Wii U's gimmick is key in local multiplayer and homes where the console is under the main TV for families to watch over their kids. That's really the hook. That's really how Nintendo has always operated.

The reason why they're getting help from EA for online is because they really have no clue about the space and what makes it successful.

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Exactly. Which is why I worry that it will be another console with limited appeal to core gamers. They seem still focused on families and kids. Which is fine. I'm fine having it eventually as just a mario/metroid/zelda machine.

Just odd as it doesn't at all vibe with all their talk about wanting to focus more on hardcore gamers with the Wii U.

I predict a release of Xenoblade and a few of the other hardcore games the N.A. Wii didn't get as a way of showing the Wii U as hardcore.

Originally Posted by dmaul1114 Exactly. Which is why I worry that it will be another console with limited appeal to core gamers. They seem still focused on families and kids. Which is fine. I'm fine having it eventually as just a mario/metroid/zelda machine. Just odd as it doesn't at all vibe with all their talk about wanting to focus more on hardcore gamers with the Wii U.

I guess...but they've been extremely wishy-washy about everything so far. Having an account for their online shop would probably make Wii U a big seller to hardcore gamers alone since that'd mean stuff was tied to an account and not a system. Especially when they're the company that usually sells multiple systems.

Yeah, that's a much needed change. I already lost some VC games from my launch console that I gave to a family friend that I can't redownload on my new Wii now.

But that's a minor thing.

If they want to sell to core gamers, they need more traditional control options for core games, new franchises that appeal to older gamers (i.e. some shooters, wrpgs etc.), and to have comparable versions of top third party games like Call of Duty, Dragon Age, Skyrim etc.

If it's missing quality ports of those big third party games, it will never be nothing but a secondary console to core gamers.

Wii got COD, but it was a year too late unfortunately. It didn't get MW2, yet it got MW3 (I seriously don't get this one) and yet they sold really well. I think Wii U's control scheme is more in-line with traditional controllers except for clickable sticks, but I fully expect competent developers to put that stuff on the touch-screen.

I also expect a Skyrim GOTY edition on Wii U next year. I don't see any reason for there not to be.

Originally Posted by KingBroly I also expect a Skyrim GOTY edition on Wii U next year. I don't see any reason for there not to be.

Whoa, you're moving fast. At least buy WIIU a drink first, sailor.

I really want Wii U to be cool and successful but I'm starting to doubt it. Perhaps the tablet controller will be a great success and used in really cool ways but right now I just don't see it. But I didn't expect the touch screen and second screen of the DS to be as interesting as it was either, so maybe they have a plan.

It'll be interesting to see if being the first "next gen" system released will be an advantage for them or if the WiiU is going to be the next Dreamcast. If the next XBOX and Playstation are considerably more powerful, a slow start could be a disaster for Nintendo. One podcast I was listening to earlier this week (I believe it was Windows Weekly) suggested that the next set of systems aren't going to have the big technological jump as previous generations because of the combination of already outputting at the highest resolution TVs can display and Microsoft and especially Sony most likely not pushing the technology as cutting edge so they can get their consoles out at a lower price than the previous generation. If this turns out to be accurate and if Nintendo makes the WiiU powerful enough instead of half-assing it so they can make a big profit on hardware from launch, I could see the WiiU finding its place in the market.

It has to suck to be at Nintendo right now, a couple years ago they were on top of the world with the massive success of both the DS and Wii, now they've gone through a poor launch for the 3DS, the Wii fell off the face of the earth faster than anyone expected, and their next console feels like it's grasping at straws.

Originally Posted by rlse9 I really want Wii U to be cool and successful but I'm starting to doubt it. Perhaps the tablet controller will be a great success and used in really cool ways but right now I just don't see it. But I didn't expect the touch screen and second screen of the DS to be as interesting as it was either, so maybe they have a plan.

I don't know about that. Some of the ideas they suggested during their E3 presentation are interesting ideas. It is a question of if it will move consoles.

It'll be interesting to see if being the first "next gen" system released will be an advantage for them or if the WiiU is going to be the next Dreamcast. If the next XBOX and Playstation are considerably more powerful, a slow start could be a disaster for Nintendo. One podcast I was listening to earlier this week (I believe it was Windows Weekly) suggested that the next set of systems aren't going to have the big technological jump as previous generations because of the combination of already outputting at the highest resolution TVs can display and Microsoft and especially Sony most likely not pushing the technology as cutting edge so they can get their consoles out at a lower price than the previous generation. If this turns out to be accurate and if Nintendo makes the WiiU powerful enough instead of half-assing it so they can make a big profit on hardware from launch, I could see the WiiU finding its place in the market.

A big problem console makers are going to have next generation is that a simple tech update might not be enough to convince people that a new console is worth it. Nintendo seems to realize that, which is why you see them trying other things to try to move consoles. While the hard-core gamer never really warmed up to motion controls, it was good enough to sell to the mass populous. Obviously it doesn't always work, with the 3DS falling flat. We'll see how the WiiU does once we actually have something to judge it by.

