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RPG Thread XVII - Talk of RPGs past.


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#961 j-cart

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 02:55 AM

To nobody's surprise, the Planescape Torment pseudosequel is using j-cart's favourite engine...



www.youtube.com/watch?v=toAEQTsidvg


So far the only game I can say that was of any worth was that BSG MMO that used UNITY. I hope that PE and Planescape sequel will at least be worth it, because so far nothing on that engine has really captured any sense of quality.

Also, learn to spell you crazy tree planter :P

#962 The Crotch

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 03:38 AM

And, Wasteland 2, also by inXile. Which is a terrible fucking company name, really.

They've said that they're probably going to launch the Torment Kickstarter before they can get a demo out for Wasteland, which is... unfortunate.

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#963 PrarieD0G

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 06:52 AM

I'm skipping Pokemon White and going straight to Version 2. Read a synopsis of the first game online; I think I'll be okay, heh.

#964 j-cart

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 06:53 AM

OMG inXile was the team that made CHOPLIFTER!

That was a stupid game. Feel sorry for anyone that paid money for it...

#965 Indignate

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 07:10 AM

...did you pay money for it?

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#966 fettmaster

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 07:46 AM

My place got robbed. Most of my game collection was in a room they didn't go in, but they grabbed EVERYTHING of value in the rooms they did go in. Sadly, I have lost the following MINT titles:

Persona 1 and 2
Threads of Fate
Chocobo's Dungeon 2
Legend of Mana
Persona 4 Golden: Solid Gold Edition (sealed!!!!!!!)
Final Fantasy XII-2 Steelbook case and the normal CE game
...and some others

We moved recently, and those were in a box of collectable RPGs I had yet to unpack/sort. They got our TV, laptop, PS3, 360, my cell phone and even our microwave...but losing those games hurts in a_different_way.

Booooo.

#967 Feeding the Abscess

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 08:20 AM

Beat Ys II today. It's still the better of the first two Ys games. The Chronicles+ versions of both were great overall; in particular, I loved the new musical arrangements, and think they outdo the Turbo CD versions that I'd been used to. Might be the best version of the Ys I & II OST yet.

Comparison: Turbo CD...

...vs. Chronicles.


I still have a ton in my backlog. Should be finally done with the PS2 ones by the end of the year, though.

Anyway, the DS is definitely (has definitely been?) an amazing system, especially for RPGs. The 3DS looks like it'll be just as good, too.


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#968 The Crotch

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 04:00 PM

OMG inXile was the team that made CHOPLIFTER!

That was a stupid game. Feel sorry for anyone that paid money for it...

I really do not know what to feel about about inXile. Everything they've done under that name has been varying degrees of mediocre to crap. I hope that they went though some sort of, "Yeah, we realize we haven't done anything good in ages, that's why we're going back to the genre and style of game that we know we're good at." epiphany, and not a "We're an unimportant company and we can't secure publisher funding for anything anymore so maybe we can use people's nostalgia to keep ourselves employed?" realization.

I'll probably back their imminent Kickstarter - something I didn't do for Wasteland 2 - though not to the extent that I did PE. And I doubt it will make as much money as either the PE or the Wasteland 2 fundraisers. But their options are either start the Kickstarter soon or lay off a bunch of staff, so I can't really blame them for going with the former...

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#969 dothog

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 04:37 PM

I agree that the name is stupid and the games are tepid, but they're made up of a lot of old Interplay people. That counts for a lot.
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#970 The Crotch

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 04:40 PM

It'll probably count for $30 or $40. Like I said, I'm hoping that this is a "back to what we know we can do" sort of thing.

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#971 R. Kasahara

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 04:41 PM

Now that I'm done running Adol into things for awhile, planning to dedicate more time to Tales of the Abyss. Over the weekend, the plot picked up and I was introduced to the new, short-haired Luke. Right now I need more cooking ingredients, though.

