SqaureEnix Overpricing on Portables

Jesse_Dylan

Jesse_Dylan

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As if the price tags of $59.99 for PS3 and 360 games weren't bad enough, when it comes to PSP and DS, we have to shell out $39.99 if we want to buy a SquareEnix game when it first comes out, and price drops and deals are hard to find.

The average price for a DS game is $29.99. Some even launch at $24.99 or $19.99. I believe PSP titles are similarly priced. SquareEnix titles, unfortunately, launch at $39.99 on both systems.

Do they do this simply because they can?

Not only did I pre-order Dragon Quest IV at this price-point, I bought two copies of Final Fantasy IV--one in Japanese last year, one in English this year--, a copy of FF Tactics A2... I think I bought FF Tactics on PSP at this price as well. (A few games, Front Mission and The World Ends with You, I've managed to get at reduced prices.)

So I'm supporting it, out of desperation.

Depressing. I can't afford this, and it really offends my cheapness.

At $29.99, a lot of their games would be instant pre-orders. At $39.99, I still pre-order them from time to time, and I'm upset at myself for it. And upset at them.

But I guess that's the biz.

CAGs, please counsel me.
 
[quote name='EXStrike']PSP games start at 39.99 usually, IIRC.[/quote]
When the PSP launched, most games were sold at that price, but now the vast majority tend to start out around 35.
 
Don't they put more into the games they put out on DS. I don't know, but you can always find a deal if you wait a bit. I just got FFIV for $15
 
Yeah, it's ridiculous.

I thought about buying TWENY for a plane trip last month as I'd finished my work/reading on the flight out, but for $40 I just couldn't do it. $30 and I'd have bought it.
 
There's a lot of games for DS that retail for $34.99. I don't think the $5 difference is that much a problem. I would feel a bit ripped off if DS games ranged from $20-$35 and SquareEnix decided to charge $45-$50 for their DS games.

But Akilshohen is right, they can be eventually found for cheap AND they tend to put out a lot of titles.
One day we'll get that Super Mario RPG port.. :drool:
 
[quote name='akilshohen']Don't they put more into the games they put out on DS. I don't know, but you can always find a deal if you wait a bit. I just got FFIV for $15[/QUOTE]Well, they do order high storage space cartridges from Nintendo, so I'm betting that's part of the reason. Also, Square Enix prices their Japanese games very high too (I believe FF games have cost almost or over 8000 yen before, compared to 6800 yen for most games).
 
I've tried to get deals on them... b2g1 free, the BML deal... getting them used complete...

I think ... wasn't FF3 only 30? or am I mistaken... that one could be the only one I didn't actually wait to get a deal on.

oh and Luminious Arc 2 is retailing for 39.99 so it's not Squeenix doing it only now.... More than likely the voice over work and the story work with long large rpg on the more expensive cart is the deal with the pricing. I could see more games coming out at 40... but don't. seems like the ones that try to start at 35 like pokemon.... they can get away with it because of the insanity gotta catch them all....

I always try to hunt for a deal for those... makes it really worth it not having to pay retail.
 
[quote name='The Mana Knight']Well, they do order high storage space cartridges from Nintendo, so I'm betting that's part of the reason. Also, Square Enix prices their Japanese games very high too (I believe FF games have cost almost or over 8000 yen before, compared to 6800 yen for most games).[/quote]

That was FFXII. It sold for 8990 yen. Pretty crazy and I don't even think that was a collector's edition or anything.

Square Enix games tend to hold their value really well. The sales from even the most lackluster games aren't terrible enough to make them lower prices. I think it's hard for fans to say no to SE games since they don't intentionally oversaturate the market (per system anyway).
 
if it's too expensive don't buy it.

problem solved.

if enough people don't buy them for $40, they'll stop pricing them that way. the demand dictates the market. even at $40, TWEWY was really hard to find for a while.

FF3 dropped to $20 after about a year. i got it on goozex for the equiv. of about $13-15 in goozex points(and it's a FINE game, BTW)

i don't see a problem here. just an annoyance.

heck,.. i could name a bunch of $30 games that are over in 6 or 7 hours... at least with a FF game, you know you're getting at least double or triple the play time out of it...
 
the games that Square Enix is re releasing for $40 were $50 in the 90's when they first were released. the value of the dollar has only gone down due to inflation, so these games are a value for those who never played them. I know this sounds smug, but historical perspective can shed light on current events.
 
When it comes to paying the Square-Enix tax, I try not to buy their games at launch.

