CAGcast #354: Monkey Xbox Ninja Andy Serkis

CheapyD

CheapyD

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The crew talks Titanfall, Apple TV rumors, Nintendo troubles, Flappy Bird, and so much more!
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Intro:  Get Away, Snoop Lion - Outro: M.A.S.K. Commercial
 
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I guess you can listen to Wombat's other podcast, Uninformed Opinions.

 
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Gah, Flappy Bird
 

About the Nintendo F2P talk, you guys totally didn't mention a Pokemon MMO! Easy money for Nintendo if they made a bunch of items require money.

 
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The problem with making a Nintendo console that's like the PS4 and Xbox One is that by the time that system comes out, everyone already has either one of those systems. The only thing they could do imo is come out with an add-on ala kinect or Sega CD that you can buy separately and every Wii U after that has it built in. Then said add-on games can have graphics comparable to the Xbox One and PS4. Just tossing my half baked theory into the ring.

And I'd like the Jazz game

Also Wombat's theory that people won't play Titanfall two and a half weeks after launch is pretty silly imo. This game will be the only thing people will play for a long time on their Xbox One.

 
Thanks for the new show fellas!  The snow is piled 8 foot tall outside with 8" on the ground.  I've lit the office fireplace and now it's high time for some CAGcast listening.  

@Shipwreck Happy Birthday!  Have you ever seen a Atari Hotwheels kiosk during your Adventures at Retail?: 
atari_hotwheels.jpg


*Yes, those Hostess donuts in the shopping cart are mine.  

 
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thorbahn3 said:
The problem with making a Nintendo console that's like the PS4 and Xbox One is that by the time that system comes out, everyone already has either one of those systems.
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I agree with Thorbahn3. By the time Nintendo comes out with a home console to compete with the Xbox One and PS4, it will be too late to capture market share from those two by-then established systems.

Assuming Nintendo has not started R&D on a WII-U successor, how long would it take for them to design, build and market a new system?

What would interest me, and I believe one of you guys brought this up on an earlier Cagcast, is a home console/handheld hybrid. Lets say Nintendo designs a handheld system that can wirelessly stream to your TV via a dongle plugged into your TV. That way you can play your games on the go, or on your big screen TV when at home. Of course, the handheld should be powerful enough to look good on modern HD displays.
 
No discussion of The Wolf Among Us Ep. 2 in new releases?  I know Cheapy spoke pretty glowingly about the first one.

I downloaded last night but will probably not play until this weekend.  I'll follow-up with impressions.

 
CAG #354

3:30 Flappy bird
5:45 Show Feedback
5:45 - Apple game system / ouya
10:15 - Wombat under the influence
13:30 Watch This: Justice League War
17:30 - Comedians in Cars Getting Coffee
18:00 New Releases
18:00 - Dustforce
22:00 - Outlast
23:00 - Lego Movie
24:30 - Jazzpunk
26:30 - Bravely Default
26:45 Child's Play Raffle & Winners
30:45 Xbox One update
33:00 EA's 360 version of Titanfall
39:15 Kinect 2 based games?
40:30 Brothers: Tale of Two Sons
44:30 Octodad
45:00 Assassin's Creed IV: Freedom Cry getting standalone release
46:00 PS4 PS+ free games
49:00 Nintendo "quality of life" / Apple
50:15 Free to play for Nintendo?
52:30 Nintendo continue portables, but go publisher for home consoles?
59:15 The Wolf Among Us, Episode 2
1:00:15 South Park: This Stick of Truth is sans Uplay
1:03:00 Hearthstone
1:07:30 Eve Valkyrie - Oculus Rift
1:08:30 Cagbag
1:08:30 - Beards
 
Nintendo lives in another world.  And that's fine.  But they don't have to compete with Microsoft or Sony really.  But right now they have lost that spot of "compliment" the other machines.  Nintendo is still coming out with great games, but the 3DS has a huge library (if you count 3DS and DS) unlike the WiiU.  That could change tomorrow if Nintendo released Gamecube/SNES games on eShop.  Instantly it could be that second must-have console and we're back to the Wii-mania again.

Sadly Nintendo seems focused on the Tread-Wii-mill.

