Game Informer: Multiple Sources confirm new HD console at E3 for Nintendo

[jbug617]

www. gameinformer. com/b/news/archive/2011/04/14/new-nintendo-console-at-e3.aspx

Now with a price drop for the Wii it makes total sense at E3 to announce a new console.

[KingBroly]

It'd only make sense if it were launching this year.

[Scorch]

HD? More powerful than the PS3 or 360?

http://i51.tinypic.com/1z3oxzc.jpg

You give me an HD system with the virtual console where I can download NES, SNES, Sega, N64, etc. with a decent online system and the ability to play current huge titles.. I'll be extremely, extremely happy. I hope that they are abandoning motion controls.

[whoknows]

I wonder if it'll be able to play DVD's this time.

[foltzie]

Tag, this should be an interesting thread.

[TheLongshot]

It'd only make sense if it were launching this year.

Can the Nintendo faithful support sales of both the 3DS and a new home console?

edit: this says late 2012 release. I really think they should be aiming for late 2011, actually.

http://wii.ign.com/articles/116/1161875p1.html

[mtxbass1]

Can the Nintendo faithful support sales of both the 3DS and a new home console?

I know I can't, and I have plenty of disposable income. I just can't justify yet another new system right now.

[KingBroly]

Can the Nintendo faithful support sales of both the 3DS and a new home console?

I can because I don't have a desire to get a 3DS right now. As for Nintendo...

Depends on what software the 3DS has. If the 3DS has Mario Kart, Kid Icarus and Animal Crossing this fall then they could probably get away with pushing a new console over the 3DS. We'd be left to wonder what franchise they launched alongside with a Wii HD, because as it stands right now, it can't be Mario (Galaxy team is working on Super Mario), it can't be Zelda (Skyward Sword) and it probably isn't Pokemon since they hate working on console Pokemon games.

And given the information news sources are putting out there right now, with the Wii price drop, the supposed pre-announcement later this month with more details at E3, it kinda makes it sound like it's this year.

[david12795]

i feel like the games of the wii generation hasnt even "started" and its been almost 6 years

[seanr1221]

What was one of my Wii2 (Wiiii?) predictions? That you would see ports of best sellers from the 360/PS3? Oh yeah.

[WormFOODx]

We'd be left to wonder what franchise they launched alongside with a Wii HD, because as it stands right now, it can't be Mario (Galaxy team is working on Super Mario), it can't be Zelda (Skyward Sword) and it probably isn't Pokemon since they hate working on console Pokemon games.

Then you forget what they did with the last Zelda game. They could release a bulked up Wii game for the launch while the Wii get's the Skyward Sword we were expecting. Is it great? Not for the new system owners. Will they do it? Sure.

This also makes me think that this was the strategy since before the Wii. Strap two Gamecubes together and launch motion controls cheaply while spending all of your R&D budget on a new system in stealth mode.

If so, well played.

[foltzie]

Game Informer first reported that the console is capable of running games at "HD resolutions." Our sources have said the the console is significantly more powerful than the PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360, and that Nintendo's intent is to recapture the hardcore market. Another source said it is capable of 1080p resolutions

Seems unusual to directly target the "Hardcore Market". New hardware may put it in parity or even a touch pass the PS3/360 and still be reasonably priced due to component cost reductions, but splurging on hardware is not in Nintendo's DNA.

[seanr1221]

Then you forget what they did with the last Zelda game. They could release a bulked up Wii game for the launch while the Wii get's the Skyward Sword we were expecting. Is it great? Not for the new system owners. Will they do it? Sure.

This also makes me think that this was the strategy since before the Wii. Strap two Gamecubes together and launch motion controls cheaply while spending all of your R&D budget on a new system in stealth mode.

If so, well played.

You might be on to something.

Take a generation to build a new user base. Then pull the core gamers back (along with your new customers) to this new console.

Nintendo has a lot of catchup though. Securing popular 3rd party titles and a solid online structure would be a good start.

[Scorch]

IGN's article says it's fully BC

http://wii.ign.com/articles/116/1161875p1.html

[TheLongshot]

Seems unusual to directly target the "Hardcore Market". New hardware may put it in parity or even a touch pass the PS3/360 and still be reasonably priced due to component cost reductions, but splurging on hardware is not in Nintendo's DNA.

Well, being a few years down the line, you don't necessarily need to splurge to be better than a PS3/360, considering PC hardware is more sophisticated than any console right now.

[KingBroly]

Then you forget what they did with the last Zelda game. They could release a bulked up Wii game for the launch while the Wii get's the Skyward Sword we were expecting. Is it great? Not for the new system owners. Will they do it? Sure.

This also makes me think that this was the strategy since before the Wii. Strap two Gamecubes together and launch motion controls cheaply while spending all of your R&D budget on a new system in stealth mode.

If so, well played.

No, I haven't. Big difference here is that Skyward Sword is being 100% designed with WM+ in mind so it probably can't move over to another console that easily. Especially since every Nintendo home console has had a different controller. So it is very likely that it wouldn't transfer over to a regular interface that well, if it's that way.

You could probably still play it on the new machine (and maybe upscaled/uprendered) but it'd have to be with the Wiimote.

[seanr1221]

http://twitter.com/jimreilly/statuses/58622803158642688

1080p?

[seanr1221]

No, I haven't. Big difference here is that Skyward Sword is being 100% designed with WM+ in mind so it probably can't move over to another console that easily. Especially since every Nintendo home console has had a different controller. So it is very likely that they won't be compatible.

I'm telling you, same/similar controller as the wii remote with a CC pro bundled. They want to keep the casual crowd and pull the core back in. Not scare the casuals away.

[TheLongshot]

No, I haven't. Big difference here is that Skyward Sword is being 100% designed with WM+ in mind so it probably can't move over to another console that easily. Especially since every Nintendo home console has had a different controller. So it is very likely that it wouldn't transfer over to a regular interface that well, if it's that way.

You could probably still play it on the new machine (and maybe upscaled/uprendered) but it'd have to be with the Wiimote.

Except that they are talking about compatibility with the Wii, so it may not be THAT different.

Course, with Bluetooth controllers being all the rage, it isn't as big of a deal as it used to be to hook up old controllers.

[KingBroly]

I'm telling you, same/similar controller as the wii remote with a CC pro bundled. They want to keep the casual crowd and pull the core back in. Not scare the casuals away.

Nintendo always changes things up. The closest thing I could see them doing is something like NES > SNES where the controller got 6 extra buttons (X, Y, L, R).

[62t]

about time. The Xbox 360 hardware is really dated

[JSiggy]

cool.

I hope it's backwards compatible with Wii games, then I'll just trade in my wii & upgrade

[Strell]

I wonder if it'll be able to play DVD's this time.

Even better, it'll play HD DVDS! Exclusively! And only if they star Corey Feldman.

[laaj]

I wonder if it'll be able to play DVD's this time.

No. That will mean paying the DVD licensing fee.

IGN's article says it's fully BC

http://wii.ign.com/articles/116/1161875p1.html

Late 2012 launch according to that link. That should be enough time for DQ X to come out on the Wii. And this means Zelda:SS won't be coming out for the new console unless Nintendo want to port a year old game as a launch game. If they are willing to do that why stop at Zelda. Why not port over Galaxy games too.

cool.

I hope it's backwards compatible with Wii games, then I'll just trade in my wii & upgrade

No Gamecube games in your collection?


Here's to hoping DQ X comes out on current Wii so that I don't have to get the new Nintendo home console.

[ROB64]

Really hope this doesn't mean Skyward Sword will be another port. :(

[slidecage]

Can the Nintendo faithful support sales of both the 3DS and a new home console?

edit: this says late 2012 release. I really think they should be aiming for late 2011, actually.

http://wii.ign.com/articles/116/1161875p1.html

still be interesting to see how long the 3ds can last with all of the bad info on it (making people sick ect ect ect)

[Dead of Knight]

I honestly have no excitement for this as I doubt Nintendo of America will get its shit together in the near future.

[limelight022]

Shovelware in HD....great...

[Ma12kez]

This could be interesting. I have completely given up on Nintendo this generation by selling/trading my DS and Wii along with their associated games. I don't have very high expectations, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't intrigued by this announcement/rumor.

[Sinfulfate]

I honestly have no excitement for this as I doubt Nintendo of America will get its shit together in the near future.
This.

[cochesecochese]

where is my next gen nintendo ON video

[Cao Cao]

And here comes the crazy (from the GAF topic (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=427412))...

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/298241/news/wii-2-has-all-new-hd-controller-out-2012-sources/

What's most exciting about the Wii successor however is its all-new controller, which industry sources have indicated is not simply an upgraded Wii Remote, and will even feature a built-in HD screen.

Our sources did not specify whether or not the controller displays will feature any other functionality, such as that of the DS's touch screen, but it's easy to imagine the sort of innovation an extra screen could bring to Wii 2 games.

"Nintendo's plans sound unreal," one source said. "Publishers are already planning launch titles and it's all very exciting.

"The hardware is even more powerful than current HD consoles and backwards compatible with Wii. The controller will be all-new and has a HD screen on it."

[cochesecochese]

sounds like a lot of bullshit

edit: oh wow it looks like someone disabled the avatars at GAF for some reason. if it's some kind of preventative measure ahead of E3, I like

[laaj]

I honestly have no excitement for this as I doubt Nintendo of America will get its shit together in the near future.

Not going to happen long as Reggie stays. He really needs to cut back on those cheesburgers though. Every E3 he gets fatter.

[whoknows]

Not going to happen long as Reggie stays. He really needs to cut back on those cheesburgers though. Every E3 he gets fatter.

He can't help that cheeseburgers are fuckin delicious.

[Wolfpup]

AAAAH! AAAAAAH! I'm so excited I can't even look at anything yet! Do we have specs? Will it have a real controller? Oh man, I can't wait!

[Wolfpup]

Don't know why the IGN article is saying some things its saying. Game Informer says they don't know if it'll be more powerful-but it'll be comparable. Don't know if it'll be backwards compatible. I'm guessing it won't, because Nintendo's pretty terrible with that.

Still, I'm DAMN excited.

Can we please, PLEASE slap anyone who says anything about "Kiddie"? Dude. Mario is not "kiddie". It's a bad ass game that happens to be all ages. Grow up. I play M rated stuff all the time, I play great E rated games too.

[spmahn]

Good lord, please eliminate the motion sensor crap, the gimmick has run it's course, and everyone is tired of it. Also, please banish shoveware from appearing on the system, put those companies making Horsez and Babiez and Minute to Win It the Video Game, out of business where they belong. Please also eliminated the antiquated region lock system, it's just not necessary anymore.

[Wolfpup]

Good lord, please eliminate the motion sensor crap, the gimmick has run it's course, and everyone is tired of it.

Oh man, I can only dream! :applause:

I'm not counting on it though, so I'll be THRILLED if it's in the box, but so is a nice normal pad too...I'd consider that a huge win.

Dang...please do this Nintendo, and people, PLEASE DON'T BE IDIOTS AND ACTUALLY SUPPORT NINTENDO WHEN THEY'RE DOING GOOD GAMES! (Thank you!) :-D

It would be hilarious though if Nintendo released this really powerful almost next-gen system, with a normal pad, and then Sony and Microsoft just moved Wii-ward :-D

[caltab]

And here comes the crazy (from the GAF topic (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=427412))...

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/298241/news/wii-2-has-all-new-hd-controller-out-2012-sources/

Sounds like a high tech dreamcast controller, the memory unit had an LCD screen.

[Salamando3000]

Sounds like a high tech dreamcast controller, the memory unit had an LCD screen.

http://www.cablemax.com.tw/product/gamecube%20to%20GBA%20link%20cable.jpg

Nintendo also had this little thing. I only used it for two games though...Mega Man X: Command Mission, where it was only used as a radar tool for finding hidden items...and Legend of Zelda: Four Swords Adventure, where it gave each player their own screen when in a cave or so.

Having a screen on the controller only really has an effect on local multi-player gameplay....there it can show players info that they can choose to use with or against other local players. With single-player, there's no reason why they couldn't just show that information on the screen...it's not like my Cat is going to be able to use that info to backstab me. Since I do most of my multiplayer online, I'll find it hard to care about this feature...if it turns out to be real, of course.

[caltab]

^Agree with superphillip. The first party wii games are very solid. Mario galaxy 1 and 2, Mario Kart, Paper Mario, Punch Out, Smash bros., warioware, Wario land, Dkc, Kirby, new Mario bros, Metroid, and upcoming Zelda. They pretty much hit all the classics. I don't really see how thats abandoning their base. As someone who still remembers getting the original nes many xmas's ago, I don't feel abandoned by those titles.

[whoknows]

Sounds like a high tech dreamcast controller, the memory unit had an LCD screen.

If they use VMU's for the Wii 2 I'm in.

Need to walk my Chao.

[KingBroly]

Here was the Wii's problem, and still is:

Third Parties were never on board. The idea that they abandoned the Wii is a joke because they were never on board to begin with. The only company that got on board with the Wii was Ubisoft, and that never really materialized into much besides Red Steel 2. But even that was poorly marketed. The only company that hopped on the bandwagon was Activision after Guitar Hero 3 was in the Top 10 for NPD's on Wii for 10 months or so.

Beyond that, you got maybe 1 or 2 hardcore games from each company besides Sega with Sonic, but Nintendo basically owns Sonic now. Capcom gave us RE4 as a test, but followed it up with 2 lightgun shooters. Third parties never supported the Wii, that's the issue, and that's probably why we'll probably see a WiiHD sooner than later.

[Monsta Mack]

Considering I hardly use my Wii I'll probably never get one for a long time. Knowing Nintendo who priced the 3DS at $250 I'm expecting $300+.

What Nintendo is going to have to do is get MUCH better third party support (which knowing past trends with the Gamecube and Wii1 they won't) and make a functional online system (which they won't most likely either) to get me to buy this anywhere close to It's release or even the first few years its out on the market.

I don't think anyone is going to deny FIRST PARTY support - Nintendo HAS delivered to their fans throughout the years with GREAT first party games. I just want to see them reach out and make a bigger effort towards third party. I'm hoping since It's on par with 360/PS3 graphics wise (or better) that we will see more multi platform games on the Wii 2, and not just 360/PS3.

[Dead of Knight]

Not going to happen long as Reggie stays. He really needs to cut back on those cheesburgers though. Every E3 he gets fatter.

Cheeseburgers? More like copies of Mother 3.

Funny. That's a fallacy itself. Do you have any proof of that? Software sales are highest on Wii. Bet you assumed differently.

And how the hell did they abandon their fanbase with 3 Mario games, a new DKC game, Kirby, a new entry to a franchise that sold like shit (Sin and Punishment), plus more?

It's laughable that I even post here. You people are SO out of touch and bitter.
They didn't really abandon their fanbase in Japan and sort of in Europe as well, as they have released some original, interesting games there that appeal to the hardcore mindset (Xenoblade, Last Story, Reginleiv, Disaster, Captain Rainbow, probably Pandora's Tower, Last Window, Mother 3, Soma Bringer, I'm sure I'm missing some but you get the point). You can't do everything with franchises. Unfortunately NOA REFUSES to release hardly any of these here, which is what is pissing people off. Sin & Punishment was an exception, and they did a shit job marketing it. These games may not appeal to you, but they appeal to a lot of hardcore gamers, including CAGs. NOA is the one who has abandoned the hardcore, not NCL, not NOE (for the most part).

