WrestleMania 21 Thread

[Pure Apathy]

*edit*
Here are the review links.

IGN - 6.0
http://xbox.ign.com/articles/606/606033p1.html

Team Xbox - 6.8
http://reviews.teamxbox.com/xbox/934/WWE-WrestleMania-21/p1/

GameSpy - 2/5
http://xbox.gamespy.com/xbox/wrestlemania-xxi/606295p1.html

Gamespot - 4.5
http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/action/wwewrestlemania21/index.html?q=wwe

http://img254.echo.cx/img254/7690/apr200011iw.jpg


http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/0...ws_6122657.html (http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/04/20/news_6122657.html)

For wrestling fans, there's nothing like pile-driving an opponent into submission--especially when they're halfway across the country. THQ's WrestleMania XXI, released today, was billed to allow gamers to do just that through the game's Xbox Live support.


Unfortunately, consumers who unwrapped the Xbox game and tried to use its online features have been slammed into an unwanted reality--currently, WrestleMania XXI's online features won't even step into the ring.

News of the possible glitch began to spring up on forums around the Web, as disgruntled gamers explained their situations. Said one forum poster, "Anyone else who has the game having this problem [connecting to Xbox Live]? Any other game I can connect with, but this game doesn't even TRY to connect. It just says, 'Your Xbox console cannot connect to Xbox Live. Do you want to start the troubleshooter?'"

Attempts to wrestle online in the GameSpot offices met the same fate. Pre-release versions worked online, albeit with some lag issues.

When trying to play the Xbox Live portion of the game, players are receiving the "Could not connect to Xbox Live" error message. Attempting to sign in to users' Xbox Live accounts causes the game to immediately display the error message, indicating that WMXXI isn't even going through the standard procedures to connect online. However, when attempting to connect through the Xbox dashboard or another Xbox Live-enabled title, Microsoft's online service works just fine.

THQ is currently working with Microsoft to remedy the issue. GameSpot will have more on this story as it develops

I'm not suprised at all, DoR 2 needs to hurry up and come out.

[Superstar]

Yeah look what they gave raw\raw 2. IGN has shown MANY times their reviews are way off.

edit : Gamestats.com gave it a 99.5\100.

[gaelan]

7.5 Presentation
The intros and special moves are spot-on. The menu system is difficult to navigate and the game chugs during transitions.

8.5 Graphics
The player models are exceptional and animations are very realistic. This is one good-looking game.

6.0 Sound
Official wrestler themes and custom soundtracks counteract the outdated licensed music and poor voice-over work.

5.0 Gameplay
The grappling system feels frustrating even with the addition of counters. This is due to the numerous issues concerning poor A.I. and collision detection.

6.5 Lasting Appeal
There are a good number of gameplay modes and there is also online play, but these are both negated by the disturbing gameplay issues.

6.0 OVERALL
(out of 10 / not an average)

[Superstar]

http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/920641.asp

they give it a 9.

[Pure Apathy]

http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/920641.asp

they give it a 9.

I still think this game is going to suck. I will pass on it for now until more people get a chance to play it. I haven't bought a wrestling game since WMXIX and I am still happy with it.

[Superstar]

I still think this game is going to suck. I will pass on it for now until more people get a chance to play it. I haven't bought a wrestling game since WMXIX and I am still happy with it.

I'll beable to tell you my opinion on it soon, if you care to hear. I am also curious what other sites think, but I don't let reviews decide for me.

[Pure Apathy]

I'll beable to tell you my opinion on it soon, if you care to hear. I am also curious what other sites think, but I don't let reviews decide for me.

Sure, I'd love to hear it. The only review site I really keep track of is gamespot. IGN's reviews have been way off here lately.

[TheUnsane1]

I'm on the fence with this game and wouldn't mind other cag opinions. I'm hoping it's good but assuming it will be trash.

[Superstar]

Sure, I'd love to hear it. The only review site I really keep track of is gamespot. IGN's reviews have been way off here lately.

Gamespot is pretty high on my list right now, to hear from about the game. I've been refreshing the main page for awhile now hah. I am glad to hear xbox live matches run smoothly, well atleast according to ign they do.

[cthcky33]

I'm on the fence with this game and wouldn't mind other cag opinions. I'm hoping it's good but assuming it will be trash.

i too am on the fence, and with that review im not gonna get it day 1, ill at least wait a week or two to see what other people think

[GuilewasNK]

I am diggin' your sig image RawisJericho!

To stay on topic...it will take a AKI-style engine before I buy another wrestling game.

[Pure Apathy]

I am diggin' your sig image RawisJericho!

To stay on topic...it will take a AKI-style engine before I buy another wrestling game.

Thanks! onetrackmind hooked me up with it, he did a really good job with it too.

I would kill right now if EA bought the rights to make WWE games and used the old AKI engine. This is the only move I'd like to see EA make. The quality of wrestling games has been on the decline from THQ.

[cthcky33]

Thanks! onetrackmind hooked me up with it, he did a really good job with it too.

I would kill right now if EA bought the rights to make WWE games and used the old AKI engine. This is the only move I'd like to see EA make. The quality of wrestling games has been on the decline from THQ.

hasnt the WWE been trying to get out of their contract with THQ or something like that???

[rafissaying]

ouch....6.0 isnt a decent enough score to keep my preorder. i guess i have to change my preorder to something else.

[Pure Apathy]

hasnt the WWE been trying to get out of their contract with THQ or something like that???

Yeah something like that, WWE sued THQ/JAKKS over something. I don't really remember what it was over, and I could be wrong with THQ being in the lawsuit.

[CaseyRyback]

Thanks! onetrackmind hooked me up with it, he did a really good job with it too.

I would kill right now if EA bought the rights to make WWE games and used the old AKI engine. This is the only move I'd like to see EA make. The quality of wrestling games has been on the decline from THQ.

pretty sure that they had the rights to TNA and they never used them to make a game.

Personally I prefer the Yuke's engine, and love the fast pace and quick combo's that it allows. It may not mimmick real wrestling, but it does things better than anything else I have played. the only thing that comes close to touching the Smackdown series this generation is WM XIX, as everything else has been pretty much garbage (though XVIII still has the ultimate roster as far as this generation is concerned)

[KaneRobot]

Sigh. And there you have it. Not that I'm surprised. Yes, it's true that it's only one review and it could be that all the other sites put it up around the 8 range or whatever...but come on - we know that's probably not going to happen. And if it does I'll gladly come back here and say I was wrong.

It would not surprise me to see Gamespot actually rank it slightly higher. IGN may have overcorrected here after still feeling dumb about giving Raw and Raw 2 such ridiculously high scores.

Regardless, it rarely fails - a review embargo that keeps reviews off sites until relase day (or after) often means crappy, overhyped game.

It's unfortunate that the only two engines that have done it right in the last 10 years (FirePro and the AKI games) are abandoned now. The FirePro one not being used I can understand - although I'd still love to see it - since it looks "old." But it makes no sense for someone to not use the AKI engine or at least something extremely similar.

Pretty sad state of affairs when the best wrestling series available are the mediocre-at-best Smackdown games.

[Matt Young]

I'd practically kill for an American online version of Fire Pro.

[evilmax17]

The thing is, IGN usually OVERRATES their games, not the otherway around. A 6 from them is a bad, bad sign.

Or perhaps they're being a little too critical after the Raw debacle? Either way, it won't be a smash, so I wouldn't waste the time.

[Scorch]

o..mg.

If IGN gave it a 6.0, I'm going to definately rent. Holy shit, this is awful. I mean, look at Raw 2. Raw 2 was awful and it got a 9. If this thing got a 6.. my god, this thing must be a tanker.

Well, now I don't have to worry about spending $ to pick it up.. wow. I'm going to go read this review, and read the bitching over at the GameFAQs message board, which i'm sure is there.

[GuilewasNK]

Sigh. And there you have it. Not that I'm surprised. Yes, it's true that it's only one review and it could be that all the other sites put it up around the 8 range or whatever...but come on - we know that's probably not going to happen. And if it does I'll gladly come back here and say I was wrong.

It would not surprise me to see Gamespot actually rank it slightly higher. IGN may have overcorrected here after still feeling dumb about giving Raw and Raw 2 such ridiculously high scores.

Regardless, it rarely fails - a review embargo that keeps reviews off sites until relase day (or after) often means crappy, overhyped game.

It's unfortunate that the only two engines that have done it right in the last 10 years (FirePro and the AKI games) are abandoned now. The FirePro one not being used I can understand - although I'd still love to see it - since it looks "old." But it makes no sense for someone to not use the AKI engine or at least something extremely similar.

Pretty sad state of affairs when the best wrestling series available are the mediocre-at-best Smackdown games.

IMO the Def Jam series is way better even though it only uses some wrestling elements and blends it into a brawler.

[Scorch]

IMO the Def Jam series is way better even though it only uses some wrestling elements and blends it into a brawler.

Agreed. This guy I was talking with at EB was waiting for Wrestlemania and this was in September or October. I mentioned how there was absolutely no media from it and to expect the worse, that Def Jam: FFNY was probably going to still be the top "wrestling" game on the XBox.

I don't understand why they chose SG to do this game. They had no experience in the field. From what they've done, I think they did a pretty amazing job with the graphics and whatnot, but with gameplay, they've fallen flat on their face. I don't think IGN was overcorrecting for the mistakes they made with Raw 2. Don't get me wrong, I'll pick this up.. just not at launch. Let's look at some of the flaws that IGN says WMXXI has.

The grappling would be too simplistic if not for the countering system. There are two types of counters, one for grapple moves, and one for strikes and they are assigned to the left and right triggers respectively.

One reversal move for two types of attacks. That's painful.

The game decides that characters are "up" almost as soon as they begin to rise from the mat.

Speaking of mat strikes, many of them can be endlessly linked to quickly drain a wrestler's stamina. On the easier difficulty levels this works in favor of the player. It is possible to land successive elbow drops on an opponent that doesn't have time to get up or roll out of the way. On harder difficulty settings, the problem works against players, especially when taking on a submission artist. It takes so long to rise from the mat, that by the time your wrestler begins to shake off a hit, he's already been placed in another hold. This type of game-breaker used to occur all the time in older wrestling games, but is inexcusable in modern releases

Didn't DOR address this issue? Didn't Wrestlemania XIX address this issue? Hell, didn't Wrestlemania X8 address this issue? They made it to where the more you stomp on an opponent, the more the momentum shifts to the CPU. I can't wait to see the matches on XBox Live.

*run*
*clothesline*
*stompstompstompstompstompstompstompstompstompstom pstompstomp*
*pin.. 1, 2, 3*

In a simple face-off, the computer acts normally, with an assortment of grapples, strikes, and special moves. However, as soon as another variable is added to the equation, strange things start to happen. This first became apparent in career mode when a third wrestler entered the arena and teamed up with my opponent. While one character continued to fight, the extra wrestler circled the ring aimlessly until the match ended.

AI has always been a problem for XBox wrestling games, though.

Another example of poor A.I. can be found in the tag-team TLC matches. Computer controlled team members not only hit each other with objects, they routinely topple the ladder just as their teammate is going for the win.

Nice. Raw 2 had something like that.

When smashing an opponent through a table, the player doesn't break through the object, instead it simply lowers into the matt and disappears.

..wtf?


Another complaint likely to come from WWE fans concerning this game is the outdated roster. There are 45 wrestlers in total, including five legends and six divas. But it's disappointing that they include someone like Val Venus while Billy Kidman and La Resistance are nowhere in sight. There are two wrestlers who are no longer with the WWE on the list, but most of the title matches from the real WrestleMania 21 can be re-created within the game.

This makes me think that the guy partly does not watch or follow wrestling. There's way more than two wrestlers who are no longer with WWE on the list.

Instead of previewing each item as it is selected, players have to choose the item and view it separately.

That is a HUGE pet peeve of mine, and might even be more annoying than Raw 2 where you have to exit to the main menu if you want to select another wrestler in the "Create A Superstar" mode.


The career mode for create-a-wrestler entails a single storyline that remains the same each time you play through.

I thought they said multiple branching storylines! WTF?

Instead, after each match there is a short cut scene that moves the story along and if players lose a match, there is simply the option to retry or quit.

Retry or quit? WTF? So you can't lose a match and progress in the story? That's fucking retarded.

The career mode has all of the double crosses, back stabbings, and backstage beat downs that one would expect from the plot lines of the WWE, but after one play through it doesn't offer any surprises.

Sad.

Without revealing any spoilers, the story line gets a lot more interesting as it progresses through the 52 matches that make up a year of kicking ass in the WWE.

At least the story mode isn't short.. too bad about the Goldberg 52-0 of it all.

I'm depressed now.. I guess that I'll give this a rental on Friday.

[Matt Young]

Guys, don't overreact. Just as IGN's reviews can't be trusted when they're unusually high, they also cannot be trusted when they are this low. Also, as I have said many times, a review is only a guideline. Many games have gotten bad reviews and people ended up enjoying them.

I'll admit, this is unsettling, but my old buddy Mike Regan and the rest of the Gaming Ring staff said it's worth buying, and I trust them more than IGN. I'll freely admit that the game could still suck a fat one, but at least wait til you can play it before losing all hope.

I'll be getting the game Friday (unless GameRush was wrong, which I hope) so once I get my copy, I'll let you know if I should eat my words or if IGN has proven to be retarded once again.

I'm eagerly anticipating the first CAG to post thoughts on the game. It's almost 9:00 over on the East Coast, time for stores to begin opening.

[Scorch]

Guys, don't overreact.

Oh, sorry, I thought we were supposed to claim when a game has shitty AI that features such highlights as ring-around-the-ring and attacking your own teammate, a linear story, and a game that can be beaten simply by hitting the attack button over and over again.

I'll admit, this is unsettling, but my old buddy Mike Regan and the rest of the Gaming Ring staff said it's worth buying, and I trust them more than IGN.

THQ provided them with beta builds, of course they'll say it's worth buying. They also gave Showdown: Legends of Wrestling a 9.0.

I'm eagerly anticipating the first CAG to post thoughts on the game. It's almost 9:00 over on the East Coast, time for stores to begin opening.

Uhh.. it SHIPS today, in stores tomorrow.. unless some retailers decided to same-day it, which I doubt they did.

[Matt Young]

As I said, those were the opinions of one reviewer. Gaming Ring and UK XBM both gave good scores. All I suggest is that you guys give the game a chance. The reviewer at IGN may be right, but he could just as well be wrong.

As for the ship date/release date, who knows? I've heard several different dates, and a lot of people say it shipped yesterday and will arrive in stores today. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

I'm not looking to launch into some huge argument right now, although a civilized debate will certainly be welcome once people have the game.

Maybe I'm just too optimistic... But hey, if it turns out to be a really horrible game when judged by the wrestling fans of the world, I can always switch up my preorder for something else.

[Scorch]

As I said, those were the opinions of one reviewer. Gaming Ring and UK XBM both gave good scores. All I suggest is that you guys give the game a chance. The reviewer at IGN may be right, but he could just as well be wrong.