 
Brothers A Tale of Two Sons should be played through in one sitting in my opinion, it's such a short game (three hours) that just like Gone Home (two hours) playing one half of the game will leave a "meh" impression.

I know its hard for people with big commitments such as children to sink uninterrupted hours into a game as Wombat said about Titanfall and online games, but these two games are designed to tell a story through an interactive medium and splitting that story will never be as enjoyable.

Unfortunately Shipwreck the puzzles in Brothers never get challenging.

Thanks for the show guys!

 
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Titanfall will likely be huge but I can't help but wonder how the average Call of Duty player will respond to a far more sci-fi oriented mech game without a campaign. :?:

 
Been listening to the CAGcast for a couple months now and I love it.  I do want to say that Wombat's criticism against Titanfall's lack of single player campaign is valid, however, I've seen people saying CoD and Battlefield should drop their campaigns for years.  Some of CoDs and BFs campaigns are cheesy and mostly forgettable, so why not spend that funding elsewhere in the game development process?  ...like on beer  :p

p.s. I'd like to be entered in the Jazzpunk contest please!

 
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FellOpenIan said:
Titanfall will likely be huge but I can't help but wonder how the average Call of Duty player will respond to a far more sci-fi oriented mech game without a campaign. :?:
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Well, I play with about a dozen or so CoD players. I often ask them if they played the single player yet. They often say no, and they never do. I'm willing to bet that the Cod:MW guys noticed that before they left.

As for Sci-Fi, I take it that you haven't played a Call of Duty game in awhile. The latest games are Sci-fi oriented and while you don't control mechs, you control lots of stuff like a robot, airplane, etc.

 
Long time listener, first time poster...    I just I'd toss this in, as I see no one else has mentioned it yet, but one thing you can do at 35 that you cannot at 34, is be elected President of the United States.  I dunno if you have any political aspirations, but there's that.

Happy Birthday, Ship.

 
Biomech said:
Assuming Nintendo has not started R&D on a WII-U successor, how long would it take for them to design, build and market a new system?
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From what I understand, Nintendo always has a team working on new hardware of some kind (other tech companies).

Homer Nixon said:
Long time listener, first time poster... I just I'd toss this in, as I see no one else has mentioned it yet, but one thing you can do at 35 that you cannot at 34, is be elected President of the United States. I dunno if you have any political aspirations, but there's that.
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Shipwreck as president? hmmm.

Great show as usual. I really don't know where you were going with the titanfall rant, wombat. It's cleary not a game aimed at you, there are plenty of people who play online games like COD, Battlefield, etc that would play this game for months. I would assume some people put time aside when the kids are in bed or not home to play games like this. I don't have kids so I can play games uninterrupted :)

 
Ship,
I hope you continue to play more Dustforce. Once you get the hang of it, its one of the most satisfying games ever. When you get that perfect run, you feel like a god! Give it another chance!
Wombat,
I'm sure some will lose interest in Titanfall quickly but I hope it keeps a nice size active player base. I really like having a single player game going then taking a break and go play a fast pace competitive shooter. Its how I like balancing my gaming so I don't get burned out on a single game.
Thanks guys for another great CagCast!

P.S I would love a Jazzpunk code!
 
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Ship,

McD's rules. Also you can keep eating it after 35 if you workout. I run 6 days a week and love bad fast food. Still floating around 9% BF eating out a couple days a week. Just keep working out and enjoy your McWraps (Chili, breaded is the best!!)

Also I would like to degauss some pidgins! I would like a JazzPunk Code.

 
Hey guys,

Great show, but I am extremely disappointed you couldn't remember Enslaved: Odyssey to the west. It was the praise you guys gave the game that made me want to buy it. It didn't sell well, which makes it that much better for the people who played it.
 
Great, entertaining show as usual. I'm sure everyone was just screaming, "ENSLAVED!" when you guys were trying to think of the game's title, but it did lead to an instant classic moment where all three of you couldn't come up with it. That's right up there with Cheapy D thinking Hawaii is boring, which was a nice callback in this episode. 

Cheapy, I'm surprised you thought Justice League: War was suitable for Tai, then again I forget how old he is. I'm not a parent but even I was a little surprised by some of the language the movie uses, unnecessarily in my opinion. Two instances that felt very egregious to me were calling Wonder Woman a "whore" and Cyborg saying "shit." I definitely wasn't offended watching the movie or anything, it just feels like these movies are definitely not aimed at kids.

