Team Fortress 2 Discussion Thread

[Scorch]

I went black and played some good ole' TFC today.. TF2 can't hold a candle to the original. I do like TF2, though.. just not as much as I like TFC with its conc jumps and grenades.. so much fun.

[crystalklear64]

I went black and played some good ole' TFC today.. TF2 can't hold a candle to the original. I do like TF2, though.. just not as much as I like TFC with its conc jumps and grenades.. so much fun.
While I can understand what you mean, I have to disagree.

TF2 just has so much more personality. TF really did just feel like a mod. TF2 feels like a full fledged game and to me a large part of that is the polish.

Going back and trying to play TFC today without having the nostalgic ties and fond memories just makes TF2 seem all the better by comparison.

[Serik]

I played TFC frequently for almost 7 years. Once TF2 hit, I haven't had the urge to go back.

But TFC Dustbowl with two good teams is much better than TF2's Dustbowl. Fun times.

[eswat]

Oh TFC Dustbowl. How I won't miss your second and third sections only having one opening for Blu to start, which would get nade/pipebomb/detpack/sentry-spammed to oblivion.

[SOSTrooper]

Oh TFC Dustbowl. How I won't miss your second and third sections only having one opening for Blu to start, which would get nade/pipebomb/detpack/sentry-spammed to oblivion.

haha I remember that.... all the mirvs, nail grenades, and concs at that choke pt.

[Sporadic]

Meet The Spy and the achievements are officially up

http://www.teamfortress.com/spyupdate/

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/4341/efc877114e97a3b050a41ce.jpg

:)

[Nohbdy]

The alert board is full of laughs itself:

RED PYRO
IS A MAN
IS A WOMAN
FOUND DRACULA
LOST DRACULA

[KingBroly]

So...what are the 3rd unlocks for both?

Some more big board notes:

Needs roommate
Jarate
Needs a Ride
Smells
Defenstrated

[eswat]

http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2515
http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2516
http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2518
http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2519

Robin Walker wins Intarweb Entertainer of the Month.

[Brak]

I can't wait any longer.

[Kaijufan]

It's going to take forever to get the next TF2 class update now that Robin's the only Valve employee, not to mention Half Life 2 Episode 3 and Portal 2. :cry:

[Salamando3000]

It's going to take forever to get the next TF2 class update now that Robin's the only Valve employee, not to mention Half Life 2 Episode 3 and Portal 2. :cry:

As if Episode 3 hasn't been taking forever.

Also, I lol'd at the "Leaked Video" alarm board entry.

[Kaijufan]

As if Episode 3 hasn't been taking forever.

Now it's going to take longer then Duke Nukem forever.

[Flak]

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/5881/announcerboard.png

Full version of the alert board. My first combo?

Red Heavy on toilet needs backup!!

[KingBroly]

I wonder if Valve will change the name of Half-Life 2: Episode 3 to Duke Nukem Forever just so it doesn't take that long to say.

Also...I just noticed that the big board says Red Spy twice. Lazy, lazy Valve

[carpwrist]

I couldn't help but notice on the board, "Leaked Video", "Is Fired", and "Stole Car"....
Looks like this situation was actually all planned out ahead of time.

[Serik]

The Big Board should be included in a new map. It's my favorite part of an awesome video.

Also: Team Fortress: The Movie would be amazing

[Kaijufan]

I couldn't help but notice on the board, "Leaked Video", "Is Fired", and "Stole Car"....
Looks like this situation was actually all planned out ahead of time.
I really doubt it took Valve very long to change a few of the things on the big board and re-render the video.

[Sporadic]

A cool weapon upgrade would be a knive where as soon as you backstab somebody, you disguise as them.

Would be nice for getaways and getting camping engineers.

[crystalklear64]

i want a knife that is supposed to facestab, but you can still backstab... sometimes

[eswat]

I couldn't help but notice on the board, "Leaked Video", "Is Fired", and "Stole Car"....
Looks like this situation was actually all planned out ahead of time.Even though the leaked videos weren't in HD, you can tell the spot where "Leaked video" was in had different words in the leaked version.

i want a knife that is supposed to facestab, but you can still backstab... sometimes
I thought everyone knew how to backstab people in the face by now. :-s

[Hydro2Oxide]

Have you all been keeping up with Robins exploits of authority? (http://teamfortress.com/)

That stuff is hilarious.

[eswat]

Looks like the Spy gets a Rail Gun! (http://www.teamfortress.com/spyupdate/)

OK, not really, but it's close enough for me. The Revolver is pretty damn good at picking people off at a distance, but this makes it even better.

[Hydro2Oxide]

This sounds awesome. Loving this update so far, nothing sounds crappy.

[Kaijufan]

Looks like the Spy gets a Rail Gun! (http://www.teamfortress.com/spyupdate/)

OK, not really, but it's close enough for me. The Revolver is pretty damn good at picking people off at a distance, but this makes it even better.
Looks more like a hand cannon to me.

[Nohbdy]

Damn right it's a cannon.

[KingBroly]

The detail on the barrel is a nice callback to the video.

[Torque]

[The Live Arena] is looking for Team Fortress 2 staff and clan members - Anybody interested contact the person below or PM me




Divinus Interactive / The Live Arena
is a new Tournament League organization.

We have recently started a new Team Fortress 2 league. For the time being, we have been recruiting staff members to help lead our tournaments. We are also looking for [TLA] CLAN MEMBERS to populate our servers and participate in future clan matches.

To apply for a STAFF position:
Email the following information to: r.jow@thelivearena.com
OR
Message: unlimiteddenk on STEAM



All qualifications for this job
Why YOU think you would do well for this job
What could you bring to The Live Arena
Leave Contact Information
Avaliable Hours

To apply for a CLAN position:
Email the following information to: r.jow@thelivearena.com
OR
Message: unlimiteddenk on STEAM
OR
Post here:



All qualifications for clanship
Information on yourself
Maturity Level
Contact Information
Skill Level

Thank you.
We hope you apply!

[Nohbdy]

Jarate is real.

I repeat, Jarate is real.

[KingBroly]

Yeah...I'm looking at it right now.

[judyjudyjudy]

No matter how many times I refresh, I can't get the stupid screen. From the Steam forums:
http://i42.tinypic.com/29y48eu.jpg

As much as I don't like snipers, I'm still hoping there's something more substantial than just a jar of pee.

[Sporadic]

Ha, it's up

http://www.teamfortress.com/sniper_vs_spy/

[Nohbdy]

I want to reflect Crit Jarates. :D

[darthbudge]

:lol:

I like the "Not a Crazed Gunman, Dad:" achievement. I wonder what exactly it will entail.

[Nohbdy]

Everyone will only be playing Gold Rush tomorrow.

[Torque]

anybody interested? in joining TLA? Staff positions [mods and such] are needed. Hit me up if ur interested

[DukeEdwardI]

I'm just throwing this out. I'm guessing the Jar of Pee is a real unlockable.

Congratulations are in order for you sir. Great unlock! Although I was kinda hoping for a boomerang. But it'll be hilarious to see people running around soaked in piss.

[crystalklear64]

ugh.

[Mr. Anderson]

This update is gonna be sweet.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Little disappointed with the pee jar but at least C&D and the bow are (likely) going to be awesome. Not to mention double payload sounds like a blast.

[Flak]

The piss jar makes me glad I can't load the game without it crashing at the main menu. Valve seems to be putting more effort and creativity into their blog posts than the game. They really never should have gotten into unlockable weapons, I miss plain vanilla TF2 so much.

[Hydro2Oxide]

The piss jar makes me glad I can't load the game without it crashing at the main menu. Valve seems to be putting more effort and creativity into their blog posts than the game. They really never should have gotten into unlockable weapons, I miss plain vanilla TF2 so much.

Well they started off strong, medic was 100% kick ass, I liked the Heavy though the sandwich was too situational and I use all the pyros weapons regularly (Not so much backburner but it has it's uses)

From there it's gone down hill, but as I said all the spy things look pretty cool and the Huntsman looks sweet.

[Brak]

The piss jar makes me glad I can't load the game without it crashing at the main menu. Valve seems to be putting more effort and creativity into their blog posts than the game. They really never should have gotten into unlockable weapons, I miss plain vanilla TF2 so much.
Outrageous.

[Nelo Ice]

update is online!
Updates to Team Fortress 2 have been released. The updates will be applied automatically when your Steam client is restarted. The specific changes include:

Maps



Added new map, Pipeline. Pipeline is the first map in a new game mode named payload race, which uses two carts in each map instead of only one like traditional payload maps
Added new arena map Sawmill
Added new arena map Nucleus
Added new community payload map Hoodoo


Sniper Changes


Added new sniper rifle replacement, The Huntsman. Instead of a sniper rifle, you have a bow that allows you to move around faster while firing, and fire more quickly than the sniper rifle. Works better at medium range than the standard rifle
Added new SMG replacement, Jarate. If thrown on an enemy they will take more damage for short period of time. Also extinguishes flames on yourself or allies
Added new SMG replacement, The Razorback. Will protect you against a single spy backstab, and stun the spy for a short period of time. Comes with a 15% move speed penalty for the wearer
Standard sniper rifle now shoots through friendly players
Added 54 new Sniper voice lines
Added 35 new Sniper achievements


Spy


Added new revolver replacement, The Ambassador. First shot is very accurate and will cause a critical hit if it hits an enemy's head. Accuracy is poor for a period after that
Added new watch replacement, the Dead Ringer. When armed, you will appear in all ways to die to the first damage you take from an enemy. You'll be cloaked for 8 second after taking this damage. Upon de-cloaking you'll make a loud, distinct sound
Added new watch replacement, the Cloak and Dagger. Your cloak meter is only depleted when you move, so you can stay invisible indefinitely if you're standing still
Spy name tags now show up properly when disguised as their own team
Fixed a bug that would cause spectators to see disguise weapons incorrectly
Fixed a bug where enemy spies disguised as friendly spies would have cigarettes that didn't burn
Fixed a bug where overhealing disguised spies would show the wrong overhealing amount to the medic
Made it more obvious on first person view model when your motion cloak is out of juice and you are partially visible
Also made it more obvious on first person view model when you're bumped while cloaked
Improved the way your disguise weapon is determined to make it clearer and fix a couple of rare issues
Spies disguised as enemy spies now get a random mask to help complete the disguise, and their target id will be set appropriately
Spies disguised as medics now have an Ubercharge: line in their disguise target info
Spies outward facing "disguise health" now matches their disguise target when they first apply the disguise
Spies can now pick up health kits for their "disguise health", even when uninjured
Disguise UI doesn't show up in minimum UI mode (hud_minmode)
Spies that disguise as a player using an unlockable now show that unlockable in hand
Spies can now use enemy teleporters
Added 70 new Spy voice lines
Added 34 new Spy achievements


Scoreboard changes


Dominations no longer get wiped when teams switch sides
Dead players draw slightly darker in scoreboard
Converted class labels to class icons
All players now display the total number of people they are dominating


General


Fixed a bug that would cause the scout's ball to regenerate at inappropriate times
Demomen can now detonate their stickies while taunting
Flamethrower's air burst now extinguishes fire on friendly targets
Grenades and rockets deflected by a pyro under the effects of Kritzkrieg will now be criticals
The Heavy and Sniper now have new custom death animations
Fixed payload HUD not updating properly if you join in the middle of a match and the cart isn't moving
Engineer's dispensers now give 20%, 30%, or 40% of player's max_ammo (for each ammo type) on each use, based on the level of the dispenser
Added -sillygibs commandline parameter which will allow the non-violent gibs to be enabled
Added a new taunt for the Kritzkrieg, which also heals for 10 points
Improved the deathcam camera handling used when a player plays a custom death animation

[judyjudyjudy]

Spy disguise improvements make me QQ.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Oh god, this is awesome. It's a damn shame I won't get to play it until Sunday night.

