Somehow I feel I'm in the right... read on update: BWAHAHA all my money back!!!

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pimp tyranny

pimp tyranny

Banned
update 3:

rather timely, i just got the last $25 back, and couldn't have come at a better time. just recently won Star Trek TNG all 7 seasons, and this $25 filled up what i lacked. and i sent a rather insulting e-mail to mr. theo moore. something along the lines of BWAHAHAHA karma bitch!

update 2:

they sent me $15.15 just now. if the seller still has his banking account attached to his paypal account, can paypal take the funds out of his bank account? that'd be nice.

update:

i got the status e-mail from paypal today:

We have determined that you may be eligible for a refund on this PayPal
transaction. To qualify for a refund, just return the item in its original
condition to the seller. (You are responsible for shipping and handling
costs for the returned merchandise.) The amount you will be eligible to
receive is determined by the terms of our buyer protection policies and we
may be unable to make a full recovery of your payment from the seller.
Please review the buyer protection policies in our User Agreement
(https://www.paypal.com/ua) before shipping the item back to the seller.

so i have to return what the seller sent me. will this guarantee i get my money back? what if he's cleared out his account? will i get the refund from paypal anyway? thanks for any help.

original post:

I won AtL Collection off ebay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSAA:US:31&Item=8224656346

Before I even bid, I sent the seller this message:

Is this the collector's edition with the box, thumb button covers, memory card holder, etc?

He responded:

yes it is

So I happily bid and won the auction for relatively cheap considering what was offered. He is in fact a new seller, so getting the same thing cheaper on account of this is always in my interests.

Anyway, he sent an e-mail saying it was sent out this past Monday, and it arrived today, Priority Mail, no Delivery Confirmation. Keep that in mind.

I'm driving down the driveway and I open the package, and it's of course obvious there's only a double wide CD case inside this Flat Rate Envelope. I'm wishing upon wish that this is the Grandia II i won for DC, but I recognize the return address is not the right one. I open it up, and in it is a AtL Collection, granted, but no inserts, no box, no thumb covers, no memory card holder, and worst of all, no AtL 2 or Monster Tournament. I'm fuming by now, so I get on the internet as soon as I get to the house, and e-mail the seller:

This game is dirty and it smells like smoke. It is not new and complete in the box with all the extras like you told me after I e-mailed you. The discs are covered in smudges and I'm very dissatisfied with its condition. That's not even mentioning that AtL 2 and Monster Tournament aren't in here. I will send it back for a full refund of $40.15.

The game really does smell like smoke, and the case has cracks and sticker residue. He responds:

the games are in perfect condition and, the game doesnt smell like smoke and u asked in the email if it was the collectors edition i bought it from the used game store a while ago and it says are the lad COLLECTION

I e-mailed him back:

No refund then? Well I tried.

Basically, by now I'm fucking pissed at this retard so I just go right ahead and file the complaint with PayPal. He sends me another e-mail:

why the fuck did you tell paypal that some of the parts were missing from teh game i sent you the full complete are the lad games none of the stuff were missing from the case so dont like and there was no gunk or smoke on the games you scammer, and i can prove it too

I respond:

If i were a scammer, I could have reported never receiving the game, since you neglected to use Delivery Confirmation. As it is, the game is grossly incomplete, and truly does smell like smoke. The discs are covered in smudges, and it is no where near good condition. I want a refund, and if you're not going to willingly give me one, then PayPal will take care of it. A refund will bag you positive feedback and your dirty, incomplete game. You won't give the refund, though, because you know your auction was maliciously misleading. You know this game is not in new condition, and had you chosen to include pictures, it would not have sold for half the amount it did sell for. So, drop the insults, and be mature about this, and both you and I will go away missing nothing but the cost of shipping.

Another thing to note, he's left me positive feedback, but I haven't left feedback for him yet. He responds:

you told a lie saying that some of the part were missing everything was there as i sent it, if it was damaged in the mail then it was not my fault and i have proof of sending you the package so dont even go there

I responded:

Now that you mention it, it was poorly packaged, no bubble wrap or cushioning of any sort. I'll be sure to add that to my complaint. And as far as your proof goes, good luck. I'm sure your proof will take you a long way. My offer still stands, refund me $40.15 and I'll send the game back.

