Originally Posted by dan77733 10) Missions/chapters, etc. that require online play even though the single player story does not. Lone example is the prologue in Splinter Cell Conviction. Wanted to play it but dont play online and have no freinds that care about SCC so im stuck. Why you couldnt control Archer (or Kestrel) and have the CPU AI control the other guy is beyond me. See how this gen has taken away the focus from single player games to online, online, its all online?

Out of all the reasons you listed, THIS is the most on spot one why gaming will be dead to me after this generation wraps. Actually, it already pretty much is dead to me right now.

Ever since Call of Duty became a "cool" mainstream cashcow, every company in existance has to shoe-horn online and online only co-op into every single game imaginable, at the EXPENSE of the single player experience (cough cough Mass Effect 3 for God's sake cough cough). All that online rubbish takes up valueable disc space that could have been used to make the single player longer and better.

Originally Posted by RaidenMGS3 Out of all the reasons you listed, THIS is the most on spot one why gaming will be dead to me after this generation wraps. Actually, it already pretty much is dead to me right now. Ever since Call of Duty became a "cool" mainstream cashcow, every company in existance has to shoe-horn online and online only co-op into every single game imaginable, at the EXPENSE of the single player experience (cough cough Mass Effect 3 for God's sake cough cough). All that online rubbish takes up valueable disc space that could have been used to make the single player longer and better.

armored core is another tradegy of this armored core 5 im enjoying it but the hire CPU mercs is greyed out for all but the online part of the game. and some story mode missions are downright insane to do solo.

Originally Posted by kit352 Anyone grab one yet? Id like to see some initial thoughts on it.

Didn't realize there was a thread for this. I got mine Sunday and have pretty much just been downloading all my PSN purchases and PS+ freebies. I haven't even tried putting a disc in yet. I'm not even sure how it opens/closes. It seems to have a button that pops it open, but doesn't close it? I dunno - will check it out some time though . The button is just sort of the left side of the front of the system and does seem pretty cheesy (the whole "bar" with the PS logo pushes in on one side only and as such doesn't feel like a button at all).

All in all, I probably prefer the regular Slim. It is definitely an improvement over the fat system I replaced though. It is whisper quiet and I can already tell it puts out WAY less heat. It isn't hot to the touch even after being on all day downloading games. And the room it is in used to get really hot with the old system in there and isn't doing that any more.

All of that combined with the GS trade-in deal on my old system ($180) plus the slightly increased storage (160 GB -> 250 GB), not to mention the UC3 GotY made it well worth it. My main PS3 is a slim that I put a 750GB HD in. But this 250 is mostly for my son and can hold all the games he wants. With the 160 I had to pick and choose - that 90 makes a huge difference (as that is an increase in actual usable space). He was missing out on a lot of games we had in our purchase history because I couldn't fit them on the old system.

Not sure Mass Effect 3 is the best example only because the online component is actually fun and well supported. Now Dead Space 2 had an absolutely horrible MP. I get the point though.

Most games are short nowadays. I'm glad I'm able to wait until the GOTY version is out, or the game is super cheap. I hate the online aspect of games too. Most of my friends don't play the same games that I do so I prefer not to play with random people online. I do love co-op games though. My girl and I just finished Ratchet and Clank All 4 One, and Rayman. Simply amazing games. The other thing I don't like about this generation is that more single player content isn't added to the games I enjoy. Like any of the Uncharted games, I'd love if I could do a few more missions but it's all online based content. I honestly think the only way I'm buying the next generation of consoles is if they support full backwards compatibility. I have you many games that I need to finish. Time will tell though.

Originally Posted by JP73 Are you sure about this? because everything I have seen and read suggests that it is noticeably louder, particularly the disc drive nosies, than the 3000 model released last year. I hope you're right, though, but I just seem to be getting some conflicting information

It's quiet - I didn't notice any significant drive noise when playing a few games yesterday. The soft plastic issue is a bigger deal for me, honestly. you can just run your finger nail across it (not even pressing down hard) and it will permanently mark up the top (the shiny plastic piece in the front and back of the top).