[crystalklear64]

not being able to play sucks.

servers must be getting raped

[carpwrist]

not being able to play sucks.

servers must be getting raped

They are. My update has peaked at 138KB/s and has dipped as low as 9KB/s.
This is like watching bamboo grow... through your body. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhPbMpYkBHA

[Kaijufan]

I played a couple of games on Pipeline and Hoodoo but I lost connection from the VAC server 3 different times (with the second and third times being about 4-5 minutes apart) so I gave up for a little while.

Also, pictures of the hats:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=15952096&postcount=1393

[eswat]

This drop system is fucking stupid.

[BlueLobstah]

This drop system is fucking stupid.


I can't quite figure it out. I randomly got the Sandman by running around before the match even started on Gravelpit.

[eswat]

I was just standing around my spawn on 2fort and I unlocked the Backburner I already had.

This isn't even a drop system. It's just some stupid dice roll that gives you a random weapon every now and then. Lame Valve. Very lame.

[Sporadic]

The unlock system is fucking stupid.

I can't believe Valve came up with a worst system than the achievement system. At least with that I could use an unlocker.

[Salamando3000]

I wish there was at least some way we could control when/what drops. As is, there seems to be absolutely no correlation between what you're doing and getting stuff.

[qwerty1]

did they really care so much that people would farm the new stuff? At least that gave an incentive to actually accomplish achievments, now i could care less about them. I dont see how wandering around and getting a random reward is any better. I've even played 2 hours tonight, completed 15 new achievements in the process, and gotten nothing for my troubles.

The new system is friggan retarded, what the hell were they thinking?

[Sporadic]

The new system is friggan retarded, what the hell were they thinking?

They weren't which has been their skeleton crew's worst problem.

[Nohbdy]

http://sharkey.gamespite.net/forum/index.php?topic=1001.msg82529#msg82529

HATS

[Torque]

[The Live Arena] is looking for Team Fortress 2 staff and clan members - Anybody interested contact the person below or PM me




Divinus Interactive / The Live Arena
is a new Tournament League organization.

We have recently started a new Team Fortress 2 league. For the time being, we have been recruiting staff members to help lead our tournaments. We are also looking for [TLA] CLAN MEMBERS to populate our servers and participate in future clan matches.

To apply for a STAFF position:
Email the following information to: r.jow@thelivearena.com
OR
Message: unlimiteddenk on STEAM



All qualifications for this job
Why YOU think you would do well for this job
What could you bring to The Live Arena
Leave Contact Information
Avaliable Hours

To apply for a CLAN position:
Email the following information to: r.jow@thelivearena.com
OR
Message: unlimiteddenk on STEAM
OR
Post here:



All qualifications for clanship
Information on yourself
Maturity Level
Contact Information
Skill Level

Thank you.
We hope you apply!
Positions still available!

[Sporadic]

Deleted the game.

I'm done with it.

[crystalklear64]

holy shit this drop thing blows

when i finally did get into the game, i've played for about 5 hours straight.

I got a blutsager, and not even for doing anything.

I think you could seriously just sit afk in a server and get items.

However, it was nice being able to be a medic and dominate every single game. With so many people to heal and no one else wanting to do it and so many easy spy kills, who could resist?

[Salamando3000]

I'm hoping there's something else to this system besides just randomness. Word is they're going to do a blog post about it tomorrow to help explain it. I just know that, currently, I seem to get a drop every 2 hours of gameplay or so. Given 18 total unlockable weapons, the math to unlock the 6 i actually want isn't too comforting.

[eswat]

I think you could seriously just sit afk in a server and get items.I got my 2nd backburner while I was alt-tabbed out of the game last night.

[darthbudge]

Woah Woah Woah Woah.

So they added in the drop system already? Is that the only way to get the Sniper and Spy unlocks? Or can you still get them via the old fashioned achievement method?

[Salamando3000]

Yes, the "drop" system is implemented. Yes, it is the only way to get the Sniper and Spy unlocks. The sniper/spy achievements will never reward you weaponry for the assorted milestones, nor do they seem to help skew the randomness any way.

And by "drop" system, it's not really fair to call it that. You can get a drop by just entering a game and standing around a spawn point - before you even have a chance to kill anything. You can, and probably will, pick up repeats of stuff you already have.

As for hats, the models are in-game, but I've yet to see anyone with one/get one/wear one.

[darthbudge]

Yes, the "drop" system is implemented. Yes, it is the only way to get the Sniper and Spy unlocks. The sniper/spy achievements will never reward you weaponry for the assorted milestones, nor do they seem to help skew the randomness any way.

And by "drop" system, it's not really fair to call it that. You can get a drop by just entering a game and standing around a spawn point - before you even have a chance to kill anything. You can, and probably will, pick up repeats of stuff you already have.

As for hats, the models are in-game, but I've yet to see anyone with one/get one/wear one.

Damn. I hate to sound like one of those people. (You know the ones that spend way too much time on the Steam forums and bitch about everything.) But I think that Valve really screwed it up this time.

[itachiitachi]

Damn. I hate to sound like one of those people. (You know the ones that spend way too much time on the Steam forums and bitch about everything.) But I think that Valve really screwed it up this time.
Ya, Someone on my server said that got a drop while spectating. I don't mind them decoupling the items from achievements, but it plain stupid to give users no control over getting items.

[Mr. Anderson]

Is the update completely automatic? Whenever I try to get into a game now (on any map), it tells me the server is enforcing something that needs "particles/water_dx80" or something similar. What the hell is going on?!

[Sporadic]

Is the update completely automatic? Whenever I try to get into a game now (on any map), it tells me the server is enforcing something that needs "particles/water_dx80" or something similar. What the hell is going on?!

The server hasn't restarted since the update has been released.

[Kaijufan]

It seems to me that the item drop system is glitched right now, I doubt Valve intended people to just randomly get items for doing nothing, or to get multiple copies of items.

[Hydro2Oxide]

While I'm all for getting updates out ASAP, I doubt they tested this on any beta testers or themselves. It seems totally borked.

[Mr. Anderson]

The server hasn't restarted since the update has been released.

No servers have restarted since the update? That error message happens on every single server I've tried to join, and in fact, since it updated, TF2 keeps getting a fatal Windows message everytime I start it up. It didn't that before.

I even completely un- and re-installed to no avail.

What is your fucking problem, Valve!

[Admiral Ackbar]

They should make unlockables on class experience then. Like, achievements but not achievements. Lieks ay, get 10 points in one life as a medic or something like that. or rack up a number or hours. Or so many kills, etc.

[Nohbdy]

Just give them out for fuck's sake.

[crystalklear64]

suggestion on steam forums for you mr. anderson:

Update not Working? Heres a Fix!
When the update launched last night, It updated my TF2. I went ingame, but no new achieves were showing and I could not join any servers.
After going into game properties/local files/ then clicking verify cache files it started updating again. After doing this 4 times it finally worked, and I was able to play.
So if you have this problem, just verify your game files and start a new update and it should work after a few tries. Another problem I had is starting TF2 again later caused a whole new update, and after it was finished I was unable to play again. Another verify and update and it was fixed... this time I am turning off automatic updating when it has a "good" update.
Its an ugly fix, but a fix none the less, let me know if this works for you!

Edit: looks like it will STILL try and update you again, so after you have a "good" update, and you exit out of tf2 it will begin updating again, you need to pause that update and leave it like that.
Last edited by EviLDeAthMaN : Today at 10:27 AM.

[guardian_owl]

Yep, between the clusterfuck of support for Left 4 Dead (the whole damn game still isn't released 6 months later, waiting on the SDK) and now this lotto method to obtain guns ensuring after hours of playing I MAY get ONE of the new weapons, its been a long ass time since I've been so mad at a game developer, and I never thought it would be Valve.

[SOSTrooper]

I think I might be the only one that actually likes the new random weapon drop system. Since I don't normally play classes other than soldier and demoman, and since I don't like to spend hours to get achievements to unlock weapons (the legit way, so to speak), I welcome the random drop. But as someone had said, they might as well just have all weapons, new and old, available to everyone right after the update.

[judyjudyjudy]

I don't get why they can't do both systems (random and achievement) at the same time. The random system is alright for me, since I only play a couple classes ever. But for people like my buddy who mainly plays spy and played 8 hours yesterday only to get 0 drops, the new system really blows.

[Kaijufan]

Robin Walker said today (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2009/05/22/the-tf2-unlock-teacup-storm/) that the random unlock system has some bugs in it right now and the way it should work is that items are pretty common and hats being a rare unlock.

[Mr. Anderson]

solution

Thanks, I'll try this when I get home. Seems like the same problem I had, so it will probably work. :D

[Nelo Ice]

http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2535


Why did we build a new system?



With our first four class updates we were tying the new weapons for each class to a set of achievements. Our intention was to make a set of achievements that eventually all players would get, and would be fun to get along the way. In some cases we did a good job at this (Scout), and in some cases we did a bad one (Medic). Across all of the class packs we were disappointed in the number of people that got to play with the new weapons, and feedback from the community was generally not favorable with this approach.


What did we do?



