]

Fry's isn't marking it down, they just had that one sale. I remember reading somewhere that says you're paying for the hard drive itself, and the game is basically free.

I gotta agree with you tho, that damn hard drive doesn't cost that much to make.

[Dustin Echoes]

Actually, I think they are slowly marking it down. It is now regularly at 89.99 at Fry's, when it used to be 99.99. Then there was that one sale probably used to test the waters and see if that damn product would move or not at a lower price. I wouldn't be suprised if that thing dropped some more.

[fireball343]

Best Buy had it at 89.99 right after release.

do you really need 40 gigs......... can you possibly use that much

the 8-10 gig xbox hdd are more than enough, unless you want to upload more than 70hrs of music and still have a ton of game saves

but it is a ripoff. it is sold as 40 gig hard drive w/ free FFXI. not worth it. maybe an 120 gig but not 40. still a bunch of extra useless space.

20gig hard drive, FXI. 50-70, that being the game costing that much with a hard drive. then would have price drops, possibly.

it should have been more like a namco guncon game or a DDR game with pad

[damack]

How do you get rainchecks from them? Is it hard or easy?

It's simple. Check out their weekly ad online, find the games with the biggest discount, then give them a call and ask if they have them in stock. If they don't, they'll be happy to give you a raincheck.

[defender]

Why do you really need a 120gb drive vs a 40 gb?

I have yet to buy anything more than a 20 and I never fill it up...a 40 sounds like a ton of storage to me.

[daphatty]

Why do you really need a 120gb drive vs a 40 gb?

I have yet to buy anything more than a 20 and I never fill it up...a 40 sounds like a ton of storage to me.

Then you just aint doin it right. :lol:

[Duo_Maxwell]

I never liked the fact that you have to pay for both FF XI and the HDD. I'll probably never play FF XI so basically I'm paying $100 for a HDD that has about a third of the capacity of a drive I could get for the same price. Not to mention, it's a smaller cache size and slower on the RPMs. If Sony marketed the HDD alone for $40 or $50 dollars I'd bet they'd get a lot more takers.

[totsmann]

wow cool! gonna check it out

[totsmann]

Goin off topic. But, sorry bout the big sig. Fixed it now.

[epobirs]

Why do you really need a 120gb drive vs a 40 gb?

I have yet to buy anything more than a 20 and I never fill it up...a 40 sounds like a ton of storage to me.

Once you start dealing with video files there is never enough storage. Even using the most advanced codecs you very quickly get into multiple gigabytes for just a few hours of material at NTSC resolution. Get into HD resolutions and you're very quickly back to well over a gig for an hour's material.

Since the highest capacity usage by games is for FMV stuff those can fill a drive via HDLoader quite quickly.

[epobirs]

I never liked the fact that you have to pay for both FF XI and the HDD. I'll probably never play FF XI so basically I'm paying $100 for a HDD that has about a third of the capacity of a drive I could get for the same price. Not to mention, it's a smaller cache size and slower on the RPMs. If Sony marketed the HDD alone for $40 or $50 dollars I'd bet they'd get a lot more takers.

For purposes of effective marketing it's always best to bundle a hardware upgrade with software that makes good use of it. Imagine if they'd offered the EyeToy with no bundled games and left it entirely up to the often clueless shopper buying for someone else to understand the item was somewhat useless without an appropriate game. The HDD has value as a way of offloading memory card saves but this isn't a primary driver for its existence. There will likely be other HDD bundle choices as more major titles appear, especially Sony published items like GT4.

The cache and RPM rate of the drive is not a major handicap for this application. The PS2 only jas 32 MB of RAM to work with. Filling this from a low-end drive is so quick as to make anyimprovement from a more feature-rich drive defy measurement. Additionally, this isn't a multitasking environment and that leaves little value for a large dirve cache.

[epobirs]

Worth it alone to use with the HDLoader.

If your sole application is HDLoader you'll get much more value from a third party drive. A 160 GB Maxtor that I can attest works great with HDLoader (althoughonly 127 GB is available) can be had for only $70 at FRy's right now. If HDLoader knew how to offload memory card files it would be complete.

[zephyr.prime]

FYI: I find that Hitachi drives also fit the PS2 network adapter but Western Digital drives do not.

