CAGcast #323: Clue Shack

[preview][IMG-L=5838]15060[/IMG-L]Cheapy visits the mountains and plays Star Command, Wombat enjoys Poker Night, and Shipwreck suffers through both Kmart and Star Trek.

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[podcast]233[/podcast]
Download (1 hour 25 minutes) - iTunes
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Show Linkage/Notes:

Intro/Outro: Soul Grabber Part 3 - GI JOE PSA


[quote name='bickle']Show Notes

0:30 Wombat's bday
3:45 Tokoyo wine tasting
7:45 Bioshock Infinite comment feedback
15:15 New Releases
15:15 - Farcry Blood Dragon
22:15 - Deadly Premonition Director's Cut
23:00 - Soul Sacrifice
24:30 - Poker Night 2
28:00 - Xenoclash 2
29:30 Fez
30:00 Strikesuit Infinity (sp?) & Trackmania
34:15 The Testament of Sherlock Holmes
38:00 Star Trek the videogame
46:45 Aliens: Colonial Marines lawsuit
50:15 Game Dev Tycoon
54:30 Respawn rumors
57:00 Xbox rumors - achievements, friends
1:01:30 No Nintendo press conference at E3
1:07:00 Robot Unicorn Attack 2
1:07:45 Star Command
1:10:45 Cagbag
1:10:45 - GTA5 trailer
1:16:00 Console names
1:20:30 Prices: consoles vs ipads
1:22:30 Google Glass[/QUOTE]


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Eager to see what CheapyD has to say about being shafted by Microsoft!

Shippy, play Far Cry 3! FC3: Blood Dragon gives you all the moves that you need to work for in vanilla FC3 so you might be spoiled when you finally get to play FC3. But FC3 is still worth picking up whenever.

As for the Uplay talk, the worst thing about it for Steam is that it's a separate launcher. And we can't earn Steam achievements which annoys the shit outta me. Uplay achievements are lame since no one can see them unless you add them to your Uplay friend list and who do you really have on there that cares about Uplay?

Don't forget everyone! This weekend is FREE COMIC BOOK DAY! And a nice lead into el Cinco.

Cannot wait for Free Comic Book Day this Saturday!

Thanks guys!

Haven't listened to the new show yet, but thought I'd pop in to wish Wombat a Happy Birthday. Enjoy your day/week.

Thanks for the Bioshock Infinite spoilers Cheapy.

I suggest anyone wanting to avoid spoilers skip 11:00 - 12:00.

Ship, you really hate the Star Trek game more than Walking Dead Survival Instincts? Was it just because you were expecting/hoping it would be good going in?

And because it's Wombat's birthday, here's a Boatcrash Chronicles On Demand Edition:

[quote name='meager']Ship, you really hate the Star Trek game more than Walking Dead Survival Instincts? Was it just because you were expecting/hoping it would be good going in?

And because it's Wombat's birthday, here's a Boatcrash Chronicles On Demand Edition:

[/QUOTE]

tears running down my face from laughing

Sorry for being one of the people annoyed with your bioshock discussion. But also, if Wombat's changes to the game were made it would have been awful. Never try to cater a game to Cheapy D. Saints Row is great but some games can be deeper.

Wombat I think you were talking about the PS3 when it comes to DRM options. I know 2 Capcom downloadable games (Bionic Commando Rearmed and Final Fight/Magic Sword) for the PS3 needs a internet connection to play. They don't need one for the 360 to work.

FYI XCOM: Enemy Unkown is coming to the iPad. As far as I know, it's the first current-generation AAA title to be fully ported over to iOS.

Re: Soul Sacrifice, you hear a hint of Demon's Souls and you just go running for the hills like you've seen Batman hurling chocolate-covered batarangs...

As the last person on the CAGcast not to try it, one of these days I think Wombat should play Demon's Souls or Dark Souls, I really think it would appeal to him if he can play past the initial adjustment period that both Cheapy and Shipwreck failed to pass. Since he has PS+ (I think) he can even play one of them (Demon's Souls) for free currently.

Regarding the "no developer would be stupid enough to make it so people can't play their games" discussion, you only have to go back a few months to find high profile blunders with always on DRM like Sim City and Diablo 3. Also, I can't count how many times a new, high profile game has had trouble with their multiplayer servers at launch. What if instead of hiccups with multiplayer you just couldn't play the game at all?

