Originally Posted by Blade3D I agree, though I am not saying that N8's time isn't appreciated. I do appreciate what he does, and maybe he does try his best. However, I do not appreciate when he threatens to quit or leave, I do not appreciate it when he complains about the work he puts in but refuses to accept any help.

His time and effort is appreciated, I just don't think the time and effort is as great as everyone expresses. Forgive me if I am just not considering things here, but I don't see what's so difficult about it.

It's not like I don't get his frustration with the game. I'm sure a lot of us can relate. I wish we could just fast forward to Madden 25, but we have what I assume is 1 more season of Madden 13 to play. Sometimes I feel like playing this game is a drag and I feel like giving up and coming back to play in Madden 25, but I want to keep whatever veteran status I may have in the league and I definitely want to play with you guys in 25, so I don't see myself quitting.

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Originally Posted by Konfusion His time and effort is appreciated, I just don't think the time and effort is as great as everyone expresses. Forgive me if I am just not considering things here, but I don't see what's so difficult about it. It's not like I don't get his frustration with the game. I'm sure a lot of us can relate. I wish we could just fast forward to Madden 25, but we have what I assume is 1 more season of Madden 13 to play. Sometimes I feel like playing this game is a drag and I feel like giving up and coming back to play in Madden 25, but I want to keep whatever veteran status I may have in the league and I definitely want to play with you guys in 25, so I don't see myself quitting.

I completely agree! My intent is not to bash him of course but to be treated, or feel like I'd be treated fairly.

Originally Posted by Docb9110 I completely agree! My intent is not to bash him of course but to be treated, or feel like I'd be treated fairly.

ya i feel exactly how doc does in that sense as well. although i can see how it can be viewed as bashing but in all honesty i don't see it as that. i also think konfusion and doc have made pretty good points with there last couple of post

You guys are insane. This is N8's league and you knew that when you signed up for it. If being the commissioner doesn't grant you special privileges then none of you should feel entitled to advance or oust n8.

As an example, I've probably received close to 500 emails just being on the trade committee in the official league. That doesn't even count everything else the 3 commissioners have to deal with. I'm sure n8 has to deal with similar considering the number of people in either league is nearly equal.

With that said I'm out of here. N8 made it clear to me and everyone else that it was his way or the highway, you all agreed to that. If you don't like it there is another league with open teams.

Originally Posted by staticz You guys are insane. This is N8's league and you knew that when you signed up for it. If being the commissioner doesn't grant you special privileges then none of you should feel entitled to advance or oust n8. As an example, I've probably received close to 500 emails just being on the trade committee in the official league. That doesn't even count everything else the 3 commissioners have to deal with. I'm sure n8 has to deal with similar considering the number of people in either league is nearly equal. With that said I'm out of here. N8 made it clear to me and everyone else that it was his way or the highway, you all agreed to that. If you don't like it there is another league with open teams.

Does his way or the highway mean (I'm sure you can read, or did I assume to much because we have CLEARLY given him credit and admitted it is hard)that he can do as he pleases with the time frame, complain about losing EVERY GAME he loses as being "maddened" then at the end of the season on a 3 game slump say he quits only to realize he has a chance to make the playoffs and get back to playing? If that is what this league has come to, un fairly treating players who you may not like personally or if you lose you can go on a rant saying how you got ed by the game LITERALLY AFTER every game you lose and the games you win post a huge summary about how he won then ill "cry wolf" with you and "leave" as well.

Your argument falls on itself! The other league has 3, AGAIN THESE ARE YOUR WORDS, 3 commissioners to run the league who like you said are more than likely overwhelmed themselves with the amount of messages from trades alone yet you are defending someone who vehemently (means strongly) took a stance on doing things all his own in this league with the same amount of players as the main league? So by your argument and stance on this you are ok by being treated this way because he said "its my way or the highway?" Maybe the better question which I have already asked is "would n8 hold the league up in this instance for DVO?" Most decidedly not as he has already passed the DVO torch to kaster I believe because he "couldnt handle ignorance." A better question since your stance is what is it "would n8 help out staticz more than DVO in ANY situation?" I'm starting to think that answer is "probably"

I will state this as many times as Needed. I AM STATING FACTS which were openly discussed in the forum. I am not bashing n8 at all! Again I partially agree with you and EVERYONE ELSE WHO HAS POSTED in saying we believe he does a great job when he is doing right by his duties! It's when he "forgets" he is the commissioner that we have a problem with. Unfairly running the league it seems AT TIMES AND NOT CARRYING HIMSELF AS SOMEONE OF AUTHORITY ( especially to a bunch of guys like us) like he should in his position! So while I agree with the "his way or the highway mentality" it is not the issue. It's the hints of abuse of power we are tired of trying to get used to.

