Navy ad Bad. [Mobile/Archive]

Justme8800

11-10-2007, 12:06 AM

It's odd, I don't see any other topics about this. Maybe everyone else who feels this way has ditched CAG. Maybe the mods are deleting critical topics... that wouldn't be very classy, so probably not. Anyways, does anyone else see my point of view here?

After listening to last week's show, I wrote this after emerging from the shock of my treasured CAGcast going corporate. I was hoping to some kind of response, but I guess it wasn't inflammatory enough for that kind of trouble. I didn't spend all that time writing this so it could be deleted with one click... feedback?

Wombat,

Hey, I'm just one of your many listeners, so I probably don't mean a lot to you, but I need a favor. Would you please let me know if/when the CAGcast stops with the advertisement segments from the US Navy? I'm asking you because I don't think Cheapy would have enough class to read this far into this message.

That's really all I need, but if you want to keep reading, I'll explain why.

When a first found this show on iTunes a year or so ago, I was thrilled! It was everything all the other garbage commercial gaming podcasts weren't; funny, low-key, identifiable, and interesting. The CAGcast had an indescribable personality to it that was integral to its distinctive brilliance. Over time, I started taking it for granted... every week, I set aside a couple hours to listen.

When Cheapy stopped taking his lessons, he started to sound a little less in touch, less of a friendly Man in Japan, and more of a blank talking head from cyberspace. (At least, him getting out less is the best reason I can come up with, who knows really.) He didn't seem to pull us into his world as much, but he still retained his professional hosting abilities well enough to be worth listening to. After all, you were still there with your brilliant humor and adept button-pushing skills.

I was hoping that Cheapy having a kid would rekindle his fascinating social appeal, and maybe it will, who knows. Not me, though. When I first turned on episode #95, I was greeted with, instead of a familiar retro tune, Cheapy's voice telling me about the Navy. "Damn," I thought, "is this some kind of joke?"

No joke, as it became apparent. After listening with rapt attention to the birthing story (which is exactly the sort of thing that makes this podcast stand head and shoulders above others), the topic of advertising came up. "Well, maybe it's unavoidable. Maybe they need to do this to keep the show on the air or something." As I listened to the reasoning, my hand crept closer to the pause button. It was just too painful to listen to. I held out until the actual ad came on, and then shut it off. I couldn't believe it. I gave it one more shot the next day, and finished the show.

Now here's the issue. Advertisements are everywhere in our media and we're quite desensitized to them, and skipping 30 seconds, while annoying, isn't a deal breaker. The advertisement/sponsored contests you've done are great, and fun for everyone. Even advertisements for games would be cool, at least they would be relevant (though not any better than other podcasts). No, the first problem here is the choice of advertisers.

Regardless on one's position on US foreign policy, it's hard to argue that military recruiters are among the worst sharks out there. They prey on kids who don't know any better, convincing them that it's worth it to go through some of the most horrifying experiences this world has to offer, just to meet quotas. (This gets even worse when you consider concerned wars have absolutely nothing to do with defending one's country, but that's a whole different can of worms.) Helping these sharks by advertising them on your show is an incredible insult to your audience. Somewhere along the lines someone thinks that a significant portion of your listeners are the sort of people who could be convinced to go through with this by a radio ad.

Of course, all that doesn't seem like much compared to the second problem here; Cheapy's motivation for going through with this. He's under the impression that by turning the CAGcast into some lowbrow trashy ad-riddled slut of a show like all the others, insiders will think highly of him? He's lost sight of what made his show great in the first place! He doesn't even need the money? If that's no object, then the least he could have done is found an advertiser worthy of his show. Please try to talk some sense into him, please. I'll be over listing to the Shipwrecks until this blows over... or at least until they sell out too.

Well, I think that's the most I can do to get my point across. Don't take this the wrong way, I still think you guys are great, but I can't find it in my heart to support a show sponsored by the military. If I haven't pissed you off beyond reconciliation yet, and you're still considering for your UGO intern, I'd love to help you out (I do have experience writing, including a full-length FAQ for GameFAQs). Good luck with whatever path you take.