Finally, I'm glad Shipwreck said Brothers was boring. I've been hearing nothing but praise for the game and after playing it for an hour, I haven't gone back to it. I know the end is supposed to be this masterful emotional journey, but I think a lot of reviewers overlook a game's rote mechanics just because it elevates the video game genre in terms of storytelling. It's still a video game though and if it's no fun to play, it's no fun to play. 

 
Nintendo is doubling down on the Wii U and Gamepad according to the Iwata presentation.   I guess they have enough stuff in the pipeline at this point that there is no turning around for the next 2 years at least so maybe coming out strong for the Gamepad and Wii U doesn't mean a lot.  But I was half-expecting them to ditch the Gamepad in order to get the price down and resuscitate  sales.  

An X1 or Ps4 clone is certainly not the answer.  The GC lost all its 3rd party support eventually.  And sales weren't good.  MS and Sony didn't make money last gen with their consoles so adding a 3rd player to that same mix this gen doesn't sound like a moneymaker to me.  

You guy were wondering if Nintendo stays in the console business and I think the answer to that was in the Iwata presentation as well.  Nintendo will have one architecture next-generation in the vein of iOS and Android which will better allow them to have the same game available for both handheld and console.

Nintendo's QoL business  is non-wearables.  They specifically mentioned "wearables" as already being too crowded of a fiel.  I think Nintendo decides to integrate mobile devices into its so-far vague QoL platform idea.   Like the Balance Board streaming to your smartphone or tablet.  Iwata mentioned that any functionality that would work better elsewhere is where they will put resources towards.  

 
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My favorite thing about Brothers isn't the story it tells, the controls, or anything else most people seem to praise. It's the world it's set in. The world is so much more interesting than Brothers is, and I kind of wish there was more to it to explain what happened in the valley (you'll know if you keep playing Ship) and all of these creatures that live close and where they come from, their relationships with all the other species, etc.

Also, to call back to the Apple tv thing...do IOS games all support controller? I genuinely don't know as I just got my first iPhone, but that's one of the reasons I don't see it being compelling if you can't play all the games with controllers. Suddenly that library is diminished greatly.

 
Another great show, guys! Happy birthday, Ship!

Really looking forward to more coverage on the Shipwreck Blockbuster Baller Beats Basement.

I'm with you guys on Nintendo keeping in the home console space. Something needs to happen with the Wii U or the software to entice customers to buy in. I don't think another system is the answer, but if it is, I'd be really interested in what they do for everyone who's bought a Wii U.

Your indie game coverage was great, haha! Cheapy's little bit of coverage on Octodad specifically had me chuckling. and Jazzpunk! I've been really excited for that game since I saw Sessler & Rev3 playing a demo.

Cheapy's Hearthstone breakdown for Wombat was pretty informative. I didn't know some of this stuff.

EVE Valkyrie! Oculus Rift Launch title! I hadn't heard that news yet. I'm right there with Cheapy and Ship on buying an Oculus at launch now that Valkyrie is confirmed.

Wombeard, haha!  

I'd love a Jazzpunk steam key!

 
Good episode this week.  It bordered on great, but I just can't give out a rating of 'great' without an epic doodie story from Cheapy.

Games like Dustforce, in the super-hard platforming category, like Super Meat Boy or N+ or Spelunky, are a curious thing.  They inspire love or hate, but rarely anything in between.  And liking one of those titles doesn't guarantee you'll like any of the others.

Watch This: Rick & Morty is a new show on Adult Swim and it is fan-freakin-tastic.  Think 'Back to the Future', but Doc Brown is an amoral alcoholic jerk and Marty is neurotic and insecure.  Oh, and the super-science goes horribly, horribly wrong every episode.

And yes, I would love a JazzPunk code.  That game looks great.

 
Outlast is pants crappingly terrifying.  I am only managing to play for about 5 minutes at a time. 

Would love jazzpunk.  Unless it is also terrifying. 

 
Happy birthday Ship and good show.  I think Nintendo is really behind the 8ball, but at least they have the cash to fail for quite awhile.  I don't know if Sony has that luxury.  Good thing the PS4 has been well-received.  

