I'm sick of modern life = empty existence = waste

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[EDIT - I'm not blaming anyone except my self... and indirectly our society which encourages spending money & going into debt.]



Buy Buy Buy - yell the commercials on the tv, radio, billboards. And so I buy, buy, buy just like they tell me - Star Wars Trilogy on HD-DVD (to replace obsolete VHS, laserdisc, & DVD), $400 X360, $1000 widescreen tv, $30,000 Lexus, and $500,000 house.



And then I look, look, look at my credit card with its $10,000+ balance & my mortgage with $300,000 debt.

So I have to work, work, work 50-60 hours a week

And life sucks, sucks, sucks because all my shiny new things are collecting dust at home while I live in my little office cubicle at work.

I'm Having No Fun.


.

Is this the "great reward" of modern life? To go into debt buying stuff & then chain yourself to your job so you never see your home or your wife or your kids? I reject this "american dream" as an "american hell". This isn't happiness. This is just wasteful.

Buy stuff.
Work 50-60 hours to pay the stuff.
Have no life at home / never see your family.
Gradually grow old until you're too sick to work.
Retire in poverty 'cause you wasted all your money on stuff.
Die.

Pointless.

troy
 
I hear you. This is the plight of mankind. This is why many people, myself included, believe in an afterlife. But, you need to find things to do to break out of the monotony and make life special. Charity, creative projects, spontaneous acts of slight craziness, etc.

Just think of things that will make others say, "why the heck is he doing that?" that don't involve injury to yourself or others.
 
I knew someone would talk about an afterlife. That's fine if you believe in that, but I do not. To me, you might as well be discussing santa claus & easter bunnies.

For me, THIS is the only life you get. About 80 years and that's it.

We should make the most of it.

troy
 
Sounds like you've got a pretty sweet thing going on. I work those kind of hours, too, but not to pay for a widescreen HDTV, a Lexus and a $500,000 house. For me those hours buy heat, electricity, food, a modest car and home and not a whole lot else. And I know there are others working those kind of hours with less than me, so I try to be grateful for what I've got.

Don't think I'm taking shots at you, though- I'm not. I understand what you're talking about, and I've felt that way a lot myself. It's all about finding a balance between work and home life. If you lowered your standard of living even a little, you could probably get by working fewer hours, and put some of that time into your personal life and your family. Just because we live in a consumer society, you aren't actually obligated to buy every single new thing you see advertised somewhere. (I know you know that, I'm just saying a little restraint can go a long way toward a healthier budget)

Try looking at it this way. Our grandparents worked the kind of hours that make a 50 hour week sound like a vacation, usually under worse conditions than we work in, and they had less material possessions to show for it. Things aren't so bad. Hold off on that XBox 360 until it gets it's first price drop and call in sick for a few 3-day weekends in the meantime.
 
[quote name='shipwreck']Why do you need a $30,000 Lexus and a $500,000 house?[/QUOTE]

I DON'T. That's the point. We (americans/europeans) buy stuff that we do not need. And then we have to work long hours to pay off the debt (average american carries $9000 in credit card debt + >$50,000 home mortgage). So we have no life except Buy & Work, Buy & Work.

I've decided to reject that.



I'll buy the cheap $10,000 used car. Buy the small two-room house, not the mini-mansion. Don't buy Star Wars Trilogy... just skip it. REJECT the way other people live (in debt) and live simply. Cheaply. Less need to work.

:)

troy
 
life in a nutshell... you work your entire life just to be able to live... You finally retire and soon die because work was the only thing keeping you alive. Talk about a twist of irony.
 
[quote name='electrictroy']I DON'T. That's the point. We (americans/europeans) buy stuff that we do not need.

And then we have to work long hours to pay off the debt.

I've decided to reject that.

troy[/QUOTE]

Great, so stop complaining about it. Put your house on the market and by a more modest house. Pay off your debt and get on with your life.
 
[quote name='shipwreck']Great, so stop complaining about it. Put your house on the market and by a more modest house. Pay off your debt and get on with your life.[/QUOTE]

Well said. :applause::applause::applause:
 
[quote name='electrictroy']Buy Buy Buy - yell the commercials on the tv, radio, billboards. And so I buy, buy, buy just like they tell me - Star Wars Trilogy on HD-DVD (to replace obsolete VHS, laserdisc, & DVD), $400 X360, $1000 widescreen tv, $30,000 Lexus, and $500,000 house.