[cochesecochese]

Nintendo also had this little thing.

It was rad chilis with Wind Waker. Tingle Tuner was, ultimately, little more than a gimmick but it was oh so hilarious and it did provide a way to burn away those excess rupees post treasure map hunt.

NOA is the one who has abandoned the hardcore, not NCL, not NOE (for the most part).
Agreed. NCL is god tier and NOE does a damn good job considering how many regions they have to localize for. I know for a fact it was Reggie's job at one point to determine which games to bring to America and I'm sure he still has final say. His choices are far too conservative for my tastes. Regarding S&P 2, according to several posters on GAF it was a test by NOA to see whether it would sell enough to make Reginleiv worth localizing; it failed that test thanks to shitty marketing. I'm thinking the only way we will even see DQX is if Iwata himself makes a big push for it.

[theflicker]

Don't know if it'll be backwards compatible. I'm guessing it won't, because Nintendo's pretty terrible with that.

Really?

GB->GBA
GBA->DS
DS->3DS
GC->Wii

I think they're the company with the best record of backwards compatibility.

Nintendo is going to justify their existence by pointing to Wii's enormous sales figures, which itself is a fallacy, since the vast majority of the people who bought it had fun with Bowling for a month, never bought another game, and then stopped playing shortly after. Most (all) of these people will have zero interest in buying an upgraded Wii, and the majority of them have moved onto other stuff like Angry Birds or Farmville anyway, so Nintendo is going to have to start from square one in finding an audience for their new console.

It seems funny to me that people who arguably have "moved on" from Wii Bowling to Angry Birds/Farmville (if that is an actual thing) now won't be expected to move on to Wii2. Won't this demographic, again, if it is one, be more likely to go, "Oooh look at the shiny new Wii2! HD BOWLING PLZ." It's like saying people who are into the newest things won't be into . . . the newest thing.

If Nintendo wants to compete in this next generation, they will have no choice but to apologize to their fanbase that they abandoned these last two generations, and the third parties they have alienated, and make games that people want to play, and appeal to different audiences, no more of this one size fits all crap where every game has to appeal to everyone ages 2 - 100.

Oh, so many sour grapes. Instead of fretting late nights by the phone waiting for the apology they apparently owe me I'll be playing games.

[TheLongshot]

Here was the Wii's problem, and still is:

Third Parties were never on board. The idea that they abandoned the Wii is a joke because they were never on board to begin with. The only company that got on board with the Wii was Ubisoft, and that never really materialized into much besides Red Steel 2. But even that was poorly marketed. The only company that hopped on the bandwagon was Activision after Guitar Hero 3 was in the Top 10 for NPD's on Wii for 10 months or so.

Ubisoft also made a Wii-specific Prince Of Persia game that was pretty good and brought over the No More Heroes games.

Beyond that, you got maybe 1 or 2 hardcore games from each company besides Sega with Sonic, but Nintendo basically owns Sonic now. Capcom gave us RE4 as a test, but followed it up with 2 lightgun shooters. Third parties never supported the Wii, that's the issue, and that's probably why we'll probably see a WiiHD sooner than later.

Capcom also made the unappreciated Zack & Wiki and brought over Tatsunoko vs Capcom when no one really thought that was going to happen.

The problem I see was that the issue was on both sides. While you can claim that third party developers didn't always bring their A game to the Wii, hard-core gamers also didn't support the games that were released. It seems like a lot of these games that were released didn't sell all that well. That's probably because early on, hard-core gamers decided to abandon the console because of what they perceived were the Wii's shortcomings. (Lack of HD, the unconventional controllers, disappointing online features.)

Personally, I didn't have a problem with the lack of HD, since many games still look pretty good (and most look superior than the PS2 games I also play). I also never really had a problem with the controllers themselves, and usually when there is a problem, it is more about how the game implements the controllers than the controllers themselves. Maybe the hardcore gamers are too set in their ways with the gamepad, which has been the standard form factor since the NES and really hasn't changed all that much over the years.

Maybe the combination of the growing pains of a new control scheme with the perception that the console was mostly selling to the casual market caused some developers not to want to play in this sandbox. It is unfortunate, since I think the controls lend themselves well to FPSs, since the control scheme is closer to a mouse/keyboard scheme on the PC, which is what I prefer.

[KingBroly]

I didn't have a problem with HD either. The only time I ever commented on the badness of the Wii's graphics were when I started up the original No More Heroes. I also never had a problem with controls on the Wii with the exception of Tomb Raider Anniversary, which I sold. If a game's controls don't work, or are wonky, it's usually the first thing I notice, especially if I can't get used to them.

Metroid Prime 3's Controls > All FPS's on PS3/360 without KB/M support

As for online play, I wish Nintendo had tied it to the Wii system code, which would've saved a lot of hassle. I also wish some game saves weren't locked to the console itself.

As far as perception goes, you can change the perception of something, it's never too late to do it. However, it's hard to do it by yourself. You need others to support you in your cause. Without third parties to support Nintendo this gen they had to crank out a lot of software they usually wouldn't do, and in turn the hardcore went 'that's all Nintendo does nowadays is pump out sequels.' It's the only thing they could do without the support of others.

[theflicker]

I also never really had a problem with the controllers themselves, and usually when there is a problem, it is more about how the game implements the controllers than the controllers themselves. Maybe the hardcore gamers are too set in their ways with the gamepad, which has been the standard form factor since the NES and really hasn't changed all that much over the years.

You have a bingo.

I've been thinking a lot lately about how great the split chuk+mote control scheme is so damn comfortable. After playing a few games of The Show on a DS3 my hands get seriously cramped.

The main problem is exactly as you stated. Too many developers seemed to look at the controller and screamed, "NOT ENOUGH BUTTONS!" and then proceeded to map controls to every button on the thing, including the '1' and '2' buttons, which are really best suited for calling up maps and other auxiliary commands.

I've been playing Wii Sports Resort lately as Pilotwings Resort has gotten me reinterested in the Island Flyover game. Unfortunately, this is one of those examples of poor control layout. You're supposed to hold the wiimote like a paper plane, but then all of the fun controls are on the buttons up top. So I have to choose between flying properly (Perfectly level flying is the supreme challenge of the scale-model pilot) and shooting flares into crowds and busting up babies balloons.

[KingBroly]

Maybe it'll be a Classic Controller but split?

Left: Analog stick, D-pad, L1/L2, Start/Select/Home
Right: Analog stick, 4 buttons, R1/R2

[Wolfpup]

If Nintendo wants to compete in this next generation, they will have no choice but to apologize to their fanbase that they abandoned these last two generations, and the third parties they have alienated, and make games that people want to play, and appeal to different audiences, no more of this one size fits all crap where every game has to appeal to everyone ages 2 - 100.

They started out that way with the Wii (although I think it's gotten fairly strong as its gone along), but last gen they had the Gamecube.

The only company that got on board with the Wii was Ubisoft, and that never really materialized into much besides Red Steel 2.

And Rabbids Go Home! A handful more games-No More Heroes 2 is awesome. Namco's The Munchables is awesome...umm...

Beyond that, you got maybe 1 or 2 hardcore games from each company besides Sega with Sonic, but Nintendo basically owns Sonic now. Capcom gave us RE4 as a test, but followed it up with 2 lightgun shooters. Third parties never supported the Wii, that's the issue, and that's probably why we'll probably see a WiiHD sooner than later.

Which...yeah, you said with your 1-2 games per company. Sega gave us Sonic Colors (haven't played it yet, but own it and supposedly good). Aaaaaand...hmm.

Even fairly casual gamers I know who always buy only Nintendo have in one case bought a Playstation 3 instead, or started with a Wii and bought another console after a while.

Agreed. NCL is god tier and NOE does a damn good job considering how many regions they have to localize for. I know for a fact it was Reggie's job at one point to determine which games to bring to America and I'm sure he still has final say. His choices are far too conservative for my tastes.

What else could have been brought over? I'm not aware of anything (am I about to get mad, learning of a pile of awesome games I'm missing? :lol:) Well, there is Sakaguchi's game which hasn't made it yet, but I keep assuming it will...I mean it would be insane if it didn't. (Where's Working Designs when you need them...)

Regarding S&P 2, according to several posters on GAF it was a test by NOA to see whether it would sell enough to make Reginleiv worth localizing; it failed that test thanks to shitty marketing. I'm thinking the only way we will even see DQX is if Iwata himself makes a big push for it.

Don't know what Reginleiv is, but I hated Sin and Punishment 2. Thought it was pretty much garbage, graphically and gameplay.

Really?

GB->GBA
GBA->DS
DS->3DS
GC->Wii

I think they're the company with the best record of backwards compatibility.

And I think they're at best tied with a bad lot so far. That's not fair maybe since Microsoft doesn't have a third console yet, though from how seriously they take it on PC (which I suppose you could count in this discussion) I think there's a good shot they'll take it semi-seriously on consoles.

You'll note the huge problem with all the systems you listed-they're never backwards compatible more than one generation. And the NES, SNES, N64, and Gamecube had zero.

"GB->GBA"

This was cool, and they included hardware to do it...but it was dropped from the DS.

"GBA->DS"

Also cool, but the writing was on the wall given that they dropped Gameboy support. Sure enough, they've not only dropped GBA support, they dropped it midway through the DS' lifecycle!

"DS->3DS"

Maybe this'll stick around, maybe not...but given their terrible track record, we shouldn't expect compatibility more than one generation.

"GC->Wii"

This is meaningless. The Wii *IS* a Gamecube. Given their terrible track record, we can expect a true current/next gen console to dump compatibility.

While I guess you think those examples are impressive-I think the exact opposite. All we have is compatibility with a single generation on the handhelds, and then its dropped. That's unacceptable, and unimpressive.

Let me play Gameboy games in my 3DS and I'll be impressed.

It seems funny to me that people who arguably have "moved on" from Wii Bowling to Angry Birds/Farmville (if that is an actual thing) now won't be expected to move on to Wii2. Won't this demographic, again, if it is one, be more likely to go, "Oooh look at the shiny new Wii2! HD BOWLING PLZ."

I seriously doubt it. These people aren't in to real games...I mean it's like saying someone likes movies because they watch clips of some guy riding a tricycle on Youtube every once in a while. They get cheap/free stuff on their phone and they're happy. They don't "get" buying dedicated hardware. They don't "get" paying $20, 30, 40, 50 for a game, or sometimes even paying at all.

Maybe with luck and great marketing they'll randomly go on to another Nintendo thing, but I think Nintendo needs to somehow attract people who actually like games, and continue to get as many casual people as will go along. It's tough...particularly since so many people who love games were idiotic about the Gamecube, and threw around "Kiddie" all the time, because they're retarded.

I don't know what you do about that. Luck. Marketing? Good third party support? If Nintendo continues a focus on real games, I wish them all the luck in the world, because I miss them and I miss Sega and other real game companies doing game systems.

[ECube3]

Wow, this is gonna be sooo cool, can't wait at all :) haha i love it that it's THE time for consoles to switch GEN's .. it's already happening and only more OWNAGE to come :)

[dothog]

Backwards compatible, eh? Great, can't wait to move my VC library over.

[theflicker]

And I think they're at best tied with a bad lot so far. That's not fair maybe since Microsoft doesn't have a third console yet, though from how seriously they take it on PC (which I suppose you could count in this discussion) I think there's a good shot they'll take it semi-seriously on consoles.

You'll note the huge problem with all the systems you listed-they're never backwards compatible more than one generation. And the NES, SNES, N64, and Gamecube had zero.

"GB->GBA"

This was cool, and they included hardware to do it...but it was dropped from the DS.

"GBA->DS"

Also cool, but the writing was on the wall given that they dropped Gameboy support. Sure enough, they've not only dropped GBA support, they dropped it midway through the DS' lifecycle!

"DS->3DS"

Maybe this'll stick around, maybe not...but given their terrible track record, we shouldn't expect compatibility more than one generation.

"GC->Wii"

This is meaningless. The Wii *IS* a Gamecube. Given their terrible track record, we can expect a true current/next gen console to dump compatibility.

While I guess you think those examples are impressive-I think the exact opposite. All we have is compatibility with a single generation on the handhelds, and then its dropped. That's unacceptable, and unimpressive.

Let me play Gameboy games in my 3DS and I'll be impressed.

Eh, you're changing your terms. You said that Nintendo wouldn't have backwards compatibility because they're "pretty terrible with that". They've shown a history of backwards compatible hardware. It's pretty ridiculous to expect to be able to plug your Power Pad and ROB into your Wii2.

Let me know how well your UMDs play on the NGP this fall.

I seriously doubt it. These people aren't in to real games...I mean it's like saying someone likes movies because they watch clips of some guy riding a tricycle on Youtube every once in a while. They get cheap/free stuff on their phone and they're happy. They don't "get" buying dedicated hardware. They don't "get" paying $20, 30, 40, 50 for a game, or sometimes even paying at all.

I think the same market that upgrades its iPhones and iPads each year will be interested in a new Wii after 6 years.

[dothog]

I think the same market that upgrades its iPhones and iPads each year will be interested in a new Wii after 6 years.
I agree with the sentiment, but it goes well beyond Apple zealots.

I'd wager most Wii owners will be interested in however Nintendo "refreshes" the Wii. All Nintendo has to do is give it the same novelty on launch that the Wii had. It sounds like they have that. And they'll have one decent first-party title on launch to feature that novelty. (Wii Sports was HUGE. HUGE.)

Anyone who thinks Nintendo won't sell the dick out of their nextgen console hasn't paid attention to Nintendo in the post-GCN era. They don't waste money or development time going after ideas that don't succeed. The only way I could see them screwing it up is if they don't price as aggressively as they did the Wii on launch -- their repeat console customers might expect that of them.

And don't bring up the 3DS, the pricing there makes sense. We're talking moving consoles, not handhelds.

[soonersfan60]

They should make every NES and SNES title available for VC download on day 1 of the Wii2's launch. That would be instant sales to tons of hardcore fans.

[Vader582]

I think the same market that upgrades its iPhones and iPads each year will be interested in a new Wii after 6 years.
I think you have the markets confused.
The folks who buy a Wii may be looking to save money with a cheaper console option. "Cheaper" is a category Apple products do not fall into...

[foltzie]

They should make every NES and SNES title available for VC download on day 1 of the Wii2's launch. That would be instant sales to tons of hardcore fans.

And a unicorn, they should include a unicorn with every console.

[dothog]

They should make every NES and SNES title available for VC download on day 1 of the Wii2's launch. That would be instant sales to tons of hardcore fans.

HAHA, this is delightful. Let me introduce you to the Virtual Console on the Wii. Trust me, it doesn't move console units. In fact, it doesn't move at all. It just sits there, tethered to the machine, rusting away.

Also, let's not even discuss the logistics of getting *every* title to run in emulation, let's just giggle for a bit.

[theflicker]

I think you have the markets confused.
The folks who buy a Wii may be looking to save money with a cheaper console option. "Cheaper" is a category Apple products do not fall into...

And cheaper products can't be purchased by people with lots of money?

People who like new tech will be interested in buying the Wii2.

[Vader582]

And cheaper products can't be purchased by people with lots of money?

People who like new tech will be interested in buying the Wii2.
It's a possibility but not a given.
I want a new iPhone but have no interest in the Wii Too, at this point.
The Wii is successful because of its price point not in-spite of it.

