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CAG may save the economy!


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#1 joeboosauce

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 03:31 PM

I read the following post about an innovative trade:
http://www.cheapassg...blog.php?b=6674
Cliff notes version: A fellow CAG trades Eternal Sonata for Bioshock and hotdogs and slurpee from 7-11 with a friend (preventing him from going to Gamestop...).

So, I was thinking this was a very innovative deal. I've been thinking with the economic crisis fanned by the credit crisis, that barter is a new way to engage in the economy. Could CAG be at the forefront of a change in our economy? Back to barter? Trade what we have? Not dealing in money we don't have ie credit! This is part humorour observation and serious observation. With things like craigslist, goozex, CAG, and just people bartering in general, this is having an impact on the economy.
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#2 yamas

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 01:48 AM

Spending (granted not on credit, money you have) actually saves the economy.
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#3 RAMSTORIA

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 02:18 AM

no

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#4 Magehart

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 05:05 AM

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"After the war, we looked on the Allies as occupiers," he says. "But after that we came to see them as our friends."


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#5 mtxbass1

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 05:13 AM

No?



#6 integralsmatic

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 05:25 AM

Spending (granted not on credit, money you have) actually saves the economy.


QFT....economy is down partially due to consumer fear with inpart by subprime mortgages and banks losing a ton of money. If 1 more giant bank goes down and the car industry sinks..be prepared people for the worst times of your life monetary wise.
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#7 Rig

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 05:45 AM

No.

#8 cochesecochese

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 06:35 AM

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#9 Grico

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 07:29 AM

Bartering hurts our current monetary based economy as it leads to less actual consumer economy. I guess theoretically it could represent a new economic model but I don't see how barter could sustain a global economy of any sort.

#10 epobirs

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 10:12 AM

Repealing idiotic laws that compel banks to make loans to people who shouldn't qualify would fix everything in short order. This is the one action the folks currently in charge won't even discuss because, well, that made it that way in the first place, including a certain Chicago attorney hired to litigate by ACORN in the 90s.
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#11 jbroush99

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 11:17 AM

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#12 keithp

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 12:05 PM

I will gladly pay you Tuesday, for a hamburger today!

#13 jaykrue

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 09:30 PM

Repealing idiotic laws that compel banks to make loans to people who shouldn't qualify would fix everything in short order. This is the one action the folks currently in charge won't even discuss because, well, that made it that way in the first place, including a certain Chicago attorney hired to litigate by ACORN in the 90s.


This.

Bartering hurts our current monetary based economy as it leads to less actual consumer economy. I guess theoretically it could represent a new economic model but I don't see how barter could sustain a global economy of any sort.


Quite the opposite really. The barter economy is as old as symbiotic creatures have been around. But no, imo i don't think the barter system can sustain a modern global economy of any sort.

The first reason is that the barter system doesn't represent exact quantifiable value of some things'/actions' worth. Is fixing your plumbing quantifiably equal to a ps3 console? or three ps3's? Without using an independent measurement system, it would be difficult to find a thing's 'worth'. Using currency or some other measurement system allows one to assign a fixed value at a certain time. This allows for more accurate accounting of some thing's value as well as breed competition between vendors to manage an accurate price when met at equilibrium. Some would make the argument that you could measure using the barter system. In my example, they would say that the plumbing might be valued at 2 ps3 consoles. But what if it was determined that the plumbing job is worth 1 and 1/2 ps3 consoles or 2 and 1/3 ps3 consoles? Unless you've got some engineering magic to make one-third of a ps3 work by itself, the barter would be inherently unfair to the plumber receiving fractional portions of a game system. So bartering would only work on a basic, rudimentary level.

The second reason bartering wouldn't help the global economy is, due to it basic mechanics, it can't scale proportionally. What if somebody wanted to build a hydroelectric dam? Again, if you tried to pay in ps3 consoles, do you think it would be practical? A person would not want several million ps3's (unless he need multi-core applications like Folding@home and even then it would be more of an isolated case) because it exceeds his needs (one ps3). It's far easier to accept currency which represents the dam's value than tangibly receiving something else that would be a logistics nightmare to move/transfer/store (such as several million ps3 consoles).

Thirdly, because it can't scale, bartering would be difficult to motivate huge groups of people to do a certain job since people all want different things. Going back to the dam example, say you were trying to get people (engineers, architects, electricians, construction, etc.) to build that dam, not all of them would be motivated to get ps3 consoles as payment. Some might want 2 consoles while others might want a/several xbox 360(s) or a Wii. With currency, you have a definitive (and more accurate) unit of value measurement that can be applied across the board and generally accepted as a form of trade towards products/services that people might want. Looking back in history, most of the great technological feats happened after the barter economy was slowly being fazed out for currency. Granted, non-monetary innovations such as assembly lines also contributed to these feats but then, how would you motivate a bunch of people to work on that assembly line?
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#14 epobirs

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 10:13 PM

Bartering hurts our current monetary based economy as it leads to less actual consumer economy. I guess theoretically it could represent a new economic model but I don't see how barter could sustain a global economy of any sort.


No. Money is not a replacement for bartering. It is an efficient extension of bartering. Money allows you to conduct trade with people do not necessarily have any goods and services you need or desire by allowing you to instead take the received value to someone who does have those goods or services.

If you have a skill, say carpentry, and need some plumbing work done, a monetary system means you don't have to search for a plumber who needs some carpentry work done, or worse, find somebody who needs carpentry and has something the plumber wants. You can instead use money to engage any plumber's services and let him decide how to apply the payment.

Money is just a universal proxy for the value of goods or services. The farther it gets detached from the more likely there is to be economic failure as it becomes solely a numbers game. This has been at the root of nearly every economic crisis in history.
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