Sincerely,
~~~~~~~~, aka "Justme8800"

rodeojones903

11-10-2007, 12:11 AM

Who cares. I'm glad Cheapy is getting some advertising dollars. Being a father is expensive. :D

Bretts31344

11-10-2007, 12:24 AM

Who cares. I'm glad Cheapy is getting some advertising dollars. Being a father is expensive. :D

Agreed. Honestly though, the ads are kind of weird for a Video Game podcast. I really don't care. There are ads everywhere. People watch TV where 1/3 of air time is commercials (Football games are ridiculous). At least these are only 30 second ads.

Richlough

11-10-2007, 12:27 AM

Uhhh , maybe because there's a CAGcast thread for every show .

http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=158720

Bitch and complain there please .

Justme8800

11-10-2007, 12:29 AM

Who cares. I'm glad Cheapy is getting some advertising dollars. Being a father is expensive. :D
Yeah, except maybe you missed the part where he's not even going to use the money. He just wants to look like a worthless commercial show, the kind that people like me don't watch because the ads are so rude and pointless... I think I said this already in the letter, didn't you read it?

Uhhh , maybe because there's a CAGcast thread for every show .

This isn't about that particular show, it's about the ads in general. I couldn't find a "constructive critism about the CAGcast" forum, so this is the most on-topic place to put it, no?

PawnTakesKing

11-10-2007, 12:38 AM

Suck it up. Either listen and deal with it, or don't.

Personally, I'm glad Wombat is finally making some money off the CAGcast, since it was his idea anyway.

pimpinc333

11-10-2007, 12:47 AM

Wait. I don't get it. What exactely is going on? I stopped listening to the CAGcast at like #58 so excuse my ignorance.

EDIT: Ok I get it now :D

thorbahn3

11-10-2007, 12:52 AM

Yeah this sucks. Now instead of listening an entertaining hour and a half show for free, I have to help the people who've been entertaining me for free for years by listening to harmless Navy ads for 60 seconds (the third is at the very end). Boo! Next thing we'll see are banner ads on CAG advertising TV shows and movies like the Sci-Fi channel's new mini series based off the wizard of OZ starring Allen Cumming.

Justme8800

11-10-2007, 12:54 AM

Suck it up. Either listen and deal with it, or don't.
Ugh, I know that. This isn't about me, or at least I hope I'm not the only one who isn't listening until the navy ads stop. The point here is that the ads come with a cost, and that is that the CAGcast will lose some listeners on principle by running them. Unfortunately, this crowd would largely not be represented here, because they're all gone.

So long as Wombat and Cheapy are aware of this cost, it's their prerogative to keep doing it. I just want them to know why I've chosen to stop listening. Is that not fair?

Yeah this sucks. Now instead of listening an entertaining hour and a half show for free, I have to help the people who've been entertaining me for free for years by listening to harmless Navy ads for 60 seconds (the third is at the very end). Boo!

Did you even read the OT?

horrido

11-10-2007, 01:25 AM

Oh the drama...

Captain Freeze

11-10-2007, 01:36 AM

I wish someone would invent somwthing that could speed up time so i could skip these annoyint ads.....

they should call it like 'fast forward' or 'Time Speeder'.

YEAH! i wish i could Time Speed past these ads....

Slayzz

11-10-2007, 01:48 AM

Regardless on one's position on US foreign policy, it's hard to argue that military recruiters are among the worst sharks out there. They prey on kids who don't know any better, convincing them that it's worth it to go through some of the most horrifying experiences this world has to offer, just to meet quotas. (This gets even worse when you consider concerned wars have absolutely nothing to do with defending one's country, but that's a whole different can of worms.) Helping these sharks by advertising them on your show is an incredible insult to your audience. Somewhere along the lines someone thinks that a significant portion of your listeners are the sort of people who could be convinced to go through with this by a radio ad.

wait.....so you don't have a problem with ads but just NAVY ad? wtf....

KingBroly

11-10-2007, 03:02 AM

The ads aren't that bad. I just wish there was a better flow into them. It honestly sounds like Cheapy goes back and adds the ads after doing the show initially.

thorbahn3

11-10-2007, 03:20 AM

Ugh, I know that. This isn't about me, or at least I hope I'm not the only one who isn't listening until the navy ads stop. The point here is that the ads come with a cost, and that is that the CAGcast will lose some listeners on principle by running them. Unfortunately, this crowd would largely not be represented here, because they're all gone.

So long as Wombat and Cheapy are aware of this cost, it's their prerogative to keep doing it. I just want them to know why I've chosen to stop listening. Is that not fair?

Did you even read the OT?

Hell no. You wrote too much for a forum post.

SteveMcQ

11-10-2007, 03:38 AM

Justme8800,

I can't speak for Wombat or Cheapy, but I'm quite certain they don't care. The percentage of listeners who have such a big problem with ads that they stop listening is so miniscule that there's really no reason for them to cater to that group. And when the end goal is to broaden and diversify the CAGcast's reach and broadcast (past podcasting, which is what I think they intend with this branding) the new listenership they gain will far outweight what so few of you will skip out on.

It's like a few people sticking to some ridiculous notion that "boycotting" EA Sports games would have any effect. Supporters/buyers of their product are always going to outweigh the detractors.

And try to cut back on the drama. No reason to write a dissertation when you could have just said, "I will no longer be listening to CAGcast as I feel you guys are selling out by playing the NAVY ads." I mean, seriously...it was "too painful to listen to" having the ads? Here you are trying to write a seriously toned explanation of your actions, but you make it sound like you're listening to the dying last yelps of your beloved family dog. Woe is me. It's a podcast. We all enjoy it, but try to get some perspective on the whole matter.

And what does "class" have to do with reading your post, in regards to Cheapy? Now to me, what would seem classless is taking cheap shots at someone's character with arguments that have absolutely no basis. He chooses not to read your post (since it pretty much echoes what's already been said, might I add), therefore one must have no class. Yes, makes plenty of sense to me.

BTW, Private Messaging is your friend. Would've saved us the trouble of going through all this again if your end goal really was just to ask Wombat to inform you when the ad campaign would end ('cause you're special) along with applying for the internship. The rest of your post could've been put far more succinctly and also placed in the aforementioned CAGcast show thread.

Thanks for listening. You won't be missed.

Sincerely,

All CAGcast listeners

Justme8800

11-10-2007, 05:38 AM

Thank you for your feedback, everyone. While it's not particularly comforting that I am alone in feeling this way, it's nice that my rant did not fall on deaf ears.

Yes, it's overly dramatic. For that I apologize, it's just to make the point. I really enjoy the podcast, I tried to make that clear, and I am very genuinely sad that my principles won't allow me to continue listening to it. It sucks to be someone who stands up for what they believe in. I doubt, especially at this point, that it will make any difference, which makes it all the more sad.

Regarding Cheapy's "class" when it comes to mail, I thought that would have been obvious. It may not have been the best choice of vocabulary, but I'm referring to his tendancy to skip over and ignore what doesn't look interesting to him (displayed in just about every episode when it comes to community contributions). It has come across especially blatently when he's done it in the live shows, hanging up on a caller he just accepted without a second thought. I meant no malice in saying that, and it's no doubt for the better when it comes to the show, but I could very easily imagine him glossing over this whole topic before finishing the title. Couldn't you?

As for PMing, I did send that to Wombat like a week ago, didn't I mention that? The reason I posted it here was because I felt like I had mailed it into a brick wall, and I didn't want all that drama to go to waste. If you couldn't tell, I was rather upset when I wrote that.

And thank you, Steve, for your sincere and comprehensive response, even if it was less than cordial. I mean no insult to anyone concerning this topic, I just need to either learn that I'm not the only sane CAG, or why I'm not sane. I think what I have to say is reasonable, and I thank those who listen.

~Justme8800

mega_n00bzer

11-10-2007, 06:46 AM

are you paying for the show? no.
can you fast forward? yes.
quit being a whiny bastard

mega_n00bzer

11-10-2007, 07:02 AM

The ads aren't that bad. I just wish there was a better flow into them. It honestly sounds like Cheapy goes back and adds the ads after doing the show initially.

he does

CheapyD

11-10-2007, 08:14 AM

Regarding Cheapy's "class" when it comes to mail, I thought that would have been obvious. It may not have been the best choice of vocabulary, but I'm referring to his tendancy to skip over and ignore what doesn't look interesting to him (displayed in just about every episode when it comes to community contributions). It has come across especially blatently when he's done it in the live shows, hanging up on a caller he just accepted without a second thought. I meant no malice in saying that, and it's no doubt for the better when it comes to the show, but I could very easily imagine him glossing over this whole topic
Skipping over what doesn't look interesting to me is just another way to describe producing a show. If it's not interesting to me, I guessing it's not interesting to our audience either. I don't see what this has to do with my class, character, morals, etc...

Regardless of your thoughts of the military or our government's current administration, there is no denying that the US Navy is an A-list advertiser. In my opinion, turning down such an advertiser is not a wise business decision for us and I feel the potential long-term positves outweigh the negatives. You are certainly entitled to your own opinion.

Your opinions are important to me and I certainly encourage our listeners to speak their minds in this forum. It's times like these when I really wish we could produce a quality live show so I could talk to you "on the air". Rest assured, I don't skip over any topic in the CAGcast forum. At the very least, I read the first post in every thread.

chronojin

11-10-2007, 09:03 AM

Cheapy,

No matter what anyone says we won't fault you for doing the ads. And yes people that don't like them can skip it.

If anything having an important advertiser like the Navy solidifies that your podcast is getting someone's attention.

DJSteel

11-10-2007, 09:08 AM

1UP has 3-4 commercials in their much shorter podcast...compare that with CAGCast...and it is nothing...besides they are providing a free service..why can't they cash in a little on their success...

Trenchalicious

11-10-2007, 11:10 AM

Don't worry OP, I have been very critical of the ads and their placement. Cheapy can see multiple sides of things, he's not an asshole.

One of the great things about this forum is, they let you speak your mind without deleting what you have to say. They only really delete spam and hate speech. Other than that, you can voice your mind without worrying about Big Brother censoring your thoughts.

evanft

11-10-2007, 02:58 PM

I just skip 30 seconds ahead.

crazytalkx

11-10-2007, 03:47 PM

I haven't been getting them (downloaded through iTunes) so I could care less :lol:

Theduck

11-10-2007, 04:04 PM

I hate the fucking Army ads and the dumb ass sharks that go to schools and talk to kids about the Army Reserves.

Aleryn

11-10-2007, 04:13 PM

You're too sensitive, OP. Let Cheapy make some money to help pay for this site we're all using.

dopa345

11-10-2007, 04:19 PM

I have no problem with a few 30 second ads for a free podcast, especially when the revenue from said ads are going to charity. Give CheapyD a break.

Noodle Pirate!

11-10-2007, 04:27 PM

This whole website is set up to make money. Why would the podcast be any different.
From what everyone else has said , they are very short ads, so why not just zone out for 60 seconds or fast foward it past them. Easy peasy.

Halo05

11-10-2007, 04:35 PM

I hate the fucking Army ads and the dumb ass sharks that go to schools and talk to kids about the Army Reserves.

Yeah! Darn facists! Curse them for giving kids who can't afford college a chance to better themselves!

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

DesertEagleXIX

11-10-2007, 04:36 PM

I've said this in the other thread and let me say it again:

Cheapy and Wombat put at least 4 hours into every show. The Cagcast is usually a 90 minute MP3, with outlining and production I'm sure they put at least 4 hours of effort in. And yet people complain about a few seconds of ads. Jeez, can you be anymore ungrateful?

Now, If you are against the nature of the ad, I'd like to bring something up- an advertisement is just a suggestion. If you think people will drop their ipods, and run to their nearest recruitment depot, you're crazy. Study a bit of media effects, the 'hypodermic model' in particular. This model, although it's been outdated for 60 years or so, is what is used by anti-gaming groups. They also think people are so stupid and gullible, that we will copy Manhunt 2's on-screen mayhem.