[Pope On A Rope]

Wait, I don't understand. Don't you have to pay for the raincheck? Or wouldn't you have to pay the difference anyways when you check out? In other words, how are you escaping paying full price?

[ddrMoPanda]

Wait so what is the actual raincheck? I understand you find a game that is advertised on sale and if it's out of stock then you can get a rain check and get a discount, but what is it exactly like do they give you a special form or anything? I'd like to try this out but I don't quite understand this.

[KingNES]

The rain check allows you to substitute another game "like item for like item" is what it exactly says. So if you have a rain check say for the GTA :Vice City for 15.88 (reg 29.99) you would get the that same discount for the HDD bundle instead, thus getting the HDD bundle ultra cheap.

[Jaket]

Goin off topic. But, sorry bout the big sig. Fixed it now.


that sig is still huge/colorful/annoying/giveing me a headache

[damack]

The rain check allows you to substitute another game "like item for like item" is what it exactly says. So if you have a rain check say for the GTA :Vice City for 15.88 (reg 29.99) you would get the that same discount for the HDD bundle instead, thus getting the HDD bundle ultra cheap.

Or, apparently, entire systems. I may go back and try it with the GameCube this week, since Spider-Man 2 is only $9.99 if you get the system.

[BigHow]

Doh - I wish I had realized that this was possible before I used my raincheck this past weekend.

[Chris Dillon]

what stores will take a game or system without a reciept though. i may use this to pay for my summer games.

[dracula]

UPDATE:
I mentioned this whole experience to a buddy of mine and he figured he'd give it a shot at the PS2 Online Combo pack (PS2, plus Network Adapter plus a game). He just called me to let me know that he took it to the register with the raincheck, the cashier asked her manager, and her manager said, "Oh yes! This can definitely be done because the game and the console are both in the same department." So he walked out of there with a brand new PS2 Online Combo pack for $88.

Holy crap, ps2 online pack for $88? Just so I am clear, your buddy got a ps2 system, broadband adapter plus atv offroad furyor corvette 2 all for only $88? Which rain check did he use? he used the rain check for the ffxi plus hard drive? that is an insane price for a ps2 system online bundle

[KurtCobain]

Raincheck? :?

[bhfgamer]

You can use ANY raincheck for ANY videogame. For example, you get a raincheck for Transformers @ $29.88 when it retails for $50. You can use the 40% off on transformers or ANYTHING in the videogame dept.

[KurtCobain]

:shock:

[xdaTwiZtidWunX]

Say i used a regular hdd..would games liek Re outbreak n fl2k5 have like the same results with a sony hdd.(ie full vdieos in halftime,etc)

[damack]

Holy crap, ps2 online pack for $88? Just so I am clear, your buddy got a ps2 system, broadband adapter plus atv offroad furyor corvette 2 all for only $88? Which rain check did he use? he used the rain check for the ffxi plus hard drive? that is an insane price for a ps2 system online bundle

Yes, he got all of that by using a raincheck that he got for Transformers for 41% off. We just did it this evening, he bought a PS2 for his friend and I got a GameCube for about $56 (then added on the Spider-Man 2 for $9.99 special that they're running). We were denied at the Electronics cashier, but had no problem with the normal store cashiers. Psi-Ops (regularly $49.99, now $28.88) was out of stock so we used the 43% rainchecks from that.

[gsr]

Holy crap, ps2 online pack for $88? Just so I am clear, your buddy got a ps2 system, broadband adapter plus atv offroad furyor corvette 2 all for only $88? Which rain check did he use? he used the rain check for the ffxi plus hard drive? that is an insane price for a ps2 system online bundle

Yes, he got all of that by using a raincheck that he got for Transformers for 41% off. We just did it this evening, he bought a PS2 for his friend and I got a GameCube for about $56 (then added on the Spider-Man 2 for $9.99 special that they're running). We were denied at the Electronics cashier, but had no problem with the normal store cashiers. Psi-Ops (regularly $49.99, now $28.88) was out of stock so we used the 43% rainchecks from that.

this is an unbelievably extreme YMMV....there is no way in hell any target that has employees that can READ will ever do this deal...take a 60 dollar hit on a console? don't think so

jc, if you were denied at the electronics counter what did you say in order to check out up front? did you tell the electronics people that you were going to try your luck up front?..lol..

[Duo_Maxwell]

My target won't let you check out up front with any products from inside the glass case. If you have an exchange or something they have to walk it up there.

