CAGcast #225: PS3 Blood Libel

I know that Microsoft replaces RROD'd xbox 360s because I know a bunch of people that have gotten RROD. In my experience they were the people that leave their consoles on all day and/or travel with them a lot, whereas I've had my xbox for like 2 years now and have had no trouble because I take care of it. Xbox 360s prior to the slim weren't well made, but I was never afraid of getting RROD because I figured it wouldn't be repaired (I know I can get it repaired for free), I was because that would mean a massive break in my game time.

I know this isn't scientific, but amongst my friends, every one of them who brought a 360 slim did so in order to avoid the potential inconvenience of RROD.

Why is this relevant? Because there's an argument to be made that a lot of the purchases of Xbox 360s this year were not purchases that will expand the install base. If your install base isn't expanding, then you're not in a position to sell much software, especially if the ways in which your base actually is expanding is by appealing to mainstream (as Kinect has almost exclusively) which is notorious for not purchasing many games.

I think it's delusional to think that, as a core gamer's console, the Xbox 360 is in good shape right now. Microsoft is saying things publicly like "The 360 is not for gaming, it's for general entertainment," releasing very few exclusives, is upping the cost of gold subscriptions, and seems completely focused on catering to casuals. At this point I really am thinking about selling my xbox. The only thing that's convincing me to keep it are the awesome past-exclusives like Deadly Premonition, Tale of Vesperia, Lost Odyssey, and the XBLA games coming out this year.

Not that Sony doesn't have its problems: the hacking thing could be a big deal (it's made MW2 practically unplayable from what I've heard), for some reason they've decided to focus on the PSP2 which is retarded as their console business is finally starting to get back on track, and Move hasn't enjoyed the same level of success as Kinect.

I get that you guys are entitled to your opinions, and my posts are not an attempt of depriving you of those. However, I do feel some of what you stated on the show is factually incorrect. Little Big Planet 2 is not a "niche" game -- quite the opposite, everyone I know loves it from my 4 year old niece, to my teenage brothers, and even my father.

You guys kept saying that Sony doesn't have any "system sellers" with the exception of both Killzone 3 and Uncharted 3, however, there are 2 games on 360 coming out this year that are exclusive core games: Gears of War 3 and Forza 4. Of those, Gears of War 3 has mass market appeal and the racing genre in general seems to be suffering from massive contraction (if the performance of Split Second and Blur are any indication). I suppose Dance Central 2 could be seen as a system seller, but considering how recently the original came out that does not seem likely. So, how is Microsoft in any better shape?

2011 is shaping up to be a hard year for Microsoft. The Launch of the 3DS is going to suck a lot of cash out of the system, their Kinect momentum is dying, there's no way the newly redesigned hardware is going to see a price drop anytime soon, and the slim's effect on hardware sales is going to be over halfway through the year. Combine that with a lack of exclusives and more multiplats selling on the PS3, and I don't know how you can think this year is gonna be kinder to Microsoft than Sony. That isn't to say Microsoft is going to be doing bad by any stretch of the imagination.

I predict they'll continue to edge PS3 out in multiplat sales, and the Kinect will continue to cater to casuals with great success. I just don't think it's the console that is going to be better for core gamers this year, unlike how 2005, 2006, 2007, and 2008 unquestionably were better for Microsoft (and I think you could make an argument that 2010 was as well).
 
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Gotta say for a time where 360 is going to focus on kincect with less hardcore exclusive games I'm pretty happy with the PS3 ones. Does the Ps3 even need to have a system seller game? the third parties could give it to them. With call of duty coming out on ps3. its much more appealing to buy a ps3 with call of duty and 11 exclusive to look at. As to 360 this year with only 2 i believe that i know of (gears of war and forza) . With MS not really announcing that many games right now there could be the potential of 360 only owners switching to ps3 and be dual console owners just my two cents thou Great show.
 
[quote name='Kewin']Gotta say for a time where 360 is going to focus on kincect with less hardcore exclusive games I'm pretty happy with the PS3 ones. Does the Ps3 even need to have a system seller game? the third parties could give it to them. With call of duty coming out on ps3. its much more appealing to buy a ps3 with call of duty and 11 exclusive to look at. As to 360 this year with only 2 i believe that i know of (gears of war and forza) . With MS not really announcing that many games right now there could be the potential of 360 only owners switching to ps3 and be dual console owners just my two cents thou Great show.[/QUOTE]


People should realize by now that MS only cares about making money. They don't care about the Live community or hardcore gamer. Heck, they raised the price of Live, and the Xbox fanboys didn't complain one bit.

If Kinect becomes more profitable, you can bet that they will stop making any hardcore game exclusives and cater to casual market. Don't forget, they left loyal Xbox 1 owners in the dust after the console was only a few years old.
 
[quote name='kingkiller33']People should realize by now that MS every company on the face of the earth only cares about making money.[/QUOTE]

Fixed that for you. :D
 
PS3 owner here. The CAGcasters' critique of the PS3 was well reasoned. Quite frankly, it sounded almost like an intervention. All three guys were, IMHO, quite passionate about wanting the PS3 to succeed. Particularly Shipwreck.

