Format War - HD DVD vs. Blu-Ray - *Its Over...Toshiba Swings White Flag*

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[quote name='Sporadic']I guess the HD-DVD conference wasn't canceled after all.[/QUOTE]

That was a press release. The conference didn't happen.
 
[quote name='Sporadic']So people quit talking about the HD-DVD as if it was a house of cards.

There are two things I fucking really hate when hearing people talk about the format war 1) people talking about HD-DVD as if it was house of cards and Warner leaving was the equivalent of one of the bottom cards being pulled out, 2) that the format war has to have a clear cut winner (for example people saying "lol HD-DVD will never come back and beat Blu-Ray") as if this is a football game. [/QUOTE]


it does have to have a clear cut winner and soon, please. because honestly, it's worse than the fucking console warz. I don't even care about either format, but I was all excited to see people calling for the death of HD-DVD, since that would mean no more bullshit hd media threads/arguments. Not just on cag, but even the most innocuous sites. even at a few christmas parties I was at this year. even among friends who are mild tech heads and normally don't care to argue about this kind of shit. Then when one format dies, there'll be a small vocal group who praise the dead format and continue to start flame wars about it for years to come.

Why is it worse than console wars? because they're movie formats with no difference other than the brand label. everyone who argues about it is arguing over a brand, rather than features (the mainstream won't care about these features at all. shit, just throw some dvd menus in there, some in-movie navigation, and the world will be happy.)

I guess I'm more pissed at the situation the industry created. I think a unified format (like DVD) would've been an easier situation for the world, and a better situation for the companies involved.
 
[quote name='Apossum']it does have to have a clear cut winner and soon, please. because honestly, it's worse than the fucking console warz. I don't even care about either format, but I was all excited to see people calling for the death of HD-DVD, since that would mean no more bullshit hd media threads/arguments. Not just on cag, but even the most innocuous sites. even at a few christmas parties I was at this year. even among friends who are mild tech heads and normally don't care to argue about this kind of shit. Then when one format dies, there'll be a small vocal group who praise the dead format and continue to start flame wars about it for years to come.

Why is it worse than console wars? because they're movie formats with no difference other than the brand label. everyone who argues about it is arguing over a brand, rather than features (the mainstream won't care about these features at all. shit, just throw some dvd menus in there, some in-movie navigation, and the world will be happy.)

I guess I'm more pissed at the situation the industry created. I think a unified format (like DVD) would've been an easier situation for the world, and a better situation for the companies involved.[/quote]
I agree in that there is too much "fanboy-ism" regarding the formats. However, the war does have some good consequences. All these B1G1 sales probably would not have happened, or as frequently, if there was no war on. The last days of this war will serve to up my collection of both formats at a huge discount :D
 
Toshiba stock falls to 9 month low....
Jan. 7 (Bloomberg) -- Toshiba Corp. shares fell to a nine- month low after Time Warner Inc., the world's largest publisher of DVD titles, abandoned the Japanese company's HD DVD format to adopt Sony Corp.'s Blu-ray technology.
Time Warner's decision may tip the balance in Sony's favor in the home theater industry's biggest format war since VHS beat Betamax two decades ago. Warner Bros. Entertainment, which had been releasing movies based on both technologies, said on Jan. 4 it will drop Toshiba's standard at the end of May.
``It's a game-changing event, game over for HD DVD,'' Macquarie Securities Ltd. analyst David Gibson said in an e-mail today. ``Other studios will follow'' industry leader Warner, which distributes more than 300 million DVDs a year, Gibson said.
Toshiba, HD DVD's leading promoter, declined 2.3 percent to 783 yen, its lowest since March 28, at the close on the Tokyo Stock Exchange. Tokyo-based Sony, the world's second-largest consumer electronics maker, climbed 0.7 percent. The Nikkei 225 Stock Average fell 1.2 percent.
Click to expand...

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a9YyDD7X.uII&refer=home



And then this site is just sad:
http://warnerlied.blogspot.com/

Rich, is that you?
 
[quote name='dallow']Rich, is that you?[/QUOTE]

I refuse to reply to that , on account of my sig incriminating me .

DOH !

Now if I talk shit about the PS3 you guys have to put up with it .
 
I wonder where all the people who bought Betamax went to complain and cry in the 80's? Look we all new buying into this war that there was a 50/50 chance we were buying a format that would be dead in a few years. Besides I haven't heard the fat lady yet. I think she's definitely warming up, but hasn't got the ok to go on stage.
 
[quote name='Richlough']I refuse to reply to that , on account of my sig incriminating me .

DOH !

Now if I talk shit about the PS3 you guys have to put up with it .[/quote]

WTF! You bought a PS3?