By making statement like 'they(recruiters) prey on kids', you begin to sound like those conservative media 'analysts', who wrongfully worry that video games are rotting the younger generations minds.

mega_n00bzer

11-10-2007, 05:01 PM

usickenme

11-10-2007, 05:09 PM

Sincerely,

All CAGcast listeners

please don't pretend to speak for all the CAGcast listeners. (Maybe just the ones up Cheapy's butt-no fault of his)

The ads largely suck and skipping is not an always an option. (I listen while running). But, If Cheapy and Wombat feel the need for them for respectability, that's fine with me.

The ads are far less annoying than Wombat's constant whining about wanting free games, thank god that is over with.

Theduck

11-10-2007, 05:09 PM

Yeah! Darn facists! Curse them for giving kids who can't afford college a chance to better themselves!

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Man, all those rolling your eye smilies really get your point across. Did you also do it at home infront of the computer when you read my post?

Yeah, lets con kids into joining the army making them think we're giving them all of this stuff for free, when in reality we'll send them to a pointless oil driven war to get killed!!

Here's the smilie i'll use because I just put some sunglasses on to post this.

8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)

rodeojones903

11-10-2007, 05:13 PM

By making statement like 'they(recruiters) prey on kids', you begin to sound like those conservative media 'analysts', who wrongfully worry that video games are rotting the younger generations minds.

Yeah! Conservatives like Hilary Clinton! :D

sublime90

11-10-2007, 07:19 PM

the ads dont bother me at all. especially because cheapy will be donating the add money to charity. three 30 second clips in a 2 hour show is not bad at all! so in a span of 2 hours you hear the navy being mentioned for a whole 1 minute and 30 seconds, oh nooooo boo hooo.

whoknows

11-10-2007, 07:23 PM

Yeah! Darn facists! Curse them for giving kids who can't afford college a chance to better themselves!

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
I don't really care, except when they're really pushy. I still get calls from them at least once a month and last time they were pretty much making an appointment for me to visit them. I told them make the appointment, but I'm not going to be there.

EDIT: Just to clarify I'm not against the Navy ads at all. I see nothing wrong with them and they're very short, too short for me to care enough to skip past them.

fullmetalfan720

11-10-2007, 08:52 PM

Cheapy and Wombat deserve to get paid for doing such a good show.

Halo05

11-10-2007, 09:16 PM

Man, all those rolling your eye smilies really get your point across. Did you also do it at home infront of the computer when you read my post?

Yeah, lets con kids into joining the army making them think we're giving them all of this stuff for free, when in reality we'll send them to a pointless oil driven war to get killed!!

Here's the smilie i'll use because I just put some sunglasses on to post this.

8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)

They get my point across more than your name-calling and foul language do.

Theduck

11-10-2007, 11:08 PM

They get my point across more than your name-calling and foul language do.

:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

yukine

11-11-2007, 12:25 AM

The Navy is the main sponsor for only a short while, perhaps after that Cheapy will get a different sponsor that is more gaming related.

If not, well then just suck it up or just don't listen to the show.

futureman

11-11-2007, 12:38 AM

I hope everyone who doesn't listen to the cagcast because of the navy ads is consistent and doesn't drive anywhere because of those incessant billboards, leaves theaters when there is product placement, doesn't watch tv, and doesn't go to a website with ads, like maybe cag? Or you are a dummy who can't stand any changes and sends emails and cries about it.

Kosh

11-11-2007, 02:12 AM

More Navy ads, please. You could also add Army, Air Force, Marines, and Coast Guard as well. Whatever pisses off all these anti-military assholes.

dafoomie

11-11-2007, 02:30 AM

I don't know which is more distasteful, the suggestion that the Navy preys upon naive young adults, or the suggestion that people only serve in the Navy because they didn't know any better.

Besides, the Navy is benefiting from an increase in recruits who want to avoid ground combat, to the detriment of the Army and Marine Corps. They don't need to decieve anyone.

mykevermin

11-11-2007, 03:03 AM

If you're savvy enough to not be persuaded by advertisements, what is the problem?

jollydwarf

11-11-2007, 03:06 AM

A well-written and thorough topic post, a rarity here or elsewhere (especially the latter!) these days. That said, while I'm not going to say your passion is misdirected, I will opine that the ads are unobtrusive enough and short enough to be totally innocuous. Let's be honest here: does anyone really think a minute or so of Navy banter is going to get some Halo punk to enlist? With all due respect to those serving our country, I'm going to wager that these (along with anything else NOT in the typical gamer's wheelhouse) are going to be summarily ignored.

Now, if Cheapy and/or Wombat were to start blurring the lines and dropping Navy plugs like a half-drunk 'play-by-play' guy pitching for his friend's Italian restaurant or barber shop during the "High School Game of the Week", then we've got an issue worth raising the CAG Defcon level for. As it stands, I don't feel like the Navy ads have 'compromised' the CAGcast, and I don't think the ads are going to work. At all. But if the military wants to try....

Justme8800

11-11-2007, 03:39 AM

Ok first of all, Cheapy, you just jumped up a few thousand notches on my respect scale. I completely take back anything detrimental I may have implied about you, especially when it comes to listening to your listeners. I was wrong to assume I needed to address my issues to Wombat, especially since he's probably so swamped with his new job and all.

As far as the Navy being an A-list advertiser, I completely agree. But if there was one thing that could be changed in all of this, it's that I hope the CAGcast can find a different, and hopefully more relevant, A-list advertiser. Maybe some big game publisher, or an electronics retailer.

To everyone who has jumped on me without even reading what I said in the first place, you're not really adding to the discussion. I tried to address these in the OT, but it seems some clarification is in order.

A) I am not complaining about ads in of themselves. Skipping 30 seconds is no more annoying for me than it is for any of you. Or, heaven forbid, listening to a little spiel telling me about a cool new game release! That's kind of why I listen to the show in the first place, eh? If it makes Cheapy and Wombat some extra cash, all the better.

B) When I say "sharks," I am NOT reffering to the US Navy. I have nothing but respect for the people working in civil defense. I am referring to the recruiters, and I would not be so short-sighted as to lump them in with the Navy itself.

C) Who said anything about people dropping their ipods and running to recruitment centers? Are you trying to say that advertising doesn't work? And what does in-game violence have to do with this?

D) Kosh, no one here is "anti-military," and no one here is an "asshole." Why do you desire people to be pissed off, anyways? This discussion is centered around avoiding that. I'm trying to be as articulate and adult as I can about this.

Let's be honest here: does anyone really think a minute or so of Navy banter is going to get some Halo punk to enlist?

Heh, the Navy sure seems to think so. :) Thank you as well for your well-written and thorough reply, it's a bit easier to read than some of the other posts here.

And thanks to everyone who has added their two cents, it's nice to hear everyone's opinion.

Ikohn4ever

11-11-2007, 04:11 AM

flybrione

11-11-2007, 04:55 AM

I do respect everyones opinions but what's the big deal? Just enjoy the show.
A couple of ads are not going to hurt you.

Justme8800

11-11-2007, 05:30 AM

A couple of ads are not going to hurt you.
*whacks head on brick wall*

This isn't about me. What is so difficult to understand about this? I spent a lot of time trying to make my writing easy to read, and my point easy to get. I apologize, because I've evidently failed on these counts. Where did I go wrong? :cry:

CheapyD

11-11-2007, 05:52 AM

As far as the Navy being an A-list advertiser, I completely agree. But if there was one thing that could be changed in all of this, it's that I hope the CAGcast can find a different, and hopefully more relevant, A-list advertiser. Maybe some big game publisher, or an electronics retailer.
Trust me, I'd love to be in a situtation where I could pick and choose!

futureman

11-11-2007, 07:37 AM

You say your problem is with the military in your first post Justme, Maybe it is JUST YOU. Where do you think military recruiters come from? If you don't listen to the show move on, I don't go talking about what tv shows should change so I would watch them again, I move on with my life.

VanillaGorilla

11-11-2007, 01:43 PM

My podcast has no advertisements at all :lol:

:booty:

And to the OP, if you don't like that aspect of the show, skip over it, or don't listen at all. Problem solved.

EastBayAnt

11-11-2007, 02:50 PM

Seriously, you guys actually hear the ads? I just automatically tune out advertisements I hear, be it on podcasts, television, radio, etc...

Punk_Raven

11-11-2007, 05:18 PM

For the next person who creates a thread about the Navy ads Cheapy should rename them " Navy" and have their custom title " Accelarate Your Life".

cdrober

11-11-2007, 05:35 PM

This doesn't bother me at all, in fact I like how Cheapy is donating the money he gets to charity, that is a class act thing to do.

LarryGe

11-11-2007, 10:03 PM

Your username describes how many people care

catapult37

11-12-2007, 10:08 PM

I think the OP summed it up himself: "I started taking the podcast for granted". You know, free entertainment sure is nice, isn't it?

Plus, it probably took you as long to write your angsty soliloquy as it would have taken to listen to two or three episodes' worth of ads.

And as I said in another thread, as someone old enough to remember life before podcasts, tivo, and bittorrent -- a time when we watched TV on the (wait for it) TV and radio on the radio... with a constant stream of ads supporting that FREE ENTERTAINMENT... let me just offer to call the WAAAAAHHHBulence, you overdramatic whiner.

sykoex

11-13-2007, 11:18 AM

Has anyone heard very begining of the current Fanboys podcast? They do a spoof on the Navy podcast ads, pretty funny.

http://thefanboys.com/podpress_trac/web/145/0/lunchcast_029.mp3

Justme8800

11-13-2007, 02:29 PM

Trust me, I'd love to be in a situtation where I could pick and choose!

That's not the case? That wasn't the impression I got from CAGcast 95, my bad. Something about you not even needing the money, I must have misunderstood. Sorry 'bout that.

I think the OP summed it up himself: "I started taking the podcast for granted". You know, free entertainment sure is nice, isn't it?

Plus, it probably took you as long to write your angsty soliloquy as it would have taken to listen to two or three episodes' worth of ads.

And as I said in another thread, as someone old enough to remember life before podcasts, tivo, and bittorrent -- a time when we watched TV on the (wait for it) TV and radio on the radio... with a constant stream of ads supporting that FREE ENTERTAINMENT... let me just offer to call the WAAAAAHHHBulence, you overdramatic whiner.

If I was paying for the CAGcast, I'd be pissed about this fiasco. As it is, I'm just disappointed. It's not my place to tell Cheapy and Wombat what they can and can't do. But, as a member of the CAG community, am I not at least entitled to an opinion? And is it wrong to try and share that opinion in the most eloquent way I can?

Let me say this AGAIN; I do not have a problem with advertisements in nature. I do not have a problem with CAG Foreplay recommending GoDaddy every show. I would not have a problem with it if they spent two minutes an episode on ads. My problem is with:

1. Cheapy's bogus rationale for doing the ads in the first place. "Industry cred?" The first time some development studio goes "Oh, CAGcast? Aren't they the guys who have A-list advertisers? Give 'em the scoop!" I'll eat every word I've typed about this. "I don't even want the money" was insulting, and it makes me feel that the ads had little benefit to the CAGcast for the listeners it lost. Not to mention, I was under the impression I was supporting CAG already by shopping through links on the site. As for the charity, CAG would do a lot better to do what they did last year, have everyone donate ten bucks in CAG's name. This year, they're gonna get a lot more of "well, I've already listened to the ads, and that money is going to Child's Play, so I've done my part."

2. Military recruiters. Stop reading now if you don't agree with this, because reason 1 is the main issue, and this is just icing of the proverbial cake. There are many people in the country who would A) sign up regardless of being told to, to serve their country, and there are many more people who would B) sign up in the event of the military actually needing more personnel resources, like in WWII, to serve their country. ATM our esteemed commander in chief is grinding resource A into the ground in Iraq, and if he is to continue his crusade in Iran as planned, he needs to draw off resource B. Problem is, he needs to convince resource B that his oil crusade is worth their lives they may lose. This unfortunate task falls on the recruiters, who channel this insanity into the next starry-eyed, patriotic 17y/o gullible enough to believe he'd be fighting for his homeland.

