Selling Xbox 360s / Becoming the ultimate bastard.

[fatherofcaitlyn]

<Disclaimer> My wife poo pooed this idea. So, I probably won't do it even if everybody here thinks it's the best idea ever. </Disclaimer>

It is simply against my nature to ignore idiots paying double retail for an item.

I want to sell Xbox 360s, but I didn't do any hoarding legwork in April (or whatever month the real cutoff date for preorders was). So, I don't have any consoles for sale.

Here's my idea: sell Xbox 360s with guaranteed delivery by Christmas or your money back.

Yes, that's selling Xbox 360s I don't own this week in the hope that M$ will flood the market within a week or two of Christmas.

Here're my justifications:

1. Ebay allows selling of preorder items to be listed within 30 days of sale. (Yes, I know the 360 isn't a preorder item anymore, but they aren't exactly available for purchase either.)

2. I'm only "borrowing" money in the short run. If I can't find a 360, the buyer gets all of his/her money back.

3. Every online retailer is doing the same thing if not worse. How many of you purchased a 360 from Best Buy online only to be told that your console will reach you in January?

Yes, all of the justifications are weak.

So, what's the consensus on this idea?

Will it land me in the same region of hell as bostonfrontier?

OR

Is it a just way of taking advantage of stupid people with too much disposable income?

[TimPV3]

Interesting idea, but you'll get a lot of shit if you don't find one and have to give somebody all of their money back after or right before Christmas when shopping is a bitch because you couldn't find/ship them an Xbox in time.

[worx]

bostonfrontier belongs in a special section of hell - although I didn't know he was doing anything on eBay :-s

but it sounds on the level as long as you're upfront about it - i.e. letting them know from the begining that they may not receive it (after all EB and GameStop did this) and if you set a date that they would ship by so there would still be a chance for them to buy something else with the money.

[fatherofcaitlyn]

Here's what the conversation with the wife about this sounded like:

<conversation>

Me: I was thinking about selling 360s on eBay with guaranteed delivery by Christmas.

Wife: You don't have any 360s to sell.

Me: Yes, but I figure I could find some before Christmas.

Wife: You've never had any luck selling something you don't already have.

Me: Rumor has it there won't be any shortage by Christmas. If I sell now, I get all of the high demand money and I'll be able to purchase for retail within a few weeks.

Wife: It's not going to work. Don't sell something unless you already have it to sell.

</conversation>

So, I'm not really gung ho about doing this.

[wubb]

What you describe would technically be against eBay's rules:

"The seller must guarantee that the item will be available for shipping within 30 days from the date of purchase "

You would be admitting in the listing itself that there is no guarantee.

[fatherofcaitlyn]

What you describe would technically be against eBay's rules:

"The seller must guarantee that the item will be available for shipping within 30 days from the date of purchase "

You would be admitting in the listing itself that there is no guarantee.

Yes, it is against the rules, but it has to be enforced.

To enforce it ...

1. Person has to find the listing. Not too hard unless I create another eBay userid.

2. Person from 1 has to report the listing as violating the rules.

3. Ebay has agree with Person from 1.

4. Since I'd use a fixed price listing, Ebay has to yank the listing before Somebody buys the thing.

To stop the process at step 3, the listing could read:

<listing>

Up for purchase is the Microsoft Xbox 360.

This is a <core/premium> system <with <accessories> <and> <games>>.

I guarantee delivery by Christmas or your money back on December 23rd.

<more bait for people with too much money>

<stock pictures of system>

<enormous price tag>

</listing>

If I start the listing on November 25th or later, I have that window to find and to send the item.

I agree that the whole idea is dishonest, but when the buyer sees the joy in little Jimmy's eyes, said middle aged idiot won't care that I screwed him/her for $400.

It's like that "Homer the Clown" episode of the Simpsons:

Marge: I'm not saying it won't work. I'm just saying it's sleazy.

Homer (dressed as Krusty): Then, if we agree, why are we arguing?

[MightySlacker]

If you are willing to take a flood of negs, chargebacks and death threats, then go for it. Although if you believe in karma, this could be tricky. The least you could do is camp out at a place if you find out when their second shipment is coming in. If you don't put in an above-average effort to fill the orders, then prepare to be hit by a train. In broad daylight. 10 miles away from any railroad tracks.

Dave

[Snake2715]

Also you may want to word it a little differently.... say you do indeed pull it off and get them shipped...

Buy Buyer X CLAIMS they never received it by Xmas... then it reads that even if they do get it after Xmas you will refund the money...