Originally Posted by TooPoor ^didnt read your whole post, only point number one. I assume most CAGs spend minimum amount (if not negative) of money playing games. I have never purchased any (yes, any) DLC in my life, I refuse to fuel this business model.

Considering how much DLC there is available, I havent purchased that much. Bought Enslaved, Mafia 2 DLC add-ons, Renegade Ops and SCC. It seems like its more than what it is. If you're getting at least 10+ hours of new content for $10 or less, then I dont mind paying if its good. But just for an hour or so is no good. I guess im more 50/50 on DLC but I would eliminate it 100% if it was entirely up to me. A game like Outland is a 2D platforming classic for $10 and NO DLC whatsoever. Thats the way it should be.

As for money spent on games, I would probably be retired if I knew how much I spent in my life time. And majority of the time, I dont regret spending the money on games as long as I know im going to enjoy it. I bought RE 6 but sold it on ebay for $61 sealed. Add in the $20 credit for BB thats I'll get and even after ebay/paypal fees, I'll still make a profit.

Originally Posted by RaidenMGS3 Out of all the reasons you listed, THIS is the most on spot one why gaming will be dead to me after this generation wraps. Actually, it already pretty much is dead to me right now. Ever since Call of Duty became a "cool" mainstream cashcow, every company in existance has to shoe-horn online and online only co-op into every single game imaginable, at the EXPENSE of the single player experience (cough cough Mass Effect 3 for God's sake cough cough). All that online rubbish takes up valueable disc space that could have been used to make the single player longer and better.

Single player games are becoming obsolete more and more. As long as there's millions of people who pay to play online, no reason for single player games or disc based games.

I said it back in 2002 when I first purchased NFL 2K3 and downloaded the roster update. As great as that was at the time, I knew it was going to be the reason why I would eventually quit gaming.

Originally Posted by dan77733 Anyway, thats pretty much it. Sorry for the long ass book but you said you were curious. LOL.

No worries, I asked for it! You actually had a lot of well-thought out reasons, and a lot of it comes down to personal preference, which I can't dispute. If I may play devil's advocate on a few of your points, though:

#1- Games have been $50+ for a long time. I remember NES games were $50, and most of them could be beat within a few hours or less.

#2- I personally don't think we'll be looking at JUST digital downloads for a long, long time. The last time I looked up the stats, something like 20% of the United States does not have access to broadband internet (even if they wanted to have it), mostly in rural areas. Furthermore, if they stop selling games in stores, stores will stop carrying their systems. Whichever system became the first to do so would have to have massive balls, because if (for instance) MS decided to go all digital and Wal-Mart said "eff you then, we're not selling your systems if you won't have us selling your games", it would be a massive advantage to Sony.

#3- That's another thing I don't see happening, at least not in the next generation of games.

As far as the extra stuff (achievements, entertainment apps, DLC) I would say that you don't have to participate if you don't want to. Of course, with achievements you have no choice...I guess you can turn off alerts so it doesn't interrupt your gaming, but you will still be earning them regardless. And yeah, it sucks when story-based DLC comes out which is overpriced, but I personally just don't buy stuff on Day 1. Even stuff like Dawnguard I will just wait on until it's on sale.

As far as game length, like I said, I remember the NES days of paying $50 for a 2-3 hour game (or at least, having your parents pay that much, ha ha). I'm always surprised when people say that games today don't have the value that they used to, since with every generation they have gotten longer and longer while prices have stayed right around $50-60.

Anyway though, a lot of your points are very good ones (I miss manuals, too!) and many of them are about personal preference- which is "to each their own" territory. Thanks for taking the time to reply.

Originally Posted by akathatoneguy No worries, I asked for it! You actually had a lot of well-thought out reasons, and a lot of it comes down to personal preference, which I can't dispute. If I may play devil's advocate on a few of your points, though: #1- Games have been $50+ for a long time. I remember NES games were $50, and most of them could be beat within a few hours or less.

