Cell phone usage while driving; some polls vs. research data

RBM

RBM

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When American motorists were asked in a recent poll by Mason-Dixon Polling & Research, about a third of those polled cited cell phone usage by other drivers as a significant factor in higher expectations for car accidents & feeling less safe on the road in general (at the same time, about 40% admitted that they themselves had also used a cell phone while driving in the recent past.)

I think by now we all realize that if you ask the average driver, he will readily admit to a correlation between talking on the phone while driving & a greater chance of collisions. However, at the same time, the average driver will also be reluctant to support legislation outlawing such cell phone usage, if he has a cell phone. If he doesn't, said driver tends to be (in my experience) fervently supportive of such legislation.

A lot of people own cell phones. Cell phone usage hasn't resulted in sufficiently catastrophic loss of life & money, and so legislation against phoning while driving has been sketchily implimented & enforced. Most folks will embrace a general sort of philosophy that "it depends on the person." Some folks can handle it and some folks can't.

Enter a recent research study into cell phone usage immediately prior to car accidents in Australia. A small study comprising a measly 456 drivers/cases, which I find interesting simply because they didn't *ask* the drivers. They looked at their phone bill records vs. the time of their accidents (the 456 were selected on the basis of their requiring hospitalization following a car accident.) The result: regardless of whether the driver was using a hands-free cell phone or holding it by hand, a correlation between speaking on the phone and a four-fold increase in the chances of collision.

Is this meaningful? They didn't take into account the multitudes who chatted away and didn't get into a wreck, since they selected their sample population from those who'd already gotten into serious wrecks. If you don't extrapolate a suitably, broadly-encompassing finding regarding such cell phone usage, it doesn't stand a chance of effecting legislation. If such a broad pattern exists (as many insist it does,) then why is it so hard to perform a suitable study/poll to show it?
 
I don't know if I agree with that last paragraph. Although I think correlation analyses are too simplistic to suggest much with, what they seem to be implying is that 4 out of every 5 accidents involved someone on their cell phone. If we believe that only 40% of people use their cell phone while driving, you have 40% of the people accounting for 80% of accidents, and the other 60% of people accounting for 20%. (Although that doesn't strictly indicate a "four-fold increase").

Also, correlations are meaningful is temporal order can be established. Rarely can it be, but in this case, people are on their phones before their accident, so causal order can be tentatively imposed.

I'd like to see a better study method, but what do you suggest? Wrecks with police reports? That's not a representative study, since I imagine those people mostly have cell phones. Perhaps a random sample of reported accidents? I dunno. Neat report though.
 
I talk on my phone all the time. Hell, I almost got a ticket for talking on the phone as I was leaving the courthouse for fighting a speeding ticket. I talk on the phone while doing 70 on a highway turn.

I'm not a woman. I know how to drive and I can control my car.
 
Thank you rich for being ever so... ... you...

Anyways, there are times that the only time I can talk in in the car. I don't sit on the damn phone gabbing because I hate phones, so I keep them short. When you work on the road, sometimes its the only place you have to make calls.
 
[quote name='Rich']I talk on my phone all the time. Hell, I almost got a ticket for talking on the phone as I was leaving the courthouse for fighting a speeding ticket. I talk on the phone while doing 70 on a highway turn.

I'm not a woman. I know how to drive and I can control my car.[/QUOTE]

I wish I was a woman so I could be offended.

Though I think some people do better on cell phones than others. I had dropped my phone multiple times to pay attention to the road, and I've often had people repeat things cause I was half listening. Now when my father gets on a phone, he's lucky if he can keep the car straight.
 
I did watch Spiderman 2 on my PSP the first morning I had it. That was a fun drive to work.

(Rush hour traffic, its not like I was doing 80 weaving lanes.)
 
I was surprised that the study results showed a significant impact (no pun intended) on driver attention from holding cell phone conversations...and that this effect even lasted for a few minutes after conversations had ended. In other words, it's the conversation itself which distracts people: not the need to hold a phone to their ears. Small wonder that cell phone companies gladly embraced hands-free solutions, since that didn't hurt business (actually, it opened new product lines) but allowed for an illusion of addressing the problem.