I'm disapointed in you Richlough :shame:
 
[quote name='mykevermin']C'mon, you know you'll own one before Christmas.

You won't be able to, at the very least, settle for an SD copy of The Dark Knight.[/quote]
I'm going through the 5 stages of loss right now...currently I'm at step three...if and when I reach 5 (acceptance) then maybe...God I can't think of not owning The Dark Knight on SD though....If only Toshiba marketed HD DVD better..:cry: (step 3 Bargaining);)

next up depression...yay!
 
[quote name='mykevermin']I'm done gloating if you need consolation. ;)[/quote]

I know, it was a great run, really disappointed in Toshiba though, they didn't market it enough, I still think HD DVD was the better choice, not just because I own it, but because of the hardware cost and HDi features. The whole 1.1, 2.0 Blu-Ray players thing worries me. Seems like the older models won't support new features and such, makes me wonder if they'll release 3.0 later on and 2.0 and below won't support whatever new features they come out with for 3.0...I don't really follow Blu-Ray news so that's where I'm currently confused on.

I think I'm actually going to buy my first BR movie, starting with Cars, I found out about that $10 Upgrade MIR if you own the DVD and with the $5 off coupon and Toys R Us B1G1, I'll get Cars and something else I guess...The PS3/Blu-Ray player will have to wait till Fall 08 though.
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']The whole 1.1, 2.0 Blu-Ray players thing worries me. Seems like the older models won't support new features and such, makes me wonder if they'll release 3.0 later on and 2.0 and below won't support whatever new features they come out with for 3.0...I don't really follow Blu-Ray news so that's where I'm currently confused on.[/quote] Profile 3.0 is audio only. Think SACD, only even more lame and with even fewer customers (if such a thing is possible. :)). 1.1 is what they call "final standard profile", ie the entire feature set that will likely ever be required. 2.0 is optional--there is no sunset date on 1.1 players. Will there be other optional features in the future? Probably. Likely there would have been with HD DVD as well. Remember DVD players didn't always support DTS, and they're still not required to. But I don't forsee any additional mandatory profiles.
 
FWIW, a BDA rep reported at CES that the PS3 would be upgraded to profile 2.0 in the future.

You're right, there may be a 3.0 eventually, or more - but then again, maybe not. The only feature that they lack compared w/ HD DVD are the web-based chat/shopping things. Which is fine by me, really. And, at some point, they'll surely try to have a standardized spec.
 
[quote name='poisonedpawn45']We should place bets on how long it will be until Linkin gets a PS3 :D[/quote]

heh, I used to think the same thing about myself. I bought mine on a whim via Amazon when I was stranded in Memphis (long story...)
 
[quote name='mykevermin']FWIW, a BDA rep reported at CES that the PS3 would be upgraded to profile 2.0 in the future.

You're right, there may be a 3.0 eventually, or more - but then again, maybe not. The only feature that they lack compared w/ HD DVD are the web-based chat/shopping things. Which is fine by me, really. And, at some point, they'll surely try to have a standardized spec.[/quote]
Do Blu-Ray's have the ability to display the menu while the movie is playing in the background like all HD DVD's?
 
"pop-up menu"? I think I played one the other week (Casino Royale?) that didn't have it, but that's the only one I've encountered thus far.
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']Do Blu-Ray's have the ability to display the menu while the movie is playing in the background like all HD DVD's?[/QUOTE]


Yes, and I think it works better on Blu-ray actually.
 
Over the weekend, I unloaded 15 HD-DVD movies for $150. Most of those movies I got for free anyway and were from Warner Bros. Still have my player with Batman Begins, 10 Universal films, and Transformers. If/when Universal announces Blu support that's it for my HD-DVD collection. Also will not be buying any future HD-DVDs no matter how good the sale is.

The $150 is going to my Blu-Ray/PS3 fund.
 
How fast will studios be dropping HD-DVD is my question. Because I really want to see some films on BR like Transformers and Batman Begins (yeah, I know WB is BR now, but it still needs to come out).
 
[quote name='KingBroly']How fast will studios be dropping HD-DVD is my question. Because I really want to see some films on BR like Transformers and Batman Begins (yeah, I know WB is BR now, but it still needs to come out).[/quote]

BB was announced for BR way before Warner went exclusive. They I believe stated they were waiting for profile 1.1 (which is out now). At this point many just believe they will wait until around the premiere of The Dark Knight and tie that into a promotional release (maybe like some studios have done lately which is include a free movie pass to the new movie in the series when buying the previous one right around the time the next one is out)
 
[quote name='KingBroly']How fast will studios be dropping HD-DVD is my question. Because I really want to see some films on BR like Transformers and Batman Begins (yeah, I know WB is BR now, but it still needs to come out).[/quote]

Until Paramount starts doing BR again, you're gonna have to wait on Transformers
 
I don't think you'll see WB bring out their HD DVD exclusive catalog quickly at all. Some titles may not come out for years (particularly stuff like Robin Hood, which I think geko pointed out didn't sell well at all), and I could imagine the Matrix coming out towards Christmas (for no good reason other than them wanting Christmas-sized sales figures).

