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CAGcast #338: Hot Air Machines

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#31 trip1eX

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 08:02 PM

Regarding the success of the Steam Machines I really think it's a mistake to consider this to only be one launch of devices. The goal from Valve and manufacturers is likely to have this be a continuing push in the future. Basically if you buy a new PC which can be used for gaming you will get a USB stick or partition with SteamOS installed.

And since it's Linux you can boot and run it from a USB stick if you want. With a fast USB3 stick it will probably even be pretty good. (Better than HDD.)

Not a selling point.

The selling point for me, based on the info out there so far, would be not giving to buy a copy of Windows for $100 for every new gaming pc I build. And to not put up with install hassles with activation keys when upgrading hardware....

But having a 2nd OS on my pc isn't a selling point. It sounds like more hassle.

#32 FAMOUSLASTWORDS

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 08:33 PM

Does anyone else think GTAV is coming this year to PS4 & XB1. There was that tweet by Sony in August saying "GTA V is going to be amazing, especially on the PS4!" which I think is really a leak. And also that Amazon Germany listing for the PS4 & XB1 games this year. It's painful but  I'm holding out for the PS4 version. 



#33 guardian_owl

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 09:40 PM

I have every American released game for the virtual boy except 3D Tetris (I collected them a few years after the virtual boy collapsed), it IS a pretty stupid idea for a console (no one else can see you playing, annoying red coloring, no multiplayer, no headstrap so you have to put it on a stand and bend over to play it), but some of the games were quite enjoyable.

 

Mario Tennis was the pack-in game and was a simple pleasure. Vertical Force was a serviceable top down shump which had the interesting mechanic of using the 3D effect to shift to an upper and lower plane in addition to dodging enemies. Wario Land was a great platformer. Teleroboxer was probably my favorite game which came out for the system, it's basically the same idea as Real Steel, as you control a giant robot boxer via a suit and play from the 1st person perspective. It worked great with the 3D, as you ducked you could see the enemy's fist fly over your head, the music would get more frantic as your HP began to drop, amping up the tension. Red Alarm I just couldn't get into, it was like they were trying to make Star Fox, but everything is in wireframe so it has the look of an early alpha or something. One of the other neat features about the system is the controller was ambidextrous, the layout and button placement was identical on both sides.

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Sony has done the $10 cash back thing around this time of year for last couple of years. Last year later in October they also did a promotion which gave you bonus months to PS+ when you renewed so those looking to reupp PS+ for a year to get $10 back should wait till near the end of the promotion to see if they do that again.

 

I think the 'PS VIta TV' name is very fitting for the system, since it seems to play PSVita & PSP games off the bat without the need of and actual 'Vita', with the ability to stream (more like Remote play) PS4 games....BUT! with the need of a physical PS4 in the household.

I'm honestly not too thrilled about getting this product! It's TOO expensive, not portable & it can't play Vita games that REQUIRE the touchscreen controls. I would have rather it be a wireless Remote-play 'peripheral' that would work as TV-Out for the (Physical) Vita & PS4 (if they STILL WON'T add TV-OUT FOR THE VITA! Unlike the PSP-2000/3000/Go!) for a far more reasonable price!

We will have to see how it goes, perhaps for games that don't require too much precision it can be half-assed with the front touch panel of the DS4 or perhaps they could get working do you could do touch with the move.


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#34 jms493

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:56 PM

I do have a question. It doesnt make sense to me that with the family game sharing on Steam you have to share usernames and passwords. I mean I can do that now, right? Give me your info and I can log in as you as long as I have the steam code.

I thought I read that you can request access to a friends library in steam and that person can allow or deny access.

Confirm?

#35 shipwreck

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:58 PM

Nope, it works like we described on the show.

I do have a question. It doesnt make sense to me that with the family game sharing on Steam you have to share usernames and passwords. I mean I can do that now, right? Give me your info and I can log in as you as long as I have the steam code.

I thought I read that you can request access to a friends library in steam and that person can allow or deny access.

Confirm?


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#36 bickle

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 01:07 AM

I do have a question. It doesnt make sense to me that with the family game sharing on Steam you have to share usernames and passwords. I mean I can do that now, right? Give me your info and I can log in as you as long as I have the steam code.

 

Yeah I guess I don't understand what is the benefit of the new program. It doesn't sound like anything new.



#37 jms493

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 01:45 AM

yeah SW is correct...here is an explanation of the process.

 

http://community.pcg...impressions-r88



#38 SeanAmI

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 02:33 AM

I was laughing so hard when Cheapy compared feeding your kid Taco Bell to leaving your little kid at home alone with no idea where you went.



#39 Drclaw411

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 03:46 AM

I have to disagree on Wombat's opinion on games vs consoles selling each other. The point that everyone who wants an Xbox One will likely have one (or have decided they want one) within about 5 months...it just doesnt make sense to me. This console generation will be 8-10 years long. If everybody who wants any of the three new gen consoles has bought them 5 months in, then there is no way in hell that particular console can survive past year 2.