For the last number of months we've been working on using the Steam Cloud to store a player's inventory. With that finally in place, we were able to deploy a new system focused on the giving of items to players. That new system watches the amount of time that players are playing TF2, and gives them a chance to find items at regular intervals. They aren't guaranteed to get the item at those points, but they have a pretty good chance. We based the system on granting items on the amount of time played because we don't want players to have to do weird things like join achievement grinding servers to get new content. Basing it off time also has the benefit of ensuring that if you play a lot of TF2, you're going to get more items than players who don't.

How long do I have to play to get an item?



When we were tuning this system we first looked at the average amount of time that players spend playing TF2 daily. From there, we set the goal of most players having around 20 items in their inventory after a couple of weeks of play. If you're someone who plays a lot of TF2, you're going to get items a lot faster than that. In the first few hours after the release yesterday, we had some issues that prevented the system from working properly, so that timeframe was not indicative of the system as it's designed.

Is this the way we'll find items from now on?



Like everything else we build, we'll be iterating on this system for a while, and have a lot of features planned. Some of the next things we have planned are:

- Item trading. This is why you're finding duplicates.

- Giving players a method to influence the system so they can work directly toward getting specific items.

- Adding more rare items like the hats.

We're going to be working on and rolling these out while we're also working on the next class pack, with the goal being to get it all released before then.

[crystalklear64]

Thanks, I'll try this when I get home. Seems like the same problem I had, so it will probably work. :D
I have just started getting the water particle error after playing just fine for hours upon hours.

[crystalklear64]

guide to making your own server for achievements weapon unlocks when you're sleeping or working or whatever:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbchKON-4xY


Basically.

create a server from the main menu, use 2fort, set map time super high.

open console

sv_lan 0
sv_password yourpassword
sv_pure 1
changelevel ctf_2fort

when you load in, open the console again and make sure it says the connection to steam was successful and that VAC secure mode is active. also that sv_pure = 1.

[shinryuu]

Payload race is awesome. Need a good balance of classes to win.

[eswat]

Crap, I forgot all about Payload Race. Got to try that later today.

Finally managed to get a new unlock last night, the Dead Ringer. Fun as Hell to use. Nothing like seeing a Heavy "kill" you with one bullet, then go nuts shooting everywhere wondering where you ran off to. :D

[Sinistar]

I don't get the payload race layout - on some maps do the carts run alongside each other and others they go towards each other? I didn't play that long last night so i didn't notice.

Also can someone confirm or deny when you are a medic and you kritzkreig a soldier or demo, does the creig do extra damage to engy suff or just normal?

And yeah the seemingly "random" unlocks is weird.. Though I wanna check out some of the spiffy new hats..

[Retro Bros.]

I have just started getting the water particle error after playing just fine for hours upon hours.
The water particle error is a server-side error. It means the server just hasn't updated and installed the hotfix that came out after the patch. :)
If it's on of your favourite servers, give it some time or send the owner a message. It should be resolved shortly.

As for the new system, I think people should just CALM DOWN! :hot: -> :cold: and give them a chance to resolve the bugs.

[Nohbdy]

I don't get the payload race layout - on some maps do the carts run alongside each other and others they go towards each other? I didn't play that long last night so i didn't notice.

Also can someone confirm or deny when you are a medic and you kritzkreig a soldier or demo, does the creig do extra damage to engy suff or just normal?

And yeah the seemingly "random" unlocks is weird.. Though I wanna check out some of the spiffy new hats..

There are three stages, just like Dustbowl and Gold Rush. Winners of the previous round get to start their cart further along the track.

The final stage is only when the carts run parallel. Also, the round starts immediately here. It's very hectic.

[soccerstud652]

I have played for about 4 hours yesterday and today and have yet to receive anything.

[qwerty1]

I have played for about 4 hours yesterday and today and have yet to receive anything.

Its apparently bugged. In about 12 hours of combined playing and idling time i've gotten 2 duplicates. If you arent in a horrid rush the best bet would be to wait until they fix this disaster, which im sure we'll see next week.

Plus at least one of the items, the Ambassador, is bugged causing it to be weaker than the normal hand gun and it cant damage buildings or objects [sticky bombs].

Suffice it to say this entire update has been very un-valve like. No polish at all.

The new maps suck too in my opinion. Entirely too hectic and rely too heavily on cooperation. Usually most of my team is camping attempting to pad their stats which = fail.

Wish they would add a classic like jailbreak

[Sporadic]

I figured I was overreacting to the new system and decided to give it another try.

First hour, Ambassador
Next 2 hours, Force-A-Nature (twice over a five minute period)
Next hour, nothing

Nope, new system is as stupid as I thought it was.

[Mr. Anderson]

I haven't been able to even start TF2 ONCE this weekend. Keeps telling me the Steam servers are too busy.

This is that last time I'll buy anything off Steam, Valve. I bought the game, I should be able to fucking play it.

[Flak]

Is there a way of booting TF2 with default settings? I tried getting back into the game recently but it keeps crashing at the menu on me and I can't be arsed to redownload the whole thing.

[thespamofpower]

I haven't been able to even start TF2 ONCE this weekend. Keeps telling me the Steam servers are too busy.

This is that last time I'll buy anything off Steam, Valve. I bought the game, I should be able to fucking play it.
I've connected several times to steam this weekend. It sounds to me like its on your end. Do you happen to have peerguardian on?


Is there a way of booting TF2 with default settings? I tried getting back into the game recently but it keeps crashing at the menu on me and I can't be arsed to redownload the whole thing.
From the games tab on steam, right click on TF2 and select properties -> general -> launch options. and then type in "-autoconfig" (no quotes).

[Flak]

Thanks for the tip, works fine now. Wish the game were still as fun as when I started though. Still wishing they just balanced out the core package and came up with a zillion new maps.

[Sir_Fragalot]

Ugh I afk'd on my own server for an hour today and not even one item. This is going to take forever (thinks of bad times with wow, lol) :bomb:

[Salamando3000]

The entire drop system is borked right now. From what I can gather, we're supposed to get Weapon drops much more frequently than we are, and getting hats with the frequency we're currently getting weapons. Overall, I'm kinda disappointed with their solution to their "problem". When people have no control over getting these new toys....and when the most efficient method to get them is to actually afk, there's an even bigger problem.

[Nelo Ice]

what has everyone gotten so far?
for like 14.2 hours of playtime ive gotten 1 bonk(deleted) a fan kgb 2 huntsman razorback jarate and a dead ringer

when they implement trading it should be easy getting rid of my extra huntsman for a cloak and dagger or ambassador 8-)

[soccerstud652]

I have received:

The Ambassador (x1)
The Flare Gun (x1)
The Killing Gloves of Boxing (x1)
The Sandwich (x1)
The Razorback (x1)
Bonk! Atomic Punch (x2)
The Kritzkrieg (x1)

We should all keep an updated inventory, this way, when the trading system goes live, we can pick up everything we are missing easily.

[KingDox]

anyone have any idea why they didn't base the unlocks on total kills/rounds played/ rounds won? They had to know people would be just be afk to get the unlocks if it was based on total time played.

[qwerty1]

about 12 hours

2x Force of Nature
1x Back Burner
1x Flare Gun

all duplicates


Also i dont think the trade system is going to work quite like people expect. If it did it would surely be a wasted effort. Think about how inundated the game would be, especially if the random item rates actually do get increased.

What i suspect we'll get is a form of a store where we can cash in items for others we actually want. That would actually make sense. Of course this patch didnt exactly make sense itself so who knows.

[carpwrist]

5 hours:
1 Huntsman
1 Flare Gun
1 Sandvich

2 dups, but that new weapon makes up for it. It's making me actually enjoy playing sniper.

[Salamando3000]

so far, i've gotten...
4x Ubersaw
4x Blutsauger
1x Kritskrieg
2x Flare Gun
1x Backburner
1x Natascha
1x Sandvich
1x KGB
1x Sandman
2x the Razorback
2x Jarate
1x Huntsman
1x Dead Ringer
1x Ambassador

And since I had all the pervious unlocks....lots of dupes...

[qwerty1]

i actually need an ubersaw still, it and the new items were the only things i dont have. Of course im not getting one. I used one of those achievment idle servers while i slept, worked but im still being screwed

Update

3 Axtinguisher
4 Back Burner
2 Force Of Nature
1 Killing Gloves of Boxing
2 Flare Gun
1 Cloak and Dagger

Everything in addition to the item i already had save the Cloak and Dagger.

[soccerstud652]

Update:

The Ambassador (x1)
The Flare Gun (x1)
The Killing Gloves of Boxing (x1)
The Sandwich (x1)
The Razorback (x1)
Bonk! Atomic Punch (x2)
The Kritzkrieg (x1)
Natascha (x1)

Add me on steam:
MGD_Hunterr

[shinryuu]

Ambassador x2
Kritz x1
Flare Gun x1
Blut x1
Sandman x1
Backburner x2

Never had the Sandman.. so I guess that makes two unlocks I didn't already have. =p

[judyjudyjudy]

About 8 hours of play since the update and I've gotten:
1x Cloak and Dagger
1x Bonk drink

The only unlocks I had before the update were the medic ones, so I probably won't have dupes for a while (especially at this rate).

[crystalklear64]

For new stuff (stuff I didn't have) I've gotten the razorback, dead ringer, force of nature, and the sandman. Multiple other items have also been found.

This is after almost 60 hours (54) of "play" time.

I am burned out for a long time now which is unfortunate since the quality of gameplay can only go up from here. Hopefully when I decide to play again this item system will be implemented in its entirety and everyone will have so many copies of the new weapons that I'll just get handed them for free.

[Prock]

After playing for about 7 hours, I've gotten:
2x The Killing Gloves of Boxing
1x Kritzkrieg
1x Ubersaw
1x Dead Ringer

All duplicates except for the dead ringer.

[Nohbdy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-k3KaAoyQU8

I wouldn't mind having a Dead Ringer NOW.

It needs a significant nerf though. Having it negate all that damage is a bit too powerful. It needs to force you to go find health for often.

[Kaijufan]

After about 9 hours I've gotten:
2x Sandvich (already had)
1x Bonk (didn't have)
1x Ambassador
1x Axtinguisher (didn't have)

[Serik]

heh, like the spy needs to be any easier to play. Allowing cloak to be recharged by metal was a big mistake. You can stay cloaked indefinitely if you know what you're doing. On Badwater, for example, you don't need to fool anyone to reach RED's teles at the start of the level. Just make a mad dash for ammo cases until you reach the enemy's base, plant sappers on the teles, and repeat.