Or lets say you do ship it and the buyer gets it after xmas as it was a shippers fault... Are you prepared to give a full refund like stated?

[dbiersdorf]

Yeah dude face it you missed the window of opprotunity. If you didn't take the effort to preorder, or at the least go at a midnight opening for some left overs, that's your own fault. Don't bring down others by hoping to get them a system. You're going to find some mom or dad buying your auction and their 10 year old boy will keeping asking, "will Santa bring me an Xbox 360!?", and then low and behold you don't get one, parents are pissed and the kid is disappointed.

It's your own fault, give it up already. You still can get in on the goods with the PS3 and Revolution.

[fatherofcaitlyn]

Although if you believe in karma, this could be tricky. ... If you don't put in an above-average effort to fill the orders, then prepare to be hit by a train. In broad daylight. 10 miles away from any railroad tracks.

Dave

:lol: That made me laugh. Could you see the CSI episode based on my death?

Marg/Whatever her name is (bearer of the sweetest ass on a 50 year old woman): How did the vic die?

Grissom: The cosmos did it. He was just that big of an asshole.

No, I'll start snooping around today after my daughter is done watching "Toy Story".

(Sane) People are not going to camp out for the second shipment because there is no telling when the second shipment to arrive. It's a 1 week time frame.

Hopefully, demand will hold out until after 360s are vaguely plentiful. (Read: you can find one if you look 10 or 15 places.)

I certainly wasn't going to stand in line for 10 hours at the local Wal-Mart just to score $300. Company was coming in. I didn't want to give the wife 10 hours to pack my bags and chuck them to the curb.

[SkyGheNe]

Microsoft won't flood the market in time for christmas.

[thagoat]

you are a truly evil and shady man. you're perfect for ebay!

[Radioactive_Man]

you are a truly evil and shady man. you're perfect for ebay!

his avatar also fits that bill.

"excellent"

[b3b0p]

You can do it, but don't expect it to work like you plan.

If you take the persons money, then prices come to reality and stock is abundant enough, they will probably want their money back if they don't have their unit yet. What will you do in this situation?

What if the person is at the local Super Wally-World getting groceries and they just so happen to have a system in stock? What will you do in this situation (assuming they buy it)?


Too many variables. Too many things can go wrong. And taking someones money without the product is just wrong. Seems sleezy.

I think it is a dumb idea and probably about gazilion others are doing it right now.

xboxlicksballs will probably not like the idea either.

[fatbeer]

You better hope, your not next charlie wenzel #2.

[mtxbass1]

fatherofcaitlyn, you are already the ultimate bastard. No reason to increase your stronghold on your bastardness.

ikik ;)

[fatherofcaitlyn]

fatherofcaitlyn, you are already the ultimate bastard. No reason to increase your stronghold on your bastardness.

ikik ;)

1. :lol: There's my boy! I've missed you threadcrapping my posts. I hope all has been well with you and yours.

2. Bostonfrontier has made significant strides in becoming CAG's resident bastard. Who knew asking "any update yet?" at 9AM EST every day in the EB morning update thread and a few homophobic comments would get you the crown. I don't even think the guy "hoards".

3. Apparently, being an easy and honest guy to trade with and giving large bumps to CAG auctions days before they end improves your reputation around here.

;)

[Apossum]

That's pretty risky and face it-- you missed the opportunity.

On top of that, there are so many other people who can deliver 360's, so I don't think anyone will be that interested in a pre-order that the seller can't guarantee (although "Guaranteed" in big letters with small print "or your money back" might trick a few of the less perceptive types.)

[dhrez]

What happens when there is no flood of 360s before Christmas? Then you're really screwed.

[fatherofcaitlyn]

Update:

I bebopped down to the local mall's Radio Shack.

They hadn't got any in, but they took my name down. Fifth on the list with no money down. It's a $750 bundle with 5 games, but I bet I can dump it for $1500 after I get the call. I've heard reports of 360s alone going for $1200 and $1750.

Preordering a 360 with $50 down at Game Crazy back in September really paid off. Over there, I'm 56th on the list. For some reason, M$ was feeding GC the line of crap that GC was still on its first allocation.

[fatherofcaitlyn]

That's pretty risky and face it-- you missed the opportunity.


<Warning> This post contains your daily serving of math. </Warning>

Let's analyze the risk of this idiotic venture.

Since I use fixed-price listings, I would attempt to sell a 360 for $1000.

How much does it cost to sell this item?

Ebay's listing fee is $4.80.

