720p to 1080i

pdiscool

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Was wondering, i read in the egm that if you tv does not support 720p as some older hd sets dont it will scale it to 1080i automatically. Does anyone kno how this works? Would u have to set games in the 360 dashboard to 1080i or 720p? Also will it look as good as it would if it was in the original 720p mode capared to the 1080i scaled way, and would it affect the framrate or have bad cropping?
 
[quote name='pdiscool']Was wondering, i read in the egm that if you tv does not support 720p as some older hd sets dont it will scale it to 1080i automatically. Does anyone kno how this works? Would u have to set games in the 360 dashboard to 1080i or 720p? Also will it look as good as it would if it was in the original 720p mode capared to the 1080i scaled way, and would it affect the framrate or have bad cropping?[/QUOTE]

Some TVs automatically convert 720p to 1080i, but some TVs don't have that function. I'm almost positive that I read that you could set your X360 to automatically convert 720p to 1080i if your TV didn't support 720p. As for which is better, it's almost a matter of opinion. Both are very good and you shouldn't have any problems since the X360 has the built-in conversion ability.
 
It's very rare that a TV will support 1080i and not 720p. But I guess in the case that it does I'm sure any game will scale accordingly via the xbox or your TV. Either way, I'm hoping there will be some 1080p lovin for my lcd, though I doubt it.
 
[quote name='Zoglog']It's very rare that a TV will support 1080i and not 720p. But I guess in the case that it does I'm sure any game will scale accordingly via the xbox or your TV. Either way, I'm hoping there will be some 1080p lovin for my lcd, though I doubt it.[/QUOTE]

It's actually not that rare for TVs to support 1080i and not 720p. A lot of the early HDTVs did not support 720p and most if not all of the CRT HDTVs do not support 720p. From what I've read, the X360 will not support 1080p unless there is a future hardware update. That would mean even more confusion for consumers, so I doubt that will happen. By the time enough people have TVs that support 1080p, Xbox 3 will be out.
 
[quote name='Zoglog']It's very rare that a TV will support 1080i and not 720p. But I guess in the case that it does I'm sure any game will scale accordingly via the xbox or your TV. Either way, I'm hoping there will be some 1080p lovin for my lcd, though I doubt it.[/QUOTE]

Not very rare at all....most early HDTV's only had 1080i (no 720p). Do a little research on what is out there. I still see TV's being sold that only do 480p and 1080i....no 720p
 
[quote name='Zoglog']It's very rare that a TV will support 1080i and not 720p. But I guess in the case that it does I'm sure any game will scale accordingly via the xbox or your TV. Either way, I'm hoping there will be some 1080p lovin for my lcd, though I doubt it.[/QUOTE]

Our HDTV has 1080i but not 720p... instead, it has 480p/540p which is weird since I've never seen it being support by any console.

Most TVs will convert 720p to 1080i if they can't support it, our's does. 1080i and 720p are way too similar- one might look better than the other but as someone already said, it's a matter of opinion. Now, 1080p... that's a different story.:)
 
my tv only supports 1080i and does not convert 720p... which i found out when trying to run soul calibur 2 on Xbox in 720p. I was sad...

but this is the first I have heard of the 360 doing that conversion for me! That would be sweet... anyone know if the PS3 will do the same (i'm more of a PS fan that an Xbox fan)?
 
Yep, I could never play 720p on my TV for XBOX games also...like MVP BAseball. So, no auto conversion. However, I think some NFL Football games come in at 720p on my HDTV, but they get converted to 1080i. So, not sure how things work.
 
Mine only supports 480p and 1080i. I thought i was SOL and was looking into buying another HDTV next spring with tax return but these news sound good to me. I'll have to try it when I get my 360. Thanks for the news guys.
 
[quote name='Zoglog']It's very rare that a TV will support 1080i and not 720p. But I guess in the case that it does I'm sure any game will scale accordingly via the xbox or your TV. Either way, I'm hoping there will be some 1080p lovin for my lcd, though I doubt it.[/QUOTE]

What everyone else said.
 
Well, I've searched a lot of other threads here at CAG about this, but I figured since there is already a discussion on it here, I might as well ask. I'm looking into buying an HDTV...but at the price range I can afford, it seems like I'll be stuck with 420p/1080i. (Not to mention I'm definately getting a CRT model...so I guess I'd be stuck with em regardless of cash) So since the Xbox 360 can upscale it, do you think I might as well get a TV that can't support 720p? I thought I had read a lot of people commenting on that when something gets upscaled, it isn't anywhere near as good as it would be if it was natively in that setting...I guess in this case 1080i.
 
well I was mostly refering to recent flat panel tvs, but yeah I can see how that works for CRT. as for 540p that's because it's just 1080i transferred over to progressive scan.