I'd urge people to listen to the podcast again with that in mind.
 
Well i haven`t listened to this podcast yet but Wombat is on the money with how the exclusive game on the PS3 do suck!!! Sony`s motto that it does about everything is good but as a Ps3 owner they should & could do way more with this system!!! Who needs a PS4 !!!!? Try to get the most out of the console now not later!!!!! Open up a ps 2 software so people like me can also play there PS2 Libraries!!!!
 
Shipwreck, do you understand that the Ps3 will Never have a huge NA exclusive system seller title? Sony has never had that - because NA is not the country where they excel in. Same goes with 360 in Europe and Japan. Does/will 360 have a huge system seller there? Nope. Sony has had theres in those countries. The reason Playstation did so well in the past in Na is due to the lack of competition. Once Xbox showed it can work there was nothing stopping it here - even most non gamers know the word Xbox and use it as a generalizing term for game systems.

The 360 does so well here due to it being an American console and they can cater the entireee console to a NA audience. Thats why the 360 is so appealing to you, cheapyd and even me. It was created w/ us in mind. Where the Playstation isnt and never was... You are putting too much emphasis on powerful exclusives and not looking at the broader picture of who they are actually targeting..

It's like the previous discussions on how to get the 360 to succeed in Japan... It cant.

(wrote on iPhone)
 
I am having a love affair with my PS3 right now having recently finished Uncharted, Uncharted 2, Killzone 2 and Infamous. I am even playinng Killzone 1 on my fatty PS3. DCUO is my first console MMO and I really enjoy it. Still, there are things that are just a pain in the nether regions. Unskippable time consuming updates, mandatory installs, a terrible interface (go look under the settings tab and see what I mean) and lack of demos in the PSN should have been fixed years ago. The 360 is brand new animal compared to what it started as with the blades system.

The guys were more than fair with their assessment of the strengths and weaknesses of the PS3.
 
[quote name='Stryffe2004']I am having a love affair with my PS3 right now having recently finished Uncharted, Uncharted 2, Killzone 2 and Infamous. I am even playinng Killzone 1 on my fatty PS3. DCUO is my first console MMO and I really enjoy it. Still, there are things that are just a pain in the nether regions. Unskippable time consuming updates, mandatory installs, a terrible interface (go look under the settings tab and see what I mean) and lack of demos in the PSN should have been fixed years ago. The 360 is brand new animal compared to what it started as with the blades system.

The guys were more than fair with their assessment of the strengths and weaknesses of the PS3.[/QUOTE]

Lack of demos? I think they are about comparable. And the PS3 has around 11 Demo's available for JUST the Move where 360 only has 3-4 for kinect. Which is a bummer...
 
[quote name='DarkNessBear']Lack of demos? I think they are about comparable. And the PS3 has around 11 Demo's available for JUST the Move where 360 only has 3-4 for kinect. Which is a bummer...[/QUOTE]

Theres a excellent reason for that. Outside of Kinect Sports and *barely* dance central, kinect games are horrifically bad. Dance Central is a great game, but its a single player game, and has a severe lack of songs. The DLC for it is also incredibly hit or miss (90% miss) and DLC for it is insanely random, no rhyme or reason as to when it comes out. Dance Central 2 better fix this stuff, or ubisoft will really overtake it when Just Dance hits the 360 (JD2 on wii has a TON of DLC and more comes out all the time).

That being said, there arent many good move games either, but at least the demos are out to judge for yourself.
 
Love the CCAST - Cheapy, Ship and Wombat have nothing to apologize for. They prefer the 360 and use it more than the others - that's it. They don't get cash from MSoft (even if Cheapy is a stockholder - Steve Jobs is too) or any other platform.

PS3 fanboys, please direct your complaints to Sony - they're the only ones who can fix the platform and PSN (it's free for a reason....just like there are no tolls going to New Jersey from NYC). I have a PS3 as my sole console so I empathize, but Cheapy and the guys can't change Sony's priorities - go to the paystation blog and offer your insights their. You might actually help PSN for everyone...

The only thing you could complain about the CAGcast is they seem to be less focused on prices right now. I'd just like to see more pricing analytics and comparisons on games and platform value - regardless of preferred platform. Not sure if they're helping PS3 owners as much as 360 owners. PSN has deals everyweek, but seems to be overlooked a little in comprison to XBOX Live. Shipwreck does a respectable job, but would be great to have the pricing be more democratic for both.

Just glad I don't have a Wii exclusively - I don't think they've talked about the Wii online store in awhile....
 