And then I look, look, look at my credit card with its $10,000+ balance & my mortgage with $300,000 debt.

So I have to work, work, work 50-60 hours a week

And life sucks, sucks, sucks because all my shiny new things are collecting dust at home while I live in my little office cubicle at work.

I'm Having No Fun.


.

Is this the "great reward" of modern life? To go into debt buying stuff & then chain yourself to your job so you never see your home or your wife or your kids? I reject this "american dream" as an "american hell". This isn't happiness. This is just wasteful.

Buy stuff.
Work 50-60 hours to pay the stuff.
Have no life at home / never see your family.
Gradually grow old until you're too sick to work.
Retire in poverty 'cause you wasted all your money on stuff.
Die.

Pointless.

troy[/QUOTE]

Sounds like someone needs an xbox 360.
 
I'll never understand why people complain when they are in debt from living above their means.

My mortgage? $0.. My car loan? $0.. My credit card bills? $100ish for gas this month. My student debt? $0.

Life become much easier when you buy what you can afford, not what you want and what you feel you need to be able to show off.
 
Please don't remind me on how much my life sucks. Let me enjoy my huge collection of DVD's, video games, and overtime paychecks until I'm old and grey. :)
 
[quote name='Cornfedwb']Life become much easier when you buy what you can afford, not what you want and what you feel you need to be able to show off.[/QUOTE]

Life is also much boring ;)
 
I totally agree with Cornfedwb!

Only buy what is within your means- and yes, you can still be jelous of people who can buy their 62 Inch DLP 1080p TV set with Cash (grins and gloats- friedram loves his DLP)

Perhaps eventually, if you picked the correct carreer path, or create a successful business you'll enjoy such neat toys.

Just remember- keep telling yourself-

1. I'm just like everyone else.
2. I can't afford that item, so while I really want it, I'm going to try to pretend that I don't.
3. I'm going to really hope that I can belive #2
4. If #3 successful, you'll be happy no mater what you do.

Me, I'm happy and my only debt is my house.
 
go for a corolla. if you think about it, with the prices on Priuses and other hybrid cars hiked up because idiots think it'll save them sooo much money in the long run, a cheap good mileage car will more than make up for having 10 to 20 MPG less than a hybrid. i drive a '96 Sable SW, and it goes through some gas. not on SUV levels, but it's still more than i want to pay. what's bull shit is my parents bought my *younger* sister a brand fucking new Saturn Ion with 30 mpg. i mean, talk about getting the shaft.
 
[quote name='pimp tyranny']go for a corolla. if you think about it, with the prices on Priuses and other hybrid cars hiked up because idiots think it'll save them sooo much money in the long run, a cheap good mileage car will more than make up for having 10 to 20 MPG less than a hybrid. i drive a '96 Sable SW, and it goes through some gas. not on SUV levels, but it's still more than i want to pay. what's bull shit is my parents bought my *younger* sister a brand fucking new Saturn Ion with 30 mpg. i mean, talk about getting the shaft.[/QUOTE]

Believe it or not your parents don't owe you anything, much less a car. If they wanted to buy your sister a brand new BMW M8 and bought you a 89 Bonneville you should be damn happy to get a free car.

Oh yes, this is from experience, my parents never bought me a car, but since they were more affluent as they aged, my three younger sisters all got cars as gifts.
 
[quote name='pimp tyranny']Priuses and other hybrid cars hiked up because idiots think it'll save them sooo much money in the long run, a cheap good mileage car will more than make up for having 10 to 20 MPG less than a hybrid. [/QUOTE]


True. People are dumb. "Oooo, look, I'm saving $5 a month with my Prius."
- Yeah and how much are you wasting in interest payments?
"Er... $50 a month."
- So your net loss is $45 a month.

People look at the tiny gas savings & never even think about the ~$10.000 they're losing on the pricetag.

troy
 
To some people, using less gas is perhaps worth the $45 dollars a month. What's the external costs for all the pollution we put into the air? Perhaps $45 is a lot less than what your less efficient engine spews out there.
 
[quote name='pimp tyranny']what's bull shit is my parents bought my *younger* sister a brand fucking new Saturn Ion with 30 mpg. i mean, talk about getting the shaft.[/QUOTE]

Seriously, be grateful that they got you anything. A car is a car when its free.
 