I was pretty sure the 360 would support 1080i. after all the regular Xbox already does 1080i (from hdtv arcade).

Enter the Matrix 16:9 480p 720p 1080i 5.1
MX vs. ATV Unleashed 16:9 480p 720p 1080i 5.1 Online
Atari Anthology 16:9 480p 720p 1080i 5.1 Online*
Syberia 16:9 480p 720p 1080i 5.1
Dragon's Lair 3D 16:9 480p 720p 1080i 5.1
MX Unleashed

Does anyone know if it will support 1080p at all though?

On another note the HDTV standard is almost enough to make me get a 360. lower resolutions just don't cut it on the higher resolution flat panels. Grainyness is more apparent and 480i makes me want to cry (Genji) =(.
 
[quote name='Zoglog']well I was mostly refering to recent flat panel tvs, but yeah I can see how that works for CRT. as for 540p that's because it's just 1080i transferred over to progressive scan.

I was pretty sure the 360 would support 1080i. after all the regular Xbox already does 1080i. Does anyone know if it will support 1080p at all though?[/QUOTE]

It does not support 1080p.
 
the 360 itself will convert the signal from 720p to 1080i.

and soul calibur 2 is 720p but not widescreen. so everybody has black bars, not just you.
 
Here is some info from what developers were working with when programming for the 360.

According to the TCR's devs only need to target 720p. The outboard display chip is responsible for scaling the image. It can scale up to 1080i or down to 480i/p. MS made this decision in order to support ALL HDTV's without requiring specific developer support for each display mode, as was the case with XBox 1. Many older HD displays are limited to supporting only 1080i or only 720p.

Because it does its scaling in the analog domain, this display chip is incapable of digital outputs like DVI/HDMI or supporting 1080p. It was designed by MS's WebTV group. Right now it is limited to composite, s-video, component, and vga. The chip can be re-engineered and changed later since it is seperate from Xenos to support digital out, but that could create consumer confusion as to which XBox units do what.
 
yeah I found that kind of wierd how Soul calibur 2 had black bars, you would think they would support widescreen =/. But oh well it looks very sharp nevertheless. I've been kind of dissapointed at the lack of 720p games for the xbox. The last one I played was Xmen Legends
 
To the people without 720p:

I wouldn't worry about buying a new TV just because your set doesn't do 720p. Have the 360 upscale it to 1080i (rather than having the TV do it, which may cause a bit of lag). Honestly, the difference is negligible unless you're someone who posts at avsforum. ;) With the prices of TVs dropping as fast as they are, and the quality improving as quickly as it is, I think it's a waste of money to buy a new set just for that, unless you're incredibly wealthy and have money to burn. But then if that's the case, why would you be here at CAG? Save your money and buy a new set in a few more years when they're REALLY improved.
 
What will be interesting is how this will handle original Xbox games. Will it upconvert those 720p games to 1080i? I can only hope, because I was never able to play Xbox games in 720p. I'm guessing the answer to this is "no", though.
 
[quote name='shipwreck']What will be interesting is how this will handle original Xbox games. Will it upconvert those 720p games to 1080i? I can only hope, because I was never able to play Xbox games in 720p. I'm guessing the answer to this is "no", though.[/QUOTE]

To add some more fuel to the fire, I've heard rumors about the 360 upconverting some games from 480p to 720p, such as Halo 2. I think that was an EGM rumor, but I'm not sure. Maybe someone can back me up on that. I guess we'll see whether or not this will be true soon enough. But I would think that if the 360 upconverted an original Xbox game to 720p, that it could kick it up to 1080i. I hope.
 
[quote name='shipwreck']It does not support 1080p.[/QUOTE]

Everywhere I've read about the X360 states that minmum support is 720 but it does support 1080

From Microsoft:

Games: Xbox 360 redefines what games look like, sound like, feel like, and play like to engage you like never before. With Xbox 360, epic worlds are alive with detail, from thunderous skies rumbling over a mountain range to tiny blades of grass rustling together in the breeze. Vibrant characters display depth of emotion to evoke more dramatic responses, immersing you in the experience like never before. You’ll see all Xbox 360 titles at 720p and 1080i resolution in 16:9 widescreen, with anti-aliasing for smooth, movie-like graphics and multi-channel surround sound.