Spoiler


My place got robbed. Most of my game collection was in a room they didn't go in, but they grabbed EVERYTHING of value in the rooms they did go in. Sadly, I have lost the following MINT titles:

Persona 1 and 2
Threads of Fate
Chocobo's Dungeon 2
Legend of Mana
Persona 4 Golden: Solid Gold Edition (sealed!!!!!!!)
Final Fantasy XII-2 Steelbook case and the normal CE game
...and some others

We moved recently, and those were in a box of collectable RPGs I had yet to unpack/sort. They got our TV, laptop, PS3, 360, my cell phone and even our microwave...but losing those games hurts in a_different_way.

Booooo.

That sucks :-( Hopefully you already had your new place insured.
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#972 eldergamer

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 06:03 PM

It's taking forever to go through Persona 2 Innocent Sin . I spent about a half hour last night just going through the Abandoned Factory (side dungeon) in order to level up and get more cards.

Persona 2 Eternal Punishment should be released today as a Playstation Classic on the PSN Store. I'd say that pretty much rules out any chance of getting an enhanced or remake version for the :psp:

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#973 Indiana

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 06:55 PM

My place got robbed. Most of my game collection was in a room they didn't go in, but they grabbed EVERYTHING of value in the rooms they did go in. Sadly, I have lost the following MINT titles:

Persona 1 and 2
Threads of Fate
Chocobo's Dungeon 2
Legend of Mana
Persona 4 Golden: Solid Gold Edition (sealed!!!!!!!)
Final Fantasy XII-2 Steelbook case and the normal CE game
...and some others

We moved recently, and those were in a box of collectable RPGs I had yet to unpack/sort. They got our TV, laptop, PS3, 360, my cell phone and even our microwave...but losing those games hurts in a_different_way.

Booooo.


That sucks. I hope insurance is replacing your stuff.

#974 j-cart

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 07:19 PM

...did you pay money for it?



Never had to, I saw the game during its XBLA/PSN development run. Felt sorry for those guys...


My place got robbed. Most of my game collection was in a room they didn't go in, but they grabbed EVERYTHING of value in the rooms they did go in. Sadly, I have lost the following MINT titles:

Persona 1 and 2
Threads of Fate
Chocobo's Dungeon 2
Legend of Mana
Persona 4 Golden: Solid Gold Edition (sealed!!!!!!!)
Final Fantasy XII-2 Steelbook case and the normal CE game
...and some others

We moved recently, and those were in a box of collectable RPGs I had yet to unpack/sort. They got our TV, laptop, PS3, 360, my cell phone and even our microwave...but losing those games hurts in a_different_way.

Booooo.



Sucks, file that police report. They will do nothing, but at least it is on record as your possessions. Then start looking at ebay and craigslist for some shady person trying to sell the exact same stuff.


I really do not know what to feel about about inXile. Everything they've done under that name has been varying degrees of mediocre to crap. I hope that they went though some sort of, "Yeah, we realize we haven't done anything good in ages, that's why we're going back to the genre and style of game that we know we're good at." epiphany, and not a "We're an unimportant company and we can't secure publisher funding for anything anymore so maybe we can use people's nostalgia to keep ourselves employed?" realization.

I'll probably back their imminent Kickstarter - something I didn't do for Wasteland 2 - though not to the extent that I did PE. And I doubt it will make as much money as either the PE or the Wasteland 2 fundraisers. But their options are either start the Kickstarter soon or lay off a bunch of staff, so I can't really blame them for going with the former...



Their previous games under the inXile name were pretty mediocre at best. Maybe these old guys are too old to hack it in the new industry.


I agree that the name is stupid and the games are tepid, but they're made up of a lot of old Interplay people. That counts for a lot.



Or maybe they are too old that they can't hack it with the top developers in the industry today. Playing Devil's Advocate here :D


It'll probably count for $30 or $40. Like I said, I'm hoping that this is a "back to what we know we can do" sort of thing.



I sure hope so.

#975 SinOfHeart

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 07:58 PM

Now that I'm done running Adol into things for awhile, planning to dedicate more time to Tales of the Abyss. Over the weekend, the plot picked up and I was introduced to the new, short-haired Luke. Right now I need more cooking ingredients, though.

Spoiler


I don't think I've ever really delved much at all into the cooking part of the Tales games, I usually cook once or twice and then kind of ignore it, haha.

