thelonepig
01-27-2008, 08:36 PM
So I recently purchased a Playstation 3 and needed to pick up a second controller. I don't really care about having the rumble feature at the moment (I'll get a new controller this summer or fall with MGS4), so I went to ebay to find a cheap, new controller.
Long story short, I found a 'make an offer' auction for a brand new PS3 Sixaxis Wireless controller. I made an offer and won the item. The condition is labeled as "New." The auction states "new" in both the item title and item description. The picture is a stock photo of a Sixaxis in the box.
So now I'm waiting for the controller and I figured I'd check out the seller a bit more. They have 100% feedback, so I wasn't worried. Now I am getting a bit leery.
Here's the ebay link to the seller's feedback: LINK (http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=cycleyard&ftab=AllFeedback&myworld=true&seeallfeedback=See%20All%20Feedback)
Since I purchased from them, there has been a feedback posted that the "item did not appear to be new. Was not in package." Whoever this was posted a positive, so I guess it couldn't have been that bad.
However, here's the clincher. If you go through their past purchases, they have an unholy amount of winning bids on broken X360 and PS3 controllers.
What do you all think?
UPDATE (1/29):
I received the controller today through Fedex. I took pictures, thanks to the recommendation of a fellow CAG.
The controller came via Fedex as opposed to the advertised UPS. Not a big deal, but maybe worth noting. The controller was wrapped in bubble wrap and is obviously not "brand new" as touted in the auction description. A USB cable for charging the controller was not included.
I dispatched the following email to the seller this morning and will update with their response.
Thank you for your prompt response earlier regarding the Fedex tracking number for the Playstation 3 controller. I received the item today.
Unfortunately, the item was not "brand new" as described in your listing. It was not in its original packaging, did not instructions, and most importantly did not include the USB charging cable that comes with brand new Sixaxis controllers. Without the cable this item is worthless to me.
I expect a full refund (including shipping costs) as well as an additional amount to be able to ship your "brand new" controller back to you.
Additionally, I find it rather odd that you advertise this item as brand new. As I reviewed your feedback I found that you have purchased a large number of broken controllers. Are you simply repairing these and passing them off as new?
I trust I will hear back from you soon.
No, I don't expect them to comply to my full request. If they do, then they get a good review for customer service. The question is, can I push this whole thing back until the new ebay feedback system kicks in? If so, I can negative all over his butt without any fear of retaliation.
UPDATE (1/29 afternoon):
I've been communicating with the seller regarding the item. I have always hated email and forums because it's difficult to determine emotion. Anyway, I received the following response:
Hi please dont do this the item you have recieved is brand new and please go to the store wright now and ask them if the PS3 controler comes with usb cables and or any thing else in that matter.If you reply and they do i will give you $100.Thats because they dont come with anything exept the controlers.Ill wait till you go to the store and check and reply then we can talk about the rest.THank you
Coincidentally, I did call my local Kmart (just to be a jerk) and was informed that the controller does in fact come with a USB charge cable. I realize that the Kmart rep had no idea what he was talking about, but thought it would be fun. I did not say anything to the seller regarding this, however.
My response was a little more direct on his activities this time:
My apologies regarding the inclusion of the cable. You are absolutely correct. When it didn't come with the controller, I had looked at a few sites online and some stated that it was included while the rest did not have say otherwise. I asked a buddy of mine, which is probably what I should have done in the first place.
I am still a bit upset regarding the open nature of the project. Though you tout it as a brand new item, all evidence points otherwise.
Again, I apologize for my jumping the gun. How would you like to resolve the situation?
See what I did there? I called Ice2Dragon my friend. I hope some day that he will consider me the same :D. Coincidentally, did you get the dualshock and was it new in box?
His response was as follows:
Thats not a problem the controler does not come with anything unfortinatly.Even in any store.The other thing is i buy these whole sale 5 in each package from a suplier so i get a good deal like that.What you saw on my account is i bought them at whole sale like 40 in each auction so im going to sell them one at a time to make money on it.You can even check out my auctions next week and you will see them. So please believe me the controler i have sent you is brand new i mean just look at it please and tell me does it look like its been used or even touched.You can even check my feedback and see that every one is happy about the controlers.Thanks ill wait for your reply.
Seriously? There is nothing in the box aside from the controller? No forms, advertisements, etc.?
Am I interpreting this wrong or did he just state that he buys broken controllers in bulk and then sells them as new?
To which I stated:
If the wholesale auction you are referring to on your account are the same ones I am seeing, those are defective. Each of those auctions describes the product as such.
What it comes down to though is that I am not willing to save $8 over retail price to receive a controller that is not in its package and not backed up with a store return guarantee.
What I am willing to do on my end is charge the controller and see if it works satisfactorily. If so, I will keep it if I can get a partial refund in the amount of $10. If not, I want a full refund plus return shipping as previously mentioned.
Also, I would encourage you to add that this is an open-box item to your item description. I for one would not have purchased from you had I known that beforehand.
What do you all think? The total after shipping was $42. I figured saving $8 was worth waiting a few days. Now I'm wishing I'd just gone to the store and purchased a new one.
Thoughts?
