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Navy ad Bad.


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#1 Justme8800

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:06 AM

It's odd, I don't see any other topics about this. Maybe everyone else who feels this way has ditched CAG. Maybe the mods are deleting critical topics... that wouldn't be very classy, so probably not. Anyways, does anyone else see my point of view here?

After listening to last week's show, I wrote this after emerging from the shock of my treasured CAGcast going corporate. I was hoping to some kind of response, but I guess it wasn't inflammatory enough for that kind of trouble. I didn't spend all that time writing this so it could be deleted with one click... feedback?



Wombat,

Hey, I'm just one of your many listeners, so I probably don't mean a lot to you, but I need a favor. Would you please let me know if/when the CAGcast stops with the advertisement segments from the US Navy? I'm asking you because I don't think Cheapy would have enough class to read this far into this message.

That's really all I need, but if you want to keep reading, I'll explain why.

When a first found this show on iTunes a year or so ago, I was thrilled! It was everything all the other garbage commercial gaming podcasts weren't; funny, low-key, identifiable, and interesting. The CAGcast had an indescribable personality to it that was integral to its distinctive brilliance. Over time, I started taking it for granted... every week, I set aside a couple hours to listen.

When Cheapy stopped taking his lessons, he started to sound a little less in touch, less of a friendly Man in Japan, and more of a blank talking head from cyberspace. (At least, him getting out less is the best reason I can come up with, who knows really.) He didn't seem to pull us into his world as much, but he still retained his professional hosting abilities well enough to be worth listening to. After all, you were still there with your brilliant humor and adept button-pushing skills.

I was hoping that Cheapy having a kid would rekindle his fascinating social appeal, and maybe it will, who knows. Not me, though. When I first turned on episode #95, I was greeted with, instead of a familiar retro tune, Cheapy's voice telling me about the Navy. "Damn," I thought, "is this some kind of joke?"

No joke, as it became apparent. After listening with rapt attention to the birthing story (which is exactly the sort of thing that makes this podcast stand head and shoulders above others), the topic of advertising came up. "Well, maybe it's unavoidable. Maybe they need to do this to keep the show on the air or something." As I listened to the reasoning, my hand crept closer to the pause button. It was just too painful to listen to. I held out until the actual ad came on, and then shut it off. I couldn't believe it. I gave it one more shot the next day, and finished the show.

Now here's the issue. Advertisements are everywhere in our media and we're quite desensitized to them, and skipping 30 seconds, while annoying, isn't a deal breaker. The advertisement/sponsored contests you've done are great, and fun for everyone. Even advertisements for games would be cool, at least they would be relevant (though not any better than other podcasts). No, the first problem here is the choice of advertisers.

Regardless on one's position on US foreign policy, it's hard to argue that military recruiters are among the worst sharks out there. They prey on kids who don't know any better, convincing them that it's worth it to go through some of the most horrifying experiences this world has to offer, just to meet quotas. (This gets even worse when you consider concerned wars have absolutely nothing to do with defending one's country, but that's a whole different can of worms.) Helping these sharks by advertising them on your show is an incredible insult to your audience. Somewhere along the lines someone thinks that a significant portion of your listeners are the sort of people who could be convinced to go through with this by a radio ad.

Of course, all that doesn't seem like much compared to the second problem here; Cheapy's motivation for going through with this. He's under the impression that by turning the CAGcast into some lowbrow trashy ad-riddled slut of a show like all the others, insiders will think highly of him? He's lost sight of what made his show great in the first place! He doesn't even need the money? If that's no object, then the least he could have done is found an advertiser worthy of his show. Please try to talk some sense into him, please. I'll be over listing to the Shipwrecks until this blows over... or at least until they sell out too.

Well, I think that's the most I can do to get my point across. Don't take this the wrong way, I still think you guys are great, but I can't find it in my heart to support a show sponsored by the military. If I haven't pissed you off beyond reconciliation yet, and you're still considering for your UGO intern, I'd love to help you out (I do have experience writing, including a full-length FAQ for GameFAQs). Good luck with whatever path you take.

