CAGcast #198: Techtonic Farts

[CheapyD]

3078[/img-l]This week's show features E3 predictions, excessive name-dropping, EA's Online Pass, Lost Planet 2, 3D Dot Heroes, your CAGbag (http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71382) and Twitter (http://www.twitter.com/cheapyd) questions, and much more!

107
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Show Linkage/Notes (click the button below to expand):


Intro: Let's Get Spunkiy Mix - EOWXXX (http://www.mediafire.com/?x3ym1r2yxil)

The Video Game Release List of 5/9 - 5/15 (http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/63701)

EA Continuing Battle Against Used Game Sales with "Online Passes" (http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3179229)
Best Buy taps Future US for new game mag: @Gamer (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/05/11/best-buy-taps-future-us-for-new-game-mag-gamer/)

Steam for Mac rolls out tomorrow, Portal and Torchlight in tow (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/05/11/steam-for-mac-rolls-out-tomorrow-portal-and-torchlight-in-tow/)
Bethesda announces Fallout: New Vegas collector's edition for high rollers (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/05/11/bethesda-announces-fallout-new-vegas-collectors-edition-for-hi/)
'Mega Man Online': Capcom's First Mega Man MMO? (http://feedproxy.google.com/%7Er/MultiplayerBlog/%7E3/dsr231ow1EE/)
4-player co-op 'Onslaught' mode coming to Bad Company 2 PS3/360 (http://www.destructoid.com/4-player-co-op-onslaught-mode-coming-to-bad-company-2-ps3-360-173502.phtml)

Nintendo’s No-Transfer Policy Could Burn Wii’s Biggest Fans (http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2010/05/black-wii-upgrade/#ixzz0nixu55KO)

Ninjatown: Trees of Doom (http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/ninjatown-trees-of-doom/id369997638?mt=8)

CheapyD's Youtube Videos (http://www.youtube.com/cheapyd) (Subscribe (http://www.youtube.com/subscription_center?add_user=CheapyD))
CheapyD's Flickr Page (http://www.flickr.com/photos/cheapyd/) (Subscribe (http://www.flickr.com/people/cheapyd/relationship/))

Outro: Poop in the Toilet, Tai - CheapyD (http://audioboo.fm/boos/126826-tai-attempts-to-poop-in-the-toilet)






(http://twitpic.com/1921lx)

[E*Master]

Perfect! I just smoked a bowl and a CAGcast will do great right now! I actually recorded it on my audioboo ;) lol

[DJmizuhara]

Cheers Cheapy...perfect timing for my drive home from work. :D

[dastly75]

"Techtonic Farts", sounds like another classy cagcast...

[whywakeup]

Snice !

[volt1up]

Way to transition from glory holes into mothers day.



Lost Planet 2 sounds fine, basically it does look like a take on the Monster Hunter formula, and I've been waiting for that to come to a console that has dual analogs, plus MH probably just isnt your cup of tea anyway, Im looking forward to playing it. As far as losing the story, do you really miss it? It was completely silly.

[KingBroly]

Nice 2 year old discussion of the Wii Shop Channel stuff guys. You can link the stuff to your Club Nintendo account, but nothing is guaranteed; however, it's your best bet. It's the reason I don't download from their shop a lot anymore. If Nintendo continues down this path, and doesn't work out something for pre-existing customers (mainly for a Wii to Wii HD (?)), it could like to a lot of people to resort to piracy of those older games, and in turn, newer games.

[PaddedCell]

I just noticed the coupon for domains from godaddy went up in price... lame...well least i got one for the original discount...

[CheapyD]

Nice 2 year old discussion of the Wii Shop Channel stuff guys. You can link the stuff to your Club Nintendo account, but nothing is guaranteed; however, it's your best bet. It's the reason I don't download from their shop a lot anymore. If Nintendo continues down this path, and doesn't work out something for pre-existing customers (mainly for a Wii to Wii HD (?)), it could like to a lot of people to resort to piracy of those older games, and in turn, newer games.
Meanwhile, after we finished recording, I got a PM from a CAG who just bought a new black Wii. He has over $1000 in downloads that he can't transfer over.

[mrn111]

"Techtonic Farts", sounds like another classy cagcast...


Sounds like a Funkadelic album title.

[Sgt Barone]

Wahoooooo!! New CAGcast!!!

[TheJerseyKush]

Meanwhile, after we finished recording, I got a PM from a CAG who just bought a new black Wii. He has over $1000 in downloads that he can't transfer over.

ouch

[LiK]

Hey guys, quick clarification. When you play EA games online, you are definitely playing on EA servers. You might remember that EA will shut down servers to games they deem old or unpopular. For example, EA shut down servers to their older versions of the Madden and NBA games. People were forced to migrate to the newer versions in order to play online.

Personally, I don't have a problem with the Online Pass either, Cheapy. But if people are paying money now and they still shut down servers to games that have Online Passes, then EA is evil.

[Gentlegamer]

On the EA "pay to play used copies" issue and server cost, used game users accessing EA servers puts no additional strain on the servers. Only one person can use a copy of a game at a time. So when the original user sells his copy, the next owner just takes his "place" in the potential server population.

[eataburger]

Good episode this week! Loved Shipwrecks review of Lost Planet 2 the best. The money line during that discussion was "Capcom makes games that look like Americans would like, but play like games Japanese like" (or something like that).

If I send you guys a picture of my poop - can I get some stickers?

[xlaxparkax]

Stankin' ass bitches, they need to wash up. Don't get mad because I don't want to fuck. You need, soap and water, soap and water, soap and water, soap and water.

Best intro ever.

[WankerJist]

Personally, I am not excited for the Gary Coleman edition Xbox 360. It makes sense since they are trying to compete with the PS3 Slim market share, but really? I'm on my third 360 because of red ringing and I don't see how this can help. If they manufacture it better, I'm sold, but until then I'm skeptical. What could be in those extra inches we're losing that could improve performance? (Obligatory that's what she said.)

[token2k6]

this is my first ever time to listen to a CAGcast and holy F you guys go for 101 mins?? crazy!! keep up the good work :)

[Leggo]

Not to be the English police, but the word is "tectonic" :(

[sheppyboy2000]

Consider me shocked, honestly and deeply shocked, over the lack of reaction to the EA Online Pass system. I, myself, am torn over the issue however I'm one of those dirty, dirty bastards who enjoys DLC. The enemy to the show in several ways. However, with the online pass and now money actually exchanging hands, I have to wonder what impact, if any, this will have on EA's tendacy to close servers. What I mean is this, count the days until Bad Company 1 can no longer be played online (if that day hasn't already passed), Skate 2 becomes road kill, and Madden 2010 empties it's arenas. With EA running the servers, the threat of shutdown hits every title they publish. Hint, this isn't an EA exclusive deal either. I have plenty of 360 and PS3 games that now have no servers. With EA now actively charging for the online servers, does this now obligate them to keep them open?

Having said that, I'd like to chime in on the DLC debate. There IS good and bad in this field and while the costume packs of Super Street Fighter IV absolutely deserved the ire they gain, think about Wipeout HD Fury Pack. $10 essentially doubles the content of a $20 game. And think about how bland Rock Band would be if you couldn't expand it nearly infinitely (personally, my copy of Rock Band 2 has over 400 songs, with 47 to be added June 8th). Map packs, additional episodes, all of these things can help boost a game beyond it's initial purchase. Despite the crews opinion otherwise, the good DLC isn't stuff that would have been in the game, but rather the stuff that would have remained chopped or even held back for a "Directors Cut" or Expansion Pack. And I don't mind if they are planned at the beginning. Why? Because as a 3D artist myself, I know my job is done relatively early in a games cycle. Aside from having masses of artists suddenly unemployed, it keeps us busy between the time one projects art assets are finished and another project is ramping up. In the old days, we would be hired guns, wandering between studios, but nowadays DLC has added stability to an unusually unstable job profession. While I now work in flight simulation, I had a bunch of friends who essentially moved every 8-10 months and aside from one, most are now over 5 years living in one spot.

