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Originally Posted by Storamin I dare you to tell me my 2 BMWs ,1994 325is and my 2000 z3 have lots of problems. I'll show you the racetrack I race my 325is on and you'll know it is the only one of the 2 to have any problems at all. As with any car, you're going to get problems with it. It depends how treat it but normally the luxury cars have more parts that will break and therefore more costs. If you're looking at a late model luxury car versus a new economy model... you're probaly better going for the new economy model.

So, let's see here. Random guy talking about how much races his 325 vs friend who went to BMW tech school and graduated last year. Hmm, who do I believe?

I wish there was a jerk off motion emoticon.

I think the big question here is "What do you really want in a car?" Having some info on what you want to use it for would help a lot. As for me, I'm a fan of used cars because of the massive savings. I've got a '68 Mercedes 250SE, '84 Alfa Romeo GTV6, and a '79 Ferrari 308. I also used to own a '82 Mercedes 300SD. All these cars are VERY different from one another and each is more suited to a particular task than the others. So the best car for you completely depends on what you will be doing with it.

If you plan on getting a Mercedes, stay away from anything made after '98. Reliability on these things used to be bulletproof, after the '98 model year though things took a turn for the worst. On my '68 I haven't had to replace anything at all after almost 6 years of ownership. On the '82 I didn't need to replace anything while I owned it (about 2.5 years) Bulletproof.

Currently the Japanese are the kings of reliability. If repairs frighten you and you want something newish, go Japanese. For fun 2 seater coupes you've got the Honda S2000. For getting around town it's hard to beat Toyota's lineup, specifically the Corolla and Camry. If you want to spend a little more you can get a Lexus. I'd go with a toyota over a Lexus though. Same company but a whole lot cheaper, kind of like the Acura/Honda relationship. The Japanese have also managed to smash the competition in the "ugliest cars on the road" race with the Scion lineup and of course the Honda Element.

I'm a huge fan of the italian cars. They've got abysmal reliability and the parts often cost more to buy than it would cost to actually have a machine shop fabricate the part for you, but for pure fun and style Italy is where it's at. Unfortunately in the U.S. our choices are limited to cars from the mid 80's and older unless you want to spend somewhere over 50 Gs....Still the handling of these cars, even the older ones is the best on the planet. Gas mileage should not be a concern when buying one of these cars. On a good day I get 20MPG on the Alfa and 9 MPG on the Ferrari.

Speaking of gas mileage not being a concern, Ford and GM. Um, stay away. The new Mustang is an attractive car that is rather suicidal around the curves due to its live rear axle. 99 times out of 100 the american cars will take a huge dump in value in an alarmingly short time.

By the cars that you mentioned in your post above, can I assume that we're working in the 15k-20k range? If so I'll give you a couple recommendations.

If you want a sporty and fun two seater, go with the Honda S2000 (used, under 20K)Or the Mazda Miata which is a bit cheaper. Be forewarned that the Miata has a reputation as a "hairdresser's car" even if it is a fantastic car. You could also go for an older italian...just be sure to keep a few bucks for a taxi when it breaks down

If you want luxury, get a Mercedes E class. The E320 and E400 are great cars and pretty much bulletproof from what I've seen. People often conside these the last of the "real" Mercs.

If you want an SUV, get in the right hand lane. You're in my way and I can't see around you. : )

For economy and sensibility, go Toyota. The Camry is a very good car. Cheap repairs, good fuel economy, easy to live with. New ones are in your price range. Used ones are the exact same car and half the price.

If you don't care about reliability, fuel economy, ease of use, or safety, Get a Ferrari Mondial. They're old but starting to creep down into your price range. It's also got 4 seats so you have room for a bike to get you home when it breaks down and leaves you with a $15,000 repair bill. Why would anyone want one? Because there's nothing better in life than saying "My Ferrari" when you see it in the morning.

Whew, long post.

Originally Posted by JJJJJS The Japanese have also managed to smash the competition in the "ugliest cars on the road" race with the Scion lineup and of course the Honda Element.

I semi-agree with you there. As ugly as the Element may be, it's also quite useful. When I test drove it, I was mighty impressed with the car. However, I think that Nissan's new Maxima is way uglier than the Scion box. I also think the Aztek is worse than any of them.