Certainly, people were chatting with others in the car long before cell phones came along, but I'd easily believe that the sheer volume and frequency of conversations behind the wheel have skyrocketed with booming cell phone usage...and while the chances of conversations behind the wheel mitigating collisions might not have changed, the sheer increase in the number of those conversations has probably given rise to more wrecks/fender benders/near misses/bad merges, etc.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']I wish I was a woman so I could be offended.
[/QUOTE]

Oh please. You know it's true--women suck at driving.
 
[quote name='Rich']Oh please. You know it's true--women suck at driving.[/QUOTE]

I know that whenever I'm in the car with a guy they complain about women drivers. And whenever I'm in the car with a woman they complain about male drivers. My opinion is there is a reason why both complain about the opposite sex, they both suck at driving and just pick up on the people who are different.

Though, statistically, it is men who get into more accidents and insurance does usually cost more for young male drivers than young female drivers. And more men die in accidents than women. Statistically, women are the better drivers.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']I know that whenever I'm in the car with a guy they complain about women drivers. And whenever I'm in the car with a woman they complain about male drivers. My opinion is there is a reason why both complain about the opposite sex, they both suck at driving and just pick up on the people who are different.

Though, statistically, it is men who get into more accidents and insurance does usually cost more for young male drivers than young female drivers. And more men die in accidents than women. Statistically, women are the better drivers.[/QUOTE]

All drivers suck but me. You know it's true.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']I know that whenever I'm in the car with a guy they complain about women drivers. And whenever I'm in the car with a woman they complain about male drivers. My opinion is there is a reason why both complain about the opposite sex, they both suck at driving and just pick up on the people who are different.

Though, statistically, it is men who get into more accidents and insurance does usually cost more for young male drivers than young female drivers. And more men die in accidents than women. Statistically, women are the better drivers.[/QUOTE]

You, apparently, have never seen a woman drive. Every woman I know routinely hits things.
 
[quote name='Rich']You, apparently, have never seen a woman drive. Every woman I know routinely hits things.[/QUOTE]

This starts to explain things. Keep talking about stuff you know.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']I know that whenever I'm in the car with a guy they complain about women drivers. And whenever I'm in the car with a woman they complain about male drivers. My opinion is there is a reason why both complain about the opposite sex, they both suck at driving and just pick up on the people who are different.

Though, statistically, it is men who get into more accidents and insurance does usually cost more for young male drivers than young female drivers. And more men die in accidents than women. Statistically, women are the better drivers.[/QUOTE]

This reminds me of a conversation we had this weekend, as we drove to Detroit for a wedding. I was throwing a fit, generalizing about the poor driving habits of Michigan residents, when my wife and friends asked me, "are there any states known for having good drivers?"

The question, of course, is rhetorical and simply meant to piss me off. We did decide, however, that while no state is known for "good" drivers, each state's shittiness is nuanced. Michigan people are scared to death of turn signals, and they don't mind pulling out right the fuck in front of you. OTOH, Ohio drivers are scared to death to drive in any climate: sun, rain, snow, cloudy, fucking anything.

While I don't have any interest in responding to Rich's claims, I'll simply point out that if women are worse drivers than men, men of all ages and in all states have one hell of a class-action lawsuit on their hands against insurance companies. This would undoubtedly be because of discrimination (although superior drivers, men pay higher premiums). So, with that in mind, we'll all get quite a rebate, or (and far more likely) Rich is just wrong.

Not that I'd discredit the judging standards of a man who takes a turn at 70MPH while talking on the cell phone, after being in court for fighting a ticket. Somehow that visage doesn't jive with the "males are better drivers" argument. :roll:
 
[quote name='mykevermin']
Not that I'd discredit the judging standards of a man who takes a turn at 70MPH while talking on the cell phone, after being in court for fighting a ticket. Somehow that visage doesn't jive with the "males are better drivers" argument. :roll:[/QUOTE]

Turns on a highway aren't 90 degrees. It's not hard to do it at 70mph. Hell, 70mph is slow by NY standards.

And I've never hit anything, because I know how to drive. Being aggresive != bad driver.

