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Is Blu-Ray all hype?

Blu-Ray launch titles underwhelm with soft, filtered video and mpeg2 artifacts along with Sony's inability to produce 50gb Blu-Ray discs - HD-DVD superior overall in video quality due to using the more efficient VC-1 codec:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=689168
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=688776
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=689241

Sony software Blu-Ray encoders cut black/white levels unlike HD-DVD:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=680008

Promised TDK Durabis "Scratch Proof" coating missing from actual Blu-Ray titles, Blu-Ray surface now most definitely more error-prone than HD-DVD's:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=689750

Not to mention that the first wave of Blu-Ray players don't support Dolby Digital TrueHD or Dolby Digital Plus like the Toshiba HD-A1 does. Hybrid DVD/Hidef discs as available on HD-DVD have also been scrapped for Blu-Ray.

For double the price of HD-DVD, why would you go for Blu-Ray? Might this be a small issue for Sony's "grand plan?"

I saw a Blu-Ray up and running at Circuit City yesterday... I was not impressed. It looked like a regular DVD to me, the only real difference I noticed was the sound quailty. It sounded very nice, but then again that could have just been because it was hooked up to such nice speakers, and the ones I have at home suck.

I still think that piracy is the main reason a new format is coming out, not because of picture quality.

i still dont know if I believe it, but what I do know is I am not spending another 1000 just to play blu-ray discs. I really want some video comparison of HDDVD and Blu on the same tv using HDMI cables to compare video quality

Blu-Ray isn't double the cost. Maybe we should wait until after Blu-Ray's first few players and movies to make comparisons. HD-DVD isn't exactly hot either, considering they're just launching both formats I didn't expect anything spectacular.

And even if Blu-Ray were slightly inferior to HD-DVD, it's the content that counts. What's the count, 7 studios to 3?

Originally Posted by Ikohn4ever i still dont know if I believe it, but what I do know is I am not spending another 1000 just to play blu-ray discs. I really want some video comparison of HDDVD and Blu on the same tv using HDMI cables to compare video quality

An A/B comparison isn't necessary. The current Blu-Ray discs look terrible while HD-DVD looks pristine. House of Flying Daggers is known as "House of Flying Artifacts" on AVSforum. Most Blu-Ray movies look like upscaled DVDs. Most HD-DVDs look better than HDTV broadcast. Whether Sony can fix this anytime soon is yet to be seen.

Sony really blew it with their launch with the poor video quality; checking any home theater forum (i.e. avsforum, hometheaterforum, etc) is proof of that. Rumor is now Disney may be going HD-DVD first due to the poor reception of Blu-Ray.

Originally Posted by TimPV3 Blu-Ray isn't double the cost. Maybe we should wait until after Blu-Ray's first few players and movies to make comparisons. HD-DVD isn't exactly hot either, considering they're just launching both formats I didn't expect anything spectacular.

We're not talking just one movie here:
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/hitch.html

Originally Posted by HiDefDigest The Video: Sizing Up the Picture - Geesh, just what is going on here? My fifth review of a Sony Blu-ray title, and another stinker.

Not one, not two, but most of the Blu-Ray titles released thus far plain old suck in video quality compared to HD-DVD.

And even if Blu-Ray were slightly inferior to HD-DVD, it's the content that counts. What's the count, 7 studios to 3?

What's the count of actual quality movies released? 10 on HD-DVD to 1 on Blu-Ray? Studios will jump sides in an instant once they see where the sales are. Not just talking about people who buy a disc or two for ps3 out of curiousity, but people who are actually interested in buying a lot of movies and hence buy a standalone player. Right now the Toshiba HD-A1 HD-DVD player is #280 on Amazon, the Samsung BD-P1000 Blu-Ray player is is #2096... And the Samsung should be the hot seller right now. Its not because the Blu-Ray software is so terrible currently.