It has to suck to be at Nintendo right now, a couple years ago they were on top of the world with the massive success of both the DS and Wii, now they've gone through a poor launch for the 3DS, the Wii fell off the face of the earth faster than anyone expected, and their next console feels like it's grasping at straws.

The thing is, the fall of the Wii is all on Nintendo. After a pretty good 2010, there was absolutely nothing until Skyward Sword. That is something I couldn't understand, especially with the seeming refusal to release Xenoblade over here. I understand part of it was to push the 3DS, but you just don't completely forget your other platforms.

Originally Posted by KingBroly Wii got COD, but it was a year too late unfortunately. It didn't get MW2, yet it got MW3 (I seriously don't get this one) and yet they sold really well. I think Wii U's control scheme is more in-line with traditional controllers except for clickable sticks, but I fully expect competent developers to put that stuff on the touch-screen. I also expect a Skyrim GOTY edition on Wii U next year. I don't see any reason for there not to be.

For it to matter they have to:

1. Get the big third party games same date as the other consoles.

2. They have to look as good as they do on the other consoles, or at least very close.

3. Controls have to work as well as on the other machines.

Remains to be seen if they can do those. Depends on how powerful the next gen Xbox and PS are relative to the Wii U, and how that big controller actually feels for playing traditional games.

Originally Posted by dmaul1114 For it to matter they have to: 1. Get the big third party games same date as the other consoles. 2. They have to look as good as they do on the other consoles, or at least very close. 3. Controls have to work as well as on the other machines.

I don't think those conditions are unreasonable. The fact that we've yet to hear *anything* on developer impressions of the Wii U, and we're instead hearing Reggie Gor-Blimey speaking in very general terms, makes #1 and #3 unlikely out of the gate.

The point isn't that the Wii U is doomed to fail. Nintendo might hammer out a concept that works in the next 6 months...

...however if the lack of news is any indication, they are doomed to repeat the cycle of the DS and Wii, where developers are waiting to see how it all shakes out. The 3DS experience is probably going to deprive them of early adopters. I think they'll survive the Wii U's first 12-18 months, but it ain't gonna be pretty.

I think Wii U will get a lot of day-and-date ports once the system's out, maybe games on a 1-2 month delay when it inevitably launches (games released 1-2 months before on the system when it comes out; Madden, GOTY's). I don't know when it's coming out though.

I don't expect stuff like NG3 and Batman:AC to sell though, because those games will come very late and most gamers would have already played it/passed judgement. I think a good indicator will be if GTAV is on Wii U or not. I'm guessing it will, but who the hell knows. They didn't reveal platform specifics, so...yeah.

Like I said before, the only control issues I can see popping up with Wii U is clickable sticks, which is something Nintendo has never had on their system, even with the CC Pro. Otherwise, it's going to be a port machine. Since it runs on similar architecture to a 360, it will probably get every non-retail exclusive it gets for a while at least.

There's also just the issue of how comfortable the controller from an ergonomics standpoint. Can they have that big touch screen controller just disappear in your hands like the 360 controller does (IMO).

I'm kind of picky on that stuff though. Controller preference is one reason I went 360 over PS3 as I've never liked the dual shocks.

That's all personal preference though of course.

Originally Posted by TheLongshot The thing is, the fall of the Wii is all on Nintendo. After a pretty good 2010, there was absolutely nothing until Skyward Sword. That is something I couldn't understand, especially with the seeming refusal to release Xenoblade over here. I understand part of it was to push the 3DS, but you just don't completely forget your other platforms.

Problem is they've done this since the N64 era, heard of a game called Dinosaur Planet on N64, well that turned into Starfox Adventures on GC, a little title called LoZ: TP, was delayed in favor of releasing the Wii version before the GC version came out. Another GC title Super Paper Mario was pushed back and turned into a Wii title, and that Kirby game released recently, you got it, another GC--> Wii conversion.

This is old hat for Nintendo at this point, they abandon ship even before the boat starts to sink and then torpedo it themselves, how warped is that.

1. Get the big third party games same date as the other consoles.

I have to say since the NES era they have NOT managed to get stellar 3rd party support, with the Wii Sega's US boss, EA, and Activision all made comments about their misgivings with the Wii publicly, and because of moves like I mentioned above is the main reason why they think that M$ burned devs when they abandoned the Xbox 1 in favor of a new system, Nintendo keeps releasing underpowered systems that don't sell software that isn't gimmick or made by Nintendo themselves and guarantee sales, only Sony has supported a system past the release of their successor. Nintendo is going to have to get with it or prepare for the eventuality that the WiiU will fall into the same trap of the Wii, good hardware sales for the first few years then flagging sales and support because it isn't on par with their competitors.

The comments I've been reading all point to people not wanting a new system for at least 2 years (or more) since they don't feel the current systems (PS3/X360) need upgrades yet, why go against what the general public wants, you're doing nothing but hurting yourself by selling them something they don't want yet, is Nintendo too blind to see this? I honestly don't know what to think about their strategy in the last decade.