:drool:Another thing!? As a comic book fan!What is with DC online? Hey Sony & Micro-buttheads,if you want to make a WOW superhero type game then make a Marvel Universe Onlinewould be way better and you could get more storylines from the orginal comics that Stan Lee has already written from years ago for example:

Moon Knight (Marc Spencer) is one my favorite characters from Marvel,that a person could play the game as the comic he would read!!.Sound stupid right!? I know but you wouldn´t have such lame ass go and do type missions that one has by so WOW games now!! And would keep an online gamer going for a while by acting out the actual storyline from the comic serie!!!
What do you think Wombat? I´m like you I love the Marvel superheroes & would think
someone could make a decent Video Game !!!!!:bomb:

THank God that Mass Effect 2 is coming to the PS3
 
It's just not accurate to say that PS3 and Xbox360 are even when it comes to offering Demos. This might be true for full retail games, but very few PSN products actually give a demo whereas every single Xbox 360 Arcade Game has free demos available.

Another cool thing about the Xbox 360 online experience is Indie Games. Especially now there are a lot of amazingly cheap, accessible, fun indie games being developed and put out for only a couple of bucks. Epic Dungeon for example I paid a dollar for and it was worth every penny: it's addicting and I've spent at least 8 hours playing it so far and haven't finished, yet I still feel compelled to continue. Sony's Minis just don't live up to the Indie marketplace in value or scope.

The only way I can think of that Xbox 360 has dropped the ball in terms of quality (quality, not price, I think the premium they make you pay is ridiculous to play online) is that they didn't release an XNA devkit so that Indie games can utilize Kinect technology.

The one arena so far where Move has actually been majorly successful so far (review wise and in my opinion) has been downloadable move titles. Tumble and Echochrome 2 in particular are amazing, quality experiences that really show off the potential of the peripheral. Microsoft really needs to convince developers to do similar things for XBLA, bite-sized arcade games are perfect for well-rationed, motion control mini-games.

P.S. As loud-mouthed as I've been about this, I have to admit that this podcast's controversial topics which I disagree with actually made listening to it more exciting. Knowing that our points were being heard and in many cases responded to by people who were on the cast adds an extra layer of interactivity to listening to the CAGcast. A few months ago I listened to my first CAGcast and wasn't terribly impressed, but the title of this episode sucked me in and the content made me rethink my interest in your antics. I'm happily looking forward to your next episode now. Even if we don't agree on a whole lot of things, I really appreciate your efforts and the readiness to respond to listener opinions.

I love hearing opinions that run contrary to my own. I have a feeling I'm gonna be a dedicated listener from here on out.
 
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[quote name='Das_Regal']
The one arena so far where Move has actually been majorly successful so far (review wise and in my opinion) has been downloadable move titles. Tumble and Echochrome 2 in particular are amazing, quality experiences that really show off the potential of the peripheral. Microsoft really needs to convince developers to do similar things for XBLA, bite-sized arcade games are perfect for well-rationed, motion control mini-games.

I love hearing opinions that run contrary to my own. I have a feeling I'm gonna be a dedicated listener from here on out.[/QUOTE]

Don't know if many people know this but 3rd Parties aren't allowed to make Kinect games for the XBLA yet... I think 6months to a year is when that contract is lifted.
 
The opening of this podcast convinced me that I use both my PS3 and my 360 vastly differently than our hosts do.

When I turn on my console, it's for one of three reasons:
1) Patching / maintainance;
2) Playing a game; or
3) Downloading a game/DLC

I already know what I'm going to do when I turn the device on; I don't need to browse the UI and 'discover' what it's advertising. I didn't even know about the 360's gamertag of the week thing until Wombat earned the dubious distinction (dubious by the community response, not as to the distinction itself). It takes me less time to go from startup to get into the various things I want to do on the PS3 than it does on the 360. (Starting a game is roughly equivalent; the store & accessing video content is much faster on PS3.)
 
I will start my saying personally I think some of the downfalls of the PS3 are magnified by everyone and just don't bother some people or aren't as much of a problem.

Regarding the list of PS3 exclusives this year, if one of the titles isn't a system seller can't it be looked at that the collection of ALL the PS3 exclusives CAN be a system seller. For instance I may not buy a PS3 just for Twisted Metal lets say but then I look at Uncharted 3 and Killzone 3 and say you know what its worth it now.

Also what is that game for the 360? Is there really that game on either console? The obvious answer of course is Halo I just don't think people buy consoles soley based on exclusives anymore but more about the experience.

-Z
 
[quote name='Stryffe2004']Unskippable time consuming updates, mandatory installs, a terrible interface (go look under the settings tab and see what I mean)[/QUOTE]

I have no problem finding options in the XMB, so maybe you're just not used to it.

[quote name='Stryffe2004']The 360 is brand new animal compared to what it started as with the blades system. [/QUOTE]

Yeah, it's much worse and full to overflowing with annoying ads. Change is not always for the better.
 