Point 2 is all but moot, as I realize nobody cares about it, except for the majority of the world population. Point 1 is actually relevant, and is the principle I can't manage to ditch in order to listen to the excellent CAGcast. CAG does not have anything in the way of "industry cred" to gain from turning the podcast into a sellout whore. CAG already gets many scoops from insiders, moreso than the average commercial show under embargo to not say anything until the whole gaming world already knows about it.

Also, I am not an "overdramatic whiner" in need of a "wahmbulance." I am someone with an apparently unpopular point of view. Just because you lack the insight to see from someone else's point of view, despite the fact that I am willing to spend so much effort explaining it to you, does not make it appropriate for you to insult me like that. You have a different opinion then I do, yet I am not calling you anything worse than a peremptory philistine.

Now can we please cool it with the disparaging comments, and can someone please explain why they think I am looking at this the wrong way? I am not trying to troll here, I honestly want to understand why the CAG community is, by and large, taking this lying down. Thank you.

~Justme8800

P.S. Yes, I am aware that I need a new pseudonym. Thank you for pointing that out.

catapult37

11-13-2007, 03:23 PM

You know, I got carried away. I apologize for the name-calling and general tone of my message, which was uncalled for. I disagree with you, but that's no reason to get all flamey. And I will agree with you on one point: Cheapy's rationale for the ads comes off sounding a little strange. It's nice that his cut will go to benefit charity, but I don't get the impression that that was the driving reason behind the decision. The "industry cred" argument is a bit odd.

mega_n00bzer

11-13-2007, 03:28 PM

I dont get the ads. HA!

Sleepkyng

11-13-2007, 03:42 PM

That's not the case? That wasn't the impression I got from CAGcast 95, my bad. Something about you not even needing the money, I must have misunderstood. Sorry 'bout that.

If I was paying for the CAGcast, I'd be pissed about this fiasco. As it is, I'm just disappointed. It's not my place to tell Cheapy and Wombat what they can and can't do. But, as a member of the CAG community, am I not at least entitled to an opinion? And is it wrong to try and share that opinion in the most eloquent way I can?

Let me say this AGAIN; I do not have a problem with advertisements in nature. I do not have a problem with CAG Foreplay recommending GoDaddy every show. I would not have a problem with it if they spent two minutes an episode on ads. My problem is with:

1. Cheapy's bogus rationale for doing the ads in the first place. "Industry cred?" The first time some development studio goes "Oh, CAGcast? Aren't they the guys who have A-list advertisers? Give 'em the scoop!" I'll eat every word I've typed about this. "I don't even want the money" was insulting, and it makes me feel that the ads had little benefit to the CAGcast for the listeners it lost. Not to mention, I was under the impression I was supporting CAG already by shopping through links on the site. As for the charity, CAG would do a lot better to do what they did last year, have everyone donate ten bucks in CAG's name. This year, they're gonna get a lot more of "well, I've already listened to the ads, and that money is going to Child's Play, so I've done my part."

2. Military recruiters. Stop reading now if you don't agree with this, because reason 1 is the main issue, and this is just icing of the proverbial cake. There are many people in the country who would A) sign up regardless of being told to, to serve their country, and there are many more people who would B) sign up in the event of the military actually needing more personnel resources, like in WWII, to serve their country. ATM our esteemed commander in chief is grinding resource A into the ground in Iraq, and if he is to continue his crusade in Iran as planned, he needs to draw off resource B. Problem is, he needs to convince resource B that his oil crusade is worth their lives they may lose. This unfortunate task falls on the recruiters, who channel this insanity into the next starry-eyed, patriotic 17y/o gullible enough to believe he'd be fighting for his homeland.

Point 2 is all but moot, as I realize nobody cares about it, except for the majority of the world population. Point 1 is actually relevant, and is the principle I can't manage to ditch in order to listen to the excellent CAGcast. CAG does not have anything in the way of "industry cred" to gain from turning the podcast into a sellout whore. CAG already gets many scoops from insiders, moreso than the average commercial show under embargo to not say anything until the whole gaming world already knows about it.

Also, I am not an "overdramatic whiner" in need of a "wahmbulance." I am someone with an apparently unpopular point of view. Just because you lack the insight to see from someone else's point of view, despite the fact that I am willing to spend so much effort explaining it to you, does not make it appropriate for you to insult me like that. You have a different opinion then I do, yet I am not calling you anything worse than a peremptory philistine.

Now can we please cool it with the disparaging comments, and can someone please explain why they think I am looking at this the wrong way? I am not trying to troll here, I honestly want to understand why the CAG community is, by and large, taking this lying down. Thank you.

~Justme8800

P.S. Yes, I am aware that I need a new pseudonym. Thank you for pointing that out.
are you for serious? think about what you're saying -

i don't know how to put this in plainer english so bear with me, savior of the oppressed advertiser haters -

CheapyD is trying to create a business - starting from scratch (the website) branching out to other levels (cagcast) - his business decisions are his own and he's been more than willing to listen to Cag feedback - but you can't knock him for accepting a grade-A (and if you can't figure out that the NAVY has big bucks and influence, especially on the 18-25 male bracket, you are retarded) advertiser unless you wanna go ahead and lay down some cash (which, by the way, you haven't because you get the cagcast, cag.com, videogame news and deals updates, community, forum support etc. FOR FREE).

what does Child's Play have to do with your topic?
furthermore, what does the war in iraq (or whevever) have to do with the CAGcast?
Who cares what Cheapy does with his money? I think he did that in part to show that he's not trying to betray our loyalty (which he shouldn't because i fully support him making money).

Small companies start with small advertisement - in this case it's a big break - but normally he would be sponsored by shitty ass companies (like madcat). Give the CAGcast 1-2 years and then see who's dope he's pushing.

Are you actually one of those people that think that people in Pepsi commercials only drink Pepsi?

i can think for myself, i don't need your World Affairs 101 bullshit up in my CAGcast, that shit is for the Lifestyle forum.

jakehoss

11-13-2007, 06:20 PM

do not want.......

DirtyDuck

11-14-2007, 04:48 PM

I've been a long time listener to the cast since about show 40... It’s been entertaining and definitely something I look forward to listen to during my commute to work... with that being said, I was of the same opinion JustMe when I first heard the ads.

I felt they were hokey and out of place, unlike the 1up show's video podcast that uses real video game related sponsorships. (at last notice, I stopped watching it months ago)

But then my other weekly podcasts started doing stranger things than having small 30 second ads. Things like posting a cast on its website rather than being able to be downloaded conveniently via iTunes. Things like begging for donations at the beginning of there casts. That’s why I decided to create a screenname and leave a post.

Cheapy, keep the ads… hopefully you get some videogame related sponsorships.

You and wombat do an awesome job of giving a different point of view rather than the usual nerdy fandom that other video game podcasts are littered with. (destructoid, 1up) Just two regular dudes who talk up video games. Keep up the excellent work.:applause:

Justme8800

11-14-2007, 07:08 PM

Hear, hear, DirtyDuck. It could certainly be a lot worse! Just because all the "cool" podcasts are doing something, it doesn't mean that they have to. As long as Cheapy and Wombat keep that in mind, and don't succumb to podcast peer pressure, I'm happy with whatever ads they want to run. I'm only boycotting the show until the navy ads are over, because frankly Cheapy sounded like a teenager whose friends convinced him to start shooting up. If he could just attest that he's not doing it for the "image," than most of my cause is justified, certainly enough to shut me up.

To answer Sleepkyng's questions, I thought I laid it out when I brought them up. Child's play is the charity that Cheapy said he'd donate the money he "doesn't need" to, and that CAG had a hugely successful fundraiser for last year.

The war in Iraq, I agree, shouldn't have any place in the CAGcast (or it's forums). So that's why I think the Navy, and by extension the war they are fighting, shouldn't be in the CAGcast.

What did I say that brought up your pepsi analogy? Do I come across as stupid or retarted to you? Just because I don't agree with your groupthink doesn't indicate my intellegence, and I shouldn't have to explain that to you.

As for Cheapy's business, what about it? He is smart, and he knows to listen to his listeners. If he pisses them off so they stop listening, that's not getting him any closer to bigger advertisers. That's how any television or radio show works. If I don't tell them why I've stopped listening and their number has gone down by one, what's the point of not listening? Self-gratitude? I may not be a very loud voice, and I may not make a big difference, but I owe it to the CAGcast to throw my pebble against the wall.

~Justme8800

PleasantOne

11-15-2007, 04:51 AM

I'm just itching to respond here, but I'm going to hold my tongue... this isn't the place for politics - that's for the Lifestyle forum and that's why I avoid that forum...

But I did want to say that I support Cheapy's decision... the ads are short and unobtrusive, IMO. Also wanted to say that there is myself and likely some others who would stop listening if Cheapy *denied* the Navy ad's simply because they were military related...

And thank you to all our military CAGs! :)

Sideshow

11-15-2007, 06:05 AM

Okay, now for my opinion that no one asked for. Personally, I don't much like the fact that they are Navy ads, but that's also why I fast forward whenever they start. Now, personally I was hoping that instead of 60 seconds of Navy ads in the show, we instead has 30, 2 second ads for Sun Chips. How awesome would that be?

Cheapy: Wombat, Guitar Hero 3 is out.
Wombat: Eat sun chips.
Cheapy: Have you picked yours up yet?
Wombat: Yes, I have. Eat sun chips.

Huh, huh? I want a Sun Chips advertisment damn it.

P. S. - As much as I don't like the idea of them being sponsored by the US government. Look at it like I do. CheapyD has only lost money from me, because I got a CAG bracelet for me, a fellow cag and my gf without even paying the extra postage of 51 cents for the three combined. So, if Cheapy and Wombat get $80 something odd dollars a piece per show for me having to listen to a couple of Navy ads, then I can fast foward a few seconds for them to make a buck.

jimbodan

11-15-2007, 06:53 AM

I'd prefer a different advertiser, but eh what can ya do?

The ads really aren't that bad.

Zurezo

11-17-2007, 02:47 AM

Well I dont know about you guys but Im joining ASAP!

Everybody needs to relax, its 1:30 of the whole show and its not like the "real" radio where you cant fast foward.

msdmoney

11-17-2007, 05:18 AM

The war in Iraq, I agree, shouldn't have any place in the CAGcast (or it's forums). So that's why I think the Navy, and by extension the war they are fighting, shouldn't be in the CAGcast.

I think you just told us the real, underlying reason why you are against the ads. There is nothing about the Iraq war in the Cagcast. You can be supportive of the US Navy and the men and women that serve, and still be against the war.

Justme8800

11-17-2007, 05:39 PM

I think you just told us the real, underlying reason why you are against the ads. There is nothing about the Iraq war in the Cagcast. You can be supportive of the US Navy and the men and women that serve, and still be against the war.

Likewise, you can be supportive of the Navy and still be against their misleading recruiting campaigns. Anyone who's actually been in a naval battle can affirm that there come's a good deal of baggage with "seeing the world," "being a man," and getting that scholarship. Anyone who joins the Navy aware of this has my absolute and complete respect. Anyone who is convinced by their deceivingly glamorous spiel has that, but they also have my sympathy.

The real, underlying reason I am against the ads has nothing to do with the Navy, it has to do with Cheapy's baloney reasons for running the ads in the first place. If my problem was with the Iraq War, don't you think I would have actually mentioned it in my rants? What would be the point of trying to boycott something while not explaining why?

lordwow

11-20-2007, 09:40 AM