To be sure, the spy needed something to help him against pyro spam and players easily figuring out disguises, but I don't think fast cloak recharge should be it. As a compromise, the spy should only be able to recharge cloak at spawn lockers and dispensers. At least the latter requires teamwork.

[shinryuu]

Dead Ringer is awesome... not that I have it, but from what I've seen, but, I think people are starting to learn how to counter it already. In the server I play in, everyone was like, "did you hear that noise? spy with dead ringer watch out"

so, I guess it won't be too OP. Huntsman.. that thing is annoying.

[crystalklear64]

dead ringer would be good if it didn't make that sound. but it does.

what i found to be most useful is to simply disguise yourself as a fellow teammate and use it while disguised so they do not suspect a spy in the area at all. they'll just think they killed a demo or pyro or whatever. then when you get cloaked, disguise as whoever you want on their team and let the fun begin, provided they are deaf.

[qwerty1]

People will learn and eventually Dead Ringer wont be near as powerful. I've already begun to continue to search and shoot anytime i kill a spy in a single hit. Its a major give away that they're still around. It also doesnt work against Pyro spam assuming they continue to spam after you've dropped your FD corpse.

dead ringer would be good if it didn't make that sound. but it does.

what i found to be most useful is to simply disguise yourself as a fellow teammate and use it while disguised so they do not suspect a spy in the area at all. they'll just think they killed a demo or pyro or whatever. then when you get cloaked, disguise as whoever you want on their team and let the fun begin, provided they are deaf.

this would work if they dont pay attention to the fact that a spy corpse dropped in place of whatever you were disguised as.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Finally got on the update and to be honest, I totally approve of everything. While the unlock system is pretty fail, I don't see all snipers and spies. You get it while playing any class. Though the obvious better choice would be something like 1/75 chance after every kill so you can do it more actively. The only problem is I'm sitting in a friends server farming them in spectate. Oh well.

Really disappointed with the rainy map, sawmill I think. They claimed lots of environmental deaths and yet all I see are sawblades. Other than that it's pretty solid. Double payload is... well, kind of boring. The last map of the 3 is interesting but other than that I find it to be a deathmatch fest.

Only gotten the C&D so far (2 of them in fact, in addition to the other dupes I have) and I don't really like it. Dead Ringer looks sweet and I hope Ambassador gets another buff after this nerf. Right now it's not a very good choice.

[judyjudyjudy]

this would work if they dont pay attention to the fact that a spy corpse dropped in place of whatever you were disguised as.If you disguise as someone on your own team, your corpse stays as your disguise.

[Nohbdy]

If you disguise as someone on your own team, your corpse stays as your disguise.

Confirming this. Having yourself "die" as a friendly is your method of infiltration.

[crystalklear64]

this would work if they dont pay attention to the fact that a spy corpse dropped in place of whatever you were disguised as.
It does not drop a spy corpse, it drops whatever you are disguised as.

[guardian_owl]

Well after playing several hours a day over the weekend and idling a couple of times overnight, I have dupes of a lot of the items I already had, at least 1 dup of all 3 spy weapons (ambassador bleh, Cloak and Dagger yay), one Huntsman (freaking awesome weapon) but still no Jarate or Razorback, and no hats.

[lordwow]

I played for 3-4 hours this weekend and got (had none):
- The boxing gloves
- The klitzkreig
- Sniper bow
- Axtinguisher

I certainly can't complain compared to what other people have been getting.

[Hydro2Oxide]

If you're a new player, it's a good system. However, if you've already gotten all the previous unlocks it's pretty lame.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Update, awesome.

Updates to Team Fortress 2 have been released. The updates will be applied automatically when your Steam client is restarted. The specific changes include:

Team Fortress 2


The Ambassador now does full critical hits on headshots, instead of mini crits

The Dead Ringer now fully drains the cloak meter, even if the Spy leaves cloak early

Fixed Spy disguise menu not being visible in HUD minimal mode

Server log improvements:

Added "player_extinguish" event for servers to log when a Pyro extinguishes flame with the airburst

Fixed kill descriptions for Force-A-Nature & Sandman, so server logs can distinguish them

Identified feign deaths in the events sent to server logs

Fixed server crash related to the Jarate
Glad to see they rebuffed Amba but I think they went overkill on the Dead Ringer, should have just had like a 5 second cooldown.

[Nohbdy]

I don't understand those devs sometimes. Why does it need that drain?

And why haven't they nerfed the Sandman yet? PUSH BACK UBERS, NOT STUN AT LEAST.

[soccerstud652]

Update:

Have:
The Ambassador (x3)
The Flare Gun (x2)
The Backburner (x1)
The Killing Gloves of Boxing (x1)
The Sandwich (x2)
Natascha (x3)
The Huntsman (x1)
The Razorback (x1)
The Sandman (x3)
Bonk! Atomic Punch (x4)
The Force-A-Nature (x1)
The Kritzkrieg (x1)
The Blutsauger (x1)
The Axtinguisher (x1)

Need:

Ubersaw
Jarate
Cloak and Dagger
The Deadringer

Add me on Steam (I am part of the CAG community as well):
soccerstud652@yahoo.com

[crystalklear64]

I don't understand those devs sometimes. Why does it need that drain?

And why haven't they nerfed the Sandman yet? PUSH BACK UBERS, NOT STUN AT LEAST.
It needed that drain, because you could almost completely negate damage from a soldier/demoman by shooting, turning the ringer on vs a rocket/nade, immediately turning it off so that it recharges instantly, and repeating.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Yeah, effectively the spy had 1250 health without being able to shoot. He could distract sentries, stop carts and caps and over all be a total nuisance.

[AK85]

Played about 6 hours so far and have unlocked:

1x Flare Gun
1x Huntsman

Haven't really played with either of them much, so I cannot tell if they were good unlocks or not.

[RAMSTORIA]

Played about 6 hours so far and have unlocked:

1x Flare Gun
1x Huntsman

Haven't really played with either of them much, so I cannot tell if they were good unlocks or not.

i play pyro more than any other class, by far, and i LOVE the flare gun.

ive put in a good amount of hours and have one of the new spy watches and the 2nd scout gun, two classes i pretty much never play. but i do have three razorbacks, yup, thatll be handy. i do play sniper from time to time and thus far i think i miss my little machine gun more than i like the razor back, although it did save me from a backstab last night.

[aznguyen316]

I'm new to playing TF2 so yes I think these random drops are pretty cool. Been unlocking quite a few things =) and also I admit I've been idling

[Salamando3000]

I don't think there's a single item I haven't gotten doubles of so far. Except the Cloak and Dagger....don't even have one of those.

And hats. Never even seen a hat drop.

[judyjudyjudy]

I guess they really did fix the system yesterday, as I got 4 items (Razorback, Axtinguisher, Natascha, and a second Bonk) in the 2 hours I played yesterday night, putting me more in line with the average.

Still no hats for me tho... I really want the pyro hat!

[Admiral Ackbar]

I played for 3-4 hours this weekend and got (had none):
- The boxing gloves
- The klitzkreig
- Sniper bow
- Axtinguisher

I certainly can't complain compared to what other people have been getting.

You got the bow on the third fucking hour.

I hate you. I hate you with a bitter bile that bubbles from the depths of hell!

Good day sir.

I said good day!

How can anyone like the flare gun.

[darthbudge]

The flare gun is great for annoying the shit out of snipers on 2fort.

[lordwow]

I sucked at using the flare gun, but I had never thought of using it against snipers, that could be awesome.

[BlueLobstah]

It's also great for sending Medics into a panic from afar. Nothing like seeing an enemy medic go crazy because of spontaneous combustion.

[Mr. Anderson]

Finally got TF2 working correctly, and it is absolutely fantastic. I didn't have any weapons before the update, and just this morning and last night I got:

The Blutslager
The Klitzkrieg
The Force-A-Nature (my favorite unlock BY FAR, so far)
Bonk! Atomic Punch

I want ze Flare Gun!!!

[crystalklear64]

every time i've seen someone hit an achievement milestone, they have gotten an unlock.

coincidence?

[Hydro2Oxide]

every time i've seen someone hit an achievement milestone, they have gotten an unlock.

coincidence?

No it's not, the old milestones still work but Sniper and Spy don't. They will likely drop off the achievement system one of these days but it seems they are phasing out of it.

I haven't played for 2 days, kind of lost the interest. With all this hubbub going on there haven't been any scrims for muh clan.

[Nohbdy]

The Force-A-Nature (my favorite unlock BY FAR, so far)


Stop playing or delete that failure of a gun.

[Mr. Anderson]

Stop playing or delete that failure of a gun.

So cold, so cold.

[Admiral Ackbar]

Holy shit.

for those of you that don't know, I hate, hate hate CTF Well. It is the worst designed map of all TF2 maps. The reason being that they pigeon holed a CTF gamestyle into a map designed for CP.

So I got in an argument last night while playing it and I was accused of bitching. So at work today the TF2 Stats are blocked. So I couldn't look it up. But I was convinced that CTF_Wel is the worst TF2 MAP Ever. Techncially even worse than Hydro which is hated because of gameplay type.

So I wrote down a number of predictions based on my understanding of the map design.

The predicitons were...

1) CTF_Well would have the lowest number of stalemates (Since the map is indefendable)
2) That it would be one of the least played maps in TF2. (Unpopularity)
3) That it will have one of the shortest game times of all the maps. (Due to it being indefendable and requiring so little skill to score. In other words, because of very minor differences in skill or player count one team can easily roll over the other team)

And guess what, each one of my predictions proved true.

1) There are less stalemates on CTF_Well than any other map that can stalemate. The only other map that comes close is Turbine. But Turbine is clearly a superior CTF map due to level design.

The reason Stalemates are low in Turbine is due to spacing. It has the least space between the flag and the capture point. It also has a small but important number of choke points. Unlike 2Fort that has tons of choke points. I'm not a huge turbine fan, because I think it's simplicity is a negative to gameplay. But it's construction is sound and I appreciate that

Well has a huge gamespace between capture points. yet stalemates are even less so on Well, further damning the map design.

2) There is only one map that's played less than CTF_Well and not an Arena Map. That's Hydro which, while technically sound, is the least popular map due to gameplay type.

The reason Arena maps are low is because they're such a different gameplay type that many servers don't play arena maps at all. But they aren't necessarily unpopular. They just feel odd in the normal map rotation. Also, they're short by nature. In fact, more rounds of arena maps have been played than any other map by far.