[TheLongshot]

I didn't have a problem with HD either. The only time I ever commented on the badness of the Wii's graphics were when I started up the original No More Heroes. I also never had a problem with controls on the Wii with the exception of Tomb Raider Anniversary, which I sold. If a game's controls don't work, or are wonky, it's usually the first thing I notice, especially if I can't get used to them.

Well, NMH seems to be the graphical style they decided to go with. I agree, not the most beautiful game in the world.

As for online play, I wish Nintendo had tied it to the Wii system code, which would've saved a lot of hassle. I also wish some game saves weren't locked to the console itself.

Not to mention the Wiiware store, which isn't very user-friendly. I'm hoping that's one of the big improvements with the new console (as well as being able to move your games, like the 3DS is allowing.)

As far as perception goes, you can change the perception of something, it's never too late to do it. However, it's hard to do it by yourself. You need others to support you in your cause. Without third parties to support Nintendo this gen they had to crank out a lot of software they usually wouldn't do, and in turn the hardcore went 'that's all Nintendo does nowadays is pump out sequels.' It's the only thing they could do without the support of others.

This is a good point. People complain about the lack of risks in game titles, but the 1st party games had to carry the console. I wonder if we would have had a new Goldeneye game if it weren't for the weak 3rd party support.

Maybe it'll be a Classic Controller but split?

Left: Analog stick, D-pad, L1/L2, Start/Select/Home
Right: Analog stick, 4 buttons, R1/R2

I saw a similar idea in Game Informer when they were talking about future controller ideas.

Which...yeah, you said with your 1-2 games per company. Sega gave us Sonic Colors (haven't played it yet, but own it and supposedly good). Aaaaaand...hmm.

"Sonic and Sega All Stars Racing" is also pretty good.

You'll note the huge problem with all the systems you listed-they're never backwards compatible more than one generation. And the NES, SNES, N64, and Gamecube had zero.

Expecting more than one generation of compatibility is silly, particularly since keeping compatibility limits what you can do with a console, which is why more often than not console-makers break compatibility. Hell, Sony was never able to get it quite right with making the PS3 compatible with PS2 games, not to mention the cost of the additional hardware didn't really make it worth it for them, so they dropped it.

[Zmonkay]

Interesting. Seems poor timing what with the 3DS launch too though. Just really afraid they are splitting their focus too much. Love backwards compatibility though.

Who thinks they'll pull another Twilight Princess and delay Skyward Sword for a double system release again?

[confoosious]

It's a possibility but not a given.
I want a new iPhone but have no interest in the Wii Too, at this point.
The Wii is successful because of its price point not in-spite of it.

complete rubbish. You act like people only bought wiis because it was a cheaper alternative to the xbox and ps3. At the height of the wii success, the price point didn't matter. Yes, as the product cycle winds down now, they have to keep dropping the price but the wii "success" has been long established already.

____

the more I think about it, the more I can see a E3 or later announcement of the Wii2 for deployment next year. If you remember, Reggie said they'd talk Wii successor if the installed base hit 45M units. Right now it's probably at 35 so a price drop would bring in all the laggards. They know that announcing a Wii 2 won't hurt the sales of the laggards because they were never gonna buy the wii 2 at launch (or 2 -3 years after launch) anyway.

The hardcore early adopters will wait for the wii 2 while the casual consumers will snap up the wii at $150 and $125 and $99.... as nintendo phases out wii game development. They'll follow the ps2 model and hope the wii keeps selling as a cheaper alternative. Allow companies to release dumbed down versions of games for the wii and allow the shovelware developers to keep releasing shit for it.

[KingBroly]

I think when Wii HD launches, either this year or next, Nintendo's big launch game for it will be Metroid. Call me crazy, but I just think something's brewing there, and I kinda feel there's an artificial desire for one at the moment.

What I want to see, but I doubt it'll happen is the ability to merge your 3DS' friend code and friends list with your Wii HD's friends list for something that is a unified profile.

[Vader582]

complete rubbish. You act like people only bought wiis because it was a cheaper alternative to the xbox and ps3. At the height of the wii success, the price point didn't matter. Yes, as the product cycle winds down now, they have to keep dropping the price but the wii "success" has been long established already.
It might be partial rubbish but not complete. I think a lot of parents bought Wiis because of the price point and the family-friendly reputation of Nintendo.
The other guy was arguing that everyone who owns Apple products will buy or be interested in a Wii Too. I'm saying that's not necessarily true, whatever it ends up costing at launch.

[Dead of Knight]

I see like one person referenced my post. Oh well. I want to hear what SuperPhillip will say to it, since I was responding to him. Very interesting about Reginleiv though. Pity NOA sent Sin and Punishment 2 to die, probably on purpose, so Reggie wouldn't have to localize any more of dem Jap shooters.

I wonder, is Reggie a closet racist?

[TheLongshot]

Who thinks they'll pull another Twilight Princess and delay Skyward Sword for a double system release again?

Given Zelda's anniversary this year and the interest they have in making it special, I doubt that they will delay it. Now, will they do an upgraded version for the new console? Hard to say.

complete rubbish. You act like people only bought wiis because it was a cheaper alternative to the xbox and ps3. At the height of the wii success, the price point didn't matter. Yes, as the product cycle winds down now, they have to keep dropping the price but the wii "success" has been long established already.

I don't think the price point argument is complete rubbish. It is part of the reason why they have been able to move so many units. The fact that they weren't taking losses while doing it is also an important fact of its overall success.

the more I think about it, the more I can see a E3 or later announcement of the Wii2 for deployment next year. If you remember, Reggie said they'd talk Wii successor if the installed base hit 45M units. Right now it's probably at 35 so a price drop would bring in all the laggards. They know that announcing a Wii 2 won't hurt the sales of the laggards because they were never gonna buy the wii 2 at launch (or 2 -3 years after launch) anyway.

I still think holiday 2012 would be a good time for it. (I keep forgetting that this is 2011, so I screwed up earlier when I said 2011. I really meant 2012.

What I want to see, but I doubt it'll happen is the ability to merge your 3DS' friend code and friends list with your Wii HD's friends list for something that is a unified profile.

Actually, it wouldn't shock me at all if that did happen.

[theflicker]

It might be partial rubbish but not complete. I think a lot of parents bought Wiis because of the price point and the family-friendly reputation of Nintendo.
The other guy was arguing that everyone who owns Apple products will buy or be interested in a Wii Too. I'm saying that's not necessarily true, whatever it ends up costing at launch.

Hi. Other guy here. I should clarify. I wasn't saying an iPhone in every hand and a Wii in every closet (gathering dust, amirite?). I was trying to illustrate that people like to upgrade and buy new iterations of products that they own. We can see that with Apple products most fervently, but also Nintendo products. How many people have upgraded their DS a few times?

[dothog]

I think when Wii HD launches, either this year or next, Nintendo's big launch game for it will be Metroid. Call me crazy, but I just think something's brewing there, and I kinda feel there's an artificial desire for one at the moment.
Metroid doesn't have a broad appeal, and I don't know that there's much they can do to amend that. It's a dark world Samus inhabits, I don't think that's the kind of thing that will go over well with the typical Wii family.

(Besides, and I'm not trying to start a Metroid flame war here, Metroid needs a break. A looooooong one, IMHO.)

If it's going to launch with a recognizable IP, and not something made up for the new features/gimmick the way Wii Sports was, my darkhorse would be Pokemon. They really haven't done much for Pokemon on consoles. Maybe internally they consider it a handheld-only franchise since the GCN version, beats me. I would think if they're serious about coupling the 3DS and the nextgen console, Pokemon would be a good IP to use for that.

[confoosious]

I was watching something about the mac where a psychologist noted that early adopters tend to feel resentful when a company gets too big and they feel left behind.

This seems to happen a lot with the wii. People think just because they played Metroid back in the day, that nintendo's expansion that allows for actual decent third party stuff thats outside of their demographic is a slap in the face. "Oh noes, we're core fans and we're being abandoned! We want updated Starfox, Zelda, Mario, Wario, Kirby, Metroid, Final Fantasy, Chrono Triger, and new first party IP, ever 6 months. And we want you to stop publishing kiddie games because it offends us.!"

[dothog]

Confoosious, I don't know what you're on about, either. Sega 1999 and Nintendo 2012 are not analogous at all. The argument that was being made for the success of the DC in 1999 was that it was beating the PS2 and "Dolphin" to the punch. It was "first," and people thought that mattered. No one's making the argument that Nintendo will have success with their next console because it comes ahead of the XBOX1080 or the PS4. Nintendo's not even playing the same game as MS and Sony, they might as well occupy different worlds.

The general argument that's being made is that Nintendo will succeed in the next generation because of the success they've had post-GCN. They don't waste movements, now, they're not hunting around for a niche. They've found it. They absolutely kill handhelds, and they've dug out a space in the console market by making a console that is "different" in ways that are meaningful to people/families who don't self-identify as gamers.

I stopped doubting Nintendo after the DS. Their next console won't set the world on fire, but it'll be anything but a flop. It will sell for all the reasons the Wii did: it will be novel, it will be unassuming, it will be priced (relatively) competitively, and it will not attempt to be an XBOX or PS.

[phantomfriar2002]

Sega 1999 and Nintendo 2012 are not analogous at all. The argument that was being made for the success of the DC in 1999 was that it was beating the PS2 and "Dolphin" to the punch. It was "first," and people thought that mattered.

Agreed, and there's also a big difference in that the Wii lags far behind the PS3 and 360 in terms of its capabilities. That didn't hamper its sales at the start -- and you can argue how much it has overall -- but now that more and more people have adopted HDTV, it's a factor for Nintendo going forward.

IMO they're smart to get going now on a console and look ahead to 2012 for that reason alone. As time goes on there the sentiment that the Wii 1 isn't capable enough and is too "old" will only intensify, which you can see from the last year of its software/hardware sales which have slowed down compared to before.

[spmahn]

Consumers are fickle, and part of the reason why Apple continues to resonate with consumers is the same reason Starbucks does, it's a brand name that people associate with style and luxury, marketed toward middle income consumers that don't often get to indulge in such things. Nintendo is not Starbucks and they sure as hell aren't Apple, there's no guarantee that this segment of consumers is going to contiue to stick with Nintendo in the future, and if Nintendo is going to put all their eggs in that basket, well that's a very risky bet to make.

[RedvsBlue]

More rumors...

http://www.joystiq.com/2011/04/15/rumor-wii-2-codenamed-project-cafe-controller-includes-built-i/

Similar architecture as 360, touchscreen controller, and front mounter camera (on the controller)

[confoosious]

Nintendo's brand is as strong as ever. I love how the nintendo core market isn't gonna support nintendo next time around, yet the same market bought up all of their shit the first time around. Unless the wii 2 is a monumental piece of shit (and it could be), how exactly are you predicting that nintendo's core market will abandon them in droves? Are you listening to yourself? Toyota killed people with their brakes and they haven't gone the way of the Dreamcast. It takes a lot to kill a brand, especially one as good as Nintendo's, despite what you may think about the wii.

I don't want to argue about the relative merits of the wii2 vs xbox720 vs ps4. What you're talking about is branding. And you somehow think nintendo doesn't have a strong brand?

Also, you think the installed base is "happy to be bowling" and won't upgrade? Are you kidding?


-----


dothog - What I'm getting at is that I suspect spmahn is just hating on nintendo cause he feels burned by them. He's an early adopter of nintendo so when everyone else jumped on the bandwagon, he felt abandoned and left out. Now he goes around predicting gloom and doom for the company. If you are on any apple forums at all, you see this alot with mac heads. "I was running OS 7. Apple doesn't care about the loyal customers! They're gonna go down!"

This, of course, is why his arguments make no sense. It's from a place of anger and not rationale.

(Or at least that's what I'd like to think because no one can possibly believe what he's saying.)

How anyone can compare the dreamcast to the wii is beyond me. The average housewife had no idea what a dreamcast was in 1999 but practically everyone in the free world has heard of the wii. Say what you want about the wii's graphical capabilities, etc, etc, but the brand recognition is through the roof.

[RedvsBlue]

What's your point? If anything you'r helping my argument. Once your core consumer realizes that you're all style and no substance, it's death.

You were arguing that brands like Apple and Starbucks are positioned such that they "resonate" with consumers such that they don't have to worry about whether consumers will "stick with" them. Now you're conceding one of those examples doesn't make consumers stick around that well.

A better point for you to have made is that any company can lose their core base of consumers at any time.

[Fonz72]

Yea, the Wii5 will be kiddie and full of shovelware and Dell and LG will have "hardcore" consoles with games made by Sony and Microsoft! :lol:

[crunchewy]

HD will definitely be a very good thing, but more importantly it needs to make major strides in online. I'm not so much talking about online multiplayer games, though that too, but things like a great download service with plenty of storage for your downloads, demos for all games not a handful of time limited availability demos, the ability to send messages to friends, compare scores, compare progress in games (universal achievements), no friend codes - instead providing robust and easy to use parental controls. Unfortunately Nintendo has come out publicly against some of these things (universal achievements, for example) and the 3DS isn't give us much hope with it's inability to even send messages to friends (they never thought of that - wow!) and having a friend code tied to the console, which doesn't just suck because it's a friend code, but because being tied to the console means that it's impossible to have multiple accounts for multiple users. That kind of unbelievable oversight is disheartening.

So while I'm looking forward to this sequel and want it to come out a lot sooner then late 2012, I'm also not really that completely hopeful for it. We'll get it and I'm sure there will be great games for it, as there is for the Wii, but it will probably still feature many of the same shortcomings of the Wii and 3DS. At this point there's no reason to believe that it won't. I hope I'm proven wrong.

[Javery]

I'm not terribly excited about a new console from Nintendo. There are a handful of games I LOVE on the Wii but overall I am very disappointed with the system (the first time I've ever felt this way about a Nintendo console or handheld). They need to get third parties on board - they just have to. They can't have as repeat of this generation where you get the HD/online awesome version of a game for the PS3/360 and then the completely different or crappy ported version for the Wii that was churned out just to make a few quick dollars since the install base is so huge.

Also, they need to drop the gimmicks - motion controls really haven't added anything to the Wii experience other than for a handful of games (Wii Sports, Metroid Prime 3, Boom Blox and some others) where it seemed necessary and integrated completely with the game design.

For the first time ever in my life I'm not going to be buying a new console from Nintendo right away - they have to convince me this time.

[foltzie]

Also, they need to drop the gimmicks - motion controls really haven't added anything to the Wii experience other than for a handful of games (Wii Sports, Metroid Prime 3, Boom Blox and some others) where it seemed necessary and integrated completely with the game design.

So where does the gimmick lie, in the Wiimote itself, or the game devs who dont integrate them well?

When used well, I loved the Wiimote. RE4 and Twilight Princess, despite being added after the fact, highlighted how fun it could be in a third-person game. I dont care that they mapped reload and the sword to Waggle, it was fun.

Still, I agree, include something a touch more traditional in the box and let the chips fall where they may.

[Wolfpup]

Maybe this has been mentioned, but I just listened to the Game Informer podcast (I'd listen to it or read the GI article, because they broke the story, and articles I've read ABOUT their article are weirdly distorted and misquote/misinterpret things they've said).

Anyway, apparently at least one source has said Nintendo's doing this right-that apparently the hardware's good, and it's non-gimmicky. Don't really know of course, but at least someone thinks so.