Universal will be the same way. Paramount, OTOH, will probably bring Transformers out with a quickness once they go back to BD; I'm not confident about the others, though.

Watching Shoot 'Em Up and catching up on work (which means watching Shoot 'Em Up, I suppose). Holy crap this is a brilliant movie, and a relatively good looking one for having that cliche "dirty urban" environ to it. Nice use of "Ace of Spades," too (and great sounding!)

In other news, from Blu-ray.com:

Sony Pictures today showcased upcoming Blu-ray interactive features for their titles. One feature will allow viewers to send a ring tone to their phone from the movie. Additionally, PSP owners will be happy to hear that a portable copy will be available on the disc encoded specifically for the PSP. Also shown was a Men In Black network trivia game. More later.
Click to expand...

Sounds like they're only going to do it for PSP, which is unfortunate, since I use my iPod for videos more than PSP. But, since I can't imagine many companies outside of Sony using it, it'll be a neat feature that won't really be used.
 
[quote name='Sporadic']I guess the HD-DVD conference wasn't canceled after all.



http://www.reuters.com/article/pressRelease/idUS35203+07-Jan-2008+PRN20080107

Not one mention of Warner leaving but I guess that was expected since this was the HD-DVD Promotional Group's conference.

Glad to see the rumors about Universal going anywhere stomped out. Then again it was kind of silly to imagine them switching when Ken Graffeo is still in charge. I don't know why but he seems to hate Blu-Ray.[/quote]
???

What are you talking about? It makes no mention of Universal staying exclusive to HD-DVD from what I read. It doesn't even say anything about any commitment to stay on HD-DVD. All it does is not announce that Universal is leaving RIGHT NOW from what I read.

I still expect in the not to distant future for Universal to at least start making BR's and Paramount to at least flip back to doing both when their exclusivity agreement is up.
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']Do Blu-Ray's have the ability to display the menu while the movie is playing in the background like all HD DVD's?[/quote]
Pretty sure all the ones I've played (which granted, is still under 10 at this point, so I am far from an expert) do have that feature. I think there are a few that don't, but it is a very common feature.
 
[quote name='HumanSnatcher']Are people really that fuckin lazy that they don't want to have to go to an actual menu anymore??[/quote]It's super convenient though.

99.9% of BDs have the pop up menu Linkin.
 
[quote name='HumanSnatcher']Are people really that fuckin lazy that they don't want to have to go to an actual menu anymore??[/QUOTE]
Some dvd menus are really annoying, long, and unnecessary; sometimes they even ruin parts of the movie by forcing video clips on you.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']FWIW, a BDA rep reported at CES that the PS3 would be upgraded to profile 2.0 in the future.[/quote]
 
Is Shoot 'Em Up a 1.1 disc, or does it use the pseudo-PiP like Terminator 2 did?

BTW, I *wholly* recommend the movie for mindless action buffs. The video quality is a bit too good at times, as the CG glass and bulletholes in the glass are rather fake looking (as is the
scene at the end when Smith is attacking people with the scalpel embedded in his hand
). But overall I haven't had that much fun watching an action movie in ages.

Guyver, I know you're a pseudo-red dude in that you have a PS3 but seem to cheerlead for HD DVD, but you may also enjoy the cameo appearance of Christian Cage in this movie as well.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']
BTW, I *wholly* recommend the movie for mindless action buffs. [/QUOTE]


Glad to hear that. I just picked it up and plan on watching it today.
 
Geko:
So is Microsofts' HDi going to be available for use on BD players?
Gates had a quote recently that said that their codecs and HDi tools were available for use on the 'other' format.
And in the specs (on Endgadet) for the new Panny BD50 player it says: Panasonic intros DMP-BD50 Blu-ray player, adds HDi support - Engadget
 
Looks like there will be some sort of olive branch peace offering given to HD DVD owners.

One last note this evening: That idea I floated yesterday, that the BDA should offer an olive branch to HD-DVD consumers? I mentioned it to senior BDA executives this evening, and I think you can safely say that they're going to move forward with something along these very lines in the weeks ahead. We'll post more when we can, but the idea was definitely warmly received. In fact, plans are already in the works. We'll post more on this as things develop.
Click to expand...

From Digital Bits.
 