[Vnt]

Holy crap, ps2 online pack for $88? Just so I am clear, your buddy got a ps2 system, broadband adapter plus atv offroad furyor corvette 2 all for only $88? Which rain check did he use? he used the rain check for the ffxi plus hard drive? that is an insane price for a ps2 system online bundle

Yes, he got all of that by using a raincheck that he got for Transformers for 41% off. We just did it this evening, he bought a PS2 for his friend and I got a GameCube for about $56 (then added on the Spider-Man 2 for $9.99 special that they're running). We were denied at the Electronics cashier, but had no problem with the normal store cashiers. Psi-Ops (regularly $49.99, now $28.88) was out of stock so we used the 43% rainchecks from that.

this is shady, seriously, actions like these are considered scams

[kristianator]

yeah. those target employees were careless. the clause says item for item... and a game for a system is not item for item. i'm not sure that this thread really reflects an actual "deal", but rather a way to exploit ignorant or careless employees.

i went back and re-read some of my initial training paperwork, and really, the substitute clause is supposed to be used on items that are of similar price (49.99 game subbed for a 49.99 game), but because some items don't necessarily have equally priced "substitutes" (like for example the most expensive high-end flat screen tv), they don't specifically say same priced item for same priced item.

i heard from one of the managers that they were going to start doing in electronics what they've been doing in the dept. where they have toilet paper. a lot of times, toilet paper on sale sells out, and they pick another brand of toilet paper and designate that as the substitute and they offer no raincheck on the original one. i hope this doesn't happen, but i think with a lot of people making use of the rainchecks on games, it might become reality.

[Vnt]

i heard from one of the managers that they were going to start doing in electronics what they've been doing in the dept. where they have toilet paper. a lot of times, toilet paper on sale sells out, and they pick another brand of toilet paper and designate that as the substitute and they offer no raincheck on the original one. i hope this doesn't happen, but i think with a lot of people making use of the rainchecks on games, it might become reality.

actually, they started that over here. there was a sale for 2 mem cards for $35 or something and it was sold out and instead of a raincheck, they substituted it with a single mem card for $20

i'm guessing rainchecks will soon disappear

[cheapass Gundam]

Just want to thank the original poster - I got a raincheck for Transformers and ended up getting a 40%+ discount on Siren. It was sort of a pain (they wouldn't do substitution on the same day the raincheck was issued and demanded I wait a few days to see if they can restock the game, and I was unable to use it in other Target stores) but in the end I got what I wanted. :D

[damack]

jc, if you were denied at the electronics counter what did you say in order to check out up front? did you tell the electronics people that you were going to try your luck up front?..lol..

No, I walked away without the stuff, picked up a different Cube and walked to the front. Later went back to get Spider-Man 2.

[n00bie]

No way this would fly at my Target.

[chris916]

Just want to thank the original poster - I got a raincheck for Transformers and ended up getting a 40%+ discount on Siren. It was sort of a pain (they wouldn't do substitution on the same day the raincheck was issued and demanded I wait a few days to see if they can restock the game, and I was unable to use it in other Target stores) but in the end I got what I wanted. :D

you know thats funny because they wouldnt letm e use a raincheck that was ONE DAY old, they said the substitution must be made at the time of the raincheck...ok, whatever. so i just had the dumb broad print me a raincheck again and then asked for a substitution, then she said she needed to get a manager. i was just trying to use this for a game, not a system. Damn target employees just make up policies on a whim. Every time it's a different story, kind of like pricematching at CC or using a GGC at best buy. i cant believe the amount of shit i get from these minimum wage employees almost everytime i try to use a coupon/pricematch of some sort. maybe it's just california.

[KingNES]

The rain checks advise that you have until a certain date for the raincheck to expire, screw that not doing it 1 day later, its over a month after the date of issue to use those bad boys

[cheapass Gundam]

you know thats funny because they wouldnt letm e use a raincheck that was ONE DAY old, they said the substitution must be made at the time of the raincheck...ok, whatever. so i just had the dumb broad print me a raincheck again and then asked for a substitution, then she said she needed to get a manager. i was just trying to use this for a game, not a system. Damn target employees just make up policies on a whim. Every time it's a different story, kind of like pricematching at CC or using a GGC at best buy. i cant believe the amount of shit i get from these minimum wage employees almost everytime i try to use a coupon/pricematch of some sort. maybe it's just california.