And i'm telling you that GamingRing gave it good scores because they are scratching THQ's back for continuously giving them information and betas. Why didn't you pick up on that? Am I the only one that think's it's NOT a coincidence that a wrestling site and a platform specific magazine gave a hyped game a high score and the first multiplatform review gave it a low score?

As for the ship date/release date, who knows? I've heard several different dates, and a lot of people say it shipped yesterday and will arrive in stores today. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

..I do, and the fact that THQ says it ships on the 20th. Who are you going to believe, random people on GameFAQs?


I'm not looking to launch into some huge argument right now, although a civilized debate will certainly be welcome once people have the game.

Why not a civilized debate now? It's fun to disagree.


Maybe I'm just too optimistic... But hey, if it turns out to be a really horrible game when judged by the wrestling fans of the world, I can always switch up my preorder for something else.

Optimistic isn't the word I'd use, "hopeful" and "in denial" would fit better, though.. like I said, I'll give it a rent Friday. We can settle it in the ring.

[Matt Young]

A civilized debate now is fine, but we're only debating the reviewer's impressions and rumors. I just didn't want things to turn into an actual argument rather than a debate.

You have a valid point about GR, but they didn't give it astronomical scores. The average was a 7/10. Those guys are big time wrestling gamers who play and own a lot of wrestling games. I've known Mike online since our days at WrestlingGames.com starting back in 2000, so I trust his opinion more than IGN's. Still, it's just another man's opinion and I'll have to form my own.

I'm not in denial. I just don't put any faith in a damn thing IGN says. If the game sucks, I'll admit it. You're right, though, I am very hopeful that it will not be as bad as some predict.

[Scorch]

You have a valid point about GR, but they didn't give it astronomical scores. The average was a 7/10. Those guys are big time wrestling gamers who play and own a lot of wrestling games. I've known Mike online since our days at WrestlingGames.com starting back in 2000, so I trust his opinion more than IGN's. Still, it's just another man's opinion and I'll have to form my own.

Since you know the guy personally, that's a different situation.. but I still don't trust GR after a 9.0 for Showdown: LoW.

If I rent WM21 and it sucks hardcore, I'm going to keep my Gamecube and re-buy WWE DoR. It may have sucked in story mode and whatnot (I actually never made it out of training because I can NOT reverse move!), but it was a blast to play.

[Matt Young]

I would never have given Showdown a 9.0. It has quite a few annoying gameplay flaws and some horrible, atrocious glicthing. However, I don't feel it was nearly as bad as many thought. It was fun to have old school dream matches.

I really need to get DoR myself. It's only $30 now. Maybe I'll get that instead of WM if WM turns out to be horrible.

It's too bad we can't play WrestleMania XIX and DoR online. Those games are great in multiplayer.

[Monsta Mack]

Well this sucks, everyone and their mom was looking forward to WM21 because It featured online play that would topple Smackdown versus Raw.

I can stand crappy AI, I can stand CAW that takes awhile to get use to and create, I can stand shitty music and voice overs, and I can stand a shitty storyline. Why? Because It's all about the multiplayer in a wrestling game for me, that's why Ihad this pre-ordered with free Overnight shipping, I couldn't wait to get my hands on it.

But I find it pretty sad you can beat people with the *kick kick kick kick kick WHAM STUNNER!* type of gameplay, that's garbage. I'm just hoping your able to reverse on the mat for people who abuse it.

What was the most annoying part in DOR was it took FOREVER to get up from moves, outside of DOR I think It's the best current generation wrestling game out there, better then Def Jam Fight For NY. The only problem is obvious: The Cube has no online play.

Well I might keep my copy sealed (that is if i get it tonight via overnight shipping) for another day till Gamespots review is up. If GS gives it a 8.0 or better thats good enough for me to open, IGN *could* be the only one shitting on WM, and the reason for that could be their past bad Raw ratings, or maybe they aren't getting paid for a high review, who knows, it could be anything.

One thing is for sure, this game will most likely be better then RAW, but for Smackdown to be better then this, that would be a dissapointment. I just put Smackdown versus RAW on eBay because I found HCTP to be a better game overall.

[Monsta Mack]

Bad reviews, one review at that should NOT be used to unjustify a purchase. Suikoden 1 or 2 anyone? Bad reviews pretty much everywhere, yet the greatest RPG of all time for me, and a very good RPG for everyone else who put more then an hour into it. Also everyone seems to say Obscure is a good game, yet every other review website has been trashing it.

[Scorch]

Even though the game will suck shit, there's a lot of CAG'ers getting it, and I just got a call stating it'd be in after 4pm.. I dunno if I can hold out..

[Pure Apathy]

Even though the game will suck shit, there's a lot of CAG'ers getting it, and I just got a call stating it'd be in after 4pm.. I dunno if I can hold out..

Just resist the temptation. If I could hold off on buying a WWE game since WMXIX, you can too! Just think of how sweet DoR 2 will be once it comes out. With Hogan and the Ultimate Warrior already confirmed, I will be happy with just them. Since Jake Roberts was on TV here recently, you would have to think that there is a good chance that he might be in as well.

If anything, you should rent it and see how bad it is first and get it out of your system. :)

[Scorch]

Just resist the temptation. If I could hold off on buying a WWE game since WMXIX, you can too! Just think of how sweet DoR 2 will be once it comes out. With Hogan and the Ultimate Warrior already confirmed, I will be happy with just them. Since Jake Roberts was on TV here recently, you would have to think that there is a good chance that he might be in as well.

If anything, you should rent it and see how bad it is first and get it out of your system. :)

I won't have a Gamecube by then. I'm actually probably trading it off today. My bro has one, though. DOR2 looks awesome.

[Pure Apathy]

Here is another reason for you to get the game Scorch... I bet gamespot gives it a 3-6 score.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/04/20/news_6122657.html

For wrestling fans, there's nothing like pile-driving an opponent into submission--especially when they're halfway across the country. THQ's WrestleMania XXI, released today, was billed to allow gamers to do just that through the game's Xbox Live support.


Unfortunately, consumers who unwrapped the Xbox game and tried to use its online features have been slammed into an unwanted reality--currently, WrestleMania XXI's online features won't even step into the ring.

News of the possible glitch began to spring up on forums around the Web, as disgruntled gamers explained their situations. Said one forum poster, "Anyone else who has the game having this problem [connecting to Xbox Live]? Any other game I can connect with, but this game doesn't even TRY to connect. It just says, 'Your Xbox console cannot connect to Xbox Live. Do you want to start the troubleshooter?'"

Attempts to wrestle online in the GameSpot offices met the same fate. Pre-release versions worked online, albeit with some lag issues.

When trying to play the Xbox Live portion of the game, players are receiving the "Could not connect to Xbox Live" error message. Attempting to sign in to users' Xbox Live accounts causes the game to immediately display the error message, indicating that WMXXI isn't even going through the standard procedures to connect online. However, when attempting to connect through the Xbox dashboard or another Xbox Live-enabled title, Microsoft's online service works just fine.

THQ is currently working with Microsoft to remedy the issue. GameSpot will have more on this story as it develops

[Matt Young]

Fucking hell. This is looking bad. If they screwed up the online portion of the game, there's no reason for me to get this.

[Matt Young]

The Team Xbox review is up. They gave it a 6.8.

http://reviews.teamxbox.com/xbox/934/WWE-WrestleMania-21/p1/

I haven't read it yet, but Team Xbox seems to give good reviews. However, I'm still skeptical about any non-wrestling person reviewing a westling game.

I'll edit/reply later with thoughts.

[mykevermin]

Holy crap; my gamespot order has been 'processing' since last night, so I can't cancel it.

myke.
...dammit.

[Pure Apathy]

The Team Xbox review is up. They gave it a 6.8.

http://reviews.teamxbox.com/xbox/934/WWE-WrestleMania-21/p1/

I haven't read it yet, but Team Xbox seems to give good reviews. However, I'm still skeptical about any non-wrestling person reviewing a westling game.

I'll edit/reply later with thoughts.

I'll edit the main post with all of the review scores as they come out. I can't wait to hear some reviews from other CAGs.

[Pure Apathy]

Holy crap; my gamespot order has been 'processing' since last night, so I can't cancel it.

myke.
...dammit.

That really sucks man. I feel sorry for you.

[rvdrock]

When is DOR2 coming out anyways?

[Pure Apathy]

When is DOR2 coming out anyways?

Probably in October or November.

[Scorch]

Holy fucking hell, the game's so broken. I'm going to try it tomorrow at GameCrazy.. I was in Rhino tonight and three people asked for it.. I went to GameCrazy and two people came in and asked about it.. I can't imagine how pissed owners of this game are. I have spare credit and was going to get it because at least the online portion would play and be fun.. but holy shit.

[mykevermin]

That really sucks man. I feel sorry for you.

If I had syphillis, you should feel sorry for me.

As a CAG, you should (1) point out that it's foolish to pay full price for new releases, (2) in particular when it's a title from an unproven publisher.

Thanks though. I really hope that I enjoy it.

myke.
...seeing as how I have the CAG title to create and defend, once they get online working :roll:

[mykevermin]

The GameSpy review is from CAG's own ViolentLee; a reliable source and benevolent provider of Pocket Kingdom shirts. Perhaps he's seen this thread and has something else to add?

[Pure Apathy]

I can't help myself but to laugh at this game. It just keeps getting worse by the minute. I want to know what the fuck SG did when they delayed the game. I wish DoR 2 would hurry up and come out. Hopefully it'll be out by September.

[help1]

is it anything like no mercy?

[Scorch]

Sweet, a "what glitch did you have?" post!


Let me tell you what just happened to me. Im in TLC match against ...oh it doesnt matter. Anyway...I lost the 1st match..you only option is to rematch or quit.

I rematch, and instead of the belt being hig above the ring. It is hanging two inches from the mat. But the wrestlers are still trying to climb the ladder to get it.

At one point...the ladder got pushed down, while Dvon was trying to climb it...Well the ladder was down, and Dvon was still climbing on some invisible ladder thing.

:rofl:


My only other gripe, and I think is a serious one. The replays....I guess they load from the hard drive....Well The game has frozen a couple of times trying to play the replays....Anybody else experienced this?

:rofl::rofl:

Matt, kiss my ring. I was so right.

[GenDV138]

Looks like I'm going to cancel mine and get something else instead, probably Chaos Theory.

[Scorch]

Looks like I'm going to cancel mine and get something else instead, probably Chaos Theory.

That, or Jade Empire, or Forza, which comes out in two weeks or so.

Or Psychonauts. Or Rainbow Six: Lockdown. Or GTA: San Andreas!

[Pure Apathy]

I thought this was pretty funny...

The commentary during matches and voice-overs during the career mode add some WWE panache, but the inaccuracies and repetitiveness do detract a bit. Why say, “Welcome to Raw!” when you’re actually wrestling at No Way Out?

[Scorch]

GamgingRing review is up, Mike gave it a 7.5, anyone got any extra clues Shrike was selling? :P

Renee Duprees invisible brother beat me up in the first match of career mode. Renee would be on one side of the ring and I'd be getting punched and hip tossed while on the other and unable to get away from my invisible assailant.

OMG :rofl::rofl::rofl:

[mykevermin]

If I don't open the package, can I return the game instore if I order from gamestop online?

myke.

[GenDV138]

If I don't open the package, can I return the game instore if I order from gamestop online?

myke.

I don't think so, AFAIK, only EB has in-store returns. Gamestop's web site says you can't return it in store though - http://www.gamestop.com/gs/help/returnpolicy2.asp

[Pure Apathy]

That, or Jade Empire, or Forza, which comes out in two weeks or so.

Or Psychonauts. Or Rainbow Six: Lockdown. Or GTA: San Andreas!

I have CT. It is a great game. I also have Jade Empire but I haven't even opened it yet. I think I'm going to take it back and exchange it for Forza, Pyschonauts, or Conker.

I was thinking about taking it back and getting WM21, but now there is...
































http://www.wweforever.de/wrestlingpix/pictures/superstars/VinceMcMahon/011.jpg

NO CHANCE IN HELL!

[Scorch]

I'm seriously starting to think the wrong copy was pressed, like Breed.

RUMOR #4: The version of BREED CDV shipped to stores was not the same version submitted by Brat Designs.

Source: An expansive and vitriolic post on the official BREED forums.

The official story: No comment.

What we heard: Once billed as a potential Halo rival, BREED has received almost universally dismal reviews since it was released last week. According to the GameSpot review, the main sticking points with the game are its "flimsy writing, atrocious voice acting, generic enemies and settings." However, one of the game's animators is reportedly claiming that the game's problems are not the fault of the developer. In a series of posts on the CDV forums, someone claiming to be Brat Designs' Billy "Bli" Allison stated, "We (Brat) finished BREED, but the released version wasn't the one we had finished." The person then leveled a series of charges against CDV, claiming the publisher rewrote and rerecorded the dialogue, "'brightened' up" subtle lighting, ruined textures, changed level scripts, and shipped a build of the game several generations behind the one submitted by Brat. The poster even claimed that CDV is holding back a patch submitted by Brat "several weeks ago" that fixed many of the game's technical issues. When confronted with the laundry list of allegations, CDV's American reps forwarded GameSpot's requests for comment to the publisher's German headquarters--who never responded. Attempts to contact UK-based Brat were also unsuccessful.

Bogus or not bogus?: In this case, the silence was deafening--and damning. Not bogus.


Breed received very low scores.. so hey, who knows.

Anyone want to make a photoshopped 'Wrestlemania Recall' picture (a pun from the Wrestlemania replays)?

[Pure Apathy]

If I don't open the package, can I return the game instore if I order from gamestop online?

myke.

Just refuse the package when it arrives, or you could just send it back.

[GenDV138]

Someone posted this on GamingRing.com forums of a glitch in ladder match:

http://img254.echo.cx/img254/7690/apr200011iw.jpg

[swetooth9]

now there's enough money for UC 2 :)

[Scorch]

:rofl:
:rofl::rofl:
:rofl::rofl::rofl:
:rofl::rofl:
:rofl:

[Pure Apathy]

So back to my old question from last week. Now that WM21 is total crap, should I try to trade for DoR so I can have something to hold me over until DoR2?

*edit*
I like the DoR PAL boxart.
http://www.2g4.ru/covers/gc_10799373043988E38.jpeg

[mykevermin]

Well, I sent a cancellation request to GS.com.

I typically buy from EB; gamestop offered free overnight shipping, though.

Given the extreme differences in the stores in reagrds to the deals they offer, more open return policies, and general friendliness to customers (not in all cases, of course), I'm rather upset that GS is the controlling company in the merger.

myke.
...DoR is very fun (I still have all 3 GC titles, because I find them to have excellent gameplay); I would recommend HCTP above all else, more due to the outstanding roster.

[Pure Apathy]

Someone posted this on GamingRing.com forums of a glitch in ladder match:

http://img254.echo.cx/img254/7690/apr200011iw.jpg

omg omg omg omg omg omg omg

[TheRock88]

Man, I didnt know the game was gonna be this bad. Glad that I decided not to preorder it.

Glitches, people cant play online, maybe a recall, etc.

BTW, that ladder pic is funny as hell.

[Logg]

I almost got this game, thank god for bad Reviews :)

[Pure Apathy]

Lets play "Guess the Gamespot.com review score."