I'm so excited about this! Thought I would be, but dang, I've had to stop drooling over current gen Nintendo games for what, six, seven years, during the Wii? I remember early screen shots people claimed were from the next console... Heck, maybe some even were, since I'm sure they had a current gen console in the works, but decided to rerelease the Gamecube instead of just releasing the controller as an accessory as was probably originally planned.

Point is, I guess my excitement was pent up! Haven't been this excited for a console since...hmm...the Xbox 360? Or actually, since the Gamecube 2 :lol:

[Cao Cao]

Also from GAF (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=27160652&postcount=5212), the crazy train groweth...
Update: Sources now confirm to IGN the new Nintendo controller allows players to stream entire games to the device from the console, saying it's like a miniature television. The screen size on the controller is also confirmed to be six inches in size.
http://wii.ign.com/articles/116/1162045p1.html

[confoosious]

I've always wanted to use my ds as a wii controller.

[Mad D]

I'm imagining this as an updated Dreamcast controller.

With tilt, rumble, IR and touch integrated. Maybe the'll even let you use 3DS's as an extra controller for some games if you happen to have one.

As for the system I just think they are just making it more flexible and open the US developers who have gone in their own direction. No one wants to miss out on the GTA money.

[dallow]

Yeah, it sounds crazy as hell.
I want to see it though I doubt I'd buy it or any other console now. Sticking to handhelds.
Still, I like to see how it all plays out.

[M-PG71C]

Uhh...I'm just confused now. Six inch screen? This may get really interesting...

So where is Nintendo for damage control? Eh fuck it, just get me my localization of The Last Story and Xenoblade and I'll ignore the Wii 2 news for a while.

Also, the whole argument of Nintendo pulling a SEGA is wrong for too many reasons. SEGA went away because they bled money for years upon years of failure in the marketplace. When Nintendo releases the equivalent of a 32X, Saturn, Nomad, CD, and too many other failures to list, then we have a talking point.

Lets put it this way, with the exception of the arcade and Genesis, SEGA never made any money. I love SEGA to death, and I'm finally correcting the one wrong in my gaming "life" and I bought a brand new Dreamcast off of eBay, but damn were they stupid sometimes. The Saturn was as hardcore of a console as it gets, and besides Japan, it failed. Bad.

Oh, and here's my shiny Dreamcast:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&rt=nc&nma=true&item=320683885255&si=5HkPfIAuAamfcd8xZ82ILW6kbwE%253D&viewitemnext=&autorefresh=true#ht_564wt_1135

[Ma12kez]

I swear. If there are friend codes again..#-o

[M-PG71C]

I swear. If there are friend codes again..#-o

I'm okay if they are the like the 3DS (One code for everything, very much like having a Gamertag) and I'm sure that's the direction they may be going at.

[cochesecochese]

Sticking to handhelds.

high-five

consoles suck right now

[Vinny]

What the hell is Nintendo trying to do? This honestly sounds like some kind of a bastard offspring of a bunch of previous systems.

Whatever they do, I hope they actually release the thing with some new and original titles. The 3DS's launch line up's best game was a port (SFIV) and the two best games in the next few months are remakes (Star Fox and OoT).

[pete5883]

I'm thinking the only way we will even see DQX is if Iwata himself makes a big push for it.
IX did so well that they have to bring X. As for S&P2 being a "test," I wonder if there's actually any truth to that or if it was just GAF speculation turned "truth."

[KingBroly]

IX did so well that they have to bring X. As for S&P2 being a "test," I wonder if there's actually any truth to that or if it was just GAF speculation turned "truth."

What's that supposed to mean? S&P2 was some kind of sales indicator if they'd lost the hardcore or not?

[cochesecochese]

According to a 'NOA insider' on GAF, supposedly if S&P2 sold 50K copies, Nintendo was going to localize Reginleiv.

Keep in mind, however, that the admins on the old NOA boards repeatedly said that Electroplankton was a 'test' and if it sold enough then Mother 3 would get greenlit. Turns out that was bullshit.

[KingBroly]

I'm pretty sure S&P2 sold the 50k they shipped. Just not at retail price.

[Dead of Knight]

According to a 'NOA insider' on GAF, supposedly if S&P2 sold 50K copies, Nintendo was going to localize Reginleiv.

Keep in mind, however, that the admins on the old NOA boards repeatedly said that Electroplankton was a 'test' and if it sold enough then Mother 3 would get greenlit. Turns out that was bullshit.

It had to have sold 50k, just not at $50.

And yeah, that sounds like total bullshit. S&P2/Reginleiv sounds more plausible since they are similar demographics. The Electroplankton/Mother 3 makes no fucking sense whatsoever.

[KingBroly]

They didn't even try to sell Elektroplankton seriously either.

I wish NOA would get their asses in gear about VC games. Final Fantasy III is out everywhere but here, and Mega Man X and Chrono Trigger are coming to Japan/Europe. Same goes for Xenoblade Chronicles and Last Story.

[Cerebral_One]

I don't understand why Mother 3 is not put on WiiWare or VC or whatever.

What I don't get is the controller. If Nintendo just puts a screen in the controller it's nothing special, it would be more gimmicky than just about anything they've done. Reminds me of the gamecube connectivity with GBA. The only thing that has me really excited about it is that you could take the controller on the go as a portable device, but why would I do that when there are better dedicated portable devices. Maybe all multiplatform games will get ported to their new system and they release another new system shortly after 720/PS4?

[Dead of Knight]

I don't understand why Mother 3 is not put on WiiWare or VC or whatever.

Because OMG TRANNIES.

And all these rumors sound absolutely insane. If half of these are true I'll be shocked and wonder what the hell Nintendo is smoking.

They didn't even try to sell Elektroplankton seriously either.
It was only sold online. They may as well have not even given it a release at all. No marketing either.

[Wolfpup]

Uhhh.... okay, having a screen on a controller....I don't know, years ago I thought it was maybe a good idea. Now I'm leaning towards gimmick-you have to look down at it, so why not do it on the TV?

Using it as the display? Uuuuuuh.... hmm.... actually does that mean you could use this system without having a TV? That's kind of insane come to think of it. And six inches is HUGE. That seems way too big for a controller. I mean for a portable game system yeah, but for a controller where it's just a random thing on it?

I don't know...that sounds weird.

high-five

consoles suck right now

:shock:


Keep in mind, however, that the admins on the old NOA boards repeatedly said that Electroplankton was a 'test' and if it sold enough then Mother 3 would get greenlit. Turns out that was bullshit.

That would have been insane. The games don't seem to be remotely related, and Mother 3 seems like it would have WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more broad appeal.

Why are they leaving Mother 1 and 3 and Magical Vacation and possibly even Last Story over there, when they bring so much garbage like Wii Music over here?

[Dead of Knight]

Why are they leaving Mother 1 and 3 and Magical Vacation and possibly even Last Story over there, when they bring so much garbage like Wii Music over here?

$$$$$$$

[preston181]

This generation was the first one where I sold my Nintendo (Wii) console prior to the generation being over. I rode the Nintendo hype train of underpowered hardware, broken promises, subpar/scaled back game selections, and wheelbarrels of shovelware long enough. I manned up and got an Xbox 360 and a PS3.

Don't get me wrong, Nintendo is an awesome company, and achieved it's goal of selling games to people of all ages. I just no longer fit in their demographic. I want cutting edge tech that will make my eyeballs melt and give me a nerd orgasm. Granted, while the idea of streaming my game to an HD screen on my controller sounds cool on paper, it's nothing more than a gimmick and will wear out fast. Besides, I already can play games on a small screen: it's called an iPod touch.

I'm not even going to buy into any of the rumors, because they are just that: rumors. Nintendo has a history of promising big, and delivering small. It's like they observe what the hardcore gamers want, and do the complete opposite. Instead of focusing on the most powerful and nerd appealing console, they focus more on a cheap console that reuses franchise characters more than Disney. And it sells. Of course it sells. When little Johnny wants a game system, what do you think is going to drive Mom and Dad's decision most? Tech or cost? Cost of course.

Here's what I see being a more realistic spec list for Nintendo's next system:
HD graphics, but only via a dongle, (sold separately, of course). Standard RCA cables will come in the box.
A specialized dual core processor running somewhere between 2 and 3 GHz, probably built by IBM.
256 MB of video RAM.
512 MB of system ram, with a proprietary expansion bay, which likely will never be utilized. (Total capacity will likely be 1 GB).
Some sort of rechargable controller, perhaps even with the screens on them, because Nintendo is king at peripheral sales.
Built-in wi-fi.
No game lobby, probably still friend codes, but codes will probably be console, no game, specific, with matchmaking being done either via direct friend codes, or out of a random pool.
Definitely a game shop with overpriced legacy titles.
Wii compatibility. No GC compatibility.
2 major first party titles at launch, with 1 of them being a Mario game. But definitely not a Zelda at launch. (unless they do a port of the upcoming Wii one).
Focus will be put on underwhelming things like their "commitment to family fun" and the gimmicky controllers. It's lack of power, (will be slightly more powerful than a 360), will be downplayed.
Cost will likely end up being $249 to $299, with one controller and a cheapy pack in title. Controllers will likely be $69.99 (if the have the screen), unless Nintendo takes a hit to push the consoles faster. Launch will probably be a "surprise", and will be THIS Christmas, not next. Why else would they do a price drop on the Wii BEFORE e3, and not after? Console will have a cool development name, but probably a stupid final name.

You guys watch and see how right I am come e3.

[Dead of Knight]

Mother 1 and 3 would sell like shit? Boy, that was a hard question!

Both games are already translated (3 by fan translators) so they could easily do it. Fuck 'em.

[Cerebral_One]

Because OMG TRANNIES.

And all these rumors sound absolutely insane. If half of these are true I'll be shocked and wonder what the hell Nintendo is smoking.


It was only sold online. They may as well have not even given it a release at all. No marketing either.

Stupid Nintendo should just change those characters/scenes. Maybe the dudes who did the translation could pull it off and leave it on Nintendo's doorstep.

This generation was the first one where I sold my Nintendo (Wii) console prior to the generation being over. I rode the Nintendo hype train of underpowered hardware, broken promises, subpar/scaled back game selections, and wheelbarrels of shovelware long enough. I manned up and got an Xbox 360 and a PS3.

Don't get me wrong, Nintendo is an awesome company, and achieved it's goal of selling games to people of all ages. I just no longer fit in their demographic. I want cutting edge tech that will make my eyeballs melt and give me a nerd orgasm. Granted, while the idea of streaming my game to an HD screen on my controller sounds cool on paper, it's nothing more than a gimmick and will wear out fast. Besides, I already can play games on a small screen: it's called an iPod touch.

I'm not even going to buy into any of the rumors, because they are just that: rumors. Nintendo has a history of promising big, and delivering small. It's like they observe what the hardcore gamers want, and do the complete opposite. Instead of focusing on the most powerful and nerd appealing console, they focus more on a cheap console that reuses franchise characters more than Disney. And it sells. Of course it sells. When little Johnny wants a game system, what do you think is going to drive Mom and Dad's decision most? Tech or cost? Cost of course.

Here's what I see being a more realistic spec list for Nintendo's next system:
HD graphics, but only via a dongle, (sold separately, of course). Standard RCA cables will come in the box.
A specialized dual core processor running somewhere between 2 and 3 GHz, probably built by IBM.
256 MB of video RAM.
512 MB of system ram, with a proprietary expansion bay, which likely will never be utilized. (Total capacity will likely be 1 GB).
Some sort of rechargable controller, perhaps even with the screens on them, because Nintendo is king at peripheral sales.
Built-in wi-fi.
No game lobby, probably still friend codes, but codes will probably be console, no game, specific, with matchmaking being done either via direct friend codes, or out of a random pool.
Definitely a game shop with overpriced legacy titles.
Wii compatibility. No GC compatibility.
2 major first party titles at launch, with 1 of them being a Mario game. But definitely not a Zelda at launch. (unless they do a port of the upcoming Wii one).
Focus will be put on underwhelming things like their "commitment to family fun" and the gimmicky controllers. It's lack of power, (will be slightly more powerful than a 360), will be downplayed.
Cost will likely end up being $249 to $299, with one controller and a cheapy pack in title. Controllers will likely be $69.99 (if the have the screen), unless Nintendo takes a hit to push the consoles faster. Launch will probably be a "surprise", and will be THIS Christmas, not next. Why else would they do a price drop on the Wii BEFORE e3, and not after? Console will have a cool development name, but probably a stupid final name.

You guys watch and see how right I am come e3.

I'd put money down on your predictions. The only thing I'd possibly change is up the price and maybe 2 SKU's or a bundle that includes a game at or a few months after launch.

I hope it doesn't just end up being WiiHD with some fancy new regular style controllers, while still utilizing the last gen Wiimotes+nunchuks. What is going to be the standard controller for this thing a new Wiimote or this screen thing? If it's this screen thing will they later come out with improved Wiimotes+nunchuks and make people pay for those?

[preston181]

They'll probably make a dongle for the Wiimotes to use on the Wii compatibilty games.

[Dead of Knight]

Stupid Nintendo should just change those characters/scenes. Maybe the dudes who did the translation could pull it off and leave it on Nintendo's doorstep.



In this day and age there's no need for them to edit that out. They are extremely tame- they just happen to have beards/mustaches and dress like women. But NOA is for some reason deathly afraid some derp soccer mom will buy the game for their kids and take offense.

[pete5883]

According to a 'NOA insider' on GAF, supposedly if S&P2 sold 50K copies, Nintendo was going to localize Reginleiv.

Keep in mind, however, that the admins on the old NOA boards repeatedly said that Electroplankton was a 'test' and if it sold enough then Mother 3 would get greenlit. Turns out that was bullshit.
I wonder which poster. I've only noticed on GAF poster who seems to know anything reliable, and he only knows about NOE.

The Electroplankton thing has got to be bullshit though - didn't every single copy produced (in NA) get sold? If new copies are no longer available for sale, I have to assume that this is the case. And if every copy got sold, how is this a failure? Pretty smart way to sell Electroplankton though :lol:

[cochesecochese]

And six inches is HUGE.

No. Really, it's just average.

That would have been insane. The games don't seem to be remotely related, and Mother 3 seems like it would have WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more broad appeal.

Why are they leaving Mother 1 and 3 and Magical Vacation and possibly even Last Story over there, when they bring so much garbage like Wii Music over here?
Mmmmm. At that point I was absolutely desperate to become a 'Sage' so I would do pretty much anything they told me. IIRC correctly, the reasoning was that Electroplankton's distribution model (sold directly by Nintendo in small quantity) could prove to be profitable for Mother 3 which, really, couldn't have hoped to sell more than 50K in America. Yes [in America] the game is absolutely adored across message boards (you should see my merch collection.....) but it's virtually unknown outside of the enthusiast community. Neither Mother 1 nor 3 was helped along by the fact that they both would have been released at the very end of each system's lifespan, and Mother 2's poor sales pretty much doomed 3's chances of American release before it even came out in Japan.

Magical Vacation was too niche as well. As for The Last Story, well, there are some signs pointing to it coming out in The States. It only just released but the Wii is really hurting for content, no question about it. I would say if we don't hear an announcement by year's end then it's done.

The Electroplankton thing has got to be bullshit though - didn't every single copy produced (in NA) get sold? If new copies are no longer available for sale, I have to assume that this is the case. And if every copy got sold, how is this a failure? Pretty smart way to sell Electroplankton though :lol:

Of course it's bullshit in hindsight, but at the time I believed. You've got to remember that the board moderators were only even tangentially involved with day to day NOA activities which I didn't really understand at the time.