As to your book analogy, I'm afraid it too falls flat. More often than not, should a book become a huge success, further printings often include "insider info," research notes, new epilogues leading into sequels, forewords by other authors, after words provided by the authors, sometimes even maps and in the case of fantasy novels, translation notes from whatever variant of gibberty joob joob this author made up to add "realism" to his/her hippie elf commune. And this is all before the trilogy collections drop... books, despite being in print, do have a LOT of DLC. In fact, the entire text book industry is built around the model. The reason why we don't hear about it that often is because 90% of books are expected to fail.

[odin08]

Great singers voice cheapy. :lol:

[xlaxparkax]

If you remember Rocket Knight Adventures for the Sega Genesis, and you had the chance to play it back in the day and have fun with it's quirky, plaftorming action (which means you're not a 12 year old kid who thinks the only way to have fun with games is by giving headshots and camping on Modern Warfare 2), you should at least try out the Rocket Knight demo. I had fun with it, although I would definitely wait for it to go on sale ($10.00/800 MS points should be fine I guess).

[Broken Cage]

I'm surprised at how short-sighted everyone is being about this EA situation. There are many variables that no one seems to be considering.

First off, we have no idea how this will effect multi-gamer homes. Have any of you considered that people in your own home may have to pay $10.00 to play online even if you bought the game new? If the online pass is linked to your EA account, anyone in your home other than you might have to pay to play online.

Second, how can you say EA doesn't make any money from used games? Their games are filled to the brim with in game advertising. It doesn't matter if the game was new or used, when the ad loads in, EA gets paid. Valve or Bethesda, sure, they might not make money off of used games, but EA is getting advertising revenue.

Third, I think the biggest issue is if this is for games using EA's servers exclusively. It's one thing to ask for more revenue when gamers will be using their servers. However, to charge for P2p online that uses Xbox's matchmaking servers (which we're already paying for) would be downright criminal.

Finally, I'd like to understand why video games and movies are the only industries allowed to punish the used market. Used Books, Furniture, Cars, Televisions, MP3 players, Gaming Consoles, etc. are all perfectly ok despite the original manufacturer making no money off of the sale. It's the movie and video game industries that suffer exclusively from this dastardly business practice.

We're going to have to wait and see where EA takes this, but their current direction and everyone's complacency with it doesn't offer much comfort.

[ObiBen]

Another great show. I am glad that someone finally mentioned the issue with not being able to transfer downloaded content between Wii systems. I too hope that Nintendo would figure out some kind of strategy for this.

Wombat, I will never be able to play another EA game without thinking about Tectonic Farts.

Damn you Cheapy for getting that pooping song stuck in my head.

Ship, keep up the good work.

[Jasonofindy]

Regarding 3D Dot Game Heroes and Wombat-

The "Install" option is the last choice on the main screen with "Continue", "New Game", etc. The load times pretty much disappear when installed.

As far as your black bar issue, I think I might know the problem. The "button guide" can be shut off in the options menu. It is the translucent black bar in the lower right corner of the screen. At least on mine this bar shuts off. However, when on it doesn't really block much of the screen and it wasn't the black obstruction that first grabbed my attention.

I could be wrong and it might have just been my experience, but I'm guessing you were already in a dungeon when you first noticed the obstructed view. If so, then it is actually the bottom wall of the room you are in and not a screen overlay. Because of the game's isometric view this wall covers almost the entire bottom row of squares in many dungeon rooms occasionally obscuring enemies or the moving spike traps. I haven't found it to be too big a deal most of the time, but I agree that it can be annoying when it does obscure an enemy. There is not much that you can do about it unless they patch the game to make this wall semi-transparent or to put a slight glow or outline around enemies and the player when you are behind something.

Again, I could be totally wrong, but I found the dungeon lower wall obstruction to be much more distracting than the small button overlay and thought it might be what you were noticing since you thought you had already turned the overlay off.

Also, I've finished the first two dungeons and so far I am loving the game except for this one tiny issue. (which isn't that big of deal.)

[prence]

This EA Online Pass thing is absolutely infuriating. As it is, they expect people to spend $60 every year for what is essentially a roster update plus some minor game tweaks. There is not that much of a difference year-to-year between games yet EA doesn't see a problem charging full price for it.

I guess I see more of a problem with it when it comes to Madden because gamers don't have any other choice because of the licensing issues. It isn't the same with the NHL series because there is more than one game to choose from.

Wasn't it earlier this year that EA said they were going to start shutting down their sports servers as soon as the next year's title comes out? It would be awesome to pay for a used copy of NHL '11, spend $10 to play online, then watch the servers get turned off a few months later. How can you see nothing wrong with that?

[Han Solo]

Great show as always...

I thought we paid 50 bucks a year to play online with xbox live. Now we have to potentially pay an extra 10 bucks. Also, EA does indirectly benefit from used game sales because some people buy new EA games with the credit they get from trading in old EA games.

[MARS one]

cheapy, i think the fact that you dont buy used games or that none of you guys on the cagcast are really big sports games guys is affecting your views on this whole online pass matter. i honestly felt the same as you do, because it doesnt really affect me too much but i read a comment on destructoid that turned me around completely. the comment was in reply to how game companies have to make up the money lost from used games somehow

"games companies don't profit from used games sales, and money has to be made somehow"

Actually, it doesn't "have to be made", they simply want the extra money, and have the ability to milk it out of you. It all goes back to the fact that game companies feel entitled to a cut of secondhand sales, even though no other physical media (music, movies, books) enjoys the same luxury. Game companies are special as far as they're concerned, and since they're actually capable of crippling your experience, they have finally decided to do just that.

Even though they already received money for the original purchase, and since the original owner has since sold the game, that secondhand sale will not increase the amount of strain/use of their online services; but they still somehow feel justified in holding online play hostage until you pay them again for that disc they've already sold once before, and they didn't even have to pay to get it back! This is nothing more than a money grab, disguised as cleverly as possible as something reasonable. Credit to EA for going so far to make it look acceptable, but poo on this continued drive to milk every last cent out of gamers' pockets.

what do you think?

[Wombat]

Regarding 3D Dot Game Heroes and Wombat-

The "Install" option is the last choice on the main screen with "Continue", "New Game", etc. The load times pretty much disappear when installed.

As far as your black bar issue, I think I might know the problem. The "button guide" can be shut off in the options menu. It is the translucent black bar in the lower right corner of the screen. At least on mine this bar shuts off. However, when on it doesn't really block much of the screen and it wasn't the black obstruction that first grabbed my attention.

I could be wrong and it might have just been my experience, but I'm guessing you were already in a dungeon when you first noticed the obstructed view. If so, then it is actually the bottom wall of the room you are in and not a screen overlay. Because of the game's isometric view this wall covers almost the entire bottom row of squares in many dungeon rooms occasionally obscuring enemies or the moving spike traps. I haven't found it to be too big a deal most of the time, but I agree that it can be annoying when it does obscure an enemy. There is not much that you can do about it unless they patch the game to make this wall semi-transparent or to put a slight glow or outline around enemies and the player when you are behind something.

Again, I could be totally wrong, but I found the dungeon lower wall obstruction to be much more distracting than the small button overlay and thought it might be what you were noticing since you thought you had already turned the overlay off.

Also, I've finished the first two dungeons and so far I am loving the game except for this one tiny issue. (which isn't that big of deal.)

Thank you, I will try all of this :)

[usickenme]

My first thought when I heard about the EA plan was "Good, maybe gamestop will drop the prices of used games".

Actually, all of your analogies were terrible. I think Ship hit the nail on the head when he said "DLC could be anything". It is not one monolithic entity. Sometimes it is minor stuff added on (costumes), sometimes it is stuff that would've been included in the old days (game ending in Prince of Persia), sometimes it is completely extra gameplay (Fallout 3 expansions). I think some DLC is justified and some is not.