Again, if you don't like it you are free to join the other league, start your own, or leave. That is how this league got started, n8 didn't like how the official league was going.

Abusing the power...seriously that is your argument? Have you ever seen a corporate expense report? This is no different. Sure N8 could've had a second commish or something else but he doesn't, that was his choice. If you guys aren't fans of that, your options were listed in the first sentence of this post.

You are correct, as such I am done. I am tired of this, I may start another league next year. I put my copy of Madden on eBay about 4 hours ago, hopefully I can get $25-30 back. Enjoy the league...

Originally Posted by staticz Again, if you don't like it you are free to join the other league, start your own, or leave. That is how this league got started, n8 didn't like how the official league was going. Abusing the power...seriously that is your argument? Have you ever seen a corporate expense report? This is no different. Sure N8 could've had a second commish or something else but he doesn't, that was his choice. If you guys aren't fans of that, your options were listed in the first sentence of this post.

Corporate expense report? Haha....contrary to your belief I don't work at a corner store.

That is my argument and your counter is referring to an expense report and saying N8 is doing the same concept? So my argument refers to the actual discussion and you brought in an example and didn't explain?

Have you ever seen a debate? This is the same concept!

The Only difference is you probably can't state an example that has nothing to do with someone running a league for video game and then not try to explain. So ill let you reset your thought process and try to explain to me so we all can try and see your point besides you saying "it's his way or the highway....IT'S HIS WAY OR THE Highway!" On that since you wanted to bring corporate logic into this discussion, a CEO OR CFO to more closely resemble your example has CHECKS AN BALANCES (pun intended) which often times is a board lf trustees as well as low level employees who are given ghost ballots to cast their votes at shareholder mettings so they cannot fudge the books a little (see Enron and Mattel).

I don't blame n8 for starting his own league! Haha I want things my way so I'm gonna do my own which is more initiative than I have for my own agenda in a game and while I am fair most of the time when it comes to something I want I can "fudge the books?" Is that what you mean?

I don't really know what to say anymore. If everyone who has ever had an issue in the league went off and started their own, it would be a waste of time. I don't feel like 31 of us should be at the mercy of 1 just because he happened to be the first guy to say "hey guys, let's make another league". There's no reason why we can't work things out without going with "my way or the highway".

Originally Posted by Konfusion It seems like the argument for why he should get special privileges is because he is the commish who works really hard and puts a ton of time into the league. I honestly can't come up with what is so hard about that job.

I have no dog in this fight, so I'll just tell you from personal experience that it is a metric ton of work running one of these leagues. It's not been overstated at all. There are 3 of us (well, now 2) in the other league and it's still a bit overwhelming at times. I'm not going to rattle off an itemized list of all the little tasks that go into it, but suffice to say that the stuff you see in the thread is maybe a third of the work involved.

I personally think n8 is insane to try to do it all on his own, but this is his league and that's his choice. Presumably all of you knew that when you signed up. I assume that n8's philosophy here (and I don't want to speak for him) is that a strong central authority is necessary to the smooth operation of a league like this. I happen to think he's 100% right. That doesn't mean it's the only way to run a league, but it is how this one is run, and that's up to him. That's how I see it anyway.

As for special privileges, I generally agree that the commissioner(s) should be bound by the same standards as everyone else, but I haven't been following the goings on in this league closely enough to be remotely qualified to hold an opinion on that.

I can't wait to have 17 JV leagues with 2 teams in each next year.