3) CTF_Well is by far the shortest lived map of all CTF Maps.

That may not sound like much when there are only 3 ctf maps. But let's look at all 3. 2fort, better known as turtlefort is the longest of all maps because it's the easiest to defend. I actually like 2fort because it requires the most skill to win, but many don't because they hate turtles.

I like turtles. That's a BRH joke.

Anyway, the next longest map is hydro, which is hated because of gameplay type and stalemates. I beliave because of the great level design of 2fort, the skill required to play, and nostalga factor, that explains why 2fort is still so popular. It's strengths overcome the weakness of stalemate risk.

More rounds of 2fort have been played than any other non-arena map.

Then look at Turbine. Turbine is right in the middle. 2fort averages 30+ minutes. Turbine around 23. Due to it's simplicity, spacing issues, lack of choke points. etc. But it's a solid design. I think it's the time that most maps should aspinre and it's not a suprise that it's in the top of the second quartile of all maps. it's not too long, not too short, just right.

Then there's CTF_Well. 17.5 minutes. A 30% reduction. Excluding arena maps only three other rank lower.

Gravelepit - That's due to only having to capture 3 locations unlike other CP maps. Also, Point B is the most defensible. Usually if B falls you cna take A quickly and have a good shot at C.

Steel - This suprised me. I couldn't explain ti at first. then it hit me, you really only need to capture one point. E. So because of this many game scould end rather quickly.

Badlands - This map has a design flaw. It is very, very, very hard to recapture the bridge. And very difficult to defend point 2. So usually the team that gets the bridge first eventually wins. It's a design flaw. (Note that Granary also has this flaw. The team that loses the middle can almost never take it back. But, the second point can be defended reasonably. Thus it doesn;'t have the time skew.)

Okay, so what does this all come down to? Well, Look at the difference in tiem between the four maps mentioned and the other maps. it's huge in statistical terms. There's almost a four minute difference between ctf_well and Granary.

The difference between the last four and the rest is either gameplay type (steel, gravelpit) or poor mdesign (ctf_Well, badlands)

Taking all this into account, CTF_Well is the worst designed map in TF2. Hydro is usually the map that comes to mind but the map design itself in hydro, while not great, isn't horrible. It's the gameplay type, the first of it's kind and a bit of an experiment, that's the porblem with Hydro. Turbine and 2fort definately show that there's a place for CTF in TF2. In fact, I believe we should see a couple more CTF maps.

So the gameplay style isn't the probltm with CTF Well. it's just that the style is not suitable for the map what was originally designed for CP. The fact that valve has tweaked Well twice since release seems to show that they also understand that the map design is lacking.

To see the statistics I based this Analysis on, click below.
http://www.steampowered.com/status/tf2/tf2_stats.php

I think I might write a position paper on this and go into more detail of why CTF_Well is such a shitty map.

[Kaijufan]

I pretty much never play any TF2 CTF maps, for some reason I just don't like the mode in TF2. I pretty much just stick to control point and payload/payload race.

[darthbudge]

Well, I just played for like an hour and I didn't get any items. :/

But I did see someone on the server get a hat.

[Mr. Anderson]

Arena and CP are my favorite modes.

Watchtower and Sawmill are awesome maps.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Ackbar, I've got a few bones to pick with your analysis. Mainly because it's totally from a pub-play perspective. I'm not calling you a noob in some elitist fashion but they are pretty much two different games, public TF2 and competitive.

CTF_2Fort is a pretty bad map due to one flaw, all points can be covered by one sentry and that totally cockblocks the entire enemy team unless they get an uber, even then it's still a sentry fast (As are all CTF maps which is their greatest flaw) The only way to make Turbine and 2fort viable is an Engi limit of 1.

Badlands middle point cap requires lots of teamwork to get back, namely killing their medic (Assuming both teams have medics which you should) After which you uber in. It's all about holding the chokepoints and pushing out. Badlands was mainly a bone thrown to competitive players which Valve doesn't do as often as I'd like but whatever.

[crystalklear64]

arena would be cool if the team simply had a set number of lives and once those lives were out you couldn't respawn. dying once and waiting 5 minutes doing nothing is not fun.

i didn't realize hydro was such a hated map, but i guess when i think about it it hardly ever gets played. i really like it.

[itachiitachi]

Did they increase the drop rates or is there a way to cheat the system? I idled on the clanwoof server for three hours and got every new unlock and two of each hats.

[crystalklear64]

rucky ferrow

[judyjudyjudy]

Looks like they just brought back achievement milestones:
http://store.steampowered.com/news/2545/

# Added Sniper/Spy milestone achievements as an additional way players can get the new unlockables
# Arena Mode

* Added tf_arena_use_queue server convar. Turn this on to get the old queue behavior. Default is off
* Added tf_arena_round_time to set a timelimit on the round

# Added the userid of the player who built the teleporter to the "player_teleported" event
# Fixed player killed event causing server crash
# Fixed Spies not being telefragged when standing on an enemy teleporter exit with the Dead Ringer enabled
# Fixed attackers seeing the mini-crit particle effect for full crits if the victim has the Jarate effect enabled
# Fixed the Ambassador not doing damage to buildings
# Fixed Spies disguised as their own team not drawing blood effects
# Fixed players killed by flaming arrows not showing the appropriate death icon

[crystalklear64]

awesome

[aznguyen316]

^ cool, although the old milestones were still in place as was discussed over at the steam boards. Glad to see they added another way though I got most of the sniper/spy unlocks now, but since I'm a noob need some of the "older" unlocks.

[Owen]

Did they increase the drop rates or is there a way to cheat the system? I idled on the clanwoof server for three hours and got every new unlock and two of each hats.

Sounds like the infamous server glitch that some have gotten that gives all the hats. Any chance you could post the ip address or give the full name of the server as I would like to see if I could get lucky. And the TF2 server selection screen sucks that you cannot search for a server by name.

[shinryuu]

CTF_2Fort is a pretty bad map due to one flaw, all points can be covered by one sentry and that totally cockblocks the entire enemy team unless they get an uber, even then it's still a sentry fast (As are all CTF maps which is their greatest flaw) The only way to make Turbine and 2fort viable is an Engi limit of 1.
I think Turbine is fine as it is. Sentry nests aren't as hard to take down as they are in 2fort and utilizes all the classes pretty well. At first, I didn't like it but it kinda grew on me. If you limit to 1 engi on that map, I think it'd be too hard to defend the intel. It's for sure one of the better CTF maps and I don't see any tweaks it really needs unless we're talking about cosmetically.

[soccerstud652]

New update 5/29:


Team Fortress 2 Update Released
MAY 29, 2009, 4:30 PM - VALVE - PRODUCT UPDATE

Updates to Team Fortress 2 have been released. The updates will be applied automatically when your Steam client is restarted. The specific changes include:

Team Fortress 2
Added Sniper/Spy milestone achievements as an additional way players can get the new unlockables
Arena Mode
Added tf_arena_use_queue server convar. Turn this on to get the old queue behavior. Default is off
Added tf_arena_round_time to set a timelimit on the round
Added the userid of the player who built the teleporter to the "player_teleported" event
Fixed player killed event causing server crash
Fixed Spies not being telefragged when standing on an enemy teleporter exit with the Dead Ringer enabled
Fixed attackers seeing the mini-crit particle effect for full crits if the victim has the Jarate effect enabled
Fixed the Ambassador not doing damage to buildings
Fixed Spies disguised as their own team not drawing blood effects
Fixed players killed by flaming arrows not showing the appropriate death icon

[Hydro2Oxide]

5 posts and ~15 hours too late =/

[lordwow]

Now that I know how to use the flare gun... it's amazing.

[carpwrist]

Now that I know how to use the flare gun... it's amazing.

It helps that they buffed the damage to 30 each shot.

[itachiitachi]

Sounds like the infamous server glitch that some have gotten that gives all the hats. Any chance you could post the ip address or give the full name of the server as I would like to see if I could get lucky. And the TF2 server selection screen sucks that you cannot search for a server by name.
^) 24/7 Pipeline #1 - HLSTATSX/RECRUITING ClanWoof.com 208.115.117.87:27015 (Join) (steam://connect/208.115.117.87:27015)
I believe it was that one

[Brak]

I need to unlock The Spy's fedora, dammit. :bomb:

[soccerstud652]

^) 24/7 Pipeline #1 - HLSTATSX/RECRUITING ClanWoof.com 208.115.117.87:27015 (Join) (steam://connect/208.115.117.87:27015)
I believe it was that one

I am going to test this server out, see what happens.

Edit: I used to play on a server that had "fucksalt" and "bobsaget" soundbytes on it when you typed the words. Does anyone know of any servers with this mod?

[aznguyen316]

Now that I know how to use the flare gun... it's amazing.

I love it too. I played a three hour session last night and got 62 "attention getter" hits toward the achievement. Awesome!

[Kaijufan]

I just unlocked the flare gun the other day through the pyro milestone (and then got one a few hours later randomly) and I'm loving it. It's totally replaced the shotgun for my pyro, I love setting people on fire from a distance.

[Kaijufan]

Kotaku interviewed (http://kotaku.com/5273555/valve-dreams-of-team-fortress-2-movie-divulges-meet-the-team-origins) the team behind the Meet the Team videos. The most interesting quotes:

"The number of people at this point who want us going off and making full length movies and that sort of stuff has got to a point where it's hard to ignore,"

"We're not ready to announce anything along those lines, but I don't think there's a person in this company that wouldn't love to see a full-length TF movie or even a 10-minute movie,"

TF2 movie incoming? :pray:

[TruVisionary]

I bought this last week during the 50% sale. so much fun. is there a Cag Server?

[DougCL]

i dont get as many kills with the bow, but god damn is it fun to use.

also the cloak and dagger is retardedly powerful

[aznguyen316]

I don't play spy, but what's diff b/t C&D and regular cloak vs the other watch? Nub here =D

[Salamando3000]

I don't play spy, but what's diff b/t C&D and regular cloak vs the other watch? Nub here =D

Original watch - Continuous Drain, recharges when you pick up material boxes

Cloak and Dagger - Drains only when moving, recharges by standing still

Dead Ringer - When active, any damage done to you will cause 1) A corpse of you to be left on the ground...2) All your cloak to be drained, and 3)Makes you invisible for up to 8 seconds (may be 6, can't remember specific). Requires full cloak to use.

[aznguyen316]

^ thank you sir.. so C&D allows some spy camping.. no wonder, I've been playing pryo and I've been burning a bangload of invisible spies!