[laaj]

In this day and age there's no need for them to edit that out. They are extremely tame- they just happen to have beards/mustaches and dress like women. But NOA is for some reason deathly afraid some derp soccer mom will buy the game for their kids and take offense.

Don't be so sure. Hear about the current J. Crew advert controversy?

[Metroid64]

Well, we can kiss Skyward Sword goodbye. Remember how it was going to be the Gamecube's swan song? Then got delayed about a year and a half so the Wii version could come out first?

[preston181]

Well, we can kiss Skyward Sword goodbye. Remember how it was going to be the Gamecube's swan song? Then got delayed about a year and a half so the Wii version could come out first?

Over the years, I've figured out Nintendo's gameplan. They always do this type of thing. Every single platform game they do, (Mario, Zelda, etc.), is a retelling of the same story, and every time, they'll do one or two of them on each console. But, the third one, they'll promise near the end of the console's life cycle, only to delay it so long, that they end up putting it on the next console instead.

[dothog]

Fuck that noise. Skyward Sword is coming out as planned. It was designed for the friggin Wii, they're not pulling a TP on it.

The biggest mistake I've made in playing through the console Zeldas was buying the Wii version of TP. I won't make that mistake if they pull a TP on SS. But again, it's not happening.

[Wolfpup]

$$$$$$$

Mother 1 and 3 would sell like shit? Boy, that was a hard question!
Why is Microsoft shunning their core gamers now with Kinect? Same thing. Money.
Unless you only like generic dudebro shooters and racing games...

I don't know that either of those works though-if Microsoft throws away the gaming market as they seem to be, it's going to cost them big time. I think Nintendo's learned that, which is why they SEEM to be kind of shifting back towards games.

And quite obviously Mother and those other games could make money. Atlus or Xseed or Working Designs could do it. If Nintendo can't, they should license it out. Its win/win for everyone. It seems like spite not to get them out over here.

Here's what I see being a more realistic spec list for Nintendo's next system:
HD graphics, but only via a dongle, (sold separately, of course). Standard RCA cables will come in the box.
A specialized dual core processor running somewhere between 2 and 3 GHz, probably built by IBM.
256 MB of video RAM.
512 MB of system ram, with a proprietary expansion bay, which likely will never be utilized. (Total capacity will likely be 1 GB).
Some sort of rechargable controller, perhaps even with the screens on them, because Nintendo is king at peripheral sales.
Built-in wi-fi.
No game lobby, probably still friend codes, but codes will probably be console, no game, specific, with matchmaking being done either via direct friend codes, or out of a random pool.
Definitely a game shop with overpriced legacy titles.
Wii compatibility. No GC compatibility.
2 major first party titles at launch, with 1 of them being a Mario game. But definitely not a Zelda at launch. (unless they do a port of the upcoming Wii one).
Focus will be put on underwhelming things like their "commitment to family fun" and the gimmicky controllers. It's lack of power, (will be slightly more powerful than a 360), will be downplayed.
Cost will likely end up being $249 to $299, with one controller and a cheapy pack in title. Controllers will likely be $69.99 (if the have the screen), unless Nintendo takes a hit to push the consoles faster. Launch will probably be a "surprise", and will be THIS Christmas, not next. Why else would they do a price drop on the Wii BEFORE e3, and not after? Console will have a cool development name, but probably a stupid final name.

You guys watch and see how right I am come e3.

Honestly that does look pretty realistic, but that's what we're being told pretty much too. If it seems to be relatively non-gimmicky, and is at least close to current gen performance, I'll be pretty happy. Though obviously way happier if it turns out to be a next gen console. Not holding my breath on that though.

Don't be so sure. Hear about the current J. Crew advert controversy?

I just Googled it. Craaaaaazy. Fox Neeeeeeews even has a "doctor" attacking it, 'cause he didn't lern abut no hooomosexewls en the doctorin scools.

[Wolfpup]

Fuck that noise. Skyward Sword is coming out as planned. It was designed for the friggin Wii, they're not pulling a TP on it.

The biggest mistake I've made in playing through the console Zeldas was buying the Wii version of TP. I won't make that mistake if they pull a TP on SS. But again, it's not happening.

Well the Wii Zelda was designed for the Gamecube, so I don't think that helps us determine anything.

I wish I could buy the Gamecube one...or of course that they were bright enough to just include normal controller support for the Wii one. I did see a copy of the Gamecube one a few years back, but at the time no longer had a controller or memory card for it.

Hmm...maybe I should just give up and buy a used copy if Nintendo won't print more. In real life everyone I've ever talked to that's played both tells me "oh yeah, I hate the Wii one too, but the Gamecube one is really good".

[dothog]

Nintendo was in a different place with the Wii launch, they withheld TP to give the Wii a boost. I don't think their next console needs that boost.

In other words, GC -> Wii and Wii -> Cafe are two very different contexts.

[Dead of Knight]

Don't be so sure. Hear about the current J. Crew advert controversy?

That's because it involved TEH CHILDRENZ.

[TheLongshot]

Mmmmm. At that point I was absolutely desperate to become a 'Sage' so I would do pretty much anything they told me. IIRC correctly, the reasoning was that Electroplankton's distribution model (sold directly by Nintendo in small quantity) could prove to be profitable for Mother 3 which, really, couldn't have hoped to sell more than 50K in America. Yes [in America] the game is absolutely adored across message boards (you should see my merch collection.....) but it's virtually unknown outside of the enthusiast community. Neither Mother 1 nor 3 was helped along by the fact that they both would have been released at the very end of each system's lifespan, and Mother 2's poor sales pretty much doomed 3's chances of American release before it even came out in Japan.

To be honest, I never even heard of the series before joining this board. There are some games which hard core gamers would be all over, but to the average consumer they'd scratch their head and move on.

Ultimately, companies the size of Nintendo look for big sales of just about everything that they do, because of the scale that they do everything. People shouldn't expect Nintendo to act like a company like Atlus, for example.

Magical Vacation was too niche as well. As for The Last Story, well, there are some signs pointing to it coming out in The States. It only just released but the Wii is really hurting for content, no question about it. I would say if we don't hear an announcement by year's end then it's done.

I expect that if we don't hear anything at E3 for a fall release, that it isn't coming. Course, given the name recognition and that Game Informer seems to think that it is coming at some point (they did an article about it in their last issue) maybe there is a better than 50% chance of it coming.

[KingBroly]

I knew about Earthbound back in the day, but only started becoming interested in it after Smash Bros. came out.

I still think this console should come out this fall, with 1 Nintendo franchise backing it, because of the third party games you could potentially get for it in the first 6 months of the system's lifecycle: Arkham City, Elder Scrolls V, Assassin's Creed ___, COD, Mass Effect 3, GTA5, Max Payne, FFXIII-2, etc. I'm not saying it'll happen, but if Nintendo got it out this fall with the big third party games, it'd really do a lot for their cause.

[spmahn]

Another thing no one has brought up, if Nintendo went the more mainstream route with this console, and all the third parties returned to them and started developing for the system, is the market big enough to sustain three consoles that would all have more or less the same selection of third party content them way it does now with PS3 and X-Box? As it stands, the only reason the market has sustained three major consoles is because Nintendo has been marching to the beat of their own drum since the Gamecube days, and aren't really competing in the same market Sony and MS are, but what if they did decide to turn around and compete for that market share by having more similar third party content on their console?

[confoosious]

I dont think they want to support 2 launch units in the same year.

[preston181]

Another thing no one has brought up, if Nintendo went the more mainstream route with this console, and all the third parties returned to them and started developing for the system, is the market big enough to sustain three consoles that would all have more or less the same selection of third party content them way it does now with PS3 and X-Box? As it stands, the only reason the market has sustained three major consoles is because Nintendo has been marching to the beat of their own drum since the Gamecube days, and aren't really competing in the same market Sony and MS are, but what if they did decide to turn around and compete for that market share by having more similar third party content on their console?


Microsoft has a (paid) online following and the most organized and functional game lobby service of the three consoles. Nintendo has friend codes. For them to go mainstream now would likely have sh*t of an impact. They've ignored the hardcore crowd, and as a result, they've all left for Microsoft and Sony. I doubt many of them will go back to Nintendo and it's half-a$$ed attempt at a comeback. I know I won't.

[Cerebral_One]

Another thing no one has brought up, if Nintendo went the more mainstream route with this console, and all the third parties returned to them and started developing for the system, is the market big enough to sustain three consoles that would all have more or less the same selection of third party content them way it does now with PS3 and X-Box? As it stands, the only reason the market has sustained three major consoles is because Nintendo has been marching to the beat of their own drum since the Gamecube days, and aren't really competing in the same market Sony and MS are, but what if they did decide to turn around and compete for that market share by having more similar third party content on their console?

Good point. They might pull a Dreamcast if they do that.

I dont think they want to support 2 launch units in the same year.

GBA & GC. Still I don't think it's a good idea, the GC didn't exactly have many great games right away. However, maybe their worse off by waiting longer. Afterall, the 720 can't be too many years off.

[KingBroly]

Nintendo can maintain their market with their own console because of their games. If they got equal support from third parties (which will probably never happen) then it'd probably be Sony to dropout. You have to remember that Nintendo has stated once they stop developing system they will stop developing games.

Besides, Nintendo basically set the trend this generation: You have to make money out of the gate or be close to it. Sony and Microsoft are only just now making money on their system while Nintendo's been doing it from the start.

[lilboo]

It'll be great to get an HD system.
Nintendo ~usually~ ends up with somewhat decent launches.
Or a launch with at least 1-2 excellent games.
They will ~probably~ do what they do know and try to appeal to everyone, and thus keep the price as low as possible.

But what I don't like is (and I just woke up so maybe I missed it) that over the last 4 1/2 years I (and I am sure MAAAANY others) have spent a lot of money in the Virtual Console and WiiWare. They can promote backwards comparability all they want.. but if I have no way of taking my download games off of my Wii and moving it to the 'HD Wii', then that's just retarded.

[M-PG71C]

I wouldn't worry about that lilboo, if the 3DS is any indication, you'll be able to move your stuff over to the new system.

[Lone_Prodigy]

Wii so excited.

I just hope they don't delay Skyward Sword for this release and that it's fully backwards-compatible with Wii games (and even controllers?)

[KingBroly]

Nintendo put out more content this generation than they ever have before. However, the nearly 2 year wait for something hardcore was really hurtful to their commitment to their fans, hence why a lot of people felt betrayed. They've been trying to win these fans back over the last 2 years, but for some it was too little, too late.

In addition, their failure to get with the times in terms of online multiplayer for their 2D platformers is troubling. When they say they need to increase their online prowess, that's an area that need to expand in.

[crunchewy]

I'm okay if they are the like the 3DS (One code for everything, very much like having a Gamertag) and I'm sure that's the direction they may be going at.

I hope it isn't like the 3DS, or it will be one friend code/account per console. Hopefully they aren't that stupid.

[moothemagiccow]

oh god uncharted sucks

look each of these products have been successful because they appeal to different people. Don't take it as an insult that it doesn't appeal to you.

[TheLongshot]

And LittleBigPlanet 2? Great game for a tiny niche market, interesting idea for the rest but hardly worth playing. At least it's an improvement over the first one, where horrid controls wasted all of the potential the game had to be anything more than a design showpiece for the handful of people dedicated enough to make something worthwhile.

And it is, unfortunately, one of the few examples of a "family" title on the PS3. Really, part of the motivation for me to get a Wii was because there wasn't much appropriate content for my now 5 year old.

I'd also say that I'm probably as happy with the games on my Wii that I probably would have been with a PS3. There are probably about as many "want to play" games on both systems for me, with the key difference is that many of the games on the Wii I can play with my son.

[KingBroly]

Virtual Console's getting Mega Man X today, and soon the non-insane load times version of Final Fantasy III (VI) so...whatever, man.

And Sony did sell their PS2 fanbase under the bus by ditching backwards compatibility for it in favor of HD remakes. But I guess paying Sony $40 for games I already own is great, right?

Coming into the Nintendo forum and spouting off like a troll isn't going to get you anywhere. Bringing up Heavy Rain isn't going to help your cause. If I did the same as you but in the Sony section I'd have the right to get my chops blown off. But for some reason you feel entitled to your trolling? It doesn't work like that.

[shrike4242]

Let's tone things down a bit, please.

[foltzie]

Let's tone things down a bit, please.

Hey baby... I know sometimes things get... heated, but that's just passion baby.

[cochesecochese]

Damn, I love the leadup to E3. So much.

[pjb16]

Virtual Console's getting Mega Man X today, and soon the non-insane load times version of Final Fantasy III (VI) so...whatever, man.

And Sony did sell their PS2 fanbase under the bus by ditching backwards compatibility for it in favor of HD remakes. But I guess paying Sony $40 for games I already own is great, right?

Coming into the Nintendo forum and spouting off like a troll isn't going to get you anywhere. Bringing up Heavy Rain isn't going to help your cause. If I did the same as you but in the Sony section I'd have the right to get my chops blown off. But for some reason you feel entitled to your trolling? It doesn't work like that.
I frankly like the remakes. In many cases (God of War and Sly specifically, but PoP as well), it was of games that I never got around to playing (and never would have) if not for the HD remake. I say that and have a PS3 that is backwards compatible.

You also don't have to pay $40 to play them unless you wanted it very early on (nor is it exactly the same as the ps2 version), so that isn't much of a knock IMO.

[TheLongshot]

You're missing the point my friend. And I say this with respect.

I laid down a challenge.

Lets discuss the merits of a good exclusive Nintendo Wii game released to retailers in 2011.

So, your point is to cherrypick a 4 month period when there has been a dead spot in the release schedule?

How about we talk about the good exclusive games of last year, which there were quite a few.

As for a second question.

How long after the Playstation 3 was released did Sony stop supporting the Playstation 2?

In case you didn't know, I've done the research for you and the answer is YEARS. In fact the Playstation 2 format is still supported by Sony and other publishers. Nintendo killed the Gamecube and made us wait over a year for any titles worth our attention until the Wii came out. Just look back at the complaints regarding how long Twilight Princess was delayed.

Now the exact same thing is happening with the Wii.

I think you should wait until the end of the year to declare that Nintendo is doing "the exact same thing".

What is the next game ANY of you are looking forward to on the Wii? Skyward Sword? That is not coming out for another 5-8 months at the very least and it would have been at least 11 months since a single AA or AAA title would have graced the console.

Pathetic!

I'm sure some are looking forward to The Conduit 2, which comes out this week.

The Last Story and Xenoblade Chronicles are the two most brought up. While we don't know if they will come out here, there is the posibility of them coming. (Particularly since JRPGs have been pretty sparse on all platforms in this generation.)

Then there is the rumors of another Kirby game.

[KingBroly]

You're missing the point my friend. And I say this with respect.

I laid down a challenge.

Lets discuss the merits of a good exclusive Nintendo Wii game released to retailers in 2011. What is the next game ANY of you are looking forward to on the Wii? Skyward Sword? That is not coming out for another 5-8 months at the very least and it would have been at least 11 months since a single AA or AAA title would have graced the console.

Pathetic!

The PS2 format is STILL supported by Sony and other publishers. Nintendo killed the Gamecube and made us wait over a year for any titles worth our attention until the Wii came out. Just look back at the complaints regarding how long Twilight Princess was delayed. Now the exact same thing is happening with the Wii.

