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Playstation Division Loses $2.8 Billion


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#1 htz

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 08:48 AM

http://kotaku.com/59...oses-28-billion
http://www.reuters.c...E8490A120120510

Sony also sees an 11 percent decline in sales this year of its PlayStation games console, to 16 million.


http://www.industryg...redicts-gaikai/
^Looks like Sony will be the next Sega. :dunce:

#2 QiG

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:12 PM

The sky is not falling. Except for the Wii launch, it has been a historic trend for a manufacturer to post losses after a launch( Vita )
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#3 RedvsBlue

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:38 PM

This thread belongs on Gamefaqs...

#4 GBAstar

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:44 PM

^Looks like Sony will be the next Sega. :dunce:


Except Sony has a much broader portfolio then Sega.

I'll admit I'm much more into PS then the other consoles but I do own everything and as fan of gaming I will support everything.

Not sure why people like to see companies fail---other then their deep rooted fanboism (not directed at you OP).

Lack of competition is very bad for the industry and will result in lackluster games and promotions.

Whatever went wrong with Sony's finances this generations will hopefully get sorted out. They have their hands in many industries and I'd have to imagine that some of them are strong enough to float those that are losing money.

#5 RedvsBlue

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:51 PM

Except Sony has a much broader portfolio then Sega.

I'll admit I'm much more into PS then the other consoles but I do own everything and as fan of gaming I will support everything.

Not sure why people like to see companies fail---other then their deep rooted fanboism (not directed at you OP).

Lack of competition is very bad for the industry and will result in lackluster games and promotions.

Whatever went wrong with Sony's finances this generations will hopefully get sorted out. They have their hands in many industries and I'd have to imagine that some of them are strong enough to float those that are losing money.

I was thinking of posting something along the same lines and had it partially typed up. Then I figured there was no reason to feed the trolls.

The PS3 is far from a failure at this point, despite what CAGcast and Gamefaqs would have one believe, selling neck and neck with the 360 worldwide. The PSP was overshadowed by the DS but still sold a healthy 70+ million (meaning it has sold nearly as much as GBA). And of course the PS2 was one of the strongest sellers in history The Vita has been out worldwide for 6 months and not in any position to be a success or failure at this point.

Sega, on the other hand, came off of the monumental failure of the Saturn and followed it up with the another flop in the form of the Dreamcast.

damn it, now I got wrapped up into replying afterall.

#6 GBAstar

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:55 PM

I was thinking of posting something along the same lines and had it partially typed up. Then I figured there was no reason to feed the trolls.

The PS3 is far from a failure at this point, despite what CAGcast and Gamefaqs would have one believe, selling neck and neck with the 360 worldwide. The PSP was overshadowed by the DS but still sold a healthy 70+ million (meaning it has sold nearly as much as GBA). And of course the PS2 was one of the strongest sellers in history The Vita has been out worldwide for 6 months and not in any position to be a success or failure at this point.

Sega, on the other hand, came off of the monumental failure of the Saturn and followed it up with the another flop in the form of the Dreamcast.

damn it, now I got wrapped up into replying afterall.



Well I'm not an analyst and I don't know the numbers but what I do know is the failure of any company or any system/handheld is bad for the industry. Period.

I think the biggest problem that the PS3 has had is that it appeals to the more refined gamer/person.

If you go to gamestop or Walmart and you see people that appear to be from lower economic backgrounds what are they buying or buying for their kids? That's right... 360 and wii games.

The PS3 has always been priced higher (not overpriced) because it offers a more broad gaming and entertainment experience.

I'm not saying better and I don't want to start an argument but it was never marketed as a toy and they never made a dumbed down bare skin an bones version like the 360 so they missed out on the bottom tier of consumers that may be more attracted to the lower priced xbox and wii

#7 RedvsBlue

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:13 PM

Well I'm not an analyst and I don't know the numbers but what I do know is the failure of any company or any system/handheld is bad for the industry. Period.

I think the biggest problem that the PS3 has had is that it appeals to the more refined gamer/person.

If you go to gamestop or Walmart and you see people that appear to be from lower economic backgrounds what are they buying or buying for their kids? That's right... 360 and wii games.