I love that this thread has went from a fanboy war, to a more reasoned discussion. And Das_Regal made a great point above that the hosts of this show may have differing opinions from each other and the community, they at least acknowledge that on the show as well as in the forums. Does anyone remember the original 1 Up Yours with Luke "Halo" Smith and Shane "Sony" Bettenhausen, Garnette Lee and John Davidson? Shane would make the most ridiculous Pro-Sony statements ever uttered by man, some serious and some had to be a bit tongue-in-cheek. As great as that podcast was, there was never any real sense of them listening to the community or even giving a damn what we thought. Hell, anytime they referenced a forum topic, they would ignore their own and always talk about something on NeoGAF instead. Bravo to Cheapy, Ship, and Wombat for at least acknowledging their community
 
Just listened to the latest CAG Cast today and it's really frustrating to hear Shipwreck go on and on about how exclusives don't sell systems, or at least the ones Sony makes won't sell systems, etc. I think he's completely off base.

Point #1:

Sony's major problem this generation was (and is) the price. Quality of titles, exclusives, features, etc., don't matter to the American public--it's all about price. Look at the Wii--if I recall correctly, it was a full $100 less than the entry-level 360, it has none of the features that the other two boast (i.e., HDD, Easy to find and add friends to your friend list, no HD graphics, no cross game chat (a.k.a., the holy grail), etc.)--yet it's sold so much more in lifetime sales than the 360 ever will, and it came out a year later. To further make my point, the PS2 still sells because it's $99 and people are still buying them. We have a growing lower class and a shrinking middle class; and also a lot of these misinformed customers will buy whatever is cheapest. I know this is anecdotal evidence, but I have 2 friends that got the Arcade and were really mad to find out that the cost to upgrade the HDD is a significant amount of money.

Point #2:

Aside from the 3rd Party exclusives (the JRPGs, Yakuza 3, etc.) and the PSN titles, many of these 20 exclusives ARE system sellers--it's just Sony royally sucks at marketing (except to their current customers and fans). Uncharted 3, Killzone 3, Ico & Shadow of the Colossus Collection, The Last Guardian, Twisted Metal, and Resistance 3 will probably be some of the highest quality, deepest, most innovative games to come out in 2011. I really can't believe that someone who enjoys video games would fault Sony for making, and continuing to make, these games. Sony's problem is that while they have great development, great game writers, great graphics, great quality, great value; they have a super shitty marketing. They need to flood the TV, Movies, and any other places that get a large amount of ad traffic, and show people (new potential customers) what they are missing on the PS3, and show them that not only does Sony have COD too, and that it's near identical experience to the 360, but they also have these can't-miss exclusives. I know that Shipwreck did touch on Kevin Butler not selling systems, and on that point, I agree with him. But the rest of the conversation was painfully off base.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that they also don't do a good job of showing people why it's worth the extra $100 to go for the PS3 instead of a 360 Arcade (or whatever they call their entry-level now). These games could be that reason, along with the other great features the PS3 has, but Sony is completely unable to get this message out to people.

All 3 of you admit that your console of choice is the 360--there's nothing wrong with that--however, I think you should consider replacing Shipwreck with someone who prefers the PS3, so we can get a good mix of conversation that's not so lopsided.
 
[quote name='jh6269']All 3 of you admit that your console of choice is the 360--there's nothing wrong with that--however, I think you should consider replacing Shipwreck with someone who prefers the PS3, so we can get a good mix of conversation that's not so lopsided.[/QUOTE]

We'll consider it.
 
[quote name='ranballer']:drool:Another thing!? As a comic book fan!What is with DC online? Hey Sony & Micro-buttheads,if you want to make a WOW superhero type game then make a Marvel Universe Onlinewould be way better and you could get more storylines from the orginal comics that Stan Lee has already written from years ago for example:

Moon Knight (Marc Spencer) is one my favorite characters from Marvel,that a person could play the game as the comic he would read!!.Sound stupid right!? I know but you wouldn´t have such lame ass go and do type missions that one has by so WOW games now!! And would keep an online gamer going for a while by acting out the actual storyline from the comic serie!!!
What do you think Wombat? I´m like you I love the Marvel superheroes & would think
someone could make a decent Video Game !!!!!:bomb:

THank God that Mass Effect 2 is coming to the PS3[/QUOTE]
http://www.joystiq.com/2008/02/11/marvel-mmo-officially-dead/

Microsoft canceled their Marvel MMO a few years ago.
 
fuck anyone that gets so upset over a opinion. If you guy's don't like the show then don't listen. I think It's pretty obvious the 360 has been their console of choice since the first podcast - and I've listened to every single CAGCast released.
 
I own both consoles. I bought a PS3 around the holidays. As I'm accustomed to the Xbox Live experience, coming over to PSN has been...a bit staggering at times.

I couldn't agree with the hosts more regarding this week's discussion about Sony. I love the PS3, and I want PSN to be better. The "transaction experience" on PSN of purchasing games and getting to play them is such a negative experience to me that it honestly deters me from buying additional games.

If Sony were to just bundle updates in with the initial download, that'd be an improvement. It wouldn't be a night and day change, but it'd be an improvement.
 
Still catching up on podcasts after not listening to any for 2 weeks (holiday break), so I just listened to this episode.