[quote name='Cornfedwb']I'll never understand why people complain when they are in debt from living above their means.

My mortgage? $0.. My car loan? $0.. My credit card bills? $100ish for gas this month. My student debt? $0.

Life become much easier when you buy what you can afford, not what you want and what you feel you need to be able to show off.[/QUOTE]

This is all well and good, but most people can't afford to pay cash for a house and have no mortgage. Do you have a house or do you live in an apartment? If you live in an apartment, you can't be bragging about your non-existent $0 balance mortgage. I agree with you 100% about the CC debt though and to a certain extent about the car (similar situation with the house, but you CAN buy a cheaper car with cash much easier than a house).
 
this picture describes things best...
emo%20emu%20jared%20hindman.jpg



now, back on topic...theres always gonna be good days and bad days, period, money is one of those things that can be easily replaced, but easier to some than to others...i say just work hard, video games are gonna be around for a long time...work hard, make the big bucks, and when u get 2 that position where u can take a few days off with no sweat ;) then life'll be sweet
 
[quote name='chickenhawk']This is all well and good, but most people can't afford to pay cash for a house and have no mortgage. Do you have a house or do you live in an apartment? If you live in an apartment, you can't be bragging about your $0 balance mortgage. I agree with you 100% about the CC debt though and to a certain extent about the car (similar situation with the house, but you CAN buy a cheaper car with cash much easier than a house).[/QUOTE]

Yeah, it's definitely a rarity to be able to just pay cash for a house. I make a decent salary and there's no way that I could buy a house without having a mortgage payment.
 
Even if he is grateful to have a car, it's not good if his parents are playing favorites and giving his sister better stuff. It's a different story if his parents are just more rich now than they used to be.

Right, the key is to live within your means. This is a lot harder to do when women are involved. My ex was actually pretty good with money, but she would like to spend some on the dumbest crap.

One absurd thing is all these people who spend $10 every day at Starbucks. That's $300/month! $3,600/year! That by itself will pay for a decent retirement.
 
[quote name='Lister']To some people, using less gas is perhaps worth the $45 dollars a month [loss in interest payments]. What's the external costs for all the pollution we put into the air?[/QUOTE]
Perhaps but those costs don't affect my wallet. And even if I was concerned about the pollution, I wouldn't choose a Prius. I'd choose an Insight (burns 35% less gas).

[quote name='pimp tyranny']what's bull shit is my parents bought my *younger* sister a brand ing new Saturn Ion with 30 mpg. i mean, talk about getting the shaft.[/quote]
That sucks. What did they give you?

I arrived 18 years after my brother. But my parents always treated us equally in terms of dollars spent - to be fair.

troy
 
[quote name='chickenhawk']This is all well and good, but most people can't afford to pay cash for a house and have no mortgage. Do you have a house or do you live in an apartment? If you live in an apartment, you can't be bragging about your non-existent $0 balance mortgage. I agree with you 100% about the CC debt though and to a certain extent about the car (similar situation with the house, but you CAN buy a cheaper car with cash much easier than a house).[/QUOTE]

I'll agree most people need to carry a mortgage. Through various strokes of luck and hard work I managed to have quite a nest egg when I bought my house and managed to pay it off within three years.

However, if the OP bought a $200,000 house instead of a $500,000 house and a $10,000 car instead of a $30,000 car.. he wouldn't have to work 60 hours a week and wouldn't have to look forward to 40 more years of the same thing. There's nothing wrong with debt persay.. but there is something wrong when your entire life consists of trying to catch up with your debt from living beyond my means.

And one other point, if you're working that hard to pay off your debt.. you're not putting much money aside for retirement (9 times out of 10). By the time you work off your extravagent purchases its time to retire with nothing in the bank. By living within my means I've put 40% of my paycheck into an IRA account for the last four years, when it comes time to retire I will be able to easily continue the same life I hold while working.
 
40% of your paycheck, that's excellent. Many people who are smart with their cash can only swing 10-20%. It all depends on your salary, members of family, children (if any), etc.
 
Its one of the main reasons I'm begining to hate, NY. A 1 bedroom apt in Manhattan is around 500-800 grand. A 2bedroom 1 bathroom house on Long Island or Westchester 450-550 grand. I can't afford that, and I dont know anyone who can.