[Hydro2Oxide]

Kotaku interviewed (http://kotaku.com/5273555/valve-dreams-of-team-fortress-2-movie-divulges-meet-the-team-origins) the team behind the Meet the Team videos. The most interesting quotes:

"The number of people at this point who want us going off and making full length movies and that sort of stuff has got to a point where it's hard to ignore,"

"We're not ready to announce anything along those lines, but I don't think there's a person in this company that wouldn't love to see a full-length TF movie or even a 10-minute movie,"

TF2 movie incoming? :pray:

OW MAI GAWD! Nice find, sounds awesome if it's true. Of course I'd take bug fixes first, movie second.

[Kaijufan]

OW MAI GAWD! Nice find, sounds awesome if it's true. Of course I'd take bug fixes first, movie second.
Well if they did make a full length movie they would most likely get an outside studio to make it, or set up their own studio for making movies so it wouldn't affect their games. I don't think they want to change Valve into a movie company.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Well if they did make a full length movie they would most likely get an outside studio to make it, or set up their own studio for making movies so it wouldn't affect their games. I don't think they want to change Valve into a movie company.

Well bug fixes come from the programmers but the 3D modelers are they people doing Meet The's. So if they devoted those guys to a video it's likely we'd see less maps and unlocks but would still probably get bug fixes.

I doubt an outside studio would do this, I mean who else but Valve could come up with someone like Saxton Hale?

[Kaijufan]

Well bug fixes come from the programmers but the 3D modelers are they people doing Meet The's. So if they devoted those guys to a video it's likely we'd see less maps and unlocks but would still probably get bug fixes.

I doubt an outside studio would do this, I mean who else but Valve could come up with someone like Saxton Hale?
Well I mean that the Meet the Team writers would write the movie script but an outside team would create the new art and animate it. I doubt Valve would want to tie up all their animators and artists on a movie.

[Serik]

I'd pay a few bucks for a ~20 minute TF2 episode.

Just watched "Meet the Soldier" for the first time in many months. It's still my favorite due to the brilliant surprise ending + UNLESS IT'S A FARM!

[RAMSTORIA]

TF2 movie incoming? :pray:

i hate video game movies. but a tf2 movie, as a comedy could work.

[Admiral Ackbar]

I've decided. If I get my promotion in the next two weeks, I'll shell out the 40 a month for a 32 man TF2 server for CAG's to play on.

[crystalklear64]

west coast?

[Admiral Ackbar]

west coast?

Depends on the hosting company. it'll probably be ne or mw though.

[shinryuu]

boo.. 32 is too much. =[

So I though the S&D would improve my Spy skillz. Nope, I still suck as Spy.

Huntsman is OK. Seems situational to me.

[lordwow]

That'd be awesome Ackbar!

[aznguyen316]

I've decided. If I get my promotion in the next two weeks, I'll shell out the 40 a month for a 32 man TF2 server for CAG's to play on.

would be totally sick, but if it saves you money I bet a 24man would be fine, password it for CAGs maybe? I dunno, but yeah good stuff

[Sir_Fragalot]

Played for around 5 hours until I got another unlock which was a duplicate. God I hate this system.

[Admiral Ackbar]

No Promo so no server.

Maybe next time.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Well for what it's worth, the guy who's running my clan has a server and I've got full admin on it so you guys can come by if you want. It's 16 player no crits though so that may be a turnoff to you all.

http://www.game-monitor.com/tf2_GameServer/8.9.36.201:27015/-SCS-_Satans_Chimney_Sweeps__247_No_2Fort__No_Crits_.ht ml

We try to start it up as much as possible.

[crystalklear64]

Played for around 5 hours until I got another unlock which was a duplicate. God I hate this system.
pssst, if you're trying for a specific item do the achievements.

[Salamando3000]

I'm still waiting for the day I see my first hat drop. I've already collected duplicates of every weapon.

[aznguyen316]

Played for around 5 hours until I got another unlock which was a duplicate. God I hate this system.

What's to hate? You can get the items you don't have by doing the achievements as mentioned above. The drops are fine.

[Sofa King Kool]

Anybody know when the weapon trading update is coming? I unlocked three Ambassadors consecutively tonight...

[Owen]

Anybody know when the weapon trading update is coming? I unlocked three Ambassadors consecutively tonight...

It's Valve so I really do not expect to see the trade function anytime soon. I bet it will be their Christmas or New Years gift to the players.

[Brak]

I legit unlocked 7 additional Force-A-Natures...

Just give me a fuckin' hat, already.

[rumarudrathas]

Gawd... sat through 1 1/2 hours of 2fort... got zip for item drops. Is there an average amount of play time before an item drops? It feels so random to me now.

[RAMSTORIA]

today i got another razorback, a 2nd flare gun, 2nd backburner, and 2nd sandvich. awesome....

[Salamando3000]

I like the idea of the drop system, but hate how it currently is. I really wish there was some option to disable it for drops I already have, or for the system to decrease the odds of a drop once you got it...anything to either stop giving me ten of the same weapon when there's no use for them (and for the people saying "trading", do you really think Flareguns are going to be in all that high of a demand?).

[Hydro2Oxide]

You have a chance at 25 minute intervals, or so most drop experiences estimate. The game does a dice roll to see if you get an item or not.

The system is likely going to be good for getting the same weapons soon as there is some code in the GCF for item stats like no medic overheal decay and on heavy fist kill, +50 health to everyone within a certain radius. The theory is every time you get a weapon, it has random stats that balance out. I hope they implement something like this.

[Sir_Fragalot]

I legit unlocked 7 additional Force-A-Natures...

Just give me a fuckin' hat, already.

Exactly, I don't want to sit through 5 hrs of trying to get an unlock and find out my unlock is a fucking weapon I got through achievements, I as well want the fucking hats.

[crystalklear64]

The system is likely going to be good for getting the same weapons soon as there is some code in the GCF for item stats like no medic overheal decay and on heavy fist kill, +50 health to everyone within a certain radius. The theory is every time you get a weapon, it has random stats that balance out. I hope they implement something like this.
ughhhh

[soccerstud652]

A while back there was a spoof video where the spy tricks the heavy and backstabs him (I think it was on Kotaku). I can't remember the theme, maybe the Heavy was in love with his gun or it was Valentine's day. I can't find the video and it is driving me nuts. Does anyone know what I am talking about? Links appreciated.

Also, it is not gameplay footage, but more of an official looking video.

[ChernobylCow]

WTS Minotaur axe 7dmg 37delay. 12 plat. /tell me

[rumarudrathas]

WTS Minotaur axe 7dmg 37delay. 12 plat. /tell me

Damn you ChernobylCow... damn you for dredging up bad memories.

Oh, one more question that I forgot to ask... Can the server disable item drop? Is this even remotely possible to do on a legit server?

[crystalklear64]

Got the scoot hat today. A shame since its one of my least played classes now, but cool to have gotten one at all.

[shinryuu]

No hat . =[

Does anyone here play a good soldier? I'm terrible at it. Maybe because he's slow or maybe because I just don't understand how to kill people with the soldier. I know how to rocket jump and to aim on surfaces for splash dmg, but I just can't get the hang of him. He's the only class I would say I'm terrible with. Always end up at the bottom when I use soldier. =p

[crystalklear64]

Wow. I would have said the soldier was one of the easier classes to play. How do you kill people with the soldier? Shoot them with rockets.

1 on 1? try to aim the rockets at their feet to blow them into the air then have another rocket aimed at where they are going to land. Very easy to kill people like that.

In a group, just spam your rockets at whatever you want.

People get close to you? You're usually safe to shoot rockets at your own feet since you have more HP than most other classes.

Always try to have the height advantage in a situation since its much easier to hit people from above since you'll always at least get some splash damage on them. If that means having to rocket jump yourself into the air, then so be it. Just be aware that when you do that, you're going to attract a lot of attention from the other team, which isn't necessarily a bad thing for your team, but it is for you.

Also know that you are a frontliner class, so don't be afraid to lead the charge. Nothing sucks more than having a team full of offensive classes only to have them hang back.

The soldier is also very good if you play it like a spy. Your maneuverability thanks to your rockets open up tons of opportunities to get the drop on enemies from places they wouldn't normally expect. Always keep an eye out for stragglers and get the drop on them for easy kills. Your rockets are great for taking out engineers and their buildings as well, though you may need a partner soldier if the engie has a good nest set up.

Obviously all this rocket jumping is going to use up your health, so always know where the nearest health pack is.

The majority of the time, you should only need your rockets, however, against scouts and pyros with the air blast, you might find it easier to use the shotgun. You can still use rockets on pyros by aiming the rocket to hit the ground right next to them and scouts as well once you get used to their timing on the double jump, but for scouts especially, I usually just bring out the shotgun.

[lordwow]

I play the solider/scout/demoman least of the 3 classes by far (they're the only 3 under an hour played for me). I find the solider especially boring to play, as CK said, it's mainly spam your rockets. Shoot where they're going. I just don't find it that entertaining.

[Serik]

The Soldier is my favorite class, especially for busting SGs. I'm always surprised by how few Soldiers are in play; teams with 3 soldiers tend to do very well in my experience. Certainly better than having 4 snipers, 3 spies, and 2 engies on an offense team. (If I see that kind of class distribution, I leave the server because it's a recipe for failure.)

My favorite tactics: pop someone in the air with a rocket, switch to SG, and blast them before they hit the ground. I also love rocket jumping over rocks and other obstances, landing behind the encamped enemy, and whacking them to death with my spade.

The Soldier is pure offense: versatile, powerful, mobile. He's also great for countering pyros (the rare pyro that can effectively use the airblast notwithstanding). If you're playing payload as BLU, you should have a few good Sollys. As you can tell, I'm strongly against the shitty pub team loaded with camping engies and snipers. Offensive muscle FTW!

[SOSTrooper]

I play the solider/scout/demoman least of the 3 classes by far (they're the only 3 under an hour played for me). I find the solider especially boring to play, as CK said, it's mainly spam your rockets. Shoot where they're going. I just don't find it that entertaining.

I play soldier the most, then demoman in close 2nd. I find soldier to be very fun to play, even though you're right, it is all about spamming rockets. But in my case, I love trying to shoot people in the air with rockets, that's where the fun begins. Not to mention rocket jumping to unexpected places, and rocket jumping towards your enemies for surprise attack. And of course, to post up against a skilled scout is always fun.

From my experience though, a skilled demoman does more damage than a skilled soldier, in terms of in-game team play.