And Wombat, do you watch How I Met Your Mother? You are the douche that Ted was when you start lecturing on the topics for which you have some knowledge.

[Doomed]

http://i.imgur.com/4xwFg.png

Meanwhile, after we finished recording, I got a PM from a CAG who just bought a new black Wii. He has over $1000 in downloads that he can't transfer over.
There is. Contact Nintendo.

[Wombat]

And Wombat, do you watch How I Met Your Mother? You are the douche that Ted was when you start lecturing on the topics for you which you have some knowledge.

you got me on that one

[morph3us]

I wonder if EA games will cost less used, maybe 5 dollars less, so the consumer and gamestop will split the cost. This should put an end to ea games being 54.99 used the week they come out.

One thing ea didn't anticipate, is if the used game become significantly cheaper and more people buy used and don't play online. Not everyone has live, and plays online. Some people just play games with there friends, and when a game is 20 or 30 dollars less used, more people may buy it used.

[CheapyD]

Lots of good comments in here this week...thanks!

I think we all know the reason why EA and other companies play this DLC game with us...because the technology exists to do so. That's the only reason why other media formats don't do it; they can't.

The reason I am not outraged by the Online Pass is that at least I don't have to spend more than the original price of the game to gain access. I can also feel like I'm getting more value out of my day 1 purchase. It makes me crazy when I pay full price for a game only to find that the price has dropped quickly and/or their is paid DLC that really should have been there from the start.

However, the bottom line is this:

I can't recall a single piece of DLC or DLC related tech that makes me glad the system was ever implemented.

[usickenme]

you got me on that one

Oh I think we all are at times, yours is just recorded.

[SaintTJ]

Wombat, you nailed it about Capcom. Also why does it seem like your so disliked? I've listened to the show longer than I've been around the site and I personally can't see it. Great show as always guys. Thanks for making my workday suck a little less.

[mis0]

I'll definitely be taking a break from studying and listening to this podcast. The only thing I've looked forward to all year (gaming-wise) is E3.

[CaptainJoel]

Great show as always, really liked hearing how Wombat was comparing DLC to ice cream and Cheapy's review of the Just Cause 2 DLC totally saved me 160 MSP, I know it's not much, but thanks! I know I would've been really pissed if I'd bought it and found out that I needed to re-buy it from the in-game merchant after every death. Also, I'm really anxious to hear about where Ship's going on his new press junket adventure.

Oh, and Cheapy, your singing voice had me amazed, seriously, record deal, get one.

[KingBroly]

Meanwhile, after we finished recording, I got a PM from a CAG who just bought a new black Wii. He has over $1000 in downloads that he can't transfer over.

And you clearly missed the part where I said 'link it to your Club Nintendo account'. When I had my Wii repaired, I had my stuff linked to it, and that's why I was able to transfer my downloads over to it. Since he's spent over $100 on downloads, he would probably qualify for the special treatment you were discussing.

But I'll mention this again: This problem has been known about for over 2 years, and you only now discuss it?

[CheapyD]

Oh, and Cheapy, your singing voice had me amazed, seriously, record deal, get one.


Here is my first music video:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/95414510@N00/3799903198/

[sheppyboy2000]

cheapy, i think the fact that you dont buy used games or that none of you guys on the cagcast are really big sports games guys is affecting your views on this whole online pass matter. i honestly felt the same as you do, because it doesnt really affect me too much but i read a comment on destructoid that turned me around completely. the comment was in reply to how game companies have to make up the money lost from used games somehow



what do you think?

Actually, when talking about Used games versus other media formats and even items, it's a stupid comparison. Yeah, I said it. It's a stupid, stupid, stupid comparison. To make such a comparison just shows someone who makes it has NO CLUE what they are talking about. Other media formats are not comparable. Allow me to explain.

When was the last time you went into a Best Buy and saw an N64 game for $85? Chances are, we're talking at LEAST 10 years ago. Now consider this, if I were to buy a copy of Gravity Kills self-titled album in that very same Best Buy, it would be the exact same price as when it converted to CD. When was that? Roughly a year before the first Mortal Kombat Movie, making this a 17 year old album that's stayed at it's exact same price all that time. Starting to see the fallacy of this argument?

Let's look at books since that's another popular outlet. Why are used book stores so popular? Well, aside from the fact that they aren't, most of what you find in a used book store is often things out of print. Book publishers actively control the availability of product through retail chains by issuing recalls and even destroying unsold stock (thus the warning in front of every book, you should never pay for a book without a cover since the cover is how stores get reimbursed for the books they throw out). Because of this, a vast majority of the books rarely get reprinted. Meanwhile, publishers would spend more to make 100 books to fulfill demand than if they just let the free market fulfill the need. The book business in general is specifically designed to bleed money out every orafice until that one hits. The theory is then as the blood rushes back in through that one hole, it will hopefully make up for the blood loss everywhere else.

I could go on but really, I just shot to **** two of the biggest arguments. Essentially this is why the used game market is such a damaging blow to the games industry. Unlike any other media, games only get one shot to make their money back. After all, until we start tuning into Halo Reach on TBS, their only shot at making money is first hand sales. Which is why any comparisons are stupid.

[retail sucks]

"Techtonic Farts", sounds like another classy cagcast...


Yep, Cheapy has a "sh!t" fetish

[Doomed]

However, the bottom line is this:

I can't recall a single piece of DLC or DLC related tech that makes me glad the system was ever implemented.
You ever get Big Surf Island? It was overpriced, but after getting 100% in Burnout Paradise, I was almost glad the system was in place. Almost.

[shipwreck]

And you clearly missed the part where I said 'link it to your Club Nintendo account'. When I had my Wii repaired, I had my stuff linked to it, and that's why I was able to transfer my downloads over to it. Since he's spent over $100 on downloads, he would probably qualify for the special treatment you were discussing.

But I'll mention this again: This problem has been known about for over 2 years, and you only now discuss it?

Yes, the problem has been known about for 2 years. The CAGcast crew knows that. However, this is the first time a new version of the Wii has come out where people might want to make a change and get a new Black Wii. This means we get emails, this means it gets talked about, and this makes it relevant NOW. Now I know you know your stuff KingBroly, but the fact of the matter is that not everyone pays as close attention to details such as how DRM works on Nintendo systems.

[CaptainJoel]

Here is my first music video:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/95414510@N00/3799903198/
HAHAHA! Favorited! I'm proud of you, Cheapy!

[daminion]

One possible solution for game developers to combat the used game market is lower prices at release.

I only feel a handful of marquee titles are worth $50 or $60 the week they are released. The vast majority of games get a price drop shortly after release. (Ubisoft is infamous for this, I don't know why anyone would buy an Ubisoft title in it's first month.)

Lower prices would likely drive more purchases within the first month. Lower prices also mean that trade-in values are lower -- making it far less appealing to play and trade that game.

I won't buy anything at $60, but a $40 game like Dot Heroes is a no-brainer.

[TheTrueSephiroth]

Oh my god Cheapy! Your toilet freestyle song at the end of the podcast had me in tears!!! it rivals the "There you go" rap for best CAGcast song.

[Keirnoth]

About the DLC thing - I can tell you that the Street Fighter 4 DLC "content" wasn't even content you download at all. The data for the costumes was ALREADY ON THE DISC. I know this because of how the PC version was treated. As soon as the PC version was released, modders were able to replace the first costume with the "alternate" so-called DLC costume (the textures and such were already there, you just had to do a swap!). So what you're essentially paying for is to access that content. The DLC wasn't "lined up" with the release, it was purposely disabled before the game even came out.

What do you guys think of this kind of practice of purposefully including completed content on the final copy of the game but locking you out of it unless you pay extra money for it? Can you even call it DLC when all you're downloading is a "unlock key" to access that content? Sounds kinda low-brow to me.