The PS3 has always been priced higher (not overpriced) because it offers a more broad gaming and entertainment experience.

I'm not saying better and I don't want to start an argument but it was never marketed as a toy and they never made a dumbed down bare skin an bones version like the 360 so they missed out on the bottom tier of consumers that may be more attracted to the lower priced xbox and wii


Well, yeah there is that as well about less competition being bad for the industry. Look at what happened when Gamestop cornered the market. I remember when games were $50 new and could trade in for as high as $32-35 without needing some promotions to boost the trade-in value. Now new games cost $60 and you're lucky to get $30 for a trade-in (of course, unless you trade in 7 at a time...).

#8 Blaster man

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:27 PM

Well I'm not an analyst and I don't know the numbers but what I do know is the failure of any company or any system/handheld is bad for the industry. Period.

I think the biggest problem that the PS3 has had is that it appeals to the more refined gamer/person.

If you go to gamestop or Walmart and you see people that appear to be from lower economic backgrounds what are they buying or buying for their kids? That's right... 360 and wii games.

The PS3 has always been priced higher (not overpriced) because it offers a more broad gaming and entertainment experience.

I'm not saying better and I don't want to start an argument but it was never marketed as a toy and they never made a dumbed down bare skin an bones version like the 360 so they missed out on the bottom tier of consumers that may be more attracted to the lower priced xbox and wii


This is the kind of arguement I've seen put forth towards the PS3 since before it's launch. Why the hell do you think it's for "more refined" people? Second, if that's true (which I think is hogwash) - how is that a good thing for a consumer product that's supposed to appeal to the masses? They never intended for it to be for "refined" tastes, they just used it to push their blu ray format towards mass adoption. It worked but the cost of the console at launch was detrimental to their image and product line and allowed Microsoft's Xbox 360 to have a huge foothold, especially in the US (the number 1 market for games).

#9 vherub

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:44 PM

The Playstation Division is actually the "Consumer Products & Services" Division which includes TVs, Cameras, PCs, and gaming.
This division was badly impacted by the earthquake, but there are systemic problems as well. TVs have been in terminal decline (and this is not just Sony, but industry-wide). The earnings release has $1+ billion of that loss as a result of the TV segment.
Sony has been in trouble for a number of years, and is getting slammed by competitors, be it Samsung, Apple or increasingly Chinese companies.
The PS brand is far, far too valuable for it to be ended anytime soon. There seems more of a chance Sony would split itself into pieces, as it continues to evaluate what structural changes might be needed to right the ship.

#10 GBAstar

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:47 PM

This is the kind of arguement I've seen put forth towards the PS3 since before it's launch. Why the hell do you think it's for "more refined" people? Second, if that's true (which I think is hogwash) - how is that a good thing for a consumer product that's supposed to appeal to the masses? They never intended for it to be for "refined" tastes, they just used it to push their blu ray format towards mass adoption. It worked but the cost of the console at launch was detrimental to their image and product line and allowed Microsoft's Xbox 360 to have a huge foothold, especially in the US (the number 1 market for games).


Because more refined people understand you can do more with a console that has bluetooth, built in wifi and blu ray reading capabilities (all at launch).

And I never said it was a good thing. Offering a bare bones console with a teenie tiny hard drive, no blue tooth, no blu ray and putting a teenie tiny price tag on it would have certainly helped with sales (wait... doesn't that describe half of the xbox consoles to date? j/k)

That was my point. Sony has priced itself out of market with the "It just does everything" campaign. They thought that the high end new tech (at the time) would be enough for people to spend that money.


Edit: Microsoft brilliantly marketed itself to the ignorant consumer that bought it just because it was cheaper (I'm not saying you're ingnorant if you buy an xbox but that you are if you buy it just because it was cheaper; not because you liked it more) because at the end of the day if you bought a console, like the original arcade, you were going to spend just as much if not more upgrading it then you would have if you bought a PS3 (upgrades = HD, Xbox Live membership, Wifi adapter, etc.)