You guys were talking about store-exclusive bonuses. Here's a key example of why exclusivity deals SUCK: the Tron Legacy soundtrack

http://www.amazon.com/review/R3CYLN...ASIN=B004FDPOHC&nodeID=163856011&tag&linkCode

I'll paraphrase:

Unfortunately, if you want the complete soundtrack (legally) you have to import the more expensive 2-CD album and the only way to get the other four missing tracks is to purchase them from iTunes AND THEN get the 8th track from Amazon MP3 AND THEN the 9th track from Nokia...

That's right. NO ONE sells the complete version of this soundtrack. You have to buy it four times, piecemeal.
 
Good show guys. I'll be expecting an Xbox360 show next week then.

I really don't like the Xbox dashboard over the PS3 XMB. Both need improvements on UI.

I'm also as pissed off as Wombat about the Dragon Age 2 preorder exclusive. Bioware should have extended it for at least 2 more weeks. Maybe I will wait for the game of the year edition or a price drop before I buy it.
 
[quote name='Monsta Mack']fuck anyone that gets so upset over a opinion. If you guy's don't like the show then don't listen. I think It's pretty obvious the 360 has been their console of choice since the first podcast - and I've listened to every single CAGCast released.[/QUOTE]

I have no problem with them preferring 360 over the others, but it gets annoying when ship has to act as if he still loves the PS3 and is just trying to offer friendly advice for them to succeed and then talks about it so matter of factly. I listen to a lot of other podcasts and a lot of their opinions differ highly from mine but they never do it in such a douchey way that bothers me.

And it sucks that I have to be taking the PS3's side since I actually prefer the 360... Im just antishipwreck. Take for example when he went on his obnoxious LBP sucks rant - ive heard a lot of people that dislike it, but none of them come off as obnoxious as ship did. Ok we get you dont like it - dont need to rant about it for ten minutes while talking down to those that enjoy it...

I vote replace Ship w/ that guy from grasshopper(?) studios 
(written on an iPhone)
 
Here's an update coming to Xbox today:

Xbox LIVE Dashboard update:
On Wednesday, January 19th we will issue a mandatory dashboard update that (re) enables the ‘Boot to Disc’ option in the Xbox 360 dashboard. After you accept the update, you’ll be able to set the option to boot to the Xbox 360 dashboard OR directly to the game you have in the tray when you power up your console. This option can be found in the System Settings.

So in fairness to Cheapy/Ship/Wombat...here is an example of Xbox doing a small update that gives users another option and speeds things up if you just want to play a game. I think it may have been an option before but was then removed and now it's coming back, but anyway this is the kind of update I don't think I've seen from PS3 but it could really use it.


Maybe that's already an option on the PS3 I don't know but my point remains they never seem to have functionality type updates like that. The web browser for example is still fucking garbage after how long now? Fix that shit Sony. I should be able to browse the web just as easily as on my computer by now.
 
Been listening to the CAGcast ever since I joined CAG and I love the show and this is the only time I feel compelled to comment on it.

The "fanboyism" that everyone comments on is there, we aren't just saying that.


You guys bring up a few valid points(mainly shipwreck) as in Sony needing to give longer periods of time in their sequels, focusing on only 4 games like Microsoft does to increase sales and console awareness, and LBP 2 not needed a sequel, etc. You guys also do bring up points that are disheartening to listen to as a gamer.

I apologize in advance for the HUGE wall of text and many, many grammar/spelling mistakes.



Saying to not focus on KZ3, Socom, and Resistance because of CoD is a kick to the balls.
--- I am taking a guess that neither of you have played Socom the way the fan base plays that game. The people who play that game will always play it simply because it is a extremely tactical game and not a run-n-gun shooter(which isn't good for general sales I know). However them choosing to make Socom 4 is only because Socom Confrontation died because of it's horrible release and it's lack of content(only 1 map pack).
--- Resistance could be huge again like the first one was; all it needs it marketing. If you guys have checked out the trailers for the 3rd one which I hope you have then you will see that it is taking on a new look that is quite different than the rest of the FPS market. It also has a story that has/had quite potential to be something the fans really cling on to.
--- I hope that you guys weren't serious with Killzone 3 because that game looks better than anything I have ever seen. Yes God of War 3, Gears 3, Uncharted 3, etc. They have also tightened the controls to suite the mass appeal of the game and are working on the story this time around. I highly encourage you guys to watch the new "Justice" trailer on their website and if Sony threw some cash into advertising that on tv I am sure they would see some return.

As for you guys talking about the ICO/Shadow of the Colossus collection not being anything to be a huge seller. Well look at the God of War collection; that wasn't meant to be a system seller or probably even sell incredibly well, it is simply their to give the new fans the backstory of the new high budget sequel at a cheap price. I personally love the idea of them making HD copies of their past big franchises so I can get the backstory rather than watching some 2 minute video in the beginning of the game like some cheap Soap Opera. The Sly Collection, GoW collection, and ICO collection to me are little gems that gamers should really appreciate. ***I see this as equal to what you guys were saying in a past show about having a downloadable title to see if a new franchise can take off or not.