I would like to a copy of Jazzpunk.

Thanks.

 
It's funny Wombat made that Titanfall prediction just around the same time they delay the 360 version 2 and a half weeks, coincidence? Nah. With this news, you can't deny it's because the 360 version is inferior and probably buggy. They don't want people reviewing it until the XB1 reviews have sunk in as glowing representations of the game. 3-4mil user base vs 70mil user base, they don't want the 360 overtaking the coverage.

All this talk of Nintendo Fusion to me just sounds like a Super Gameboy(SNES) or Gameboy Player(Gamecube).

Bioshock Infinite on PS+ before a year is up is a good deal for everyone. If you didn't buy it by now, you probably weren't going to buy it, or at least not higher than $20 and most likely used. Plus they have 2 story DLC out/just out soon that people won't feel ripped off buying if they got the game for free.

I find it amusing that Shipwreck calls Brothers (not 2 Brothers) puzzles not challenging. While I do agree most of them are simple, the 2 analog stick premise alone confuses people. They have trouble navigating both Brothers at the same time, which makes for some funny deaths.

Props to The Order 1866 for their firm stance on not adding a tack-on-who-gives-a-shit multiplayer. Can't say the same for Titanfall having no single player campaign though, that's just wrong.

 
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Happy Birthday Ship!

Here the best method I've seen to beat Flappy Bird.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gD-nzHy2DdU&feature=youtu.be

 
Nintendo is going to continue to struggle because kids older than 10 don't want colorful fun and creative games anymore. They want CoD and GTA... At least on a home console they do. I think maybe Nintendo would be better off with just handhelds. I don't want to lose them as a console maker, but it doesn't seem like they are going to cater to what people want. Handhelds are a perfect place for the Nintendo franchises, just look at Zelda LBW and Mario 3D Land.

Also, I hate to revisit an old topic, but the fact that Apple would be successful at a console doesn't change the fact that your anti Ouya arguments still apply here - you guys said people don't want cell phone games on a TV. Apparently you've changed your minds since Apple decided to do it. Bah
 
nintendo is failing because 3rd parties dont know what the fuck to do with this stupid last generation pad shit. 

Its better NOT to make games for it.

 
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Cheapy's point about Apple TV being a better place for indies than Steam might be a bit off since it doesn't seem like the latest Apple TV sells all that well, as much as numbers from Apple say. The latest numbers I can find from Apple is 6 million of the 3rd generation Apple TV and Steam currently has over 6.5 million concurrent users with many more that regularly use and buy games on Steam. Then again, Indies have no platform preferences and will put their games on any platform out there if it's not too much work as the Ouya shows.

I don't get Wombat's argument as to why nobody will keep playing a highly-anticipated multiplayer game after a few weeks because its audience are parents that don't normally play multiplayer games.

Sony announced at E3 that the first PS+ games for PS4 will be indie games (Resogun, Don't Starve, Outlast, and Secret Ponchos) and then Contrast came later once Driveclub was delayed, so there shouldn't be much surprise about that. Indies will jump at the chance of big promotional opportunities with PS+ for their launch on PS4 since the bigger publishers won't do the same for their titles until a year or two down the line.

There are a lot of good Free-to-Play games on PS4/PS3 that seem to be well-populated in DC Universe Online, Warframe, War Thunder, Blacklight Retribution, and Tekken Revolution from Namco on PS3.

 
Definitely dug the Titanfall talk on this week's CAGcast (but not as much as the awkward silences while trying to remember Enslaved). Does the way EA has handled other online games such as Battlefield 4 or Sim City impact your excitement for it? 

ps: I'd love a Jazzpunk code. 

 
Yet another great show guys, easily my favorite podcast. I do have to say though, I don't agree with Wombat about Titanfall. Considering CoD still has a massive player base (despite it going to shit after MW2), with games easily joined even as far back as CoD 2, it's quite apparent that there are still many gamers who enjoy multiplayer and don't mind the fact that they can't pause. After all, Halo 4 and Battlefield are also huge games full of active players that don't mind the process of lobbying up and then playing a game in which pausing isn't truly possible. If Titanfall is as good as it looks, it won't have a problem holding a player base for quite some time

Oh, and count me in for Jazzpunk, thanks.

