Originally Posted by ID2006 There's evidence to suggest that permitting private ownership of guns isn't the problem. It's part US culture and part personal accountability (along with a lot of nuance) that ultimately foster gun violence. There are countries with both more and less gun control that have lower crime rates than the USA.

Would it be wrong for me to conclude that the more culturally stable countries are more deserving of gun rights than the USA?

Originally Posted by 120fps Would it be wrong for me to conclude that the more culturally stable countries are more deserving of gun rights than the USA?

How do you sell the argument to the American people, then? Just curious, since outright banning is not going to happen if they don't accept it.

But, culture is part (and only part) of the problem.

Originally Posted by ID2006 How do you sell the argument to the American people, then? Just curious, since outright banning is not going to happen if they don't accept it. But, culture is part (and only part) of the problem.

Abortion was legalized before people were technically ready for it so why would banning guns be any different? What we need is stronger leadership and more passion on the left.

Originally Posted by 120fps Abortion was legalized before people were technically ready for it so why would banning guns be any different? What we need is stronger leadership and more passion on the left.

With abortion, they were protecting a freedom, and they were reinforcing that right. Taking away guns is removing a freedom embedded in this country's foundation and its constitution. It's got much stronger standing and history and much larger support on both sides.

Beside that, you need some statistics to back things up. What was the opposition to abortion? Mostly religious. Guns aren't tangled with religion like abortion, so it's quite a different story.

Also, you should keep in mind that being a Democrat does not mean being for the banning of guns. There are plenty of Democrats in the House (and probably Senate) that support the existence of the 2nd Amendment, even if they also support gun control. It's not black or white for Democratic party.

Originally Posted by ID2006 There's evidence to suggest that permitting private ownership of guns isn't the problem. It's part US culture and part personal accountability (along with a lot of nuance) that ultimately foster gun violence. There are countries with both more and less gun control that have lower crime rates than the USA.

For a country born out of violence I guess we can't expect much more. Then again, this is 2013, you'd think by now people would have put the revolutionary war behind them.

Don't feel like reading the whole thread but just thought I'd share. Hillsborough county in Florida (around Tampa) is putting an armed guard in every elementary school. Around 150 of them

I love that "conservatives" want armed guards posted in schools. You can't make this shit up.

Originally Posted by willardhaven You can't make this shit up.

The modern GOP slogan.

Originally Posted by willardhaven I love that "conservatives" want armed guards posted in schools. You can't make this shit up.

Aside from the obvious totalitarian aspects of it, there's also the obscene cost this would carry...

The super right don't actually want "armed guards" in schools, that costs money. They want armed volunteers.

Originally Posted by detectiveconan16 The super right don't actually want "armed guards" in schools, that costs money. They want armed volunteers.

So what happens when one of the volunteers turns out to be unstable and shoots up a school themselves? Volunteers to watch the volunteers?

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Originally Posted by slickkill77 Don't feel like reading the whole thread but just thought I'd share. Hillsborough county in Florida (around Tampa) is putting an armed guard in every elementary school. Around 150 of them

Originally Posted by willardhaven I love that "conservatives" want armed guards posted in schools. You can't make this shit up.

Quick search shows that Hillsborough County went for Obama in 2008 and 2012. I know that some of the far-left folks like to consider Obama to be conservative, but I'm not sure how many folks on here would go that far.

Originally Posted by UncleBob Quick search shows that Hillsborough County went for Obama in 2008 and 2012. I know that some of the far-left folks like to consider Obama to be conservative, but I'm not sure how many folks on here would go that far.

It's a close split but Republicans outnumber Democrats there (41% to 33%). To your second point, it's pretty hard to differentiate Obama from the Republicans of just 20 years ago.

Conservative ≠ Republican.

Originally Posted by UncleBob Conservative ≠ Republican.

No kidding. I was just countering your point.

I'd actually argue that a conservative wouldn't have voted for Obama or Romney either one. But that's beyond the point.

To claim that a bunch of folks in an area that voted in favor of the least conservative of the two major candidates are "conservative" is a questionable claim at best.

It's funny, schools are sometimes thought of as prisons for children. Well with armed guards I guess we're one step closer.

Originally Posted by UncleBob I'd actually argue that a conservative wouldn't have voted for Obama or Romney either one. But that's beyond the point.

You are beyond the point my friend.

Originally Posted by UncleBob To claim that a bunch of folks in an area that voted in favor of the least conservative of the two major candidates are "conservative" is a questionable claim at best.

You zeroed in on the specific case after my generalization and I provided evidence to counter your point. You have a different definition of conservative, just as I do. However Republican enrollment and historical voting records are accepted means for testing how "conservative" a county is by popular definition. So I don't know what to tell you. I don't know why you are harping on this or why I'm indulging you.

I don't know why people are bashing armed guards so much. It would make me feel better sending my kids to a public school knowing there is one more safety barrier put in place.

Originally Posted by perdition(troy I don't know why people are bashing armed guards so much. It would make me feel better sending my kids to a public school knowing there is one more safety barrier put in place.

Maybe I'm being presumptuous but you wouldn't want armed guards in your workplace or in the grocery store would you?