Woman = bad driver.
 
Umm........ NY is swarming with cops and the people drive slower than in VT, NH and MA, at least on the new york thruway and nearby cities.

Though here's a bunch of statistics from the late 90's (it's a bit difficult finding a site with everything neatly laid out) http://www.gendercenter.org/drivingstats.htm
:

In 1998, 85 percent of women were licensed to drive, compared with 93 percent of men

Females represented 31 percent of drivers who were found to be drunk driving in a survey during 1996

1.5 percent of female drivers surveyed in 1996 had a 0.10 or higher blood alcohol concentration, compared to 3.7 percent of men.

The fatal collision rate by male drivers was 43 accidents per 100,000 licensed drivers in 1998. (2)

The fatal collision rate for female drivers in 1998 was 16 accidents per 100,000 licensed drivers.

Female drivers were responsible for 27 percent of all fatal crashes in 1998,

About one-third of all motor vehicle deaths in 2000 were females. They accounted for 30 percent of driver deaths, 47 percent of passenger deaths, 32 percent of pedestrian deaths, 11 percent of bicyclist deaths, and 9 percent of motorcyclist deaths.

The percent of male drivers and female drivers involved in fatal crashes who had a blood alcohol concentration of 0.10 or higher was 20 percent and 10 percent, respectively.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']Umm........ NY is swarming with cops and the people drive slower than in VT, NH and MA, at least on the new york thruway and nearby cities.

Though here's a bunch of statistics from the late 90's (it's a bit difficult finding a site with everything neatly laid out) http://www.gendercenter.org/drivingstats.htm
:

In 1998, 85 percent of women were licensed to drive, compared with 93 percent of men

Females represented 31 percent of drivers who were found to be drunk driving in a survey during 1996

1.5 percent of female drivers surveyed in 1996 had a 0.10 or higher blood alcohol concentration, compared to 3.7 percent of men.

The fatal collision rate by male drivers was 43 accidents per 100,000 licensed drivers in 1998. (2)

The fatal collision rate for female drivers in 1998 was 16 accidents per 100,000 licensed drivers.

Female drivers were responsible for 27 percent of all fatal crashes in 1998,

About one-third of all motor vehicle deaths in 2000 were females. They accounted for 30 percent of driver deaths, 47 percent of passenger deaths, 32 percent of pedestrian deaths, 11 percent of bicyclist deaths, and 9 percent of motorcyclist deaths.

The percent of male drivers and female drivers involved in fatal crashes who had a blood alcohol concentration of 0.10 or higher was 20 percent and 10 percent, respectively.[/QUOTE]

Now get %s of ALL accidents. No good driver gets in minor accidents often.
And don't preach to me about driving speeds in NY--I'm well aware of how we drive; I do it every day. Our speed limit is generally lower, and we usually have much more traffic on the roads, but all things considered, we're fucking fast and aggresive. (not necessarily bad)
 
[quote name='Rich']Now get %s of ALL accidents. No good driver gets in minor accidents often.
And don't preach to me about driving speeds in NY--I'm well aware of how we drive; I do it every day. Our speed limit is generally lower, and we usually have much more traffic on the roads, but all things considered, we're fucking fast and aggresive. (not necessarily bad)[/QUOTE]

The new york thruway is nothing compared to boston. That's what I know in NY, and traffic volume on any part of it (once you get on from the masspike) is a joke compared eastern MA. I couldn't believe that the NYT in buffalo hit 35-40 at rush hour. I've never been to NYC and have no idea what it's like there.

Though females were responsible for 27% of fatal accidents. I can't find any major statistic that would suggest females are worse drivers. I can find repeatedly that young men have more accidents than young women, like this one from state farm insurance:
Your age, sex, and marital status.
Click to expand...
Accident rates are higher for all drivers under age 25, especially young males and single males. Insurance prices in most states reflect these differences.
Click to expand...

http://www.statefarm.com/insuranc/auto/affects.htm

It would be hard to believe a gender that is responsible for 27% of fatal accidents would somehow be involved in more minor accidents. I've shown many statistics that support my position. You haven't shown any.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']The new york thruway is nothing compared to boston. That's what I know in NY, and traffic volume on any part of it (once you get on from the masspike) is a joke compared eastern MA. I couldn't believe that the NYT in buffalo hit 35-40 at rush hour. I've never been to NYC and have no idea what it's like there.