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/xbox360/factsheet.htm

And read on GameStop.com:

Microsoft's second-generation video game console features a multicore 3.2GHz IBM PowerPC-based CPU, a custom ATI graphics chip, and multichannel surround sound. The unit has wireless controllers and offers 720p and 1080i support for all games. The system is Wi-Fi ready and has a detachable 20GB hard drive

http://hardware.gamespot.com/x-15016-O-4-4
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']Everywhere I've read about the X360 states that minmum support is 720 but it does support 1080

Microsoft's second-generation video game console features a multicore 3.2GHz IBM PowerPC-based CPU, a custom ATI graphics chip, and multichannel surround sound. The unit has wireless controllers and offers 720p and 1080i support for all games. The system is Wi-Fi ready and has a detachable 20GB hard drive

http://hardware.gamespot.com/x-15016-O-4-4[/QUOTE]

It supports 1080i. It does not support 1080p. There's a big difference.
 
Oh crap. My bad, didnt notice the "p" till you mentioned it. I didnt even know that 1080p was a resolution for HD i thought it was just 1080i

Sorry.
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']Oh crap. My bad, didnt notice the "p" till you mentioned it. I didnt even know that 1080p was a resolution for HD i thought it was just 1080i

Sorry.[/QUOTE]

Don't worry about it. The reason it doesn't support 1080p is because so few people actually have TVs that can output 1080p. Microsoft decided to cut costs on some features that not many people would take advantage of this time around.
 
[quote name='Zoglog']the funny thing about soul calibur 2 is it's only not widescreen when in 720p mode according to hdtvarcade.[/QUOTE]

Yea Namco screwed that up - it still looks pretty amazing. Amped 2 looks insane in 720p.
 
Thanks for the good work everyone...Shipwreck mainly.

MX vs ATV looks good in 1080i. I was first playing it on 480p, until I switched my inputs to run through my receiver....I only have ONE Hi-Def Component input in my TV....so my receiver switches it between my HD-cable box and my XBOX.
 
There is a setting on the XBOX to enable 720p/1080i....they have to be turned on through the XBOX dashboard. Don't turn 720p on if your TV does not support it...you will get a BLUE screen or osmething to that matter :D
 
[quote name='pdiscool']Was wondering, i read in the egm that if you tv does not support 720p as some older hd sets dont it will scale it to 1080i automatically. Does anyone kno how this works? Would u have to set games in the 360 dashboard to 1080i or 720p? Also will it look as good as it would if it was in the original 720p mode capared to the 1080i scaled way, and would it affect the framrate or have bad cropping?[/QUOTE]

Not all 1080i TVs scale 720p up. Some scale it down or just display a blank screen.


However, even if your TV does not scale 720p, the XBOX360 has a builtin analog scaler that will scale the picture to 1080i. Just set the XBOX360 to display the ones your TV supports, and it will take care of the rest.

It will look spectacular either way, so don't worry its no problem! :)
 
[quote name='doubledown']There is a setting on the XBOX to enable 720p/1080i....they have to be turned on through the XBOX dashboard. Don't turn 720p on if your TV does not support it...you will get a BLUE screen or osmething to that matter :D[/QUOTE]

I do have mine setup like that, but my TV scaled it down to 480p instead of up to 1080i. I'll check my tv setups.
 
We have to wait for PS3 for 1080p......and HDMI. Part of the reason the shots we are seeing of the PS3 screens are so sick. This technology coupled with blu-ray is why Sony thinks it will win the "next generation war". I think they will both do just fine...........
 
[quote name='Ruined']Not all 1080i TVs scale 720p up. Some scale it down or just display a blank screen.


However, even if your TV does not scale 720p, the XBOX360 has a builtin analog scaler that will scale the picture to 1080i. Just set the XBOX360 to display the ones your TV supports, and it will take care of the rest.

It will look spectacular either way, so don't worry its no problem! :)[/QUOTE]

Actually in order to convert 720p to 1080i most TVs take the image and scale down to 540p then up to 1080i.
 
[quote name='Indiana']Actually in order to convert 720p to 1080i most TVs take the image and scale down to 540p then up to 1080i.[/QUOTE]

I was under the impression that most HDTVs don't do the scaling at all since most HD sets do not have in integrated HD tuner. All HD STBs that I know of have scalers built into them. I know with my Cox HD box, I set it's scaler options to 1080i and it handles the conversion.
 
[quote name='THE DARK KNIGHT']We have to wait for PS3 for 1080p......and HDMI. Part of the reason the shots we are seeing of the PS3 screens are so sick. This technology coupled with blu-ray is why Sony thinks it will win the "next generation war". I think they will both do just fine...........[/QUOTE]

As of right now 1080p tv's only run at 30 frames a second. So if you have a 1080p tv that automatically upconverts any signal to 1080p you will be playing next gen games at only 30 frames a second. Just something to remember if you are shopping for a 1080p tv for gaming.
 
I know 1080p is the best, but those tv's are still a little too expensive, so I was wondering which is better, 720p or 1080i? Thanks!
 
Ok thanks a lot guys. I think I may go for a 42" Samsung 1080p. It's a little expensive, but it is probably worth the investment.
 