My guess is 3.5

[GuilewasNK]

This is one time I think I will check the Gamefaqs board just to see what people are saying, lol.

[Pure Apathy]

This is one time I think I will check the Gamefaqs board just to see what people are saying, lol.

I have been all day. I have had a few good laughs already. :lol:

[Matt Young]

Matt, kiss my ring. I was so right.

I never said you were wrong, I was just hoping you were. Thanks for making me remember the "reparations checks" skit from Chappelle's Show, though. "Kiss the rings, bitch!" I need to go watch the DVDs.

I'm still going to wait and judge the game myself, although if the bad reviews keep coming, I'll rent before deciding whether or not to cash in my pre-order or get something else.

I like nearly every wrestling game, even the ones that most people deem mediocre, so if the online play is fixed and the overall gameplay isn't as bad as WCW Thunder or Backstage Assault, I may well enjoy the game. It can't be worse than paying $50 for WCW Thunder.

Of course, I could end up hating the game, too, and chances are that your negative attitude is more validated than my hopeful outlook, but I'll hold on to that last glimmer of hope until I actually play it. Then if it really is that damn bad, I will readily admit it. Things aren't looking too good now, though.

[Monsta Mack]

Holy crap; my gamespot order has been 'processing' since last night, so I can't cancel it.

myke.
...dammit.

MYKE! I am in the same fucking situation! I am going to return this game tomorrow and not open it, and get credit from gamestop. Is that easy to do u think?

Edit: Fucking hell I can't return this game!? The online play doesn't even work!

[Scorch]

I never said you were wrong, I was just hoping you were. Thanks for making me remember the "reparations checks" skit from Chappelle's Show, though. "Kiss the rings, bitch!" I need to go watch the DVDs.

I was referencing Scrubs, actually.

[Rig]

Heh. I haven't played a wrestling game since the PS2 Here Comes the Pain. I better show this thread to one of my friends. (He buys every wrestling game he can get his hands on.)

[Matt Young]

I've never seen Scrubs, although I heard it's good. My mistake, though.

I still can't get Gaming Ring's message boards to load. I've been going there for years, so I know there's always a ton of traffic on a game's release day, but this is getting irritating.

[GuilewasNK]

Here's a few Gamefaqs quotes....

I'd Rather Watch JBL, Orlando Jordan and Eric Bischoff Square Dance together for an hour straight then play this game anymore.

I had more fun playin wcw Backsault assault then this trash n wcw assault was trash too.


I played one match at EB and immediately cancelled my preorder. The game is crap



I'd also rather watch Bill Cosby throw a Soda in HHH's face, then fight him in a match for 85 minutes, No Selling HHH's moves.

:lol:

[Scorch]

I've never seen Scrubs, although I heard it's good. My mistake, though.

I still can't get Gaming Ring's message boards to load. I've been going there for years, so I know there's always a ton of traffic on a game's release day, but this is
getting irritating.

I got in earlier. Nothing but complaining in the WM21 board.

Told you Mike would give it a good/decent review. IGN was way too lenient with a 6.0.

[Monsta Mack]

Heh. I sent Gamestop about my order since it hasn't shipped yet. Hopefully they'll cancel it, if not I am going to return this to Wal-Mart because there is no way I'm going to throw $50 on a game that doesn't even have Online play when It's advertised. Fuck THQ.

I could have lived if the online play worked, no matter how broken this game was. Fuck. Fuck. Fuck.

[Scahom1]

I bought it today...game is just ok. It doesn't have the rush or excitement of the Smackdown series. Like you can have a back and forth match, and finally pull off your finisher and win, and both the crowd and the announcers are dead as a doornail. Also when you do a finisher, the background turns all red or blue. Very ugly.

Sadly, with no online play, this game is a dud. I really REALLY hope there is a recall, so I can receive a sealed copy, which I can return to my store or sell off :P

[Monsta Mack]

Well as I said, I e-mailed Gamestop to cancel my order, if i cant get a hold of them by the morning im goign to call them. But from what I read you can send your game back if it's new and sealed with the original things u received (the game sealed and calander) but u lose out on your shipping and handling fee. I think I'm gonna pick up UC2 instead.

[Pure Apathy]

Here's a few Gamefaqs quotes....


I'd also rather watch Bill Cosby throw a Soda in HHH's face, then fight him in a match for 85 minutes, No Selling HHH's moves.


:lol:

:applause: :rofl:
That was great. This game is pure shit and I love it!

[SevereTireDamage]

I was referencing Scrubs, actually.John McGinley is awesome.

[Skylander7]

A friend of mine is all pumped about this game for the online component. I never got wrestling games though. I mean c'mon.. a magical "stamina" meter that barely goes down when you get your head planted through a table? Then again, that's all about tastes.

However, he's not turned away by the reviews. He's still all about it. Goes to show that although reviews do affect game sales, there's still that portion that gets sold on the anticipation and hype of a game

[Scorch]

A friend of mine is all pumped about this game for the online component. I never got wrestling games though. I mean c'mon.. a magical "stamina" meter that barely goes down when you get your head planted through a table? Then again, that's all about tastes.

However, he's not turned away by the reviews. He's still all about it. Goes to show that although reviews do affect game sales, there's still that portion that gets sold on the anticipation and hype of a game

Have you bothered to tell him that.. you know, there isn't an online mode?

[Scorch]

MORE GLITCHES!!!!!! :D


1. After a loss in a fatal four-way, I restarted quickly, won and they played Booker's music and announced he won (my CAW was still credited with the win)

2. If you tap the A button fast enough after a loss, you can have the match with that stupid WWE Replay logo on the bottom

3. Bischoff says my CAW has to fight Snuka in a cage match, yet no cage?


No Music is played when in a Royal Rumble match.

- In my handicap matches, I don't have to do anything because my opponents fight each other

During my HBK/Nature Boy match, Flair irished whipped me into the corner...however when my guy reached the corner he was stuck in a crouching/running motion only he wasn't moving...And to make it worse, Flair ran the OTHER way and ended up doing the same....So, I had to quit the match.....

People don't go to the ropes to break a sub, nor tap out when it says they do.

another thing i noticed was with edge

when he comes out he has his new music but after i won a match his old music was playing

you cant even preview the attires for your caw without selecting them than going back again

referee keep saying 1 1 1 1 on the count out even though nobody went into the ring

:rofl::rofl:

[Pure Apathy]

^The one with Flair/HBK was the best :lol:

Runners up was the Edge theme, and the 1 1 1 1 1 referee.

Keep 'em comming!

[Monsta Mack]

lol that is hillarious!

[Monsta Mack]

People on gamefaqs are also stating the games freezes during the replay sequences, and in some other portions as well.

[Pure Apathy]

I can't wait till tomorrow.
Gamespot is going to rape this game in their review.

[Monsta Mack]

I can't wait till tomorrow.
Gamespot is going to rape this game in their review.

I can't wait to ship my copy back tomorrow... that is if gamestop doesn't cancel the order for me.

[Pure Apathy]

Ok guys, here's a new review posted over at gamefaqs. Here it is.

OmegaXHavoc I don't post at gamefaqs.com too much but i read the boards a lot. I bought WWE WrestleMania XXI and the game reminds me of the N64 days, which i like. I hated Smackdown and PS2 WWF games cause i thought it was too fast and flashy. This game i like, it's not lightening and it's solid. If you like the old school WWE games then ignore the reviews and check this out. I almost didn't cause i was burned with Raw but i took a chance and i haven't put it down since (except to type this).

Only thing i dislike:

- Gotta earn the legends (good but i wanted to be the hitman for my first game)
-Online not working (duh)
-Only CAWs can go through the career mode, i hate making them so i'll wait till some people made some classic CAW wrestlers to copy.


Good game cause it's what i wanted, if you like faster WWE games then stick with PS2. Very Very Simple, BTW this will be the biggiest selling game since HALO 2 and GTA no matter if it got an 0.1 from ign.

PS.

IGN can go to hell soaked in gasoline because they cost me 50 bucks with Raw. In the words of a famous man "they know not what they do".

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=920641&topic=20535730

[Monsta Mack]

I actually paid $50 for Raw 2 on release, had lots of good laughs with the game but it wasn't worth $10.

The entire problem with WM is you can't take it online, and either THQ is going to have to recall the copies or somehow get MS to make it go online somehow (but how is that even possible?) or just say online doesnt exist, and in the next batch of copies remove the LIVE logo, which is probably going to be the case.

I bought this game solely for the online play, because that eliminates all the AI glitchs, and goes down to either laggy gameplay, ref mistakes (I guess the 1...1..1 glitch) or abuse of gameplay mechanics, which shouldn't be the case all the time if u play with good people. Now that THQ has made the Live play inactive, there is no purpose for me to own this game other then laugh at it. Unreal Championship 2 here I come if they don't fix this games Live ability by TOMORROW.

[Scorch]

The entire problem with WM is you can't take it online, and either THQ is going to have to recall the copies or somehow get MS to make it go online somehow (but how is that even possible?)

By issuing a mandatory Live upgrade, though I doubt they'll do it just to fix it.

[Pure Apathy]

I actually paid $50 for Raw 2 on release, had lots of good laughs with the game but it wasn't worth $10.

The entire problem with WM is you can't take it online, and either THQ is going to have to recall the copies or somehow get MS to make it go online somehow (but how is that even possible?) or just say online doesnt exist, and in the next batch of copies remove the LIVE logo, which is probably going to be the case.

I bought this game solely for the online play, because that eliminates all the AI glitchs, and goes down to either laggy gameplay, ref mistakes (I guess the 1...1..1 glitch) or abuse of gameplay mechanics, which shouldn't be the case all the time if u play with good people. Now that THQ has made the Live play inactive, there is no purpose for me to own this game other then laugh at it. Unreal Championship 2 here I come if they don't fix this games Live ability by TOMORROW.

I doubt it'll be fixed for a while. I hope this is a big wakeup call for THQ. Maybe since this is the 3rd flopped game on the Xbox, they will actually come out with something good on the 360.

[KaneRobot]

I doubt it'll be fixed for a while. I hope this is a big wakeup call for THQ. Maybe since this is the 3rd flopped game on the Xbox, they will actually come out with something good on the 360.

I hope so too, but I bet it won't be since unfortunately the name will sell the game. How f'ing sad is that - the best wrestling game on the XBox isn't even a wrestling game (Def Jam Vendetta). THQ had three chances to get it right and blew every one.

What I REALLY hope is THQ loses the WWE game rights since they have long worn out their welcome. I know some people think the Smackdown and/or Day of Reckoning games are ok, but I think that's more of a case of everything else being so bad, not those being anything amazing.

Still, reading about that referee "1...1...1..." glitch made me laugh.

[bil4l]

I want a Smackdown style game on XBL game. The Smackdown games are pretty quality, I and even though I no longer watch WWE, I would definitely want a quality WWE XBL title, guess I won't find it here. :(

[Monsta Mack]

By issuing a mandatory Live upgrade, though I doubt they'll do it just to fix it.

How's that? *clueless look*

God I'm so frustrated, forgive me for not thinking during half my recent posts. My apologizes to the CAG community that has to read through my posts.

[TheRock88]

Since EA is snatching up a lot of licenses, why dont the try and get the WWE one when the current contract expires. I'm sure anything they put out will be WAY better then Raw 1, 2, and Wrestlemania XXI. Plus, they have the AKI engine (like from Def Jam series) so it could be like No Mercy except for current consoles.

[Scorch]

How's that? *clueless look*

God I'm so frustrated, forgive me for not thinking during half my recent posts. My apologizes to the CAG community that has to read through my posts.

A mandatory Live upgrade? You know how when you sign into Live on some games and it'll say update required? Yeah, it'd just do that when you logged on the XBL main menu.

I'm half expecting them to stop making games on the XBox and claim it's a failure or something. If anything, I hope THQ loses the rights to make the game and EA grabs them and licenses AKI out to do them.

BTW, stop blaming THQ.. it's not like they made the game itself. Blame Studio Gigante.

[Pure Apathy]

A mandatory Live upgrade? You know how when you sign into Live on some games and it'll say update required? Yeah, it'd just do that when you logged on the XBL main menu.

I'm half expecting them to stop making games on the XBox and claim it's a failure or something. If anything, I hope THQ loses the rights to make the game and EA grabs them and licenses AKI out to do them.

BTW, stop blaming THQ.. it's not like they made the game itself. Blame Studio Gigante.

THQ chooses who makes the games so it is their fault in a way. If they want a good wrestling game, they should go with a developer with more experience.

[Monsta Mack]

A mandatory Live upgrade? You know how when you sign into Live on some games and it'll say update required? Yeah, it'd just do that when you logged on the XBL main menu.


So it would have to be done from the main xbox live menu from the xbox dashboard? I see. Thanks Scorch, you da man *Scott Hall taunt*

[Scorch]

True, but it's not DIRECTLY their fault. SG may have been the only one available that'd do it.

Funnily enough, since it's with store credit, if they get Live up and going, I just may get this. I don't care how shitty it is.. I bet it's a blast on Live. Since most of the game's problems are AI and glitches involving the AI.. yeah, I bet it's fun as hell on Live.

[TheRock88]

True, but it's not DIRECTLY their fault. SG may have been the only one available that'd do it.

Funnily enough, since it's with store credit, if they get Live up and going, I just may get this. I don't care how shitty it is.. I bet it's a blast on Live. Since most of the game's problems are AI and glitches involving the AI.. yeah, I bet it's fun as hell on Live.

Only thing that bothers me is with the people who will exploit the glitches like the one where

1. knock the opponent down
2. stomp on him/her
3. keep stomping
4. still keep stomping
5. when they're weak enough, pick them up and give them your finisher

Only way I would play this online is if it was with my friends, not random strangers.

[Scorch]

I just want online so I can serve up a can to Matt :)

[MorPhiend]

Well, I thought this would be the case with all of the delays and the lack of any reviews until last night. Although, I was hoping that it had been delayed for legitimate polishing. All I have to say is that I'm glad that I ordered in-store, and now I will be picking up my refund soon...

[mykevermin]

There are lots of computer savvy people out there.

What we need is a 5 minute video of these horrible glitches patched together, with the song "Yakkity Sax" (a/k/a "The Benny Hill Theme") playing. Perhaps THQ will wake up if they see that.

Not likely. They did, I will admit, exchange me a copy of HCTP when I told them I had no interest in Raw 2 (b/c of glitches).

I can't help but wonder if THQ will find themselves in the same spot that Acclaim is in now, given that both companies' have heavily license-driven revenues, and don't seem to mind putting an absolutely abysmal and clearly unfinished game on the market if it makes their bottom line soar.

Sure, they're still profitable now; it will be a cold day in Kansas before I preorder any WWE title from now on (unless its developed by AKI or Spike).

myke.

[Monsta Mack]

Hmm Myke any news on canceling your order on "processing?". Looks like overnight shipping isn't paying off either way because most stores will have this game by today, and for us to get a game later (whether it sucks or not) by a day even with free overnight shipping is pretty bad. Granted It's only 7:43am EASTERN atm. Ouch.