Always on DRM is already possible on the existing system for downloadable games (at least on the PS3), more recently released Capcom download games like Bionic Commando Rearmed 2 have always on DRM so it was impossible to play this single player game (and others) while the PSN was down due to hacking.

Sporadic application of always on DRM for disc games on the new consoles is almost as bad as the onus to suss out which games have that feature will fall on the consumer to have to figure out (or find out after they've already purchased it) instead of it being a given that you will need or won't need an online connection.

Happy Birthday, Wombat!
Great show, as always.
And, ignore the haters that say you got Bioshock Infinite wrong. It was a great game, but not the greatest.
Thanks for the warning about Star Trek. Will avoid it.

[quote name='eataburger']Thanks for the Bioshock Infinite spoilers Cheapy.

I suggest anyone wanting to avoid spoilers skip 11:00 - 12:00.[/QUOTE]

God damn it. Wish I had read this beforehand.

Happy Birthday Wombat.

Shipwreck. Play the Soul Sacrifice demo if you want to see if you might like it. The demo has the games first chapter and can be played offline or online.

About the lawsuits. Just think about how many stupid lawsuits won people millions of dollars? The one woman who thought the Winnebago's cruise control was the same as auto pilot so went and made a sandwich, the woman who sued McDonald's because apparently coffee isn't hot so don't be careful, etc, etc.

Wombat, if you're headed into the city this weekend, you should check out the Koch Comics Warehouse in Brooklyn. It's accessible by train, 36th Street on the N or D line, after go into the subway at Atlantic Avenue. Walk down to 41st, make a right and keep walking past under the expressway and at 2nd ave you'll find some movie posters. Inside is a huge place full of random comic books and stuff. I've never seen so many old GI Joe comics in one place before.

Here's my thoughts on Soul Sacrifice having played it a ton the past few days:

1. It's a good game, but it is VERY repetitive and a bit grindy. You'll be killing the same bosses and characters in the same levels OVER AND OVER. You CAN play through the single player on your own for the story. I really like the story. But some of the last few levels can get a little tricky (namely cerberus but he isn't too bad if you know to use the shield to knock him down and follow up with some projectiles). But you're probably going to want to play a multiplayer to level up a bit.

2. Multiplayer is where the game really shines because you can coordinate with your friends or randoms. You can play the multiplayer levels on your own with npcs or with people online. The monsters get a bit stronger, but when you have more people but you get more outs because each of you can cast a dark rite, sacrifice each other and even lower the bosses defense by tapping it once dead.

3. I've had nothing but positive experiences with the multi. It's so much more chaotic and fun. You're constantly running out of stuff to cast and looking for stuff to sacrifice so you can cast again. The scoring system basically rewards you the most for finishing the bosses fast. If you finish fast you probably took less damage and took out some cursed parts and made a lot more quick sacrifices for even more points. So it's all about speed.

4. The only thing it has in common with Demon's Souls is the style of the game, being another RPG that you'll spend a ridiculous amount of time playing. It's not frustrating at all. It has a crafting system similar to how bosses in demon's souls drop unique souls where each enemy drops items you use to make new spells.

5. I'd say the game is a lot like Megaman or Pokemon. Others have said monster hunter, but i havent played that series.There are different elements like fire, ice, electricity, poison, stone, normal in the weapons and armors and they all have strengths and weaknesses against different enemies. There's a lot of customization. You can pretty much use 6 spells out of hundreds and you get new ones all the time to upgrade and swap in. You also customize your sigil tattoos which add in additional modifiers to your spells/stats.

6. NPC Ai is pretty good except for the cerberus fight where they always ended up dying a ton if I didnt aggressively shield block the boss and stay on top of him.

7. It has a TON of lore. It's almost as much of a book as it is a game. If you want to read some sick little stories about how people become corrupted and turn into monsters or backstory on the twisted environments you play in.

Since you missed out on the preorder bonus, I'd wait for a price cut. I'd say it's good. It met my expectations, but didn't blow me away. That said, i've pretty much been playing it nonstop the past 3 days so it's got me hooked. The preorder bonus for this game was TOTALLY WORTH IT. Basically gives you japanese voice overs which I don't use, but it also gave you these 3 spells which are crazy good. There's a firesword, electricity attack and poison mortar. I used them for the first 2 days until today where i'm finally replacing them. I believe i'm like 2 levels from the ending, but i took a break to get lunch.