[quote name='himsahealer']Ok thanks a lot guys. I think I may go for a 42" Samsung 1080p. It's a little expensive, but it is probably worth the investment.[/QUOTE]
360 only goes up to 1080i or 720p, ive done both and I prefer 720.
 
[quote name='himsahealer']Ok thanks a lot guys. I think I may go for a 42" Samsung 1080p. It's a little expensive, but it is probably worth the investment.[/QUOTE]
if youre going strictly for 360 gaming i dont think a 1080p set is needed. i think at 42" youre on the fence for being able to notice any difference with that resolution period.
a lot of people on the internet are going to say everything but the supposed best tech (for this topic its 1080p) is garbage, even though id bet half of these people dont have a hdtv of any res.
depending on the policy of whichever retailer, you can exchange a tv after viewing it in yoru home. i went into the store with a specific, well-reviewed tv i wanted and after seeing the picture in person i was doubtful, if not for the ability to return the tv after having it in my home i wouldnt have bought it with the way it was setup. after seeing the picture in home im very happy withg it.

anyway, hope that helps a little, dont get caught up in internet folk trying to live vicariously through your purchase.
 
[quote name='panasonic']720P or 1080P only 1080i is ass[/quote]Why exactly is 1080i ass?
I have my tv on 1080i and it looks great (but I'm going to have to see what it looks like on 720p now...).
 
[quote name='paz9x']if youre going strictly for 360 gaming i dont think a 1080p set is needed. i think at 42" youre on the fence for being able to notice any difference with that resolution period.
a lot of people on the internet are going to say everything but the supposed best tech (for this topic its 1080p) is garbage, even though id bet half of these people dont have a hdtv of any res.
depending on the policy of whichever retailer, you can exchange a tv after viewing it in yoru home. i went into the store with a specific, well-reviewed tv i wanted and after seeing the picture in person i was doubtful, if not for the ability to return the tv after having it in my home i wouldnt have bought it with the way it was setup. after seeing the picture in home im very happy withg it.

anyway, hope that helps a little, dont get caught up in internet folk trying to live vicariously through your purchase.[/quote]

I agree. I have found out that many people who don't own a specific gaming console talk bad about it simply because they can not afford to have the experience. Anyways I did find your write up very helpful, thank you. What kind of tv do you use to run the 360 on? I played a PS3 on a set before I bought my PS3, and the person told me it was doing 720p, but my PS3 can only output either 480p or 1080p. I noticed that the LCD they had the PS3 running on looks great. I have never been very much into tv's, but I figured it was time to jump into a better resolution for my games.

I mainly want the HDTV for my Xbox 360, because I have my PS3 in another room, and my 360 is my main gaming hub. So I don't really plan on using my PS3 on the HDTV. I also don't plan on investing in Blu-Ray movies because I will stick to regular DVD until the Digital Distribution takes off everywhere. So this set will be strictly used for the 360.
 
[quote name='LiquidNight']Why exactly is 1080i ass?
I have my tv on 1080i and it looks great (but I'm going to have to see what it looks like on 720p now...).[/QUOTE]


Because 720p costs more than 1080i so people who own 720p have to justify why their TV cost more. ;)
 
In my experience, 720p looks a little bit more fluid than 1080i. However, 1080i seems to be a bit sharper. I have the option to do either, but I run 720p on my projector and I'm pleased with the results.
 
[quote name='himsahealer']I agree. I have found out that many people who don't own a specific gaming console talk bad about it simply because they can not afford to have the experience. Anyways I did find your write up very helpful, thank you. What kind of tv do you use to run the 360 on? I played a PS3 on a set before I bought my PS3, and the person told me it was doing 720p, but my PS3 can only output either 480p or 1080p. I noticed that the LCD they had the PS3 running on looks great. I have never been very much into tv's, but I figured it was time to jump into a better resolution for my games.

I mainly want the HDTV for my Xbox 360, because I have my PS3 in another room, and my 360 is my main gaming hub. So I don't really plan on using my PS3 on the HDTV. I also don't plan on investing in Blu-Ray movies because I will stick to regular DVD until the Digital Distribution takes off everywhere. So this set will be strictly used for the 360.[/QUOTE]
the output of the ps3 doesnt sound right, i dont have one and havent paid too much attention but im pretty sure it outputs at other resolutions.
anyway, i use a westinghouse 32w6 for my 360 and ive had tons of compliments, ive also had it on a 57" dlp sony and it looked great on that as well, it looked a little more vibrant than the westinghouse but not as sharp (both tvs were at 720p). i currently have it set at 1080i but i looks about the same to me.
personally, if i had a ps3 (and i will when i an walk into a store and buy one) id have it hooked up to an hdtv.
good luck.
 
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