[mykevermin]

I'm going to call them as soon as I get to the office this morning. I've got a laid back day ahead of me.

myke.

[Monsta Mack]

Yeah I just sent orders@gamestop.com a second e-mail to double enforce that my order is being canceled. I'm sure Gamestop is going to love all the returns/canceled pre-orders on this baby.

[screwkick]

Will the Xbox ever see a great wrestling game?

THQ should re-release Wrestlemania 2000 and No Mercy on one CD and sell it at 19.99.

I'd buy that, even with the old ass graphics. But at least the gameplay would be there.

[GuilewasNK]

LOL, this is the first time in a LONG time I have heard numerous people WANTING EA to get a particular license.

[mykevermin]

Now I have a tracking number, and it is on the FedEx truck for delivery.

myke.
...allow me to express my emotions; I think Eric Cartman's disgusted pronunciation of "goddammit!" will more than suffice here.

[Scorch]

Fake a chinese accent when the guy shows up and make him think he has the wrong house or something.

[evilmax17]

Now I have a tracking number, and it is on the FedEx truck for delivery.

myke.
...allow me to express my emotions; I think Eric Cartman's disgusted pronunciation of "goddammit!" will more than suffice here.

Return to Walmart? Last resort, ebay it for $45.

[mykevermin]

Called FedEx to refuse delivery (I don't want to waste the dude's time to go to my house, and I'm not home to refuse).

After calling Gamestop and FedEx, the package is refused and going back to GS. I don't pay any shipping charges to send it back, and I get all my money back. Good times.

Fuck you GS; god love FedEx.

myke.
...wiping the sweat from my brow.

[mykevermin]

Fake a chinese accent when the guy shows up and make him think he has the wrong house or something.

Well, I'm a pasty white honkey. I doubt that would work. 'twould be pretty funny, though.

myke.

[flybrione]

I was one of the unfortunate people to give the game a chance and pick it up yesterday. Luckly I talked with my friend last night who works at the game store I picked it up at and he is going to let me return it as defective and get a full refund.

I think the Raw series which is not good blows this game out of the water!

The game is full of glitches and freezing. Game play I think is the worst wrestling game I have ever played.

You get knocked to the matt and you just roll around and can not get up.

When you try to sign on to Xbox Live it does not even work.

The game froze on me twice and I only played three games yesterday.

After I won the first match the replay skipped and would not play.

The anouncers say I am doing a move that I have not even attempted, ie finishers. It said I was trying to do an RKO and I did a standing drop kick but good old JR said I did an RKO.

The music quality of the entrances is crap. The outdated rosters sucks too. I picked Batastia vs John Cena and they were booing Batasia during his entrance. He is no longer a heel! These are things that should be fixed when you delay a title. Also I think the entrances suck in general. I picked Booker T vs Triple H and was very dissappointed in the entrances of each character. Weak firework and lighting effects.

The only positive I have to say is that some of the player models look good, but that does not mean they animate well.

Please I advise every CAG to stay far away from this game. Please do not waste $50 on it even if you are a diehard wrestling fan. If you must play it rent it but I would not waste the money on a rental either when there are much better games that came out this month. I would say that IGN was too generous with the 6.0 review. I would have given the game no higher than a 4.0 and that would be only for the character models everything else about this game is arse!

[cthcky33]

LOL, this is the first time in a LONG time I have heard numerous people WANTING EA to get a particular license.

i hate EA as much as the next guy, but they would probably make something better than this ball sack of a game

[CheapyD]

Yikes..I was really looking forward to going online and defending the CAG Championship Belt.

[GenDV138]

I cancelled my preorder today at EB and got Jade Empire LE instead.

[flybrione]

I cancelled my preorder today at EB and got Jade Empire LE instead.

That was a very smart move! I am going to get Unreal instead of this pile!

[guyver2077]

i just got it...awesome!!!

[guyver2077]

hell no ea better not get wwe license.......the only good thing that could come out of it is yukes making the game again.....

but still no....

[Pure Apathy]

I still can't wait for the gamespot review. I'm sure it'll be a good one. :)

[cyborg2040]

Ha! I find this funny. after everything that has been posted on the net already, and the upcoming reviews in game mags for people without net access. THQ still has these VERY out of context review qoutes up on their offical WM21 mini site.

"Without a doubt, WrestleMania 21 is the best-looking wrestling game to date."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"…Xbox gamers can know that after all of this time, there's a wrestling game worth buying."
- Sean Malcolm, King Magazine

"We haven't even scratched the surface of WM 21's Career or Online modes and it is already the best wrestling game we've seen on the Xbox."
- Rob Semsey, TeamXbox.com

"The combatants move with such fluidity and grace that WrestleMania 21 captures the flow of an actual WWE match better than any game that has come before."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"WrestleMania's looking like it may have what it takes to be king of the ring."
- Joshua Cain, EGM

"The online function of WrestleMania is one of the most impressive aspects of the game."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"Xbox has not been home to many wrestling games and has, at times, felt like the forgotten console for wrestling fans. That changes this March with the release of the highly-anticipated WrestleMania 21."
- Hilary Goldstein, IGN.com

"Thanks to the developer's goal of creating the ultimate presentation for a wrestling game, players will be immersed in the world of the WWE like never before."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"Featuring motion-captured animations, voice-over and commentary from your favorite wrestlers, and four-player head-to-head online play, WrestleMania 21 sounds like the wrestling game Xbox owners have been dying for."
- Hilary Goldstein, IGN.com

"The WWE keeps on rolling and THQ is there to pump testosterone-fueled machismo into the mouths of gamers everywhere with WWE WrestleMania 21."
- James Mielke, 1up.com

"WrestleMania 21 is firing on all cylinders - a definite championship contender."
- Chris Hoffman, Play magazine

[Pure Apathy]

Ha! I find this funny. after everything that has been posted on the net already, and the upcoming reviews in game mags for people without net access. THQ still has these VERY out of context review qoutes up on their offical WM21 mini site.

"Without a doubt, WrestleMania 21 is the best-looking wrestling game to date."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"…Xbox gamers can know that after all of this time, there's a wrestling game worth buying."
- Sean Malcolm, King Magazine

"We haven't even scratched the surface of WM 21's Career or Online modes and it is already the best wrestling game we've seen on the Xbox."
- Rob Semsey, TeamXbox.com

"The combatants move with such fluidity and grace that WrestleMania 21 captures the flow of an actual WWE match better than any game that has come before."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"WrestleMania's looking like it may have what it takes to be king of the ring."
- Joshua Cain, EGM

"The online function of WrestleMania is one of the most impressive aspects of the game."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"Xbox has not been home to many wrestling games and has, at times, felt like the forgotten console for wrestling fans. That changes this March with the release of the highly-anticipated WrestleMania 21."
- Hilary Goldstein, IGN.com

"Thanks to the developer's goal of creating the ultimate presentation for a wrestling game, players will be immersed in the world of the WWE like never before."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"Featuring motion-captured animations, voice-over and commentary from your favorite wrestlers, and four-player head-to-head online play, WrestleMania 21 sounds like the wrestling game Xbox owners have been dying for."
- Hilary Goldstein, IGN.com

"The WWE keeps on rolling and THQ is there to pump testosterone-fueled machismo into the mouths of gamers everywhere with WWE WrestleMania 21."
- James Mielke, 1up.com

"WrestleMania 21 is firing on all cylinders - a definite championship contender."
- Chris Hoffman, Play magazine

:lol:
:lol: :lol:
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:lol:

[guyver2077]

omg the voiceovers in season mode are awesome!!!!

teddy long says holla holla holla!!!!!!!!

[CaseyRyback]

True, but it's not DIRECTLY their fault. SG may have been the only one available that'd do it.

Funnily enough, since it's with store credit, if they get Live up and going, I just may get this. I don't care how shitty it is.. I bet it's a blast on Live. Since most of the game's problems are AI and glitches involving the AI.. yeah, I bet it's fun as hell on Live.

I still do not have any clue why they changed developers to SG. Anchor may not have done a great job with the WWE Raw games, but they did a damn good job with the original UFC game.

and I do not think Raw 2 was all that far from being a great game (it sucked, but it was only like 4 or 5 months of tweaks away from being awesome). The gameplay could have used tweaking, but it was close enough that they should have kept letting Anchor develop the Xbox WWE games

[guyver2077]

damn the voiceovers woop smackdowns ass

[guyver2077]

http://www.themiamifamily.com/Videos/career.WMV


FIRST VIDEO

[Scahom1]

Ha! I find this funny. after everything that has been posted on the net already, and the upcoming reviews in game mags for people without net access. THQ still has these VERY out of context review qoutes up on their offical WM21 mini site.

"Without a doubt, WrestleMania 21 is the best-looking wrestling game to date."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"…Xbox gamers can know that after all of this time, there's a wrestling game worth buying."
- Sean Malcolm, King Magazine

"We haven't even scratched the surface of WM 21's Career or Online modes and it is already the best wrestling game we've seen on the Xbox."
- Rob Semsey, TeamXbox.com

"The combatants move with such fluidity and grace that WrestleMania 21 captures the flow of an actual WWE match better than any game that has come before."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"WrestleMania's looking like it may have what it takes to be king of the ring."
- Joshua Cain, EGM

"The online function of WrestleMania is one of the most impressive aspects of the game."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"Xbox has not been home to many wrestling games and has, at times, felt like the forgotten console for wrestling fans. That changes this March with the release of the highly-anticipated WrestleMania 21."
- Hilary Goldstein, IGN.com

"Thanks to the developer's goal of creating the ultimate presentation for a wrestling game, players will be immersed in the world of the WWE like never before."
- Jeremy Zoss, Game Informer

"Featuring motion-captured animations, voice-over and commentary from your favorite wrestlers, and four-player head-to-head online play, WrestleMania 21 sounds like the wrestling game Xbox owners have been dying for."
- Hilary Goldstein, IGN.com

"The WWE keeps on rolling and THQ is there to pump testosterone-fueled machismo into the mouths of gamers everywhere with WWE WrestleMania 21."
- James Mielke, 1up.com

"WrestleMania 21 is firing on all cylinders - a definite championship contender."
- Chris Hoffman, Play magazine

This is sadly why I NEVER should trust magazine previews anymore. They hype everything up.

[Scorch]

Everyone's ignoring Guyver. Stop ignoring him.

I just went to GameCrazy and popped this in. I played for two hours straight. I played ladder matches, handicap matches, HIAC matches.. I lost the ladder match six times trying to duplicate the bug and it never happened. As a matter of fact, I did not have ANY bugs. People complain about freezing. I think this is due to them having the Thompson drive. You read right. I had no bugs. In a handicap match, both people tried to whoop my ass. I never had an AI bug at all. I never had a bug in HIAC. It was a wonderful experience. My only complaint is that they get up too fast sometimes. When climbing a ladder and knocked off, Christian popped right back up. Other than that, this game is fun. Word of mouth has trampeled it so bad that most of you aren't even going to give this a try and you're missing out on a fun experience.

I started a career mode with a default CAW so I could hear the voiceovers. The voiceovers are absolutely top notch. I played against Renee Dupree in the first match and lost. I had no "invisible person" attacking me. Bottom line, give this a rent. I played it and I loved it. If Live support comes up, I will, without a doubt, get this.

[Monsta Mack]

Damn the fedex dropped off the package, and I wasn't able to refuse.
However, I got about 25 days to watch and see what GS gives this game, and if THQ is going to do anything about Online (it's advertised all over the package to, how sad). I'm gonna keep it sealed and see what happens. Is this game really worst then RAW2? Or is Scorch right and this game deserves a shot? I'm a huge wrestling fan, but im pissed about the online ability so much to the point I want to take out my lighter and burn WM21 on video and distribute it over the net, rather then get my $50 refund ;)

I'm waiting on THQ, I think im gonna give them a ring today, and I hope everyone does the same till something is done about the Live portion.

[Scorch]

Play it. It's worth a shot. I honestly like it. I had fun with it. Ask Guyver for a second opinion.

[GenDV138]

I'll probably pick it up after they get the online deal sorted out, that's the main reason why I wanted the game.

[Scorch]

I'll probably pick it up after they get the online deal sorted out, that's the main reason why I wanted the game.

I may get it before that. It was a fucking blast to play.. and if you have me, the guy who made fun of it from the start, talking about how awesome it is.. yeah. Seeing the entrances for the first time was AMAZING. Watch HBK come out. When he comes from behind the curtain, you'll swear it's on TV or something. The frame rate is so smooth it's unreal.

[cyborg2040]

Just one question, you don't walk with the directional pad, and run with the left analog stick do you? That was one of my biggest complaints about RAw... well that and seasion.


After Legends of Wrestling III got all the bad reviews it did, I avioded it like the plauge. But then I found a copy right before Christmas last year that was new/sealed and only cost $14.99 so I decided why not. Honestly, I like the game. Sure, it has bugs that are VERY annoying, but they are pretty rare for the most part.

Funniest one was Bret Hart pinning me 1....2 KICKOUT! Yet bret staied in the pin position while I shot around the arena like the metal ball in a pinball machine.

Anyhow, I might still consider picking up a copy of this game in the near future, but I'm not sure about paying $50.00 for it. I will prob. wait until I can find a used copy on ebay or something for around $20.00

[Scorch]

Just one question, you don't walk with the directional pad, and run with the left analog stick do you? That was one of my biggest complaints about RAw... well that and seasion.

You can walk with both the D-Pad and Analog stick. The right stick is used to taunt. Hit the Y button to run.

For the record, I like Showdown as well.

I'm seriously fighting back the urge to go pick it up now. It was a blast when I played it. THQ says Live should be up in the next few days.. must.. resist..

[cyborg2040]

Thanks for the reply Scorch. I'm thinking about renting it Monday, maybe I will go that route and see for myself if it's worth the investment.

[Scorch]

Most places will get it for rent tomorrow around noon, so try then.. seriously, it's fun

[Monsta Mack]

Since Scorch is one of the most reputable members on this website, It's hard to fight his opinion. But I keep reading of all the bugs and glitchs and what not and It seems hard to ignore. Someone also stated You can be right near the ropes and you won't be able to break submissions, also performing Jericho's special will teleport other characters to the middle of the ring! lol!

[rvdrock]

Yeah i know, Scorch is making me considering going to get the game...im just lost as to what to do...

[Scorch]

Since Scorch is one of the most reputable members on this website, It's hard to fight his opinion. But I keep reading of all the bugs and glitchs and what not and It seems hard to ignore. Someone also stated You can be right near the ropes and you won't be able to break submissions, also performing Jericho's special will teleport other characters to the middle of the ring! lol!

I've never had a teleporting submission. Every time they were near the ropes, it broke the submission for me. Never had a problem with that.

If all else fails, even though you have it, rent it. That way you only spend $6 or so and you can leave it sealed.. if you like it, open it up, if you don't, send it back. I'm going to try to get it later today, I had a blast playing it. If you can be specific on other bugs you are concerned about, I can let you know if I encountered them or not.

BTW, this was played on a Samsung drive. If you have a Thompson, you should probably avoid this game like the plague. Raw 2 barely worked with it, I doubt WM21 will.

[Pure Apathy]

Yeah i know, Scorch is making me considering going to get the game...im just lost as to what to do...