Nintendo is determined to push the Wii U onto a casual audience with the way they're doing all of these family ads, emailing old Wii owners and pulling out of E3. I will be resolute in holding off on buying the system until they show us some really solid 1st party games for gamers older than preteens/teenagers. The 3DS has gotten much better games than the WiiU. If they were to allow u s to play the 3DS games on the WiiU then I would buy a Wii U.

Next GTA will be revolutionary with the ability to switch between the 3 characters on the fly during missions while robbing banks, flying helicopters, rappelling down the side of a skyscraper, sniping etc. The main reason to watch the trailers is NOT to pay attention to the characters/story, but to closely analyze them to pickout the new gameplay elements in the quick action scenes they slip in.

What is it about Ipads that makes you want to buy them and buy new editions so much? What do you use it for?

[quote name='guardian_owl']Re: Soul Sacrifice, you hear a hint of Demon's Souls and you just go running for the hills like you've seen Batman hurling chocolate-covered batarangs...

As the last person on the CAGcast not to try it, one of these days I think Wombat should play Demon's Souls or Dark Souls, I really think it would appeal to him if he can play past the initial adjustment period that both Cheapy and Shipwreck failed to pass. Since he has PS+ (I think) he can even play one of them (Demon's Souls) for free currently.

Regarding the "no developer would be stupid enough to make it so people can't play their games" discussion, you only have to go back a few months to find high profile blunders with always on DRM like Sim City and Diablo 3. Also, I can't count how many times a new, high profile game has had trouble with their multiplayer servers at launch. What if instead of hiccups with multiplayer you just couldn't play the game at all?

Always on DRM is already possible on the existing system for downloadable games (at least on the PS3), more recently released Capcom download games like Bionic Commando Rearmed 2 have always on DRM so it was impossible to play this single player game (and others) while the PSN was down due to hacking.

Sporadic application of always on DRM for disc games on the new consoles is almost as bad as the onus to suss out which games have that feature will fall on the consumer to have to figure out (or find out after they've already purchased it) instead of it being a given that you will need or won't need an online connection.[/QUOTE]
Was coming to post the same. Also look at Microsoft games like Shadowrun so it wouldn't be a stretch for msft to support online only drm

Show Notes

0:30 Wombat's bday
3:45 Tokoyo wine tasting
7:45 Bioshock Infinite comment feedback
15:15 New Releases
15:15 - Farcry Blood Dragon
22:15 - Deadly Premonition Director's Cut
23:00 - Soul Sacrifice
24:30 - Poker Night 2
28:00 - Xenoclash 2
29:30 Fez
30:00 Strikesuit Infinity (sp?) & Trackmania
34:15 The Testament of Sherlock Holmes
38:00 Star Trek the videogame
46:45 Aliens: Colonial Marines lawsuit
50:15 Game Dev Tycoon
54:30 Respawn rumors
57:00 Xbox rumors - achievements, friends
1:01:30 No Nintendo press conference at E3
1:07:00 Robot Unicorn Attack 2
1:07:45 Star Command
1:10:45 Cagbag
1:10:45 - GTA5 trailer
1:16:00 Console names
1:20:30 Prices: consoles vs ipads
1:22:30 Google Glass

I agree with Shipwreck. All these things geeks are twisting themselves in a knot over the next Xbox will turn out to be nothing.

Another great podcast guys!

I loved the discussion on the fact that people are suing because of Aliens: Colonial Marines being a poor game. Give me a break! I completely agree with you.

Although, I don't think this type of mentality is going away anytime soon. I'm a school teacher, and the sense of entitlement with kids and parents these days is unbelievable.

Shipwreck is right, Uplay is indeed really odd. So, during some Steam sale, I bought both AC Brotherhood and Revelations. (It was ~$16 for both and all the DLC, so I went for it. I'm the type of person who wouldn't be able to play III until I play these two since I'm like that.) Obviously, when I load them through Steam, Uplay opens. I knew this ahead of time.
What's weird, though, is my copy of Far Cry 3. So, FC3 came for free with my video card I got in January. Unfortunately, it was a Uplay-only code and not Steam (sad, but it was free so I can't complain). However, if I open up Uplay to play FC3, I don't actually see either of the AC games to play. And the same is true in the reverse - if I load up one of the AC games through Steam that opens up Uplay, FC3 isn't listed there. And it definitely is the same Uplay account.
TL;DR Uplay is just weird and I wish it wasn't a thing.