I have seen them both and I feel HDDVD is better. In a previous post someone said that blueray looked like just upscaled DVD... that is exactly what my impressions were. Also at my circuit city their bluray player is hooked up to some sound system that cost nearly a grand in itself and that is probably the only reason of the "improvment" as ChrisNCali was speaking of. I sure hope HDDVD wins this out because of the superior quality and the affordibility. 30gigs is plenty...The only reason I fear for HDDVD is because the PS3 will have blueray which will have a leap in home installment base. But i feel the better technology lies within HDDVD

http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/...ad.php?t=98026

We already have a thread regarding the avs forums going nuts over this stuff.

i cant wait till regular old dvds start to get dirt cheap. I'll be buying regular dvds for the next 5 years at least.

Sony not living up the hype? Never D:! lols

keep in mind though these are mostly problems with the inherent release of the first disks. There is no reason to believe things will be improved signifigantly as time goes by.

Can we say Blu-ray is the next beta-max? UMD is already going down the hole----studios (except for the one Sony owns) and retail stores are all cutting back on UMDs.

Originally Posted by Chris in Cali I saw a Blu-Ray up and running at Circuit City yesterday... I was not impressed. It looked like a regular DVD to me, the only real difference I noticed was the sound quailty. It sounded very nice, but then again that could have just been because it was hooked up to such nice speakers, and the ones I have at home suck.

I saw the same thing at a Circuit City in Westland, MI. I couldn't tell the difference. Plus, the picture looked unusually soft.

Originally Posted by dragonxxiv Can we say Blu-ray is the next beta-max? UMD is already going down the hole----studios (except for the one Sony owns) and retail stores are all cutting back on UMDs.

Actually that's a very naive viewpoint. Blu-ray doesn't follow the same format. Blu-ray has the support from the majority of the studios (minus Universal). Big studios like WB will release on both. If anything HD-DVD has a higher chance of flopping due to lack of support. The problem with UMD was that it only worked on 1 device, the PSP. Also why would somone buy a UMD for a DVD they already own, the formula was destined to fail. Blu-ray and HD-dvd are the next step in the optical formats instead of a side tangent.

You people need to research this more. The problem is not inherent with Blu-ray technology but with the initial Release disks. If you look at the Displays at the Metreon with the Blu-ray trailers disc it looks fantastic. Do not expect Bluray to mature anytime before August.

Originally Posted by Zoglog Actually that's a very naive viewpoint. Blu-ray doesn't follow the same format. Blu-ray has the support from the majority of the studios (minus Universal). Big studios like WB will release on both. If anything HD-DVD has a higher chance of flopping due to lack of support. The problem with UMD was that it only worked on 1 device, the PSP. Also why would somone buy a UMD for a DVD they already own, the formula was destined to fail. Blu-ray and HD-dvd are the next step in the optical formats instead of a side tangent. You people need to research this more. The problem is not inherent with Blu-ray technology but with the initial Release disks. If you look at the Displays at the Metreon with the Blu-ray trailers disc it looks fantastic. Do not expect Bluray to mature anytime before August.

Yeah, you're right. Did anybody read the article about PS3/Blu-ray and 360/HD-DVD in the latest EGM magazine? If you haven't, you should. It has great interviews with CEOs/head officials from both Sony and Microsoft.

I think the only problem with Blu-ray is that it is freaking expensive. The cheapest Blu-ray player, the PS3, will cost an upward of $600-$700 and the movies probably in the $30-$40. I would rather get a Wii and 360 instead of a PS3 and just wait off on the whole next-gen dvds. Only the hardcore fans/tech geeks/filthy rich are gonna cough up nearly a thousand dollars for a PS3. In addition, the early models of the PS3s are gonna have so many glitches---anyone remember PS2's disc errors.