Talking about "the game" to be a system seller I think the only time for that is within the first year, maybe 2 of a system's life. Gears 3 won't make millions of people go out and buy a 360, Super Mario Galaxy 2 didn't make people buy a Wii, MGS 4 and Halo 3 would be considered to be system sellers because they were so hyped and were all rumored to be released at the system's launch.

As for Sony basically jocking Fable is the equivalent of making all these "rip off" titles that try to steal God of War, Gears of War, etc. etc.

Cheapy please NEVER try to describe Socom ever again......Gears meets Call of Duty? -__- Cmon now Cheapy we can do better than that. I would say Socom 4 tries to take the control/look of Lost Planet which is a horrible idea.

As for Microsoft being smart in killing off franchises that is not a good thing for us at times. Say goodbye to ever seeing a game resembling Alan Wake ever again on the 360. As a company they may not have 4 titles make 8 million units but they may have 7-10 titles ship that many or close to.

As for the Hacker thing we need to get some better background info. This guy was some dickwad who basically was trying to hack the PS3 from the ghetto and he was having some progress with the other OS install feature. Hence the reason Sony removing it which they had the right to do, then the same guy was all like "WTF SONY YOU GOING DOWN NOW" and so he finally is making good headway for people hacking their PS3's.
---Now that is out of the way. Very proud for Sony taking him to court, they need to cut the head off this snake before we have another Dreamcast on our hands. Any guy that is being a douche for bragging on the internet about how cool he is deserves to potentially have his life ruined.
--- There aren't really any more people going for Sony because of this one asshole, it is really just him and his posse.
--- They don't need the revenue lost to be huge for them to have a lawsuit, he is openly releasing all of this information and explaining how to do it. It is hard to tell a jury "All you do is open your PS3, sauder two or three spots, and then you are done."
--- Having a lawsuit will put this hack the PS3 craze off for some good time in my opinion.



Having ALL of that said, I think Sony has one thing against them: Marketing

You see/saw commercials for Microsoft and Nintendo games but never anything Sony unless it is those new commercials with Kevin Butler which the fans love but they don't attract as much attention as needed. Sony needs to just make badass trailers like the KZ3 Justice one and put them on tv. Trailers like that make you want to play the game.





Hope you guys don't tear this post apart to much on next weeks show. Thanks for reading all of it if you actually did.
 
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[quote name='jh6269']
All 3 of you admit that your console of choice is the 360--there's nothing wrong with that--however, I think you should consider replacing Shipwreck with someone who prefers the PS3, so we can get a good mix of conversation that's not so lopsided.[/QUOTE]

Please say you were kidding.
 
[quote name='TG_Antifire']Anything on the psp doesn't sell and it does matter who makes it because Zipper would't release a broken game and take a year to fix it and then want to charge for DLC.[/QUOTE]

They released Socom 3 which could not nearly compare to Socom 2.


....and they made Socom 1 and 2.
 
First time post, I have to say, great podcast guys!

On to this weeks discussion, I think if anything the ps3 list shipwreck made IS the system seller. The ps3 has some good to great games coming out no matter what genre is your favorite... and i believe that the action rpg for the ps3 will be final fantasy xiii versus (when it releases) whether it's added to this years excellent roster of exclusives or next year. The best thing about the ps3 vs. 360 argument is that you do not have to pay a cent to play any of these upcoming exclusive games online... you can essentially afford another game purchase by not having to pay an annual fee. speaking of, why exactly did the live fee go up in price? will it keep going up in price? is Microsoft still trying to recoup losses from their HD-DVD failure??? :) jk... but I do find it strange that everyone forgot about the big blu-ray Vs. hd-DVD battle that the 360 lost.

the last few things I'd like to mention is that 3d tv's might not be in everyones house, but the houses that did buy those expensive shinny new 3d tv's want cool, fun stuff to use it for.... which sells ps3s! it's the only system that does 3d games + the movies. Also, many of these 3d games support the move, which has it's appeal to casual gamers, look at the wii, casual gamers drive that console, that very very successful console. even though Sony pretty much copied nintendos motion concept and improved upon it, it's not a bad move by anymeans (no pun intended, hehe). I'm sure this year we will see many games from developers who include motion support on the ps3 but not on the kinect because of the input lag and lack of a real controller to do precise movements while in game.

I understand your qualms cag casters, but your opinions were cup half empty instead of cup half full. now go turn on your 360 to watch that sweet new hd-DVD that just came out! lol :)
 
I am a happy PS3-only owner.

I don't care if PS3 ever catches the 360 in sales.

My only investment in Sony's sales is that the PS3 remains competitive, which it's been doing. Every publisher has their blockbuster titles coming out for both systems and there's no danger in that changing.

The discussion about how Sony can get ahead in sales, from a business perspective, is an interesting one to have. But as a consumer, I really don't care if they ever take the lead as long as they remain competitive and keep the games that I want to play coming to the system.