Also, Ship, one of your comments on the Star Trek game was that it maps dodge/evade and take cover to one button. I'm not excusing the game from being awful, but I feel that a majority of games do that these days. I don't think it's too uncommon. I'm sure that it really doesn't function well in this Star Trek game, but the concept itself is not too bizarre. Unfortunately I can't think of any games to give as an example, so there goes my point down the toilet. But still.

Yup, other games do map it to the same button, which is why I think Star Trek did it. It's just not implemented well.

"But we can't get a good Alien's game Cheapy" - Shipwreck around 50:ish

http://www.amazon.com/Aliens-Infest...UTF8&qid=1367553997&sr=8-1&keywords=aliens+ds

I liked this one.

[quote name='Monsta Mack']"But we can't get a good Alien's game Cheapy" - Shipwreck around 50:ish

http://www.amazon.com/Aliens-Infest...UTF8&qid=1367553997&sr=8-1&keywords=aliens+ds

I liked this one.[/QUOTE]

Yup, that one was fun. I will not sue that game.

[quote name='banodyne']I agree with Shipwreck. All these things geeks are twisting themselves in a knot over the next Xbox will turn out to be nothing.[/QUOTE]

Maybe, maybe not. If a game is registered to a console, that will suck incredibly. Even account-based would be bad, if they continue with their weird account restrictions. Already, one account playing on multiple consoles in the household is a pain in the ass.

[quote name='guardian_owl']Re: Soul Sacrifice, you hear a hint of Demon's Souls and you just go running for the hills like you've seen Batman hurling chocolate-covered batarangs...

As the last person on the CAGcast not to try it, one of these days I think Wombat should play Demon's Souls or Dark Souls, I really think it would appeal to him if he can play past the initial adjustment period that both Cheapy and Shipwreck failed to pass. Since he has PS+ (I think) he can even play one of them (Demon's Souls) for free currently.[/QUOTE]

I started playing Demon's Souls last month because of PS Plus, and I don't think it would be a great game for Wombat. Once you get over the hump it's not that difficult, and there are ways to make things easier on yourself (mainly using a good bow). But it's very time consuming and you can't pause the game, which is not ideal for a gaming dad with two young kids.

I'm surprised Shipwreck didn't stick with it, though. It's very rewarding once you have gained some levels, upgraded your equipment, and teamed up with random co-op partners to plow thru levels.

Now that I finished the whole cast, a comment on console naming - I adore the fact that the PlayStation has a naming convention that they stick to. PlayStation, then PS2, then PS3, and now the PS4. It's simple, clean, and there is no confusion involved. Nintendo's methods are just... ugh. Don't like it at all. (Although the DS to 3DS was a nice one, and so was the GameBoy to GBC to GBA before it. I guess it's just the consoles they like to mess around with.) If the next Xbox is 720, then that will be fine and good. But the if rumor of it being called "Xbox Infinite" (I heard that just the other day) is true, or it's something else, then... ugh again. Maybe some people find it boring, but I like nice and simple naming conventions. Don't go crazy with that shit.
Had Nintendo decided to drop the Wii name, I wouldn't have blamed them. I still think it's a dumb name. But they didn't, and they picked something even more confusing...

Microsoft has snapped up a bunch of domain names which are variants on "Xbox Fusion" so I would say that is a likely candidate for the name of their next system

[quote name='Curufinwe']I started playing Demon's Souls last month because of PS Plus, and I don't think it would be a great game for Wombat. Once you get over the hump it's not that difficult, and there are ways to make things easier on yourself (mainly using a good bow). But it's very time consuming and you can't pause the game, which is not ideal for a gaming dad with two young kids.[/QUOTE]
Correct, though you can go menu and quit at any time (other than when in the middle of PVP multiplayer) to save your place. Your character will sit down and save exactly where you are. Then when you boot the game back up you are in the same place, all the enemies in the level are still dead, etc, it's like you never left. If something comes up during a boss fight, you can still go menu > quit, and when you log back in you will just have to start the boss fight over again.

I think I'm starting to feel the same way about Nintendo that Cheapy does. Losing interest. The Wii U is just very underwhelming and I feel no reason to pick one up. I agree it might make more sense to make a more powerful 3DS with some sort of Airplay or HDMI function for the TV. Then they can focus on 1 platform that performs well and gets 3rd party support.

[quote name='guardian_owl']Correct, though you can go menu and quit at any time (other than when in the middle of PVP multiplayer) to save your place. Your character will sit down and save exactly where you are. Then when you boot the game back up you are in the same place, all the enemies in the level are still dead, etc, it's like you never left. If something comes up during a boss fight, you can still go menu > quit, and when you log back in you will just have to start the boss fight over again.[/QUOTE]

Wow, I had no idea you could do that. I have only ever quit the game when I was back in the Nexus.