I'm waiting on the gamespot review. It is the only review site I can really turst anymore.

[onetrackmind]

i dont care what the reviews say, i gotta get this game. I'm taking scorch's word on it. The online is very cool, but i can deal without it.

[rvdrock]

When is the gamespot review supposed to be up?

[ViolentLee]

The GameSpy review is from CAG's own ViolentLee; a reliable source and benevolent provider of Pocket Kingdom shirts. Perhaps he's seen this thread and has something else to add?

Sorry I didn't peep this thread until now. My review ( http://xbox.gamespy.com/xbox/wrestlemania-xxi/606295p1.html ) speaks for itself, really. The game is straight-up awful. Scorch and others seem blinded by good graphics and nice Superstar voiceovers, but they'll get old fast when you actually play the thing. If you're curious, rent it.

I know reviews are to be taken with a grain of salt, but I've played more wrestling games than any other reviewer out there, and I'm the only one to be trained as a pro wrestler with over 100 matches under my belt. I know my stuff. Of course, opinions differ, so if you spent $50 on the game and like it, more power to ya.

[Scorch]

Scorch and others seem blinded by good graphics and nice Superstar voiceovers, but they'll get old fast when you actually play the thing.

What makes your opinion any better than mine? How can you tell me that my OPINION is wrong? Do you think that your opinion matters more because it was published on a website? I don't care if you're fucking Triple H, my opinion is my own and I like the game. I'm not blinded by "good graphics" or voiceovers (especially the latter, since I played one match in Season). Yes, the game's pretty, but i'm not blinded by anything. Smackdown vs. Raw was pretty and I thought the game sucked shit.

Don't open the game based on my recommendation. As I said, rent it, or try it in a game store first.

[ViolentLee]

What makes your opinion any better than mine? How can you tell me that my OPINION is wrong? Do you think that your opinion matters more because it was published on a website? I don't care if you're fucking Triple H, my opinion is my own and I like the game. I'm not blinded by "good graphics" or voiceovers (especially the latter, since I played one match in Season). Yes, the game's pretty, but i'm not blinded by anything. Smackdown vs. Raw was pretty and I thought the game sucked shit.

Don't open the game based on my recommendation. As I said, rent it, or try it in a game store first.

I'm not saying my opinion is better than yours; I am saying I have the most informed opinion. It's not always about you, bro. Other people were talking about how reviews don't matter and how reviewers don't know wrestling. I was just telling them I know what I'm talking about.

Plus, your posts made it sound like you'd only gotten two matches in -- and your most recent post validates that. Again, I'm more informed. Care to argue that point? I played the game many hours before writing my review, where you're basing your thoughts on what sounds like 15 minutes of play.

[flybrione]

You know what you guys can believe Scorch if you want he has given some decent insight on games her at CAG but trust me this game sucks.

I am a diehard wrestling fan and I think that Raw 2 is a better game and that game sucks too.

I will agree that the voice overs did actually sound good in Guyvers video but after playing a few exhibition matches I did not want to even bother to create a character and play career mode. As I mentioned earlier rent it first don't buy it.

This is really a horrible game with many glitches and we as gamers should not accept crap like this on the market.

I really wanted to like this game but I could not. Please please do not buy it. There are many other great titles that have come out this year pick up one of the ones you might of passed up because you were excited to buy wrestlemania 21.

This is my honest opinion and you can take it or leave it.

[Monsta Mack]

Well I opened the game since it was a gift anyways, and from my brief encounters with career mode and exhibiton, I can say the game is anywhere from bad to ok.

The glitchs put down the game ALOT. You can run towards people and as they are getting up you'll get bumped, the refeeree does indeed count "1!" twice when your out of the ring. There are so many glitchs in this game It's not even funny, and I really can't say this game is very good with all the glitchs and no Online play (yet.).

The graphics are viewtiful, but dear god please do not take the original camera view when your wrestling. Use the TV/broadcast view it changes the experience alot, and makes the game enjoyable at times.

The CAW is OK but is major weak sauce compared to the likes of DOR and Smackdown, I would say Smackdown still has the best CAW of current generation wrestlings.

Gameplay is OK to BAD, with all the collision problems and the RAW crap where you can't just tap + direction to do light grapples, instead you gota tie up then do a grapple... I hate that. The countering seems unique but I can't quite grasp how to counter all the moves. And whose idea was it to give you major heat for just one taunt? Supers seem really easy to achieve. I think the gameplay needed more time in the development department.

The game doesn't freeze on me after the match but it does skip, which is incredibly stupid, during the replay. Almost all the glitchs people have mentioned are real and It's downright dissapointing to see me getting DDT in the middle of the air DBZ style by whomever.

The commentary is pretty good but gets annoying just like in Smackdown versus RAW.

Storyline voice over is top notch, and much better then SVR, but storyline quality wise I don't know If It's better then SVR or not, looks better then DOR though.

Exhibition match quality seems ok, but theres nothing over the top.

Two things that are going to give this game a better rating? Multiplayer and Online, one component I can't even test out yet.

If this game is just as fun as every other wrestler multiplayer wise I would give it a high 6, and if Live kicks ass a mid 7. It's better then RAW2... but not by a whole lot.

More dissapointing then Smackdown versus Raw? From what I've played yes, but I won't call the final verdict till THQ does something about the Live play. But for now I would give it a 6.

[Scorch]

I'm not saying my opinion is better than yours; I am saying I have the most informed opinion. It's not always about you, bro. Other people were talking about how reviews don't matter and how reviewers don't know wrestling. I was just telling them I know what I'm talking about.

How the fuck do you have the most informed opinion? Jeez, someone needs to pop your ego. I know it's not all about me. I never said it was. I never said anything about reviewers not knowing anything about wrestling, because, believe it or not, you don't have to know the sport to review the game. What most people seem to be forgetting is that games are loosely based on the wrestling product. It's not supposed to 100% follow the storylines.

Plus, your posts made it sound like you'd only gotten two matches in -- and your most recent post validates that. Again, I'm more informed. Care to argue that point? I played the game many hours before writing my review, where you're basing your thoughts on what sounds like 15 minutes of play.

Again, pop your ego. If you had read my post, you would've read that I played for TWO HOURS, not fifteen minutes. Yes, I care to argue my point.. my point is that you're an egotistical asshat who thinks he's a bigshot because he can freelance review and get it published.. newsflash, jerkoff.. that doesn't make your opinion any more or less informed than mine. I played the game for a couple of hours and tried out nearly every mode. Read my posts before you start making assumptions. Different people have different tastes.


I will agree that the voice overs did actually sound good in Guyvers video but after playing a few exhibition matches I did not want to even bother to create a character and play career mode. As I mentioned earlier rent it first don't buy it.

This is the guy you should be talking to. He formed his opinion after playing a few matches and didn't bother to dive into the CAW or career mode. Everyone who's played is also failing to mention how old their XBox is. The drive you have also plays a huge role in the glitches.


The glitchs put down the game ALOT. You can run towards people and as they are getting up you'll get bumped, the refeeree does indeed count "1!" twice when your out of the ring. There are so many glitchs in this game It's not even funny, and I really can't say this game is very good with all the glitchs and no Online play (yet.).

As I said, I never encountered any bumping of any walls or any miscounting whatsoever.


The game doesn't freeze on me after the match but it does skip, which is incredibly stupid, during the replay. Almost all the glitchs people have mentioned are real and It's downright dissapointing to see me getting DDT in the middle of the air DBZ style by whomever.

I did have the slow/stuttering during the replay.

As I said, I liked it, and maybe I can justify getting it more because i'm getting it with store credit instead of forking over cash. I respect everyone's opinion who plays this game, and I realize that this game is extremely love/hate... but damn, ViolentLee, you really need a fucking ego check.

[Monsta Mack]

Yeah people are overblowing it and saying It's the worst wrestling game ever. Anyone who says such needs to go back and play Backstage Assault, or WCW Thunder or something, the game isn't that bad, It's just dissapointing. Everyone had high hopes as with everyother WWE game to come out recently, and none has capitalized outside of HCTP a few years ago, but even then it had no online play and the gameplay was still 100% Smackdown which is love it or hate it gameplay as is.

I actually gota say I haven't ran into as much as glitchs as everyone said in my two hours of gameplay, but the collision detection is still something that's laughable at times.

And I still don't care for the grapple first then input wrestling move second sort of gameplay, and thats why No Mercy will still be the best wrestler of al ltime because of how it handled grapples and strikes.

I dont' feel as bad owning it either because my mom gave it to me as a gift since they sold their old house and had alot of free money to spend. I wish I got UC2 over this based on reviews alone, but as a wrestling fan I can give it a recommendation when it hits the $20-$30 level, just not your hard earned $50 especially without Live.

[flybrione]

This is the guy you should be talking to. He formed his opinion after playing a few matches and didn't bother to dive into the CAW or career mode. Everyone who's played is also failing to mention how old their XBox is. The drive you have also plays a huge role in the glitches.

I know that people say the drive may cause problems with xbox titles but I have never experienced any freezing in any other xbox titles except for MLB2K4 and NHL2K5. I got my xbox from my girlfriend as a xmas gift when the Jet Grind/GT pack was available. I have a very large collection of games and as I mentioned the only titles to every give me problems are the two above. I do not think the drive has anything to do with the glitches in this game. I believe that the developer has to take blam for the glitches. Can you explain to my why I can not sign on to Xbox Live? Can you because your drive is newer?

Now back to the game. Just because the voiceover is good in a game does not mean that gameplay is good. I did not enjoy the gameplay of this game at all and was really disappointed in it. Now if the gameplay is not good why would I want to suffer through career mode. . . because the voiceovers are good, come on now.

There is a video on teamxbox of a match with Jericho vs. Shelton. Watch the video there are glithes happening in the reviewer's video.

I glad to see you liked the game Scorch. But I think it sucks.

[flybrione]

I really think the problem with people is they stick up for a game that is done half arse. Now if you like it that is ok people can form there opinion and pay for whatever they like but I will not pay $50 for this piece of . . .

When they should look at DOR or SVR or No Mercy. These games do not have the major problems that this game has.

It might be going in the right direction to some degree but I expected something completely different. The collision detect in my opinion ruins the gameplay experience. It to me is one of the worst wrestling game to be released because of the faulty collision detection. How can you enjoy a wrestling title with bad collision detection that is what you do in wrestling collide with your opponent.

Maybe if they would have delayed it again it might have come out better but I find this game to be unacceptable.

Who approves a game like this to be released. That what I want to know. Especially with the Live portion not working.

[ViolentLee]

How the fuck do you have the most informed opinion?

Do we need to measure our dicks? Okay, then. Me: pro wrestler, pro journalist, played virtually every wrestling game known to man, spent >8 hours with the game, and then broke it down into 1,200 or so analytical words. If you think that makes me a prick for saying it, so be it. You asked a question, I answered with facts. FACTS, not ego. Again, that doesn't make any differing opinions wrong -- I never said that -- but it does make me the most informed. Need I mention how much I played the game for preview or the demo I was given by the THQ guys months ago? If you think you're more of an expert on the subject than me, I welcome your evidence.

I know how you like to think you rule the CAG roost, and you got others drinking that Kool-Ade, but there's always a bigger dog. In this case, it's me -- no matter how pissed that makes you. So go on another of your little curse-filled rants (most people get a good laugh out of them), but you lose this one. You saying I have an ego problem is like Yokozuna calling Rikishi fat. </heelpromo>

By the way, I didn't run into many "glitches" while I played, and I tend to not concern myself too much with them. Falling through the floor once is nothing compared to lame AI, laggy controls, or poor balancing.

[mykevermin]

I like the Gwar avatar more than the NIN avatar. That's my two cents.

[Scorch]

Now back to the game. Just because the voiceover is good in a game does not mean that gameplay is good. I did not enjoy the gameplay of this game at all and was really disappointed in it. Now if the gameplay is not good why would I want to suffer through career mode. . . because the voiceovers are good, come on now.

..Why do you keep mentioning voiceovers? I realize the difference between voiceovers and gameplay.. geez, wtf?

There is a video on teamxbox of a match with Jericho vs. Shelton. Watch the video there are glithes happening in the reviewer's video.

I want to watch what happens when I play the game on my XBox, not what happens when a reviewer plays on his.

I really think the problem with people is they stick up for a game that is done half arse. Now if you like it that is ok people can form there opinion and pay for whatever they like but I will not pay $50 for this piece of . . .

What's your deal? We understand that you do not like the game and you do not want to pay $50 for it. Please stop repeating yourself.

Do we need to measure our dicks? Okay, then. Me: pro wrestler, pro journalist, played virtually every wrestling game known to man, spent >8 hours with the game, and then broke it down into 1,200 or so analytical words. If you think that makes me a prick for saying it, so be it. You asked a question, I answered with facts. FACTS, not ego. Again, that doesn't make any differing opinions wrong -- I never said that -- but it does make me the most informed. Need I mention how much I played the game for preview or the demo I was given by the THQ guys months ago? If you think you're more of an expert on the subject than me, I welcome your evidence.

Being a pro wrestler and a pro journalist has fuck all to do with you knowing shit about a game. If anything, you being a wrestler would make you even more anal about reviewing it than you already are. Yes, you're a prick. And yeah, you did say my opinion was wrong. How could "This game is awful, Scorch was just blinded by the good graphics" be taken any other way? You basically told me to shut up and sit down, and i'm not one for taking orders. I don't care if you had a preview for a demo. I don't care if you're a pro journalist.

When did games stop being about having fun and start being the subject of overanalysis? I thought I played games to have fun, not to bitch when The Rock looks to the left of the ramp instead of the right.

I know how you like to think you rule the CAG roost, and you got others drinking that Kool-Ade, but there's always a bigger dog

Um.. no, I don't. I don't "rule the CAG roost" and I don't have others "drinking kool-aid". I think you should take a step back and stop the bullshit observations. You think that I am forcing people to play it because of my opinion - i'm not. I constantly stress that while others may not find the game fun, I do. I even said not to open the game based on my opinion. Seriously, stop thinking you know me as a person, because you don't.

In this case, it's me -- no matter how pissed that makes you. So go on another of your little curse-filled rants (most people get a good laugh out of them), but you lose this one. You saying I have an ego problem is like Yokozuna calling Rikishi fat. </heelpromo>

I've gone beyond saying you have an ego problem.. words can't describe how cocky you are. I don't know where you have your little opinion of me from, but you should reevaluate it.

It's really annoying how you talk to people, too. You've got a god complex and it feels like you're being condescending.. seriously, just because you don a pair of tights and work at some indie promotion slaving away to make a few extra bucks a night by throwing a hiptoss in some rundown arena doesn't make your opinion on a game any more valid than mine. The fact that you flaunt that you're a "pro wrestler" is funny in itself.


By the way, I didn't run into many "glitches" while I played, and I tend to not concern myself too much with them.

A quick look at your review suggests the polar opposite.

Bottom line, quit being a dickhead and thinking your opinion is above everyone else's. Everyone has their own opinion and i've encouraged people to try it first.

[Scorch]

And I think "Lina" trolled in my thread.