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#40 dsingh2007

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 05:05 AM

Thank you for answering my question about the console visions and presentations. Microsoft was definitely pushing the TV and online services pretty hard in the beginning but now they have tried to come around and talk about just games exclusively. It seems like that Xbox One will place equal importance on games and online/TV services. Whereas Sony from the beginning has made their console the Game console and online services have taken a back place.

 

Microsoft's message and execution was horrible in the beginning and I don't know if they will be able to win back all the gamers who were left with distaste in their mouths. Sony has done a great job presenting themselves as the game company from the beginning.  I have no doubt that both consoles will be great game consoles but only time will tell if they will deliver on their online/TV promises. 



#41 chinoev

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 11:14 AM

Wombat is right, some sort of onscreen directional cues should have been used in GTAV.  Both Saints Row and Sleeping Dogs used this and it made the driving around more fun.  When I'm staring at the little map I tend to crash into more things.  On a side note, I really hope Square Enix makes a sequel to Sleeping Dogs.



#42 MannishBoy

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 12:58 PM

Why is Nvidia making the Shield? Two reasons:

 

1) The reason you guys guessed on the show related to the streaming requiring Nvidia graphics cards, so it's a add on to their other money making line of GPUs. So it promotes Nvidia graphics cards.

 

2) A demo bed/halo product for their new mobile processors/SOCs, the Tegra 4's. This is the first device on the market with the newer version of Nvidia's mobile chips, which down the road, might end up being Nvidia's biggest business if PC sales continue to decline. They've taken some of their PC graphics tech and put it on top of an ARM processor. Another product that will come out using the Tegra 4 is the Surface 2. Nvidia is also making an OEM tablet that will be rebranded and sold by other Android tablet vendors in a similar model to their reference design graphics cards.



#43 encendido5

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 02:09 PM

Cheapy, sounds like you can't enjoy a mindless movie anymore after watching all those intelligent and depressing documentaries :)


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#44 codenamelenny

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 03:00 PM

I do have a question. It doesnt make sense to me that with the family game sharing on Steam you have to share usernames and passwords. I mean I can do that now, right? Give me your info and I can log in as you as long as I have the steam code.

I thought I read that you can request access to a friends library in steam and that person can allow or deny access.

Confirm?

In most situations you live close to your family/friends so you could log into their computer yourself authorize the device then have them log in. If they live across country (or across the world), giving them your password is the only option but in theory you should trust them enough to give it to them. Once the sharing is authorized they would be able to have their own save and achievements under their steam account and give them ease of buying the game, maybe with special discounts.

 

I think you three are underestimating the steam machine, once we have final specs and prices we can understand more who this is for. If there is one cheap enough it could be a roku competitor.



#45 gregleg

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 03:52 PM

It may be a niche market, but providing a decent option for a prebuilt HTPC/media center PC without a dependency on Microsoft's OS, and a known consistent Linux build, has plenty of merit.

I have a main PC in my home office. That office is way too far away from my mancave (by design) to send the HDMI directly to the bigscreen. So I also have a (now outdated) HTPC in the cave. If SteamOS runs enough of the games (and emulators, media players, etc.) for me to be happy, AND Valve can work out proper consistent driver support, then SteamOS could be an awesome alternative. If streaming games from my primary office PC over my LAN (not wireless - I've pulled CAT5e to several rooms of my house) also works, that's a bonus, but I'm not counting on that...

#46 AriesDog

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 04:24 PM

This is the Windows 8 walled garden Gabe Newell was talking about. Before Windows 8 launched they announced there was going to be two versions:

Windows 8 Pro. This is the one people could buy, upgrade to, and what you get with new computers.

Windows RT. Aimed mostly at ARM based mobile CPUs. This one only comes preinstalled on tablets. Consumers can't buy this on their own. This is what Gabe was worried about because this version only apps and programs installed from the new Windows Store. Since Steam's business is digital distribution, of course he was worried.

 

The reality is that Gabe had nothing to worry about. Windows RT was only for tablets, not for the kind of computers that do real PC gaming. Also, Windows RT has struggled in the market. Partly because of the limitations, partly because it turned out ARM based processers weren't much cheaper than the full-blown ones. The only model still being produced is that basic Microsoft Surface.



#47 zebwinz

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 04:27 PM

I have a feeling that offline mode is not going to work on the SteamMachines if you use Steam Family sharing. 


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#48 zebwinz

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 04:52 PM

Cheapy, I think there are a couple reasons they haven't been showing Kinect. They had to do all the 180-stuff and try to appeal to core gamers, who if internet comments are to be believed, don't care about Kinect. Anything Microsoft shows with Kinect is just ripped apart instantly with comments like "Quit shoving crap i don't want down my throat!". Also, the interface is still being ironed out and that's one of the places Kinect will be used the most. More info is slowly coming out though like Xbox Fitness, which was announced after the podcast was recorded. 