Btw The toilet song at the end was AWESOME.

Also CheapyD, do you have Red Dead REVOLVER reserved? :D

[Curufinwe]

This EA Online Pass thing is absolutely infuriating. As it is, they expect people to spend $60 every year for what is essentially a roster update plus some minor game tweaks. There is not that much of a difference year-to-year between games yet EA doesn't see a problem charging full price for it.

Solution: don't buy games like Madden every single year.

[apathylad]

Hey guys, this was an enjoyable episode. I have a few quick comments about the EA Online Pass initiative:

I don't really care much about it right now, in that I don't buy sports games, so it doesn't concern me. I could potentially see this escalating into other genres though, which would be frustrating. I'm already paying for Xbox Live Gold, so paying extra to unlock essential features on a per game basis would be annoying, assuming used titles are all that are instock. Also, this will probably confuse a lot of customers who might not know about the EA Online Pass.

Gamestop will still profit from used sales if they price their games proportional to their value. I could easily see them promoting 1600 point cards with the purchase of a used title, and thus maximize profit.

[FriskyTanuki]

I'm a bit behind, so I'm posting some 197 comments with 198's:

Picross is not expensive to find on DS, as I got it at the local GameStop for less than $10 used and in mint condition, though I might have been lucky to have it be available at the closest GS. It's hard to find, but not rare or expensive in the least these days. Picross 3D is a great follow-up with some nice fixes to how you succeed in completing a puzzle.

I couldn't care less about Amazon balking on allowing their feed in the CAG app. Just put it out without it and patch it in if they ever give in to the demand. There's no reason to delay this app any further if it's ready to go, unless you're hoping to pull a Duke Nukem Forever on your own site by continuing to hype it up and never actually releasing it.

It's kind of stupid to say that developers should give out all of their DLC for free if you've bought it new. Say goodbye to any substantial paid DLC (GTA IV episodes, Rock Band songs, Fallout 3 expansions, etc.) because none of them would exist if they weren't going to get paid for the extra work that's required to make them after the initial game came out.

198:

It would be really interesting to see EA games become available to play online to XBL Silver members since the Gold subscription isn't paying for EA to maintain their own servers, but it'll never happen since it would be a huge precedent for others to do the same thing and ruin the whole point of paying for Live. MMOs like FFXI and PSU don't require a Gold subscription, but it seems like MS doesn't want any more MMOs on the Xbox 360 anyway. Multiplayer's a mixed bag after a certain point for any online-enabled game, like PGR3 being an impossible 1000 points because Bizarre disabled Gotham TV within two years of that game coming out.

The whole Online Pass thing is really only affecting used buyers since you can get a seven day trial for every game with your gamertag/ID that is perfect for rentals.

I avoid buying used unless the game is discontinued or very hard to find new (Picross DS) or the used price is much cheaper than new (Elite Beat Agents), so I'd get any of these new purchase "bonuses" that EA's been doing for over two years now anyway.

Of course the DLC for black market items in Just Cause 2 works like all of the other black market items you unlock as you play the game. I can understand that that whole mechanic isn't all that great, but you should've known what you were getting into if you had played JC2 at all before buying the DLC. Even the DLC I got from GameStop and the free DLC pack they released the week it came out worked that way.

Microsoft must be saving the larger space for their performance art show that is the Natal press conference.

Cheapy came so close to a Spaceballs reference and bailed on it at the last moment.

Good show.

[JadedJedi]

I think EA should just release one sports game, per sport, per console generation and have the new rosters be dlc at a price of $45. People pay $60 bucks every year for just that, but on a disc. This would be a savings for EA because they won't have to pay for manufacturing and shipping, and the player will save $15.

[Broken Cage]

When was the last time you went into a Best Buy and saw an N64 game for $85? Chances are, we're talking at LEAST 10 years ago. Now consider this, if I were to buy a copy of Gravity Kills self-titled album in that very same Best Buy, it would be the exact same price as when it converted to CD.

Store aside, are you sure you want to use Nintendo in your example? The company has made bank off of reselling their older titles. Yes, the price is much lower, but there's also ZERO manufacturing cost, unlike buying a pressed Gravity Kills CD. In fact, it was the carts that were so expensive to manufacture in Nintendo's cart days, compared to the relative cheapness of pressing discs today.

Furthermore, since Nintendo publishes their own games, they maintain their original price for a long while and avoid oversaturation. Super Mario Galaxy is still $49.99. Meanwhile, Activision and EA release annual titles that essentially compete with last year's release, forcing a price drop for last year's title or eliminating its sales all together as an "updated" version is released. This is still the game industry's fault. They're doing it to themselves.

Regardless, Virtual Console has made Nintendo a lot of money off of their old titles. Perfect Dark, Castlevania: SOTN, Doom, Call of Duty 1, and Duke Nukem are among the best selling Xbox Live Arcade games. Many old games are still bringing in revenue, with little to no material or manufacturing costs.

Edit: EA's own Battlefield: Bad Company, Skate 2, and Bungie's Halo (Released in 2001) are some of Xbox's best selling Games on Demand, also with no additional packaging costs.

[KillerRamen]

Yes, the problem has been known about for 2 years. The CAGcast crew knows that. However, this is the first time a new version of the Wii has come out where people might want to make a change and get a new Black Wii. This means we get emails, this means it gets talked about, and this makes it relevant NOW. Now I know you know your stuff KingBroly, but the fact of the matter is that not everyone pays as close attention to details such as how DRM works on Nintendo systems.

Yeah, it's very depressing. I have a launch Wii and it's been through a lot, so I would like to get one that looks presentable. I downloaded a ton of stuff when I first got my Wii, but stopped when I learned I couldn't transfer it to a new Wii.

On the plus side, this means I'm not spending $200 I don't have for a system I already own. Maybe they'll release a transfer cable or whatever when they release the Wii in Pink or some other fun color. Nintendo just doesn't seem to want my money and part of me is thankful.

...I wonder if the Gary Coleman Edition 360 will come in more colors than Black. (Black is kinda boring and my current one still runs fine.) It's also going to be kind of depressing when they announce none of the face plates or hard drives will be compatible. I have a pretty big collection of face plates and I was planning to buy an Arcade whenever my 360 gets the RROD for the 5th time. With the remodel, they're kinda forcing me to spend an extra $100 whenever the stupid thing finally dies yet again.

[canestim]

Perfect, just in time for my long drive tonight. Also got a MBMBAM show saved up from Monday as well. These shows will make it less painful.

[banodyne]

Hey guys, quick clarification. When you play EA games online, you are definitely playing on EA servers. You might remember that EA will shut down servers to games they deem old or unpopular. For example, EA shut down servers to their older versions of the Madden and NBA games. People were forced to migrate to the newer versions in order to play online.One of the major reasons I never buy EA games. When EA was the biggest games publisher they insisted they got to host to their own servers. They shut down servers and people who were playing these games are left out in the cold. Meanwhile, all other games hosted by Xbox Live are still going strong in case someone wants to play it. Heck, they supported all original Xbox games four years after the system was discontinued.

[Evilsean]

Great show as always. If publishers are so worried about used game sales why don't they just use the Cheap Ass Gamer price tracker for gamestop and set up they're own website that can sell new games that price match gamestop's used game of the same title. Slap some free shipping and I am sure a lot of people would rather have a new game than a used one.

And I can't believe Cheapy is even questioning whether to get an iPad or not. You are an Internet Space Pimp and you gots money. And since when have you ever bought anything you actually needed. I am sure we can start a forum thread 20 pages long with crap you have bought and not needed.

[ChernobylCow]

CheapyD, thanks for including the soundclip of your little toilet song. I've gotta play it for my gf. Nothing like a little improv on the squat! I mean spot.