Some of the N64 games were $80... Also there was no ongoing development costs/patches.

Originally Posted by io Didn't realize there was a thread for this. I got mine Sunday and have pretty much just been downloading all my PSN purchases and PS+ freebies. I haven't even tried putting a disc in yet. I'm not even sure how it opens/closes. It seems to have a button that pops it open, but doesn't close it? I dunno - will check it out some time though . The button is just sort of the left side of the front of the system and does seem pretty cheesy (the whole "bar" with the PS logo pushes in on one side only and as such doesn't feel like a button at all).

io...I was just wondering what your impressions are of the slide out tray on your new UC3 system??

I am debating trading in my fat 80GB and upgrading to this or the AC III system but for some reasion this slide out tray is a real sticking point for me.

It's probably because I have never had any problems with the 80GB system I have now and had to replace my Phat PS2 twice because of silde out tray malfunction issues...anyways I'm just a little wary of the slide out tray and respect your opinion...

thanks

It's not actually a slide out tray. The cover on top slides over to the left side.

Originally Posted by akathatoneguy No worries, I asked for it! You actually had a lot of well-thought out reasons, and a lot of it comes down to personal preference, which I can't dispute. If I may play devil's advocate on a few of your points, though: #1- Games have been $50+ for a long time. I remember NES games were $50, and most of them could be beat within a few hours or less. #2- I personally don't think we'll be looking at JUST digital downloads for a long, long time. The last time I looked up the stats, something like 20% of the United States does not have access to broadband internet (even if they wanted to have it), mostly in rural areas. Furthermore, if they stop selling games in stores, stores will stop carrying their systems. Whichever system became the first to do so would have to have massive balls, because if (for instance) MS decided to go all digital and Wal-Mart said "eff you then, we're not selling your systems if you won't have us selling your games", it would be a massive advantage to Sony. #3- That's another thing I don't see happening, at least not in the next generation of games. As far as the extra stuff (achievements, entertainment apps, DLC) I would say that you don't have to participate if you don't want to. Of course, with achievements you have no choice...I guess you can turn off alerts so it doesn't interrupt your gaming, but you will still be earning them regardless. And yeah, it sucks when story-based DLC comes out which is overpriced, but I personally just don't buy stuff on Day 1. Even stuff like Dawnguard I will just wait on until it's on sale. As far as game length, like I said, I remember the NES days of paying $50 for a 2-3 hour game (or at least, having your parents pay that much, ha ha). I'm always surprised when people say that games today don't have the value that they used to, since with every generation they have gotten longer and longer while prices have stayed right around $50-60. Anyway though, a lot of your points are very good ones (I miss manuals, too!) and many of them are about personal preference- which is "to each their own" territory. Thanks for taking the time to reply.

1 - Agree 100% but considering the technology, the console's power, resources, etc., it just feels like you're paying more for less. Maybe, its because of all the DLC, Complete/GOTY/Gold editions, etc. It just feels like as a consumer im paying more but getting less. Its probably just me but I do agree with what you said.

2 - Agree in regards to say, Microsoft going all digital but not Sony or vice versa but I think that there's still a chance that it could happen with Xbox 3 and PS4 because when you actually make a list of positives and negatives, the positives far outweigh the negatives for Sony, Microsoft and developers/publishers. If not next gen, then 100% with Xbox 4 and PS5.

By going all digital, the cost is dramatically reduced for the companies in so many ways. No manufacturing (except consoles) of discs, cases, no printing of manuals, no distribution costs, etc. Then add in that in order to play the game, you simply buy it at full price or you dont. Companies would never ever have to reduce the prices of the games because there would be no reason for them to do so. It would eliminate them losing money from someone buying a used game instead of brand new.

With games being focused more on online gameplay day by day, the reality of companies going all digital is getting closer and closer. Look at Sony, they have that "day one digital" promotion or whatever its called. People will buy the available games via DD.

