Jump to content



Photo
- - - - -

ECA: Hal Halpin's Latest Statement: Changes are Coming


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
3992 replies to this topic

#1 caltab

caltab

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 12:55 PM

The new discussion thread is located HERE.


Latest update:

I recommend everyone read Hal's latest statement, it's his best statement to date and I believe shows the ECA finally has gotten our message. In it he offers better explanations for what happened with the auto-renew function, promises to notify members of changes to terms of service, and even apologizes.
http://www.gamecultu...ship-complaints
Spoiler


In my opinion, if the ECA follows through with what he's saying they will have done a lot to fix this. Also, a lot of his explanation and tone is much friendlier and clearer. They seemed to be listening to ours and others concerns and making right. For that, I applaud them.

12/9: The ECA has removed the section of the TOS referring to their ability to change your CC's expiration date, again a positive change that they should be commended for.


--------------
12/7 update:

Latest word from the ECA's Gypsyfly:
"Right now ECA is working on implementing an online option for members which will require creating a new business, accounting, and site module as the site never had this option. They will also notify members of policies changes via their members newsletters even though they are not required to, some items in the TOS will also be updated moving forward to better reflect the needs of members."

I'd recommend waiting a bit before spending the time and money on a certified letter, we'll hopefully be able to cancel a more convenient way soon.

...........

12/4 update: the eca has a new faq that includes info about canceling. They still require written notice. While they say it doesn't need to be traceable, I'd still recommend it given part 12 of their terms. They also now say they are working on another way to cancel and an option to disable auto renew.
http://forums.theeca...read.php?t=7158
Spoiler


I am pleased progress is being made, I still strongly feel they need to send an email to all members stating that the disable auto renew feature was never functioning. Also, while they say the feature was only available for a short time, there are indications it was available as far back as March and as late as the end of October (thanks blisskr for finding these posts). I wouldn't consider that a short period time, certainly its long enough to necessitate personal notice to all of their members. Please also note a mod responds to the March post and makes no mention of its non-functionality. I would also think that means they should have known about the button as early March, yet it was not removed until several months later. Additionally, according to several CAGs, the nonfunctional button gave verification that the auto renewal feature was canceled. It's very difficult to trust someone with your credit card information if such a major mistake is left on their website for months.


................

I am well aware that this is not a deal and many will flame me and say this is the wrong forum or that this is a re-post. However, at one point it seems like the majority of CAGs gave these people their credit card information in order to sign up for a paid or "free" membership. It should be emphasized that everyone who became a member(including free ones) had to give their credit card info, in case you have forgotten. Many if not all who signed up immediately canceled the auto renew billing feature using the website. It appears that it is now ECA's stance that anyone who did this did not actually cancel because it was never a working part of their website. They claim that the auto renew feature was only available for a limited time and never actually did anything because of some glitch, but anecdotal evidence from CAGs suggest it was online for several weeks and possibly months. Up to this point, they have refused to adequately accept responsibility for this mistake and have failed to personally notify their members of this problem. The original thread where I got this info from is found here, full credit should be given to Cager arcane93 for pointing all this out in this thread.

The ONLY way you can cancel your membership is by a letter through some form of TRACEABLE mail.

send your cancellation here, which according to their terms must be sent 30 days prior to your renewal date:
[FONT="]Attn: Accounting, ECA, 64 Danbury Road, Suite 700, Wilton, CT 06897-4406. [/FONT]

What info is needed to cancel?
Just say you want to cancel and include your full name and email.

THERE IS NO WAY TO TURN OFF AUTO RENEW- you can only cancel your membership, they say here that "You will be notified a month before hand of your account expiring. So you have time to cancel if you decided to do so." But according to section 4 of their terms you must cancel 30 days prior to your renewal date. Obviously, this is highly problematic.