Besides, passion is good Shrike. I've done my best to refrain from personal insults and to use valid points to show that Nintendo has thrown hardcore gamers under the bus. I expect the situation to be the same with the next console. I'll be happy to talk numbers and stats and to have a meaningful debate but some people want to argue about the little things so we they don't have to look at the big picture.

It's easy to pick any one title and crap over it under the guise of personal taste but the truth of the matter is that overall libraries and experiences of the Xbox 360, the Playstation, and the PC medium have eclipsed the amount of good content available on the Nintendo Wii.

This is expressed concisely by rating tracking firms such Metacritic and Gamerankings and is stat based proof to back up what I'm saying. If you feel I'm out of line, please let me know and I will edit out those statements.

I'd also argue this is the reason the 3DS hasn't taken off. The hardcore have lost faith and they're not going to get suckered by a gimmick again.

So you say you didn't insult others, then you insult us. Okay...

The 3DS hasn't taken off because there isn't a major game out for the system yet. Not because they've lost faith in Nintendo. Software sells hardware. I refuse to buy a system where the game I want to play isn't out yet. You're saying the software is already there when it isn't.

Reviewers nowadays are coerced by the overhyped game. I can easily point to many games that are overrated that don't deserve what they got, whether it be on Wii, PS3 or 360. Getting into a war over metacritic ratings is hardly worth my time, nor is it worth your effort because someone will always rate a game a 3 while someone else rates it a 9.

You're right, I can't point to a Wii exclusive game from 2011 that has come out that I want. Guess what? I can't do that for PS3 or 360 either. LBP2 and Killzone 2 don't cut it. Socom 4 won't either. And don't get me started on 360, because the only exclusive for that system comes out in September. PS3...November. Now there are multiplatform games I'm looking forward to, but that wasn't your question.

Also, edit faster next time.

[theflicker]

I just had to double check, but yeah, there's been a dry spell. I can say though that I've been enjoying Kirby's Epic Yarn and Donkey Kong Country Returns. Mario Sports Mix is also enjoyable when people are over. I'm not a typical gamer though. I only recently beat NSMB Wii and still have Twilight Princess and both Mario Galaxies to play through.

Anyway, my point is that I've been having fun and if it weren't for Nintendo there'd be a whole lot less to play on the Wii, so I don't see how they "stopped trying".

[shrike4242]

Some people didn't get this hint the first time, so I'll repeat it again:
Let's tone things down a bit, please.

There's a fine line between expressing your opinion in a civil fashion and going well beyond that line. Some of you have crossed it, one well beyond it, as I'm sure everyone can see.

Keep it civil and away from personal attacks, if that's possible.

[foltzie]

Nintendo IS strong today.

If they had gone the way you suggest, they'd probably be Sega and out of the console business. As much as some wish for that, I think it would be a bad thing overall.

Wasn't Sega the Sega of the console business?

[StarKnightX]

IMO , Sega and Nintendo were (in the case of Sega) both forward thinking companies , the difference between them being that Nintendo generally is only forward thinking to the extent of "can we do this and keep it profitable" where as Sega seemed to feel that bigger risks (at a higher cost to themselves) would eventually pay off into bigger rewards in the future , which of course turned out very poorly for them.

Edit:Heh , just saw what happened. Based on Shrike's comments I was expecting that , just didn't know when.

[confoosious]

IMO , Sega and Nintendo were (in the case of Sega) both forward thinking companies , the difference between them being that Nintendo generally is only forward thinking to the extent of "can we do this and keep it profitable" where as Sega seemed to feel that bigger risks (at a higher cost to themselves) would eventually pay off into bigger rewards in the future , which of course turned out very poorly for them.

Edit:Heh , just saw what happened. Based on Shrike's comments I was expecting that , just didn't know when.

You are about right. And the difference is that Sega never had the deep pockets to ride out the expense like Microsoft did.

[dothog]

Another difference between Sega and Nintendo is that SONIC SUCKS HAIRYBALLSWEAT.

[foltzie]

Damn, I love the leadup to E3. So much.

Certainly brings out the vitriol and mass venting of spleens.

[Javery]

Another difference between Sega and Nintendo is that SONIC SUCKS HAIRYBALLSWEAT.

I have to agree here. The Sonic games on Genesis were just OK - they don't hold up well at all either.

[Corvin]

Nintendo was in a different place with the Wii launch, they withheld TP to give the Wii a boost. I don't think their next console needs that boost.


I disagree. I don't think success is guaranteed this time out. Grandma isn't going to buy a Wii2 and they have lost a lot of ground in terms of 'core' gamers. This is where Nintendo comes groveling back to the hardcore crowd they built their company on. They're going to have to have some heavy hitters to sway them back into their corner. I can see Skyward getting bumped, assuming Wii2 holds onto motion in some form.

[Wolfpup]

I have to agree here. The Sonic games on Genesis were just OK - they don't hold up well at all either.

There's not much to them. I loved the original...maybe just because it was fast, looked phenomenal (still holds up fine), and was kind of cool...but there's just not enough to them.

Really looking forward to playing Colors, since it seems like maybe it finally adds what the series needs, and it's gotten great reviews.

I like deliberate gameplay typically, and lots of power ups. Heck, I don't like Super Mario 64 all that much partially because the original version is basically devoid of powerups. Not huge on Rayman 2 for the same reason.

I sooooo want a sequel to Tomba! 2. IMO that might be the best platformer ever made :(

[Zmonkay]

I sooooo want a sequel to Tomba! 2. IMO that might be the best platformer ever made :(

Not to take things OT, but I just had to second this. A third Tomba would be perfect for the 3DS imho, as it's 2.5D graphics and perspective shifting would actually mesh well with the 3D capabilities. Why aren't there any more games like these!?

[georox]

Not to take things OT, but I just had to second this. A third Tomba would be perfect for the 3DS imho, as it's 2.5D graphics and perspective shifting would actually mesh well with the 3D capabilities. Why aren't there any more games like these!?

Or they could make it a real game and do a massive console release with an epic 50-hour storyline... *drools*

50 hours of Tomba... I need a new pair of pants now. Damn you dreams.

[Wolfpup]

I'll buy it on any system they want, though obviously I prefer a real release and not some download thing.

Dang, yeah, I soooooooooo love the days of deep platformers :(

Ooooh, do you guys love the Genesis Wonder Boy in Monster World? I think that's what it was called. It's sort of like a...umm...almost Zelda esque thing, 2D side scrolling. Really awesome too, as I recall (from foggy 20 year old memories).

[StarKnightX]

I would love to see a sequel to Tomba , but that might be unrealistic so I'd settle for PSN ports (or remakes , whatever).

As for Wonder Boy , you can get enough Wonder Boy to last a lifetime on the VC. They (now) have all the Sega original versions plus all the alternative non-Wonder Boy versions.

[Wolfpup]

I would love to see a sequel to Tomba , but that might be unrealistic so I'd settle for PSN ports (or remakes , whatever).

As for Wonder Boy , you can get enough Wonder Boy to last a lifetime on the VC. They (now) have all the Sega original versions plus all the alternative non-Wonder Boy versions.

Well, IMO there are only two good ones...one good, one great (that Wonder Boy 3/whatever-it-was-called-on-the-Turbographix) and of course the Genesis one.

Both of those aren't even in the same genre as some of the earlier arcade games and whatnot. Actually that's kind of cool that they differ so much between games, but it's basically just that one (or two) games that I care about.

[KingBroly]

So...apparently Retro's working on a game everyone wants. I wonder what it could be?

My money's on a new DKCR, but it could easily be Zelda or Metroid.

[rocky435]

One of the many things I'm wondering about is how they will handle virtual console games.

I bet we will be able to transfer our games via usb or redownload. Kinda like the 3DS to dsi which no one knows the full process yet. Well not until may.

Also with virtual console games if they somehow upres them to 1080/720p will they charge extra??? I hope not. Maybe 50 cents. But I'm not going to pay another 5 bucks for Super Mario Bros NES. It looks fine and amazing in 480p. I do wish they smooth the pixels out for snes, genesis games a tad. There's been some people who were dissponted that all-stars wii was just a rom dump and didn't like the 4:3 fullscreen aspect ratio. Although on the ps 3 and 360 they have to use the 4:3 ratio since widescreen wasn't as prevalent as it is today with games. Mortal Kombat 2 arcade is 4:3 on the ps 3 I'm assuming they knew it would look bad or didn't want to put the effort into widescreening it??? If it's fullscreen it's fine with older games as long as it looks good even with borders.

I also hope that having Rockstar making a Grand Theft Auto 5 on the system means and strongly hints that nintendo is FINALLY adding a good online network and some type of gaming tags. ;) And that the 3DS will be updated to support this infrastructure too.

I love Sonic 1,2,3 and Sonic and Knuckles. sonic cd too. sonic adventure and 2 were good but after 2 sega seemed to lose their focus and churned out crap out to sonic 4 which i thought was nice getting back on track. Generations looks simply stunning so far. It looks like they are taking the best of the 2D sonics, Colors, and the first and second Sonic Adventures which is good. I also hope generations will be out on the wii 2.

[Corvin]

There were there same Rockstar rumors about the Wii a year before it came out. I wouldn't hold your breath on that one.

[sciafb]

I'm not listening to the rumors at all, its great to have fun thinking about what could happen but there's no reason to commit to an idea when it can 'never happen' and you will disappoint yourself. I learned that the hard way with the Wii and Twilight Princess.

Don't get me wrong though, after looking past the disappointments in Brawl's online, and physics, Twilight's ease,linear play,relying on OoT model too much, Mario Kart Wii's snaking removal,cheating AI,item abuse,awful online(yes it was still not good enough imo). And just all the other things everyone already knows in general with 3rd parties. I still managed to collect over 20 Wii games that I deem well worth keeping in my collection. I love what the Wii brought but looking back I wish it was more than it ended up being.

I'm sure Nintendo knows what basics are needed for the 'Wii 2' its not like they don't know what a powerful console is. The idiots around the net like on n4g for example spread too much Bullsht about Nintendo always being underpowered and blablahblah (is it normal for kids to know learn ANY history about anything?)
So the only thing that Nintendo would need to be slacked in the face and told what is required of them after the basics is online on par with XboxLIVE. There is no excuse for them.

fk the rumors I'm waitin for e3 and have no expectations, surprise me Nintendo!

[Mad D]

So...apparently Retro's working on a game everyone wants. I wonder what it could be?

My money's on a new DKCR, but it could easily be Zelda or Metroid.

I would have gone with StarFox.

Another rumor had it being this game:

http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/9558/eternaldarknesscover.jpg

[KingBroly]

Who wants Retro to do that?

[Strell]

Not me. Eternal Darkness has a great atmosphere, but that's about it. The gameplay is terrible.

Granted, gameplay is Retro's strong point, so maybe they could craft a good game out of the husk Silicon Knights created.

[StarKnightX]

I'd be willing to let Retro have a shot at doing another (remake of?) Eternal Darkness. Not like Silicon Knights is ever going to get around to doing it , just like they are never going to get around to finishing their epic Too Human trilogy.

[cochesecochese]

Is there a countdown to Nintendo's E3 conference up yet anywhere?

It's pretty much confirmed that I'll be buying this thing, whatever it turns out to be, but I am an unapologetic Nintendo Hype Whore. So, you know, would be glad to know when we're going to find out.

[dothog]

So here come the fakes (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=27275090&postcount=13642)!

[pete5883]

Is there a countdown to Nintendo's E3 conference up yet anywhere?

It's pretty much confirmed that I'll be buying this thing, whatever it turns out to be, but I am an unapologetic Nintendo Hype Whore. So, you know, would be glad to know when we're going to find out.
We don't even know exactly when it is yet.

[KingBroly]

It's June 7th at Noon EST I believe. The day when E3 starts. Sony and Microsoft are the day before that. Sony's is at 9pm EST or something like that.

For some reason I'm expecting a bombshell of a release timeframe. Nintendo's always released their home console during the fall. So I wouldn't be shocked if they said fall 2011, $249 or $299.

[theflicker]

I'd be willing to let Retro have a shot at doing another (remake of?) Eternal Darkness. Not like Silicon Knights is ever going to get around to doing it , just like they are never going to get around to finishing their epic Too Human trilogy.

Is Eternal Darkness not Silicon Knight's IP?

I enjoyed playing it back in the day and never finished all three paths. HD remake could be alright.

[foltzie]

Is Eternal Darkness not Silicon Knight's IP?

I enjoyed playing it back in the day and never finished all three paths. HD remake could be alright.

No or not entirely. Nintendo owns at least the trademarks and by implication may own the entirety of the IP too...

[Zmonkay]

I'm just cringing at having to buy extra controllers for this thing of the screen part is true. I think it's stupid that a DS3 or 360 controller costs 50 bucks. Then again, how much was a Wiimote + nunchuck when they first came out? I don't recall.

[2DMention]

Wiimote + Nunchuck were $60 each.

It seems too early to me. All the other systems are on 10 year life cycles now.

I bet it'll be WiiHD.

[Javery]

I'm just cringing at having to buy extra controllers for this thing of the screen part is true. I think it's stupid that a DS3 or 360 controller costs 50 bucks. Then again, how much was a Wiimote + nunchuck when they first came out? I don't recall.

I think the nunchuck was $20 and the Wiimote was $40. I still don't have a second nunchuck (or a wii motion plus dongle).

If Nintendo delivers on the new console I'll definitely buy it (but NOT at launch). I'm a Nintendo fanboy at heart even though I pretty much hate the Wii (I loved the Gamecube). I really really wish Mario Galaxy, Donkey Kong Country Returns, Super Mario Bros. Wii, etc. were in 1080p. They are all gorgeous in 480p so I can only imagine how great they could have looked.

[KingBroly]

Wiimote: $40
WiiMotion+: $20
Nunchuck: $20
Classic Controller: $20
Total: $100

If a Major Nintendo IP is there at launch, I will buy it at launch. Depending on which franchise, I may or may not break the bones of others to get it Day 1.

EDIT:
Heads Up everyone; apparently, Nintendo is going to stream their investor's meeting. Yeah...um...if true...then WHAT!?

[Sir_Fragalot]

I will be buying this day one as long as it is HD. I am worried it wont be because I know how Nintendo works. While I think Sonic Colors is a great game, playing it on my 26'inch HDTV makes the game look like crap.

[Dead of Knight]

EDIT:
Heads Up everyone; apparently, Nintendo is going to stream their investor's meeting. Yeah...um...if true...then WHAT!?

When is this?

[theflicker]

When is this?

April 26th.

[cochesecochese]

When is this?
Stolen (http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Nintendo+Investors+Meeting&iso=20110426T16&p1=248) shamelessly from GAF

edit: beaten painlessly by theflicker

[KingBroly]

I will be buying this day one as long as it is HD. I am worried it wont be because I know how Nintendo works. While I think Sonic Colors is a great game, playing it on my 26'inch HDTV makes the game look like crap.

It kinda has to be HD. Everyone's saying it is. To what degree of power it has is the debate.

[Sir_Fragalot]

It kinda has to be HD. Everyone's saying it is. To what degree of power it has is the debate.
As long as it's 720p I am fine. I mean I am no graphics person who will complain about graphics but since I got a HDTV the Wii's graphics are more noticeable for some games. Doesn't make the games any more worse but I would like to see games in HD.