As for stores not carrying consoles, it wouldnt matter because with online, you can easily order via your PC and never leave your house. As for the 20% that dont have access to broadband internet/Fios/Optimum, etc., it wouldnt matter to the companies because the money saved from going all digital at worse for them, breaks even.

The number one focus on gaming nowadays is online. There's a reason for that. Companies, developers and publishers know what they're doing. They're basically preparing everyone for when the day does come that gaming goes all digital.

The worse thing that I hate about gamertags is with online passes and downloading roster updates, they can only be used on the gamertag that downloaded them. You can play DLC and the games using different gamertags because the content is licensed to the console, not the gamertag but in those other instances, its the opposite.

As for games nowadays not having the value, the cost of the actual game $50 to $60 between the NES days and now are the same and while the games nowadays have far superior visuals, etc., that doesnt make them better or more valuable than the old school games. Take any game from this generation, keep it sealed as a collector's item and there's still no way that it would be half of the value of an factory sealed SNES classic like Chrono Trigger.

In twenty years from now, this generation of games will at most be worth the same price now where as old classics will still be worth more. So while the technology and whatnot have advanced a lot, the games nowadays just dont hold that "I have to keep this game forever" sentimental feeling.

A lot of it is own personal opinion. I used to be a hardcore gamer back in the day. Now, im casual. The games themselves are still for the most part fun, entertaining and enjoyable but everything else around the games arent.

Anyway, like you said, "to each his/her own". I'm not speaking for anyone but me but I personally will be done with gaming once 360/PS3 is dead. My interest is nowhere near what it used to be and more stuff that I prefer gets taken away, the more my interest becomes less and less.

In the end, im in the minority who prefers the SNES/GEN era out of them all. But again, to each his/her own.

Stores don't carry any software for Ipad or Kindle, but will carry them to bring people to the store. Remember the markup is much higher on accessories than games.

Amazon has a decent deal on the 320 gb Original Slim right now, for anyone who wants that version.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...pf_rd_i=468642
http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/...1#post10024471

Originally Posted by dan77733 2014 is my guess for Xbox 3 and PS4. Once this generation dies, I'll sell off my 360 and PS3 and just stick with my slim PS2 and probably buy back an SNES. The reasons are simple actually - Anyway, thats pretty much it. Sorry for the long ass book but you said you were curious. LOL.

Looking at your points,
1) Completely agree, and I think costs will continue to go up and many will stop playing games because of it. Then there will also be free to play which will be good for some stuff but will be abused by publishers and people will first gravitate to it and then find out later how much of a rip off it is.

2) Agree Sony will probably charge for online and at some point Nintendo too. XBLive cost will increase. Publishers will continue to do things to charge like that COD Elite and BF 3 Premium crap, more publishers will get in on it. But you won't see digital download only until the generation after PS4, if there is one and not just cloud gaming on PS4 generation hardware. Even when there is digital only we will see sales because there will be competition in different games and hopefully enough different devices to play on.

3 & 4 & 5) Ya that sucks. I think we'll see more achievement type modern gaming ideas next gen. DLC is the biggest rip off in gaming. The only good stuff is the expansion pack type content and even then it sucks because you can't sell it. Once in a blue moon there's something small that is actually worth it, until you stop playing that game of course.

I usually never buy DLC, hold out for the GOTY editions, but then gaming isn't as fun because you have to wait years and then you lose interest because nobody plays the game anymore or talks about it. Or a game that was once AAA gets surpassed in graphics, gameplay, etc from a newer game. Then there's EA who usually don't bundle their DLC on disc.

6) Don't mind the extra stuff, but it is stupid that you're basically paying more on 360 and will overtime to access it. Hope that part remains free on PS4.

7 Amen Unfortunately, IMHO only Sony really cares about core gaming on consoles anymore. And since they're doing so bad they may eventually have to abandon that and start doing casual more than anything else. Maybe. Unless core gamers can unite behind PS4 as THE core console next gen while Nintendo and MS stay how they are currently.

