HD DVD thread - Toshiba: HD DVD DISCONTINUED, REPAIR/SUPPORT CONTINUES, NO BLU PLANS

Status
Not open for further replies.
[quote name='mykevermin']Bullshit. I'm sure WB was paid a hefty sum, but half a billion? *any* speculation on what WB's financial take was is just that. Until I see a reliable source put a number out there (the way NY Times and others mentioned 150m to Paramount/Dreamworks), I call complete bullshit.

Half a billion. Heh.

And FOX? Chalk me up for another heh. Those cats ran scared with their tails between their legs when BD was cracked last year before full implementation of BD+ encryption (which, although cracked, yes, I know - is disc specific, so they managed to crack a single title). I don't see them going HD DVD exclusive until the bitter end, just like I would expect Universal to do in the opposite case.

That said, if you'd like to discuss this further, I'll be in the format war thread. I'm not going to bring that nonsense in this 'un.[/QUOTE]


Actually it is true. The insider thread on AVS is full of people "in the know" admitting it's true. Not the money itself. Let me quote Dave Vaughn, insider for Home theater Spot, known to have many connections in the industry:

And you are right...it wasn't a slam dunk. For people celebrating for Blu-ray, it could just as easily have gone the other way...yes it was that close. There was an agreement in principle between Toshiba, Fox and Warner, but FOX pulled out at the 11th hour and went to Sony with their intentions. To Sony's credit, the did whatever it took to get Fox and Warner (although Warner is denying any type of incentives...if you believe this, I have a bridge for sale if anyone is interested). For the record, I think "incentives" are perfectly acceptable and a part of doing business.

Let's look at this from a business perspective. Is Toshiba harmed by losing HD DVD? Yes, but not to the degree that Sony would be if Blu-ray died. Sony has literally bet the farm on Blu-ray with the PS3. The PS3 isn't considered a successful game machine (yet), and if Sony lost Fox and Warner after the Paramount defection, that would have been the end of Blu-ray and possibly the end of Sony as we know it.
Click to expand...

So yes, Fox was in negotiations with HD DVD. And for whatever reason, they went back to Sony and asked them to counter offer. Warner was simply going to go whichever way Fox went (or any other studio).

It's just very interesting that no studio decision here had anything to do with which format they liked better or which one they thought was "winning" it all had to do with incentives.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']Actually it is true. The insider thread on AVS is full of people "in the know" admitting it's true. Not the money itself. Let me quote Dave Vaughn, insider for Home theater Spot, known to have many connections in the industry:
Sony has literally bet the farm on Blu-ray with the PS3. The PS3 isn't considered a successful game machine (yet).
[/QUOTE]

He does know his stuff .
 
From the insider's forum post:
For the record, I think "incentives" are perfectly acceptable and a part of doing business.
Click to expand...

Yes, which is pretty much the only thing that surprises me about this deal. When it comes down to paying out, MS and Toshiba hold the biggest arsenal.

However, I'm still not sure I'm buying into this Warner - Fox connection theory. That sounds like HDM fanfic or something.
 
To reiterate what I posted elsewhere just a few minutes ago, could The Dark Knight (the movie, not the inevitable game) be the 'killer app' for the PS3 this fall, particularly if FF XIII slips in the U.S. into '09? Am I being ridiculous again?
 
I still find it laughable about Blu-ray. Your average person didn't know what Blu-ray was. So Sony had to start putting in the commercials that a movie would be available on DVD or Blu-ray "Hi Def". I hope Time Warner's sales tank.
 
[quote name='jollydwarf']To reiterate what I posted elsewhere just a few minutes ago, could The Dark Knight (the movie, not the inevitable game) be the 'killer app' for the PS3 this fall, particularly if FF XIII slips in the U.S. into '09? Am I being ridiculous again?[/QUOTE]

Yes, MGS4.
 
Don't overestimate the power of the MGS. I don't think that it's quite 'the draw' with the GTA/Madden crowd that people here think it is. I also specifically said "Fall", and isn't this game a likely Q2 release (worldwide)?
 
[quote name='jollydwarf'] Am I being ridiculous again?[/QUOTE]

Yes.

