Self Loathing vs. Narcissism

[JSweeney]

Which do you think is more harmful?
Which do you think applies more to you?
How do you think these affect group dynamics?

For some reason, I have a feeling that this won't do nearly as well as some of the other more recent "vs" threads.:)

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Which do you think is more harmful?
Which do you think applies more to you?
How do you think these affect group dynamics?

For some reason, I have a feeling that this won't do nearly as well as some of the other more recent "vs" threads.:)

They're equally harmful. EDIT: They can be equally harmful.
Self Loathing.
Either you can be the only person hating yourself, or everyone else can hate you.

Judging by the response so far I'd say that's a safe assumption.

[Lina]

Self-loathing. There's no point to it.
Narcissism.
Either you can be the only person hating yourself, or everyone else can hate you.

[DenisDFat]

Self loathing is funny more often than is narcissism. Narcissisn is more wont to lead to resentment in groups.

Self loathing sometimes leads to pity attention from hot chicks.

[shrike4242]

I think they're equally harmful for different reasons.

Self-loathing will have your view on the world colored by the lack of self-worth you have. And color those around you who interact with you.

Narcissism, same problem, opposite issue, since you won't have a good grip on reality because you love yourself so much.

Self-loathing affects group dynamics more, since people IMHO tend to be affected more by someone being depressed/down more than they are with them being high on themselves.

$0.02 where appropriate.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Self loathing can't affect group dynamics if you make the mental leap of "if I hate myself then everyone else must" and avoid any and all groups.

[jaykrue]

Self loathing can't affect group dynamics if you make the mental leap of "if I hate myself then everyone else must" and avoid any and all groups.

I agree. If you loathe yourself, you wouldn't interact with anyone else even though you want to with every fiber of your being. Narcissism (that's a lot of 's'), which I admit is my greatest flaw, can be terrible for group dynamics since the narcissist will be more outgoing (although in the wrong way) and thus earn initial trust from a social group. It isn't until the narcissism is self-evident that the group dynamics is altered.

[shrike4242]

I agree. If you loathe yourself, you wouldn't interact with anyone else even though you want to with every fiber of your being. Narcissism (that's a lot of 's'), which I admit is my greatest flaw, can be terrible for group dynamics since the narcissist will be more outgoing (although in the wrong way) and thus earn initial trust from a social group. It isn't until the narcissism is self-evident that the group dynamics is altered.

I stand correctly and agree. Sit corrected as well.

[Kayden]

I think I'm a self-loathing narcissist. I hate me for thinking I'm so great :mrgreen:

[Mookyjooky]

I've been a bit of both in my hay-day....I'll say one thing...it depends on what you do.

When I was a musician, being Narcisstic was a must have...If you started loathing...you'd write crap. Even the people with the romatic infactuation with self-loathing.

Now that I'm a Self Loathing I.T. Slug at GE....yea, I'm depressed alot...

But fuck it....I'm getting back to the top now.

[jaykrue]

I think I'm a self-loathing narcissist. I hate me for thinking I'm so great :mrgreen:

I think I'm the same. I can't stand myself for being so beautiful and having the face of god.

*ahem* Inner Monologue:

Ego: Inflated Ego much?

Super Ego: Yes, thank you, I am hot

Id: I love lamp.

[Kayden]

I think I'm the same. I can't stand myself for being so beautiful and having the face of god.

*ahem* Inner Monologue:

Ego: Inflated Ego much?

Super Ego: Yes, thank you, I am hot

Id: I love lamp.

I think my id would be the exact same as me. My personality is so broad that I hit just about every emotion at some point in the day.

[shrike4242]

I think I'm the same. I can't stand myself for being so beautiful and having the face of god.

*ahem* Inner Monologue:

Ego: Inflated Ego much?

Super Ego: Yes, thank you, I am hot

Id: I love lamp.