I'd agree with that, but I'd say that it'd since the SNES era, not the NES era. SNES had a lot of great 3rd party games.

Screwing up their partnership with Sony for a disc-based console and going with carts for the N64 was the beginning of their down fall. From then on they've made decisions that make it harder for developers to port games over to their consoles.

And they've just not kept up with the industry and kept focus on kids and families when shooters, WRPGs etc. have became the dominant selling genres as people like me who grew up on Nintendo grew up and moved on to those kind of genres.

Of course I'm not saying they should scrap their franchises etc., just that they failed to also make new franchises to compete with CoD, Halo etc. to keep adult gamers really interested in their platform, while also keeping Mario et al. around for the kids and for nostalgic purchases by older gamers like myself.

Originally Posted by dothog Provided they're within a year or so of the 720/PS4 releases, I don't think there will be anywhere near the performance gap that there was for the Wii vs. 360/PS3. That was one of the only points from E3 that was intelligible, that they had every intention of meeting "hardcore gamer" expectations in terms of HD and performance.

It all comes down to how all three companies play their cards. If Nintendo continues to cheap out to profit on day one while the other two willingly take a loss to cram in fancy hardware(not to mention launch a 1+ later), then we most definitely will be seeing a big performance gap again.

My fear is that Nintendo is shooting for 360 and PS3 specs, or marginally better, which at this point are 6 years old.

Originally Posted by dmaul1114 3. Will online be more than an after thought this time around?

They've already said they won't have a unified service and are leaving it up to developers to build their own infrastructures, which is a terrible idea. So a company maximizes their game for XBL & PSN, platforms that already exist, but have to start from scratch to make them playable online for the WiiU, ala PS2? I see ports getting gimped because of this.

Originally Posted by dmaul1114 Of course I'm not saying they should scrap their franchises etc., just that they failed to also make new franchises to compete with CoD, Halo etc. to keep adult gamers really interested in their platform, while also keeping Mario et al. around for the kids and for nostalgic purchases by older gamers like myself.

Hell they don't even have to make new franchises in these genres, they merely have to make a comparable system with features that can run those games from third parties. Nintendo just doesn't get it when it comes to third party support and they haven't gotten it for 20 years. I don't expect that to change this time out either.

If they aren't going to offer a unified online experience, trophies, friend lists, chat, etc. then there is zero reason for a gamer to purchase the WiiU version of a popular franchise. Couple that in with a lack of a traditional ergonomic controller and you have a recipe for disaster for the core crowd. Like the last 3 consoles, it will remain a dedicated Nintendo franchise console from day one. It's amazing that the bigwigs at Nintendo can't see that after all these years.

Originally Posted by Corvin If they aren't going to offer a unified online experience, trophies, friend lists, chat, etc. then there is zero reason for a gamer to purchase the WiiU version of a popular franchise.

Exactly. Then 3 years after the Wii U releases, people will still be chanting the same things. "Games likes Legend of Zelda: New Game, Metroid Prime 4, and Mario Galaxy 3 are awesome and look great on the Wii U!"

Basically, we'll be boasting how awesome 3 games are, in say.. a 3 year period.

I want to want one of these so bad. I am a true fanboy at heart, but logic has taken over. :(

Online service should be a staple now in current gen consoles. Its tarted way back with the original Xbox, it was improved tremendously with the 360..and I can see it possibly getting better with the '720'. Same for PS4. Their online is OK, but at least they have a similar system like Xbox. There's just no reason for them to NOT have it, and it's sad that people will defend this.

720 and PS4 will get the newest and greatest games, and we'll all be talking about how throwing a frisbee feels "even more real" now with OMG ISLAND VACATION 7. It's just so darn silly. They make suuuuch quality games, along with suuuuch quality systems... why are they just, being silly with their WiiU?!

I demand more info on this. I've already got it pegged as "pretty lame" and am basing it off of the small info we have. HOPEFULLY, that changes.

Originally Posted by Corvin They've already said they won't have a unified service and are leaving it up to developers to build their own infrastructures, which is a terrible idea. So a company maximizes their game for XBL & PSN, platforms that already exist, but have to start from scratch to make them playable online for the WiiU, ala PS2? I see ports getting gimped because of this.

No, we don't know if they're going to have a unified account system or not. It's that simple. What has been implied is that they won't run online matchmaking/servers, I.E. it'll be the PSN approach, where developers front the cash for multiplayer servers.

Originally Posted by Corvin Like the last 3 consoles, it will remain a dedicated Nintendo franchise console from day one. It's amazing that the bigwigs at Nintendo can't see that after all these years.

At this point I honestly think they don't care. They must do just fine profit-wise with selling their systems and about a game or 2 per year over the life of the system to the diehards. Anything on top of that (3rd party) is just icing on the cake.

At the heart of the console is an 45-nm IBM processor based on the same technology as IBM’s super-computer, Watson, the Jeopardy champion.

I, for one, welcome our new... Wii-U overlords?