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=920641&topic=20551438

[mykevermin]

Well, I refused the package, joined gamefly, and now have WM21 and Jade Empire en route as my trial games.

A much better solution, methinks.

[ManChowder]

Gamespot review is up.....

WM21 got a 4.5!!!.... ouch.

[TheMoor]

On a lighter note, the gamespot review is up!!!!!

http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/action/wwewrestlemania21/index.html?q=wwe

[lupe121283]

look, I am there too.
Anyways, would Ebgames even get memo on live patches even though is just a retail store?

[ViolentLee]

I've gone beyond saying you have an ego problem.. words can't describe how cocky you are. I don't know where you have your little opinion of me from, but you should reevaluate it.

It's really annoying how you talk to people, too. You've got a god complex and it feels like you're being condescending.. seriously, just because you don a pair of tights and work at some indie promotion slaving away to make a few extra bucks a night by throwing a hiptoss in some rundown arena doesn't make your opinion on a game any more valid than mine. The fact that you flaunt that you're a "pro wrestler" is funny in itself.

A quick look at your review suggests the polar opposite.

Bottom line, quit being a dickhead and thinking your opinion is above everyone else's. Everyone has their own opinion and i've encouraged people to try it first.

Boo hoo hoo. I needed a Kleenex after reading yet another whining, insulting Scorch post. I'm disappointed it wasn't more sweary, though. You contradict yourself so often, I think you should get tested for mutliple personality disorder. I'm the one who talks bad to people? I'm flaunting things? Again, I used facts to back up my review. You haven't used fact one to back up anthing -- especially for how much you flap your lips and tickle the keyboard. You can't disprove anything I've said so you resort to personal attacks. Good strategy, big man.

To you, everyone is either wrong or a dick. Since I was right, I'm a dick -- about my opinion being more informed than yours -- remember how mad that statement made you and how you can't disprove it? Oops, I'd better stop "flaunting." Keep telling me what to do and how I should be, because you're such an expert psychologist -- not to mention a paragon of virtue and a shining beacon to us all. If I took your conduct as an example on how to act, you'd think I was an even bigger ass. You may want to forgo buying a cheap ass game one time to purchase a mirror so you can look at yourself in it.

Word to the wise: Scorch takes everything said in any thread he posts in as a direct assault on him, and will call you every name in the book as a retaliation. Just agree with him and pat him on the head for being so smart, or suffer his horrible wrath. Just be prepared when he spontaneously flipflops -- like how he dissed this game terribly until he played it 5 minutes and liked it, or when he used to always trash the PSP mercilessly then talked about wanting one after it'd been out a week. Need I repeat the term multiple-personality disorder?

[TheMoor]

Gamespot review is up.....

WM21 got a 4.5!!!.... ouch.

I was a little too slow

[Scorch]

Wow, this is hilarious..

To you, everyone is either wrong or a dick

The only people I've called wrong or a dick is you and Matt Young.

Since I was right, I'm a dick -- about my opinion being more informed than yours -- remember how mad that statement made you and how you can't disprove it?

I don't understand why you continually try to justify an opinion.. I have my opinion and you have yours. Yours is no better than mine. That's what I've said from the start.

Word to the wise: Scorch takes everything said in any thread he posts in as a direct assault on him, and will call you every name in the book as a retaliation.

I think you're confusing me with Morphiend or Nephets. Why would I call someone names (well, besides you, for thinking someone could have a bigger opinion than someone else) over the internet?

Just be prepared when he spontaneously flipflops -- like how he dissed this game terribly until he played it 5 minutes and liked it, or when he used to always trash the PSP mercilessly then talked about wanting one after it'd been out a week. Need I repeat the term multiple-personality disorder?

Multiple personality? Uhh, right. I was making fun of the game because of the videos and pictures people posted. Once I actually played the game, I retracted my statement.

I still trash the PSP mercilessly, but yes, I'd like one to transfer MP3's and videos on. That's the post I started in the forum.

I can transfer MP3's with it, right? A whole 8 songs or so. I probably won't get any games at launch, but aside from GTA and GT4, what else is on the horizon? Basically, what else should I learn before trying to get one?

I also made a post on conversions. So yes, I don't like the PSP, but I'd like to carry music and movies around.

Whatever I say, you'll come in with a personal attack, which is completely unnecessary. Yeah, I called you a few names, but you decided to insult me as a person, and you don't even know me at all.. so you know what? Screw this.

[Superstar]

I actually enjoy the game quite a bit. Yeah, it has it's problems, but the gameplay is fun to me.

[Saucy Jack]

Damn, I have no freakin' clue about what to do. My brother and I are wondering whether to buy this game or not. I can understand some glitches and collision detection problems (what game doesn't have a couple of screwups?), but a lot of folks are talking about this game being a complete piece of shit that will melt my Xbox if I play it.

I'm heading out for dinner soon and hopefully someone can help me decide whether or not to pick this up on the way home.

Thanks! :)

[Matt Young]

Scorch, it's very relieving knowing that you enjoy the game. I may not know you personally, but seeing you giving the game praise does more to make me think positively than any review would make me think negatively.

ViolentLee, I respect your opinion as well, but I'm a (partially) trained pro wrestler myself (obligatory New Midwest Wrestling cheap plug) so we'll see what I have to say. :-P If we disagree, maybe we can battle it out in real life for the CAG Title. You're not too far away, lol.

Anyway, I just called GameRush since my sleep was permanently interrupted, and apparently they don't have the courtesy GameCrazy would to call the customers who preordered, because the game's in. I'm leaving to pick it up in a minute. I'll post thoughts later on tonight.

Oops, I forgot- Scorch, I'm not sure if the person who replied to your GameFAQs post is our Leena or not. I saw that someone posts as "Leenah" there and "Leena" at GR, but both names are spelled differently than the name she used at CAG. Also, e-mail addresses are different. I don't know if it's her or not, but that's been something I've been wondering about myself.

[rvdrock]

Well, I got the chance to play it some at EB and it just didnt feel right to me. I appreciate the opinions of everyone, but I decided against getting it for now. I am currently trying to get a job at EB and then maybe with the discount, I'd get it, but instead its Jade Empire for the next few weeks. And whats with Lina trolling on GFAQS? Thats just odd...

[TheRock88]

Damn, I have no freakin' clue about what to do. My brother and I are wondering whether to buy this game or not. I can understand some glitches and collision detection problems (what game doesn't have a couple of screwups?), but a lot of folks are talking about this game being a complete piece of shit that will melt my Xbox if I play it.

I'm in the same boat as you. Me and my bro want to get it too but I wanna wait and see some more reactions to the game before deciding to pick it up or wait. The glitches and other things dont bother me as long as the gameplay is good.

Scorch, if you've played any other current wrestling game (could be anything;, DOR, HCTP, SVR, LOW:S, etc.), how would you compare those to Wrestlemania's gameplay? Could you give a score out of 10 too to how good the gameplay is?

[slimpip]

Thought I'd post some news here for you guys, dunno if anyone else has brought this up....I have a friend who worked on the graphics engine for WMXXI and he said there MAY be a recall on the game, apparently there was a HUGE mix up with the beta of the game and the beta was accidentally released retail. He said it's doubtful THQ is gonna take the blame for the mistake, even though the published the game.

Also, some more tidbits: THQ took (I think) 3-4 months off the production schedule, and rushed the game to somewhat coincide with the actual event.

[KaneRobot]

I like the Gwar avatar more than the NIN avatar. That's my two cents.

Make it four cents.

BTW, this was played on a Samsung drive. If you have a Thompson, you should probably avoid this game like the plague. Raw 2 barely worked with it, I doubt WM21 will.

That's one user's experience. I bought my XBox on launch day and even with the earliest Thompson drive you can get I never had any problems with Raw 2, and I've rarely had any problems with ANY XBox games. Still, "you should probably avoid this game like the plague" is accurate regardless.

I have my opinion and you have yours. Yours is no better than mine. That's what I've said from the start.

And that's one of the biggest, most overused cop-outs by people on the internet. Everyone who can't come up with something strong to support what they are saying just falls back on "IT'S ALL OPINION, NO ONE IS WRONG" as if it's not possible for one of the two (or more) people to have a more reputable or informed opinion. I don't even know if that's the case here...nor do I care...reading all the back and forth posts would be too tedious for someone whose attention span has been destroyed by the internet and television.

Sure, it's possible for someone to enjoy this game - just like it's possible for people to have lower standards. If someone enjoys the game, good for them. I hope it's not just someone trying to justify their disappointing $50 purchase. Hey, I've been there...I bought Raw 2 for $40 bucks when it first came out and I tried to convince myself it was ok before giving up and selling the piece of crap.

[mykevermin]

Thought I'd post some news here for you guys, dunno if anyone else has brought this up....I have a friend who worked on the graphics engine for WMXXI and he said there MAY be a recall on the game, apparently there was a HUGE mix up with the beta of the game and the beta was accidentally released retail. He said it's doubtful THQ is gonna take the blame for the mistake, even though the published the game.

Also, some more tidbits: THQ took (I think) 3-4 months off the production schedule, and rushed the game to somewhat coincide with the actual event.

That would be pleasing news. As I am a skeptic (it's what I'm paid to be), I would like you to provide some evidence that what you're saying is true. If not, no big deal (I'm not going to start a gamefaqs sissyfight over the ordeal, unlike two people whose names rhyme with 'violentlee' and 'scorch', to be vague). I'm just a fan of corroboration.

I have to admit that I'm kind of depressed that this game is so abysmal. It would be nice if THQ stepped up and recalled the title. I can't think of *any* instance where a company has admitted fault in a release (what was the end of the story with the Breed game mentioned a few pages back?). THQ never acknowledged that No Mercy had one fatal bug; they never acknowledged that Raw 2 was plagued. Can anyone cite an example of a company saying something to the effect of "Oh, shit. We're sorry, here's the real game." I think they had to do that with GC Phantasy Star Online in Japan, but other than that, I'm drawing blanks.

I'm also up to my neck in games; currently, I have no qualms in admitting that Doom 3 is scaring me half to death. It is one of the most fantastic titles in terms of ambience (and not a half bad shooter, either).

myke.
...having bought a Boston Terrier on Sunday (very expensive, FYI), and having a tattoo appointment next Thursday, perhaps this is $50 that I'm better off having saved.

[slimpip]

If I could provide hard evidence I would :) All I can really say is he works for Studio Gigante in Chicago (I live in the burbs right outside of Chicago so he visits often). If you go through the credits his name is Rodrigo M. Here is his website if you'd like to view some of his work: www.arempire.com

Again, I don't know if THQ is going to perform a recall, since it would be at cost to them...but I know for a fact that Studio Gigante is demanding it.

[KaneRobot]

If I could provide hard evidence I would :) All I can really say is he works for Studio Gigante in Chicago (I live in the burbs right outside of Chicago so he visits often). If you go through the credits his name is Rodrigo M. Here is his website if you'd like to view some of his work: www.arempire.com

Again, I don't know if THQ is going to perform a recall, since it would be at cost to them...but I know for a fact that Studio Gigante is demanding it.

A recall would be a huge pain for them and would be basically admitting that they released a really crappy product which would damage their reputation even more than it has been already. I can't see it happening, but I hope you are right.

My memory isn't working right now...can anyone remember a recall on a game before? (any console)

[CheapyD]

Thought I'd post some news here for you guys, dunno if anyone else has brought this up....I have a friend who worked on the graphics engine for WMXXI and he said there MAY be a recall on the game, apparently there was a HUGE mix up with the beta of the game and the beta was accidentally released retail. He said it's doubtful THQ is gonna take the blame for the mistake, even though the published the game.

Also, some more tidbits: THQ took (I think) 3-4 months off the production schedule, and rushed the game to somewhat coincide with the actual event.

So its BREED all over again, eh?

[slimpip]

So its BREED all over again, eh?

Pretty much, but on a much larger scale :)

[WhipSmartBanky]

A recall would be a huge pain for them and would be basically admitting that they released a really crappy product which would damage their reputation even more than it has been already. I can't see it happening, but I hope you are right.

My memory isn't working right now...can anyone remember a recall on a game before? (any console)
I don't see it happening either. They'll just keep working on it and turn it back out as WM22 next year.

[ViolentLee]

They used to talk about recalling WWF No Mercy, too, since it would spontaneously erase all your saved data. Never happened, though.

Also, some more tidbits: THQ took (I think) 3-4 months off the production schedule, and rushed the game to somewhat coincide with the actual event.

Regarding dev cycle, I don't envy THQ or Studio Gigante. This was a new engine and a new developer trying to turn out a project under a tight deadline. In my opinion they failed miserably, and it's yet another case of the quick-turnover sequel mentality biting everyone in the ass. When will companies learn that we don't need a sequel every year -- especially when THQ is releasing almost 3 WWE properties per year.

[mykevermin]

They used to talk about recalling WWF No Mercy, too, since it would spontaneously erase all your saved data. Never happened, though.



Regarding dev cycle, I don't envy THQ or Studio Gigante. This was a new engine and a new developer trying to turn out a project under a tight deadline. In my opinion they failed miserably, and it's yet another case of the quick-turnover sequel mentality biting everyone in the ass. When will companies learn that we don't need a sequel every year -- especially when THQ is releasing almost 3 WWE properties per year.

Yes and no. Many argue for and against annual updates. Some sports might be considered unnecessary. Not to pick on football or baseball, but roster updates would be more than sufficient in many cases.

On the other hand, wrestling has many facets that change very quickly; the roster on any given WWE game is outdated by the time it is released. Some characters' appearances, moves, or music changes. Perhaps, in the future, roster updates can fix this. In the meantime, remaining current is very important for fans of wrestling games. We're like comic geeks in that respect. If Kurt Angle's character model doesn't spin the right way, we bitch. Is it snarky? You betcha.

It's counterproductive, of course, since THQ decides to rush games the way they have. I was burned by Raw 2, but THQ exchanged it at no cost for Here Comes the Pain. You would think they know better; perhaps the sales indicated otherwise. That's a total shame.

myke.

[ViolentLee]

Yes and no. Many argue for and against annual updates. Some sports might be considered unnecessary. Not to pick on football or baseball, but roster updates would be more than sufficient in many cases.

On the other hand, wrestling has many facets that change very quickly; the roster on any given WWE game is outdated by the time it is released. Some characters' appearances, moves, or music changes. Perhaps, in the future, roster updates can fix this. In the meantime, remaining current is very important for fans of wrestling games. We're like comic geeks in that respect. If Kurt Angle's character model doesn't spin the right way, we bitch. Is it snarky? You betcha.

It's counterproductive, of course, since THQ decides to rush games the way they have. I was burned by Raw 2, but THQ exchanged it at no cost for Here Comes the Pain. You would think they know better; perhaps the sales indicated otherwise. That's a total shame.

myke.

New NBA game every year? Okay, sure. New Tiger Woods or Tony Hawk games every year? As much as I like them, it's overkill. I think wrestling is the same way -- though I'm anxiously anticipating when my homie Daivari (RAW Superstar) appears in a game. Besides, you're never going to be totally current with the rosters and the storylines, no matter how often you put out a new game. I'm glad that games are making up their own storylines, independent of what's happening on TV.