Sincerely,
~~~~~~~~, aka "Justme8800"

#2 rodeojones903

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:11 AM

Who cares. I'm glad Cheapy is getting some advertising dollars. Being a father is expensive. :D

#3 Bretts31344

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:24 AM

Who cares. I'm glad Cheapy is getting some advertising dollars. Being a father is expensive. :D


Agreed. Honestly though, the ads are kind of weird for a Video Game podcast. I really don't care. There are ads everywhere. People watch TV where 1/3 of air time is commercials (Football games are ridiculous). At least these are only 30 second ads.

#4 Richlough

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:27 AM

Uhhh , maybe because there's a CAGcast thread for every show .

http://www.cheapassg...ad.php?t=158720

Bitch and complain there please .

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#5 Justme8800

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:29 AM

Who cares. I'm glad Cheapy is getting some advertising dollars. Being a father is expensive. :D


Yeah, except maybe you missed the part where he's not even going to use the money. He just wants to look like a worthless commercial show, the kind that people like me don't watch because the ads are so rude and pointless... I think I said this already in the letter, didn't you read it?

Uhhh , maybe because there's a CAGcast thread for every show .



This isn't about that particular show, it's about the ads in general. I couldn't find a "constructive critism about the CAGcast" forum, so this is the most on-topic place to put it, no?

#6 PawnTakesKing

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:38 AM

Suck it up. Either listen and deal with it, or don't.

Personally, I'm glad Wombat is finally making some money off the CAGcast, since it was his idea anyway.
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#7 pimpinc333

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:47 AM

Wait. I don't get it. What exactely is going on? I stopped listening to the CAGcast at like #58 so excuse my ignorance.

EDIT: Ok I get it now :D

#8 thorbahn3

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:52 AM

Yeah this sucks. Now instead of listening an entertaining hour and a half show for free, I have to help the people who've been entertaining me for free for years by listening to harmless Navy ads for 60 seconds (the third is at the very end). Boo! Next thing we'll see are banner ads on CAG advertising TV shows and movies like the Sci-Fi channel's new mini series based off the wizard of OZ starring Allen Cumming.
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#9 Justme8800

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 04:54 AM

Suck it up. Either listen and deal with it, or don't.


Ugh, I know that. This isn't about me, or at least I hope I'm not the only one who isn't listening until the navy ads stop. The point here is that the ads come with a cost, and that is that the CAGcast will lose some listeners on principle by running them. Unfortunately, this crowd would largely not be represented here, because they're all gone.

So long as Wombat and Cheapy are aware of this cost, it's their prerogative to keep doing it. I just want them to know why I've chosen to stop listening. Is that not fair?

Yeah this sucks. Now instead of listening an entertaining hour and a half show for free, I have to help the people who've been entertaining me for free for years by listening to harmless Navy ads for 60 seconds (the third is at the very end). Boo!



Did you even read the OT?

#10 horrido

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 05:25 AM

Oh the drama...

#11 Captain Freeze

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 05:36 AM

I wish someone would invent somwthing that could speed up time so i could skip these annoyint ads.....


they should call it like 'fast forward' or 'Time Speeder'.



YEAH! i wish i could Time Speed past these ads....

#12 Slayzz

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 05:48 AM

Regardless on one's position on US foreign policy, it's hard to argue that military recruiters are among the worst sharks out there. They prey on kids who don't know any better, convincing them that it's worth it to go through some of the most horrifying experiences this world has to offer, just to meet quotas. (This gets even worse when you consider concerned wars have absolutely nothing to do with defending one's country, but that's a whole different can of worms.) Helping these sharks by advertising them on your show is an incredible insult to your audience. Somewhere along the lines someone thinks that a significant portion of your listeners are the sort of people who could be convinced to go through with this by a radio ad.


wait.....so you don't have a problem with ads but just NAVY ad? wtf....
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#13 KingBroly

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 07:02 AM

The ads aren't that bad. I just wish there was a better flow into them. It honestly sounds like Cheapy goes back and adds the ads after doing the show initially.
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#14 thorbahn3

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 07:20 AM