Spoiler


My place got robbed. Most of my game collection was in a room they didn't go in, but they grabbed EVERYTHING of value in the rooms they did go in. Sadly, I have lost the following MINT titles:

Persona 1 and 2
Threads of Fate
Chocobo's Dungeon 2
Legend of Mana
Persona 4 Golden: Solid Gold Edition (sealed!!!!!!!)
Final Fantasy XII-2 Steelbook case and the normal CE game
...and some others

We moved recently, and those were in a box of collectable RPGs I had yet to unpack/sort. They got our TV, laptop, PS3, 360, my cell phone and even our microwave...but losing those games hurts in a_different_way.

Booooo.


I know that feeling, had my apartment broken into back in college and lost a bunch of consoles and my laptop (didn't take any TVs though). Luckily they didn't really touch any of my games either, other than getting away with some discs that were in the consoles. Insurance ended up paying to replace everything after the somewhat high deductible was payed (still far less than the cost of everything I lost though). For sure contact the police if you haven't, it will make filing the insurance claim fairly easy.

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#976 The Crotch

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 08:26 PM

Their previous games under the inXile name were pretty mediocre at best. Maybe these old guys are too old to hack it in the new industry.

Yep, that's the fear. And it's all-but-confirmed that Avellone won't be involved in the project, which is disappointing but not surprising. Dude's probably pretty god damn tired of every interview ever asking him about Planescape Torment, anyway.

If I interviewed him, I'd ask him whose idea it was to put that stupid fucking ghost quest in Fallout 2. But nobody has the guts to ask Tough Questions like that.

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#977 j-cart

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 08:43 PM

Yep, that's the fear. And it's all-but-confirmed that Avellone won't be involved in the project, which is disappointing but not surprising. Dude's probably pretty god damn tired of every interview ever asking him about Planescape Torment, anyway.

If I interviewed him, I'd ask him whose idea it was to put that stupid fucking ghost quest in Fallout 2. But nobody has the guts to ask Tough Questions like that.



You should look into this thing called twitter. Sometimes popular people will answer the Tough Questions like that on there.

Also, there should be more SWTOR talk here :P

#978 The Crotch

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 02:50 AM

The only time I tweeted Avellone was to tell him that I'd been pronouncing his last name wrong for years. He said it was okay and actually I was right anyway but his family dropped the hard "e" sound when they came to the US so that's the pronunciation everyone uses now.

Also, it's PE update day, focusing on one of my favourite topics: combat mechanics! More specifically, Attacks of Opportunity, something that I think is damn important (and historically underpowered, if not altogether absent) in this sort of game.



Last week, our art director, Rob, showed you our godlike concepts and dazzled you with an in-depth technical breakdown of how we're doing animation rigging on the project. This week, we'll be talking about a different technical subject, but one that's more connected to gameplay: engagement -- specifically, melee engagement.

Melee engagement is a solution to two common problems in the Infinity Engine games: melee characters' inability to control an area and ranged characters' ability to "kite" melee characters. In the Infinity Engine games, melee characters could be quite powerful in toe-to-toe combat, but many opponents found ways to foil those characters with little difficulty. Fast characters could easily rush around a slower melee character with impunity and ranged characters could backpedal perpetually out of reach.

If you're familiar with D&D 3E/3.5/4E/Pathfinder's attack of opportunity mechanics, Project Eternity's melee engagement fills a similar role by making melee combatants "sticky". Coming near a melee combatant means being drawn into Engagement with him or her, a state that can be risky to get out of.

Here's how it works: when two opposed combatants come near each other and one of them a) has a melee weapon equipped b) is not moving and c) is not currently at his or her maximum limit of engagement targets (the standard is 1), the other character will be Engaged.

When an opponent is Engaged by an attacker, moving any significant distance away from the attacker will provoke a Disengagement Attack. A Disengagement Attack has an inherent Accuracy bonus, does significantly more damage than a standard attack, and will call a hit reaction animation while momentarily stopping the character's movement.

When it's initiated, a Disengagement Attack automatically breaks Engagement on the target, but if the target is also the attacker's current melee target, the attacker will typically be able to re-establish Engagement before the target can move farther away. In this manner, melee combatants, especially ones that have high Accuracy and damage per hit, have a solid mechanic for keeping enemies close to them -- or making the cost of escape extremely expensive.