---for those concerned about potential unwanted charges: the charge shows up as: "ENT. CONSUMER ASSOC" Phone number 203-761-6180 CT"

Here are some tidbits from the ECA mod's themselves, taken from their forum:

Was there a button for auto-renewing?
Yes, for some browsers, but it wasn’t intended to be there, wasn’t a working option and was removed as soon as we became aware

Why can’t we terminate via email?
Because the org has grown too large to handle the volume and requiring a mailed piece separates those who are serious from those who are lazy or finicky – joining and leaving repeatedly – and it gives us written documentation, a paper trail to reconcile against

Notable Parts of their terms of service:

[FONT="]5.[/FONT][FONT="]Right to update Credit Card Account Information[/FONT][FONT="]. If the credit card provided by Member to ECA has expired during an attempt to bill fees per section 4, ECA will revise the expiration date and proceed with billing using the same credit card account. <----this was removed from their TOS 12/9[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana]12. [/FONT][FONT=Verdana]Receipt of Mail. ECA cannot guarantee that it receives any mail that Member claims to have sent. Member should, at Member’s own expense, send any notices to ECA in a form to ensure to Member that the[/FONT][FONT=Verdana]ir communication arrived at ECA, which form may include but not be limited to FedEx, UPS, USPS Return Receipt Requested and USPS Certified Mail.

[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana] ECA's current cancellation policy, and Hal Halpin's response to concerns can be found here[/FONT][FONT=Verdana]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]Information about the ECA's views on EULA's can be found here
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana] ------
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]Consumerist article, second
Kotaku first article, second
Joystiq article
IGN article
Penny Arcade's comment
[/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana] Better Business Bureau:[/FONT]
http://www.bbb.org/c....on-ct-87070995
[FONT=Verdana]
ECA contact info:
[/FONT]
http://theeca.com/feed_back
phone: +1 (203) 761-6180
fax: +1 (203) 761-6184

ECA Sponsors(thanks NicaVic for list)
Spoiler

Edited by CheapyD, 10 December 2009 - 11:05 PM.
TOS change noted


#2 BaboonSqueezer

BaboonSqueezer

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 12:57 PM

I think a class action lawsuit should be filed against this company for their deceptive business practices.

#3 addicted2games

addicted2games

    游戏玩家为生活 !!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:02 PM

Maybe this should be stickied somewhere.

#4 RedGamer

RedGamer

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:03 PM

This is.. bullshit. The ECA are scumbags.

This is seriously extremely low of them.

#5 Guest_crazy blain_*

Guest_crazy blain_*

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:04 PM

What a fucking hassle

#6 darkpice

darkpice

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:06 PM

you wont get flamed for this one. this actually deserves to be here! good work op!
Retail Store Hustler

#7 lucid734

lucid734

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:08 PM

YIKES!..........What a Load! What a headache!

#8 nightmare452

nightmare452

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:08 PM

So, how do we cancel? By mail only, no phone number or such (not that I would call anyhow)

Now playing: Diablo 3 (360), Lost Planet 3, Saints Row 4, Rayman Legends, Killzone Mercenary, Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm.


#9 Ryukahn

Ryukahn

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:09 PM

This is not good at all.

#10 BarrettSan

BarrettSan

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:09 PM

What a load of crap. I can't believe I gave these jokers my CC info and only got one lousy Amazon code out of it!


#11 Kaoz

Kaoz

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:10 PM

[FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]12. [/FONT][FONT=Verdana]Receipt of Mail. ECA cannot guarantee that it receives any mail that Member claims to have sent. Member should, at Member’s own expense, send any notices to ECA in a form to ensure to Member that the[/FONT][FONT=Verdana]ir communication arrived at ECA, which form may include but not be limited to FedEx, UPS, USPS Return Receipt Requested and USPS Certified Mail.


[/FONT]



So in other words they are gonna throw everything out unless you can prove you sent it. They are ridiculous.
Posted ImagePosted Image

#12 volt1up

volt1up

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:11 PM

Wow, wtf.

Thanks for posting.

#13 Guest_crazy blain_*

Guest_crazy blain_*

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:11 PM

I can't wait to tell my friends who I got to sign up, who never got to take advantage of the Amazon codes by the way, what they now have to do so they don't get screwed.

Thanks for making me an asshole ECA!

#14 salazarmark

salazarmark

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:12 PM

Oh man! I only joined because of Amazon ECA codes, and I didn't even get those; BS man, BS!

Edited by salazarmark, 02 December 2009 - 01:25 PM.


#15 RedGamer

RedGamer

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:13 PM

Do we have any lawyers on CAG? (Like -good- lawyers? )

#16 Dakkon

Dakkon

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:13 PM

Wow, that's rediculous. I signed up too late to even get an Amazon code, and now I'm going to have to deal with this....uggh.