Originally Posted by Zoglog Actually that's a very naive viewpoint. Blu-ray doesn't follow the same format. Blu-ray has the support from the majority of the studios (minus Universal). Big studios like WB will release on both. If anything HD-DVD has a higher chance of flopping due to lack of support. The problem with UMD was that it only worked on 1 device, the PSP. Also why would somone buy a UMD for a DVD they already own, the formula was destined to fail. Blu-ray and HD-dvd are the next step in the optical formats instead of a side tangent. You people need to research this more. The problem is not inherent with Blu-ray technology but with the initial Release disks. If you look at the Displays at the Metreon with the Blu-ray trailers disc it looks fantastic. Do not expect Bluray to mature anytime before August.

When you have movies that have been made in the past few years on high end equipment, there is absolutely no excuse as to why the picture should look horrid. Sony has always tried to have a format out that competes. And what happens, it FAILS?

Originally Posted by Zoglog Actually that's a very naive viewpoint. Blu-ray doesn't follow the same format. Blu-ray has the support from the majority of the studios (minus Universal). Big studios like WB will release on both. If anything HD-DVD has a higher chance of flopping due to lack of support. The problem with UMD was that it only worked on 1 device, the PSP. Also why would somone buy a UMD for a DVD they already own, the formula was destined to fail. Blu-ray and HD-dvd are the next step in the optical formats instead of a side tangent.

The problem with "Greater studio support" is that studios will switch sides overnight. They just want the money. IMO HD-DVD has the advantage because they are significantly cheaper than Blu-Ray, are more consumer friendly (better name, hybrid DVD discs, less DRM), and currently look better than Blu-Ray for half the price.

You people need to research this more. The problem is not inherent with Blu-ray technology but with the initial Release disks. If you look at the Displays at the Metreon with the Blu-ray trailers disc it looks fantastic. Do not expect Bluray to mature anytime before August.

If you really did all of your research (or owned/watched HD-DVD on an ISF calibrated set), you'd realize that the 15gb/30gb discs offered by HD-DVD are more than enough to encode artifact-free reference quality movies in VC-1 on. Blu-Ray's 50gb dual layer disc is currently too costly to produce (apparently 1 out of every 100 BD-50s actually work compared to 95 out of 100 HD-30s) and won't offer significant video quality over HD-DVD anyway because VC-1 won't benefit from the extra space. Not to mention Toshiba has a 45gb triple layer disc in development - even though its been proved completely unnecessary.

The only the 50gb Blu-Ray discs are needed for is for Sony to compete using MPEG2 with HD-DVD using VC-1. MPEG2 on 25gb discs has been a disaster thus far, and with BD-50 too costly to produce and VC-1 not up to speed yet on Blu-Ray you really don't have many options at this point.

Even if Blu-Ray does bring quality up to the level of HD-DVD, what does the Blu-Ray backer get? Similar quality video for double the price and still the Blu-Ray user doesn't have the DD+/DD True HD (nextgen sound formats) that the $500 Toshiba unit has.

Knowing the specs of both formats and the codecs they can use, it is pretty clear to me that HD-DVD is the better choice of the two. It has more mature software, is less vulnerable to damage/errors than Blu-Ray, supports hybrid DVD/HD-DVD discs, has less DRM, and has more than enough space for movies encoded in perfect 1080p. All for less money than Blu-Ray. The choice is pretty clear if you are not simply arguing because you want your videogame console of choice to win - HD-DVD looks to be the better technology for now and the near future. Beyond that , the best Blu-Ray could truly muster is a tie - which isn't promising considering the price difference.

Originally Posted by GuilewasNK I still think that piracy is the main reason a new format is coming out, not because of picture quality.

I hadn't thought of that, but I think you hit the nail on the head!

Originally Posted by tilcfast I hadn't thought of that, but I think you hit the nail on the head!

Heres another reason.

The new movies that studios release now are all crap. Shit, theyre so bankrupt for ideas that they just remake old movies nowadays.