So the marketing for Xbox by offering a cheaper but ugpradeable console was and is the biggest reason why it is by far outsold the PS3 in the states. People never had a chance to buy a cheap PS3... they have never existed while Microsoft has always offered tons of options for a budget 360

#11 gamerpro4000

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:48 PM

^Looks like Sony will be the next Sega. :dunce:


I disagree with you on this one also. Sony's market is a lot more broader compared to Sega. These are guys who make electronics like sound systems, computers, phones, and even televisions. Although the company maybe struggling in the gaming system market, probably because the PSP Vita is complete garbage in my opinion, Sony still owns a big part in the movie and music industry. This is a company who meticulously sold their PS3 systems with a loss in profit just to beat the whole HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray battle and they were successful. Because of the Blu-Ray technology, buying used ps3 games has never been so easy as they are less likely to scratch up and that is a big plus for me. I think Sony is going be here for along time just like the PS2.

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#12 GBAstar

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:53 PM

I disagree with you on this one also. Sony's market is a lot more broader compared to Sega. These are guys who make electronics like sound systems, computers, phones, and even televisions. Although the company maybe struggling in the gaming system market, probably because the PSP Vita is complete garbage in my opinion, Sony still owns a big part in the movie and music industry. This is a company who meticulously sold their PS3 systems with a loss in profit just to beat the whole HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray battle and they were successful. Because of the Blu-Ray technology, buying used ps3 games has never been so easy as they are less likely to scratch up and that is a big plus for me. I think Sony is going be here for along time just like the PS2.



The Vita is garbage? OH noes.. I should really return mine and by the alternative HD Microsoft handheld gaming device. Thank yous!

#13 gamerpro4000

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 02:31 PM

The Vita is garbage? OH noes.. I should really return mine and by the alternative HD Microsoft handheld gaming device. Thank yous!


oops i meant the PSP GO

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#14 GBAstar

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 02:34 PM

oops i meant the PSP GO



Well I agree with you on that. The tech was great and it is a great device with a few mods but I don't think people were ready for an all digital device with no physical media.

That was a big fail

#15 camoor

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 03:23 PM

I love my PS3. I would not like to live in a world where my two choices were either kiddy Nintendo or shoddy M$oft.

While their products are more expensive, I think Sony makes great hardware with tons of options.

The fact that Sony's doing poorly makes me sad - it proves noone appreciates quality electronics anymore.

#16 GBAstar

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 03:27 PM

I love my PS3. I would not like to live in a world where my two choices were either kiddy Nintendo or shoddy M$oft.

While their products are more expensive, I think Sony makes great hardware with tons of options.

The fact that Sony's doing poorly makes me sad - it proves noone appreciates quality electronics anymore.



^ Yes and that is my point.

People would rather buy cheaper consumer electronics even though the odds are they are going to have to more frequently repurchase them or purchase upgrades rather then purchase higher quality and higher cost electronics.

I'm not trying to make a direct comparison between the 360 and PS3; but rather that most consumers would take the cheaper option when given a choice

#17 htz

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 03:54 PM

Don't take my comment regarding Sony being the next Sega seriously, I had the tin foil hat smiley placed after that sentence for a reason. ;) I also hope Sony does not exit the gaming industry, the PS1 is actually my first gaming console. It's just sad to see Sony doing everything right for the core gamer like giving us tons of exclusive/variety of games and still not sell as much PS3s as Microsoft which has been riding the COD and Kinect train.

They give the average consumer tons of value on there purchase with free online play(No fee barrier for using Netflix, and other apps) and even allow us to upgrade the hard drive freely which is important to enjoy everything the PS Store has to offer.

The sky is not falling. Except for the Wii launch, it has been a historic trend for a manufacturer to post losses after a launch( Vita )

The losses didn't mention anything about the Vita. They just mention last year's PS3 price cut, lower demand for PS3s, and Thai floods. I actually think Sony makes a slim profit off each Vita, hence why it was not mentioned as a factor for the losses.

The Playstation Division is actually the "Consumer Products & Services" Division which includes TVs, Cameras, PCs, and gaming.
This division was badly impacted by the earthquake, but there are systemic problems as well. TVs have been in terminal decline (and this is not just Sony, but industry-wide). The earnings release has $1+ billion of that loss as a result of the TV segment.
Sony has been in trouble for a number of years, and is getting slammed by competitors, be it Samsung, Apple or increasingly Chinese companies.
The PS brand is far, far too valuable for it to be ended anytime soon. There seems more of a chance Sony would split itself into pieces, as it continues to evaluate what structural changes might be needed to right the ship.