UPDATE (1/30):
Through a series of ebay messages and responses, I think everything has been worked out. The seller agreed to allow me to return the controller and he would refund the full price plus return shipping. Keep in mind this was after many messages and a few "I'll refund you $5 after you give me positive feedback"-style messages.
Funny thing is, once I said that I was going to send the controller back he sent me another message that stated something to the extent of "Fine, if you don't want $5 for nothing. Just send it back." I told him I would send it back and then let him know I wasn't interested in giving him positive feedback for the transaction and that I don't think he should expect any. Yeah, I probably shouldn't have done that, but I didn't want to send everything back and then be stuck with a "I'll refund you after you give me positive feedback" situation.
I received the following message shortly thereafter:
Thats fine.You dont seem to not want the $10 refund.I dont know if you noticed but the auction does not describe that the item is in sealed package smart one. All it states is that the item is brand new and it is.And if you are so smart next time you buy an item dont expect gold.The item dont come with what ever you want them to come with. Like USB and INSTRUCTION.
I responded in like:
Stating the item is brand new AND including a stock picture of a Sixaxis controller in a sealed package is enough per ebay and PayPal to file a claim. I contacted both groups regarding the situation to find out their stance in case it came to this. Nothing has been filed at this point, but just so you know.
When I purchase an item I expect to receive what is described in conjunction with what is shown. I would say that 100% of ebay buyers would agree with that statement.
The USB and paperwork were completely my fault. I assumed, based on information I found from online stores and forums. I apologized (and continue to do so) for my lack of understanding in that aspect.
Your previous message indicated a $5 refund in exchange for positive feedback. Nothing was mentioned regarding a $10 refund. As that was one of the options I originally provided, I would be willing to go that route.
Yeah. There are a lot of things I should have done differently. I hate debating/arguing as I typically get flustered and then say things that I shouldn't - usually things that come back to get me later. Still, I think I must have made some good points (or the seller is getting as sick of me as I am of him) as I received another email this morning:
Ok you know what lets stop been kids ill give you the $10 refund.This is the first refund that i would of done if you are intrested let me know.Thanks and im so sorry for acting so childish.
We'll see how this comes through. If it does, I think he has me to a neutral on the feedback scale. I don't plan on leaving any at this point unless he provides me a negative. Should I cut my losses at this point or should I report him to the ebay Trust and Safety team?
Update (2/2/08):
After 3 days with no response, I messaged the seller regarding the refund. They had forgotten "which one" I was and asked for my email. Luckily, they processed the refund immediately.
Upon receiving the refund, I reported the seller to the ebay trust and safety team.
Update (2/5/08):
I just received notification from the ebay trust & safety team today that the seller was closed down.
Give it up for the little guy!
Long story short, I found a 'make an offer' auction for a brand new PS3 Sixaxis Wireless controller. I made an offer and won the item. The condition is labeled as "New." The auction states "new" in both the item title and item description. The picture is a stock photo of a Sixaxis in the box.
So now I'm waiting for the controller and I figured I'd check out the seller a bit more. They have 100% feedback, so I wasn't worried. Now I am getting a bit leery.
Here's the ebay link to the seller's feedback: LINK (http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=cycleyard&ftab=AllFeedback&myworld=true&seeallfeedback=See%20All%20Feedback)
Since I purchased from them, there has been a feedback posted that the "item did not appear to be new. Was not in package." Whoever this was posted a positive, so I guess it couldn't have been that bad.
However, here's the clincher. If you go through their past purchases, they have an unholy amount of winning bids on broken X360 and PS3 controllers.
What do you all think?
UPDATE (1/29):
I received the controller today through Fedex. I took pictures, thanks to the recommendation of a fellow CAG.
The controller came via Fedex as opposed to the advertised UPS. Not a big deal, but maybe worth noting. The controller was wrapped in bubble wrap and is obviously not "brand new" as touted in the auction description. A USB cable for charging the controller was not included.
I dispatched the following email to the seller this morning and will update with their response.
Thank you for your prompt response earlier regarding the Fedex tracking number for the Playstation 3 controller. I received the item today.
Unfortunately, the item was not "brand new" as described in your listing. It was not in its original packaging, did not instructions, and most importantly did not include the USB charging cable that comes with brand new Sixaxis controllers. Without the cable this item is worthless to me.
I expect a full refund (including shipping costs) as well as an additional amount to be able to ship your "brand new" controller back to you.
Additionally, I find it rather odd that you advertise this item as brand new. As I reviewed your feedback I found that you have purchased a large number of broken controllers. Are you simply repairing these and passing them off as new?
I trust I will hear back from you soon.
No, I don't expect them to comply to my full request. If they do, then they get a good review for customer service. The question is, can I push this whole thing back until the new ebay feedback system kicks in? If so, I can negative all over his butt without any fear of retaliation.