1) The good thing is you'll see more and more of that with even larger budgets, but you'll also see prices rise to where XBLA/PSN games will have many be or even the norm be $20. Cash for in game coins lol, the future will bring a lot more of that with the free-to-play games but those will actually be Pay-to-Play where you'll have to grind for hours unless you pay up.

Originally Posted by io Didn't realize there was a thread for this. I got mine Sunday and have pretty much just been downloading all my PSN purchases and PS+ freebies. I haven't even tried putting a disc in yet. I'm not even sure how it opens/closes. It seems to have a button that pops it open, but doesn't close it? I dunno - will check it out some time though . The button is just sort of the left side of the front of the system and does seem pretty cheesy (the whole "bar" with the PS logo pushes in on one side only and as such doesn't feel like a button at all).

I was under the impression the button to open the drive is only mechanical parts - not electronic, thus the reason for not being able to close.

Originally Posted by CheapAssHustla The other thing I don't like about this generation is that more single player content isn't added to the games I enjoy. Like any of the Uncharted games, I'd love if I could do a few more missions but it's all online based content. I honestly think the only way I'm buying the next generation of consoles is if they support full backwards compatibility. I have you many games that I need to finish. Time will tell though.

No no no please don't tell developers you want single player based DLC. They will chop the game up into pieces and you'll have to pay for the ending. PS4 will not be BC due to the CPU being too different from the Cell CPU unless they do it through software. 720 maybe but it's MS so they will probably prefer to resell to you too.

Once this generation dies, I'll sell off my 360 and PS3 and just stick with my slim PS2 and probably buy back an SNES. The reasons are simple actually -

lol what. so you played this gen and enjoyed it enough to buy multiple systems but once it ends you will just sell the systems and live 10-20 years in the past?

i really dont get that.

Originally Posted by lewchief It's not actually a slide out tray. The cover on top slides over to the left side.

Yep, and it is a little on the cheesy side. It opens automatically if you push the left side of the little bar (with the PS logo on the front). But it doesn't seem to close automatically. I'm guessing the opening is just spring-loaded and not mechanical so that's why it only works one way. To close it, you have to slide it, and it sort of catches near the end and you have to force it past that to close it completely. It definitely doesn't seem very sturdy in that regard. However, the lack of a slot or tray-loading mechanism will probably mean it is actually more durable than previous PS3 models.

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Originally Posted by kayne2000 lol what. so you played this gen and enjoyed it enough to buy multiple systems but once it ends you will just sell the systems and live 10-20 years in the past? i really dont get that.

This gen is good, but gaming really is going downhill. DLC, online passes, bugs/patches, same generic games over and over. I can understand why someone wouldn't want to get a next gen console, as I probably won't either. I'm definitely keeping my PS3 though.

Originally Posted by roundhouse This gen is good, but gaming really is going downhill. DLC, online passes, bugs/patches, same generic games over and over. I can understand why someone wouldn't want to get a next gen console, as I probably won't either. I'm definitely keeping my PS3 though.

yea i could understand not wanting a next gen console especially if they have a huge backlog or finances or just losing interest for whatever reason but selling your current systems and going back to the nes era and ps2 era? that part i dont get.

while i do see some issues with this current generation of gaming i dont find it to be worse than the previous one....i do admit i miss days where i was teenager and gaming was one massive social event as opposed to now.

Definitely trading in my little brothers fat Ps3 at gs, but not sure if I should get him a slim or a sup slim. I've had my slim over a year and the only problems I've had are weird occasional noises and a rare freeze up here and there.

Originally Posted by kayne2000 lol what. so you played this gen and enjoyed it enough to buy multiple systems but once it ends you will just sell the systems and live 10-20 years in the past? i really dont get that.

I actually thought about doing it at one point. It's kinda hard to explain, but it seemed like a good idea at the time. Best way to explain it is to sort of compare it to some older people and music. Regardless of the fact that there are now MP3 players and before that CDs, there was just something about having old records and a record player that you wanted to hang on to forever. Even if your same old music had been remastered and now sounds cleaner than ever, you simply don't want to have anything to do with it and just want your records. I guess it's a way of holding on to your youth.