#17 Karyyk

Karyyk

    Brooding Insomniac

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:13 PM

I'd say that this definitely qualifies as total bullshit. The org has grown too large to handle the volume? What a freaking load. Thanks for posting this...

#18 Quadriflax

Quadriflax

    Consumer of Energy

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:14 PM


[FONT="]5.[/FONT][FONT="]Right to update Credit Card Account Information[/FONT][FONT="]. If the credit card provided by Member to ECA has expired during an attempt to bill fees per section 4, ECA will revise the expiration date and proceed with billing using the same credit card account.[/FONT][FONT=Verdana]

[/FONT]


Wow. That's some balls right there. Updating credit card information to take more money? That doesn't seem legit at all. I signed up with a virtual card through my Citi MasterCard, which I thought would prevent auto-recharge because it expired in a month, but I guess not? I wonder if it makes a difference that I closed the virtual card number right after I signed up.

Either way, wow. Guess I'll be sending a certified letter to cancel, just to be safe, and out of principle at this point. I never even got to use the Amazon discount. What a bunch of crap.

#19 BarrettSan

BarrettSan

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:14 PM

So if you call your bank and tell them to block any charges from the ECA, will that prevent the billing from going through?

Edit: Thank you for the info caltab, really good to know.


#20 webdoggy

webdoggy

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:15 PM

Thanks for the post op. What about the ones of us that used a "use once" pay pal credit card? I assume they wouldn't be able to charge it again as it would have expired and there would be no valid cc # anymore. Is that right??

#21 bradr

bradr

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:17 PM

I've actually canceled the credit card I used to sign up for ECA so I should be OK without sending any type of letter. That, in my opinion, is a pretty shady practice to try to keep their membership.

I remember when this first started, a lot of people were singing ECA's praises, saying what a great service they provide the gaming community. I wonder if anyone still feels that way?

#22 burningrom2

burningrom2

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:18 PM

I never believed in them as a reputable organization, but I didn't think they were a company in disguise. I'm sending them my cancel letter. thanks op. Fuck ECA

#23 foxdvd

foxdvd

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:18 PM

This is beyond stupid. I have never been so pissed at a company. I am NOT going to go through hoops to do all this shit. I will just dispute the credit card charge and point out that I did everything I was suppose to do to cancel and they changed the rules after I did. Easy enough, and I check my transactions like a hawk.

Game Informer needs a letter about this, along with anyone who has ever quoted ECA. They just opened a world of negative press. This needs to be posted at other places.
:bouncy:My beef bayonet is golden brown:bouncy:

#24 utopianmachine

utopianmachine

    Deal Ninja

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:22 PM

This is pure shit.

Thanks for sharing, OP. Guess I'll be sending them some mail soon.

#25 stk i wvu

stk i wvu

    CAG Veteran

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:22 PM

wow... eca might have just won itself a spot on the shittiest org of all time list for the next cheapy awards

#26 intoxicated662

intoxicated662

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:24 PM

eh it's crap on their part and they are going down. hope they are prepared to be offline for awhile and by the way my cc expires in a few days and i'm not getting a new one. screw them and I didn't even get to use the amazon eca discount. all that for 10% off people think about it..not worth the hassle

#27 Guest_crazy blain_*

Guest_crazy blain_*

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:26 PM

Well some people got 20% off. Oh yeah, that's why we no longer get 10% and that's why were getting hosed now.

#28 savagepastry

savagepastry

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:27 PM

I'm not a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that ALTERING someone's credit card information, regardless of whether or not they intentionally signed up for your service, is completely illegal, and they freely admit to it. Similarly, all but standing up and shouting "ha, ha, we're going to pretend we lost your mail" is also.

I never signed up for any of this, but someone who did and gets screwed by this could EASILY sue for fraud, deceptive marketing, bait-and-switch; the whole terrible corporate package.

#29 backseatdog

backseatdog

    CAGiversary!

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:27 PM

5 star the thread to alert everyone ppl

Best online trading website currently in my opinion.  Trust me I'm a CAG.

 

Banner2.png


#30 panasonic

panasonic

    Joanna Dark

  • CAGiversary!

Posted 02 December 2009 - 01:36 PM

what do we write in the letter?