Originally Posted by pitfallharry219 I can't wait to have 17 JV leagues with 2 teams in each next year.

lol thats funny... but this topic has really made a turn for the worst. it gone from advancing or not advancing if u dont like it make ur own league. Theres got to be a way to find a happy medium instead of going to the extreme. and honestly nothings going to change more than likely until n8's here to talk about it with the rest of the group which more than likely will be once he returns from vacation

I can't believe the bickering that goes on in these Madden leagues. The league is (potentially) tearing itself apart because people can't wait a few days to get things rolling.

N8, if you read this, my recommendation is to tune out the thread until your vaca is over. If online fantasy sports bullshit were to cause you to take any time away from some time off, ignore it and get back to it once time allows. Many here appreciate the work you put in for the league and will be here to get things going once you're back and ready.

Although at this rate, if we lose enough folks to drama there may not be a Season 3. And if everyone's really burnt out, maybe that's not such a bad thing.

wow I leave for a few hours and it goes from talking about my hot sister again ( ) to people getting all pissed over a 3 day delay. Everyone just needs to breathe.

It is honestly laughable that all of this has erupted over what essentially amounts to a 4 day delay. Although, I'm sure a lot of it can be attributed to some people's general opinion of me anyway. This may come as a shock, but I couldn't give a dangling shit about any of that.

Some of the arguments being raised in here are so inanely stupid, the "threat" of these people leaving the league does nothing to disturb me. Likening this situation to the draft is a horrible comparison. The time/date of the draft is voted on by every league member, from a selection of 4-5 potential dates/times. The time that gets the most votes is chosen. Instead of bitching and whining, come up with a more fair way to handle that.

I won't dispute BV's assertion that the commissioner should be held to the same standard as other league members. After all, fair is fair. But I would like to highlight again that my options are limited. All I really have the power to do is advance the league and essentially leave my team by the wayside. I expressed that if we were to go this route, my interest in continuing playing would likely disappear (if I can't improve my team, why bother with the final season?) This is not a "threat" or "leverage" or whatever other BS Blade wants to label it as. It's really just common sense honesty. So, I'm an "asshole" for holding up the league for myself...and I'm "childish" for not wanting to continue with a game after my team has been shorted. Seems like a no win situation.

Either way, like I said, I think some people just had a bone to pick, and that's fine. I won't miss them, and I'd rather move the league away from people of that mindset anyway. This is, after all, a video game. Sure, I take it seriously, but I'm not losing any sleep over it. I definitely wanted to give people the option of coming up with a fair compromise (though again...my options are pretty limited) but I was really shocked at the venomous way some people responded. Again, it says a lot.

For anyone who is still here when I get home on Friday, I'll advance the league and we'll hash out the details of free agency. And however many teams we have to fill, we'll work on filling them. I'm actually pretty confident this will strengthen the league moving forward. Everybody needs to take a good shit now and again.

Apparently N8 is supposed to ask permission to take a vacation.

Mine wasn't a threat, I already left. Unlike you I do not use it as a threat, and follow through. It's the principle of the matter and the same issues are always brought up. You can throw your tantrums and accusations to have everyone fall in line with what you want, I however will not be a part of it anymore. You bitch and moan about running a league, but a large number of people have expressed a desire to help but you don't care or don't want help. Fine, be an asshole and do want you want with your league. This is my main concern, and if handled better the league would have never run into this problem. I don't need to play this video game or need this.

Most you it was a joy to play Madden with, and i hope we get a chance next year.

Hey Nate, clear your PMs. I want to ask you something. Don't worry, it's not hostile or anything. I have a question about something else.

I have stated my opinion an even though I disagree with some tactics used to run the league I will continue to follow the rules set forth obviously. I voted to wait because as N8 said, either way we are waiting no matter what option is taken.

For the record I felt I was respectful in expressing my opinion.

Originally Posted by Blade3D Mine wasn't a threat, I already left. Unlike you I do not use it as a threat, and follow through. It's the principle of the matter and the same issues are always brought up. You can throw your tantrums and accusations to have everyone fall in line with what you want, I however will not be a part of it anymore. You bitch and moan about running a league, but a large number of people have expressed a desire to help but you don't care or don't want help. Fine, be an asshole and do want you want with your league. This is my main concern, and if handled better the league would have never run into this problem. I don't need to play this video game or need this. Most you it was a joy to play Madden with, and i hope we get a chance next year.

Good for you. Best of luck in your future endeavors.