I would have mentioned the Aztec, but somehow my mind must have aborted the memories that contain all images of that vehicle. It's like a failsafe to protect my delicate brain. I'll agree that the new Maxima is pretty ugly to. Maybe if they removed the mohawk we can upgrade it from "Jesus cryingly ugly" to "boring"

My advice whenever anyone asks what kind of car to get:

an old air-cooled Volkswagen.

That's right, a VW. I have a 1964 Volkswagen Karmann-Ghia and it runs like a champ.

You can get a really nice Bug or Ghia for a few thousand dollars and if you just take care of it, it will last you forever.

Where will your modern car with all its electronics, and needless wiring, and power everything be when it's 42 years old? That's right, crushed into a little cube.

A little saying that I like:
In 10 years, your car will just be old. In 10 years, my car will still be a classic.

I say buy a subaru that is from the past few years they are the best on the market for reliability. Buying it used or certified used is a great idea it should only be $15,000 or a little more. The loan won't be as long and the payment pretty cheap.

Originally Posted by Graystone I say buy a subaru that is from the past few years they are the best on the market for reliability. Buying it used or certified used is a great idea it should only be $15,000 or a little more. The loan won't be as long and the payment pretty cheap.

No, they aren't. Subaru does rate well at all on JD Power's Initial Quality Study. In 2005, they were only slightly better than Kia.

I just bought my first new car about 3 weeks ago (2006 Subaru Impreza WRX) & I'm lovin it!! After having experienced the cheapness of 2 previous used cars, I have to say owning a new car is a high like no other. I am a car nut and the car I bought was my dream car since 1999. I finally could afford it so I went for it. Yes the payment is more than I wished it would of been, but damn.....I HAVE A NEW CAR!! Just take care of it with proper care so once your warranty runs out, you have minimal problems. Too many people rely on the company to take care of their cars afterwards but all those problems can be avoided with proper care through the car's lifetime. You can see my car here!!

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2240284

I was really looking at buying a Scion tC but after doin the math and decideing that I had many corners that could be cut (Yes, videogames was on of those but hopefully CAG can help me with that) I went and fullfilled my dream by purchasing the car. I was actually looking at a 2005 used car but little to my knowledge was that financing is usually WAY higher on a used car. Mine is through Subaru and they hooked me up pretty good on a rate.

Originally Posted by brodiemash I finally could afford it so I went for it. Yes the payment is more than I wished it would of been, but damn.....I HAVE A NEW CAR!!

Rather than getting a 2006 WRX, wouldn't have getting a 2005 WRX for far less than sticker have sufficed? Or is having a new car really worth a few thousand dollars? My guess would be "no". According to edmunds, sticker is approx $25k, and since they're in demand, it would probably higher. 2004 and 2005 WRXs appear to be sold for between $15k-$20k.

Like everyone says...It really depends on what you wannt out of it. If you can work on cars then get either one. If you want economy get a Scion or Toyota. Looks well, I'm pretty sure you know which one(s) you're looking at.

BTW - since you live in California and decide to get a used car..get a 2000+ model. You only need to smog it once every 4/5(?) years. I think its for most models. This is of course if you plan to modify it.

Originally Posted by capitalist_mao Rather than getting a 2006 WRX, wouldn't have getting a 2005 WRX for far less than sticker have sufficed? Or is having a new car really worth a few thousand dollars? My guess would be "no". According to edmunds, sticker is approx $25k, and since they're in demand, it would probably higher. 2004 and 2005 WRXs appear to be sold for between $15k-$20k.

Actually, I was looking at a 2005 WRX with only 3000 miles and the sticker on that was only $1500 less than the new one, and that was after getting the price down $500 (the dealership people were jerks and it's hard to find a used WRX around here) so I figured I'd spend the extra on a new one and got a rate than was 55% less than on the used one. I came up on both ends!

You should get your self a third generation Acura TL. It doesn't matter if it used or not, just get one! Very nice looking car and it pack some horse powers too. My cousin just got one last month and you wouldn't believe how many heads turn to look and see what kind of car it is. .

Whoa I really appreciate everyone's input on this because I've been going crazy trying to figure it out and your input is very good. So here it is as it stands I was only looking at luxury type vehicles because my wife likes BMWs and I saw I could afford other older luxury type cars too. But now that I know service and parts are insane I will try to convince her otherwise.

As far as new vehicles I like the Scion TC, Nissian Altima, Honda Civic (in LA that is a burglar magnet) and the Ford Mustang (thought I could get a great price with all the trouble their in).