OK heres the deal anyone finds me a better paying job, I will buy them 3 brand new full price games of your choice, upon my hiring, offfer valid in the 48 continental US states
 
Cordfedwb is 100% correct - live frugally/minimally. Unfortunately less than 1% of americans actually live that way.

OK heres the deal anyone finds me a better paying job, I will buy them 3 brand new full price games of your choice, upon my hiring, offfer valid in the 48 continental US states

Better idea - find a similar job, paying slightly less, but in an area where housing only costs 200 grand. I've got a list of jobsearching headhunters if you want it. *Email* (not pm) me privately.

troy
 
[quote name='shipwreck']Why do you need a $30,000 Lexus and a $500,000 house?[/QUOTE]

This should answer your question OP. It's called living below your means. If you don't have the money or the mental fortitude to handle that kind of expenses then it's time to reevaluate your priorities and stop blaming and bitching. You don't need a $30K Lexus when a nice cheap Honda will suffice you. After all that's the purpose of a vehicle - to transport you from point A to point B. If it looks really nice, bonus points. You're not a race car driver so there isn't a big need to have a car that runs fast. Your only consideration is fuel economy. A $500K house is only a big deal if the only means of supporting it is your sole salary. Even if your wife has a job to supplement you, then it might still not be enough. You should have multiple streams of income to support any new venture. A $1K widescreen tv is useless. Economically, it's better to buy a digital projector as you can set it to whatever size you want and project it on a wall. Starting price? $700 and up. Any and all of your possessions should be sized up and categorized into 2 different types - assets or liabilities. Assets, by definition, are things you own that give you a ROI - return of investment or more (in other words getting the money you spent to buy the asset back and a little extra). If it doesn't, it's a liability. Your car isn't an asset... at least not to you. Nor is your house. Your car is a high end instant liability as its value automatically decreases the instant you buy it and drive it off the lot. Your house is the same way and doesn't become an asset until one of 2 things happen:

You rent out portions of your house to cover your mortgage & utilities and thus allowing you to essentially live in a free house.

or

You sell it above the amount covered by your loan & initial down payment.

Your Xbox360 is an instant liability since, like the car, it loses its value the instant you buy it. The resale value of an Xbox360 when it launches may be higher than the initial price paid but it is only a temporary effect due to unbalanced demand. So ONLY for that time period is an Xbox360 an asset. But, overall it is a liability.

So what ARE assets? Like I said, things that pay for themselves and more. An $500K 2-unit apartment complex you own whose mortgage/utilities/repairs are covered by your rent is an asset as you don't put any of your own money to build equity (value of ownership in an asset) in it. Your credit card is a sign of your fiscal responsibility. Your credit score is your new 'report card'. It gives those with high scores A's and thus are worthy of receiving more funds to further invest. If you can't manage it, then it's time to cut them up and start using a debit card so it'll keep you honest.

The reason you work 50-60 hours is that you aren't willing to take chances on yourself and use your head. Doing administrative work is tedious and most jobs have a tedious nature to them. People like to work hard but they never work smart. I only work about 20 hours but my real estate company (and when I say my company, I say that as the owner, not just an employee) earns enough that all of my personal needs are covered by it (and legally, to boot). If I had kids, I would have more than enough ample time to take care of them. I've set up more than a few trust funds for my many nieces, nephews, & godchildren for their college expenses with very little money out of my own pocket.

The American Dream is more than achiveable. The problem is that people aren't willing to do the due diligence to get there. If you don't have the skill, then go to college. Working full time? Go to night school. Kids? Go online. There really isn't an excuse for bitching anymore. What skills are necessary? Learn basic accounting procedures - you'll never need to go to that accountant again. Learn basic housing laws specifc to your state/county - you'll know what your rights are as a tenant (and as a landlord if you decide to become a property owner). That's it. Don't have time to learn those skills? Hire it out. You won't be able to know every statistic or arcane knowledge so it's good to have some hired guns. What are the most basic? A good lawyer, a good CPA (not an accountant), a good financial manager. They may even be the same person.