Wait until they go on sale for $10 off (CC had TWEWY at that price one week after launch). Personally, I caved on FFTA2....but 180+ hours later, I can't complain about doing it.
 
and the thing is most CAGers are willing to pay full price for them. go check the FFIV, TWEWY, or Chrono Trigger topics to see people happily paying $40 for a DS game
 
[quote name='Jesse_Dylan'] Do they do this simply because they can?[/QUOTE]

Yes, they do it becase of the following.

[quote name='Jesse_Dylan'] Not only did I pre-order Dragon Quest IV at this price-point, I bought two copies of Final Fantasy IV--one in Japanese last year, one in English this year--, a copy of FF Tactics A2... I think I bought FF Tactics on PSP at this price as well. (A few games, Front Mission and The World Ends with You, I've managed to get at reduced prices.) [/QUOTE]

You've told them you don't care what the price is, as long as Square Enix is on the box you're buying it.
 
[quote name='Chacrana']A lot of Square's stuff is at least $10 better than the majority of DS offerings, so I can deal with it.[/quote]

Yeah, considering how much bang for your buck that SquareEnix offers compared to the crap other companies have shoveled on the DS, it's worth the extra money.

If you don't like paying extra for a game, then don't buy it. It's not like a Square-Enix employee is going to come to your house, point a gun at your head and force you to buy their game(or are they? :whistle2:k).
 
Yeah I was also bucked that the games are 40 bucks but they do drop rather quickly

And it doesn't matter how much they "put into it" they aren't original games anyway
 
[quote name='aknowlesjr']the games that Square Enix is re releasing for $40 were $50 in the 90's when they first were released. the value of the dollar has only gone down due to inflation, so these games are a value for those who never played them. I know this sounds smug, but historical perspective can shed light on current events.[/QUOTE]Actually, their SNES games at times cost $70 in the early 90's. $40 seems VERY cheap compared to that IMO.
 
PSP games actually started at $49.99. DS games from Nintendo are $34.99 usually. So Square Enix thinks their games are better than Nintendo games. Which I disagree with. I bought FFIII for $40 and TWEWY for $40. I think TWEWY is a far better buy at $40 than FF remakes.

If Square could get away with it, they'd charge $70 for 360/PS3 games and $60 for Wii games.
 
[quote name='KingBroly']PSP games actually started at $49.99. DS games from Nintendo are $34.99 usually. So Square Enix thinks their games are better than Nintendo games. Which I disagree with. I bought FFIII for $40 and TWEWY for $40. I think TWEWY is a far better buy at $40 than FF remakes.

If Square could get away with it, they'd charge $70 for 360/PS3 games and $60 for Wii games.[/QUOTE]

Now most psp games cost $29.99 with the exception of Square enix games. Nintendo DS games like Mario Party DS and Advance War Days of Ruin cost $29.99. Only Pokemon games cost $34.99 from nintendo.

Square did try to charge extra by only allowing people to preorder the Special Edition of FF12 at gamestop.

Now if only Square Enix decide to nickle and dime us with the internationa/final mix version of Final Fantasy and Kingdom Hearts games. I am sure most people wont have a problem with that.
 
[quote name='lilboo']One day we'll get that Super Mario RPG port.. :drool:[/quote]
...Didn't you JUST get done nabbing SMRPG on the VC? Does your Valentina lust know no bounds?
 
[quote name='smoger']if it's too expensive don't buy it.

problem solved.

if enough people don't buy them for $40, they'll stop pricing them that way. the demand dictates the market. even at $40, TWEWY was really hard to find for a while.

FF3 dropped to $20 after about a year. i got it on goozex for the equiv. of about $13-15 in goozex points(and it's a FINE game, BTW)

i don't see a problem here. just an annoyance.

heck,.. i could name a bunch of $30 games that are over in 6 or 7 hours... at least with a FF game, you know you're getting at least double or triple the play time out of it...[/quote]

Winnar winnar chicken dinnar.

This thread is really pathetic. The OP basically boils down to 'I'm broke as shit but I can't stop buying videogames!' How many of these have actually been fully completed? Just be glad you have the time and spare cash to actually afford such a horrible horrible fate.
 
Yeah the pricing is annoying, but I don't mind paying extra if its worth it, like for TWEWY, and for the updated FFIV (DS).

However I think it's a bit much charging $40 on a port like Chrono Trigger(DS) especially since it came out on the ps1, with FFIV so you are at least getting two games there.
 
[quote name='cochesecochese']Winnar winnar chicken dinnar.

This thread is really pathetic. The OP basically boils down to 'I'm broke as shit but I can't stop buying videogames!' How many of these have actually been fully completed? Just be glad you have the time and spare cash to actually afford such a horrible horrible fate.[/quote]

Well you get the jerk of the week award.

