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So, our military kills civilians...

Posted by joeboosauce, 06 April 2010 · 901 views

So, this is horrid shit news for today but its just like another episode of a sitcom. People will forget after a day or two. It's not like people (who don't hide their head in the sand) didn't know this goes on with our military. This incident is only out there and known because it was leaked. If you don't know by now, here are sources on this story. Basically, Wikileaks.org released a bombshell of a video depicting US troops opening fire into a crowd of civilians who have no weapons. The "weapons" are the oh so lethal video camera and tripod of journalists on the ground. There was no firefight that the military claimed after their "investigation." The military would not release the video to Reuters who the 2 journalists belonged to. And further, the soldiers shot at a van of people trying to help a wounded man and they shot 30mm rounds into 2 children. Yay USA! If you watch the attitude, especially the end, it reveals a callousness as the soldiers show no remorse. They even laugh and hope that the wounded civilians try to shoot them with the nonexistent gun. And command sanctions this all the way.

Our culture has truly become perverse. We are desensitized to the horrors of war thanks to our gov't, "news" media, and entertainment media. This includes video games. The soldiers really sound like what you would hear playing COD4/5/6/any FPS on XBox Live/PSN. But, isn't this what is needed in to maintain a highly militarized society? One that supports invasions, occupations, covert interventions, death squads/terrorists (El Salvador, Nicaragua, etc), drone bombings, fomenting civil wars in Africa and elsewhere, is the #1 arms supplier to the world, and I could go on and on.

Well, rant over. I would be interested in hearing your thoughts for and against mine or whatever is on your mind. Although, the machine has conditioned us to steer clear of important issues that concern our society and go... play video games?

Here are some sources on this topic:
N.Y. Times, Weekly Standard join in a falsehood By Glenn Greenwald

Coverage and interview with Wikileaks founder:

Full video:

Brief article:

US gov't is attempting to shut down Wikileaks

From the Democracy Now interview, I thought this really sums up this incident and our military apparatus in general:

"These are not bad apples. This is standard practice. You can hear it from the tones of the voices of the pilots that this is in fact another day at the office. These pilots have evidently and gunners have evidently become so corrupted, morally corrupted, by the war that they are looking for excuses to kill. That is why you hear this segment, “Come on, buddy! Just pick up a weapon,” when Saeed, one of the Reuters employees, is crawling on the curb. They don’t want him for intelligence value to understand the situation. The man is clearly of no threat whatsoever. He’s prostate on the ground. Everyone else has been killed. They just want an excuse to kill. And it’s some kind of—appears to me to be some kind of video game mentality where they just want to get a high score, get their kill count up. And later on you’ll hear them proudly proclaiming how they killed twelve to fifteen people."

Also yes we get George Bush was a horrible president we get it. But he wasn't the only president in our country that made bad mistakes. The country made it thru the Bush administration and you know what we'll make it through this as well. "You're with us or you're against us" mentality was something I believed in back from the Carter to today's Obama era. So are you going to say to me that I should not believe in my country?

Dude, Lil Wayne was never president. In fact, he's in jail right now dropping the soap.
All I want to know is why the hell is Obama busy posting on CAG under a fake name instead of doing something about these supposed atrocities he is on here whining about?

Other than that I think im done with this thread as Its going nowhere good fast and I have better things to do with my interenet free time. Like reading the daily hahas
Personally I have seen much worse videos from all around the world and how other cultures enact there sense of justice. So its not that I did not feel empathy but I was not there. What happen to lead up to that incident? Right now all we are seeing is just one side and granted its a nasty side but that is life and that is what war really is.

At the same time we don't know what those soldiers are going through. Or more to the point what have they gone through up to that point of the video. Are they at fault or where they just falling orders?

It sucks man it really does but if you don't like then I suggest we all do our American duty and speak with our vote and change the people in office that are making these decisions to send our troops.

Do I want our troops there no, but they are that is the reality of it. So instead of spitting in there faces I rather they come home safe with open arms and sit down to share a beer.
Shimra, the point is that you equate "supporting your country" and "supporting your troops" with loudly and obnoxiously shouting down anything that approaches a critique of what they do.