Guys, thanks for churning out the show quite regular I really appreciate it. The last month has been hard with a death in the family and job hunting. So it is nice to have some funny and fun gentleman on hand to talk about my favorite hobby. Keep up the good work.

[Walt Jay]

Nice show guys. I look forward to the Xbox 360 - Gary Coleman Edition. :lol:

Also agree on the people pirating the Humble Indie Bundle. What kind of fucking asshole pirates a game being sold for charity, let alone one you can get for $1.00, heck, $0.01?

[Kuromimi]

Here is my first music video:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/95414510@N00/3799903198/

lol awesome! Good show guys!

[banodyne]

I wish @Gamer magazine well, if just to give Game Informer some competition. It always ticked me off that Game Informer doesn't stand on its own merits. The only reason its numbers are so high is that GameStop hard sells it as part of the discount membership. Store clerks are even given a quota of how many to sell per week. Because the numbers are so artificially high, that's where advertisers are willing to go. I'll admit it's a brilliant business model but it is a bit of a cheat. Electronic Gaming Monthly, and other gaming magazines, were better but struggled like all other print magazines on newsstands today.

[TheFreshPrince]

Cheapy, Wombat, and Shipwreck,

Quit with all the DLC complaining! When has DLC ever been legitimately good, or legitimately integral to the original retail game?

The Assassin's Creed 2 DLC stunk. The game proper would have been far worse had they included these 'missing' chapters. The Mass Effect 2 DLC isn't up to caliber either, and doesn't further the main storyline in anyway. The same can be said of Resident Evil 5 DLC, etc. DLC such as costumes in SSF4 in no way hurts the main game--it's just a foolish cosmetic add-on for crazed fans.

Regardless of at what point the DLC was developed, or even if it was 'cut' from the main game, I've yet to see DLC that felt as good as, or necessary, for the main game. Borderlands and Left4Dead2 are the only ones that have come close for me, and even those add-ons aren't needed to fully enjoy the respective game.

DLC is just an easy cash-in for companies who take advantage of fanboys with spare change.

It's not a big deal at all.

[DrainRegain]

I followed the instructions at the end of the cagcast
i pooped, now wheres my stickers and gifts and stuff?

[MotzCTG]

ClassAct can you PM me with your information for the Shred Nebula stuff.

[banodyne]

Hey what happens to the people who pay for EA's Online Passes then EA shuts down the servers 18 months after the game came out like they've done with every sports game this generation?

[beard_of_zeus]

However, the bottom line is this:

I can't recall a single piece of DLC or DLC related tech that makes me glad the system was ever implemented.

I was actually thinking about this myself. The only example of good DLC I could come up with were the Fallout 3 expansion packs. The original game was certainly crammed with enough content to stand on its own, and all the expansions were released a while after the game came out, if I recall correctly. Plus the add-ons were all pretty fun and had a lot of enjoyable content.

But in 99% of the cases, I totally agree with you; it's just the companies nickel and diming the consumer to death or selling us content from the cutting room floor because this medium of entertainment makes it oh-so-easy for them to do so.

[beard_of_zeus]

Cheapy, Wombat, and Shipwreck,

Quit with all the DLC complaining! When has DLC ever been legitimately good, or legitimately integral to the original retail game?

The Assassin's Creed 2 DLC stunk. The game proper would have been far worse had they included these 'missing' chapters. The Mass Effect 2 DLC isn't up to caliber either, and doesn't further the main storyline in anyway. The same can be said of Resident Evil 5 DLC, etc. DLC such as costumes in SSF4 in no way hurts the main game--it's just a foolish cosmetic add-on for crazed fans.

Regardless of at what point the DLC was developed, or even if it was 'cut' from the main game, I've yet to see DLC that felt as good as, or necessary, for the main game. Borderlands and Left4Dead2 are the only ones that have come close for me, and even those add-ons aren't needed to fully enjoy the respective game.

DLC is just an easy cash-in for companies who take advantage of fanboys with spare change.

It's not a big deal at all.

From a personal, short-term perspective, I am inclined to agree - you don't want the DLC, you don't have to pay for it. The only thing that worries me is that since it seems a lot of people are buying this content, it tells the game companies that their foray into this sort of business model is economically viable. I hate to use a "slippery slope" argument, but I feel like people buying all this DLC has led us to things like the EA Online Pass, and that it's only going to get worse from here on out. At that point, it finally might start affecting you.

[VidPower]

Another hilarious show. Awesome song diddy by CheapyD at the end.

[tenma]

Also agree on the people pirating the Humble Indie Bundle. What kind of fucking asshole pirates a game being sold for charity, let alone one you can get for $1.00, heck, $0.01?

This was something I actually disagreed with them on. I may be misunderstanding the system in question, but doesn't "Pay what you want" mean "Pay what you WANT"? It's a dick move to not even toss a couple of bucks towards charity, but I don't see how that's considered pirating. It'd be like going to a museum that was free, but took donations and calling anyone who didn't donate a thief for seeing the attractions for free. If the bundle normally required you donate at least a cent and people were finding ways around even paying a cent, then I agree with what Cheapy et al were saying, but I assumed that with "Pay what you want" there was inherently the freedom to choose $0 as what you want to pay. I thought it was common knowledge that this sort of business model inherently had that risk associated with it.

Regarding EA: While I'm still ticked off with the decision it has more to do with my fears that if this move is successful it may very well establish a precedent in the gaming community. Even if you're not into sports games there has to be the realization that something like this could spread to other genres. I understand why it's being done and from a business perspective I can't really fault EA for doing it. I'm just incredulous about the belief that punitive measures work better than reward-based systems. I feel like encouraging new game purchases through worthwhile bonuses and other incentives would truly be a reward as opposed to penalizing those who are simply looking for the best value. Time will tell how successful it is, but I can't help but think of how other punitive measures in gaming and other electronic-based media have done nothing but make their respective organizations (be it the RIAA, MPAA or game publishers with crippling DRM) look like the bad guys.

Disagreed with some stuff, but it was still a great show.

[reddjoey]

If the bundle normally required you donate at least a cent and people were finding ways around even paying a cent.

An article I read alluded that they were subverting the donation system all together and just direct downloading the bundle. That is piracy.


On the show:

Great show guys. I really enjoyed the poop song and the discussion on Capcom/Lost Planet 2.

[Z_meista]

man, you guys (cheapy and wombat) have a thing for poop, farts and ass-washing!
great show guys.

[tenma]

An article I read alluded that they were subverting the donation system all together and just direct downloading the bundle. That is piracy.


But is there ultimately a difference in the real, tangible sense of the word between going through a website, choosing "$0" and downloading the title versus direct downloading it? I agree that it's unfortunate that people who may otherwise have been willing to donate for the title otherwise didn't because whichever website they got the link from never mentioned they had that option. But in the end, both methods - going through the legitimate website, donating nothing and downloading it for free vs. skipping those first two steps - still yields the same end profit for that particular transaction. I guess I can see how, in the literal sense, it's considered piracy but I suppose knowing that the openly available option of getting it for free without the work-around already existed anyway just makes me hard for me to feel that angry about it.

[Midguy]

Good podcast as usual.

And oh yeah, the EA online pass is lame for obvious reasons

[Gamer SDP]

I think this is the first cagcast where the material for the "title" was toward the last few minutes.

also Cheapy, and chance you read my suggestion about the contest (having more winners by distributing the monies out?)

[Gregory_Tea]

Thank you for re-mentioning the Justin McElleroy voice comments from a few casts ago. I rarely read the show comments, i'm just a podcast fan, but thank god I checked them out.

I also started listening to Justins new podcast as a result of his appearance.

I think the comments should be aired, and I think Justin would gain much entertainment from that event.

I mean come on, you're gonna sing poop songs, discuss drugs and sex, and offend races around the world; but you're above airing some hilarious comments for guarenteed amusement?