God forbid I make conversation about the state of the games industry we love.

Maybe games should just be $100 each, and we could be thankful that we have the time and money to spend upon such extravagance.
 
Am I the only one here that never pays full price for a Squareenix game anymore? They are one of the few companies where I know for sure the price will drop eventually so I just wait. It may take a year or two but I have plenty of games in my backlog to play.
 
[quote name='62t']Now most psp games cost $29.99 with the exception of Square enix games. Nintendo DS games like Mario Party DS and Advance War Days of Ruin cost $29.99. Only Pokemon games cost $34.99 from nintendo.

Square did try to charge extra by only allowing people to preorder the Special Edition of FF12 at gamestop.

Now if only Square Enix decide to nickle and dime us with the internationa/final mix version of Final Fantasy and Kingdom Hearts games. I am sure most people wont have a problem with that.[/quote]

New Super Mario Bros., Zelda, MPH, SM64DS, and Mario Kart DS came out at, and some still are $34.99.
 
[quote name='KingBroly']New Super Mario Bros., Zelda, MPH, SM64DS, and Mario Kart DS came out at, and some still are $34.99.[/QUOTE]

SM64 was $29.99
 
[quote name='Jesse_Dylan']Well you get the jerk of the week award.

God forbid I make conversation about the state of the games industry we love.

Maybe games should just be $100 each, and we could be thankful that we have the time and money to spend upon such extravagance.[/quote]

That didn't answer my question.
 
Wait a minute. I thought I was at www.cheapassgamer.com or did I accidentally type in www.ibuygamesatreleaseforfullprice.ijustcannotstopmyself.com?

SquareEnix tends to use larger amounts of ROM capacity, thus higher prices at time of release. They also have very high production values making for greater development costs. So it isn't as if the value isn't there.

If you find this cost too great for your then don't buy the damn thing when it first comes out. Same as any other game. It's one of the core tenets of being a Cheap Ass Gamer. I can count all of the games I bought at release in twent-five years while keeping one shoe on. (The extra toes really help there.)

This cannot be overemphasized. Unless you're getting a special deal, do not buy newly released games. It is a self-destructive urge to be overcome, just like overeating, gambling, or letting yourself promise a spouse you'll look through a book of fabric swatches. You have to gird your loins (it's better to have that spouse do stuff to your loins but she's still pissed about your disinterest in interior design) and take a firm stand against newly released games with their high prices.
 
[quote name='epobirs']

SquareEnix tends to use larger amounts of ROM capacity, thus higher prices at time of release. They also have very high production values making for greater development costs. So it isn't as if the value isn't there.

[/QUOTE]

Do explain how anyone can charge $40 for the port of a SNES game? There other publisher with games that have high production but no one else is charging $40
 
[quote name='62t']Do explain how anyone can charge $40 for the port of a SNES game? There other publisher with games that have high production but no one else is charging $40[/QUOTE]

Can you point to a specific game? The SquareEnix titles of yore that have been newly released on the DS have been substantially overhauled with entirely new graphics and additional gameplay elements. These are a big contributor to the high ROM capacity needs as compared to the straight ports that graced the GBA, often of the same games.

It isn't clear from their site what changes, if any, are being applied to the upcoming Chrono Trigger but FFIII and FFIV certainly had a far greater investment than a simple port.

And there is another reason.

They charge $40 because they can get it.

Build a reputation for being the definers of a genre and you can price your products at the high end as well. But if you cannot trade on a high reputation well earned, you'll have to try to make it up in volume.

And lets not hear any whining about having already bought the game at full price before back when it first appeared for console X. The primary audience for a game like the DS FFIV wasn't even born when the SNES version was in stores. That there are adults who'll pay good money to play it again years later is just icing on the cake for the publisher and Nintendo.
 
[quote name='epobirs']Can you point to a specific game? [/QUOTE]

refer to my post chrono trigger DS
 
[quote name='magus83']refer to my post chrono trigger DS[/quote]

Dude, come on. He addressed Chrono Trigger literally two sentences later into his post.
 
[quote name='cochesecochese']Dude, come on. He addressed Chrono Trigger literally two sentences later into his post.[/QUOTE]

Doh yeah, sorry bout that. That's what I get for posting when its late and I'm half asleep. Ugh my bad.

Just annoyed at the pricing for the game, since they could have released it on VC. And without any graphical improvements, like FF3, FF4 most gamers who grew up on 3d games will most likely not play it since its graphics suck to them.
 