I'm so blinded by your divine radiance, I need shades. :roll:8-)

[Kayden]

I'm so blinded by your divine radiance, I need shades. :roll:8-)

Do you wear them at night?
http://www.interq.or.jp/www1/onj1/corey/sunglasses.jpg

[shrike4242]

Do you wear them at night?
http://www.interq.or.jp/www1/onj1/corey/sunglasses.jpg

All depends on how much time jaykrue spends in eyeshot. :rofl:

And certainly not looking anything like that. :shock:

[jaykrue]

All depends on how much time jaykrue spends in eyeshot. :rofl:

And certainly not looking anything like that. :shock:

C'mon, you know you want to pimp out the '80s-Hello-My-Name-Is-Corey' look :D

[shrike4242]

C'mon, you know you want to pimp out the '80s-Hello-My-Name-Is-Corey' look :D

No, not even at gunpoint. :razz:

Anyway, I don't have the hair to pull that look off, regardless. Short short short hair, have I. :D

[jaykrue]

No, not even at gunpoint. :razz:

Anyway, I don't have the hair to pull that look off, regardless. Short short short hair, have I. :D

That's what wigs are for ;)

[shrike4242]

That's what wigs are for ;)

Try as you might, oh divine light of blinding fury, it ain't happening. :rofl:

[jaykrue]

Try as you might, oh divine light of blinding fury, it ain't happening. :rofl:

Hey, I hadda give it a shot :lol:

[shrike4242]

Hey, I hadda give it a shot :lol:

Indeed you did. Hope you liked some of that wasted effort. :lol:

[tauruskatt]

Which do you think is more harmful?
Which do you think applies more to you?
How do you think these affect group dynamics?


Self loathing = more harmful for the individual
Narcissism = more harmful for a group

hrm, yup, narcissism, since I definately don't do the self loathing thing. i have a tendancy to make farcical narcissitic comments/commentary (along the lines of talking about being hit on or checked out, etc) but I generally am joking about these things as much as I do because it's easier to joke about being hot then it is to think of other people thinking of me as a piece of meat. my sense of humor is my shield ~ you can't touch me, nananabooboo!!.... 8-)

narcissitic people tend to either take on everything in a group and moderate/"manage" everything to the distaste of others, or everyone just shuns that person and does their own thing. Someone who's self loathing however would probably just allow anyone else to walk all over them and never make any valuable contributions because their afraid they aren't worthy of mattering :cry: sad pandas.

~

[zionoverfire]

To much of anything is bad, but I prefer narcissim to self-loathing any day of the week.

[Quillion]

Self loathing sometimes leads to pity attention from hot chicks.


I know you don't like people quoting DDF. But... I felt that this was a tremendously prescient statement from him concerning recent events in the OT forum.

Maybe I'm the only one who will make that leap.

Back on topic, The degree of either determines how harmful it will be.

I'd say I have a healthy self-image. I'm a bit arrogant, but undeluded as to my actual qualities.

I would also say that the degree determines the level of disruption to a group dynamic.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

You were right Sweeney, guess you should have put "titts" somewhere in the title. :lol:

[Kayden]

You were right Sweeney, guess you should have put "titts" somewhere in the title. :lol:

*beats sub*
Let it die, let it die, let it die! :lol:

[sblymnlcrymnl]

*beats sub*
Let it die, let it die, let it die! :lol:

No, this is an important subject worthy of our attention. :D

I guess to stay on topic ( ;) ) I can say that my sister is one of the worst narcissists I've ever met, and I'm her polar opposite in almost every regard.

[BigSpoonyBard]

well, there is something gratifying about a good self-loathing binge :)

[zionoverfire]

No, this is an important subject worthy of our attention. :D

I guess to stay on topic ( ;) ) I can say that my sister is one of the worst narcissists I've ever met, and I'm her polar opposite in almost every regard.

I'm a narcissist and I'm reasonably sure you aren't very self loathing.:lol:

[zewone]

What if you were both? Dun dun dun dun dunnnnnnnnnnnnnn!

[BigSpoonyBard]

What if you were both? Dun dun dun dun dunnnnnnnnnnnnnn!

God I hate myself for being so freakin awesome! :bomb:

[sblymnlcrymnl]

I'm a narcissist and I'm reasonably sure you aren't very self loathing.:lol:

Maybe you don't know me as well as you think. :lol:

[BigSpoonyBard]

Maybe you don't know me as well as you think. :lol:

Just look at him, zion. What reason wouldn't sblymnl have to hate himself?