[rumarudrathas]

Yeah, to me the soldier is one of the easiest class to play. My girlfriend took the soldier for a spin, so here are some suggestions I gave her:

Love that splash damage: It's almost impossible to directly land that rocket on someone, so aim for their feet and take them out with the rocket splash damage.

Reload often... if you aren't firing, then you're reloading your rocket launcher.

Fall in love with the Q button: during an intense firefight, where reloading is not an option, swap the rocket launcher with your shotty.

There is this little trick I picked up, which is basically the ability to strafe in and out of corners/cover, squeezing off a rocket shot in between. Might be a good skill to learn as a soldier or TF2 player in general. It helps with trying to take down sentries or a lone heavy without taking the punishment.

GL with playing as a soldier. He's currently my third most-played class.

[Filbert]

I'm a terrible shot, my cousin says it's because I play with my sensitivity too high. So I've never done well with the Soldier or Sniper classes. I tend to gravitate to Heavy, Medic, and Pyro. Obviously this is because they all allow a more continuous firing pattern.

That said, even though I know that as a soldier you should fire at the feet, I always find myself forgetting that while actually playing.

[Hydro2Oxide]

Soldier's my #2, second to scout and I have to say he's got quite a range of skill. Newer players can pick him up easy due to he's extremely simple "Point and click" arsenal. Experienced players will also gravitate to him due to his Quake-like rocket jumps and airshots. The main thing a soldier needs is a good medic though.

[Oktoberfest]

I think we can all agree though that Heavy is pretty dull? Or is that just me

[Serik]

I think we can all agree though that Heavy is pretty dull? Or is that just me

I think the Heavy, in general, is a shitty class, which is not what you'd expect from 300 HP + minigun. Fact is, without a medic, he's way too easy to kill. As a spy, I always go for Heavies (low-hanging fruit). Snipers can't miss them. They're pin cushions for arrow spam. Also easy targets for the Sandman.

So I only play heavy when I can camp cap points next to dispensers or occupy a safe corner. But I rarely find that enjoyable and do it for the benefit of the team.

Having a medic changes everything, though. Still, I don't like my enjoyment to be totally dependent on the availability of a competent medic.

Valve's stats bear this out (http://www.steampowered.com/status/tf2/tf2_stats.php): the heavy is the least-played class across all maps. So while the Heavy update attempted to change this, I think subsequent changes (mega-buffing the spy, the Huntsmen) have actually made him a less-attractive class.

Interestingly, while the Heavy is the least-played class, he averages the second-most points per hour. The sniper and engineer, the most-played classes, are towards the bottom when it comes to points per hour. Go figure.

[rumarudrathas]

I think we can all agree though that Heavy is pretty dull? Or is that just me

Pretty much a spray and pray class, but there's a bit of utility than can spice playing a heavy a bit:

You could physically block people at tight doorways
You could be a movie meat-wall, soaking up bullets
You could punch people.
Also, you could think of yourself as a Pyro with a longer range, in that one of you base strategy should be trying to set up an ambush and mowing down the idiots that stupidly stumbles upon you.

-Just my thoughts.

[Hydro2Oxide]

The fact of the matter is every update fucks over the heavy. Spy got headshots which demolish him, he's an easy Jarate target, etc. Pretty much any buff to any class is icing over the Heavy.

[Serik]

Hmmm, I wonder if Valve will make the new football helmet unlock function like the Razorback, only for headshots. After one headshot, the helmet could fly off.

As an aside, the Ambassador is probably the worst unlock to date. Spies are already powerful enough without a headshot weapon.

[soccerstud652]

Why didn't they give the heavy a Russian hat? What the fuck does a football helmet have to do with the Russian Heavy?

http://www.chapelbaitsupplies.co.uk/shop/images/HAT.jpg

[Hydro2Oxide]

Hmmm, I wonder if Valve will make the new football helmet unlock function like the Razorback, only for headshots. After one headshot, the helmet could fly off.

As an aside, the Ambassador is probably the worst unlock to date. Spies are already powerful enough without a headshot weapon.

Uhhhh, Sandman?

[Nohbdy]

Why didn't they give the heavy a Russian hat? What the fuck does a football helmet have to do with the Russian Heavy?


What does an afro have to do with a Black Scottish Cyclops?

What does a propeller beanie have to do with a pyro?

[Serik]

The Sandman is pretty stupid, no doubt, but in terms of destroying game balance, the Ambassador takes the lead. Besides, I encounter more spies with Ambassadors than I do Scouts with Sandman.

The Kritzkrieg is probably the best in terms of adding additional functionality while not invalidating the original. Plus it's not ridiculously annoying like jarate, the Ambassador, and the Sandman. So, on the whole, I think class unlocks have only made TF2 a worse game and I sincerely hope Valve provides a cvar for servers to disable unlocks. You can already dick around with respawn times, player counts, crits, damage falloff, etc. I don't see why unlocks are untouchable from a server operator's perspective.

[rumarudrathas]

@Serik:

True, the heavy is one of the most underplayed classes, but if you look at avg point, kills, and assists per hour, plus damage dealt percentage, you see the Heavy being on the top three.

Moving on to heavies in general...

I'm not a big heavy player, and yes, most classes have an answer to the heavy-problem, but the same can be said for a lot of the classes having "answers" to every other class: a mediocre Pyro player can demolish a spy and unaware scout, Soldiers needs only 1-2 rockets to bring down a scout and pyros, A scout can seriously fuck up a sniper if he's not careful, etc etc.

The point is this: it's still a fairly viable class to play, if you know how to play as him. I think Valve is beating a quite dead horse on the message that a Medic is a Heavy's best friend (case in point, look at the Heavy Achievements). Also, players need to keep in mind that Heavy's are not necessarily the best pick for straight out offense, but does a fairly bang-up job of playing defense.

-my 2 centavos.

[Hydro2Oxide]

An excellent update!

http://store.steampowered.com/news/?appids=440

In other news, an allegid email from RW claims HWG is going to get a buff.

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10414674&postcount=115

[crystalklear64]

Reverted Force-A-Nature and airblast knockback on disguised Spies, so that they can once again be knocked back
Yay.

[Sofa King Kool]

I've been playing this a lot lately, and I'm finally decent at it. I still have my off days where I do terrible, but when that happens I just switch to pyro for some easy pick-me-up kills.

[shinryuu]

OK, I guess I wasn't THAT bad at being Soldier, but I seem to do better as a Soldier on defense rather than offense. Also, after the FaN damage boost, I'm definitely feeling it now. Scattergun is still good, but I find myself on top of the leaderboards when I use the FaN. Another thing, I read that Dead Ringer + regular revolver makes a good alternative spy. Tried it today on badlands and it worked wonders. I was on top of the leaderboard again, next to a Demo and a Medic. Hmm...

[Brak]

Practice rocket jumping.

You'll be unstoppable.

[Brak]

In other news, an allegid email from RW claims HWG is going to get a buff.

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10414674&postcount=115
'the Hell does that mean?

[shinryuu]

Practice rocket jumping.

You'll be unstoppable.

I'm good enough at rocket jumping. I think it has more to do with me not liking to lead the pack.

[crystalklear64]

Maybe ya'll can help me figure out the name of this map I used to play.

It was fairly linear, two bases on either side for blue and red in a canyon setting.

The middle was a bridge with a large pit underneath but each team had to stop to cap a point before that middle point in a mini-village sort of thing.

An attempt to show what I'm talking about.

http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/7918/wutmapisthis.png

[seen]

Not sure what map you mean but I like this site to re-educated myself to the game this week.

http://tf2wiki.net/wiki/Main_Page

What ever happened to the CAG Syndicate? Lets get it rockin' again!

[soccerstud652]

CAG Syndicate!

[SOSTrooper]

I'm good enough at rocket jumping. I think it has more to do with me not liking to lead the pack.

accept my friend invite :) let's play in a server sometime, im west coast too

[SOSTrooper]

Maybe ya'll can help me figure out the name of this map I used to play.

It was fairly linear, two bases on either side for blue and red in a canyon setting.

The middle was a bridge with a large pit underneath but each team had to stop to cap a point before that middle point in a mini-village sort of thing.

An attempt to show what I'm talking about.

http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/7918/wutmapisthis.png


It's called Warpath. There are servers in TF2 that run that map 24/7, or in rotation.

[Kaijufan]

In other news, an allegid email from RW claims HWG is going to get a buff.

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10414674&postcount=115
They really need to make it so the heavy doesn't suffer nearly as much knock back from things like airblasts.

[Hydro2Oxide]

It's called Warpath. There are servers in TF2 that run that map 24/7, or in rotation.

Seconded, that is indeed warpath.

[crystalklear64]

played with a former syndicate member today for awhile. good stuff.

and thanks for the map name. i love that map.

[Serik]

warpath was the greatest thing in TFC, next to Dustbowl of course

God, I think I've played some form of TF at least once a week since 2000 :O

[bg88]

Whats up guys. I've been playing a lot of TF2 lately and I am trying to get better as a Spy. Most of my success has resulted in just getting behind the enemy and disguising as one of them. What I mean is I haven't been using the other gadgets (Dead Ringer, Invisibility Watch, Cloak & Dagger) much. I'm not really sure which gadget would be best to use. Any of you seasoned Spies have any tips or suggestions?

[Kaijufan]

Whats up guys. I've been playing a lot of TF2 lately and I am trying to get better as a Spy. Most of my success has resulted in just getting behind the enemy and disguising as one of them. What I mean is I haven't been using the other gadgets (Dead Ringer, Invisibility Watch, Cloak & Dagger) much. I'm not really sure which gadget would be best to use. Any of you seasoned Spies have any tips or suggestions?

For just starting out as spy going with the Invisibility Watch or the Cloak and Dagger would be best. Both only have around 8-10 seconds of cloak. The Invisibility Watch can be refilled by dispensers or ammo boxes. The Cloak and Dagger on the other hand only refills when you're standing still. Test them both out and go with your personal preference.

I think the Dead Ringer is something for more advanced Spy players since it's quite a bit different then the other two watches.

[lordwow]

I almost exclusively use the cloak and dagger. I am by no means a spy master, but I really enjoy being able to sit there and wait for people especially in places I know they're coming. The challenge with the cloak and dagger is of course cloaking only when necessary or moving quickly and efficiently from one hiding place to another.

I have to say, I found the spy achievements to be ridiculously easy. I've already earned about 20 of them with only about 90 minutes of playing spy.