No one is buying these shit movies when they come out on dvd. The serious dvd collectors, the people who own hundreds of dvds, buy catalog titles (old movies from years ago). Not new release dvds that were in theaters 6 months ago.

Now the problem with that is. Once you own Jaws, and Star Wars, and Big Trouble in Little China, your not gonna buy them again. Maaaaybe they get you with a super duper collectors box and you buy the movie twice, but now what?

I'll tell you now what. Now the studios rush out a new format with some additional features so you can line up to buy those movies yet again.

Just look at the recent trend of releasing films sans features and commentary tracks. Every Harry Potter film was a 2 disc set for $20. The last Potter film was a featureless one disc release for that same $20. Or you could buy the 'special' 2 disc edition for $30 or more. King Kong did this also, with a $30+ 2 disc set, and many more dvds Im sure. And even the 'features' on that second Harry Potter disc pale in comparison to what was given on all the other Potter discs.

They are cutting back features and saving them for the new formats to sell you the same films again.

Lucas recently announced a new Star Wars original trilogy box set that was going to include the 'original' original trilogy, minus all the cg crap. They then annoucned that they would only be extras on a second disc, and would not be optimised for widescreen tvs, or play in high def, or have digital sound. Why did they do that? So they can sell it to you yet again in HD, or Blu-Ray, I guarandamntee it!

Originally Posted by Ruined The problem with "Greater studio support" is that studios will switch sides overnight. They just want the money. IMO HD-DVD has the advantage because they are significantly cheaper than Blu-Ray, are more consumer friendly (better name, hybrid DVD discs, less DRM), and currently look better than Blu-Ray for half the price. If you really did all of your research (or owned/watched HD-DVD on an ISF calibrated set), you'd realize that the 15gb/30gb discs offered by HD-DVD are more than enough to encode artifact-free reference quality movies in VC-1 on. Blu-Ray's 50gb dual layer disc is currently too costly to produce (apparently 1 out of every 100 BD-50s actually work compared to 95 out of 100 HD-30s) and won't offer significant video quality over HD-DVD anyway because VC-1 won't benefit from the extra space. Not to mention Toshiba has a 45gb triple layer disc in development - even though its been proved completely unnecessary. The only the 50gb Blu-Ray discs are needed for is for Sony to compete using MPEG2 with HD-DVD using VC-1. MPEG2 on 25gb discs has been a disaster thus far, and with BD-50 too costly to produce and VC-1 not up to speed yet on Blu-Ray you really don't have many options at this point. Even if Blu-Ray does bring quality up to the level of HD-DVD, what does the Blu-Ray backer get? Similar quality video for double the price and still the Blu-Ray user doesn't have the DD+/DD True HD (nextgen sound formats) that the $500 Toshiba unit has. Knowing the specs of both formats and the codecs they can use, it is pretty clear to me that HD-DVD is the better choice of the two. It has more mature software, is less vulnerable to damage/errors than Blu-Ray, supports hybrid DVD/HD-DVD discs, has less DRM, and has more than enough space for movies encoded in perfect 1080p. All for less money than Blu-Ray. The choice is pretty clear if you are not simply arguing because you want your videogame console of choice to win - HD-DVD looks to be the better technology for now and the near future. Beyond that , the best Blu-Ray could truly muster is a tie - which isn't promising considering the price difference.

Actually if you did your research Bluray discs now are not any more expensive to make than HD-DVD Discs (hence you see some Blu ray titles going out for 11-20 dollars). Despite the shoddy initial release it's far too early to assume that all Blu Ray will fail and have worse quality than HD-DVD. In the end you have to factor in the installed user base from people buying PS3s and the initial impact of having the majority of the studios. That just means more people will buy the player initially because they expect more support by seeing more titles available for it. Which disc is superior and which one you prefer in the end has only an extremely limited impact on the disc's success. Personally I don't give a crap who wins as long as we end up with only 1 format in the end. Even though only time will tell my money is still on Blu-ray (though sony sucks ass)