[volt1up]

But is there ultimately a difference in the real, tangible sense of the word between going through a website, choosing "$0" and downloading the title versus direct downloading it? I agree that it's unfortunate that people who may otherwise have been willing to donate for the title otherwise didn't because whichever website they got the link from never mentioned they had that option. But in the end, both methods - going through the legitimate website, donating nothing and downloading it for free vs. skipping those first two steps - still yields the same end profit for that particular transaction. I guess I can see how, in the literal sense, it's considered piracy but I suppose knowing that the openly available option of getting it for free without the work-around already existed anyway just makes me hard for me to feel that angry about it.

You cant choose to pay $0
It's pay what you want, not pay if you want.

[Hbomb5]

Wombat,

Although I do appreciate the effort you made in avoiding the r-word, couldn't you just call the guy a moron, idiot, dope, or similar word. As someone who is on the autism spectrum, I am offended to be lumped in with this moron/idiot/dope.

Keep up the otherwise good work.

[tenma]

You cant choose to pay $0
It's pay what you want, not pay if you want.

See, this is what I didn't know. This model has been used elsewhere online - Radiohead's "In Rainbows" release is one of the bigger examples - and every other time I'd seen it there was always the option to pay $0. If this wasn't the case here then I agree with what everyone else has said so far.

[lvgamer1]

I didn't see anyone else respond to your comments about the coming Fallout CE (forgive me if this has already been said).

Wombat, you ignorant slut.

Do you have any idea how much a fair set of poker chips cost? Even an ultra cheap set of chips at walmart or target cost $20. Do you have any idea what a typical quantity is for a "set" of poker chips (300-500)? Do you have any idea how much this friggin' CE box would weigh if they included a whole set? Do you realize that as production quantities go down, the cost (per chip) increases?

If they did include a whole "set" of chips, they would probably be so light weight and crappy that you'd then proceed to bitch about the quality of the chips. If the CE chips included end up being crap, then you're argument has a little bit of validation - just a little.

As for the cards, again these are custom made. They may end up being crap, but they're not going to be that cheap to produce.

Assuming that all of the CE items are of fair quality, I think the extras would easily sell for about $20 on their own ($10 for the book, $5 for the cards, $5 for the chips).

Also, the damn game is Vegas-themed. What else would you have them include in the CE? Some fake crystal meth and a bottle of fake whiskey? Oh, I'm sorry, you would complain about the meth and the whiskey not being real....

Seriously, great show as always. Thanks for all the work you guys put into the CAGcast and the website (even you Wombat).

[SoxFan13]

I was thrilled to hear my show feedback on this week's CAGcast. I still think you guys are a little too suspicious about what is intentionally held back from retail copies of games, and what wouldn't have been made in the first place without DLC as an option. That being said, I like Wombat's take on the ice cream analogy-- something about "getting ice cream with all the toppings for 10 years, and then being told you have to pay for toppings."

Keep up the great work, and those Jean Snow references!

[actripxl]

Hey guys, this was an enjoyable episode. I have a few quick comments about the EA Online Pass initiative:

I don't really care much about it right now, in that I don't buy sports games, so it doesn't concern me. I could potentially see this escalating into other genres though, which would be frustrating. I'm already paying for Xbox Live Gold, so paying extra to unlock essential features on a per game basis would be annoying, assuming used titles are all that are instock.


Truth be told you deserve to pay more for the simple fact that you pay for Live. Live should have been free to begin with, but you paid so that got others in this case EA thinking that they should start charging something too. Activision can't be that far behind with coming up with something as well, its the snowball effect all because you, Cheapy, and others keep paying for Live. I refuse to pay for Live and because of that I haven't bought a single Xbox game since Gears 2 and most likely won't till Gears 3.

[K_G]

While not praising our new DLC overlords, I would point out that it isn’t necessarily all downside for CAGs. With Mass Effect 2, I was able to sell off the just the DLC (collectors armor, pre order bonus armor, Cerberus network code) from my collectors edition on ebay for almost as much as I paid for the entire game new.

While the ME2 armors were a specialized case with rather irrational buyer interest, I think it shows that there are some options for those that can make the effort to sell off bits of games they don’t want/need.

I’m not a big online multiplayer guy, so for me, the multiplayer competent usually doesn’t have much value. If I know that I’m going to keep a game, I’m quite able to sell off the online pass code, ultimately lowering my overall purchase price. EA may think it is putting $10 more in its pocket with this, but the odds are it is going to put $6 more in my pocket on the games I choose to keep. And on the games I sell off, that unused code is going to net a higher price compared to other copies of the game without the code.

Now not everyone is going to do this, but there will be some who will…and there will be a secondary market for these codes. If you love madden, but don’t play online, boom, now you can get a partial refund on your “online gaming tax” if you buy new…and someone else who really wants online can buy it used and pick up an online code on ebay or CAG for $7 instead of $10 worth of points. Or you can buy it used, and now that it doesn’t have access to the thing you actually don’t care about, used prices are cheaper right out the gate (ie, starting price used at Gamestop is $45 vs $55).

And while I generally agree with Cheapy’s view on DLC’s overall value, I would say that Broken Steel for Fallout 3 was a true (and literal) game changer. While some of the Fallout 3 DLC was weak, Broken Steel was both a good level and fundamentally changed how the game ended in the fact that it no longer actually ends as well as adding all sorts of interesting touches that the developer never would have thought to make during the initial game development. While some DLC is clearly designed from day one, Broken Steel was a chance for the developer to make a big changes to the game based on gamer’s wants after the game was released.

[Wombat]

I didn't see anyone else respond to your comments about the coming Fallout CE (forgive me if this has already been said).

Wombat, you ignorant slut.

Do you have any idea how much a fair set of poker chips cost? Even an ultra cheap set of chips at walmart or target cost $20. Do you have any idea what a typical quantity is for a "set" of poker chips (300-500)? Do you have any idea how much this friggin' CE box would weigh if they included a whole set? Do you realize that as production quantities go down, the cost (per chip) increases?

If they did include a whole "set" of chips, they would probably be so light weight and crappy that you'd then proceed to bitch about the quality of the chips. If the CE chips included end up being crap, then you're argument has a little bit of validation - just a little.

As for the cards, again these are custom made. They may end up being crap, but they're not going to be that cheap to produce.

Assuming that all of the CE items are of fair quality, I think the extras would easily sell for about $20 on their own ($10 for the book, $5 for the cards, $5 for the chips).

Also, the damn game is Vegas-themed. What else would you have them include in the CE? Some fake crystal meth and a bottle of fake whiskey? Oh, I'm sorry, you would complain about the meth and the whiskey not being real....

Seriously, great show as always. Thanks for all the work you guys put into the CAGcast and the website (even you Wombat).

The full set of chips was Cheapy's idea, not mine. I just agreed with him.

[stratmancj]

i think the project 10 dollar philosophy sucks. great, ea is getting more revenue for new games sold, but now we, the customers have to buy a game with a diminished trade in value. whatever the trade in value would have been, it is gong to be worth 10 dollars less. gamestop isn't going to take a loss, they are just going to pay less for all the games with this dumb feature.

[trip1eX]

The $10 online pass is most likely going to drive the trade-in value of these games downward. This is, in effect, a price increase for all, but those gamers who never trade in said games.

OTher media can do DLC (and do so in some cases) because all media formats are now distributed electronically. Multiple versions of songs. Lost never before released songs. iTunes LP. DVD extras. Memorabilia. This stuff is DLC or same difference.

Don't forget EA hasn't made money in any year the past 4 years or so. They've lost $2 billion instead. Small wonder they are trying to put some more into their coffers with these kinds of moves.


I'm with Cheapy on ignoring previews. Always a disappointment. Used to love it as a kid myself back when most CAGs were just sperm and eggs, but CAG kids - you don't know what's good for you. These publishers are selling candy to you all. And you always want more.