Of course, there are other ways to end Engagement. If the attacker switches to a non-melee weapon or performs a non-melee-based action, Engagement immediately ends. If the attacker moves away from their Engagement targets, is paralyzed, knocked down, or otherwise prevented from maintaining a threat, Engagement will also immediately end. If the attacker has a limited number of Engagement targets (as most do) and switches his or her attack focus to a different character, Engagement immediately ends.

We believe that Engagement can give AI a clear "decision point" where they can evaluate the threat of their new status and choose the appropriate course of action. For player-controlled characters, it makes melee enemies more potent threats and presents players with tactical challenges to solve.

We want Engagement to be a mechanic that players and enemies can mess with using a variety of class Abilities and general Talents, so we will be experimenting with a variety of elements to that end:

  • Fighters' Defender mode allows them to engage two additional targets and increases the range at which they engage targets. This gives fighters much greater capability to control the area around them.
  • The limited-use Escape ability lets rogues break Engagement without provoking a Disengagement Attack. It is generally best used when the rogue's enemy is preoccupied with another target.
  • Barbarians can use Wild Rush to temporarily ignore the movement stop and hit reactions from Engagement and Disengagement Attacks, respectively -- though they can still suffer massive damage while powering through.
  • The wizards' Grimoire Slam allows them to attack an enemy in melee with their magically-charged grimoires, unleashing a concussive wave of energy on contact. If it hits, the attack knocks the target back, usually far enough to break Engagement in the process.

Additionally, creatures may have their own special abilities related to Engagement and Disengagement Attacks. We hope that the system itself is easy to understand but allows for increasingly complex tactical considerations over the course of the game.

I like everything I heard. Running past melee enemies was way too easy in the IE games, and even the more modern NWN/NWN2/DAO. Kiting was also comically easy in a lot of fights.

Come to think of it - holy shit, DAO didn't have any sort of Attack of Opportunity mechanic. What the Fuck, Bioware? God damn Neverwinter Nights had them!

Edited by The Crotch, 27 February 2013 - 03:03 AM.

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#979 Action!

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 04:30 AM

Hey guys, maybe a little out of left field, but this seemed like the best place to ask.

I'm trying to gather up a bunch of old school RPG reference. I'm primarily looking for guides and instruction manuals that are art-heavy. Weapons, armor, characters; stuff like the Super Mario RPG guide, FF Tactics guide, and Chrono Trigger Perfect Bible come to mind. Also rocking the FF9 artbook.

Diggin this kind of stuff:
Spoiler


I'm working on a little side project that's meant to feel real "early 90s RPG" and I wanted to get some outside opinions. Thought I'd see if anyone here had any input. Doesn't even necessarily have to be from an RPG. I'm mostly just trying to capture that 90s art feel.

Thanks either way!

#980 Indignate

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 04:32 AM

1. Print out the english translation of Xenogears Perfect Works or if you're feeling adventurous, try to procure a Japanese copy if that's even still a thing that people can do.

2. Never have to worry about anything else.

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#981 Action!

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 04:37 AM

1. Print out the english translation of Xenogears Perfect Works or if you're feeling adventurous, try to procure a Japanese copy if that's even still a thing that people can do.

2. Never have to worry about anything else.



Haha, that was a quest I gave up on long ago. I have a PDF right hurr. It's fantastic, but I'm also looking for some stuff from the--I don't want to say "kiddie" end of the spectrum--but well, the kiddie end of the spectrum. Been thinking about going back to grab that fan-made Mother 3 Handbook.

#982 kainzero

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 05:53 AM

1. Print out the english translation of Xenogears Perfect Works or if you're feeling adventurous, try to procure a Japanese copy if that's even still a thing that people can do.

oh, surely the japanese one can't be that rare. i bet it's easy to find if you're japanese.

wait a minute.

oh. never mind then. carry on.
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#983 R. Kasahara

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 03:44 PM

Hey guys, maybe a little out of left field, but this seemed like the best place to ask.