Folks still don't realize their PS3s can play Blu-ray movie discs. I actually watched a guy trade in his copy of Spider-man 3 because, and I quote, "I don't own a Blu-ray thing and I don't want one"

It's hard to have a killer app when a healthy portion of your buying community doesn't understand what is actually in their living rooms.
 
[quote name='TrueBlueLS']I still find it laughable about Blu-ray. Your average person didn't know what Blu-ray was. So Sony had to start putting in the commercials that a movie would be available on DVD or Blu-ray "Hi Def". I hope Time Warner's sales tank.[/QUOTE]

...the average person probably doesn't even understand high def, or this format war or pretty much anything electronic related.
 
the sad thing is that most of us hd backers "chose" to back the format for whatever reason.

Alot of the blu-ray backers (ps3 owners) are just happy because they won by default.
 
It's hard to have a killer app when a healthy portion of your buying community doesn't understand what is actually in their living rooms.

Well, it'll be interesting to see how that movie is marketed on Blu-Ray this coming Fall/Holiday season, as the (potential) PS3-owning crowd and the Batman-loving crowd probably share significant overlap.

Or, at least they do now.
 
Sporadic - on the Band of Brothers set, is disc five only the documentary like it is on the DVD set, or does it have the final episodes on it as well?


[quote name='ChrisInCali']Hopefully when Universal starts releasing on Blu-ray the will do a better job with the transfer having 20gb more of disc space to work with.[/quote]
Not a shot in hell. If Universal opts to release on Blu-Ray in the future, they'll use the same transfers they did on HD DVD. Total waste of resources to redo it for Blu-Ray. It's doubtful that there would be a noticable difference anyway, aside from the occasional DD+ to THD track.




I think a lot of this hysteria would die down if people heard from Toshiba and/or Universal and/or MS. Even if it is just to say "WE GIVE UP" at least people would stop flipping out with speculation. A few noteworthy titles would probably shut up a lot of people as well.
 
[quote name='KaneRobot']

However, I'm still not sure I'm buying into this Warner - Fox connection theory. That sounds like HDM fanfic or something.[/QUOTE]

Then you would be calling multiple insiders liars. There are multiple people in the AVS insider thread that have spilled the beans.

Warner told HD DVD if they could get another studio to go exclusive they would too. That is fact now.

HD DVD did what they could to pursuade Fox over, so Warner would come to. What happened after that point is very sketchy, but it sounds like they all had verbal commitments with Toshiba to go exclusive, then for whatever reason Fox went to Sony and said "This is what we are thinking about doing, and Warner will to, you wanna tell us why we shouldn't?"

Fast forward a week, and now all blu ray supporters will be paying off Sony's rather massive "incentives" for those studios for some time to come.
 
[quote name='jollydwarf']
Well, it'll be interesting to see how that movie is marketed on Blu-Ray this coming Fall/Holiday season, as the (potential) PS3-owning crowd and the Batman-loving crowd probably share significant overlap.
[/QUOTE]

Sony is definitely doing a better job at getting their content providers to advertise it will play Blu-ray movies. On the Pirates 3 $10 coupon, it points out twice that "Did you get a Playstation 3 for Christmas?!? Why not enjoy High Definition Movies via Blu-ray!!"

My other concern is just numbers. Let's assume The Dark Knight does at least 300's numbers. That's maybe 350,000 (Extreme extrapolation on my part - using the 250,000 discs sold as of August 7th as a basis). Can that really be considered a major success when talking about games? Will The Dark Knight then open the flood gates to ensure more folks buy more movie discs? I would have thought Spider-man 3 would have done this, but I'm not seeing any increased sales in my neck of the hill billy woods.
 
it was fun guys, but the format war is over

I'm gonna dump my a2 and discs while the going is still good.

I don't want to have two players in my rack

I expect paramount and universal to jump ship this summer and start flooding the market with titles.. Bourne Trilogy on bluray anybody?
 
Well, I know it's not considered a deterrent for the overall moviegoing. movie-buying public, but Spider-Man 3 sucked in a major, major way. I seriously doubt that The Dark Knight will do the same, given that nothing about it so far seems to indicate that it'll play like the scribblings of an AD-HD-riddled, soon-to-be-schizo eight-year-old.