 
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"Its the kind of thing that no one asks about because they assume no one's dumb enough to ship a console without it" hahahahaaaaa 

Still super jealous of anyone whose got next gens though, sigh. Waiting on Kingdom Hearts 3. And a job. 

Would really love a copy of Jazzpunk! oh and ~*Happy Birthday Shipwreck*~

tumblr_mq3c9z7bze1s8mgkyo1_500.gif


 
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I'm sort of in agreement about Brothers. I thought the game was pretty good, but not amazing. I didn't think the puzzles were very engaging. I also ran into 3 separate game stopping bugs (360 version) in the 3 hours that game lasts which is never a good sign. It was a nice story, with pretty nice storytelling, but I don't quite understand where all of last year's ridiculously high praise came from.

I say that as the guy who loves new and interesting storytelling methods in games and who plays mostly indies. Gone Home is one of my absolute favorite experiences last year. Brothers just didn't do it for me.

Also, in for Jazzpunk. Thanks.

 
Well I thought Wombat was spot on last week, but this week his thought on Titanfall were kinda nuts.  The Xbox One audience is similar to the 360 audience who are geared toward mulitplayer.  Developers know how many people are playing their single player portions, and I think it is a lot smaller than what Wombat assumed in his Titanfall argument. 

 
Btw Cheapie is offbase about the Gamepad being a crappy tablet. it isn't trying to be a tablet. And what tablet allows you to play last gen console quality games with full console controls?  You can't play full-fledged CoD on your iPad complete with analog sticks and buttons.


Right now I am watching some NBA on ABC while my son is sitting next to me playing Lego Batman 2 on the Gamepad.

You can't do this on tablets and on other consoles.

Another excellent use of the Gamepad is split screen multiplayer.  In Lego Batman 2 this is a godsend compared to that nauseating splitscreen in the other versions. The second player gets their own screen. This is also possible in CoD even when playing an online game. This is not possible on other consoles.

To me the failure of the Wii U has little to nothing do with the Gamepad being a bad device.

I think the Wii U was always in the tough spot  of being a "Nintendo-only" console.  3rd parties were never going to make it a western AAA console.  It needed that Wiisports-sized hit to be in the penthouse otherwise it was the outhouse.      The Gamepad really only hurt the pricepoint.

Other than that I don't think Nintendo got out in front of the messaging.  The Gamepad is a game controller with a screen.  Not a console with a crappy tablet.  Not a crappy tablet with a wireless hdmi box.  Nintendo didn't do enough to show this and show why you need it in single player games either according to Iwata.

Last it sounds like the GAmepad has something to with the bigger picture.  Nintendo is moving to 1 architecture.  Iwata talks about sharing games across their platforms.  And the Gamepad only makes the Wii U more like Nintendo's handheld.  

 
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With the last few episodes about Titanfall, do you think EA is actually going to have this game ready and playable at launch. I am thinking that it is going to be another rush job just like Sim City and Battlefield 4. I still jump into servers with audio issues on Battlefiled 4 (PC) and remember what EA said. That they have the entire company working on fixing Battlefield 4. Titanfall = doomed because of quality issues at launch. Of course I will buy it once i see a deal similar to Battlefield 4 59.99 - 50% off black Friday sale 2013 - Dr. pepper 10 off promo code thanks to cag's forums. You guys make my commute much more enjoyable. 

PS Shipwreck. I was fist pumping the air when i heard how busy you are these days and you said the golden word "baby". I knew it would be said. I'm at the tail end of the baby stage so i feel for you. Wait until you have two kids around. It's like quadruple the work. 

 
It's the same thing Wombat said in the previous episode regarding the proposed Apple TV game console, almost all the games have a touch control interface. If you have to be staring down at your iphone/ipod touch in order to play the iOS game, then the console part becomes irrelevant you might as well just play it on that device.

I also don't get the hype for titan fall, but that doesn't mean that Wombat's pause argument makes any sense. I do think the Multiplayer shooter crowd will pick it up, play it for a bit, and then go right back to what they were previously playing, Call of Duty. What are the blockbuster multiplayer successes these past 2 generations? Halo, Call of Duty, Battlefield, and Gears of War?