I am really leaning towards an used car for savings and more of a variety and I think Foriegn is the way to go. I have '98 Eclipse and had a lease on a Toyota Tundra for 5 years turned it in and thats why I need a new or used one. I just want a car now because in LA it was crazy trying to park that thing and the gas mileage didn't help. I really don't care about impressing people but to impress myself and my wife because we will have to live with it for awhile.

Any other suggestions on sporty looking type vehicles new or used that I am missing?

Originally Posted by capitalist_mao I semi-agree with you there. As ugly as the Element may be, it's also quite useful. When I test drove it, I was mighty impressed with the car. However, I think that Nissan's new Maxima is way uglier than the Scion box. I also think the Aztek is worse than any of them.

http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/re...&model=Impreza

http://www.epinions.com/auto_Make-20...splay_~reviews

This is just one of the the hundreds of sites I found the give subaru high ratings.

I grow rather tired of your know it all attitude.

Originally Posted by headpiece747 sporty looking type vehicles

Well, if you want it sporty looking, just buy any Sport Compact, and attach gigantic wheels, an alluminum spoiler and a gigantic muffler. Bonus points for unpainted carbon fiber hood, lowered suspension and underbody lights.

As for the cars you mentioned, in my personal opinion, I would nix the Scion, Altima and Stang. I find all of them ugly. The Altima and Stang are low on the reliability rungs. Despite being made from Toyota engines, Scions don't have the quailty assurance of Toyota cars. I'd say replace the Altima with an Accord.

If you must have sport, some cars you may want to look into are:
RX-8
Corvette (totally bucks Chevy's quality trend)
S2000
RSX Type-S

Just be warned that all these cars (and most sports cars) are going to garner higher fuel costs (both from having lower economy and from requiring premium fuel), higher insurance costs, and unless you plan on actually racing them, could essentially be construed as a waste of money.

In my opinion, you really cannot go wrong with a Honda. Toyotas are good quality cars too, but their exterior designs suck, so they look as economical as they are. Hondas have a bit of sexiness to them. The one car that I was most surprised with had to be the Honda Element. It's gas mileage isn't stellar at 21-24 (EX style with manual trans), but, it is quite a good ride, has a great turning radius, plenty of room and is rated quite highly among car sites.

Originally Posted by Graystone http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/reliability.aspx? year=2003&make=Subaru&model=Impreza http://www.epinions.com/auto_Make-2004_Subaru_Impreza/display_~reviews This is just one of the the hundreds of sites I found the give subaru high ratings.

http://www.jdpower.com/news/releases...asp?ID=2005069
Subaru has an average of 138 problems per 100 vehicles, 20 more problems than the industry average.

http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/u...x.cfm/id/2231/
Value in class: 4
http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/n....cfm/id/38235/
Value in class: 5
http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/n....cfm/id/38799/
Value in class: 3

Compare that to any Honda Civic which will get a Value of about 8-9.

Originally Posted by Graystone I grow rather tired of your know it all attitude.

Get over it. I know a lot and I'm not afraid to say that.

Originally Posted by capitalist_mao Get over it. I know a lot and I'm not afraid to say that.

Are you in college by chance?

Honda Accord. I have never heard anyone complain about theirs, and mine is a blast to drive.

I recommend certified preowned, there's no point in buying a new car unless you are rich.

Originally Posted by Graystone Are you in college by chance?

Yes, but I was hoping you would pay more attention to the systematic Crushing of the belief that Subaru Imprezzas are great cars.

get a new car under 10 miles on it, only if its a sports car, I went looking for a Mazda rx 8 and one that i wanted had 95 miles on it, I witnessed the car salesmen litterally beat the shit out of the car (break-in)

Originally Posted by capitalist_mao Yes, but I was hoping you would pay more attention to the systematic Crushing of the belief that Subaru Imprezzas are great cars.

OK if you wish I will say subaru suck as cars. Despite the fact that I have known a great many people with subaru's and have drove them hundreds of thousands of miles without major problems except for one person I knew who thought it was made for racing every place he went. I also know people with some of those great Japanese cars that last forever as well.

My point to asking if you were in college is the fact that their is an "elite" group of people that are in college. They think they know everything. You may have never seen this because you are that person the professor hates you cause you question everything, you never shut up and you walk around with coffee, and talk about how the economic playing field is being leveled by outsourcing.

Now one cares for this but the others around you.

Not trying to be a dick but the truth is a bad motherer.