Wow, that's strange. I guess with Target rainchecks it's the proverbial YMMV. GGC at BB is a total pain, I've given up on that and relying on cheap deals from other stores instead. You save more anyways.

[fieldkillah]

I got denied trying to substitute for FFXI. First they said it was the price, but i pointed out that no where on the rain check or in the store in public view does it say that item has to be of equal or lesser value. Then they said that it was with the hardware so it was considered hardware, I then pointed out that the tag underneath the game says PS2 SFT meaning its category is software. Then they said that because they had a copy of transformers in I couldn't get the substitute, and again nowhere did it say that substitutions are not allowed when product is back in stock. I just gave up for the night because they were close to closing. Tomorrow I go back with the plan of calling corporate if these register biscuits keep deciding to make their own policies and fucking with me. I am so fucking frustrated right now that I don't even care about the game, I'm just doing this as a personal crusade.

[Duo_Maxwell]

Wait, you're mad cuz you were trying to cheat their policies and they called you on it? Yeah corporate is gonna help you a bunch I'm sure.

[Vnt]

Wait, you're mad cuz you were trying to cheat their policies and they called you on it? Yeah corporate is gonna help you a bunch I'm sure.

I agree. I honestly wonder why this thread is still open if people are expecting to try to get away with this when they most likely can't and then come here and bitch about it

IMO I hardly find this thread useful for finding a cheap FFXI HD, rather it just tests the limits of greed.

[fieldkillah]

How is that cheating their policy? Im substituting an item for an item in the same category. In fact, here is word for word the policy on the bottom of the rain check.
CHOOSE A SUBSTITUTE
Chose a substitute and recieve the same percentage off (listed above) on a regular-priced item within the same product category (i.e. TV for TV, doll for doll, shirt for shirt).

They should not offer the policy if they are not going to honor it, they gave me no reason as to why they couldn't give me the substitute, just a bunch of BS. If they had given me a good reason I wouldn't be mad and I would have said Ok I understand.
I really dont even know why I am explaining myself to the holier than thou types, just because you are the "perfect beings" doesnt mean everything you say is divine word. Flame me if you want, but I honestly just dont care what you have to say because what you say has 0 impact on my life.

[KingNES]

If Target doesn't want this exploited they need to change their store classification for what FF XI w/ the HDD is, instead of SFT(software) it should be ACC (accesory) or some other type, then they can stop this, but as far as the ran check reads, it is in the realm of the possible to get the FF XI. I am not supporting it however, cause if this happens often they will change their policies for sure, and we all will be out, but legally he is correct for the moment.

[guardian_owl]

If you wonder why you get much shit from Target employees you must realize, if they end up screwing up on policy 2 or 3 times, they get canned.

My sister used to work for Target and the incident she got canned for was when someone brought in clothes to return, they were tagged with the a brand sold at Target so she allowed the return (I believe they had a receipt as well). She comes in on Monday to work and finds out she's fired, turns out some shithead bought Target brand clothes, took off tags, re-attached them (professionally, so we suspect it was someone in retail with access to equipment) to a different brand not sold at Target, and then returned them back to Target.

Granted, trying to exploit a vague raincheck policy isn't anywhere on the level of blatant fraud, but if a retail employee blocks your attempt at a YMMV transaction like this, realize they are most likely just covering their own ass.

[Duo_Maxwell]

How is that cheating their policy? Im substituting an item for an item in the same category. In fact, here is word for word the policy on the bottom of the rain check.
CHOOSE A SUBSTITUTE
Chose a substitute and recieve the same percentage off (listed above) on a regular-priced item within the same product category (i.e. TV for TV, doll for doll, shirt for shirt).

They should not offer the policy if they are not going to honor it, they gave me no reason as to why they couldn't give me the substitute, just a bunch of BS. If they had given me a good reason I wouldn't be mad and I would have said Ok I understand.
I really dont even know why I am explaining myself to the holier than thou types, just because you are the "perfect beings" doesnt mean everything you say is divine word. Flame me if you want, but I honestly just dont care what you have to say because what you say has 0 impact on my life.

Why would they let you substitute anything when they have the game you got a raincheck for in the first place. That's the ACTUAL purpose of the raincheck, not to try and push the limits of greed as someone else put it. Also, I think they file it under SFT cuz FF XI's part of the package and is technically software, I guess it's both SFT and ACC, so maybe they should classify it as both.