Besides that, the entire Spider-Man series has always been at least slightly overrated, in my opinion, and was probably going to be considered 'played out' by many regardless of the quality of the third entry. Most superhero franchises in recent times seem to have the second entry being the best (probably because of not needing to establish the origin story and yet not running low on fresh ideas or key characters).

Enough hyphens for ya?

EDIT: All I'm saying is that I could see where one movie on Blu-Ray might hold as much, if not more sway over someone on the fence this holiday season than any one game. People will want this movie in high-def, no two ways about it. By the time it releases for home viewing, I think the scenario might be a perfect storm (more HDTVs, another PS3 price drop, more games that people can 'get with', etc.) for it to be the proverbial straw.
 
he said

"And our sources are now telling us that Universal - knowing Warner was about to go Blu-exclusive - has already begin taking steps to prepare for their own future Blu-ray efforts"

one hilarious thing he said was speilberg wants to go back to universal and he will use that to get universal to go blu

"Steven Spielberg has repeatedly made his desire to move DreamWorks back to Universal clear, and he's also a committed Blu-ray Disc backer - Universal going Blu is almost certainly going to be a sticking point in the negotiations, especially when you consider that Spielberg has TWICE now required the HD-DVD camp to retract statements claiming that his Universal films were coming soon to that format."
 
So no one has the Potter OotP disc and wants to try out the community screening thing? You don't even need a USB keyboard, if you have your PC in the same room you can type on that and it'll pop up on the screen.

SHEESH. This will probably be the only time we see this feature for quite a while, since Blu-Ray won't adopt it until the format is finalized and HD DVD is tanking.
 
Even more bad news for HD-DVD

http://kotaku.com/341012/ces-hd-dvd-press-conference-canceled

In light of yesterday's announcement that Warner Bros. will be going exclusively Blu-Ray, the HD DVD Promotion Group has canceled it's press conference for this year's CES. The news came in an email sent around to CES attendees yesterday.
"Based on the timing of the Warner Home Video announcement today, we have decided to postpone our CES 2008 press conference scheduled for Sunday, January 6th at 8:30 p.m. in the Wynn Hotel. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. We are currently discussing the potential impact of this announcement with the other HD DVD partner companies and evaluating next steps. We believe the consumer continues to benefit from HD DVD's commitment to quality and affordability - a bar that is critical for the mainstream success of any format.
We'll continue to keep you updated on new developments around HD DVD."
​
Yeeeeesh. Not that I think the entire format war relies on the decisions of Warner's, but it is one of the largest movie distributors and their choice will serve to start swinging things in Blu-Ray's direction. If a few more prominent companies choose this same option, we could well see an end to the format wars in the not too distant future. Man, am I glad I bought that PS3 when I had the money.
Click to expand...
 
[quote name='KaneRobot']So no one has the Potter OotP disc and wants to try out the community screening thing? You don't even need a USB keyboard, if you have your PC in the same room you can type on that and it'll pop up on the screen.

SHEESH. This will probably be the only time we see this feature for quite a while, since Blu-Ray won't adopt it until the format is finalized and HD DVD is tanking.[/quote]

i have it.. but have to catch up.. im still by the 3rd movie
 
I won't deny that Bill Hunt is 'in the know' about industry developments, but his blatant campaigning for Blu-Ray (not just this weekend, but all of last year)--and now blatant gloating--has completely turned me off to his site. He should go work for CNet with that mentality.

That's half the problem with the Internet entertainment industry media: they may have 'made good' for themselves, but at the end of the day, you've still got immature, easily-bought fanboys delivering you your 'news'.
 
[quote name='jollydwarf']I won't deny that Bill Hunt is 'in the know' about industry developments, but his blatant campaigning for Blu-Ray (not just this weekend, but all of last year)--and now blatant gloating--has completely turned me off to his site. He should go work for CNet with that mentality.

That's half the problem with the Internet entertainment industry media: they may have 'made good' for themselves, but at the end of the day, you've still got immature, easily-bought fanboys delivering you your 'news'.[/QUOTE]
Wait and see how "outraged" (for the consumer's good, of course! :roll:) that he is if Paramount and Universal don't IMMEDIATELY go Blu-Ray next week.
 