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#49 Kaneco

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 05:58 PM

Yeah Shipwreck already dismissed his theory by stating (if I recall correctly) "That might be the worst point you have every made on this show"

lol, I know....they both did right after he made that statement, I'm just reinforcing that he's wrong and why I think he's wrong. :P



#50 John

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 06:15 PM

Bring TiredJohn on the show once in awhile.  Everything he says carries extra weight because of his accent.  And he seems to have some strong opinions which is always good podcast fodder.

 

Yeah, he's great - as was Cheapy's idea to bring him along to E3. *cough*



#51 AriesDog

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 06:45 PM

The concerns about the range of the Tesla is the reason I like the Chevy Volt. It's an electric engine that can be recharged at home or charging stations but as a fallback it has a tiny had powered engine to make electricity. In my opinion that's the most practical solution for an electric car in present day.

#52 jms493

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 07:56 PM

The concerns about the range of the Tesla is the reason I like the Chevy Volt. It's an electric engine that can be recharged at home or charging stations but as a fallback it has a tiny had powered engine to make electricity. In my opinion that's the most practical solution for an electric car in present day.

Yeah but that Tesla is so damned sexy! 8-)



#53 Darth Sontin

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 08:42 PM

In terms of console vision, I think Microsoft has actually been fairly consistent in their desire to market towards the "Mountain Dew/Doritos/Call of Duty/football" crowd. Their initial vision for the Xbox One was a football-watching device that also plays Call of Duty, and they've mostly stayed true to that. That isn't necessarily a bad thing- they have found an emerging market and are aiming towards it. That specific market didn't really exist 8 years ago when the 360 launched as games were still considered "nerdy" back then.

 

Sony wants to market to hardcore gamers. They have designed a game machine that can do other things like Netflix on the side. Their vision of the PS4 is a games platform that has a lot of indie games, unique games, and weird crazy Japanese games.

 

Both approaches have their benefits and issues.


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#54 Gregalor

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:21 PM

I agree with Wombat about the GTA mini-map. It's just like how everyone plays through Metal Gear games by just looking at the upper right corner of the screen and playing it like a Pac-Man game.



#55 Kazaganthi

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 11:19 PM

The way you guys described Steam Family Sharing makes it sound bad. Giving out login info/password just so they can be kicked off when I'm playing a DIFFERENT game? Sounds like a hassle and not at all like lending physical games out. You can pretty much already do this with Steam, but you'll be using same account, cloud save, and achievements, but does anyone care about those?

 

I have an idea for Steambox that might make sense to you guys and blow your mind: Make it priced exactly the same as, and do the same thing as PS Vita TV. Replace PSN with Steam and people will eat it up...oh snap!



#56 steverl22

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 03:08 PM

I'm worried about the Kinect as well.....not once have we seen a flawless demo of this new Kinect. People keep saying give it time, time my ass we're less then 2 months away from launch. If you're going to pack in this thing to every system then make sure it works at least 99% of the time.

We'll see what happens.....I could always unplug the damn thing

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#57 Jasper Kazai

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 04:40 PM

One of my friends won the PS4 prize from Taco Bell a couple of days ago. I'm pretty jelly.



#58 spid

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 02:04 PM

My problem with some one brings up a negative story about Kinect is they often forget about the positive stories.  Like perchance the following article.

 

http://www.ign.com/a...-actually-works

 

It also ignores the fact the game has been pushed back to 2014 so what the build they showed may not be representative of where the game is at. Of course my biggest problem is I don't think Kinect's best function has to do with games per say.  It is about providing a great control mechanism for everything else you do with the console.  It is like complaining about the touch screen on a smart phone because some games do not use the screen that well. You wouldn't throw away the touchscreen just because you can't use it with a first person shooter game. 



#59 Thomas96

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 07:33 PM

Wombat is the Gaming prophet! Who knows..

I do agree that consoles will sell games. The main reason is that we've all said that this gen was the end of exclusives. Titanfall introduce as an exclusive and everyone believes that it'll be out on ps4. That game isn't going to sell consoles because everyone will wait for it'll be released on another console. It's up to the consoles to sell themselves, the games will follow. The exclusives will give a boost, but it's going to be thy overall library that will push consoles, right now the libraries are similar that it boils down to the console.
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#60 thadwhit

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Posted 30 September 2013 - 12:51 AM

I also have to disagree with Wombat's assertion that a game can't sell a system.  A great game is exactly what it takes to sell a system. Could TitanFall give that edge to the Xbox One next spring?  Absolutely.

 

The idea that everyone has already decided which system they are getting at this point in the game is ridiculous.  Sure a bunch of rabid geeks have declared PS4 the winner and preordered.  A smaller number have preordered the Xbox One.  But many people, including myself, will wait and see how it plays out for a few months.  Many post launch factors could make the decision of which console to buy an easier choice.  Just because Microsoft lived and learned through the red ring of death, doesn't mean their new hardware won't be shitting the bed too.  Just because Sony is now charging for online play, doesn't mean their online is not going to suck.  None of the launch games are great on either system anyway, a killer app like TitanFall could easily be the jumping in point to the next generation, assuming everyone's hardware and networks work fine.


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