[KingNES]

But if Target does not re classify the HDD bundle then they leave the door wide open for use of the rain check, they also leave the door ever more so open with the substitution clause. Either way as it stands to their own policies, by the written statements it is legal, even though people frown upon it. Do they have to honor it? No they do not. Push it to Corp and I doubt you'll get far, But if you find someone who will do it for you, you are not doing anything wrong according to Targets own wordings. They just need to evaluate their policies and adjust them accordingly.

[chris916]

I hate my target, i thought i'd go in and try this just for the hell of it. of course he said no, so i tried to buy siren with it and hes all that wont work either, the game has to be "29.77"--the same price red dead revolver was on sale for...then i was like man think about what you just said. If i was trying to buy a game that cost 29.77 on sale with a raincheck, why would i need a damn raincheck? while his peanut-brain was hard at work trying to come up with an answer he said, well siren's not 49.99 or 29.77, so it won't work. Fuckin shit. i said where does it say any of that and he told me the policy was "more complicated" than what was actually on the receipt. I don't even know how this guy ties his own shoes in the morning before he comes to work, maybe i should have checked for velcro.

[KingNES]

It isnt, according to the rain check the item doesnt have to be a specific price, in your case you should have asked for it in writing. They cant provide that cause it doesnt exist. Technically a cheaper game would also work, so long as it is a regular price for said game. You need to ask them to provide it in writing on a Target letterhead , if they cant do that they need to honour it. Just dont make it a cheaper game then what the original sale price for the rain check game was. Ie: GTA VC is 15.99 or something on sale, dont make your substitute game cheaper than that, it is a cheap move and will easily make something raise a red flag. Go same price or higher and most times youll encounter no problems, worse case call corp and threaten a call to the BBB, also most states have statutes on the books as well in regards to this. To those who are trying to get 48 percent or such on games cheaper than the sale prices like say 9.99 titles, you deserve to get refused. It's cheap and quite low classed in itself. Just grab what ya need same price or higher and maybe more people will be able to get by on this, instead of people getting systems and accesories. Also remember this, by getting a system or some insanely priced item you just may have cause that employee their job since the money lost on that transaction will come back to them in a bad way. If no one cares about someones job, they are sad to begin with. Just keep that in mind everyone. Put yourself in their shoes. I am not playing holier than though, I have used the rainchecks as well as it was written, games for games. Just some thoughts for everyone.

[chris916]

it's funny how there's only this problem with video games. i guess the game nzai's behind the counter feel like they're some kind of god because they "hold the key" to the great glass casing around the video games. I use a raincheck for DVDs and CDs all the time (my target is ALWAYS out of their advertised DVDs and CDs).

[KingNES]

Game Nazi's or not, they need to honor what is says, if they can't do their job, find a manager to do it for them, make a polite enough stink and you'll get the match. I haven't had one go bad yet.

[kristianator]

target employees shouldn't care. they can't get fired because it's a policy, and all they'd be doing is following policy. none of my co-workers knew about the policy until i pointed it out to all of them one day... and they were like "OH MY GOD, THAT'S WRONG" but i asked them "why? it's on paper for a reason. we may or may not know WHY they put it on paper, but it's still there."

selling some of these things at sale prices isn't exactly losing money. in fact, i'd be willing to bet any target location loses more on internal and external theft than from people coming in and BUYING these games with substitutions. one stolen camera from an employee is worse than people coming in one weekend into the store with intentions of buying something.

they're scared because every changed price gets recorded and printed out on a review sheet for security and the manager to review each and every night. anything out of the ordinary gets investigated briefly, and if needed, more thoroughly later. everyone's right when they say target employees just wanna cover their ass, but the solution is to ask for a manager. make sure you don't come across as hostile, and they should be helping you out in no time.

[KingNES]

They can however be sacked for letting systems go @ 48 percent of the such off with rain checks and the shrink is high from that. I speak from personal experience with that,I did LP for Target for a year and 3 years for Sears as well. I have seen Target employees let go for a hell of a lot less then that as well. Thats what I was speaking of particularly when I mentioned their jobs on the line. Some users I am sure have tried to get systems with the game rainchecks and as it stands one user already did so.