When he titled that 'Blu-Ray site hack' story "The Look and Sound of Desperate", you know he had a grin that made the Joker look pursed-lipped.

Again, legitimate news, worth covering, but his angle on the HD-DVD fanboyism just illuminated his own.
 
[quote name='guyver2077']watching the rkelly hd dvd right now...

not bad at all[/quote]

I havent seen that anywhere.. whered you manage to snag a copy? Amazon?
 
[quote name='Ice2Dragon']I havent seen that anywhere.. whered you manage to snag a copy? Amazon?[/quote]

rented via netflix..

may actually pick it up (and shakira) if i see it for cheap
 
[quote name='jollydwarf']When he titled that 'Blu-Ray site hack' story "The Look and Sound of Desperate", you know he had a grin that made the Joker look pursed-lipped.[/QUOTE]
That was good, but my favorite was when the Paramount story broke, he posted his kneejerk reaction diatribe - on par with a 12 year old's whining - complete with calling Microsoft "Money$oft" throughout the post. Shortly after it went up, he edited it, removing some of the more amusing whining and changed it to "Microsoft" and pretended his original post never happened.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']That's old news, and has been mentioned twice already.

It makes sense though, because HD DVD was planning on having a 3 hour gloat fest about having Fox and Warner exclusive. Now they are forced to make new plans.[/QUOTE]


Umm, Fox HD DVD exclusive... no.
 
[quote name='guyver2077']rented via netflix..

may actually pick it up (and shakira) if i see it for cheap[/quote]

Shakira I picked up for I think 22 at Borders with the 20 percent off coupon, its great :)
 
It was an awesome run for me, being able to really watch high-def movies at a cheap price, but I think I need to sell off my collection of HD-DVDs and get a PS3 in the next few months. Luckily I only bought like 4 actual discs, rest were free.
 
[quote name='guyver2077']the sad thing is that most of us hd backers "chose" to back the format for whatever reason.

Alot of the blu-ray backers (ps3 owners) are just happy because they won by default.[/quote]

That's so true...I believe that HD DVD is the better format, with HDi and all those interactive features...but leave it to Sony once again with their gorilla marketing to pounce on the better product...not to long ago, PS2 vs Dreamcast and now PS3 vs HD DVD...what a shame. I think that if Toshiba had pushed their marketing dollars bit more, we could have gotten WB.
 
Well, don't call me a quitter but, do you assume GS will take in the HD-DVDs and the 360 player? I really, really don't want to deal with trying to sell these to an unsuspecting buyer that doesn't know the unfortunate fate that lies ahead.
 
[quote name='Chris in Cali']Umm, Fox HD DVD exclusive... no.[/QUOTE]

Not exclusive, the plan was for them to go neutral and Warner to go HD-DVD exclusive.

Warner really fucked the dog on this one.
 
Well, I just took my B3G2 discs back to Best Buy for a return. Until we hear from Uni/DW/Paramount/Toshiba/MS one way or the other, I'm done buying HD DVD. If the two studios remain firm with HD DVD, then I will resume purchases. If one of the two goes neutral, I'm done with HD media for the forseeable future and will go back to downloads. I will not buy a Blu-Ray player until their hardware is finalized.

I'm not selling anything besides the Potter discs and I'm not cancelling any of the things I have already preordered (I believe all I have right now is the UFC disc anyway), but for now, the Band of Brothers set is the final thing I'm picking up...a hell of a way to go out, considering it's my favorite TV series of all time.

I'll continue to update the OP in the meantime.


[quote name='LinkinPrime']That's so true...I believe that HD DVD is the better format, with HDi and all those interactive features...[/QUOTE]
Yep. To draw another Sonv/PS3 vs. (whoever) analogy, HD DVD sort of struck me like the 360 in that theoretically it was slightly less "powerful," but in execution results were identical, it was easier to work with, and had more neat gimmicks from the get-go.
 