And anyway, miracuously ebay somehow alerts my attention to the fact that I have a sent messages folder, which is how I found that first message. So I send another final e-mail before he responded again:

Furthermore, I, on the other hand, do indeed have proof convicting you of misinformation. Thanks to my trusty folder of sent messages, I was able to scrounge up the e-mail I sent you BEFORE I EVEN BID, asking:

Is this the collector's edition with the box, thumb button covers, memory card holder, etc?

and you responded:

yes it is

I have more than adequate proof to back up my side of the story. This will be my final e-mail unless you reneg on not refunding me. I will be more than happy to add these two messages to the complaint.

He responded once again with some massive grammar ingenuity:

actually my proff wont take a long way b/c its right here with me and how do i know what u mena by the box u really dont mean case and how am io supossed to know what thumb covers are and ect, you should of been more spesific, and i did have a little cushoning in the package

So that's my story, and I haven't actually added the poor packaging or messages before I bid to my claim. What should I do?
 
You're right. Stick with filing the complaint with paypal since this guy seems to stupid to reason with. Get your money back and throw that shit in the trash.
 
Get your money back, keep what pieces of the game he sent, leave him negative feedback, and tell him to go fuck himself. Assholes like that are why I rarely buy from ebay anymore.
 
I hate the opposite of this situation. I sent a new game out that I bought from Toys R Us, and the guy filing PayPal complaint against me saying it was used. I will never sell anything on eBAY again if that cock gets his money back for a bogus complaint. He isn't even offering to send the game back, although even if he did I wouldn't take it since he would probably send me a used one and keep the new one I sent him.

eBAY sucks :bomb::bomb::bomb::bomb::bomb::bomb::bomb:
 
Wow, sounds like a nightmare.
I personally don't have any experience with the complaint system, but I wish you all the luck in getting satisfaction in the end.
That is why I rarely buy games from ebay.
If I were you though, after you get it resolved, I would still leave the guy negative for the crap he pulled. I bet this incident will prove time consuming to see it through to the end and he should be "rewarded" as sutch.
Good luck!! :)
 
You should also get money back to pay for shipping it back. And his argument that
how am io supossed to know what thumb covers are and ect
Click to expand...
is proof enough that he lied, as he said that the game included something that he hasn't even heard of.
 
I'm completely serious in wondering this: just where the hell do these morons learn to write? Do you suppose he's 12, or is it an adult cruelly doomed to express himself in that manner for life?

I blame videogames. Right?
 
Keep the game. Continue the filing of the complaint. Receive your payment from PayPal. Leave him negative feedback. Have a beer...
 
file away. you got him with the pre bid questions.



man that blows. im getting really sick of these stock photo assholes. unless they're a huge online retailer like dkoldies(nes cart ebay store) its a pretty good tipoff that they're up to something, i don't think that guy will be selling much longer if hes that kind of seller. to be honest with you I've never really warmed up to the idea of people raking in the dough off of ebay. It was originally setup to be an online flea market to get rid of stuff you don't need an buy stuff you do. I try to go through CAG's auctions and bid bump when I can afford it so It really iritates me when I see people register here just to push their overpriced and likely shit games on ebay like we dont know any better ( people who trade me know im a cheap ass lol ) sorry ranting im done.
 
All these eBay complaint stories really suck. I've never had to deal with a bad seller or buyer before, so I'm happy with that, but if I where in this situation I'd do like the rest of them said: keep the claim and get your darn money back.

New buyers are always questionable, is their listing true? Do they know what the heck their doing? Are they just retarted scammers? You really don't know for sure, and that's what sucks, that's why I'm more and more considering blocking eBay sellers who don't at LEAST have 1 feedback. Unfortunetly sometimes the people who are new bid higher, but sometimes it's not even worth the risk.
 
I was just at a store and they had Arc the Lad used but totally complete. Even the cardboard things weren’t out of the plastic. It was $39.99. They also had Growlander (sp) with the watch and cards and ring and chain. Everything perfect for 36.99.