There is an awful lot of bitching in this thread about something we listen to for free.

E*Master

11-20-2007, 10:47 AM

I have an Idea cheapyD. There is a better way to skip the ads. Since you are using an iMac now you can do this. Enhanced podcasts. What you can do is set chapters in the podcast which will make it much easier for users to skip the ads. Kinda like going to "the next track" on a cd or ipod but still being in the same file. Check it out here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_podcast. Only hting you will have to do is put apicture corresponding to the chapter but that's all.

usickenme

11-20-2007, 02:32 PM

Enhanced podcasts are itunes/ ipod only. While awesome, you would have to have an MP3 feed or cut out a large percentage of your audience

E*Master

11-20-2007, 11:32 PM

Enhanced podcasts are itunes/ ipod only. While awesome, you would have to have an MP3 feed or cut out a large percentage of your audience
It Is in quicktime as well. I still think it's a good idea.

Justme8800

11-21-2007, 12:57 AM

Great idea and all, guys, but that's sort of solving the wrong problem... besides, I doubt any advertiser would go for that, much less the Navy.

As for "bitching," what? Do you think Cheapy would rather I just stopped listening and didn't explain why? Or would it be better to rectify a show-stopping problem that can be trivially fixed?

Maybe you have some scrupulous issues with dogfighting. If the CAGcast took on some advertising from a dogfighting scout, would you just sit there and listen to it like a good little consumer? No, you'd take issue with it. I'm not saying the Navy are like dogfighters, but maybe you've gotten my point.

~Justme8800

11-21-2007, 03:17 AM

Wombat seems to be more prepared and eager to do the show each week now that he's getting a little $$$. Plus Cheapy is donating his cut to charity. If anything its enhanced the program and the image of CAG.

Kosh

11-21-2007, 04:01 AM

Justme8800

11-21-2007, 04:47 AM

The only point you keep making, is that you are a dumbass. It seems the majority don't mind the ads, they either fast forward through them or just mentally block them out. Oh, wait, there might be that large percentage that go out and enlist in the Navy... :roll:

Good lord, how many bleedin' times do I have to say it? It's the principle of the thing! Not annoyance, not worry that a few CAGs on the fence are going to sign up, no, those are fine!

I CANNOT simply "fast-forward" past the fact that Cheapy is trying to pass the CAGcast as any other two-bit streetwalker of a podcast. I CANNOT "fast-forward" past him saying "I don't even need the money," because I've already heard him say it. I cannot "fast-forward" past my moral conscience like it's worth less than a podcast, no matter how entertaining it is. I'm thrilled for you that you can do it, but fast-forwarding does not solve any problems.

And even if you could find a dictionary with the definition for "dumbass" in it, I don't think you would find that it says "a person who disagrees with the majority." Just because I think you are an ignorant and heartless troll doesn't give me an excuse to call you names. What have I said, out of four pages of explaining, that wasn't well supported and logical? What did I say that led you to believe I am someone of comparable intellegence to a retarded donkey? One day you will learn that there are people who think differently than you do in this world, and that many of them are actually wiser than you are.

~Justme8800

P.S. Sorry to anyone who had to sit through that. I know that in any argument, resorting to name calling is a concession of defeat, but it still sets me off like nothing else.

lordwow

11-21-2007, 07:06 AM

As for "bitching," what? Do you think Cheapy would rather I just stopped listening and didn't explain why? Or would it be better to rectify a show-stopping problem that can be trivially fixed?

Maybe you have some scrupulous issues with dogfighting. If the CAGcast took on some advertising from a dogfighting scout, would you just sit there and listen to it like a good little consumer? No, you'd take issue with it. I'm not saying the Navy are like dogfighters, but maybe you've gotten my point.

~Justme8800

I don't stop watching my favorite TV shows because they have ads I don't like on them, and I don't walk out of theaters because they have ads before movies now, and I'm certainly not going to stop listening to the CAGCast because of a 30 second ad I can skip over.

Kosh

11-21-2007, 12:05 PM

And even if you could find a dictionary with the definition for "dumbass" in it, I don't think you would find that it says "a person who disagrees with the majority."

You're right it doesn't. Nope, you're a dumbass for many various other reasons. Here are a couple pointed out by others in this thread.

are you for serious? think about what you're saying -

i don't know how to put this in plainer english so bear with me, savior of the oppressed advertiser haters -

CheapyD is trying to create a business - starting from scratch (the website) branching out to other levels (cagcast) - his business decisions are his own and he's been more than willing to listen to Cag feedback - but you can't knock him for accepting a grade-A (and if you can't figure out that the NAVY has big bucks and influence, especially on the 18-25 male bracket, you are retarded) advertiser unless you wanna go ahead and lay down some cash (which, by the way, you haven't because you get the cagcast, cag.com, videogame news and deals updates, community, forum support etc. FOR FREE).

what does Child's Play have to do with your topic?
furthermore, what does the war in iraq (or whevever) have to do with the CAGcast?
Who cares what Cheapy does with his money? I think he did that in part to show that he's not trying to betray our loyalty (which he shouldn't because i fully support him making money).

Small companies start with small advertisement - in this case it's a big break - but normally he would be sponsored by shitty ass companies (like madcat). Give the CAGcast 1-2 years and then see who's dope he's pushing.

Are you actually one of those people that think that people in Pepsi commercials only drink Pepsi?

i can think for myself, i don't need your World Affairs 101 bullshit up in my CAGcast, that shit is for the Lifestyle forum.

I don't stop watching my favorite TV shows because they have ads I don't like on them, and I don't walk out of theaters because they have ads before movies now, and I'm certainly not going to stop listening to the CAGCast because of a 30 second ad I can skip over.

Both of these people debunk your two points that you are trying to make located in this post. http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3577034&postcount=59
Being, 1. You don't accept Cheapy's reasoning for having the Navy ads, and 2. You don't like Military Recruiters.

That is why you are being a dumbass about this topic. You can say all you want about being an adult, but the reality is you're not being one yourself. You keep on and on about it, even though the majority doesn't care and seeing as we've heard Navy ads for the last three shows, Cheapy pretty much said, tough shit the ads are staying.

Do us all a favor, stop listening to the Cagcast, because obviously the 90 seconds of Navy ads is too much for you to handle. While you're at it delete your account on these forums, I'm pretty sure you won't be missed.

Justme8800

11-21-2007, 04:13 PM

I've already explained what was wrong with the first post there that "debunked" my *opinion.* As for the second one, just because that guy lets show producers piss all over his humanity by endorsing evil advertisers, doesn't mean I should.

As for me being wrong because the "majority" disagrees with me, I'm sorry, but that's just stupid. Even if all the cattle are gladly being herded into the next pasture for their FREE grazing, I'm not stupid for seeing that it's one more pasture closer to the slaughterhouse. You guys go on ahead, but I'm going to stand my ground.

Doing you all a favor... Yes, as I've mentioned a couple times now, I am no longer listening to the CAGcast because of these ads. The last one I heard was #95, and I'm not listening to any more until Cheapy finds a better advertiser... heck, ANY other advertiser. And I'm sure no one would miss me if they never heard from me again... except for, y'know, just about everyone who listens to CAG Foreplay, since I'm sponsoring the next giveaway contest. I'm sure Ship wouldn't mind if I dropped out now. I'll make sure they all thank you personally for giving me such excellent advice.

~Justme8800

P.S. Seriously, dude, name calling is not necessary, and it's an extremely trollish thing to be doing. If you feel you can come up with a legitimate reason why I'm wrong, even given that no one has yet to do so, I invite you to talk about it rationally. Showing everyone that you're old enough to use "language" isn't proving anything beyond your inability to talk levelheadedly.

Kosh

11-21-2007, 11:50 PM

As for the second one, just because that guy lets show producers piss all over his humanity by endorsing evil advertisers, doesn't mean I should.

Maybe you're not a dumbass, but I do know you're bat shit crazy.

Why is the Navy considered an "evil" advertiser? Because you said so? You take the cake, dude, you take the cake. LOL!

If you feel you can come up with a legitimate reason why I'm wrong, even given that no one has yet to do so, I invite you to talk about it rationally
I'll give you a reason. It's really simple. It's Cheapy's show, he can choose any advertiser he damn well pleases. That's all any of us need to know, including you. It's not a Democracy, you don't get a choice. Cheapy is the Supreme Leader of the Cagcast and Wombat is his Evil Queen.

And I'm sure no one would miss me if they never heard from me again... except for, y'know, just about everyone who listens to CAG Foreplay, since I'm sponsoring the next giveaway contest. I'm sure Ship wouldn't mind if I dropped out now. I'll make sure they all thank you personally for giving me such excellent advice.

That's fine, don't sponsor it. I'll gladly take your place.

Shipwreck, if this guy backs out on supplying the prize for the next giveaway contest just drop me a PM. I'll gladly donate a prize, it would be my pleasure if it gets rid of this guy.

Justme8800

11-22-2007, 12:59 AM

Why is the Navy considered an "evil" advertiser? Because you said so? You take the cake, dude, you take the cake. LOL!
LOL, ha ha, the cake is a lie and all that jazz. I consider active Navy recruitment bad, which is a synonym for "evil" in the context I was using. I'm not trying to speak for anyone else here, least of all you, but yes, I've explained my logic here several times over.

I'll give you a reason. It's really simple. It's Cheapy's show, he can choose any advertiser he damn well pleases. That's all any of us need to know, including you. It's not a Democracy, you don't get a choice. Cheapy is the Supreme Leader of the Cagcast and Wombat is his Evil Queen.

Ah, yes, that is true. Which is why I've left the "kingdom of CAGcast," as it were for the time being. If a king is unjust to his people, they will leave. That's why kings try to make their kingdoms a good place to be. That's why Cheapy read and responded in this thread, because, as any good king, he cares about what people want.

At the moment, it seems he thinks that more of "his" people will benefit from the hypothetical deluge of exclusive insider opportunities he will get by selling out his show. I think the kingdom has nothing to gain by selling out the show, but for the check in his (and by extension, Child Play's) pocket. Even there, it's pretty clear to me that he will lose more in listener donations than he will gain from the Navy. Not to mention all this talk about getting more inside info by looking more commercial is hogwash, and you know it.

That's fine, don't sponsor it. I'll gladly take your place.

Shipwreck, if this guy backs out on supplying the prize for the next giveaway contest just drop me a PM. I'll gladly donate a prize, it would be my pleasure if it gets rid of this guy.

I was being sarcastic when I said I would take advice from you. Why in the world would I go back on promising Ship a donation? I have absolutely nothing against CAG Foreplay, as what sponsorship they have is completely resonable and transparent for what it is. Though by all means, don't let that stop you from donating! Two contests are better than one.

~Justme8800

P.S. "Crazy" is fine, I can handle that. So were Che Guevara, George Washington, and Mahatma Gandhi. Heck, even you're a little loose, but don't take that as an insult. :)

Kosh

11-22-2007, 09:28 AM

You're worse than FoxNews. You're trying to spin this so much, you're stepping all over yourself.

Here's you're two main problems.

1. Cheapy's bogus rationale for doing the ads in the first place. "Industry cred?" <snip>

2. Military recruiters. Stop reading now if you don't agree with this, because reason 1 is the main issue, and this is just icing of the proverbial cake. <snip>

You say the main problem is the first. Which you then reinforce here.

The real, underlying reason I am against the ads has nothing to do with the Navy, it has to do with Cheapy's baloney reasons for running the ads in the first place.

Then you say this.

I'm only boycotting the show until the navy ads are over, because frankly Cheapy sounded like a teenager whose friends convinced him to start shooting up. If he could just attest that he's not doing it for the "image," than most of my cause is justified, certainly enough to shut me up.
And this.

The last one I heard was #95, and I'm not listening to any more until Cheapy finds a better advertiser... heck, ANY other advertiser.