1) I don't loathe Bill Hunt the way other folks do (or, likewise, the way BD-lovin' folk loathe Amir), but I also don't consider him credible. I also consider him to be, like most bloggers of "repute," an egomaniac. Like he's the only guy in the world to think of offering a trade-in/incentive/whatever to go Blu? Pthhhhhb. Whatever.

2) Why do it? It's stupid and unprecedented. Maybe there's money to be made here by getting more BD people on board quickly; a gesture like this would certainly "end" the war (unlike at the moment where we're somewhere between V-day and George Bush's "Mission Accomplished" in the format war), bring over the remaining formats, but most importantly, neutralize any delusions of grandeur that Uni/Paramount/Weinstein have of getting money to go to BD.
 
[quote name='dallow']Looks like there will be some sort of olive branch peace offering given to HD DVD owners.


From Digital Bits.[/quote]

Call me stupid, but WTF does "olive branch peace offerring" mean---Some sort of incentive for HD DVD owners to move to Blu-Ray?
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']I know, it was a great run, really disappointed in Toshiba though, they didn't market it enough, I still think HD DVD was the better choice, not just because I own it, but because of the hardware cost and HDi features. The whole 1.1, 2.0 Blu-Ray players thing worries me. Seems like the older models won't support new features and such, makes me wonder if they'll release 3.0 later on and 2.0 and below won't support whatever new features they come out with for 3.0...I don't really follow Blu-Ray news so that's where I'm currently confused on.[/quote]

That's why I bought a PS3.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']
BTW, I *wholly* recommend the movie for mindless action buffs. The video quality is a bit too good at times, as the CG glass and bulletholes in the glass are rather fake looking (as is the
scene at the end when Smith is attacking people with the scalpel embedded in his hand
). But overall I haven't had that much fun watching an action movie in ages.[/QUOTE]

I second this statement, Shoot Em' up is the most balls to the wall action movie since The Killer/ Hard Boiled.
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']Call me stupid, but WTF does "olive branch peace offerring" mean---Some sort of incentive for HD DVD owners to move to Blu-Ray?[/quote]Pretty much.
Maybe trade in movies, or player.
Who knows.
 
[quote name='dallow']Looks like there will be some sort of olive branch peace offering given to HD DVD owners.
[/quote]

Hmm, trade in your old player for a credit? Free movies with hd player tradein? It will be interesting to see where they go with this.
 
[quote name='doctorfaustus']No new titles at CES=waiting out the clock on their contract with HD?[/QUOTE]

I think they'll still release movies. Personally, I think Paramount's statement doesn't really say anything about their current state. It doesn't rule out BD support, given that they said "we still support HD DVD," leaving out words "exclusively" and the like. Moreover, we all can see quite clearly how meaningless these ambiguous phrases are - look at Warner's move on Friday versus their "we have not changed our plans" statements.

I think Paramount is more likely to go neutral than BD exclusive, but I do think they'll do so sooner than later (not this week soon, but soon). Neither Uni nor Paramount want to be the last one out the door, but with Ken Graffeo at the helm of Universal, I think they're likely to be the real stubborn holdout.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']I think they'll still release movies. Personally, I think Paramount's statement doesn't really say anything about their current state. It doesn't rule out BD support, given that they said "we still support HD DVD," leaving out words "exclusively" and the like. Moreover, we all can see quite clearly how meaningless these ambiguous phrases are - look at Warner's move on Friday versus their "we have not changed our plans" statements.

I think Paramount is more likely to go neutral than BD exclusive, but I do think they'll do so sooner than later (not this week soon, but soon). Neither Uni nor Paramount want to be the last one out the door, but with Ken Graffeo at the helm of Universal, I think they're likely to be the real stubborn holdout.[/quote]
Isn't he the one who said Gamers won't buy movies?
 
[quote name='anomynous']Of course paramount still supports HD DVD, they legally have to.[/quote]
Well, we don't know the terms of the contract with Toshiba so it was still up in the air...actually like myke said them saying we still support HD DVD doesn't really mean anything for Blu-Ray yet.

EDIT: This whole Paramount/Dreamworks HD DVD vs. Blu-Ray thing reminds me of this webcomic :D:

 
I am seriously considering selling/trading my sealed Heroes Season 1 HD-DVD box set towards something blue ray related. At the moment, I am looking forward to seeing TNG on Blue Ray when it happens. Yes I know Paramount is still stuck with HD-DVD. Now I am GLAD I didn't run out and build a massive collection of HD-DVD Movies when I got my HD-DVD player. The only HD DVD I actually bought was was Apollo 13 HD-DVD and that's because it was 5 dollars "As is" at my local target. Everything else I got for free with that hd-dvd promo back in October. Now I am really not forward to getting my free HD-DVD's coming anytime now :(
 
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