Oh by the way, you are right and he is wrong. Don't give in!
 
Go to PayPal, go through the whole schpiel, and get your refund in about two months or so. Toss the seller a negative feedback at the end and leave him be. Heck, toss a warning to other buyers in the negative as well. If the seller wants to play it up as if everything was fine and dandy, it's going to be his loss in the end anyway.

This is why I love saving all of the correspondence, alerts, and everything else until a good week after the auction ends and I have the item in my hands. Saves a lot of trouble down the road in case someone wants to pull something cute.
 
ok i've left the seller a negative, paypal's in my favor, and i'm supposed to send the game back. will this guarantee my refund?
 
There is no guarantee of a refund if the seller has no funds to return. If you filed that the items were not received in said condition you have to send them back and the seller has to alert paypal that they received them before a refund can take place. If you alert paypal you sent them and the seller never responds paypal automatically assumes they got the items within a certain period of time and initiate a refund (if possible). You're best bet would be to pay for stuff with a credit card through paypal that way if you don't get your money back just do a credit chargeback.
 
man this webpage has become nothing more then theifs and rip off artist. people are telling the OP to get the refund and keep the game (dont send it back) This site used to be very good when i joined back in July 2004 but since then this site seems to gear towards " let see who we can screw and rip off games from people"

hate to tell you think but nowhere in the auction page does it say that your getting all that stuff, yea they might said it in a email but its not on the auction page (something they could bring up with paypal )


either wait to return the game until you get the refund. (if you keep the game after getting the refund then paypal should ban you ) when you send the game send it

with around 100 bucks of insurance on it and DC (so they have to sign for the package) That way if they say they never got it you got someone name saying they got it and you could go after them for mail fraud,..

finally did you really think you was going to get a Mint condition ATL for 35 bucks when these get 50+ everyday. you should of thought something was funny...

best of luck
 
so basically even if i prove the seller got the game back, if he's removed the funds, i can't get my money back? and i paid with my debit card, does it work the same as a credit card on paypal?
 
I had the same situation happen with Mega Man X3. Seller posted a pic of a "mint" cart and said nothing about any damage in the description. When I get the game, it has a massive tear across the front label. The seller's response: "You bought a GAME, not a label". Paypal was on my side, but when I added up the cost of sending it back USPS, plus tracking (because DC doesn't "count" in Paypal's world), not to mention who knows if I'll even get my money back, I decided to keep it.

The letter from Paypal sounds pretty clear. They may or may not get you your money back. You could CALL THEIR 800 NUMBER and just ask them if his funds have been pulled. They've either pulled his funds to cover your complaint or not. Just give them a call and explain.
 
No idea if PayPal will give you a straight answer on if they have the funds on hold for you or not. If they don't, I'd personally just keep what you have rather than send it back and risk PayPal telling you they couldn't get any money for you. I'd assume that PayPal stating they 'may' be able to give you a refund means they don't have the money on hold. But it also could just be the standard thing they always say.

Anyway, I think you should feel good about how you handled yourself. As you said you could have claimed to have never received the package (since he didn't use DC) and PayPal would have given you a full refund. Now that would have been a lie and mail fraud, but I bet quite a few disgruntled buyers would have done that.

If you do send it back, be sure to put Delivery Confirmation on it. I'd say to get Insurance too, but if you do get screwed it'll likely be that the DC # shows the package as delivered and PayPal won't be able to get your money. Shipping insurance wouldn't help with that.

Does your debit card have a Visa logo? You probably have the same protections as if you used a Visa card, though I'm not 100% sure. Call the CS number for your card (even if it doesn't have a Visa logo) and ask if you can dispute that transaction. It might piss off PayPal, but if they can't gaurantee your refund once you return the item, fuck em. Just be sure you don't dispute it as an unauthorized charge (which it wasn't after all). That apparently REALLY pisses off PayPal.
 
[quote name='wubb']No idea if PayPal will give you a straight answer on if they have the funds on hold for you or not. If they don't, I'd personally just keep what you have rather than send it back and risk PayPal telling you they couldn't get any money for you. I'd assume that PayPal stating they 'may' be able to give you a refund means they don't have the money on hold. But it also could just be the standard thing they always say.