Ugh, I know that. This isn't about me, or at least I hope I'm not the only one who isn't listening until the navy ads stop. The point here is that the ads come with a cost, and that is that the CAGcast will lose some listeners on principle by running them. Unfortunately, this crowd would largely not be represented here, because they're all gone.

So long as Wombat and Cheapy are aware of this cost, it's their prerogative to keep doing it. I just want them to know why I've chosen to stop listening. Is that not fair?



Did you even read the OT?


Hell no. You wrote too much for a forum post.
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#15 SteveMcQ

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 07:38 AM

Justme8800,

I can't speak for Wombat or Cheapy, but I'm quite certain they don't care. The percentage of listeners who have such a big problem with ads that they stop listening is so miniscule that there's really no reason for them to cater to that group. And when the end goal is to broaden and diversify the CAGcast's reach and broadcast (past podcasting, which is what I think they intend with this branding) the new listenership they gain will far outweight what so few of you will skip out on.

It's like a few people sticking to some ridiculous notion that "boycotting" EA Sports games would have any effect. Supporters/buyers of their product are always going to outweigh the detractors.

And try to cut back on the drama. No reason to write a dissertation when you could have just said, "I will no longer be listening to CAGcast as I feel you guys are selling out by playing the NAVY ads." I mean, seriously...it was "too painful to listen to" having the ads? Here you are trying to write a seriously toned explanation of your actions, but you make it sound like you're listening to the dying last yelps of your beloved family dog. Woe is me. It's a podcast. We all enjoy it, but try to get some perspective on the whole matter.

And what does "class" have to do with reading your post, in regards to Cheapy? Now to me, what would seem classless is taking cheap shots at someone's character with arguments that have absolutely no basis. He chooses not to read your post (since it pretty much echoes what's already been said, might I add), therefore one must have no class. Yes, makes plenty of sense to me.

BTW, Private Messaging is your friend. Would've saved us the trouble of going through all this again if your end goal really was just to ask Wombat to inform you when the ad campaign would end ('cause you're special) along with applying for the internship. The rest of your post could've been put far more succinctly and also placed in the aforementioned CAGcast show thread.

Thanks for listening. You won't be missed.

Sincerely,

All CAGcast listeners

#16 Justme8800

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 09:38 AM

Thank you for your feedback, everyone. While it's not particularly comforting that I am alone in feeling this way, it's nice that my rant did not fall on deaf ears.

Yes, it's overly dramatic. For that I apologize, it's just to make the point. I really enjoy the podcast, I tried to make that clear, and I am very genuinely sad that my principles won't allow me to continue listening to it. It sucks to be someone who stands up for what they believe in. I doubt, especially at this point, that it will make any difference, which makes it all the more sad.

Regarding Cheapy's "class" when it comes to mail, I thought that would have been obvious. It may not have been the best choice of vocabulary, but I'm referring to his tendancy to skip over and ignore what doesn't look interesting to him (displayed in just about every episode when it comes to community contributions). It has come across especially blatently when he's done it in the live shows, hanging up on a caller he just accepted without a second thought. I meant no malice in saying that, and it's no doubt for the better when it comes to the show, but I could very easily imagine him glossing over this whole topic before finishing the title. Couldn't you?

As for PMing, I did send that to Wombat like a week ago, didn't I mention that? The reason I posted it here was because I felt like I had mailed it into a brick wall, and I didn't want all that drama to go to waste. If you couldn't tell, I was rather upset when I wrote that.

And thank you, Steve, for your sincere and comprehensive response, even if it was less than cordial. I mean no insult to anyone concerning this topic, I just need to either learn that I'm not the only sane CAG, or why I'm not sane. I think what I have to say is reasonable, and I thank those who listen.

~Justme8800

#17 mega_n00bzer

mega_n00bzer

Posted 10 November 2007 - 10:46 AM

are you paying for the show? no.
can you fast forward? yes.
quit being a whiny bastard

#18 mega_n00bzer

mega_n00bzer

Posted 10 November 2007 - 11:02 AM

The ads aren't that bad. I just wish there was a better flow into them. It honestly sounds like Cheapy goes back and adds the ads after doing the show initially.


he does

#19 CheapyD

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 12:14 PM

Regarding Cheapy's "class" when it comes to mail, I thought that would have been obvious. It may not have been the best choice of vocabulary, but I'm referring to his tendancy to skip over and ignore what doesn't look interesting to him (displayed in just about every episode when it comes to community contributions). It has come across especially blatently when he's done it in the live shows, hanging up on a caller he just accepted without a second thought. I meant no malice in saying that, and it's no doubt for the better when it comes to the show, but I could very easily imagine him glossing over this whole topic