Though females were responsible for 27% of fatal accidents. I can't find any major statistic that would suggest females are worse drivers. I can find repeatedly that young men have more accidents than young women, like this one from state farm insurance:


http://www.statefarm.com/insuranc/auto/affects.htm

It would be hard to believe a gender that is responsible for 27% of fatal accidents would somehow be involved in more minor accidents. I've shown many statistics that support my position. You haven't shown any.[/QUOTE]

I was in Boston the whole summer last summer. Granted I didn't drive while there, the traffic seemed much easier than NY. As for statistics to support my position? I doubt there are any statistics on minor accidents available--all I have is what I know from what I've experienced to base it on...and that would be that women suck at driving.

I remember in my senior year of HS, within a week, one girl backed up out of the parking lot into another car that was backing up behind her (both girls, mind you) the same week another girl was turning left over a main blvd that had a pair of double solid lines and yellow lines blocking left turns. God they suck at driving.
 
[quote name='Rich']I was in Boston the whole summer last summer. Granted I didn't drive while there, the traffic seemed much easier than NY. As for statistics to support my position? I doubt there are any statistics on minor accidents available--all I have is what I know from what I've experienced to base it on...and that would be that women suck at driving.

I remember in my senior year of HS, within a week, one girl backed up out of the parking lot into another car that was backing up behind her (both girls, mind you) the same week another girl was turning left over a main blvd that had a pair of double solid lines and yellow lines blocking left turns. God they suck at driving.[/QUOTE]

My father was driving a rented car in new orleans and accidentally turned onto the wrong side of the street. Cars beeped at him, so he quickly turned off the street onto the next street. Cars started beeping at him again and he realised he had turned onto the wrong side of a street again (I was about 15 at the time and couldn't stop laughing).

I was leaving school one time and I hit (and broke off) one of my rear view mirrors against a SUV parked along the side of the parking lot.

I changed lanes into another car at a red light once (no damage to them, I had a sizeable dent).

I caused an accident one time by not seeing the break lights of the car in front of me, I hit my breaks fast and the two guys behind me collided (but didn't hit me).

I accidentally let up on my break and hit a car while sitting at a red light (no damage), I did this twice in two weeks, but both were very minor (the first time the person didn't even notice).

I backed into a car going by when pulling out of a parking space at target (no damage).

I hit a car going into a parking space in NH once (no damage, but some idiot called the cops and said I hit the car and took off. I had a store receipt to prove that I didn't and described the person who I thought did it. Cops said I could be arrested, but seemed to believe me and put it down as an accident and not a hit and run. The cops did show up at my house, but I wasn't home yet.

I hit another car (no damage) going into a parking space at a subway (to boston) parking lot, no one ever found out though.

I hit another car going into a parking spot at a grocery store near my house.

My father backed into a parked car while leaving a parking lot a month or so ago.

I turned left, into the exact spot another car was, luckily the car was going by a parking lot and was barely able to turn into it (luckily they saw me, I sure as hell didn't see them).

My father totalled his first 3 cars, one time his car even flipped over.

My car spun out doing about 70 on the NYT and slammed into the railing. Car still ran and I continued driving home, think I slid (it was raining a little).

My mothers 52, drives 45 minutes to work everyday, and has caused one accident in her life. She wasn't paying attention and backed into my car in our driveway (so she's never caused an accident while actually driving). My father is 55, also drives about 45 minutes to work, and was involved in many accidents, more than I've listed. And I think I've been involved in another one or two minor, no damage accidents (I've tapped a lot of cars in parking lots).