So, let's say the Navy ads end and he starts advertising McDonald's. Also, let's say it's for the same reason, they're a big "A" list advertiser and he wants the credibility of having that "A" list advertiser. That's okay with you? Because, remember, you said you're only boycotting the show while the Navy ads run.

Remember though, you did say this.

The real, underlying reason I am against the ads has nothing to do with the Navy, it has to do with Cheapy's baloney reasons for running the ads in the first place.
The reasoning for the ads is still the same, whether it's the Navy or McDonald's. The show's credibility.

It has nothing to with the Navy, huh? Yet, as long as it's not the Navy you'll listen again. Nope, sorry you're full of it. It has everything to do with the Navy for you.

You also say this.

Let me say this AGAIN; I do not have a problem with advertisements in nature. I do not have a problem with CAG Foreplay recommending GoDaddy every show.

Proving once again, that it's all about the ads being the Navy.

So what is it? I understand it can be both reasons, but if the advertiser changes, your reason #1 is still there. Yet, you said you'd start listening again. Just stop contradicting yourself and come clean. You're anti-military and that's the only reason you have a problem with the current running ads.

Padrino

11-22-2007, 12:56 PM

I have to admit, I am not a fan of the Army/Navy's new found respect for the recruiting pool that is "gamers". But I do have a lot of respect for the armed forces. The Army knows its demographics and in the past few years has ramped up the war games = games = adventure and respect.

That being said, I think the folks that run CAG have every right to put ads in the show. I think CAGs would just like the ads to reflect the spirit of the show and armed forces recruiting is not in that spirit for most people.

Justme8800

11-22-2007, 02:03 PM

You're worse than FoxNews. You're trying to spin this so much, you're stepping all over yourself.
Sigh. All I am trying to do is explain my position on this, and I'm getting hoarse repeating myself. You're right, that one line I said is due for a little clarification, as I could have phrased it better:

The main, underlying reason I am against the ads has nothing to do with the Navy, it has to do with Cheapy's baloney reasons for running the ads in the first place.

I was trying to emphasize that I have more of a problem with #1, as it were, than with #2. I still have both problems, but problem #1 is the primary thing I am against here.

So what is it? I understand it can be both reasons, but if the advertiser changes, your reason #1 is still there. Yet, you said you'd start listening again. Just stop contradicting yourself and come clean. You're anti-military and that's the only reason you have a problem with the current running ads.
I have problems #1 and #2. The sum of both problems. Problem #1 by itself is an annoyance and an insult to the listeners, and problem #2 by itself is an annoyance and an insult to the listeners. I can put up with an annoyance and an insult, and neither problem on its own merits boycotting. Both of them at the same time, however, is just too much, and I refuse to be dragged that far.

If the ads were to change, (and I was thinking more along the lines of something relevant to the audience, like Toshiba or the like) I would consider my efforts worth it. In that case, not only would reason #2 be nullified, it would mean that Cheapy listened and did something about it, which would mean a lot to me (and more than counter for reason #1). Likewise, if Cheapy were to outright take back what he said on CAGcast #95 about the "cred" gibberish, thus nullifying problem #2, I would hop back on board for the same reasons.

By the way, being anti-war and anti-recruiting do NOT mean the same thing as anti-military, do not confuse them. I am not anti-military (that would be silly, it is essential for us to have National Defence), and what I object about concerning the Navy is not the whole story here. I am not contradicting myself, I am not trying to spin anything, I am only explaining what it is I'm doing, and why I'm doing it. I am not asking that you do it, I am not asking that you agree with me. All I ask from you is that you see my point of view, and to stop treating this as some sort of debate. Happy Thanksgiving!

~Justme8800

mega_n00bzer

11-22-2007, 02:15 PM

I dont see whats bad about the ads, give cheapy a break. he IS a father after all. one day, trolls on the forums will make him so mad, he'll chop his 360 in half. do you want that. do you!?!

my opinion: this thread is shoveled with crap. the navy is evil is it? HAHAHAHA!

greydt

11-22-2007, 11:16 PM

Even if all the cattle are gladly being herded into the next pasture for their FREE grazing, I'm not stupid for seeing that it's one more pasture closer to the slaughterhouse. You guys go on ahead, but I'm going to stand my ground.

I have a feeling people are disliking you not specifically for the difference in opinion, but for the kind of things you're posting similar to what I've quoted: a mix of being on a high horse, combined with a condenscending tone...and a dash of ego ("I would consider my efforts worth it").

It's easy to say that people are disliking you because of your opinions...all i can say from MY opinion is that even though I have zero stake in the conversation, I really can't stand the way you're carrying yourself in this conversation. You could be arguing for solving world hungry...and it would still come off annoying as hell if you used the same tact as you did in this thread.

More power to ya for sticking to your beliefs, but oy vey, next time find a better way to get your point across. It was a diasater since your opening post, and it only got worse from there. Best of luck for next time.

Justme8800

11-23-2007, 02:08 AM

I have a feeling people are disliking you not specifically for the difference in opinion, but for the kind of things you're posting similar to what I've quoted: a mix of being on a high horse, combined with a condenscending tone...and a dash of ego ("I would consider my efforts worth it").

It's easy to say that people are disliking you because of your opinions...all i can say from MY opinion is that even though I have zero stake in the conversation, I really can't stand the way you're carrying yourself in this conversation. You could be arguing for solving world hungry...and it would still come off annoying as hell if you used the same tact as you did in this thread.

More power to ya for sticking to your beliefs, but oy vey, next time find a better way to get your point across. It was a diasater since your opening post, and it only got worse from there. Best of luck for next time.

You, sir, are absolutely correct. I've been thinking more and more that my shortcomings in dealing with people calling me names is my own worst enemy here. I try to apologize every time I catch myself flaming, it's just that I really can't stand people saying "I don't understand what you're talking about, therefore you must be stupid."

I hate to be giving people the wrong impression about my social nature, and in retrospect I can't blame them at all for doing so, judging by this thread. The initial post was written in a complete furor, as the whole issue came completely out of the blue. People read that, assumed my rage was aimed at them, and retaliated as expected. It's not my nature to take being insulted lightly, (which is probably why I brought this issue up in the first place) so I end up explaining my position over and over, with increasing exasperation. Everyone here has only seen my "pissed, activist" side, which is in all honesty not something I often express.

All the same, these are my shortcomings, and not those of the issues at hand. I would hope people can see past my evidently imperfect descriptions, and see the underlying problems. It's sometimes important to be able to see past the people jumping up and down screaming, and understand what they are so desperately trying to tell you. What I'm trying to get across is not about me, so don't let your opinion of me impact your views on the topic.

Again, I'm sorry, for giving such a poor impression. I have a problem with flamebait, especially when it's directed at me, and I would imagine I'm not the only one like that. I think if you were to find any of my internet presence elsewhere (than this thread), I would not come across as hotheaded as I do here.

~Justme8800

P.S. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. May you all have a cheap ass black friday!

Kosh

11-23-2007, 03:43 AM

Slayzz

11-23-2007, 07:47 PM

Justme8800

11-24-2007, 02:45 PM

It seems almost everyone understands what you are saying. However, only a very few agree with you. Most either, don't agree or don't care either way. It's one thing to be an activist and a complete other thing to be an asshat.

Reasons have been given why Cheapy went with the ads, he even said so on his podcast. They are valid reasons, whether you agree or not, and people have pointed that out in this very thread. You just had to go on and on, contradicting yourself all along the way. You entered the asshat territory long ago.

OK, now I know you're just trolling me. I'm not even gonna bite that.

And it's not like I haven't seen any of the reasons for, it's that none of them outbalance the reasons against.

I agree... after reading 5 pages of replies. I understand Justme8800's point, but at the same time he just keep on digging his hole bigger and bigger.

That's one way to put it. Even as I've tried to lay my case clearer and clearer (or deeper and deeper, as you say), I've done my best to do it without wonton obscene insults, unlike some here who seem to enjoy provoking me.

I just really have trouble wrapping my head around the fact that so many people are swallowing this stunt hook line and sinker. Something that should be drawing an uproar from the listener community is flying over their heads, and they're hardly noticing it. How am I supposed to react other than to keep screaming, hoping that somewhere, someone else will take off their blinders.

As it seems, most of you guys seem perfectly content with this outrageous supplement. If that's honestly the way you feel, you don't have to keep telling me how my body is arranged, posts like that are not helpful to anyone. If you want to argue a point, that's great, but argue the point, not the one making it.

Really, I don't see why you guys are focusing on me here. Do you think the democratic points argued by Hillary Clinton are stupid because she's crap at debating? Are republican points argued by Fred Thompson stupid because he's the one saying them? I agree, those are bad examples, but just because you don't think highly of the one talking doesn't mean what they say is necessarily wrong. I am not what we're arguing about.

~Justme8800

willardhaven

11-24-2007, 02:57 PM

People are getting a little silly by stating that we are "getting" the 'cast for free.

Would anyone in their right mind pay for an amateur fan-made podcast?

I listen to it when I'm bored and it's fun, but there is nothing of value in anything that is said (granted the guest spots are a step in that direction).

I would say we are doing Cheapy more of a service by listening... if it wasn't for the people on this site, who the heck would Digg it or recommend it to others?

Kosh

11-24-2007, 03:55 PM

And it's not like I haven't seen any of the reasons for, it's that none of them outbalance the reasons against.

Once again you state your opinion as fact and the asshattery continues.

People are getting a little silly by stating that we are "getting" the 'cast for free.

Would anyone in their right mind pay for an amateur fan-made podcast?

I listen to it when I'm bored and it's fun, but there is nothing of value in anything that is said (granted the guest spots are a step in that direction).

I would say we are doing Cheapy more of a service by listening... if it wasn't for the people on this site, who the heck would Digg it or recommend it to others?

You just made the best possible argument for Cheapy's reasoning for having the advertisements.

Having "A" list advertisers makes the show look more professional and not like an amatuer fan-made podcast. I'm sure there are lots of people that dismiss the podcast because of the same reasons you gave. Including probably some potential guests.

Now, since the podcast is being recognized by "A" list advertisers maybe some people and potential guests will recognize the podcast as being something worthwhile. Advertisers aren't going to pay money if the podcast isn't being listened to, their ad dollars would be wasted. This in turn may make potential guests want to be on the show more often.

willardhaven

11-24-2007, 05:44 PM

Not liking the ads and denying their value as a business move are two separate things.

That said I suppose I am naive in thinking that improving the quality of the podcast should take priority over gaining advertisers.

In the end it's up to Cheapy, I don't expect him to stop the ads because I dislike them. I have the power to fast forward through them or not listen to the podcast, but why attack the OP for criticizing?

Justme8800

11-24-2007, 09:21 PM

Once again you state your opinion as fact and the asshattery continues.

When did I say it was fact? I said it, so I would have thought the implication was clear that it was my opinion. Sorry, I'll clarify it: it is my opinion that none of the reasons for the ads outbalance the reasons against. Or was that another troll too? I can't tell with you.

Sheesh, since when was everything I say fact? Although I should be honored that you revered my word so much. Sorry to let you down, but believe it or not I have an opinion too.