Anyway, I think you should feel good about how you handled yourself. As you said you could have claimed to have never received the package (since he didn't use DC) and PayPal would have given you a full refund. Now that would have been a lie and mail fraud, but I bet quite a few disgruntled buyers would have done that.

If you do send it back, be sure to put Delivery Confirmation on it. I'd say to get Insurance too, but if you do get screwed it'll likely be that the DC # shows the package as delivered and PayPal won't be able to get your money. Shipping insurance wouldn't help with that.

Does your debit card have a Visa logo? You probably have the same protections as if you used a Visa card, though I'm not 100% sure. Call the CS number for your card (even if it doesn't have a Visa logo) and ask if you can dispute that transaction. It might piss off PayPal, but if they can't gaurantee your refund once you return the item, fuck em. Just be sure you don't dispute it as an unauthorized charge (which it wasn't after all). That apparently REALLY pisses off PayPal.[/QUOTE]

i would pay the extra 1.80 and get sig. delivery as well. they could say that someone Took it out of their mailbox and they never got it.. DC just shows that it got to that address it doesnt show that someone got it at that address

i had a problem with paypal few months back. SOmeone paid me using an old bank account. it took almost 12 days before they fixxed the problem (lucky the dude still paided)
 
Call your CC company, get a chargeback and keep his money and game as an idiot tax. Even if you send back the game, PayPal cant guarantee you money back.
 
That is what I hate about ebay, and the reason I don't use it. This paypal shit keeps you from being able to do chargebacks. The ability to do a chargeback is the only thing that can keep you from getting ripped of online and that is why ebay has paypal, to screw the consumer. My local newspaper was dragging their feet about refunding my money after I cancelled my subscription, so after a call to the credit card company they had it taken out of their hide. Plus it costs the merchant extra money on top of the refund if a chargeback is applied to them.
 
[quote name='slidecage']i would pay the extra 1.80 and get sig. delivery as well. they could say that someone Took it out of their mailbox and they never got it.. DC just shows that it got to that address it doesnt show that someone got it at that address

i had a problem with paypal few months back. SOmeone paid me using an old bank account. it took almost 12 days before they fixxed the problem (lucky the dude still paided)[/QUOTE]

Sig conf. could be a waste IMO. The DC # showing it as delivered is all PayPal will require to authorize the refund. I guess sig conf could help you in filing mail fraud however.

I have to agree with slidecage about the CAGers suggesting the OP commit fraud to 'make things right'. That crap should not be tolerated.
 
With signature confirmation, could he choose not to sign and fuck you over again? I'd say ship it with insurance, and if he denies receiving it, you'd have the Post Office on your side. But as chosen1s said, it might not be worth your time/effort, seeing as it could turn into a legal battle. Then again, this guy doesn't seem like the brightest knife in the shed, so he might buckle in response to a simple threat. Good luck man.
 
Good luck with your complaint! I had one denied once because the guy sent the item, even though it was a different item than what I paid for. I bought an old Transformer toy and he sent me a knockoff even though he stated in his auction that it was not the knockoff and I asked him to check the copyright before I paid. Paypal was no help at all saying he sent it so they could do nothing even though on top of all that I saw that he'd just bought the thing a few weeks earlier on EBay himself (where the previous seller DID state it was a knockoff) then ended up selling it to me and buying a real one himself.
 
All I can say is that Paypal and eBay suck.

Second, keep demanding the refund. Don't, I repeat don't send anything back to this asshole. If you do, he'll end up with your money and your game.

Paypal's buyers and sellers protections are a joke. When you need it, they make you jump through a million hoop to get it. If you don't get their "protection", when you get hosed, they don't care and make it all your fault.

Also, make sure of how much you will lose with the buyer's protection. The old eBay one used to make you give up the first $25. If that's the case, I'd keep the game, since you're only going to get like $15 back and that's before shipping.

Did I mention that eBay and Paypal suck?