The farther removed we get from the NES/SNES/N64 era the less relevant Nintendo becomes, the newer generation coming up does not have that nostalgic connection to Nintendo's cast of characters. It doesn't help matters that they launch the WiiU at just about the worst possible time. They had a 1 year jump on the competition but had very little compelling software for that entire year so the headstart was wasted. Better to launch earlier and not be caught in the transition time between this next gen or later and launch with a good library.

Those that do have the connection to the characters can easily get their fix on a DS console and there is a library of quality 3rd party games to boot, I also did find it a bit funny that you brought up that Nintendo has so much cash on hand considering the discussion at the beginning of the episode regarding Shipwreck's Internet and that throwing money at the problem wasn't solving it.

I'll get Wolf Among us when the season is finished since they have been releasing the episodes rather slowly and it's only going to get worse I imagine since they keep announcing more properties they are adapting.

I would like to be entered for the Jazz Punk contest.

 
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I agree with Wombat when he said Titanfall isn't going to be a mega-hit series (in terms of lasting popularity, not sales), but his reasoning is terrible. Titanfall is aiming for the CoD crowd that play MP matches repeatedly. You can never pause those (as Shipwreck pointed out). Wombat wants a SP component, and that's understandable. But Titanfall is meant to be MP-only. They would've had to devote time and energy to making a campaign, scripting levels, etc etc for an SP. They didn't do that obviously. Having a SP-only mode of what they are currently offering would just be a bot match. No one is interested in playing only bot matches. EDIT: I am aware that bots are mixed into the normal matches, but here I was referring to bot-only matches with one player.

TL;DR Titanfall is not a game aimed at Wombat's demographic in the slightest and I'm not sure he fully realizes that. But I agree with him that I don't think it will have lasting popularity.

 
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I played Brothers and felt it was just "meh." I think it's one of those games that just doesn't stand on its own if the emotional hook of the story fails on you. It did on me. I also played the majority of it in one sitting and by the end I was just straining at the slow pacing (done for the aforementioned emotional hook) and just wanted it to be DONE. The puzzles were also never really puzzles. I felt they were just there to keep the gameplay from being a straight walk-through experience.

On the positive side, I did really enjoy the art and the game world. I also got it on sale (Steam), so I didn't have any complaints about the length. I would have if I'd paid $15, though.

Put me down for some Jazzpunk!

 
Jasper Kazai said:
I agree with Wombat when he said Titanfall isn't going to be a mega-hit series (in terms of lasting popularity, not sales), but his reasoning is terrible. Titanfall is aiming for the CoD crowd that play MP matches repeatedly. You can never pause those (as Shipwreck pointed out). Wombat wants a SP component, and that's understandable. But Titanfall is meant to be MP-only. They would've had to devote time and energy to making a campaign, scripting levels, etc etc for an SP. They didn't do that obviously. Having a SP-only mode of what they are currently offering would just be a bot match. No one is interested in playing only bot matches.

TL;DR Titanfall is not a game aimed at Wombat's demographic in the slightest and I'm not sure he fully realizes that. But I agree with him that I don't think it will have lasting popularity.
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Bolded: That's funny, because they already announced that every match is a bot match. They put bots in there because "we needed some fodder so people could summon titan mechs".

So CoD is going 3-year or something? It was already a 2-year rotation with 2 studios, so it could come out every year, right? Is there no new CoD this fall, meaning no true next gen version yet? This could be a positive for Titanfall imo. Even the CoD fans say Ghosts is the worst, so when Titanfall comes along they may just stick with it and not fall back to Ghosts and nothing else coming out in fall. Oh wait, Battlefield just announced they are coming yearly now...oh boy.

All this Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons talk, and no one has mentioned the story. Or more specifically how the story is conveyed. There is no words, text, or spoken language we can understand. It's all very intuitive and conveys just what is needed and you still understand it. The fact that I've never heard one complaint about how the characters don't speak a real language just goes to show how good it is. I think that's amazing, and well done.

 
Kazaganthi said:
Bolded: That's funny, because they already announced that every match is a bot match. They put bots in there because "we needed some fodder so people could summon titan mechs".
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I'm aware there are bots in matches. I meant full-on bot matches: you and 5 bots vs 6 bots or whatever the cap is. And that's actually probably in the game. But it's not an attraction by any means.

 
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