Anyone really upset that Cheapy, Wombat and Shipwreck play most of their games on the 360 is missing the point. Do you like the PS3? Good. Keep playing it. No one's telling you not to. The fact is the difference between the systems is marginal and your decision on which to play will come down to preference. Anyone trying to debate that anyone's preference is wrong is, again, missing the point.

We could waste our time having fanboy arguments or you can shut your browser down and simply be happy with your purchase without getting frustrated trying to justify that purchase to people: a) who don't really care and b) whose opinion you're not likely to change anyway.
 
[quote name='ShockandAww']The web browser for example is still fucking garbage after how long now? Fix that shit Sony. I should be able to browse the web just as easily as on my computer by now.[/QUOTE]

At least there is a web browser on the PS3, and on the Wii.

Just like free Netflix for Netflix subscribers, the 360 is the only console that doesn't have it.
 
[quote name='Anti Lifesaver']Please say you were kidding.[/QUOTE]

Eh, kind of half-half. I'm sure Shipwreck is a nice guy and all, but he's just so opinionated and abrasive on the podcast. I think it's just that I personally don't care for people who can't admit they were wrong or are so closed minded that they can't appreciate a different point of view. I really don't think he adds anything to the CAG Cast; I used to look forward to the CAG Cast every week, but now not so much since Shipwreck joined. Having someone say that the 360 is better for them, or that they prefer it over the PS3, is fine; but this last PS3 "analysis" by him was just so over the top ridiculous, I just had to comment.

He's using NPD and VG Chartz numbers, which are North America (maybe even USA) only. 360 outsold the PS3 like 2 to 1 in the US. However, worldwide, the PS3 is just a few million short of matching 360 total sales; so naturally the numbers are going to skew to the 360 according to NPD. And even if the games aren't selling proportionately, after adjusting for the disproportionate install base, to the 360 titles doesn't mean they're bad games, it just means Sony's failing to make a connection with 360 gamers and new customers (I mentioned the main 2 points why I think this in my last post).

I think the biggest thing that I took offense to is that he pretty much was saying that even though Sony's Flagship titles are "good" (I think they're great btw), that they should give up because the games aren't worth making if they don't outsell Call of Duty. If Sony did everything exactly like the 360, there'd be no reason for another console. Sony's trying to differentiate themselves from the competition, and from what I can tell, the reason for the big number of exclusives is to get people back on the console, and maybe they will realize that XBOX Live, as good as it is, isn't really worth what they thought it was worth. They have an obvious weakness when it comes to the social side of gaming, so they're trying to emphasize their strengths. The problem though is they don't have the marketing to back it up.

The 360 had a price drop and a redesign. They made Kinect a re-branding. Sony could have waited on the Slim and used the Move + Slim + Pricedrop as a re-branding too, and they may have done better in North America. But it's pretty amazing to me that the PS3 was able to dig themselves out of that hole they were in and put themselves practically neck and neck with Microsoft worldwide.

They have a problem connecting to gamers and the bloggers in the US, and that's their main problem.
 
[quote name='ubermark'] The "transaction experience" on PSN of purchasing games and getting to play them is such a negative experience to me that it honestly deters me from buying additional games.
.[/QUOTE]


WTF? Totally disagree. How hard is it pick a game, confirm purchase, download and install? It's not.

And you can do it in real dollars.

Beats having to buy ridiculous MS space bucks and have odd point remainders.
 
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[quote name='Curufinwe']At least there is a web browser on the PS3, and on the Wii.

Just like free Netflix for Netflix subscribers, the 360 is the only console that doesn't have it.[/QUOTE]
I know and I prefer my PS3 over Wii or Xbox but it should be so much better than it is.
 
Few observations from the show:

1. I find it odd that so many people leave negative comments after each show. There are so many video game podcasts to listen to, so why keep listening to one you don't care for? I listen to be entertained. If someone likes a game or system I don't, it's ok. I value the chemistry and banter between the three of you and that's what keeps me coming back. I have no idea how many subscribers there are to the show, but I would be interested in seeing how the number has gone up or down over time.

2. I'm in my 30's and I drink more than two beers in a sitting. Maybe you should switch to wine coolers or something.
 
[quote name='jh6269']All 3 of you admit that your console of choice is the 360--there's nothing wrong with that--however, I think you should consider replacing Shipwreck with someone who prefers the PS3, so we can get a good mix of conversation that's not so lopsided.[/QUOTE]

That would make the show terrible. Who wants to remove Ship with someone that would prattle on about a terrible console?
 
[quote name='ZForce915']That would make the show terrible. Who wants to remove Ship with someone that would prattle on about a terrible console?[/QUOTE]

I vote that it's not you :hot: :lol:

I like Ship and wouldn't want him replaced, but I wouldn't mind either someone who's open minded about the other platforms joining, or for the current guys to really try to be non-fanboys.
 