[zionoverfire]

Maybe you don't know me as well as you think. :lol:

I should certainly hope not.:lol:

But really you seem to loath company more than yourself, if you really are self loathing you keep it under wraps a lot better than a certain squire.:D

[sblymnlcrymnl]

I should certainly hope not.:lol:

But really you seem to loath company more than yourself, if you really are self loathing you keep it under wraps a lot better than a certain squire.:D

I can loathe everyone equally, I don't have to differentiate between myself and others. :lol:

Besides, self loathing is a personal matter. There's no need to share with the class so to speak.

[BigSpoonyBard]

Besides, self loathing is a personal matter. There's no need to share with the class so to speak.

He's got a point there.

[zionoverfire]

I can loathe everyone equally, I don't have to differentiate between myself and others. :lol:

Besides, self loathing is a personal matter. There's no need to share with the class so to speak.

True, it just doesn't seem to suit you. Why in the world would you of all people be self loathing?

[BigSpoonyBard]

True, it just doesn't seem to suit you. Why in the world would you of all people be self loathing?

Just look at him, man!!!

[sblymnlcrymnl]

True, it just doesn't seem to suit you. Why in the world would you of all people be self loathing?

Why not? If all people are equally worthless, and I am a person, obviously it follows that I am worthless. :lol:


And as little as you might know about me zion I'll have you know that I revealed my pedophilic tendencies here a full 8 years earlier than I did with my closest friends. ;) :lol:

[zionoverfire]

Why not? If all people are equally worthless, and I am a person, obviously it follows that I am worthless. :lol:


And as little as you might know about me zion I'll have you know that I revealed my pedophilic tendencies here a full 8 years earlier than I did with my closest friends. ;) :lol:

Which is why you self loathing I really don't see, well I don't see completely I always figured you for a bit of a narcist, especially how you wrote that first sentance.;)

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Narcissist? No. Nihilist? Getting warmer. :lol:

[zionoverfire]

Narcissist? No. Nihilist? Getting warmer. :lol:

Yes but I figure out of the 2 choices listed you would have been sllightly narcisistic not vice versa.;)

[KingSpike]

With that current picture, it's clear that sblymnyl is doing SOME self-"loathing."

[zionoverfire]

With that current picture, it's clear that sblymnyl is doing SOME self-"loathing."

Or beating it thinking about some other user.;)

[BigSpoonyBard]

Or beating it thinking about some other user.;)

Considering your reputation, zion, I think we know who that is...

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Yes but I figure out of the 2 choices listed you would have been sllightly narcisistic not vice versa.;)

How so?

[zionoverfire]

How so?

Because you seem to look down on certain people, that's a bit more typical of narcissism.


Considering your reputation, zion, I think we know who that is...

Sorry bud but clearly you are way out of the loop on this one.;)

[Kayden]

Why wont the hurting stop?

[BigSpoonyBard]

Sorry bud but clearly you are way out of the loop on this one.;)

Loop, shmoop. I'm just continuing a prior discussion zion and I had :)

[zionoverfire]

Why wont the hurting stop?

Because you touch yourself at night.:lol:

Loop, shmoop. I'm just continuing a prior discussion zion and I had :)

In this case it doesnt' work and thanks for misdirecting it, I was trying to give sbmyl more shit.:D

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Because you seem to look down on certain people, that's a bit more typical of narcissism.

I still don't see how being self loathing excludes you from loathing others. :lol:

[BigSpoonyBard]

In this case it doesnt' work and thanks for misdirecting it, I was trying to give sbmyl more shit.:D

All the more reason to do it, jerk :lol:

[zionoverfire]

I still don't see how being self loathing excludes you from loathing others. :lol:

It doesn't, it just appears to me that you would be MORE narcissist than a self loather and on a simple scale like this would fall into the narcs catagory.;)

[Kayden]

Because you touch yourself at night.:lol:


Lies. I'm too busy playing Guild Wars at night... I touch myself durring the day just after I wake up. :joystick: :lol:

[zionoverfire]

Lies. I'm too busy playing Guild Wars at night... I touch myself durring the day just after I wake up. :joystick: :lol:

How is guild wars by the way? My friend is looking for something everquest like.

[Kayden]

How is guild wars by the way? My friend is looking for something everquest like.