The black Wii and transfer of games policy? Nintendo's customer service is pretty good. Call them up and tell them your old Wii broke so you bought a new one and would like your VC games transferred pretty please.

(If that doesnt work, then worst case, you can send both Wiis in and get the content transferred. Not saying that's good, but it certainly caps the amount of money you're out of pocket to the shipping costs.)

[Interfeci]

Cheapy sounds like he was tired (or uninterested) through most of the show.

With the bundle, it'd be very interesting to wonder what was better. Sure, there's a bandwidth cost, but for everyone saying 'They should have at least donated .01' forgets that paypal has its costs. Paying a penny leaves them with credit fees, taking away more from bored children.

Think of the children!

[Dr Mario Kart]

I approach the used games issue from another angle. Every publisher complains about the income side of the equation but no one wants to control development costs. The used market has always existed. EA has always been able to sell a ton of software at retail. The thing that has changed are development costs, which goes up exponentially every generation. Meanwhile unit sales are at record highs, but growth is much slower.

These money grabs like DLC and EA Online Pass are only kicking the can down the road. At some point someone is going to have to figure out how to control costs.

These charts are old, but the point is still relevant. The last data points are ~2003, things are radically worse now. Average 360/PS3 games cost in the $20/$30 million range. This math is unsustainable. Something in the industry has to change. Digital distribution isnt a silver bullet either.

http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/4434/escapist1.jpg
http://img576.imageshack.us/img576/4248/escapist2.jpg
http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/5739/escapist3.jpg

[Kerig]

Not to be the English police, but the word is "tectonic" :(
I thought the same thing, then realized it's actually referring to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FpmCEXUL0g&feature=related

So you see, Wombat wasn't referring to Earth-shaking flatulence, but rather Gassy gay-gay dancing.

Techtonic fart can be seen at :54, results can be seen at :58.

[lvgamer1]

The full set of chips was Cheapy's idea, not mine. I just agreed with him.


Sorry Wombat! I listen to the podcast whilst I work. I didn't catch that it was Cheapy that suggested a set of poker chips; maybe I just selectively heard you talking about them. "Wombat Ball Busting" is something of a sport on this site, after all.

I may have to retract my statement about the cards though....
I just learned (from CAG) that Rockstar gave out Red Dead Redemption playing cards at some of the midnight releases. Maybe they're not all that expensive to produce after all. I collect playing cards (poker, not TCG) and a lot of the decks that are made in fairly large quantities are still $4-$8 a piece. I'll definitely be checking out BB, Gamestop, and Walmart today to see if any of these are still available (fingers crossed).

[soliddragon]

Torchlight is an awesome Diablo Clone, only thing its missing is the multiplayer.

[thwak]

Hey what happens to the people who pay for EA's Online Passes then EA shuts down the servers 18 months after the game came out like they've done with every sports game this generation?

The problem with that argument is that it assumes that someone out there is playing a sports game that's 18 months old online.

Infact let's test this theory! As far as I know the servers to NHL 09 are still up and running, if anyone out there has a copy of the game and can get into a ranked match with it please send me a screen shot of this transpiring.

I'll wait.

[Jadam]

I think the Wombat complaints are amusing. People need to stop taking their video games so seriously and lighten up.

I agree with others that the EA pass is just an attempt to get more money out of people without really providing anything new. However, I almost never buy used games so I'm not sure I really care right now.

[Josh5890]

Great CAGcast but if unless I missed it, Cheapy gave his E3 predictions but Wombat and Shipwreck didn't. Very interesting predictions though Cheapy. Hopefully more exclusives from Sony and less bouwel movement. (Playstation Move)

[smoger]

i think the project 10 dollar philosophy sucks. great, ea is getting more revenue for new games sold, but now we, the customers have to buy a game with a diminished trade in value. whatever the trade in value would have been, it is gong to be worth 10 dollars less. gamestop isn't going to take a loss, they are just going to pay less for all the games with this dumb feature.

Not if they don't lower the price of the used copy anyway. Remember, a while back their stance was that their customers don't care about "extra content" because they are budget minded. I suppose that's why EA is stepping up and making these "bonuses" more and more significant parts of the game.

I really can't agree with anyone on this point: I hate how Gamestop operates... not because they make it hard for publishers(i dont think the game industry deserves freedom from the second hand sales that EVERY other industry deals with).. only because they are so anti-consumer... buying so low and selling so high (though they've been doing better lately - I've found some surprising used prices-like No More Heroes 2 for 20 bucks- and they've had some nice promos going consecutively for a while now.. hopefully they keep this up)

On the publisher side, I hate that they are beginning to treat used game sales as they do piracy. Think about it... you see the same approach to two different scenarios: punish the customers. Why should I, as a paying customer, have to spend ANY TIME at all entering codes to access what I purchased on that disc? Heck, being that all this stuff revolves around EA accounts, some consumers are going to have to go beyond that, calling customer support to figure out how to link their gamertags, etc. I remember a lot of issues with this stuff when Mass Effect 2 came out, and the people I heard it from were well beyond the level that the average idiot consumer is.

Even as a used buyer, why should I feel bad? Why does the videogame industry feel they are above a form of bartering that exists for every non-consumable physical good ever produced? Furniture, cars, music, books. Nothing is exempt from used sales. Media at least has one Ace card- they can, and should, remove their products from being tied to physical items. The music industry learned this the hard way, and the movie industry is finally following their lead(kicking and screaming). Books are making a big leap, but games really are not(except on PC)

..And what all these internet-dependent codes mean in the long run is that at some point, there will be no way to ever get that content back again. If I play Super Mario Bros. 1 today - on my Wii, NES, whatever... it retains the entire game. All the content that I paid for 25 years ago is there. What are the chances that I'll be able to pop in Mass Effect 2 in 2035 and be able to play through Zaeed's loyalty mission? I'm going to go out on a limb and say pretty much none.

my .02

[Sigma]

I really can't understand why everyone is up in arms about the EA Pass. I personally like the concept and think it will hurt used sales a bit, which is a great thing if you ask me. Companies like Lamestop take advantage of the consumer by buying (especially with sports titles) at a considerably low price and selling for $5 less than a new copy. Being able to buy used is great, but the developers and publishers see none of that money and the fact that Gamestop is reaping in all the profit from used games sales is sickening.

My hope is that Gamestop has major issues selling these games to reap a real profit due to people not wanting to pay an extra $10 which with Gamestops pricing a newer game would actually cost an extra $5 used than it would have cost to to buy it brand new. I hope this results in Gamestop having an influx of used sports games that no one wants to buy and they are forced to lower the prices and eat the cost. That or I hope someone buys a game and the employee doesn't tell them about the online pass and then Gamestop gets sued again and eventually they go out of business forever!

In all seriousness though, like Cheapy. This will not really affect me, FIFA is the only sports game I play that EA makes and I have no problem with buying it new. I also rarely buy used games as I prefer to either pick it up new or wait for a deal.

[itachiitachi]

I find it ironic that wombat is lecturing somebody on talking about stuff they don't understand. I remember wombat after being confronted with the fact that he lacked any of understanding piracy, drm, and other aspect of PC gaming, responding by acting like a little girl on her period and refusing to discuss it any time cheapy tried to bring it up.

Wombat,

Although I do appreciate the effort you made in avoiding the r-word, couldn't you just call the guy a moron, idiot, dope, or similar word. As someone who is on the autism spectrum, I am offended to be lumped in with this moron/idiot/dope.

No wombat couldn't because that would require him to not be ignorant

Ya wombat clearly doesn't know the difference between, learning disabilities, autism and mental retardation.

[retromufc]

I've given up on this podcast. I've been a listener for the past 20 or so shows. Between the shit, fart, and toilet jokes to CheapyD unnecessarily repeatedly reminding listeners that he is earning a good living based on this website I've just had enough. The gaming talk is decent but I'm tired of listening to the other crap. I enjoy crude humor but most of what Cheapy pushes through on these podcast is not entertaining and in poor taste.