~Justme8800

sp00ge

11-24-2007, 11:14 PM

I only skimmed this thread because there is way too much BS to sift through, but anyways....

Working for a TV station, I can tell you that without advertising, there would be no TV, no radio. Unless people are willing to shell out huge dollars to cover the costs of production, which are far higher than your cable provider charges.

Whether or not a viewer or group of viewers don't like a certain advertisement, it doesn't matter. As already mentioned, anytime you get a Grade-A advertiser, such as the Navy in this case, turning them down would be a bad idea. By running their ad, you open many more doors to other Grade-A advertisers. "If Company X is running their ads on this show, maybe we, Company Y, should as well."

Sure, there are going to be ads that viewers won't like. Take those 1 minute (as I call them) spam commercials. "Work from home! Be your own boss! Crazy like a fox!" They are obnoxious as hell, but they pay very, very well for airtime. And that is what it comes down to. Basically, limited commercial time will go to the highest bidder.

The more sponsorship you get, the higher the production values can be. A bigger, better show is possible. And when a show gets bigger and better, more exclusivity in stories and previews is possible.

That's what it comes down to. It's not a middle-finger to the viewer, as some people see it. It's about paying the bills and having the ability to do more for the viewers.

Kind of off-topic, but here's a fun thing for you to do. Next time you watch your local news, time out how many minutes of the show is commercials. Write it down and hold onto it for sweeps-season. Time out the commercial time and compare. I can guarantee 10-20% increase in commercials. Why? Prime commercial viewership opportunity. More people want to advertise and will pay for it. Same reason for Superbowl airtime being so expensive.

robot_jesus

11-25-2007, 10:07 PM

Kosh

11-26-2007, 12:51 AM

Honestly, you should read the thread before making a comment, because that was useless. Podcasts are a completely different beast than TV programs.

They both take time and money to produce, how are they that different?

This thread is filled with users who are just mindlessly repeating Cheapy and Wombat's reasoning for the ads without even reading the OP's opinion.

Nope, everyone has read and understands his opinion. How could we not when he keeps on and on about it like a raving lunatic. It seems you and he need to go back and read other people's responses. Which is, most people don't care about his point.

If you were defending your opinions against all these internet tough guys you wouldn't want to sound like an idiot, would you?

It's way too late for that. First, it's "it's not that the ads are Navy", then it's "I'd listen if wasn't Navy ads", now it's "Cheapy's reasoning for having ads", or "no one understands me"... blah, blah, blah.

Face it, he's complaining just to complain. It's that simple.

polly

11-26-2007, 01:49 AM

Well, the Navy's role in Iraq is pretty small. So whatever your feelings on that topic it really shouldn't be the issue.

That said, I think it's pretty lame we live in a country where the military has to advertise in the first place. I realize they do what they have to in order to hit their numbers but it's pretty ridiculous when you stop and think about it. I'd be all for mandatory service. We'd definitely have a much more responsible and politically aware population.

The major issue for me is that by running commercials for the Navy in the CAGcast, they're supporting a morally questionable ad campaign that as gamers we should be a little offended by. I am not a "military hater" or anything. My dad is a retired colonel. Several of my friends have served. I think it's a very admirable thing to do. But these ads are geared at deceiving kids into thinking it'll be just like Call of Duty. It's blatant. To the point where the military makes their own videogames and puts together tournaments which are basically recruiting sessions. Forget that yeah, you could die or come back wounded or disfigured. Instead it's, "Nice gamerscore. Military life is kickass fun too! So you want to be a badass for real? Sign here!" Pretty deceptive IMHO.

All in all, it's Cheapy's show. He's calling the shots. And hey, people gotta get paid. But I'd be lying if I said I didn't find the ads a little jarring. I just sit through them, shake my head, and enjoy the CAGcast for what it is. Free entertainment.

Justme8800

11-26-2007, 02:14 AM

Honestly, you should read the thread before making a comment, because that was useless. Podcasts are a completely different beast than TV programs.

This thread is filled with users who are just mindlessly repeating Cheapy and Wombat's reasoning for the ads without even reading the OP's opinion. Any real argument or thought has been destroyed by Kosh, who has resorted to semantics.

It's really kind of disgusting to see somebody under constant attack because of their moral opinions. I'm sorry if you don't agree with him, but he has the right to share his views in an open forum.

It's not surprising his posts sound "high and mighty." If you were defending your opinions against all these internet tough guys you wouldn't want to sound like an idiot, would you?

Thank you. Someone needed to step in and say that, 'cause no one was listening to me saying it, that's for sure.

You know, before this fiasco, I had high respect for the general CAG community. A group of gamers smart enough to realize that they don't have to pay full price for their games, and on top of that are collaborating and working together to achieve great means. How could they go wrong?

Now, it seems to me that a much greater percentage of them are just here for the freebies. Thorbahn3, a CAG with a respectable community standing, flamed me without even reading what I had to say. It seems that for the most part, the reaction is "ooh, an angry guy! Let's provoke him and see what he does!" Few people are taking this seriously (with the notable exception of Cheapy, ironic given my original approach), and many people are having trouble even seeing my point of view. I feel like every time I try to explain why two plus two is four, someone is asking where three comes into it. I've tried to be as understanding as I can, systematically reiterating that it is not five, six, or seven.

This place is almost as bad as the GameFAQs boards now. Heck, they've probably got more FAQs than we do deals.

They both take time and money to produce, how are they that different?

Yeah! So do Florida Key limes, school buses, and cookies! Oh, wait, we're looking for differences?

Did you miss the part where the TV shows' alternative is being taken off the air, whereas the CAGcast's alternative is not sounding like yet another trashy advercast? For the record, there are billions of people who do not put up with overtly annoying ads. I know I don't, and so do most people I know. And television companies are wondering why their ratings are dropping? Try not broadcasting 40% ad time, maybe that's the problem... nahhh. Why do you think internet podcasting is so popular in the first place?

Nope, everyone has read and understands his opinion. How could we not when he keeps on and on about it like a raving lunatic. It seems you and he need to go back and read other people's responses. Which is, most people don't care about his point.

He needs to go read those responses to see that nobody cares? Near as I can tell, there are three sorts of responses here; Those who understand my point and agree with it, those who understand my point, but are loyal to the word of Cheapy with the kind of zeal usually reserved for crazy fanboys, and those who have discovered that I respond to trolls when they ridicule my cause. The first two are fine, and expected. The latter is just being annoying, though, and isn't really adding anything to the discussion.

It's way too late for that. First, it's "it's not that the ads are Navy", then it's "I'd listen if wasn't Navy ads", now it's "Cheapy's reasoning for having ads", or "no one understands me"... blah, blah, blah.

What are you on about? You only just noticed that I actually have more than one complaint about this? I'm pretty sure I outlined everything from the beginning, there. As to why I keep on explaining, it's because people are in effect asking me to. "Why this?" "This is why." "Why this?" "Ok, I'll elaborate for you." "I don't agree with this point here." "Here's why I do." "You disagree with this other point." "And here's why."

Why shouldn't I explain why I say what I say?

Face it, he's complaining just to complain. It's that simple.

Ok, that is really pissing me off. You think I have nothing better to do than bicker with flamers jeering at me for getting blown off "the man" like a flea? I do not enjoy this. I am putting this effort in because I do not want the CAGcast to deteriorate into an infested shell of its former self. Frankly I am shocked that so many CAGs are actively standing in my way, much less standing aside and rooting for me or, god forbid, joining me in my efforts to save the CAGcast from these shackles it seems to be so gleefully attaching itself to.

Kosh, I've tried to be adult about your trolling, but this is enough. If you have an argument against the CAGcast's integrity, lay it out and explain why you support it. If you have nothing but semantic complaints about how I write, please leave this thread and don't come back. You or I are not part of this discussion.

Kosh

11-26-2007, 10:50 AM

Mookyjooky

11-26-2007, 10:56 AM

I just dont understand how having ads in your cast makes you lack "Class"

Insulting stuff you didnt even have to pay for is retarded.

SirMikael

11-26-2007, 12:03 PM

Frankly I am shocked that so many CAGs are actively standing in my way, much less standing aside and rooting for me or, god forbid, joining me in my efforts to save the CAGcast from these shackles it seems to be so gleefully attaching itself to.
I don't think CAGs are exactly "standing in your way", but instead are perhaps "standing up" for the decision to place short ads in the CAGCast.

Having revenue involved keeps CheapyD and Wombat hungry, and that keeps the podcasts coming, which in the end - is all I care about.

I don't know your age, but it just seems like you haven't fully grasped the concept of "Choose your battles wisely". Just my opinion...

sp00ge

11-26-2007, 12:12 PM

Yvan eht nioj! :roll: This whole "crusade" absolute reeks of Cindy Sheehan.

I say Cheapy should run some birth control ads next and see how much more whining comes of it. Maybe he can get 2 complaints this time.

Justme8800

11-27-2007, 03:36 AM

Have you been to cheapassgamer.com? Not the forums, but the front page of this website. If so, you realize that this is a business, that's right CAG including the CAGcast is a business ran by CheapyD. Take a look at that front page again, see the ads, not just the normal ads, but all the links to buying different games at different sites. Cheapy makes a small commission everytime someone clicks one of those links and buys a game. I'm sure it's not a lot, and I'm sure most of it goes back into the site, but I'm also sure he makes some kind of profit off of them.

I'd like to think he produces the CAGcast out of the bottom of his heart, and for the most part he probably does. However, the CAGcast is part of cheapassgamer.com, therefore a part of Cheapy's business. Is it too much to think that he might put some advertisements in the show. I understand he's giving the money from the ads to a charity, but hey, that's still a possible tax write off so he still could benefit from the ads.

So Cheapy puts time and money into making the CAGcast, now he and Wombat are getting something out of it. I say, good for them. Therefore, I find absolutely no problem with him putting ads into his show. No problem at all. That's my stance on this whole thing. Of course, nothing I've said hasn't been said before, so it's nothing new. You just have a problem listening.

As for why podcasting is so popular, I'm sure less advertising is one of the reasons why. Along with the fact that this particular podcast covers a topic that you can't find very often in other forms of media, ie. TV and Radio. There's also the fact that it's portable and the user can listen at his or her convenience. The last two are my reasons, I could care less about ads.

As far as your crusade against these ads and the supposed "deterioration" of the CAGcast, I have this to say. I think you are pretty naive to think that eventually advertisements wouldn't start coming to this relatively new form of media. Especially a podcast that is part of a business, like the CAGcast is as a part of the cheapassgamer.com business.

So, good luck with your crusade. Why stop at the CAGcast though. 1up has been putting ads in their podcasts as well. Outside of video game podcasts, Ricky Gervais has had ads in his podcasts since the beginning. In fact, when they first came out his podcasts were free, now you have to pay for them. Yes, pay for podcasts, heaven forbid anyone try to make a buck for taking the time and effort to produce entertainment for other people.
That's a little more like it, thanks for laying down your position instead of just taking potshots at mine. Here's why I don't agree with you:

You say CheapAssGamer is primarily a business. I say CheapAssGamer is primarily a community, whose webmaster happens to make some money though affiliate links and banner ads. CAG would be nothing without the CAGs, so that begs the question; If CAG is a business, who does Cheapy consider to be his customers?