Now with that said, it doesn't matter if this system has a ton of third party ports. I realized the reason I love my Wii is it has probably about half of my favorite games this generation (SMG and NMH), and I know this system will deliver on the same greatness.

[FatBoyInside]

I hope Nintendo will also include internal 1080p HD upscaling for current Wii titles if this new console is indeed fully backward compatible (similar to how the original PS3 affected PS2 games). I don't believe that's too much to ask, right?

[Dead of Knight]

Stolen (http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Nintendo+Investors+Meeting&iso=20110426T16&p1=248) shamelessly from GAF

edit: beaten painlessly by theflicker

3am? Fuck.

[foltzie]

http://gear.ign.com/articles/116/1163325p1.html
- GPU Wii 2's GPU will be a modified version of AMD's R700 architecture.
• - CPU The CPU will be a custom-designed triple-core version of the IBM PowerPC chipset.
• - Visuals Project Cafe will run in 1080p, and may be able to utilize Stereoscopic 3D, though it hasn't been confirmed as a feature.
• - Size & Design The console will be around the same size as the first-gen Xbox 360, and may be designed to look like a futuristic looking Super Nintendo.
• - Price Say goodbye to Nintendo having the "budget" console: Project Cafe may cost between 350 and 400 dollars.
• - Release Date Supposedly, the Cafe itself could be ready to ship from the manufacturer to retailers as soon as mid-to-late October, but in order to give developers more time with the new hardware, Nintendo may not launch the console until early 2012.

How Odd... Seems unlikely that Nintendo would abandon their usual pricing strategy... Then again they did just release a $250 handheld...

Interesting.

Speculation GO!

[cochesecochese]

E3 this year is going to be absolutely insane. I predict borked streams 20 minutes before conferences, liveblogging failing, all my favorite sites crashing and...bitter fanboy tears.

[Sir_Fragalot]

http://gear.ign.com/articles/116/1163325p1.html


How Odd... Seems unlikely that Nintendo would abandon their usual pricing strategy... Then again they did just release a $250 handheld...

Interesting.

Speculation GO!
Nintendo is like the Apple of consoles. No matter what they do, they know people will buy it. Well now that I seen the specs, I am day one buying this. Actually all they had to say was HD Wii and I would day one buy it, lol.

[KingBroly]

If it's $400 I won't buy it.

[pjb16]

If it's $400 I won't buy it.
I will if the games look good enough.

[spmahn]

Nintendo is like the Apple of consoles. No matter what they do, they know people will buy it. Well now that I seen the specs, I am day one buying this. Actually all they had to say was HD Wii and I would day one buy it, lol.

I don't buy it, people line up for days to get the new iPhone, and a month later you still have to get on a waiting list to get an iPad 2, while on the other hand the 3DS launch came and went without so much as a whimper and they've been more than readily available since day one. Nintendo is not Apple, not by any stretch of anyones imagination, so people need to quit making that comparison.

[Dead of Knight]

I will if the games look good enough.

I will if they release good weeaboo games... Oh wait Reggie won't allow any over here.

[seanr1221]

From gaf...

http://cache.static.tsavo.com/wordpress/uploads/2011/04/nintendo-project-cafe.jpg

[cochesecochese]

Clearly fake. Posted by dothog a few posts back.

[TheLongshot]

http://gear.ign.com/articles/116/1163325p1.html


How Odd... Seems unlikely that Nintendo would abandon their usual pricing strategy... Then again they did just release a $250 handheld...

Interesting.

Speculation GO!

Funny they say that, since the PS3 launched at $499 for the low end. XBox 360 launched at $299 for the low end. Sounds like Nintendo is splitting the difference.

[thegreek]

$150 controllers??

[Dead of Knight]

I just read the rumor that it'll be as big as the original 360... :rofl: I'm sure that'll go over big in Japan.

[Sir_Fragalot]

I don't buy it, people line up for days to get the new iPhone, and a month later you still have to get on a waiting list to get an iPad 2, while on the other hand the 3DS launch came and went without so much as a whimper and they've been more than readily available since day one. Nintendo is not Apple, not by any stretch of anyones imagination, so people need to quit making that comparison.

I meant saying that no matter what Nintendo does, Nintendo still has die hard fans to support them just like the die hard Apple fans. I was never saying Nintendo was Apple, I was just referring them to the company that close resembles Apple in the video game world with their fans.

Also I really hope the controller has the joystick placement like the classic controller and the PS3 where both joysticks are at the bottom and the d-pad is top left. It makes using the d-pas a hell of a lot easier for me.

[KingBroly]

I just read the rumor that it'll be as big as the original 360... :rofl: I'm sure that'll go over big in Japan.

I think it just said 360. Plus, they're not taking into account the size of a potential power brick.

I dunno...if this launches this fall, I can only thing of 1 Franchise that would be there at launch from Nintendo, and it's not Zelda.

[TheLongshot]

Considering neither Sony nor Microsoft are likely to release a new console until 2014, I doubt Nintendo rushes it out this year.

http://kotaku.com/#!5794000/microsoft-and-sony-targeting-2014-for-new-consoles-leaving-nintendo-in-the-clear

[foltzie]

I think it just said 360. Plus, they're not taking into account the size of a potential power brick.

I dunno...if this launches this fall, I can only thing of 1 Franchise that would be there at launch from Nintendo, and it's not Zelda.

Earthbound?

Is Io a Mother fan?

[bmulligan]

I'd love the idea of an HD Wii for $400 if I didn't already have a Move for my $500 PS3. Right now, it's satisfying my needs for hitting golf balls, shooting zombies, Helghast, and other moving targets. If I could only get my Star Wars RPG, some good light gun remakes, and a decent dungeon-crawler-hack-and-slash, I'll be all set for a while.

I'm also not too keen on drinking the next generation milk in the form of Mario Kart HD, Mario Tennis HD, Mario Super Duper Sluggers HD, Super HD Smash Brothers. God knows Animal Crossing never needs to be remade. I'm not sure the gameplay will be that much different than from the last 3 generations.

I wouldn't mind a fully fleshed out, StarFox Galaxy game in HD, though. Maybe a StarFox sandbox game with a shit-ton of worlds. There will have to be more to coax $400 out of me, though. My needs are almost fully taken care of with MS and Sony right now.

[KingBroly]

I think you need to go back and re-read at what point we're at right now.

The only thing that NO ONE is talking about, and it's once again a point of major contention: Online integration.

[omster]

Finally, Miyamoto made comments about Project Café, the alleged name of Nintendo's next system. He notes that Nintendo believes research and development on new consoles takes about five years to become interesting. He says that Nintendo is always working on new hardware and experiments that the public will never see, making the comment that "where there's smoke there's fire". He, however, warns readers that "you shouldn't believe everything you read", most likely referencing the stream of rumors about the system that started circulating the internet last week.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/news/26125

[pjb16]

Finally, Miyamoto made comments about Project Café, the alleged name of Nintendo's next system. He notes that Nintendo believes research and development on new consoles takes about five years to become interesting. He says that Nintendo is always working on new hardware and experiments that the public will never see, making the comment that "where there's smoke there's fire". He, however, warns readers that "you shouldn't believe everything you read", most likely referencing the stream of rumors about the system that started circulating the internet last week.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/news/26125
He's just playing coy so that everyone is floored come E3. ;)

[KingBroly]

What interests me is that neither Miyamoto or Iwata were the first ones from Nintendo to hint at their next console. I'm wondering what is being worked on from the person who was.

[crunchewy]

I think you need to go back and re-read at what point we're at right now.

The only thing that NO ONE is talking about, and it's once again a point of major contention: Online integration.

+1. Unfortunately I'm pretty doubtful they are going to get it right.

[Sir_Fragalot]

He's just playing coy so that everyone is floored come E3. ;) And hopefully release some secrets no one knows about that make this sound awesome.

+1. Unfortunately I'm pretty doubtful they are going to get it right.
Well the 3DS was a step in the right direction. Now with that said, they had like what, 4 years with the PS3/360 to get it right but Nintendo are fucking dumbasses in the online department so I will guess no. I have come to learn that the Wii/3DS are not really for online but for an enjoyable single player experience and I am fine with that.

[dothog]

At this point, I really couldn't give a shit what the internal spec or MSRP turns out to be, I just hope the Wii 2/Cafe has a trailer hitch so I can hang a rubber novelty ballsack off it.

[MorPhiend]

Possible leaked pic?
http://bulk2.destructoid.com/ul/199406-/cafe-noscale.jpg
We've been inundated with all sorts of mock-ups and leakages concerning Project Cafe, the rumored HD console being developed by Nintendo. The latest development is this supposedly leaked image, found on various forums and image hosts around the 'net.

"Project Cafe is simply the most developer friendly SDK the industry has ever seen," reads the text accompanying the image. "Deliver unparalleled next generation performance at current generation costs. It doesn't get any easier than this."

The image also boasts easy portability from PC and Xbox 360, as well as the ability to update games at any time and an integrated M-Live framework.

As with everything concerning Project Cafe, don't take the picture as incontrovertible truth. Looks pretty slick though, right? What do you reckon?
http://www.destructoid.com/here-s-the-latest-leaked-project-cafe-image-199406.phtml

[omster]

At this point, I really couldn't give a shit what the internal spec or MSRP turns out to be, I just hope the Wii 2/Cafe has a trailer hitch so I can hang a rubber novelty ballsack off it.

Trucks all over the world will be castrated for this noble cause.

[Rocko]

Hmmmmm. May want...

[io]

Earthbound?

Is Io a Mother fan?

Wait, what? Me? I don't understand. If you do mean me, then, no, I would have never heard of Earthbound/Mother if it weren't for this site. I sat out the NES/SNES/N64/PS1 console generations so all that stuff is alien to me. I went right from the Atari to the Gamecube ;).

I have to admit I'm pretty blown away by the rumored specs and especially the controller. You have to give Nintendo credit for one thing if any of this is true - it is a bold move. It would have been easy for them to coast along and just release an incrementally updated HD Wii with the same look and controller. I'm not up to date on which pictures people think are fake and whatnot, but the pictures on the previous page seem to match up with the Powerpoint-looking picture posted on this page. And both have that genuine "captured-on-a-cell-phone-cam" look to them, though I suppose if someone wanted to they could fake that aspect of it as well.

But hopefully at least some of this is true. If so, all the whiners who put down the Wii for its lack of power and non-standard controller (such that it never gets multiplatform titles) will have to come up with something else. Actually, they have: the online... Well, that remains to be seen of course, but I'm not head over heels enthralled with the online on the other two systems. As long as they ditch game-specific friend codes (as they have down with the 3DS) then I'll be happy. Of course I'd prefer a username type setup and some sort of achievement/trophy system as well, but I'm not counting on that.

But it seems like Nintendo is specifically going after the multiplatform stuff not only with the HD support but with the more traditional controller + claims of easy portability of PC and 360 titles. Again, that remains to be seen, but that should remove the major barrier third parties had to at least deliver equivalent ports to all 3 systems.

As for the price, yeah, $200-$250 is nice and all and it was a stroke of genius for the Wii to get it off the ground and in so many homes by pricing it relatively low (compared to the competitiion at the time of launch). Maybe they figured with such a large install base they can charge more for the followup. I do agree with probably most CAGs in thinking that many non-traditional gamer Wii owners would probably balk at $350-$400, though. But they've got to do something different as I think that market is for the most part tapped out anyway.

And really, if you think about it, $350-$400 isn't that bad at all. I mean, sure, some people will pass on it, but there is such a thing as inflation and the baseline for a "cheap" console can't always be $150-$200. I don't have a problem with it creeping up a bit. I really hope they keep it at $300 not only for its own sake, but because that would put pressure on Sony and MS with their next systems - and I want them all on the cheap ;).

[KingBroly]

$350-$400 is bad if it's in-line with current consoles.

[io]

$350-$400 is bad if it's in-line with current consoles.

Really? I think if they came out with the same price as the 360/PS3 and yet it is the new shiny thing then it will do fine. I don't think it can come out much higher than them. Lower would always be better of course. But since we all know Nintendo does not subsidize their console prices I'd rather it be priced higher if that means it has higher-quality stuff inside. Some bare-bones $200 HD system (which is what I really thought they would go with: the standard Wii + HD) isn't going to do much for me.

Of course they have to be prepared that both MS and Sony would counteract any new product announcement with further price cuts on their systems. So I really think there is a ceiling there on what Nintendo can charge. Hopefully that doesn't mean they remove features/power to lower the cost, but that's what I'd be worried about. As I said, I'd rather pay more for it to be a bit more future-proof and ahead of the curve than a stripped down system just to meet some arbitrary price threshold. $50 or $100 doesn't matter much in the long run and if it means better games for years to come then I'm all for it. But that is of course my view on it - Nintendo will price it as they feel is appropriate to sell the most units and make the most money ;).

[laaj]

My only advice for Nintendo is to make this powerful as they can. Or else Microsoft and Sony will leapfrog them again and Nintendo will be right back where they are now with the Wii. For 2-3 years there will be multi-platform development for all 3 consoles but that will drop to 2 if Nintendo's console can't keep up.

[io]

My only advice for Nintendo is to make this powerful as they can. Or else Microsoft and Sony will leapfrog them again and Nintendo will be right back where they are now with the Wii. For 2-3 years there will be multi-platform development for all 3 consoles but that will drop to 2 if Nintendo's console can't keep up.

This. And my concern is that they will drop some power/features in favor of hitting an arbitrary price target. And while that may be OK short term, it will hurt them in the long run.

On the other hand, I think the jump from 360/PS3 to the next gen MS/Sony systems won't be as dramatic as the last transition. I mean, we can't go any higher than HD and that was the big change last time. Yes, frame rates, polygon counts, etc can improve, but I don't think the change will be as massive next time. So, in that respect, if Nintendo can come out at least a little ahead of the 360/PS3 they probably won't be too far behind when their next systems hit. It would be nice if they could at least split the difference (though without knowing what those next systems will be of course).

[foltzie]

Wait, what? Me? I don't understand. If you do mean me, then, no, I would have never heard of Earthbound/Mother if it weren't for this site. I sat out the NES/SNES/N64/PS1 console generations so all that stuff is alien to me. I went right from the Atari to the Gamecube ;).


I meant you, but I meant to include a wink since you had to drop the ban hammer a page or two back.

[KingBroly]

Really? I think if they came out with the same price as the 360/PS3 and yet it is the new shiny thing then it will do fine. I don't think it can come out much higher than them. Lower would always be better of course. But since we all know Nintendo does not subsidize their console prices I'd rather it be priced higher if that means it has higher-quality stuff inside. Some bare-bones $200 HD system (which is what I really thought they would go with: the standard Wii + HD) isn't going to do much for me.

Of course they have to be prepared that both MS and Sony would counteract any new product announcement with further price cuts on their systems. So I really think there is a ceiling there on what Nintendo can charge. Hopefully that doesn't mean they remove features/power to lower the cost, but that's what I'd be worried about. As I said, I'd rather pay more for it to be a bit more future-proof and ahead of the curve than a stripped down system just to meet some arbitrary price threshold. $50 or $100 doesn't matter much in the long run and if it means better games for years to come then I'm all for it. But that is of course my view on it - Nintendo will price it as they feel is appropriate to sell the most units and make the most money ;).

I mean if it's $350-$400 and is only as powerful as 360/PS3 will it be a bad idea. Then in 2-3 years they'll jump so far ahead and they'll be in the same situation they are in now.