Skipping over what doesn't look interesting to me is just another way to describe producing a show. If it's not interesting to me, I guessing it's not interesting to our audience either. I don't see what this has to do with my class, character, morals, etc...

Regardless of your thoughts of the military or our government's current administration, there is no denying that the US Navy is an A-list advertiser. In my opinion, turning down such an advertiser is not a wise business decision for us and I feel the potential long-term positves outweigh the negatives. You are certainly entitled to your own opinion.

Your opinions are important to me and I certainly encourage our listeners to speak their minds in this forum. It's times like these when I really wish we could produce a quality live show so I could talk to you "on the air". Rest assured, I don't skip over any topic in the CAGcast forum. At the very least, I read the first post in every thread.

#20 chronojin

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 01:03 PM

Cheapy,


No matter what anyone says we won't fault you for doing the ads. And yes people that don't like them can skip it.

If anything having an important advertiser like the Navy solidifies that your podcast is getting someone's attention.

"The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence"



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#21 DJSteel

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 01:08 PM

1UP has 3-4 commercials in their much shorter podcast...compare that with CAGCast...and it is nothing...besides they are providing a free service..why can't they cash in a little on their success...
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#22 Trenchalicious

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 03:10 PM

Don't worry OP, I have been very critical of the ads and their placement. Cheapy can see multiple sides of things, he's not an asshole.

One of the great things about this forum is, they let you speak your mind without deleting what you have to say. They only really delete spam and hate speech. Other than that, you can voice your mind without worrying about Big Brother censoring your thoughts.

#23 evanft

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 06:58 PM

I just skip 30 seconds ahead.

#24 crazytalkx

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 07:47 PM

I haven't been getting them (downloaded through iTunes) so I could care less :lol:

#25 Theduck

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 08:04 PM

I hate the fucking Army ads and the dumb ass sharks that go to schools and talk to kids about the Army Reserves.
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#26 Aleryn

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 08:13 PM

You're too sensitive, OP. Let Cheapy make some money to help pay for this site we're all using.

#27 dopa345

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 08:19 PM

I have no problem with a few 30 second ads for a free podcast, especially when the revenue from said ads are going to charity. Give CheapyD a break.

#28 Noodle Pirate!

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 08:27 PM

This whole website is set up to make money. Why would the podcast be any different.
From what everyone else has said , they are very short ads, so why not just zone out for 60 seconds or fast foward it past them. Easy peasy.
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#29 Halo05

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 08:35 PM

I hate the fucking Army ads and the dumb ass sharks that go to schools and talk to kids about the Army Reserves.


Yeah! Darn facists! Curse them for giving kids who can't afford college a chance to better themselves!

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As many of you know, black ops 2 is plaid with bugs, lag etc which many people have been suffering including me.


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#30 DesertEagleXIX

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Posted 10 November 2007 - 08:36 PM

I've said this in the other thread and let me say it again:

Cheapy and Wombat put at least 4 hours into every show. The Cagcast is usually a 90 minute MP3, with outlining and production I'm sure they put at least 4 hours of effort in. And yet people complain about a few seconds of ads. Jeez, can you be anymore ungrateful?

Now, If you are against the nature of the ad, I'd like to bring something up- an advertisement is just a suggestion. If you think people will drop their ipods, and run to their nearest recruitment depot, you're crazy. Study a bit of media effects, the 'hypodermic model' in particular. This model, although it's been outdated for 60 years or so, is what is used by anti-gaming groups. They also think people are so stupid and gullible, that we will copy Manhunt 2's on-screen mayhem.

By making statement like 'they(recruiters) prey on kids', you begin to sound like those conservative media 'analysts', who wrongfully worry that video games are rotting the younger generations minds.
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