Both Smackdown and Day of Reckoning are quality titles, but imagine what THQ could do if it pooled its developmental resources to make one, all-encompassing wrestling game. Why, it might even rival the great AKI games of old -- and finally give Xbox owners something worth playing. .

[guyver2077]

yea the game is awesome...if you enjoyed legend of wrestling showdown then you will like it...


has anyone been able to get online?

[guyver2077]

wtf....4.5? is gamespot crazy...

cmon even legends of wrestling got a higher score than that...

and this is way more enjoyable...

[Monsta Mack]

If I could provide hard evidence I would :) All I can really say is he works for Studio Gigante in Chicago (I live in the burbs right outside of Chicago so he visits often). If you go through the credits his name is Rodrigo M. Here is his website if you'd like to view some of his work: www.arempire.com

Again, I don't know if THQ is going to perform a recall, since it would be at cost to them...but I know for a fact that Studio Gigante is demanding it.

It wouldnt suprise me that what we are playing is a beta, but how much improved can the final product be? Less collision detection and glitchs? That can't improve the gameplay too much, but one things for sure we all want online play, and we want it now. This is clearly false advertisement by THQ, and if they don't get on the ball I bet some insane wrestling fanatics will be taking action soon.

[guyver2077]

what is going on with this online issue....i havent been able to log in....

edit...answered myy own question....this is fucking incredible


The online play in Wrestlemania XXI is easily the most attractive feature in the game. Too bad you can't play it. Somehow, some way, the retail game that you can buy in stores right now will not connect to Xbox Live at all. It doesn't even try; it just spits out a fat connection error the second you try to sign in. How the game could have shipped with such a significant oversight is unthinkable, though for what it's worth, with gameplay like this, online play wouldn't have helped much. And in case you were wondering, the possibility of an online patch doesn't seem like it's going to be an option, what with the whole inability to even connect to Xbox Live thing.

[Scorch]

Alright.. ViolentLee, I'm sorry. I shot off remarks that shouldn't have been said. Truth be told, your review is a good one. Let's just call a truce and agree to disagree.

I thought the problem with No Mercy was a loose cart battery or something.. I never personally had the big glitch, thank god.

If there was a recall, that'd be great. I like the game right now, so I can only imagine how much more I'd like it if they had an improved version.. however, in the beta versions, the online mode was working, and it's not even working now.. so.. who knows. If they rereleased it, that'd be great.. it'd be (one of) the first time a company's ever admitted that they messed up and wanted to fix the problem. A recall would cost a ton of money, though.. maybe they could say just mail us your copy of the game and receipt and we'll send you the real version?.. that'd be cool.

what is going on with this online issue....i havent been able to log in....

oh come on, guyver.. do you not pay attention at all? lol that's what we've been talking about, the online mode is broke, everyone's waiting for a patch.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/04/20/news_6122657.html

[guyver2077]

yea sorry i bought the dame first thing this morning and only played for like an hour and have been studying for a final all day today....just started checking the boards again..

i was hoping they would fix this by the end of the night

[ViolentLee]

Alright.. ViolentLee, I'm sorry. I shot off remarks that shouldn't have been said. Truth be told, your review is a good one. Let's just call a truce and agree to disagree.

A truce it is, good call. I enjoyed our banter, and I realize I was an anus about some things. I honestly hope people who bought the game like it -- nobody wants to have wasted $50, whether it's cash money, store credit, or someone else's money in the form of a gift. We all get different experiences out of what we play; that's what makes games so great.

[guyver2077]

well i enjoy every wrestling game... no matter what...

heck i bought raw 2 when it came out for $50 and enjoyed it...

[ViolentLee]

well i enjoy every wrestling game... no matter what...

heck i bought raw 2 when it came out for $50 and enjoyed it...

Hey, IGN liked Raw 2, too. It had some good things to it, I'll admit. I gave it a 7.25 out of 10. Multiplayer story mode, jacking guys in the back, custom soundtrack entrances. It wasn't all bad, in my opinion.

Did you ever play Legends of Wrestling 2 for GBA, though? Probably the worst wrestling game I've ever played: http://gameinformer.com/Games/Review/200303/R03.0729.1528.47692.htm

[Scorch]

A truce it is, good call. I enjoyed our banter, and I realize I was an anus about some things. I honestly hope people who bought the game like it -- nobody wants to have wasted $50, whether it's cash money, store credit, or someone else's money in the form of a gift. We all get different experiences out of what we play; that's what makes games so great.

Agreed. I went back to GameCrazy and planned on getting this.. they only had the display copy. I played the employee there, and it was a blast to play against him. He was Stacy Keibler and I was HBK.. bit of an uneven match, no? Anyways, it was pretty fun, and hopefully it'll be that type of fun on Live.

I will admit though, it did freeze once or twice, but nothing to restart the XBox. It froze for a good 20-25 seconds before a replay after a match.. maybe some people just don't have patience and reset their XBox.

I did, however, grab a MGS3: Snake Eater standee (woohoo! Was a bitch and a half to get out the door, in the car and home, then re-set up.. I can't get the backing thing to connect in the right spot..) and some awesome Pelican controller for 12.99 with the black and white buttons at the top, almost like L1 and R1, with the triggers being an L2 and R2.

http://gear.ign.com/articles/566/566357p1.html

I THINK that's it, though my controller does not glow. Oh well. After discount and taxes it was like $12.50.. not bad for an extra controller. I keep hearing rumors about a patch tonight for Live, though I'm not holding my breath. If there is one, though, I'm getting the display copy i've been playing at GameCrazy..

[Pure Apathy]

Hopefully there was a mixup with the game (Breed). I would reconsider getting this game if there is a recall and the correct game is sold.

[Monsta Mack]

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/wrestlemania21/autoupdate.htm?level1=enushome&level2=ticker&level3=wrestlemaniaautoupdate

Dear Valued Customers:

It has come to our attention that, due to a manufacturing error at the disc replication facility, gamers may experience problems utilizing the online feature in WWE WrestleMania® 21.

We are currently working to issue an auto update that will be available for download on Xbox Live as quickly as possible. Please be assured this is a isolated issue and we apologize for the inconvenience.

We appreciate your patience while we work to address this situation.

Regards,
THQ Customer Service

[CheapyD]

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/wrestlemania21/autoupdate.htm?level1=enushome&level2=ticker&level3=wrestlemaniaautoupdate

Dear Valued Customers:

.... Please be assured this is a isolated issue and we apologize for the inconvenience....

Regards,
THQ Customer ServiceI thought nobody could get online...how is that isolated?

[Slipknot9762]

its alright i just got it today, kinda dissapointed by the CAW, xbox live currently doesnt work, story mode is ok, the pyro is bad looking, the crowd isnt what i expected, the graphics and gameplay are great though

[Monsta Mack]

You got me.
Well atleast the online issue will be fixed. Doesn't fix the glitchs and what not though, think they'll be able to fix some of them via update? *shrugs*

[Saucy Jack]

Just got home. Stopped by GameCrazy and asked to try out the game. It's pretty cool how they will let you try ANY game out. Played a match with my bro, and we liked it. So we bought it and renewed our MVP (got EGM for a year, too, which is great since our free sub ended).

The girl at the counter was super-happy. "Wow, you're the first person to actually buy a new game after we open a new copy for you to try out." :)

Hopefully, the online is fixed soon and I can get to play with my buddies here at CAG. That'd be pretty sweet. :)

[mykevermin]

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/wrestlemania21/autoupdate.htm?level1=enushome&level2=ticker&level3=wrestlemaniaautoupdate

Dear Valued Customers:

It has come to our attention that, due to a manufacturing error at the disc replication facility, gamers may experience problems utilizing the online feature in WWE WrestleMania® 21.

We are currently working to issue an auto update that will be available for download on Xbox Live as quickly as possible. Please be assured this is a isolated issue and we apologize for the inconvenience.

We appreciate your patience while we work to address this situation.

Regards,
THQ Customer Service

So, they pressed a pre-final copy of the game, that much appears to be clear. So the fix will only address XBL? Egads.

myke.

[Scorch]

So, they pressed a pre-final copy of the game, that much appears to be clear. So the fix will only address XBL? Egads.

myke.

The pre-final copies had working XBox Live.. so this is a real deal, not a beta :(

[mykevermin]

The pre-final copies had working XBox Live.. so this is a real deal, not a beta :(

Although I won't try to discount any difficulties experienced due to a certain dvd drive derivative, many of the bugs people have been claiming have nothing to do with the drive.

The collision detection, the precise timing with which you need to hit moves when the opponent is on the mat, ladder matches with the hanging item right in the ring, ad infinitum. None of that has to do with the drive.

I applaud THQ for acknowledging and fixing the XBL problems; it's obvious that those with live will simply have to boot up their systems and download the update directly from the dashboard, due to the in-game difficulties connecting to the network. I don't think that will be a terrible ordeal.

myke.
...shame that people are citing dozens of other things that desperately need fixing, which THQ seems to be (for the moment) intentionally overlooking. Oh well, at least they're consistent.

[Sojeph]

I still think there were two different final versions of the game. The one they pressed was the one that was suppose to come out on the 28 of march. I probably hold on to my copy. I got mine from eb and it has a 14 day return policy. I'll give THQ 14 days for them to press the correct final copy. I still like the game despite the glitches but its not bad at all. Legends of Wrestling 3 had warping characters on screen at least this doesnt have that.

[guyver2077]

i actually have legends of wrestling 2 for gba......horrible....

but ive been saying since the start that this game plays like showdown and it does....

and now the long wait for dor2 begins.....that will be amazing

[Scorch]

http://gamepro.com/microsoft/xbox/games/reviews/44528.shtml

Gotta love how it gets a 4/5, with specific nods to XBox Live.. and then they go on to say there's no blood.. makes you wonder if they even played the game.

[mykevermin]

I don't recall reading any reviews that discussed experiences playing on XBL. Any links?

[Scorch]

I don't recall reading any reviews that discussed experiences playing on XBL. Any links?

From IGN:

Online play feels just as smooth as multiplayer on the same console. Of course it also suffers from all the same gameplay problems as the single-player experience.

From Team XBox:

It’s nice to finally have a wrestling game on the Xbox with online play and it may be WM21’s saving grace. 1-4 players can battle it out with voice support in most of the matches available in the offline game (no Royal Rumble for obvious reasons). In our playtests most matches performed at the same level as the offline game with little lag, but it remains to be seen how the retail version performs with four players on Xbox Live. If the hardcore crowd can look past some of the flaws and really adopts online championships, then WM21 could get a boost. This is a big “if” however, being that the gameplay is hard to stomach. As with the rest of the game, the Xbox Live UI is poorly designed.

[mykevermin]

danke schoen.

[BustaUppa]

I can't think of *any* instance where a company has admitted fault in a release (what was the end of the story with the Breed game mentioned a few pages back?). THQ never acknowledged that No Mercy had one fatal bug; they never acknowledged that Raw 2 was plagued. Can anyone cite an example of a company saying something to the effect of "Oh, shit. We're sorry, here's the real game." I think they had to do that with GC Phantasy Star Online in Japan, but other than that, I'm drawing blanks.Well I know that both Mortal Kombat Trilogy (PS1) and Mortal Kombat Gold (DC) had "fixed" versions released after a lot of bugs were discovered. I'm not sure if there was ever a direct statement from Midway though, where they officially acknowledged the problem. I'm not positive but MK Gold might have had a proper recall.. but I know for sure that there was a distinct re-release of the game that had a different colored disc and everything. You couldn't even save the game in the original so the glitches were pretty crippling. The glitches in MKT weren't exactly game-breaking, just slight gameplay inaccuracies (relative to Ultimate MK3 in the arcade, which the game engine was based on) that were later corrected in the Greatest Hits version.

[GizmoGC]

Didn't the fixed Dreamcast versions have a gold star that said "Hot!" or "New!"?

[TheRock88]

Just picked up my copy, gonna start playing it now. I hope it's as good as some people are saying it is.

[Scorch]

Picked it up, made a CAW.. I started looking through CAS.. the move list and entrance moves/ring moves are pretty bare (though I think you can unlock a ton), Studio Gigante gets major props because in the T-Shirt section, they have logos of EVERYTHING on your shirt, from ECW to LWO to The Outsiders to D-Generation X.. four DX logos, actually, and nWo white and red, a "Tough Enough" shirt, and so much more.

My guy's got a "bandit" mask on, jeans, and an "E C F'N W" shirt. I love this.

[BustaUppa]

Didn't the fixed Dreamcast versions have a gold star that said "Hot!" or "New!"?Correct! And the disc was red instead of yellow/gold. Also Sektor could only do 3 teleports in a combo (infinite combo in the original), Noob Saibot's 3rd costume wouldn't crash the game, and of course saving the game finally worked.

MKT lowered the "gravity" in the Greatest Hits version. In the original version, the juggling was a bit floaty, and the moves would knock people in the air a little too high. This led to some unbalanced combo's that "shouldn't" work under normal MK3 rules. Again the average player wouldn't even notice, but to an MK nerd/completist like myself it was important to have the most accurate version.

[guyver2077]

Picked it up, made a CAW.. I started looking through CAS.. the move list and entrance moves/ring moves are pretty bare (though I think you can unlock a ton), Studio Gigante gets major props because in the T-Shirt section, they have logos of EVERYTHING on your shirt, from ECW to LWO to The Outsiders to D-Generation X.. four DX logos, actually, and nWo white and red, a "Tough Enough" shirt, and so much more.

My guy's got a "bandit" mask on, jeans, and an "E C F'N W" shirt. I love this.


yea it was so awesome when i saw those nwo and dx logos...its about fucking time someone puts them in there...

yea and the base entrances suck ass

[guyver2077]

Correct! And the disc was red instead of yellow/gold. Also Sektor could only do 3 teleports in a combo (infinite combo in the original), Noob Saibot's 3rd costume wouldn't crash the game, and of course saving the game finally worked.

MKT lowered the "gravity" in the Greatest Hits version. In the original version, the juggling was a bit floaty, and the moves would knock people in the air a little too high. This led to some unbalanced combo's that "shouldn't" work under normal MK3 rules. Again the average player wouldn't even notice, but to an MK nerd/completist like myself it was important to have the most accurate version.

great to see another mk fan... i love mkt...never had that prob with n64 version...

bret hart just got speared....1...2....3...

[Scorch]

Just had a tag match in season with Booker T.. man, that was insanely fun.. this game rocks.

//edit: and then it froze when trying to load the next match. Lame. I think I might take it back.. depends on when the online portion gets up and going.

[Daywalker]

I just got this game and as a big WWE fan, this game was a BIG disappointment. AGAIN, they try to make this game TOO realistic and they forget to include the "fun" factor. The game is slow as crap, everything doesn't seem to click, I agree with the low scores. I'm beginning to miss those Smackdown games for the PS1 back then.

[Scorch]

So you got the game and judged it without getting into it.. nice. The pace in this game is NORMAL, everyone's used to the hyper speed of the Smackdown series.. oh well, to each their own (and for the record, I think SD: HCTP was, and probably still is, the king of the next gen wrestling games)

[guyver2077]

yea ive been noticing some glitches here in there....sucks that they even delayed it to clean out the kinks ...

how long is it going to take to get this patch out jesus crist...