Well, at least you extend that "nobody can ever criticize this" to the military, since I seem to recall you posting some uninformed anti-health-care-reform blather a few weeks back. So you do criticize the government. Good on yeh.

My point is that there's no room for debate for you. The world is not Hulk Hogan versus the Iron Shiek. We live in a complex world where rationales and actions are complex. We can't distill all military actions ever down into a justified versus unjustified binary. It's unreasonable, it's silly, it's a waste of time.

You permit no room for criticism of the military. That's my primary problem with your approach to debate. Another is that you're woefully uninformed, but let's put that aside for the moment. By treating everything and everyone in the military as above criticism, you harm their nobility.

You like pictures and don't like words. I think you should check this video out (no joke):
Seen the video already. Also the way I am expressing my point is no different than how Joeboo is coming across.

He started it...:bouncy:
"he started it."

this is why we can't have anything nice.
I love how people all over the inter webs state things like "listen to the blood lust in their words"

Comments like that do a disservice to our troops over there. Most people don't join our armed forces to be fucking Rambo. They join to get an education, to serve, or escape a bad situation. I know people over there that hate what they see and I know people that are FUBAR from it all.

Politics aside, what is has come to is many people act like we are slaughtering a whole country and this video is fuel to say our troops are all evil.

This is what happens over there.......yet we are the evil ones.....
Cool strawman lowgear26, no one has used the word 'evil' to describe all our troops, or any of them for that matter.

'listen to the blood lust in their words', well, i dont know who said that but do you dispute that description? You say it harms our troops but the fact is that this was an unfortunate incident, the manner in which the troops reacted while it was happening (like a video game) is also really unfortunate. But pointing out these indisputable facts isn't doing a disservice, it's pointing out a reality.
So what HAVE you read on US foreign policy? Do you think it is of no value to know your own history or how it functions? That is is the furthest thing from being a patriot.
REALLY child? "Evil"? Who told you those tales of good/evil? Big poppa Dubya? Yes, reality is like a comic book? Wait a minute, comic books have developed more depth nowadays. So, you are an 80s era comic book. Ahh... Reagan era "evil empire" days...
Yeah, actually thanks for correcting me on the net neutrality issue. The Obama admin is actually doing something on that. But, they need to push more on that ie push for legislation as this ruling challenges internet regulation in general. And more deregulation is obviously bad.

Hmmmm... See people? A well thought out response that makes a valid point. Not some simple parroting. You know, it doesn't hurt to learn your own history. Any worthwhile citizen will do this. A worthless one will not.

And who is the fool that thinks I am Obama? Or a fan of his. I am not. "Whoa! So, you don't sound like a Republican and you don't like Obama! Oh no! I cannot compute. World only exist in duality(I don't know what that word means). Only good/evil, Repub/Dem, con/lib, etc. Head hurtin!"
I don't know who deleted the tags that people put up (terrorist, unpatriotic, etc.) but I think they should have stayed up. It really shows the disconnect people have with reality.

Seriously, what joeboosauce is saying is a fact. And General Stanley McChrystal is saying the same thing joeboosauce is saying:

"We've shot an amazing number of people and killed a number and, to my knowledge, none has proven to have been a real threat to the force . . . . [T]o my knowledge, in the nine-plus months I've been here, not a single case where we have engaged in an escalation of force incident and hurt someone has it turned out that the vehicle had a suicide bomb or weapons in it and, in many cases, had families in it."

And yet you FUCKING douchebags are attacking joeboosauce for this. Yet it's totally cool when McChrystal says the same thing? Unbelievable. They're just stating facts guys.
My experiment in demonstrating conservative stupidity and racism was a resounding success.

Here is an EXCELLENT study that reveals the difference between conservative and liberal thinking.
Misperceptions, the Media and the Iraq War

Surprise, surprise. Cons were the most ill informed.
Particularly, check out the chart in the top left on page 20 of the full report: "Exposure to News and Frequency of Misperceptions Among Bush and Democratic Nominee Supporters"
The more news they consumed, the more misinformed they became! HILARIOUS! Talk about a confused lot. This explains Shimra and his ilk.