I have a warning for going 50 in a 25. I almost got a ticket for running a red light, but the cop got a more important call and gave me my license back and took off. I have a ticket for doing 80 in a 65. I got a ticket for supposedly drifting into the next lane (don't agree with this one). I got another ticket for driving in a carpool lane (ontario puts car pool lanes on the right side of normal, city roads and puts a sign above giving the carpool hours, I had no idea about this and got pulled over). My father has multiple speeding tickets and gets a parking ticket everytime he goes into a city area. My mother got a ticket once, for speeding, but (I was in the car at the time) was going the same speed as everyone else and was unlucky enough to get singled out.

All those times I've hit people, I've been hit twice that I was in the car for(though I have a bunch of dings that I got on campus and earlier in high school, not sure if their car was moving or just got hit by doors). Once I was at a stop light, moved up to get a better view, and the suv behind me thought I was going and slammed into the back of me. The other time I stopped on the highway (it was rush hour so everyone was stopped) and the car behind me tapped me slightly.

That was long, but I made my point as far as my family is concerned.
 
[quote name='Rich']So you and your father suck at driving. That's your point? :p[/QUOTE]

I have tons of minor things, I tend to make small mistakes a lot (ie. parking lots). Either way, my point is your memory says women are worse, mine says men are worse (my family being a perfect example). The one difference is the the statistics that have been shown clearly side with me.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']I have tons of minor things, I tend to make small mistakes a lot (ie. parking lots). Either way, my point is your memory says women are worse, mine says men are worse (my family being a perfect example). The one difference is the the statistics that have been shown clearly side with me.[/QUOTE]

Statistics show major accidents--the shit insurance companies would concern themselves with. Bad drivers get into minor accidents; stupid and drunk drivers in major and fatal accidents.
 
[quote name='Rich']Statistics show major accidents--the shit insurance companies would concern themselves with. Bad drivers get into minor accidents; stupid and drunk drivers in major and fatal accidents.[/QUOTE]

Well you seem to lack any sort of statistics to back up such an opinion. And why bad drivers would somehow avoid major accidents is beyond me. It would seem if you suck at driving you'd get into more accidents across the board.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']Well you seem to lack any sort of statistics to back up such an opinion. And why bad drivers would somehow avoid major accidents is beyond me. It would seem if you suck at driving you'd get into more accidents across the board.[/QUOTE]

Because most women are defensive drivers, which would result in minor as opposed to major accidents.

My statistics? Like I've already stated, my opinoin is based off of what I have witnessed.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']Well you seem to lack any sort of statistics to back up such an opinion. And why bad drivers would somehow avoid major accidents is beyond me. It would seem if you suck at driving you'd get into more accidents across the board.[/QUOTE]

Although for me it's a one sided conversation, I'm laughing my ass off seeing Rich trying to maintain his opinion, despite offering ZERO evidence that women are worse drivers than men.

Hell, not only is he offering no evidence, but he's completely ignoring data from an insurance company! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

You know what, let me throw up an argument here. If we're allowed to make statements without backing them up, allow me to say that Republicans are shittier drivers due to their latent aggression that places them at the center of more accidents.

Goddamn, kid, when will you admit you're wrong?
 
Any insurance company will have lower rates for a woman than a man. Men are hot headed and prone to do stupid shit like race or flare the ego in other ways. When was the last time you heard of a woman dragging another driver out of the car and beating the shit out of them?
 
[quote name='RBM'] (at the same time, about 40% admitted that they themselves had also used a cell phone while driving in the recent past.)
[/QUOTE]

That has to be BS. I think it's way higher than 40%. I HATE people who don't pay attention while driving, regardless of the reason - and cell phones are a huge cause of not paying attention (you cimply can't pay enough attention to both the conversation and your surroundings, no matter what you may think).
 
[quote name='Backlash']That has to be BS. I think it's way higher than 40%.[/QUOTE]
Realize that it's 40% of those polled and not 40% of those owning cell phones. It's possible that only about half of those polled even owned cell phones, and of those who do own them, 80% (that's just a guess, mind you, about half of them owning cell phones...I don't know what the real number is) used them on the road.

Furthermore, (although it's worded a little vaguely in the article) the 30% who cite cell phone users behind the wheel as annoyances on the road may not overlap any (or at all) with the 40% who admit to doing so, themselves. That's my interpretation, anyway. I could be misreading the article, myself.
 
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