UPDATE (1/29 afternoon):
I've been communicating with the seller regarding the item. I have always hated email and forums because it's difficult to determine emotion. Anyway, I received the following response:
Hi please dont do this the item you have recieved is brand new and please go to the store wright now and ask them if the PS3 controler comes with usb cables and or any thing else in that matter.If you reply and they do i will give you $100.Thats because they dont come with anything exept the controlers.Ill wait till you go to the store and check and reply then we can talk about the rest.THank you
Coincidentally, I did call my local Kmart (just to be a jerk) and was informed that the controller does in fact come with a USB charge cable. I realize that the Kmart rep had no idea what he was talking about, but thought it would be fun. I did not say anything to the seller regarding this, however.
My response was a little more direct on his activities this time:
My apologies regarding the inclusion of the cable. You are absolutely correct. When it didn't come with the controller, I had looked at a few sites online and some stated that it was included while the rest did not have say otherwise. I asked a buddy of mine, which is probably what I should have done in the first place.
I am still a bit upset regarding the open nature of the project. Though you tout it as a brand new item, all evidence points otherwise.
Again, I apologize for my jumping the gun. How would you like to resolve the situation?
See what I did there? I called Ice2Dragon my friend. I hope some day that he will consider me the same :D. Coincidentally, did you get the dualshock and was it new in box?
His response was as follows:
Thats not a problem the controler does not come with anything unfortinatly.Even in any store.The other thing is i buy these whole sale 5 in each package from a suplier so i get a good deal like that.What you saw on my account is i bought them at whole sale like 40 in each auction so im going to sell them one at a time to make money on it.You can even check out my auctions next week and you will see them. So please believe me the controler i have sent you is brand new i mean just look at it please and tell me does it look like its been used or even touched.You can even check my feedback and see that every one is happy about the controlers.Thanks ill wait for your reply.
Seriously? There is nothing in the box aside from the controller? No forms, advertisements, etc.?
Am I interpreting this wrong or did he just state that he buys broken controllers in bulk and then sells them as new?
To which I stated:
If the wholesale auction you are referring to on your account are the same ones I am seeing, those are defective. Each of those auctions describes the product as such.
What it comes down to though is that I am not willing to save $8 over retail price to receive a controller that is not in its package and not backed up with a store return guarantee.
What I am willing to do on my end is charge the controller and see if it works satisfactorily. If so, I will keep it if I can get a partial refund in the amount of $10. If not, I want a full refund plus return shipping as previously mentioned.
Also, I would encourage you to add that this is an open-box item to your item description. I for one would not have purchased from you had I known that beforehand.
What do you all think? The total after shipping was $42. I figured saving $8 was worth waiting a few days. Now I'm wishing I'd just gone to the store and purchased a new one.
Thoughts?
UPDATE (1/30):
Through a series of ebay messages and responses, I think everything has been worked out. The seller agreed to allow me to return the controller and he would refund the full price plus return shipping. Keep in mind this was after many messages and a few "I'll refund you $5 after you give me positive feedback"-style messages.
Funny thing is, once I said that I was going to send the controller back he sent me another message that stated something to the extent of "Fine, if you don't want $5 for nothing. Just send it back." I told him I would send it back and then let him know I wasn't interested in giving him positive feedback for the transaction and that I don't think he should expect any. Yeah, I probably shouldn't have done that, but I didn't want to send everything back and then be stuck with a "I'll refund you after you give me positive feedback" situation.
I received the following message shortly thereafter:
Thats fine.You dont seem to not want the $10 refund.I dont know if you noticed but the auction does not describe that the item is in sealed package smart one. All it states is that the item is brand new and it is.And if you are so smart next time you buy an item dont expect gold.The item dont come with what ever you want them to come with. Like USB and INSTRUCTION.
I responded in like:
Stating the item is brand new AND including a stock picture of a Sixaxis controller in a sealed package is enough per ebay and PayPal to file a claim. I contacted both groups regarding the situation to find out their stance in case it came to this. Nothing has been filed at this point, but just so you know.
When I purchase an item I expect to receive what is described in conjunction with what is shown. I would say that 100% of ebay buyers would agree with that statement.
The USB and paperwork were completely my fault. I assumed, based on information I found from online stores and forums. I apologized (and continue to do so) for my lack of understanding in that aspect.
Your previous message indicated a $5 refund in exchange for positive feedback. Nothing was mentioned regarding a $10 refund. As that was one of the options I originally provided, I would be willing to go that route.
Yeah. There are a lot of things I should have done differently. I hate debating/arguing as I typically get flustered and then say things that I shouldn't - usually things that come back to get me later. Still, I think I must have made some good points (or the seller is getting as sick of me as I am of him) as I received another email this morning:
Ok you know what lets stop been kids ill give you the $10 refund.This is the first refund that i would of done if you are intrested let me know.Thanks and im so sorry for acting so childish.
We'll see how this comes through. If it does, I think he has me to a neutral on the feedback scale. I don't plan on leaving any at this point unless he provides me a negative. Should I cut my losses at this point or should I report him to the ebay Trust and Safety team?
Update (2/2/08):
After 3 days with no response, I messaged the seller regarding the refund. They had forgotten "which one" I was and asked for my email. Luckily, they processed the refund immediately.
Upon receiving the refund, I reported the seller to the ebay trust and safety team.
Update (2/5/08):
I just received notification from the ebay trust & safety team today that the seller was closed down.
Give it up for the little guy!