[crystalklear64]

the dead ringer is fairly useful again apart from the noise, now that it can be refilled via ammo boxes. you can force a cloak on yourself by taking a little fall damage and use the route you normally would with the regular watch, picking up your ammo along the way.

you still need to find a place to decloak where its hard to tell where the sound is coming from, or pull whatever tactics you can to disguise the noise (yell random shit as you decloak on all talk servers to mask your noise)

i find that the cloak and dagger makes very bad spies and encourages poor playing habits in the team setting.

[Serik]

i find that the cloak and dagger makes very bad spies and encourages poor playing habits in the team setting.

Totally agreed. The spy is one of my favorite classes, but I'm reluctant to play him because pub teams are typically loaded with mediocre spies and snipers. It's frustrating as hell to have 3 dumbass spies on your team sitting in one spot with C&D instead of rushing behind enemy lines and blowing teles (especially important on payload and A/D maps).

I use the regular watch most of the time, since it's conductive to my sole spy mission of rushing the enemy spawn within the first 30 seconds of a match. Destroying 4 tele entrances in a row at the start of Badwater is very rewarding.

Also: the C&D is a great way to dick around with people if you're not in the mood to help your team. Find a far-flung engy or sniper and spam vocal taunts at them. You can stay invisible the entire time, moving when necessary. This can actually tie up a few people in a useless goose chase once word gets out there's an asshole spy hanging around :D

[lordwow]

I can't speak for other players, I just find C&D far more effective. Yesterday on 2Fort, I sat on the opposing side's top (where all the snipers stand) and ended up with about 10 backstabs, all snipers. It kept the bridge/middle clear for our team to get across for several minutes.

[shinryuu]

Like I mentioned earlier, I'm finding myself at the top of the leaderboards with the last Dead Ringer update. Pair it with the normal revolver and backup the frontline-- purrdy good. Not as "easy" to sabotage engineers, but it's doable. =p

I liked using the C&D since I sucked with the original watch, but then I learned how to use the Dead Ringer, so, iunno. At times though, you'll feel very inefficient and wasting time waiting, so ,yeah.

[Kaijufan]

So now that we likely have around 2 months until the next class update what is everyone predicting for new weapons?


For Engineer I'm going to go with a longer range weapon to replace the shotgun, perhaps a mini sniper rifle type weapon to attack enemies out of range of sentry guns. Of course it would be much weaker then the shotgun when attack short ranged enemies.

I could see another weapon being an some kind of EMP weapon that disrupts the cloaking device or disguises. I could also see this as an item like goggles that the engineer has to wear but drains metal, gives him limited sight (maybe 5-10 feet) and leaves him unarmed.

I wouldn't mind seeing some new things for the engineer to build but I can't think of anything. Maybe someone else has a good idea?


For solider I wouldn't mind seeing some kind of semi auto rifle. I also like the idea of an Unreal Tournament style rocket launcher where you have remote control of the rocket by pointing at where you want to it to go. This would make it easier for the rocket to hit out of the way targets but require the solider to stay out in the open, leaving him open to attacks.

I do think it's possible valve may go the sniper route with the solider and give him radically different weapons then what he has.


As for demo perhaps replacing stickies with proximity bombs? Make them have a fairly limited range, being able to be set off by the demoman, and have them disappear when the demo is killed.

I don't know if they'll replace the grenade launcher, maybe they could give him different types of grenades? Fire grenades that set people on fire like the Pyro, or EMP grenades that give a small shock and temporarily disable anything electronic.


I also want to see more Payload, Duel Payload and Control Point maps. I imagine that we are mostly seeing arena maps because they are small and only have one part, but I would love to see more Valve made maps in my 3 favorite modes.

I definitely am interested in seeing what other people come up with. I believe Hydro2Oxide pretty much predicted the huntsman.

[seen]

I really dislike the dual payload maps. I've had games where my whole team only tries to attack the opposition instead of moving the cart!

[Curufinwe]

I only really play payload maps now, unless I want to do the sniper war on 2fort.

[SOSTrooper]

I think the payload map needs a fix. How can a team win a round by pushing the cart all the way to the end, only to have a 10 ft advantage in the next round?

[Serik]

I think the payload map needs a fix. How can a team win a round by pushing the cart all the way to the end, only to have a 10 ft advantage in the next round?

Heh, that seems like a classical "momentum" problem. On the one hand, you want to encourage players to win stages A and B, but on the other hand you don't want a runaway winner. Maybe the winning team could get a special bonus route or pimped out bomb cart? (Winning A upgrades the bomb's dispenser to level 2; winning B upgrades it to level 3.) Maybe a combination of both?

Payload is my preferred game mode, but the race map is poorly executed. The idea is good, but I find most rounds are either total blowouts or lengthy wars of attrition. Only the third stage, where the carts are side by side, do I find the back-and-forth nonstop action of a "racing game."

RE: class updates

Valve's been implementing "hard counters" to other classes as unlocks (Razorback to protect against spy backstabs), so I wonder if the engy will see anything like that. Maybe an anti-spy device that pings for spies every X seconds but constantly consumes metal? Maybe a shield generator that also consumes metal? Depending on the unlocks, players could perhaps outfit their engy as either pure offense or pure defense, essentially creating two subclasses.

I know Robin said that SGs, at present, are too binary (as in good players can always destory them while bad players cannot).

[Kaijufan]

Heh, that seems like a classical "momentum" problem. On the one hand, you want to encourage players to win stages A and B, but on the other hand you don't want a runaway winner. Maybe the winning team could get a special bonus route or pimped out bomb cart? (Winning A upgrades the bomb's dispenser to level 2; winning B upgrades it to level 3.) Maybe a combination of both?

Payload is my preferred game mode, but the race map is poorly executed. The idea is good, but I find most rounds are either total blowouts or lengthy wars of attrition. Only the third stage, where the carts are side by side, do I find the back-and-forth nonstop action of a "racing game."

RE: class updates

Valve's been implementing "hard counters" to other classes as unlocks (Razorback to protect against spy backstabs), so I wonder if the engy will see anything like that. Maybe an anti-spy device that pings for spies every X seconds but constantly consumes metal? Maybe a shield generator that also consumes metal? Depending on the unlocks, players could perhaps outfit their engy as either pure offense or pure defense, essentially creating two subclasses.

I know Robin said that SGs, at present, are too binary (as in good players can always destory them while bad players cannot).


That's a pretty good idea for duel payload. I have a feeling that the mode is basically in public beta and we'll see some changes to it in upcoming updates.

Yeah those anti spy devices also sound good, engineers do need something to defend against spies.

[RAMSTORIA]

Valve's been implementing "hard counters" to other classes as unlocks (Razorback to protect against spy backstabs), so I wonder if the engy will see anything like that. Maybe an anti-spy device that pings for spies every X seconds but constantly consumes metal? Maybe a shield generator that also consumes metal? Depending on the unlocks, players could perhaps outfit their engy as either pure offense or pure defense, essentially creating two subclasses.

I know Robin said that SGs, at present, are too binary (as in good players can always destory them while bad players cannot).

me and my buddies were speculating what the engi and demo would get in their updates. we all agreed some kind of "spydar" would be good. or maybe something similar to the razor back, you can booby trap your builds, so if a spy tries to sap them they get a jolt or a bonk a la sand man. id also like to see an upgrade to the shotgun somehow for the engi.

for demo i thought something that might be good would be something like tear gas or nerve gas, it doesnt do as much damage, but does damage over time, it could clear out rooms or campers.

in either case ill be looking forward to the updates, engi and demo are two of my highest played classes. but pyro still tops them all.

[crystalklear64]

I don't think a spy detector is a good enough upgrade for the engineer. Simply knowing that there is a spy around doesn't really help.

*Detector goes off* Boys theres a spy arou-SPY SAPPIN' MAH SENTRY *rest of the team follows up directly behind the sap as an organized team does and proceeds to decimate nest*

It needs be something that serves a purpose to specifically stop a spy from doing what it what usually does, and that is sapping. Like the Razorback, perhaps the ability to upgrade one device to level 4 which does nothing except provide a small second lifebar (visually, perhaps the form of an external battery) for the machinery, which must first be destroyed before the machine itself can be sapped. When the battery is being sapped, the machine still functions as normal, and is immune to being sapped until the battery is destroyed.

Concerning methods apart from sapping to destroy machinery, the external battery has no benefit, as an explosion would logically hit the entire object, and not be centered on the battery.

As a drawback to being able to do this, spies who constantly push and seek out nests rather than sitting around doing nothing waiting for the right moment should be rewarded in the face of this opposition. Apart from the 1 battery limit, engineers who choose to carry this extra power source require a different set of tools to install it. This "wrench" has the drawback of decreasing the max amount of metal that can be held, increasing the number of trips that must be made for the engineer to fully upgrade his devices on their own without punishing them in a team environment. Also, while other engineers may help build the machine to level 3, only an engineer with the special "wrench" can upgrade a device to level 4 and cannot be aided by normal wrenched engineers at the 4th level.

Further Drawbacks to be Considered:
To continue with this theme of rewarding speed, the "wrench" also has the drawback of not being able to speed up production time by whacking at the machinery as it builds.

Instead of punishing speed, gear this more towards individual play and say that the machinery is just altogether too complex for the normal wrench and therefore by choosing to use the special "wrench", you make other engineers without the wrench unable to assist you in the repair or construction of your devices.

Summary-
Pros:
Prevents a spy from sappin' your sentry or other device of choice by providing a second lifebar that must first be removed before the device itself can be sapped.

Neutral:
Only an engineer actually holding the special "wrench" can upgrade an object to level 4. Friendly engineers can help upgrade the "wrench" owner's devices to level 3 as usual, but not to level 4.
Only 1 level 4 upgrade per engineer with this item.

Cons:
Decreases maximum metal held meaning more time must be spent seeking metal to build with.

Possible Cons:
No increased building speed by hitting when building.
No help allowed from other engineers in repairing, upgrading, or speeding up production.
No Crits.

[RAMSTORIA]

i think everyone likes the idea of a anti-sapping technology for engis, i bet valves aware of this.

id like to see the soldier get something like a high powered rifle, a la M4. no scope, but a powerful gun, have it replace the rocket launcher. have people running around like CTs in counter strike. could be fun, i know i would like solider more, ive never been a big fan of soldier.

[bg88]

The last couple of weeks I have found that I absolutely love playing as the Scout. Its a very good answer to Snipers. I never get tired of getting behind someone and killing them with the bat.:whee:

Has their been any confirmation as to what class is up for the next update?