TBW

PS I don't use Paypal anymore and rarely buy on eBay. When I do, its only from sellers that I know or who have tons of flawless feedback.
 
From my experience, both from being scammed and having money taken out of my account after someone paid because their account got "hacked"...

I got 75% of my refund back when I was scammed. This was due to the fact that when payments go over 100 dollars, paypal only returns so much (other percentage is processing fee or some crap).

When someone paid me and a "complaint" was filed, I had already transferred the money to my bank account. Well, paypal quickly reversed the transaction and put the money back into the guys account, even though it wasn't in my paypal account.

If he has anything tied to his paypal account...bank account, credit card, anything, you'll get your money back.
 
that's exactly what this seller did. look at his feedback history and click on the auction numbers. he seriously ordered like three different AtL: Collections and left a neg on one of them. so, iow, he sold me the crap he left a negative on. i wish i had checked his buying history before i got into this mess, but who really does that?

[quote name='crowbb']Good luck with your complaint! I had one denied once because the guy sent the item, even though it was a different item than what I paid for. I bought an old Transformer toy and he sent me a knockoff even though he stated in his auction that it was not the knockoff and I asked him to check the copyright before I paid. Paypal was no help at all saying he sent it so they could do nothing even though on top of all that I saw that he'd just bought the thing a few weeks earlier on EBay himself (where the previous seller DID state it was a knockoff) then ended up selling it to me and buying a real one himself.[/QUOTE]
 
Congrats! It's good to hear Paypal do the right thing, particularly in a "not as described" dispute.

[quote name='pimp tyranny']i wish i had checked his buying history before i got into this mess, but who really does that?[/QUOTE]If someone selling something I want has low feedback, I go mad-internet-stalker on them before I bid, so I can definitely admit to doing that.
 
[quote name='pimp tyranny']Is this the collector's edition with the box, thumb button covers, memory card holder, etc?

and you responded:

yes it is [/QUOTE]


I would have filed "item not received", got my refund from paypal, and kept the game. And here's why:

(1) He false advertised claiming an item was "like new" when in reality it was scratched/cracked and damaged. i.e. Used.

(2) When you asked if it includes the extras, he false advertised a *second* time, by claiming it did.

(3) Since there appears to be a pattern of repeat lying from this seller, it's a very good bet he's lying to other customers too. It's his modus operandi to lie/false advertise.

(4) Therefore the seller *deserves* to be punished for his corrupt practices. Keeping the game for Free is good punishment. Maybe he'll learn to be honest.

troy
 
[quote name='SkyGheNe']From my experience, both from being scammed and having money taken out of my account after someone paid because their account got "hacked"...

I got 75% of my refund back when I was scammed. This was due to the fact that when payments go over 100 dollars, paypal only returns so much (other percentage is processing fee or some crap).

When someone paid me and a "complaint" was filed, I had already transferred the money to my bank account. Well, paypal quickly reversed the transaction and put the money back into the guys account, even though it wasn't in my paypal account.

If he has anything tied to his paypal account...bank account, credit card, anything, you'll get your money back.[/QUOTE]
I think eBay/PayPal covers like $120-220. Something like that. I thought PayPal cant go into someones bank account and take money.

I bought a pair of Nike Jordans for my friend. It turned out to be fake. I emailed the seller and in the auction, he said it was authentic (as in real), but when I emailed him, he said it was a replica (fake). So I filed a complaint with PayPal and faxed them the email convo. PayPal was able to cover like $25 that was in his account, but I was still missing $60 or so. I had to wait until he received more money into his PayPal before PP can refund me the rest or the buyer had to send it himself. After threatening him with mail fraud, he sent the remaining himself.
 
[quote name='electrictroy'](3) Since there appears to be a pattern of repeat lying from this seller, it's a very good bet he's lying to other customers too. It's his modus operandi to lie/false advertise.

troy[/QUOTE]
Although he might not be a liar, maybe he lied in the AtL auction just to get rid of it. But got himself in trouble and backfired on him
 
Congrats on getting your money back. It's great that you did it honestly and still came out on top. PLus you never sank to his level by keeping the game, etc.
 