Hey guys, great show, a couple of comments about the PS3 issues from my point of view. The PS3 will never catch the XBox360 in the US. It is too far into this console life cycle for them to make up the differences here. The 2 largest areas i think they failed in:

1. The redesign. I believe many of the new 360 sales are people replacing their old boxes with a new one. Microsoft went with the Nintendo & Apple approach and made their redesigned system a better console in every way. More USB ports, bigger HDD, quieter DVD drive, and cooler running CPU/GPU. Sony on the other hand made their redesigned system worse. Granted it is quieter and runs cooler, but they removed features most notably all backwards compatibility and the "Install Other OS." While I would probably never install another OS in my PS3 they still took something from me. Microsoft gave their customers a reason to buy another system while Sony did not.

2. It took Sony too long to release new games for their largest franchises. Three and a half years for a new God of War and 4 years for GT5! We are still waiting for Team Ico's game, a new SOCOM, Twisted Metal. At some point Sony has to go to its developers and make them release the game. If GT5 released two years age with half the tracks and cars it would still sell the same, instead Sony gave hard core racing fans a reason to jump to the 360 and Forza.

I also think Shipwreck is correct about Sony diluting its franchises by having too many of the same. For shooters MS has Halo & Gears of War and they don't release them during the same year. This allows those online communities to get large, gamers don't have multiple games to choose from. Sony is releasing 3 shooters this year (Killzone, Resistence & SOCOM), this is going make each games' community smaller and eat into sales of the other games. I know there are other shooters out there like COD but MS & Sony can't control when those release.
 
Geez. I don't get why people get heated about PS3 vs Xbox. 90% of the great games are cross-platform anyways.

It's nothing like the good old days of SNES vs Genesis wars, where 90% of the great games were exclusive on one side or the other and even the shared games had major changes (like blood in Mortal Kombat).
 
[quote name='Jadam']1. I find it odd that so many people leave negative comments after each show. There are so many video game podcasts to listen to, so why keep listening to one you don't care for? I listen to be entertained. If someone likes a game or system I don't, it's ok. I value the chemistry and banter between the three of you and that's what keeps me coming back. I have no idea how many subscribers there are to the show, but I would be interested in seeing how the number has gone up or down over time.[/QUOTE]
We leave these negative comments because we want them to be successful. We're trying to help. We really want the CAGcast to succeed. If you just look at this spreadsheet I have here, it says that the CAGcast's PS3 viewers are down by 5% with this latest show's podcast. They really need to stop talking about the PS3.

(I'm adding this because I doubt everyone will be able to pick up on the parody.)
 
I wonder if the decline in sales for PS3 systems is related to the drop in price of a stand alone Blu-ray player. That might be interesting to put in your spreadsheet, Shipwreck. They advertise how it does everything, but I know many people that use is only for movie watching.
 
[quote name='Loonknight']The Cagcast has been "dumping" on the PS3 and Sony since I've started to listen to this podcast, it is usually a short snicker or comment here or there such as "Nobody has a Go, that doesn't count." I'm glad at least you guys are trying to "help Sony"

Now I would be disappointed with the PS3's online service or the Wii's online service if I had to pay-to-play online like I have to do with my Xbox360. Microsoft essentially fooled everyone last gen when they started Xbox Live and its pay-to-play service adding this new premium in order to play with your friends online and back then paying for something like that made sense. The crack that is playing with friends online was what Microsoft was banking on and has helped continue to improve the Xbox Live infrastructure to what it is today. They essentially have pulled the wool over the collective gaming minds of the community and I applaud them for their mastery of the Jedi Mind trick they employed and applaud Microsoft for continuing to keep fooling us all into thinking you still need to pay-to-play online. So bravo.

Now, I am not dumping on the Xbox360. It has excellent games on it, and great indie titles as Wombat has pointed out recently, but I'll be damned if I'm going to support a pay-to-play model I don't believe in anymore. I can stream Netflix on my Wii, my iPod, my Mac, my PC, my PS3 for free, but not on my Xbox...why is that??? We need to rise up against this before other companies start charging us to pay-to-play online because they want more revenue.[/QUOTE]


I'm jumping in from the front page since I'm at work, but I have to rail against this "Xbox charges you to play online" banter from the PS3 fans. SONY CHARGES YOU TO DOWNLOAD CONTENT YOU PAID FOR WHILE THE PS3 IS OFF. In my opinion, that's more disgusting than paying to play online. At least I'm having fun playing online, having to leave my PS3 on so I can download a bunch of games, then installing them one by one afterwards, is ridiculous.

I just bought my first PS3 on monday, but I owned a PS2 originally, and had every intention of getting the PS3 over the Xbox 360 had it not been for their insane $600.00 price point. I've got no stock in either company, so the success of their console means nothing. My opinion is Microsoft designed the better console experience, it has a better interface, better controllers (I had to buy third party buttons to make DS3 triggers comfy), and I won't discuss online cause I haven't played PS3 online. PS3, on the other hand, has the exclusvies. I bought the damn thing just to play Sony published games like GoW3, Uncharted, Ratchet, etc. I also like the "themes" that the PS3 offers, but for my gaming buck, I do prefer playing on the 360, and that's mostly because of the interface and controller.
 
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