How much have I posted in the past week? :lol:

[sblymnlcrymnl]

It doesn't, it just appears to me that you would be MORE narcissist than a self loather and on a simple scale like this would fall into the narcs catagory.;)

Maybe that would apply if the basic tenant of narcissism wasn't self love (and not in the physical sense). Without that you haven't a leg to stand on. :lol:

[zionoverfire]

Maybe that would apply if the basic tenant of narcissism wasn't self love (and not in the physical sense). Without that you haven't a leg to stand on. :lol:

Part of self love is having self worth and to have self worth well sometimes you've got to crack a few eggs. And if you really are such a self loathing bastard I think you wouldn't stand up for yourself nearly as much as you do.


How much have I posted in the past week? :lol:

Honestly I couldn't tell you.

[Kayden]

Part of self love is having self worth and to have self worth well sometimes you've got to crack a few eggs. And if you really are such a self loathing bastard I think you wouldn't stand up for yourself nearly as much as you do.




Honestly I couldn't tell you.

Well, think about what you can mock me for saying thats less than a week old... :lol:

[zionoverfire]

Well, think about what you can mock me for saying thats less than a week old... :lol:

Oh your gf came on and posted a few juicy ones. :twisted:

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Part of self love is having self worth and to have self worth well sometimes you've got to crack a few eggs. And if you really are such a self loathing bastard I think you wouldn't stand up for yourself nearly as much as you do.

But I have no self worth. I have very specific beliefs (and lack of beliefs) which I am not granted exception from.

For example, I maintain that the sole purpose of all life is reproduction. I have no desire to reproduce, therefore I am of no value to the world. :lol:

[zionoverfire]

But I have no self worth. I have very specific beliefs (and lack of beliefs) which I am not granted exception from.

For example, I maintain that the sole purpose of all life is reproduction. I have no desire to reproduce, therefore I am of no value to the world. :lol:

Interesting, where do I find a list of these beliefs? Or do I have to coax them out of you somehow?

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Interesting, where do I find a list of these beliefs? Or do I have to coax them out of you somehow?

I don't have a current list at the moment, though maybe I can whip one up in the near future. I'd like to take my time though, to make sure I don't leave something out.

Alternatively, you could ask specific questions and if I have an anwser it will be provided.

[zionoverfire]

I don't have a current list at the moment, though maybe I can whip one up in the near future. I'd like to take my time though, to make sure I don't leave something out.

Alternatively, you could ask specific questions and if I have an anwser it will be provided.

Okay if the purpose of all humanity is to have children:

1. Why are you so facinated by supermodels who lack child bearing hips?
2. Why don't you want to have children?
3. Why if you are totally worthles haven't you killed yourself?
4. And why in the world is the purpose of life soley to reproduce?

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Okay if the purpose of all humanity is to have children:

1. Why are you so facinated by supermodels who lack child bearing hips?
2. Why don't you want to have children?
3. Why if you are totally worthles haven't you killed yourself?
4. And why in the world is the purpose of life soley to reproduce?

1. Because that isn't important to me.
2. It is a pointless endeavor. And I don't like kids. :lol:
3. Yet. Also having nothing to live for is not the same as wanting to die. Though I do consider it on a fairly regular basis.
4. That's just the way things are. :lol: I don't know how you want me to answer that ... propogation of the species is the goal of all life, human or otherwise. It's a vicious circle, that.

[zionoverfire]

4.that ... propogation of the species is the goal of all life, human or otherwise. It's a vicious circle, that.


Out of all of your answers this one makes the least sense. Every species after some point will have produced offspring that are not of the same species, so in the end they produce their own end.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Out of all of your answers this one makes the least sense. Every species after some point will have produced offspring that are not of the same species, so in the end they produce their own end.

Yes, but they don't know that. They merely live to breed.

[zionoverfire]

Yes, but they don't know that. They merely live to breed.

And what happens when they have the ability to choose how they breed? Humanity has been very selective when it can be on which traits it chooses.

But even then breeding requires years of nurturing before the cycle can be completed and that will requrie a great deal of people who themselves are not the parents themselves. Teachers for instance are a great example.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

And what happens when they have the ability to choose how they breed? Humanity has been very selective when it can be on which traits it chooses.

But even then breeding requires years of nurturing before the cycle can be completed and that will requrie a great deal of people who themselves are not the parents themselves. Teachers for instance are a great example.