I'm trying to gather up a bunch of old school RPG reference. I'm primarily looking for guides and instruction manuals that are art-heavy. Weapons, armor, characters; stuff like the Super Mario RPG guide, FF Tactics guide, and Chrono Trigger Perfect Bible come to mind. Also rocking the FF9 artbook.

Diggin this kind of stuff:

Spoiler


I'm working on a little side project that's meant to feel real "early 90s RPG" and I wanted to get some outside opinions. Thought I'd see if anyone here had any input. Doesn't even necessarily have to be from an RPG. I'm mostly just trying to capture that 90s art feel.

Thanks either way!

Square's "Ultimania" guidebooks have a fair amount of art and aren't too hard to get ahold of.

I really want to get the Final Fantasy 25th Memorial Ultimania Vol. 2, which features 7-9, but it's hardcover and will cost a lot to import as far as shipping fees go, unless I include it in a big Amazon.co.jp order. From what I've seen of the FF Memorial Ultimanias, they're more image-focused and less like huge game guides.

Also, if you're into Dragon Quest at all, there is a fantastic monster encyclopedia that came out for the 25th anniversary. It has art for every monster in the series up until that point, plus screenshots showing how they've appeared in different Dragon Quest games over the years. I got a copy last year and love it.
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#984 Action!

Action!

    King Koopa.

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 04:13 PM

Man, I've always eyeballed those Ultimanias. Especially the ones for FF9 and Vagrant story. Have you seen many? I'd just hate to start getting invested in them and discovering more screenshots and promo art than illustrations. This could quickly get to be an expensive venture.

That DQ monster encyclopedia looks incredible, by the way.

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#985 R. Kasahara

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 04:24 PM

The only Ultimania I have is the Final Fantasy VII Ultimania Omega. For artwork, mainly there's a handful of pages of concept art in the back, character art (for the main, Shinra, and some of the supporting characters) near the front, illustrations for all of the items and weapons in the game (pulled from FFVII International's fourth disk), and a lot of screenshot thumbnails.

Also remembered that for straight-up artbooks, Square/DigiCube used to have a series called "Visual Art(s) Collection", which mainly focus on character designs and promo art, but there are barely any of those for PS1-era and older games. The ones I have are for Kingdom Hearts, FFX-2, and Unlimited SaGa.

And another thing I just thought of: there's a company in Japan called Kusanagi which a lot of RPG makers outsource background art to, and there's a whole series of hardcover books of the work they've done for games and anime. They're pretty expensive for what you get, however.

Edited by blueshinra, 27 February 2013 - 04:34 PM.

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#986 eldergamer

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 05:19 PM

So...

Unchained Blades won the PSN Gamer's Choice for best :psp: game.

It's on sale (for plus) for $14.69. Tempted to pick it up. Looks like a first person dungeon crawler that has monster collecting, a sphere grid upgrade system and even some rhythm elements (?)

Any opinions?

Also, what is the Dungeons & Dragons Daggerfall game on PSN.

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#987 elessar123

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 05:49 PM

So...

Unchained Blades won

Any opinions?


You'll like it.

#988 j-cart

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 12:10 AM

Okay, when they mention Pathfinder in the Project Eternity Update #44 video, I get what you mean about the combat change Crotch.

I like the idea of it, sure hope it becomes practical in gameplay.

#989 The Crotch

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    I was famous and I was powerful.

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 12:45 AM

Okay, when they mention Pathfinder in the Project Eternity Update #44 video, I get what you mean about the combat change Crotch.

Ironically, I know nothing about Pathfinder aside from it being very popular with people who hated 4e. But I'll assume everything's cleared up, anyway.

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#990 Kazaganthi

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 01:35 AM

Hope this is the right place to ask, I never see much MMO talk. With all this news about FF14 shutting down, fully rebuilding game, relaunching a new version of the game/beta, I remembered an old story. I'm not a big MMO fan, but I'm still very curious as to what Sqaure Enix's 3rd MMO was supposed to be? Anyone know/speculate?

http://www.siliconer...-budget-mmorpg/
http://www.videogame...april_2012.html

It was supposed to be announced around March/April 2012.