The Playstation Division is the Playstation Division. The company as a whole which includes the other consumer electronics products lost $5.74 billion.

#18 camoor

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 04:44 PM

^ Yes and that is my point.

People would rather buy cheaper consumer electronics even though the odds are they are going to have to more frequently repurchase them or purchase upgrades rather then purchase higher quality and higher cost electronics.

I'm not trying to make a direct comparison between the 360 and PS3; but rather that most consumers would take the cheaper option when given a choice


Don't take my comment regarding Sony being the next Sega seriously, I had the tin foil hat smiley placed after that sentence for a reason. ;) I also hope Sony does not exit the gaming industry, the PS1 is actually my first gaming console. It's just sad to see Sony doing everything right for the core gamer like giving us tons of exclusive/variety of games and still not sell as much PS3s as Microsoft which has been riding the COD and Kinect train.

They give the average consumer tons of value on there purchase with free online play(No fee barrier for using Netflix, and other apps) and even allow us to upgrade the hard drive freely which is important to enjoy everything the PS Store has to offer.


I agree with both of these posts. I feel that Sony has been really good to PS3 owners and once you know all of the features it is truly a fantastic device.

PS3 is seriously the console I had been waiting for my entire life. Internet multiplayer. Streaming movies. Wireless controllers. Music/Movie/Photo storage. Bluray player.

Then compared to the competition it's what I want - reliable hardware, no-cost mutliplayer, wide variety of gaming genres.

#19 Enuf

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 08:25 PM

there's a couple factors that I see
1-Demand for PSP & PS2 is still high & will continue for sometime.
2-There's still alot of E3 rumor's that show Sony will have much more success with Move & vita games coming which will boast the sales of both. A PS3 price still looks like it'll happen too. Now as for the vita price cut not going to happen UNLESS they have a newer version coming which is unlikely at this point either just based of the current sales of the ones already released. And when reading this statement it shows they're focusing on the software side too.

http://www.vgchartz....e-end-of-march/

#20 dirtyvu

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 12:10 AM

here's the craziness of Sony. market capitalization value of Sony in 2000 at the height of the PS2: $100 billion. Sony's value in 2011: 18 billion. that's a lot of money gone... heck, even Samsung's value is at $137 billion in 2011.

#21 uncle5555

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 12:31 AM

This thread belongs on Gamefaqs...


exactly....

http://www.industryg...redicts-gaikai/


Looks at article date...

Posted January 11, 2012

Umm yeah...:roll:

They're not going anywhere, if anyone Nintendo not changing with the times will be the first casualty, since they do games and nothing else, MS has Windows and other things, and Sony has their movie division and consumer electronics arms, they're more diversified.

...it proves noone appreciates quality electronics anymore.


^ Yes and that is my point.

People would rather buy cheaper consumer electronics...most consumers would take the cheaper option when given a choice


Look no further than each year at Black Friday to see that in action, want a cheap junky TV for $150, sold. High end electronics will be a thing of the past or only for high rollers with lotsa greenbacks to blow.
The CAG motto: "Maybe you'll luck out and get the game during a sale before it sells out, maybe not, that's the life of a CAG. Luck of the draw. And timing is everything."

#22 6er

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 12:41 AM

Epic has games in the works for vita, killzone vita has been confirmed, resistance is coming out soon, gravity rush is getting a lot of attention, and this will be the first handheld with a full.array of console quailty sports games.

Throw in the eventual GT for Vita( crap, if they just annouce it sales will pick up, they could probably port a toned down GT5), and sales are bound to pick up

#23 mrx001

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 01:00 AM

Epic has games in the works for vita, killzone vita has been confirmed, resistance is coming out soon, gravity rush is getting a lot of attention, and this will be the first handheld with a full.array of console quailty sports games.

Throw in the eventual GT for Vita( crap, if they just annouce it sales will pick up, they could probably port a toned down GT5), and sales are bound to pick up


I don't care about those games and here is a better link.
http://www.gamesindu...r-USD2-8bn-loss