Awesome show. Cheapy's Microsoft Press Conference plans sound like the right way to go to me. Lets get messed up and watch Major Nelson play kinectimals

In response to Game Dev Tycoon, could you imagine if other recent publishers took that same route towards piracy? A version of Madden that throws personal fouls every 2 minutes, a release of Call of Duty that only allows you to walk, Dead Island with no zombies, just cats?

Seriously, if the pirate market is flooded with defunct games, would that have any effect at all?
I hope it would, but my gut tells me that wouldn't change the mind of that group of people.

Serious Sam 3 has a good one, an enemy that you can't outrun and can't be killed is added to the first level.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e91q5BtlxK0

Come on now Wombat. You didn't compare Bioshock Infinite to pictures like Inception or the Batman movies. You compared it to "the most throwaway popcorn movie." It's pretty easy to see why people were insulted by that. Comparing it to Inception or other Nolan movies would have actually endeared you to a lot more people.

I kind of think Nintendo is dropping the ball by not having a press conference. While the PS4 and Xbox 720 are going to be heavily focused on, it's hard to tell what kind of launch lineups these systems will have. Nintendo has had plenty of time to work on games for the Wii U now, and if they some good franchise games coming up in the Fall then they need to get that information out everywhere. Of course if they don't have anything planned for this year, then the Wii U is screwed and they might as well cancel the conference as it's not going to rise up much past a niche product.

Anyways, Happy Yesterday Birthday Wombat, and keep up the good work all.

Nintendo not having a conference should say a lot.

Nintendo wont die but I can't imagine them being able to sustain the Wii-U for very long the way the Next Gens are coming.

Memento popcorn movie wtf, also nailed it about bio shock though it was fun and well paced but the ending sucked the story was kind lame.

I think Cheapy hit the nail on the head with both Sony and Microsoft having the tech there and "leaving it up to the publishers" on online-only/DRM/no used games/$10+ used game fee. Should add that to the Top Analyst.

It's the next step in Publisher greed. We already see that with "online passes" and some are even for offline content. Catwoman levels in Batman, for example. Oh, you need $$ to pay for the servers because those used games buyers are clogging it up, oh wait what servers? Double meaning, some "online pass" game servers have already been shut down.

[quote name='meager'][/QUOTE]
Love the Boatcrash Chronicles, thanks!

My opinion on the WiiU: Wall-O-Text

Skip the Wall-O-Text and watch a funny video instead!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvGEC2CQj8Q

The Xbox 360 already has online-only DRM in place for all XBLIG titles, as you cannot play them without being signed into Xbox Live. It wouldn't be a huge step up to do that to everything.

[quote name='shipwreck']Yup, that one was fun. I will not sue that game.[/QUOTE]

Comment of the year.

Wondering if Ship picked up a Fitbit Flex, and if so what he thinks of it.

Cheapy, your Godaddy link isn't working. There's no "h" in the http://


ttp://www.godaddy.com/?isc=cag249

[quote name='FriskyTanuki']The Xbox 360 already has online-only DRM in place for all XBLIG titles, as you cannot play them without being signed into Xbox Live. It wouldn't be a huge step up to do that to everything.[/QUOTE]


Really? Did this happen with an update? At least for the first few years, this only applied to Arcade titles you redownloaded/transferred to different console or HDD. Unless these conditions are what you meant.

But nonetheless, this is the direction they (particularly Microsoft, generally the gaming industry) want. It doesn't mean they'll do it now, but I figure the goal is to wear us down, desensitize us to the concept, so that someday we have no absolute ownership of anything, and that they can effectively 'turn off' consoles once the next ones are sufficiently available and keep us in a perpetual subscription/rental model. I believe this is the case for all forms of entertainment, ultimately, unless there's a very strong pushback, which there won't be, because people love to complain, but are too big of junkies to detox. I see it everyday with sports fans. I think the analogy holds up for gamers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRBDMMVctu8

And another thing (shakes cane):

First and foremost, let my silence on virtually every other CAGCast I've ever listened to speak as my approval of them. You know how we are about expressing gratitude and agreement.