Think it can't be done? It can. Start a company and use the company to pay for all of them. Set up your own company and use it to pay for your lawyer, CPA, etc. Use it to pay for your car, your house, and any other things relevant to your company. Funny thing about America. For all the bitching ppl have about corporations and how evil they are, it never occurs to them to actual try and utilize it. It's actually quite easy to build one and maintain. But people are afraid of failing thanks to a little statistic about how 50% of businesses fail after 5 years. So what? It's as meaningless a statistic as 4 out of 5 people die each year. Statistically, there are as many people now than ever existed on the whole planet. Those mean nothing. That statistic is misleading as they don't include the other half. So what if 50% of businessees fail after 5 years? The half full portion of the glass says that 50% of businesses succeed after 5 years and continue to thrive. They also fail to mention that no one gets things right after the first time. So, if a business failed, there's never any mention of the particular entrepreneur starting up a new business and learning from the mistakes of old. How else could Donald Trump go bankrupt and still be a rich bitch? He's a crafty old fucker who knew to have more than one company so that if one breaks, the others could buy up its assets and start up a whole new one. Live, fail, learn, succeed. So stop bitching and get to work. You've got a lot to do.
 
[quote name='Cornfedwb']I'll agree most people need to carry a mortgage. Through various strokes of luck and hard work I managed to have quite a nest egg when I bought my house and managed to pay it off within three years.[/QUOTE]

I have a decent job i work between 45-50 hours a week. I cant even afford a 100,000 dollar home, its financally impossible for me. How you pulled that off is amazing.
 
Haha, if you want a cheap house, go to Alabama or Indiana. My grandma moved here to Florida and sold her TINY house on Long Island for around $300,000.
 
[quote name='Cornfedwb']I'll agree most people need to carry a mortgage. Through various strokes of luck and hard work I managed to have quite a nest egg when I bought my house and managed to pay it off within three years.

However, if the OP bought a $200,000 house instead of a $500,000 house and a $10,000 car instead of a $30,000 car.. he wouldn't have to work 60 hours a week and wouldn't have to look forward to 40 more years of the same thing. There's nothing wrong with debt persay.. but there is something wrong when your entire life consists of trying to catch up with your debt from living beyond my means.

And one other point, if you're working that hard to pay off your debt.. you're not putting much money aside for retirement (9 times out of 10). By the time you work off your extravagent purchases its time to retire with nothing in the bank. By living within my means I've put 40% of my paycheck into an IRA account for the last four years, when it comes time to retire I will be able to easily continue the same life I hold while working.[/QUOTE]

You are definitely an anomaly. Being able to invest 40% of your paycheck is impressive. I could certainly cut some costs, but at this time I would have no hope of putting that percentage aside. Of course, when our household income will double in a year and a half, we should be able to save more. Although student loans will come into play then.
 
[quote name='jaykrue']time to reevaluate your priorities and stop blaming and bitching. You don't need a $30K Lexus when a nice cheap Honda will suffice you. [/QUOTE]
strawman argument - I was bitching but I was NOT blaming anyone, except myself.


[quote name='jaykrue']The American Dream is more than achiveable. [/QUOTE]

You missed the point entirely. The American Dream (own lots of stuff) is NOT a worthwhile goal. There's no fulfillment there. It's empty.

troy
 
I've been thinking that for years. Thats why I don't work a minute over 40 hours and don't buy what I can't afford. Work isn't too bad. It keeps me busy, and if not, allows me to post on CAG or otherwise dick off on the net. I bring home about 1400 a month and my bills are about 1000. I'm slowly building up money for stuff I may want later. At this point, its looking like it'll be a new car because the fuel pump on my current one is shot. After the alternator and AC died and tire went flat. However, I only paid $1000 for it and its lasted about a year so far. I also owe about 30k on student loans. Sure it can suck, but its generally worth it when I get home and my gf tackles me.
 
[quote name='shipwreck']You are definitely an anomaly. Being able to invest 40% of your paycheck is impressive. I could certainly cut some costs, but at this time I would have no hope of putting that percentage aside. Of course, when our household income will double in a year and a half, we should be able to save more. Although student loans will come into play then.[/QUOTE]

There's always a way. You just might not know about it. Try doing this experiment. It works only for those who have direct deposit. Set up a zero balance checking account. This account you only check every 6 months. If you go to your accounting department of your company (or whichever department handles your salary) tell them to separate a portion of your weekly, monthly, whatever check aside for this checking account. Use a portion that you could theoretically handle taking a hit, say maybe $50. It might be high for you part-timers but quite low for a regular office wage slave. After all the paperwork is done, FORGET ABOUT THAT CHECKING ACCOUNT. Resist the temptation to see what's in it. If you remember it 6 months later, check out how much money you 'forgot' was there. You'd be surprised how much money you could actually save by simply 'forgetting' about it. The absurd thing is that it keeps accumulating if you don't check it within year. I remember doing this experiment and I ended up having a cool $7K that I 'forgot' about. :cool: I took 10% of it and rewarded myself for my 'forgetfulness' and put the rest in an interest bearing account and just forgot about it again. It just sits there as my salary just keeps pumping money into it. It's been a year since I lasted checked it. It's probably about time to do so again.
 