The fact that humans prepare for a life greater than mere survival is irrelavant. All that matters is that your offspring survive long enough to produce their own.

[zionoverfire]

The fact that humans prepare for a life greater than mere survival is irrelavant. All that matters is that your offspring survive long enough to produce their own.

That takes time, I'm not talking about society in terms of feeding, cloathing and producing skills nessasary to produce, feed and shelter the next and the next generation to come. The advantage with a society lies in it's ability to use other than the parents to take some of this load which allows for an increased reproduction rate and an increase survival rate. Therefor one does not need to physically have kids in order to benefit reproduction.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

That takes time, I'm not talking about society in terms of feeding, cloathing and producing skills nessasary to produce, feed and shelter the next and the next generation to come. The advantage with a society lies in it's ability to use other than the parents to take some of this load which allows for an increased reproduction rate and an increase survival rate. Therefor one does not need to physically have kids in order to benefit reproduction.

Ok, somehow that wasn't clear to me in your last post. I was eating, my apologies. :lol:

In any case if you're not part of the solution, you're ... shit I changed my rank. :lol:

[zionoverfire]

Ok, somehow that wasn't clear to me in your last post. I was eating, my apologies. :lol:

In any case if you're not part of the solution, you're ... shit I changed my rank. :lol:

Yes I make my posts vague for reasons such as this.;)

It just seems odd that you'd become so fixated on reproduction but you have so little interest in it.

Personally I'd say reproduction isn't that important because most of the people of this planet are simply cogs in a machine, if a few don't want to reproduce who cares the rest will simply make up for it. The importance of humanity has never in my opinion been our continuation in descendants but rather the ingenuity of a hadfull of people each generation.

[dcfox]

:dunce: This conversation is too intellectual for me. But I will agree with Zion on that within a society personal propagation no longer has to be the first priority. Rather preservation of the species/society as a whole becomes more important. You can see this in social insects like ants or bees where there is a division of roles. Some exist only to protect the society, others exist only to feed the society and others still only exist to mate.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

Yes I make my posts vague for reasons such as this.;)

It just seems odd that you'd become so fixated on reproduction but you have so little interest in it.

Personally I'd say reproduction isn't that important because most of the people of this planet are simply cogs in a machine, if a few don't want to reproduce who cares the rest will simply make up for it. The importance of humanity has never in my opinion been our continuation in descendants but rather the ingenuity of a hadfull of people each generation.

I only said it was what I believed, not that it made any sort of sense. :lol:

I'd agree that it's not important, but I maintain that it is the only thing approaching a purpose we have. :lol:

[zionoverfire]

I only said it was what I believed, not that it made any sort of sense. :lol:

I'd agree that it's not important, but I maintain that it is the only thing approaching a purpose we have. :lol:

It just seems odd that you are so focused on a "collective" purpose, do you actually care if the human race dies off in 500 years? I know I could lead a quite happy life even knowing of the planets impending doom.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

It just seems odd that you are so focused on a "collective" purpose, do you actually care if the human race dies off in 500 years? I know I could lead a quite happy life even knowing of the planets impending doom.

Oh, not at all. I have a capacity for indifference you would not believe. :lol:

[zionoverfire]

Oh, not at all. I have a capacity for indifference you would not believe. :lol:

So then why consider yourself unimportant? I mean sure on a universal scale we are nothing but even I try to avoid thinking about really large and very tiny things to often, it's not very healthy. Certainly after seeing what the majority of humanity does with its lives you can see yourself as being worth perhaps a bit more than a shit?

[sblymnlcrymnl]

So then why consider yourself unimportant? I mean sure on a universal scale we are nothing but even I try to avoid thinking about really large and very tiny things to often, it's not very healthy. Certainly after seeing what the majority of humanity does with its lives you can see yourself as being worth perhaps a bit more than a shit?