So now, the complaining. I have to say, I was somewhat surprised and disappointed with the way the three of you so summarily and contemptuously dismissed the notion of a lawsuit against Sega/Gearbox regarding Colonial Marines. No, I'm not partaking in it, as thanks to my trademark procrastination, I was able to return my CE to Amazon for a full refund, after seeing the first wave of reviews. And even if I didn't get to return it, I most likely wouldn't join in the legal revolt...but I also wouldn't condemn it.

To a non-gamer (not you three), I could see where it would seem like standard nerd petulance, and therefore frivolous, but this is a pretty special situation that I believe merits a lawsuit, and no, Shipwreck, doesn’t open the floodgates for a deluge of, well, litigious fanboy tantrum throwing. Please note: reasonable people here aren't complaining simply because of the extreme suckitude of the game, but because of the path that led it to that point. How could someone who preordered have known it was going to be so far off the mark until it was (practically) too late?

The bulk of the promotional videos did present a very misleading representation of graphics, content, and overall atmosphere that resonated heavily with fans of the franchise. I don’t think ‘we’ were seeing what we wanted to see. While the outsourcing of the project probably created quality issues a lot worse than they'd bargained for, Sega and Gearbox almost certainly were playing on that very nostalgia from the beginning, knowing that it was important to get people emotionally invested ASAP (which would lead to monetarily invested sooner than later), and then if they couldn't quite match the promise, oh well.

Alien franchise fans knew that most of the previous games had been south of mediocre, so based on who was involved, and what they'd seen, they probably went 'all in' on the good faith assumption that at worst this game would be just 'decent.' Time and time again, fans will be apologists, and find ways to rationalize something passable into something much better. And yet this turd clearly didn't even reach halfway to that baseline. Because if it did, they would have. Trust me.

Please also note that gamers very rarely even start to seriously murmur about 'consumer advocate' suits about games for quality-related reasons. People know (or at least don’t care) how many intellectual properties and franchises are just assumed to be exploitative cash-in attempts. I don't think too much teeth-gnashing is going on right now about the Star Trek Into Dreckness tie-in, e.g. And when most games severely disappoint compared to that ideal expectation fans daydream about, they tend to just remember that and not buy the next attempt (new, anyway). In this egregious case, though, the confluence of factors, particularly the promotional material presented, created the impression that preorders could be made with the final game falling into certain reasonable parameters, which the review consensus clearly indicates it didn't (not to mention examples of how broken the AI is, the game's brevity, etc.).

The suit may get dismissed, it may result in nothing, it may just force publishers to put more prominent 'not final product' disclaimers everywhere. And yeah, there's clearly about a thousand things more important on a 'daily life' level. But that’s true of many lawsuits that have merit. This is about Colonial Marines, and Colonial Marines only, although it could have the effect of making future decision-makers and bean counters think twice about how far they can abuse the ‘work in progress’ disclaimers, promotional campaign, and consumers’ basic trust. And how bad would that be, especially on the verge of an even higher-stakes console generation?

P.S. The BioShock example doesn't fly (buh-dum!) because you're simply referring to a 'deleted scene' that probably had no appreciable effect on perceptions versus the final product, one way or another, and in terms of 'set pieces' within the game, is more or less fungible. If they would’ve downgraded the graphics to PS2 levels to 'maintain framerate,' or eschewed the skyrails for Elizabeth just teleporting you around, or made it ‘Doom in the clouds’ with a soundtrack of dubstep Disturbed remixes, that’d be more like this debacle.

P.P.S. I can respect a man’s opinion if he doesn’t like Batman or chocolate. But not both.

Hi guys after finishing Far Cry 3 and really enjoying it and with the release of Blood Dragon is it really worth getting i am a bit tight on money right know since losing my job and can only buy a number of games a month until i find something is it worth it thanks guys!

Great show as always, but I just wanted to address Cheapy's comment about hoping that Saints Row 4 will show Rockstar how to make a good GTA game (or something to that effect). I don't think Rockstar needs to compete with or tap into Saints Row's ethos just as I don't think SR needs to tap into GTA's ethos. I think it's great that both games can serve different needs. I loved Saints Row 3 for it's raw, unadulterated outlandishness but still prefer GTA IV (and the GTA franchise as a whole) for its atmosphere, more tempered gameplay and cinematic qualities. If I can get a Saints Row 4 that's like 3, but better, and a GTA 5 that's like GTA IV, but better, I'll be ecstatic. They're their own individual brands and them embracing their own qualities just gives the gamer even more choice and variety.

Wombat's Watson is second only to Wombat's Cosby. Great show!