If it sells, Ebay's final value fees for a $1000 item are $28.12.

http://pages.ebay.com/help/sell/fees.html

That's a cost of $32.92. Mathematically, it's -$32.92.

Before anybody says I'm forgetting Paypal, Paypal refunds its cut when money is refunded. So, :-P.

Ebay's FVF is also refundable IF the buyer and seller agree via an Unpaid Item dispute that they no longer complete the transaction, but that's pushing it.

How much profit can be made from the sale?

You make $1000 gross from the sale.

In KY, a premium 360 without any bundled accessories is $424 after tax.

That's $576 leftover.

Subtract eBay's cuts (rounded up) and you're left with $543.

Subtract Paypal's 2.9% and 30 cents and there is $513 left.

I don't know how much a 360 weighs, but I'm guessing it's nearly 20 pounds. The original Xbox console is 12 lbs. Controllers is 1 lb. I hear the 360 has an external power supply that weighs about 3 lbs. Fair enough? On top of that, let's rule out international shipping.

Express Mail for 20 lbs. from where I live to 90210 is $53.45. Rounded up, that's $459 left over profit. Express mail provides both delivery confirmation and signature confirmation. A chargeback just isn't going to happen. Even if the customer tries it, you give Paypal the info and your money is going nowhere.

The box, tape and bubble wrap can be bought at the post office for $10 or less.

For the hell of it, let's add an additional $1000 of insurance. Off the top of my head, I know it is less than $15.

That's a profit of $444. Mathematically, it's $444.

Let's set up the equation to determine profitability.

$444P + (-32.92)Q = 0

P = probability of finding a 360 before December 20th
Q = probability of not finding a 360 before December 20th or 1 - P

Here goes the algebra:

$444P = $32.92Q

$444P/$32.92 = Q which is roughly

13.48P = Q or 13.48P = 1 - P Since Q = 1 - P

More algebra:

14.48P = 1

Divide both sides by 14.48 to get

P = 0.069.

Anybody's head hurting yet? Mine is, but I have enough left on the brain to explain the results.

If I am able to complete a mere 7% of the 360 orders I take, I make a profit.

If anybody finds an error in my calculations, don't hesitate to point it out.

[thespillcanvas]

I certainly wasn't going to stand in line for 10 hours at the local Wal-Mart just to score $300. Company was coming in. I didn't want to give the wife 10 hours to pack my bags and chuck them to the curb.
Your wife will kick you out for camping out for a 360 quicker than she will for this idea? ;)

[Apossum]

:rofl: I meant risky as in, no one will want to do it and you run the risk of getting negs from the people who didn't read or understand the terms of your auction.
Also, I don't think premiums are going for a grand anymore...

[fatherofcaitlyn]

Also, I don't think premiums are going for a grand anymore...

This isn't my auction. (I haven't posted an auction yet.)

http://cgi.ebay.com/Microsoft-Xbox-360-Premium-Console_W0QQitemZ8236808768QQcategoryZ62054QQrdZ1Q QcmdZViewItem

That's $1085 for a premium with 1 game ending about 20 minutes ago.

AND

The goods are en route to the seller.

[fatherofcaitlyn]

no one will want to do it and you run the risk of getting negs from the people who didn't read or understand the terms of your auction.

Agreed. I really don't want to ruin my eBay account. I almost have 1500 in feedback.

However, you can stipulate "no negative feedback" in your auction. It's a huge red flag, but the idea is to take advantage of people who can't read thoroughly. What's another red flag when the auction already has 3 or 4?

[jlarlee]

I bet if you said console guaranteed delivered before Dec. 23 2006 someone would fall for it

[fatherofcaitlyn]

Your wife will kick you out for camping out for a 360 quicker than she will for this idea? ;)

No, she hated this idea, too.

[fatherofcaitlyn]

I bet if you said console guaranteed delivered before Dec. 23 2006 someone would fall for it

:lol:

:applause: That's brilliant!

Response to Paypal "Item Not Received" complaint: I still have 11 months to make delivery!

[Apossum]

Agreed. I really don't want to ruin my eBay account. I almost have 1500 in feedback.

However, you can stipulate "no negative feedback" in your auction. It's a huge red flag, but the idea is to take advantage of people who can't read thoroughly. What's another red flag when the auction already has 3 or 4?

:lol:

[gopro]

:lol:

:applause: That's brilliant!

Response to Paypal "Item Not Received" complaint: I still have 11 months to make delivery!

LOL, if I had a 60 feedback from paypal and 98% positive then I would do this but unfortunetly I only have 24 FB with 2 negs. So yea, you should do this.