worth it when I get home and my gf tackles me
That is the true American dream. It's great to get home from work and have a girl jump all over you. :D

Kayden, saving $400 a month is pretty good man. And getting a year out of a thousand dollar car is great.

I've moved three times in the past few years, and this has created a desire in me to not buy loads of useless stuff because it is a pain in the ass to pack and move, haha.

To learn more about jaycrue's advice, read The Automatic Millionaire.
 
[quote name='jaykrue']There's always a way. You just might not know about it. Try doing this experiment. It works only for those who have direct deposit. Set up a zero balance checking account. This account you only check every 6 months. If you go to your accounting department of your company (or whichever department handles your salary) tell them to separate a portion of your weekly, monthly, whatever check aside for this checking account. Use a portion that you could theoretically handle taking a hit, say maybe $50. It might be high for you part-timers but quite low for a regular office wage slave. After all the paperwork is done, FORGET ABOUT THAT CHECKING ACCOUNT. Resist the temptation to see what's in it. If you remember it 6 months later, check out how much money you 'forgot' was there. You'd be surprised how much money you could actually save by simply 'forgetting' about it. The absurd thing is that it keeps accumulating if you don't check it within year. I remember doing this experiment and I ended up having a cool $7K that I 'forgot' about. :cool: I took 10% of it and rewarded myself for my 'forgetfulness' and put the rest in an interest bearing account and just forgot about it again. It just sits there as my salary just keeps pumping money into it. It's been a year since I lasted checked it. It's probably about time to do so again.[/QUOTE]

$50 does not equal 40% of my salary. I'm easily able to save $50 a month, and I'm putting 10% of my salary into my 401K right now. It was the thought of trying to up that another 30% that is unreachable for just about everyone. Not having a mortgage payment would definitely make that doable though.
 
[quote name='shipwreck']$50 does not equal 40% of my salary. I'm easily able to save $50 a month, and I'm putting 10% of my salary into my 401K right now. It was the thought of trying to up that another 30% that is unreachable for just about everyone. Not having a mortgage payment would definitely make that doable though.[/QUOTE]

No mortgage.. well no debt at all actually and no children atm makes it quite a lot easier. I do realize when my wife and I do have children as we want to do soon the percentage of savings will drop, that is one of the reasons I crimp to save as much as possible right now.

Even if my savings drop to 5-10%, provided a moderate rate of return on my savings, I should be able to retire without a single worry. Saving as much as you can as early as you can is the key.
 
[quote name='electrictroy']You missed the point entirely. The American Dream (own lots of stuff) is NOT a worthwhile goal. There's no fulfillment there. It's empty.

troy[/QUOTE]

It's only empty if you haven't found spiritual contentment. I have all the toys I want but I temper it with an attitude that says, if I lost it all today, it wouldn't matter, because I have my mind which is my most precious asset. I can always buy more toys but, if I lost my mind & memories, I'd be most upset. It doesn't have to come from a religion or fulfillment from possession of material things. Have a goal. When people work, they only do so simply to live. They don't work to strive for a higher purpose. Me? I have a company which provides homes, jobs, salaries, med. insurance, etc. My company donates to charity every year without fail and employees are able to set up trust funds for their own kids with some guidance from my accounting/law division. It's not a big company but its yearly profits help provide for all those things. I don't see myself as a savior but I think that helping ppl out gives me a sense of self-satisfaction.
 
[quote name='shipwreck']$50 does not equal 40% of my salary. I'm easily able to save $50 a month, and I'm putting 10% of my salary into my 401K right now. It was the thought of trying to up that another 30% that is unreachable for just about everyone. Not having a mortgage payment would definitely make that doable though.[/QUOTE]

I'm saying do that in addition to whatever investments you have now. How much of a financial hit in the pocket can you take consistently which you could forget about. If $50 is too small for you try seeing if you could live without an extra $200 a month then. Set it and forget it as those infomercials say.
 
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