Site is good in spite of your podcast.

[RichMeisterMan]

Wombat, quit being blinded by the trolls. I don't usually follow the show threads, but when I do it's usually because I asked you or Cheapy a specific question, and for the most part Cheapy doesn't take part in the discussions as much. You are pretty vocal though and on numerous occasions you will bypass legitimate questions in order to get some kind of flame war going with someone that insulted you.

On a few occasions I have inquired about some superhero bull shit that you may have touched on in the show, only to see your response after asking being directed towards someone correcting/mocking/trolling you and my question (and I assume others') being left in the dust.

The only reason I even showed up was because I saw your tweet.

[bsachtjen]

What i dont understand is why do people complain so much about the show? By now most people know how/what these guys talk about so why do people complain? If you dont like the show thats fine, dont listen to it. There is no reason to make personal attacks at the hosts of the show that is entertaining YOU! Let them talk about what they are going to talk about and stop being douches.


thanks,

and Cheapy, I showed my GF your song and she loved it.

[SaintTJ]

What i dont understand is why do people complain so much about the show? By now most people know how/what these guys talk about so why do people complain? If you dont like the show thats fine, dont listen to it. There is no reason to make personal attacks at the hosts of the show that is entertaining YOU! Let them talk about what they are going to talk about and stop being douches.


thanks,

.

Exactly. People need to lighten up. I'm so sick of listening to people bitch about either being pc or complaining about what others do. If you don't like it do it yourself. I would like to see half the whiners produce something like this and see how it feels when a bunch of jackasses put you down for something your giving them for free. :roll: Are you lacking something in your lives that it makes you feel good to put someone's hard work down? Or are you just as ignorant as you assume someone else is.

[Gureggu]

Wow, people get so worked up.

I download every week simply because I like to hear the irreverent banter of the hosts, mixed in with some casual game discussion. Like in real-life, nobody is ever 100% statistically correct, nor does nobody ever say something which might come off offensive to certain people (but like water off a duck's back to everybody else.) I just wish CheapyD told more stories about his adventures in Japan, whether it be about the Pizza Guy or leaving money in the ATM or what's going on with Tai, I always find them fun to listen to and as Cheapy is such a frank guy, the no holds barred approach he takes to detailing things most people wouldn't even mention (a la porn and poop) is something unique you can't find anywhere else. Although Wombat does sometimes seem to be a bit of an attention seeker trying to divert conversations he can't participate in, his repertoire with Cheapy is what makes the CAGcast what is it and it would be pretty flat if it was just Ship and Cheapy, I think. Also, it would be nice to hear how Sabrina is getting along. It seems everyone here hates it when they talk about stuff unrelated to games, but I would welcome something fun like a Kid's Corner where they talk about the fun stuff their kids have done that week.

Keep up the good work and the podcast, it is much anticipated and appreciated each week.

[Kezmer]

I listen to this podcast because "I GET IT" I mean they are just a few guys bullshitting about games and life like we all do. I mean really if you just started listening I could understand, but seriously, you cannot tell that Wombat is being silly and sarcastic in just about everything? I appreciate a guy who says crazy things knowing fully that it will piss people off enough to come to a forum and bitch at him. The guy is a genius.

I am sure that I am not the only one who even listens and adds my 2 cents in after something only realizing I am not in the room lol.

This is a wonderful show and of all the pod casts i listen too, this is ALWAYS #1 on my consumption list when it shows up on my I-touch. All 3 guys know who and what they are and whether I agree 100% or not with everything they say, I love the honesty.

[Hbomb5]

Regarding the discussion on the potential name for a hypothetical Baby Boatcrash, I just assumed the Ships would go with Cheapy for a boy and Wombat for a girl. ;)

[ChicoChanqlueta]

Just started listening to the show. And it's awesome! I've been listening to the earlier shows before I get to the current ones while at work, but the Cagcast really helps the time fly at work. Keep up the amazing work and I'm very excited to hear more.

[FriskyTanuki]

I think EA should just release one sports game, per sport, per console generation and have the new rosters be dlc at a price of $45. People pay $60 bucks every year for just that, but on a disc. This would be a savings for EA because they won't have to pay for manufacturing and shipping, and the player will save $15.
The problem with that plan is that you instantly cut off everybody that's not connected to XBL or PSN after the first year, which would see those sales drop greatly for the second year and that would go down each year after that. Considering that online penetration is maybe 50% at best, you lose out on a lot of potential sales by not putting out a physical product each year.

[Sigma]

Wow, people get so worked up.

I download every week simply because I like to hear the irreverent banter of the hosts, mixed in with some casual game discussion. Like in real-life, nobody is ever 100% statistically correct, nor does nobody ever say something which might come off offensive to certain people (but like water off a duck's back to everybody else.) I just wish CheapyD told more stories about his adventures in Japan, whether it be about the Pizza Guy or leaving money in the ATM or what's going on with Tai, I always find them fun to listen to and as Cheapy is such a frank guy, the no holds barred approach he takes to detailing things most people wouldn't even mention (a la porn and poop) is something unique you can't find anywhere else. Although Wombat does sometimes seem to be a bit of an attention seeker trying to divert conversations he can't participate in, his repertoire with Cheapy is what makes the CAGcast what is it and it would be pretty flat if it was just Ship and Cheapy, I think. Also, it would be nice to hear how Sabrina is getting along. It seems everyone here hates it when they talk about stuff unrelated to games, but I would welcome something fun like a Kid's Corner where they talk about the fun stuff their kids have done that week.

Keep up the good work and the podcast, it is much anticipated and appreciated each week.
I 100% agree with everything you said.

I love the CAGcast, I look forward to it weekly and have been listening since the start. The main reason I look forward to the CAGcast each week is the fact that Cheapy, Wombat, and Shipwreck talk about games, geek culture, and life; all very casually. It's like listening to your buddies talk about video games and joke around.

I'd done a short lived podcast in the past when I worked with Kombo.com and myself and the guy who worked on it with me just didn't have the chemistry CAGcast has. The project never saw past a handful of episodes.

Keep up the great work guys and haters stop CAGcast bashing dammit!

[TheToiletDuck]

I'm totally singing that song next time i go to poop in the toilet.

[morph3us]

ok, I am going to have to completely disagree with you guys on the ea online pass. I play about 0 ea sports games, but am afraid that if this succeeds it will transfer to other games, then they will start charging 70 dollars a game. This is nothing but a money grab as the used gamers cost them no more than the original buyers did. Also I am sure alot of people trade in used games buy other ea games, so they do in fact make money off the used games market, they just feel like they don't make enough.

This is the only industry that feel like people should not be able to purchase used, can you imagine if ford charged you 1,000 dollars to use the ac and stereo on your 5,000 dollar used car?

[smoger]

The problem with that plan is that you instantly cut off everybody that's not connected to XBL or PSN after the first year, which would see those sales drop greatly for the second year and that would go down each year after that. Considering that online penetration is maybe 50% at best, you lose out on a lot of potential sales by not putting out a physical product each year.

So perhaps they update the core game each year(replacing the old), but offer the DLC as an option to those who already purchased it.

[super_nerd]

I would like to have Cheapy sing the poopee song at my wedding, where do I sign up? Here's my credit card number, 12345 (same combination as my luggage!).

I agree with Cheapy on the EA and dlc matter; thanks to CAG I buy new games cheaply so it doesn't effect me. If there's anything to get angry over, it's pay for dlc. Take Mass Effect 2 for example. I love this game but all this dlc is nonsense! I'm shaking my fist in the air here. What next, charging for my space hamster in ME3! Please don't do that :( I am not buying ME3 until a goty edition is released because this is getting out of hand.

Great show as always, and Cheapy needs to sing more.

P.S. I am stalking Wombat on steam. I hope I can grief you in the near future Wombat, buy and play some more games on steam!