[quote name='doodle777_98']^^^^that's why you have so many problems. It's people like you that make me hate ebay.[/QUOTE](3) Since there appears to be a pattern of repeat lying from this seller, it's a very good bet he's lying to other customers too. (4) Therefore the seller *deserves* to be punished for his corrupt practices. Scammers don't deserve to be treated morally. Someone steals; Take them to court; Throw them in jail. Someone false advertises on Ebay trying to scam customers; Take him to Paypal; Scam him back. He deserves it.





UPDATE # 4 (or 5?)

- Turns out the OP aka buyer did NOT return the game. He mailed back a box full of trash. The Scamming Seller has now been reverse scammed... as the bastiche deserves. ***CHEERS*** to the OP.


I thought PayPal cant go into someones bank account and take money.
Click to expand...
They can not. They will wait until the Seller receives more funds. If Seller never receives more funds into his paypal account, you might not get your money back.

Or you might receive money from Ebay's insurance (minus a $20 fee). Paypal's "protection" is rather poor.

.
 
[quote name='electrictroy'](3) Since there appears to be a pattern of repeat lying from this seller, it's a very good bet he's lying to other customers too. (4) Therefore the seller *deserves* to be punished for his corrupt practices.

Scammers don't deserve to be treated morally. Someone steals; throw them in jail. Someone false advertises on Ebay... tying to scam customers. Scam him back. He deserves it.[/QUOTE]

So you're saying that when you list your unsealed games as new knowing that people will assume they are sealed they should scam you out of those games? ;)
 
sounds like that topic a while back where the son sold a whole like flea market butt load of games on ebay, and his mom came on here defending him. he listed all this stuff as sealed, but not resealed.
 
I'm not doing anything illegal (neither is EBgames or Gamespot or Sears when they sell non-sealed games as "new". I've bought many "new" games from these stores that had no plastic wrapping. Perfectly legal for these stores to do that).


Advertising a DAMAGED/scratched/USED game as new.... that's illegal. The Seller is breaking the law, and deserves to be punished.
 
[quote name='electrictroy']I'm not doing anything illegal (neither is EBgames or Gamespot or Sears when they sell non-sealed games as "new". I've bought many "new" games from these stores that had no plastic wrapping. Perfectly legal for these stores to do that).


Advertising a DAMAGED/scratched/USED game as new.... that's illegal.[/QUOTE]

You are deliberately misleading people. If you aren't, then why wouldn't you explain that they are new but not sealed in your auction description. People can see that an ebgames game is not sealed when they buy it in a store, but rely on an auction description to tell them that on ebay.
 
Whatever. If you want to discuss EBgames, Sears, Toy'R'us, Target's, or Gamespot's habit of selling new games w/o plastic wrapping, go create a "EBgames/etc. selling non-sealed games as New" topic. DON'T hijack other people's threads.



BACK ON TOPIC: Advertising a DAMAGED/scratched/USED game as new.... that's illegal. The Seller is breaking the law, and deserves to be punished. The Seller is a scammer/liar, and he does not deserve to get his game back.


.
 
[quote name='doodle777_98']^^^^that's why you have so many problems. It's people like you that make me hate ebay.[/QUOTE]No kidding. Terrible advice, and terrible reasoning. I agree with greendj that what electrictroy does is just as bad as the seller in the OP.
[quote name='electrictroy']Turns out the OP aka buyer did NOT return the game. He mailed back a box full of trash. The Scamming Seller has now been reverse scammed... as the bastiche deserves. ***CHEERS*** to the OP.[/b][/QUOTE]Huh? Where does it say this?
 
[quote name='judyjudyjudy']No kidding. Terrible advice, and terrible reasoning. I agree with greendj that what electrictroy does is just as bad as the seller in the OP.
Huh? Where does it say this?[/QUOTE]


Looks like Troy's gone now. I don't see the OP saying anywhere that he sent the seller back trash anywhere. I'm guessing he made it up.
 
De-lurking -------





Pimp Tyranny told me the same me in a PM--

"hahaha. Thanks for your support. Yeah I mailed the Seller a box of trash and kept the game!"
 
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