[mykevermin]

Just had a tag match in season with Booker T.. man, that was insanely fun.. this game rocks.

//edit: and then it froze when trying to load the next match. Lame. I think I might take it back.. depends on when the online portion gets up and going.

Y'know what, dude? I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt earlier. Look at what you've written above: "this game rocks....I think I might take it back."

Sure, it loses its context, but I think I've decided that you're a priss who, while you may be subtly admitting that you were wrong about the game, feel the need to emphasize picking on other's choices instead of recognizing your own. You wanted to shit on ViolentLee's head like he'd written a review based on nothing more than looking at the boxart, and yet you've had limited (yet some) experience with the title.

Next, you're slagging on the guy below for some reason (which I don't remember). So he didn't "get into it." Please, tell me what qualifies as "getting into it."

So, the important question is this: Do you like the game now? Did you like the game then? If so (or not), why bother pissing up everyone else's skirt because you feel compelled to do so?

Do you like the game or not? Take a paxil and let us know, so we can respond accordingly next time you decide you love/dislike this title.

myke.
...Sony sent me back a PSP with one stuck pixel. Cunts.

[Scorch]

Perhaps you didn't notice the "edit" part.. that usually means something's changed. If I wanted to take it back, I'd take it back right now. I don't know where you get this whole "emphasize picking on other's choices instead of recognizing your own".. I like this game, but if it continually locks up on me, yes, I will take it back.. just because I take it back doesn't mean I don't like it. I really don't understand how you and VL think you have me so pegged over a message board.. some of you guys take this place way to seriously.. no one here should get a game based on someone else's recommendation alone.

Read the ViolentLee discussion again. I was angry because he thought his opinion was higher than everyone else's. "Limited" experience? Yeah, I guess six or seven hours is pretty limited.. right..


So, the important question is this: Do you like the game now? Did you like the game then? If so (or not), why bother pissing up everyone else's skirt because you feel compelled to do so?

..what? "Pissing up everyone else's skirt"? The hell does that mean?

Just because I return it doesn't mean I hate it.. It could mean a number of things, you just assumed that it meant I was pissed about it freezing. If I return it, it's just going to be to get the full $50 back.. i'll get it again when it's $20 or I have a modded XBox so it doesn't stutter to hell or something.

//Hour 36 begins!.. and hopefully it ends here.. god, I need sleep. Sorry if none of the above is coherent.


Next, you're slagging on the guy below for some reason (which I don't remember). So he didn't "get into it." Please, tell me what qualifies as "getting into it."

Something other than putting it in, playing one or two matches, then taking it back out.

Do you like the game or not? Take a paxil and let us know, so we can respond accordingly next time you decide you love/dislike this title.

Paxil? Paxil has fuck all to do with my feelings on the game.. it seems like you're trying too hard to take jabs at me..seriously, what the fuck is the deal.. I say it looks great but will suck, I play it, I don't think it sucks, I buy it, I play it more, it freezes, I may return it and pick it up at a later time.. why the shit is everyone flaming me? It's not like i'm saying OMG THIS GAME IS THE BEST EVER OPEN YOUR COPY BECAUSE I SAID TO.. I stressed that people should try it elsewhere before trying and not to get/open a game based on my opinion alone. So quit trying to start arguments.

[Daywalker]

I've played it for over 10 hours already and I still hate it. I dunno how much you want me to "get into it".

[mykevermin]

Perhaps you didn't notice the "edit" part.. that usually means something's changed. If I wanted to take it back, I'd take it back right now. I don't know where you get this whole "emphasize picking on other's choices instead of recognizing your own".. I like this game, but if it continually locks up on me, yes, I will take it back.. just because I take it back doesn't mean I don't like it. I really don't understand how you and VL think you have me so pegged over a message board.. some of you guys take this place way to seriously.. no one here should get a game based on someone else's recommendation alone.

Read the ViolentLee discussion again. I was angry because he thought his opinion was higher than everyone else's. "Limited" experience? Yeah, I guess six or seven hours is pretty limited.. right..



..what? "Pissing up everyone else's skirt"? The hell does that mean?

Just because I return it doesn't mean I hate it.. It could mean a number of things, you just assumed that it meant I was pissed about it freezing. If I return it, it's just going to be to get the full $50 back.. i'll get it again when it's $20 or I have a modded XBox so it doesn't stutter to hell or something.

//Hour 36 begins!.. and hopefully it ends here.. god, I need sleep. Sorry if none of the above is coherent.



Something other than putting it in, playing one or two matches, then taking it back out.



Paxil? Paxil has fuck all to do with my feelings on the game.. it seems like you're trying too hard to take jabs at me..seriously, what the fuck is the deal.. I say it looks great but will suck, I play it, I don't think it sucks, I buy it, I play it more, it freezes, I may return it and pick it up at a later time.. why the shit is everyone flaming me? It's not like i'm saying OMG THIS GAME IS THE BEST EVER OPEN YOUR COPY BECAUSE I SAID TO.. I stressed that people should try it elsewhere before trying and not to get/open a game based on my opinion alone. So quit trying to start arguments.


Here is your immediate response to daywalker's first post:

So you got the game and judged it without getting into it.. nice.

What in their post helped you think that they did not get into it.

myke.
...pleasure to meet you pot, I'm kettle. At least I have drinking as an excuse for being onery (or is it ornery? I need someone southern to help me out there).

[ViolentLee]

Regarding online in the reviews, I'll give away a little secret to you guys: It's next to impossible to rate online features in a pre-released game. We end up having to fudge a little bit in that area, because first off, debug consoles and Xbox Live don't really get along. And even if we can get on, there's rarely anyone around to play with.

What normally happens is we have to set up one-on-one sessions with someone at development. While this gives you an idea what to expect, it's not an authentic online experience. Hence the lack of talk about online in WM 21 reviews, and the amount of praise for the online component of DOA Ultimate -- which I thought was a laggy mess in actual execution.

[GenDV138]

I heard the XBL patch is finally out according to people on GamingRing and Gamefaqs, anyone try lately?

[guyver2077]

I heard the XBL patch is finally out according to people on GamingRing and Gamefaqs, anyone try lately?

i will try right now

[guyver2077]

i will try right now


YES ITS OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111 thank you god!!!!!!

pretty large update

my tags guyver2077 if anyone wants to try it out

[GenDV138]

YES ITS OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111 thank you god!!!!!!

pretty large update

my tags guyver2077 if anyone wants to try it out

Nice, let me know how it is online! I think I will pick it up tomorrow morning.

[mykevermin]

Do you download it from the dashboard, or from the in-game menu?

myke.
...hoping that gamefly is quick on the shipping.

[guyver2077]

first experience has been a horrible lag mess

you dl straight fom the game

im kinda mad theres no entrances in online mode....

[guyver2077]

Yes My First Victory!!!

Rko!!!!


kinda wack that it doesnt track like your wins or anything..

[guyver2077]

Warning!!!!! Im So Fucking Mad About This!!!


Downloading The Patch Will Erase Your Caw And Your Progress In Season Mode..


This Fucking Sucks......

[Monsta Mack]

Warning!!!!! Im So Fucking Mad About This!!!


Downloading The Patch Will Erase Your Caw And Your Progress In Season Mode..


This Fucking Sucks......

Yes it does. Just noticed this

[rvdrock]

This game has more bugs than the Amazon rain forest...

[guyver2077]

luckily goldberg doesnt take too long to create

[Monsta Mack]

The online patch deletes CAWs and what not is to prevent cheating, as all edited caws and created caws you need to sign into LIVE to make/edit. So It's understandable why this happened, but still sucks after play a good three hours of story mode yesterday. But atleast I got use to the game play.

You can even have guests (!) signed into XBox live. All modes of gameplay are in outside of Royal Rumble. One thing that irked me was no stats? Were kept track of during play, theres also no entrance or aftermath/victory screen when the match is over. Not to mention the clunky gameplay is still there, I bet people will be abusing ground submissions in due time.

Either way with the game being online and offering alot more online then SVR offered, it goes up a point in my book. But this game is STILL not worth paying more then $30 for, even if your a hardcore wrestling fan. Of course this is just my opinion, and this game is still better then any Legends of Wrestling game and slightly better then the Raw series.

Let's just hope Studio Gigante doesn't fuck up the next WM game and offers even a deeper career, better CAW and more online options.... and that they don't ship out a game that doesn't even go online on It's first day.

Edit: Removed edit. Halo 2v2 doesn't go in Monday. doh!

[Saucy Jack]

So, the patch is out, huh?

I've heard rumors that the patch also fixes a couple of freezing glitches in the game. Any truth to this? I'm not expecting it to fix anything major like collision detection, etc. but if it does indeed fix the replay problem and other related freezes, that would be awesome. :)

[Monsta Mack]

So, the patch is out, huh?

I've heard rumors that the patch also fixes a couple of freezing glitches in the game. Any truth to this? I'm not expecting it to fix anything major like collision detection, etc. but if it does indeed fix the replay problem and other related freezes, that would be awesome. :)

The patch is 100% out, I don't know if it fixes anything besides the online play. Unfortunately we will be waiting another year on the colission detection and smoother gameplay in general.

I haven't heard that it fixes freezing and what not, that would be interesting though.

[Sojeph]

This large patch helped with the game alot especially that load times and replay hiccups its smooth now. They just need to tweak the online a bit as it kind of laggy. Not bad that it took them a day to patch. Hope they can patch some more stuff about this game.

[Graystone]

The sad thing is I bought this, and want to beat everyone ass who made this game. Think legends of wrestling with a pretty face.

[Graystone]

I want to know what the fuck SG did when they delayed the game.


They pissed on it, for some reason they said why even try who cares anymore gaming is not for me. So the whole entire studio converted to a shit factoy where they make shit all day. DAMN IT I want my 53 bucks back SG

[TheRock88]

Rumors are that if you dont have Xbox Live to download the patch, then OXM may have the patch on the next issue's monthly dvd.

[Matt Young]

I'm not going to give a full review since I'm too lazy, but I'll just give some short impressions on the game. I got it Thursday night and I played matches and created a supertar or two for a good 4-5 hours, taking a 2 hour break for Smackdown. I also played a few matches this morning before I left.

In total, I've likely played 25-30 matches (My record lists 22, but I've had it freeze and not record results). I've tried out almost every match type, done some career mode, and I re-enacted just about every match from the WrestleMania 21 show, amongst many others.

I really like the game. It's not No Mercy or Fire Pro, but it's damn good. There are flaws, such as the occasional freezing before a match (happened once) and afterwards if you try to skip the replay (happened 3 times). Load times are semi-long. The game can be frustrating when the opponent keeps grappling you as soon as you get up, but I haven't lost a match or been dominated due to that.

The graphics are incredible, but you already knew that. The voice-overs in career mode are nigh-perfect. All the gimmick matches are fun to play, although it's quite disappointing that we cannot have more than 2 people in ladder, TLC, and Hell in a Cell matches.

I like this game a lot after extended play, and I think that says more than those who diss it after a short time with the game. You may like it less if you're not a huge WWE fan like me, but it's still a solid game.

Overall, I'd give WrestleMania 21 for Xbox a 7 or 7.5 out of 10. That's just comparing it to wrestling games, not all games. Fire Pro D would be a 10 and No Mercy a 9, just for comparison's sake.

I'd say maybe take 1 point off the score if you're not a huge WWE mark. I haven't tried online play yet, but I feel that it could add a point to the score and extend replay value for ages.

Now, off to play WrestleMania... on Live!

[Scorch]

Warning!!!!! Im So Fucking Mad About This!!!


Downloading The Patch Will Erase Your Caw And Your Progress In Season Mode..


This Fucking Sucks......

ARE YOU KIDDING ME!? Actually, it makes sense.. someone described it was to thwart cheaters or something.. i'll just transfer my caw onto my memory card.. (EDIT: Looks like I couldn't do that)

I went to bed at 6pm yesterday, just woke up.. how do I download the patch? I went into the game and nothing happened... there it goes, nevermind, downloading now

Friend request deployed to Matt, Guyver, what's your XBL name?

[Matt Young]

I just played 4 matches online against Scorch- Bret Hart vs. Shawn Michaels in a TLC match, Matt Hardy vs. Edge in Hell in a Cell, Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio, and Lita vs. Trish in a Bra and panties match. I was the wrestler listed first in each match.

All the matches ended up in draws (they really need to change the 10 minute time limit) and there was noticeable lag, but it was ridiculously fun. I love online wrestling.

On a random note, why does everyone who has seen my pic ask if I'm using a voice mask online? It's not that deep. :-P

Anyway... Guyver, we need to have a Bret Hart vs. Goldberg match sometime. Also, when will we have an official CAG Championship and maybe league?

[upsslave]

i have the game i dont listen to reviews i only trust my self and i like the game

[Scorch]

Yeah, it was ridiculously fun playing against MY. I went to make a CAG belt.. holy shit, there's like 81723486123846129837468923649812364 belt combinations -- there's even the million dollar belt! Anyways, yeah, there's a noticible lag between moves on Live, but after about three or four minutes, you definately get used to it.

[Mr_hockey66]

I thought the game was terrible. Good gaphics and actual voices that this game has going for it. Its glitchy, slow paced, out dated, week roster, you can't use custom music, you have to create a wrestler for season mode, you can't edit the wrestlers, you can only pick the superstars entrences and mix between them, once they knock you down they keep beating you, if you try to stand up you just keep rolling on the matt.

In other words this game is utter crap! I baught it day one and returned it the very next day at store opeing! Thq needs to be slapped for this! Guess its still smackdown here comes the pain for me! Hell I'd rather play wcw vs nwo on 64 then play this garbage. Well the good news is that you will be able to pick it up for under ten real soon!

[Scorch]

Its glitchy, slow paced, out dated, week roster, you can't use custom music, you have to create a wrestler for season mode, you can't edit the wrestlers, you can only pick the superstars entrences and mix between them, once they knock you down they keep beating you, if you try to stand up you just keep rolling on the matt.

90% of the glitches were fixed by the patch, "out dated" and "weak roster" are kinda the same, yes you can use custom music (You have to unlock the ability to, you can use custom music for CAW's anytime), of course you have to play season with a CAW, that's why it says "become a legend", you unlock more entrances as you go along, and hit Y to stand up instead of rolling around with the joystick.

[Superstar]

The game is really fun online, more fun then I expected. Also, I love how the patch fixed most of the glitches. I am very happy with the game

[CheapyD]

Does it really not keep your online W-L? Did the patch "fix" that?

[Matt Young]

No, Cheapy. Your profile keeps track of overall wins and losses, online and off, but there's no leaderboard or win/loss/draw/drop/quit stats on Live. That sucks, since you never no if someone quits a lot, but between CAG, GameFAQs, Gaming Ring, and The Smart Marks, I shouldn't have a problem finding quality, non-quitting opposition.

[Scorch]

And all matches have a ten minute time limit on Live. That kinda sucks. But other than that.. yeah, it's great.

Guyver, you suck for not responding to the invites! Matt and I were waiting, we were going to have a nice triple threat match with you!