[david12795]

I mean if it's $350-$400 and is only as powerful as 360/PS3 will it be a bad idea. Then in 2-3 years they'll jump so far ahead and they'll be in the same situation they are in now.


for all we know, since they claim the wii hd will be more powerful than ps3/360, it could be to any extent

[Sir_Fragalot]

This. And my concern is that they will drop some power/features in favor of hitting an arbitrary price target. And while that may be OK short term, it will hurt them in the long run.

On the other hand, I think the jump from 360/PS3 to the next gen MS/Sony systems won't be as dramatic as the last transition. I mean, we can't go any higher than HD and that was the big change last time. Yes, frame rates, polygon counts, etc can improve, but I don't think the change will be as massive next time. So, in that respect, if Nintendo can come out at least a little ahead of the 360/PS3 they probably won't be too far behind when their next systems hit. It would be nice if they could at least split the difference (though without knowing what those next systems will be of course).

I think we have finally reached the point in gaming where the advancements in tech wont add much to a game except for graphics. I mean every time a new layer of tech gets shoved onto developers they are only forced to spend more time and more money making product but as of today I just don't see the big improvements over like 4 years ago. I seriously don't think the 720 and PS4 will be a life and death difference over the project cafe like the Wii to PS3 (Considering the Project Cafe is more powerful than a PS3). Especially since the games will be more innovative.

[Cerebral_One]

I can't wait until Nintendo announces New Play Control for Wii games on this new fucking console.

[Wolfpup]

I think we have finally reached the point in gaming where the advancements in tech wont add much to a game except for graphics. I mean every time a new layer of tech gets shoved onto developers they are only forced to spend more time and more money making product but as of today I just don't see the big improvements over like 4 years ago. I seriously don't think the 720 and PS4 will be a life and death difference over the project cafe like the Wii to PS3 (Considering the Project Cafe is more powerful than a PS3). Especially since the games will be more innovative.

There's NO evidence for that whatsoever, and no reason to think that.

EDIT: Even if it were true, graphics alone would be plenty of reason to upgrade every five years. We're probably a century away from doing stuff flawlessly, if we ever can.

[KingBroly]

I can't wait until Nintendo announces New Play Control for Wii games on this new fucking console.

Don't you mean Old Play Controls? But honestly...Galaxy in HD would be a buy. Brawl would be...if they removed tripping, added an online marketplace for stickers/trophies, gave us co-op for everything and fixed the netcode.

[mastagoalie]

with everything that has been said of project cafe, it would be able to launch this year. I think they would be very wise to wait for an early 2012 launch with a good launch lineup than rushing it out this year. Just my 2 cents doh

[Wolfpup]

Don't you mean Old Play Controls? But honestly...Galaxy in HD would be a buy. Brawl would be...if they removed tripping, added an online marketplace for stickers/trophies, gave us co-op for everything and fixed the netcode.

It would be hilariously awesome if they released Galaxy and other great Wii games with upgraded graphics and "new" play controls...meaning regular controls, that they should have had to begin with :lol:

Oh, hilariously I'm playing Dead Space: Extraction right now with a regular pad...and it's easier than when I played it with the Wii controller (not easy, but it is actually easier to aim :lol:)

[KingBroly]

Galaxy doesn't need regular controls. Twilight Princess didn't either and already got them. DKCR...arguments can be made. They need to have pointer controls though. Some of the pointer stuff in games (Corruption, Galaxy, Twilight Princess) were AWESOME and not allowing me the option to use said controls is a bad move in my opinion.

I'm playing Dead Space Extraction PSN with a Move Controller. It's SO MUCH EASIER with a Move Controller it's not even funny. Although that game is really hard regardless.

[Wolfpup]

I'm fine if it's an option, but not if a normal pad isn't an option, or isn't bundled in. Galaxy already HAS normal controls pretty much, aside from random wagle. IMO Twilight Princess was pretty bad, but I've heard from multiple people that the (unavailable) Gamecube version is MUCH better and worth playing.

[Cerebral_One]

Don't you mean Old Play Controls? But honestly...Galaxy in HD would be a buy. Brawl would be...if they removed tripping, added an online marketplace for stickers/trophies, gave us co-op for everything and fixed the netcode.

New Play Controls where instead of fucking swinging your wrist you swipe on the stupid 6 inch screen. Same old shit over and over again.

[KingBroly]

Somebody's cranky.

The only NPC game I wanted was Pikmin 2...which they never released here.

[io]

I meant you, but I meant to include a wink since you had to drop the ban hammer a page or two back.

You totally lost me there ;). Anyway, it wasn't me who did anything a few pages back. I do see a bunch of deleted posts (done by another mod) but I still don't get the Earthbound connection...

Anyway, back on topic. I was thinking of dumping one of the 2 Wiis I have now, especially in light of this upcoming system (even if it is in 2012). With the current GS promo I can get around $100 for my launch system. I had picked up a red one in Nov. when Kmart had such a good deal I couldn't resist. I then sold the red remote and nunchuk, Wii Sports, and NSMB (that came with it) and pretty much ended up with the system for free.

The only problem is that I have a decent amount of Virtual Console content on the original system. I assume that I will lose all that, right? I haven't checked into this stuff in a long time and Nintendo's support page is totally silent on the topic but it seems they still haven't implemented any sort of license transfer feature, right? This is why I stopped buying Wii Shop stuff a few years back. It's to the point now where I don't even remember how it all works any more.

If that is the case, then, man, I dunno. I have so many "classic" Nintendo games on there (Mario 64, Star Fox 64, several of the 2D Marios, some Zeldas, etc). Then again, no one in my house has touched them in years. It would just be so nice if they would xfer stuff to a new system for you - at a minimum in the clunky way MS does it (online license transfer, once per year, etc).

[KingBroly]

Yup, you will lose that VC content. You'll probably be able to transfer that stuff to the new system since they are doing it for 3DS. I'd also tie that stuff to a Club Nintendo account just for precaution as well.

Nintendo really just needs an Online Shop Profile. Sales of their Digital Stuff would pickup a lot more if they did that because consumers are scared of losing money.

EDIT:
I'm going to just put this out there as a guess. This touchscreen is going to be 3x2 or 2x3.

[Corvin]

I mean if it's $350-$400 and is only as powerful as 360/PS3 will it be a bad idea. Then in 2-3 years they'll jump so far ahead and they'll be in the same situation they are in now.

That's my concern as well. I likened it to the Dreamcast on another forum. It was the best thing at the time, but it came out mid-generation so it was easily leapfrogged 2 years later with the Xbox, PS2 and GCN. That seems to be where this will fall. Sure it can be better than the 360/PS3, but for how long? 18 months? 2 years?

[Javery]

I wonder if it will actually be a big issue for them. If they launch in 2012 and Sony and MS don't launch until 2014 they get 2 full years to develop a good game library. The first year of the new Sony and MS consoles is going to be rough because it takes that long for a console to find it's footing (Nintendo won't have this problem because their console will probably get a ton of high quality PS3 and 360 ports out of the box). So now we are 3 years into the 5 year cycle - perfect time to drop a new Mario, Zelda, Metroid, etc. to squeeze one more solid year out of the system and after that they will move on to Nintendo Console VII.

[foltzie]

I wonder if it will actually be a big issue for them. If they launch in 2012 and Sony and MS don't launch until 2014 they get 2 full years to develop a good game library. The first year of the new Sony and MS consoles is going to be rough because it takes that long for a console to find it's footing (Nintendo won't have this problem because their console will probably get a ton of high quality PS3 and 360 ports out of the box). So now we are 3 years into the 5 year cycle - perfect time to drop a new Mario, Zelda, Metroid, etc. to squeeze one more solid year out of the system and after that they will move on to Nintendo Console VII.

Could be the plan, of course like any good company the plans are flexible. But in the case of WiiHD, Wii2 or whatever, they've been able to plan this since the days of the Gamecube as the Wii really was a slim Gamecube. There were spec bumps, and of course they hardware group has been working on things such as the Wiimote and Motion Plus, but in terms of new hardware, they've had over a decade working on this platform. The leaked specs imply bumps to previously used hardware* making B/C reasonably easy and cost effective and really a no brainer for the Blue Ocean audience.

The statements about easy porting form the PC/360 is interesting, implying good support of OpenGL and something in the SDK to ease porting from the DirectX APIs used by PC/360 games. Granted, porting from DirectX to OpenGL is reasonably common.

* The rumored ATI chip may not be B/C, as the Flipper/Hollywood chip was an acquisition, but given Hollywood was estimated to be just $30 when the Wii launched, there is probably enough economies of scale by now to include that on the board should inclusion in the new graphics chip not be possible

[david12795]

wow i cant believe the new generation is already starting...feels like its just beginning!

[KingBroly]

Going over what's known and not known for Nintendo at the moment, it seems that a launch title can from any one of the following franchises:

Pokemon, Metroid, F-Zero, Pikmin, Donkey Kong and Smash Bros.

We know Pikmin is/was in development for Wii, but things could change, but I doubt Pikmin would be a compelling title for people to buy a new console. Pokemon seems a bit of a stretch since there's never been a successful console main Pokemon game; a new game is set to be announced in May, but that's most likely for 3DS. Smash doesn't seem likely since Sakurai is developing Kid Icarus Uprising. So we're left with either F-Zero, Metroid or Donkey Kong.

[omster]

Somebody's cranky.

The only NPC game I wanted was Pikmin 2...which they never released here.

I have wondered about this too. Maybe they want to use it later to promote Pikmin 3?

[KingBroly]

Considering it released everywhere but the US two years ago I doubt that.

[Corvin]

Going over what's known and not known for Nintendo at the moment, it seems that a launch title can from any one of the following franchises:

Pokemon, Metroid, F-Zero, Pikmin, Donkey Kong and Smash Bros.

We know Pikmin is/was in development for Wii, but things could change, but I doubt Pikmin would be a compelling title for people to buy a new console. Pokemon seems a bit of a stretch since there's never been a successful console main Pokemon game; a new game is set to be announced in May, but that's most likely for 3DS. Smash doesn't seem likely since Sakurai is developing Kid Icarus Uprising. So we're left with either F-Zero, Metroid or Donkey Kong.

There were also rumors that a Luigi's Mansion sequel was in the works a couple years back. WaveRace was another no-show this gen, which could make a return. Although, with those two you would be looking at a repeat of the GCN launch. lol

If this is really geared towards the hardcore crowd, I think F-Zero is a high possibility.

[pete5883]

wow i cant believe the new generation is already starting...feels like its just beginning!
Isn't this more like Nintendo finally joining the current generation? ::puts up flame shield::

[KingBroly]

There were also rumors that a Luigi's Mansion sequel was in the works a couple years back. WaveRace was another no-show this gen, which could make a return. Although, with those two you would be looking at a repeat of the GCN launch. lol

If this is really geared towards the hardcore crowd, I think F-Zero is a high possibility.

Wave Race and F-Zero, while aimed at the hardcore, won't move systems.

[spmahn]

I have wondered about this too. Maybe they want to use it later to promote Pikmin 3?

I would be surprised if we even saw a Pikmin 3 here. While the games were fun, they petty much tanked here for being too weird and because of their unusual gameplay elements. US audiences are strange, sometimes games that are way out there end up being successful (Katamari Damacy) but a lot of times they don't (Pikmin).

[M-PG71C]

Pikmin 1 + 2 did alright, they didn't bomb by no means, but I don't see it pushing systems out the door either. I can see it coming here and selling well, but not a system seller by no stretch.

[spmahn]

Pikmin 1 + 2 did alright, they didn't bomb by no means, but I don't see it pushing systems out the door either. I can see it coming here and selling well, but not a system seller by no stretch.

Pikmin 1 did all right because it was (pretty much) a Gamecube launch title, but most people I know at least expressed remorse over purchasing it due to it's usual (and not necessarily in a fun way) gameplay. Pikmin 2 was pretty much a bomb though, it came out without much fanfare, and was quickly forgotten about.

[M-PG71C]

@ Spmahn

I know VGChartz is not the most reliable source out there, but they typically get things fairly close. Sometimes. I'll use them for a "its enough" sample. Pikmin 2 sold about 360K in the U.S. The original Pikmin sold about 800K, but as you said, launch title. Enough said.

That was during the GameCube days too, and the tail end of them to boot. That's not bad for an obscure game. I wouldn't call it a "bomb". Not a success either, but certainly not a bomb. There are JRPGs that would absolutely kill for that number of sales.

Looking at trends, I can see Pikmin 3 coming Stateside. I don't believe NOA should be looking at to sell "gangbusters" to mainstream, but if it can maintain numbers similar to Pikmin 2 or better, that's enough in a lot of ways. Of course, I have little faith in NOA in general so this may be a moot point. :/

If it is a launch title though...it certainly a better pick than Steel Diver was. :D

[spmahn]

@ Spmahn

I know VGChartz is not the most reliable source out there, but they typically get things fairly close. Sometimes. I'll use them for a "its enough" sample. Pikmin 2 sold about 360K in the U.S. The original Pikmin sold about 800K, but as you said, launch title. Enough said.

That was during the GameCube days too, and the tail end of them to boot. That's not bad for an obscure game. I wouldn't call it a "bomb". Not a success either, but certainly not a bomb. There are JRPGs that would absolutely kill for that number of sales.

Looking at trends, I can see Pikmin 3 coming Stateside. I don't believe NOA should be looking at to sell "gangbusters" to mainstream, but if it can maintain numbers similar to Pikmin 2 or better, that's enough in a lot of ways. Of course, I have little faith in NOA in general so this may be a moot point. :/

If it is a launch title though...it certainly a better pick than Steel Diver was. :D

I have Pikmin 1 selling even less than that, closer to 680k in the US, but I digress. I can just see Nintendo doing with Pikmin what they more or less did with Fire Emblem, where people bitched and bitched and bitched about them not getting localized, and then when they finally did, no one actually bought any of them, so they're probably going to stop localizing them again.

[KingBroly]

This link: https://www.warioworld.com/cafe/

Pretty much confirms that Nintendo's next console is codenamed "Cafe."

[omster]

This link: https://www.warioworld.com/cafe/

Pretty much confirms that Nintendo's next console is codenamed "Cafe."

They changed the link. It just forwards to https://www.warioworld.com without the /cafe/. Unless that's the way it always was since the link doesn't end up a 404 error.

[omster]

Here is what it was before: http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/news/26140

I guess that still leaves us knowing nothing really.

This Tuesday maybe interesting though with the Nintendo investors meeting.

[jbug617]

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/2676/nintendojps77.jpg

Got this pic from Gaf and it's a rumor controller for Project Cafe.

Here is the banner for Project Cafe from the Wario World site

http://i.imgur.com/EpbJ8.jpg

[jbug617]

Nintendo confirms that there is a new console and it will be shown at E3 and will launch in 2012.

[cochesecochese]

6 weeks. boom.

STOLEN SHAMELESSLY FROM NIROLAK AT GAF:
http://i.imgur.com/3ydGU.png

It's a translated version of the PDF found here. (http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2011/110425_4.pdf) (NCL official site; Warning:PDF)

[Sir_Fragalot]

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/2676/nintendojps77.jpg

Got this pic from Gaf and it's a rumor controller for Project Cafe.

Here is the banner for Project Cafe from the Wario World site

http://i.imgur.com/EpbJ8.jpg

I hope that's real. That design looks fantastic.

[pete5883]

Same power and Home buttons as the Wii? Hmm.