Why? I have accomplished nothing in life and intend to keep it that way. It's not so much that I want to do nothing as it is there is nothing I want to do. I'm not prone to healthy thoughts, which is why I try to limit my exposure to my own mind through constant bombardment. (books/games/movies/music)

On a side note I think I may be a bit ADD, because when reading I can better concentrate on the task at hand if I have something to distract me. (usually music)

[zionoverfire]

Why? I have accomplished nothing in life and intend to keep it that way. It's not so much that I want to do nothing as it is there is nothing I want to do. I'm not prone to healthy thoughts, which is why I try to limit my exposure to my own mind through constant bombardment. (books/games/movies/music)

On a side note I think I may be a bit ADD, because when reading I can better concentrate on the task at hand if I have something to distract me. (usually music)

My god how similar we are, it's rather spooky. But you forget one important point: what happens when you take a thousand alienated humans of reasonable intelligence and allow them to think for 50 years? You get a few really good ideas, besides I bet you get a bit more from that constant media bombardment than most people.;)

[sblymnlcrymnl]

My god how similar we are, it's rather spooky. But you forget one important point: what happens when you take a thousand alienated humans of reasonable intelligence and allow them to think for 50 years? You get a few really good ideas, besides I bet you get a bit more from that constant media bombardment than most people.;)

:lol:

I can't imagine seeing 50. Hell, I can't even see myself making it to thirty. But I think that's ok. When you aren't looking forward to anything is hard to see how the future could possibly be different.

[zionoverfire]

:lol:

I can't imagine seeing 50. Hell, I can't even see myself making it to thirty. But I think that's ok. When you aren't looking forward to anything is hard to see how the future could possibly be different.

See this is what I get for speaking in general, people don't normally like to think that they won't at least reach 70.;)

So tell me what outside of videogames do you actually enjoy in this world and women made of plastic and computer editing don't count.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

See this is what I get for speaking in general, people don't normally like to think that they won't at least reach 70.;)

So tell me what outside of videogames do you actually enjoy in this world and women made of plastic and computer editing don't count.

Besides books/games/movies/music? Not a whole lot. I guess you could add "Open discourse with like-minded individuals". I don't really do much else. I go to school, but for the most part I have no interest in the classes I take. I work, but that's just a paycheck. That's about it. :lol:

Also if you didn't notice, my list of interests are in alphabetical order. That was not unintentional. :oops:

[zionoverfire]

Besides books/games/movies/music? Not a whole lot. I guess you could add "Open discourse with like-minded individuals". I don't really do much else. I go to school, but for the most part I have no interest in the classes I take. I work, but that's just a paycheck. That's about it. :lol:

Also if you didn't notice, my list of interests are in alphabetical order. That was not unintentional. :oops:

So pretty much the same damn shit I do but only in an anal retentive way, what in the world is your major anyhow?

[sblymnlcrymnl]

So pretty much the same damn shit I do but only in an anal retentive way, what in the world is your major anyhow?

Information Technology. :cry:

[zionoverfire]

Information Technology. :cry:

:rofl: You have all this potential and you choose that? My god you could have at least gone with philosophy, granted you'd never get a job but you'd probably be a hell of a lot happier.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

:rofl: You have all this potential and you choose that? My god you could have at least gone with philosophy, granted you'd never get a job but you'd probably be a hell of a lot happier.

I started out as a straight CS major, because basically by the time I finished high school I was sick of everything else. :lol: I quickly decided that I didn't want to put that much effort into a lesser evil type situation. :lol:

You know I've never taken a philosophy class. There is one required for my degree, but it always fills up before I bother to enroll. It's "Foundations of Logic and Scientific Method" Which I think will be a bit too basic but possibly enjoyable.

I want to take some more psychology and maybe history classes for personal enjoyment, but they conflict with my 2 day a week schedules. :lol: :cry:

[zionoverfire]

And this is why you get a major you actually care about, although I suppose I shouldn't talk seeing as outside of labwork I basically hate chemistry.

Well I'm off to sleep, I'll have to think about this more in the morning you're conclusion just seems a bit odd, perhaps a biology class or 2 might be fun for you.

[sblymnlcrymnl]

And this is why you get a major you actually care about, although I suppose I shouldn't talk seeing as outside of labwork I basically hate chemistry.

Well I'm off to sleep, I'll have to think about this more in the morning you're conclusion just seems a bit odd, perhaps a biology class or 2 might be fun for you.

Yes well that would be more enjoyable but probably less useful.

Oh yeah, and I haven't taken biology since I was a sophomore in high school. And even that was a basic class. :lol: I do subscribe to Discover, so that helps somewhat. :lol:

Night, I'm off to bed myself.

[shrike4242]

Locked, per the request of the OP.