[quote name='dg7md']Well, don't call me a quitter but, do you assume GS will take in the HD-DVDs and the 360 player? I really, really don't want to deal with trying to sell these to an unsuspecting buyer that doesn't know the unfortunate fate that lies ahead.[/quote]

same just i want money back since i barely used it and now its about to lose...ps3 is stll too much for me :cold:
 
I guess I'm in the minority since I'm both keeping my HD-DVD collection and actually looking forward to increasing my collection. I'll be monitoring eBay a lot more often now.

Sure, I'll eventually make the jump to Blu-Ray (via PS3 to play the handful of games that actually interest me) if and when HD-DVD is officially declared dead by Toshiba, but I still plan on enjoying HD-DVD until that time comes.
 
Not that I've got a huge collection anyway, only 15 movies, but I'm in it with red until the end too. No plans on getting a Blu-ray player anytime soon, and the PS3 is no option for me until I can think of more than two games I'd play on it -- and those two aren't even coming out anytime soon!
 
I have no intention of investing in blu ray. Probably ever.

1- I have realized that Warner may have just saved me a bundle of cash. Because I really only watch movies once or twice after I buy them, and if I just stick to renting them on the Xbox Marketplace if I can't buy them on HD DVD, I save huge. Even if I rent a movie twice, it's still cheaper than buying.

2- I only have 720p (the difference in 1080p isn't noticeable enough to upgrade until my display device breaks.)

3- This way this whole thing panned out this week has soured me even further on Sony and Blu ray, and I don't intend to help Sony recoup the half billion they paid out.
 
I saw this on AVS and it's a nice moment of clarity in the middle of all this hysteria...this was explaining why someone was thinking about selling all their stuff, but changed their mind:


I have an HD DVD player.

I've gotten a ridiculous amount of entertainment out of it.

It still plays movies that look just as good as the other format, just like it did yesterday.

In the event my player eventually fails sometime down the road, it will not be difficult to find a replacement...probably for less money than I paid the first time around.
Click to expand...
 
[quote name='guyver2077']what does everyone use to keep track of what movies they own?

can anyone suggest something? ign?[/QUOTE]

I use DVD Aficionado (www.dvdaf.com) but after their re-design I'm not liking it too much. It does the job, but the layout isn't too pretty and not all movies are in their database (the HD-DVD import of Underworld, for instance).
 
[quote name='captainfrizo']I use DVD Aficionado (www.dvdaf.com) but after their re-design I'm not liking it too much. It does the job, but the layout isn't too pretty and not all movies are in their database (the HD-DVD import of Underworld, for instance).[/QUOTE]

I also use that, but I REALLY need to update my collection as I've sold several DVDs and have a ton more HD DVDs now.
 
I'm sure its been alluded to several times already, but I'm too lazy to read back and am anxious to watch Northern Exposure before bed, it'll turn out like the Dreamcast.

Toshiba and their HD DVD pals will still pledge support. Maybe even offer some bombshells (I'm guess ET/Jaws/Jurassic Park from Universal, The Godfather from Paramount). Releases will be strong through June, then we'll start hearing odd cancellations (I'm guess Cloverfield will be one). Then come October, the bombshells will be cast aside. Before Christmas, it'll be announced that these bombshells will appear on Blu-ray starting in January.

But like the Dreamcast, HD DVD owners that hadn't abandoned their players will reap the rewards of fire sales and $5 discount bins at Wal-mart. And even after four or five years, the devoted will still be trading for that Japanese Band of Brothers set.
 
[quote name='terribledeli']I'm sure its been alluded to several times already, but I'm too lazy to read back and am anxious to watch Northern Exposure before bed, it'll turn out like the Dreamcast.[/QUOTE]

I could have sworn I said that earlier, but maybe not. Regardless, I agree 100%. It'll be "fine" for a while, but when Warner dries up (after not delivering a few of the titles they said they would), we'll start to see cancellations here and there.

Then come fall/winter 2008, the remaining customers get the motherlode of all sales.


Obviously this all goes out the window if Toshiba/Uni/Paramount has some unexpected news that boosts the format, but I'm not counting on that. Frankly, if it DOES go the Dreamcast route above, it's fine with me...I wouldn't mind some 5-10 dollar closeout discs to tide me over until Blu-Ray is complete and the prices are reasonable.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
bread's done
Back
Top