This is somewhat of a tangent, but lets find out the answer anyways. The CAGs? Not really, they're just here to support each other. Aside from occasional donations or whatnot, they are, as the site so boldy proclaims, cheap asses. So who else? Oh, right, the advertisers! They're the ones actually paying Cheapy for the CAG eyeballs/ears. That makes us CAGs, what, commodities? You don't find that mildly insulting?

Now, it's one thing for a website to mildly annoy its readers, it's understandably necessary to recoup bandwith and other costs. It's understandable for a TV or radio show to do that. It's quite another thing altogether to do it for its own sake, while blowing off the money saying you don't even need it. No one hears an ad and thinks "now they've got integrity," not even industry insiders. When I hear an ad, I hear the production saying "we are desperate enough to sully our creation with this obnoxious endorsement." What I hear Cheapy saying is more along the lines of "I don't need to do this or anything, I'm just going to rub these all over the shiny CAGcast 'cause I think it needs to look uglier." That is insulting enough to the listener to warrant boycott, and I can't believe I am the only one who feels that way.

How am I naive to feel that sort of insult is unnecessary?

As for 1up or any of those other crapcasts, I'm generally of the opinion that they're not worth listening to even despite the ads. The CAGcast is something good enough that it doesn't need to go that route, and I believe it is worth the effort it's taking to save. Cheapy should be offended that you don't.

I just dont understand how having ads in your cast makes you lack "Class"

Insulting stuff you didnt even have to pay for is retarded.
Insulting one's listeners is retarded.

The "class" thing was wrapped up the instant Cheapy replied to this thread. It had nothing to do with the ads in the first place.

I don't think CAGs are exactly "standing in your way", but instead are perhaps "standing up" for the decision to place short ads in the CAGCast.
Other than semantics, what's the difference there? They are hands still feeding the dog that bit them. They are actively siding with an obligation they feel towards defending the word of Cheapy, no matter what the words say. They are putting up with tripe that does not need putting up with.

There are many ways to analogically describe what they are doing. That's all beside the point that they are doing it.

Having revenue involved keeps CheapyD and Wombat hungry, and that keeps the podcasts coming, which in the end - is all I care about.
If only Cheapy agreed with that. 'Cause, you know, he did say something about "not even needing the money...." This is kind of the issue here.

I don't know your age, but it just seems like you haven't fully grasped the concept of "Choose your battles wisely". Just my opinion...
You mean, only play games you'll win? Maybe one day you'll grasp the concept of a conscience. Cheapy may bring the CAGcast down into whatever ad infested hellhole he likes, but at least I'll be able to sleep soundly knowing that I did everything in my ability to save him.

Yvan eht nioj! :roll: This whole "crusade" absolute reeks of Cindy Sheehan.

I say Cheapy should run some birth control ads next and see how much more whining comes of it. Maybe he can get 2 complaints this time.

Yeah, and most of these replies reek of redneck hillbillies with sawed-off shotguns, saying "we don't like yer kind in these parts."

Now, see how ridiculous that was? Making comparisons to rival Godwin is not helping. I am trying to help Cheapy and the CAGcast, not impeach him.

As for birth control ads, I would be surprised if he could pull that off given the audience represented in this thread, and the unlikelyhood that a significant amount of them are in any danger of procreating. Then again, maybe it would be a good idea to run them just to make sure.

Kosh

11-27-2007, 10:04 AM

You say CheapAssGamer is primarily a business. I say CheapAssGamer is primarily a community, whose webmaster happens to make some money though affiliate links and banner ads. CAG would be nothing without the CAGs, so that begs the question; If CAG is a business, who does Cheapy consider to be his customers?
Yes, the CAGs are his customers. If you've ever clicked on one of the links on the front page and bought something, you are one of his customers. Cheapy was the middleman and he recieved a commission off your purchase. Pretty similar to a salesman really.

This is somewhat of a tangent, but lets find out the answer anyways. The CAGs? Not really, they're just here to support each other. Aside from occasional donations or whatnot, they are, as the site so boldy proclaims, cheap asses. So who else? Oh, right, the advertisers! They're the ones actually paying Cheapy for the CAG eyeballs/ears. That makes us CAGs, what, commodities? You don't find that mildly insulting?
No, I don't. I completely understand my role here. If you find it insulting then you probably shouldn't be at this website, because that's they way it is, it's a fact. I'm not saying that's the number one reason the site was created and I'm not even saying it's the number one reason the site still exists, however it's still a fact that Cheapy makes money off of this website and CAGs.

Now, it's one thing for a website to mildly annoy its readers, it's understandably necessary to recoup bandwith and other costs. It's understandable for a TV or radio show to do that. It's quite another thing altogether to do it for its own sake, while blowing off the money saying you don't even need it.
I know Cheapy said he doesn't need the money. What about Wombat? He's said he'd definitely take the money and I'm sure he does. I'm not sure about Wombat's business relationship as far as cheapassgamer.com goes and making money off the commissions, but he is a part of the CAGcast. Being part of the CAGcast should allow him some sort of compensation and the ads do that.

No one hears an ad and thinks "now they've got integrity," not even industry insiders.
Prove it. Are you an industry insider?

That is insulting enough to the listener to warrant boycott, and I can't believe I am the only one who feels that way.
You're not the only one probably. However, I think you are in the minority and I think that minority is very small.

Cheapy may bring the CAGcast down into whatever ad infested hellhole he likes, but at least I'll be able to sleep soundly knowing that I did everything in my ability to save him.
I think this is where you are running into problems. You've asked in other posts why people have a problem with you and not your message, this is it. You think you're the single handed saviour of the CAGcast. Just like big government, I don't need you to save me from myself and I'm pretty sure Cheapy doesn't need you to save him from his business decisions. If you've seen this site, I think you'd have to agree he makes some pretty good business decisions on his own. If people don't like the ads they will stop listening on their own, they don't need you to save them from the dirty, dirty capitalists.

sp00ge

11-27-2007, 10:25 AM

Yeah, and most of these replies reek of redneck hillbillies with sawed-off shotguns, saying "we don't like yer kind in these parts."

Now, see how ridiculous that was? Making comparisons to rival Godwin is not helping. I am trying to help Cheapy and the CAGcast, not impeach him.

As for birth control ads, I would be surprised if he could pull that off given the audience represented in this thread, and the unlikelyhood that a significant amount of them are in any danger of procreating. Then again, maybe it would be a good idea to run them just to make sure.

How are you trying to help him when you are the only one that has an apparent problem with what he's doing? Sure, other people have said they really don't care for it, but as said, they just ignore it.

Why not give up your crusade and save your energy and efforts for something that really makes a difference, like helping starving families? You sure seem to be putting an awful lot of time into this and for what? Why not actually try to make a difference where it counts?

As far as I'm concerned, you're just a rabble-rouser looking to get a rise out of people. The majority of spoken on the issue and don't agree with you. The same rights that allow you to whine about something frivelous also gives the rest of us the right to disagree and speak our minds.

mikeohara

11-28-2007, 02:34 AM

also, a general FYI for the person who mentioned something about enhanced podcasts ... they also work in Windows Media Player, as at one time Major Nelson was doing them.

I for one don't mind the Navy ads at all, a lot of the podcasts I listen to (TWIT leading the list) has a single commercial before the show.

Chicken008

11-29-2007, 11:35 AM

Well, I live in Canada, so I don't get ads on my CAGcast. :D

Justme8800

12-02-2007, 11:29 PM

I think this is where you are running into problems. You've asked in other posts why people have a problem with you and not your message, this is it. You think you're the single handed saviour of the CAGcast. Just like big government, I don't need you to save me from myself and I'm pretty sure Cheapy doesn't need you to save him from his business decisions. If you've seen this site, I think you'd have to agree he makes some pretty good business decisions on his own. If people don't like the ads they will stop listening on their own, they don't need you to save them from the dirty, dirty capitalists.
*Sigh* I know perfectly well what problems people have with me, that's been fairly well established. What I'm asking is for people to stop focusing on me, and instead on the issue at hand.

I do not think of myself as any kind of savior. Though I'm being made out as some kind of martyr, I don't agree with that either. I'm simply expressing why I am distraught with something that I am reasonably unhappy with. I am not some Jesus-like "savior" telling you what to think, I am telling you what I think.

True, I do harbor the small hope that Cheapy might see these problems with his show, and fix them. I'm not holding my breath, though.

How are you trying to help him when you are the only one that has an apparent problem with what he's doing? Sure, other people have said they really don't care for it, but as said, they just ignore it.
In five years, when CAG is some giant media conglomerate feeding greedily on ad deals, and Wombat gets fired for some less-than-positive opinion on an advertiser's product, I just want you all to know that I ****ing called it.

Why not give up your crusade and save your energy and efforts for something that really makes a difference, like helping starving families? You sure seem to be putting an awful lot of time into this and for what? Why not actually try to make a difference where it counts?
Who instilled this "crusade" idea into your head? I'm putting far more time into this than I ever intended, simply because it's something that needs time put into it. Few others seem to want to go against the will of the conformist masses, and I'm not about to let this scandal fly by uncontested. It needs to be said, and you sure as heck aren't about to say it, are you? Oh wait, you're too busy helping starving families.

As far as I'm concerned, you're just a rabble-rouser looking to get a rise out of people. The majority of spoken on the issue and don't agree with you. The same rights that allow you to whine about something frivelous also gives the rest of us the right to disagree and speak our minds.
If that's really what you think, you don't have to exercise your "right" to take part in this. I shouldn't have to point out that the "majority" is not always correct, especially when it comes to opinion. Are you saying minorities should remain silent because they aren't the majority?

Well, I live in Canada, so I don't get ads on my CAGcast. :D

Really? Sweet, you wouldn't mind sharing that magical XML feed with the rest of us, would you?

~Justme8800

Kosh

12-02-2007, 11:39 PM

In five years, when CAG is some giant media conglomerate feeding greedily on ad deals, and Wombat gets fired for some less-than-positive opinion on an advertiser's product, I just want you all to know that I ****ing called it.

LOL, that's funny stuff. :applause:

PlumeNoir

12-03-2007, 12:40 AM

All this is about less than 2 minutes of ads?

I have gone through this thread, and I still don't quite understand what JustMe's problem is. Do you flip out when you see a billboard as you drive down the street, too?

Besides, Cheapy had a point: the Navy is a prime advertiser. (Oh no! I'm a parrot! Squawk-squawk!) He is trying to build the show, and bring in revenue. It is a good thing you weren't alive during WW2 when there was a Draft and military posters were everywhere. (Hell, even Batman and Superman were used to sell war bonds.) Obviously, I'm not comparing the current clusterfuck to WW2, but the point is the same - it is just an ad, you can ignore it.

Cheapy and Wombat have been doing this, what, 95 episodes with no ads. Add in the preparation time and post-production, and that is a lot of time invested that they have been giving away. (Time is money, afterall.) I, for one, all for seeing Cheapy and (especially) Wombat make some cash for all their efforts. Hell, I could even handle a couple more ads, if they were put into stopsets, ala a radio hour.

And let's look at the CAGcast history: there have been numerous off-color comments and drug references made, but that was all okay? Was it because it was "cool" because it was unsponsered? So, the Navy wants to buy time on the show, let them! I take this as a good thing: the CAGcast has "made it" and advertisers see this as a way to reach people.

There are a lot of problems in this world that could certainly use your attention, rather than focusing on ads, and what they are, played on a podcast.