Most big name PSP titles retail for $40. God of War, Portable Ops, the GTA games...all of those retailed for $40. So, on the PSP, SquareEnix is right inline with everyone else. I am not too familiar with the DS pricing scheme, but looking at a few websites, I notice most of the big titles, like Mario and Zelda stuff, is $35. I know if I did own a DS, I would gladly pay an extra $5 for the FFIV remake.
 
[quote name='epobirs']Can you point to a specific game? The SquareEnix titles of yore that have been newly released on the DS have been substantially overhauled with entirely new graphics and additional gameplay elements. These are a big contributor to the high ROM capacity needs as compared to the straight ports that graced the GBA, often of the same games.

It isn't clear from their site what changes, if any, are being applied to the upcoming Chrono Trigger but FFIII and FFIV certainly had a far greater investment than a simple port.
[/QUOTE]

I was referring to Chrono Trigger. Before you mention things like extra dungeon, the port is likely made by TOSE. If you want to refer to rom size again Bleach DS had one of the latest rom for a ds game and Sega charged $29.99. Like I said before there are other games with high production value and large rom but no other game is over $34.99

[quote name='epobirs']
And there is another reason.

They charge $40 because they can get it.
[/QUOTE]

That was exactly my main point. It has nothing to do with production value or rom size.

[quote name='epobirs']
Build a reputation for being the definers of a genre and you can price your products at the high end as well. But if you cannot trade on a high reputation well earned, you'll have to try to make it up in volume.

And lets not hear any whining about having already bought the game at full price before back when it first appeared for console X. The primary audience for a game like the DS FFIV wasn't even born when the SNES version was in stores. That there are adults who'll pay good money to play it again years later is just icing on the cake for the publisher and Nintendo.[/QUOTE]
This having nothing to do with charging $40. Full price for a DS game from other publishers are $29.99-34.99
 
I don't really mind it. It's only a five dollar increase, and the games are generally worth it. Shit, I payed like 55 to import Bleach Ds from Play Asia way back when.
 
[quote name='epobirs']
Build a reputation for being the definers of a genre and you can price your products at the high end as well. But if you cannot trade on a high reputation well earned, you'll have to try to make it up in volume.
[/quote]

Nintendo has defined multiple genres but even they aren't pricing their games like SE has.

The OP has a fair point. To the people that tell us to stop buying: We've stopped. I want to bitch because their output is so darn good. I really want to play TWEWY.

Nearly half of all my GBA games were published by SE but absolutely none in my collection are for the DS. Crisis Core and FFT are sure to make GH anyway, so PSP users should be okay.
 
because they are extremely high budget games worth the $40 in comparison to some DS crap which is $19.99 and lasts 2 hours and is a shell of a real game?

Lots of wii games launch at $29, $39 and $49.

and all good PSP games are $40 the crappy ones launch for $30 as well.
 
[quote name='DQT']Nintendo has defined multiple genres but even they aren't pricing their games like SE has.

The OP has a fair point. To the people that tell us to stop buying: We've stopped. I want to bitch because their output is so darn good. I really want to play TWEWY.

Nearly half of all my GBA games were published by SE but absolutely none in my collection are for the DS. Crisis Core and FFT are sure to make GH anyway, so PSP users should be okay.[/QUOTE]

Nintendo has lower costs in two areas where SE does not. First, Nintendo doesn't charge themselves at profitable rates for ROM production. Actually, they do but just for accounting purposes. The money is going right back to them so it doesn't burden the cost of the retail package as it does for third parties.

Second, Nintendo doesn't charge itself the royalty fee, over and above the ROM manufacturing fees, it charges to third party publishers.

These two factors allow Nintendo to bring games to market at a lower retail price than third party games of the same physical properties. It has been this way on every mask ROM platform Nintendo has produced, so this is hardly a new complaint.

Mario 64 for the DS was lower than average priced but it was also on the small side in ROM usage. The N64 version was just 64 Mb and by the end of the N64's mainstream career was smaller than all but a handful of other carts, which mostly tended to be in the 96-128 Mb range. (Tetrisphere, IIRC, was only 32 Mb.) This is a repeating pattern for cartridge based systems. The early greats are tiny ROMs in the long run. Take Super Mario World on the SNES, for instance. A mere 4 Mb but still great.

Sidetrack: One reason I didn't think it a necessarily bad thing that the original XBLA requirements were so restrictive on size is that there was an inspirational challenge for developers to work within those limits.
 
[quote name='62t']I was referring to Chrono Trigger. Before you mention things like extra dungeon, the port is likely made by TOSE. If you want to refer to rom size again Bleach DS had one of the latest rom for a ds game and Sega charged $29.99. Like I said before there are other games with high production value and large rom but no other game is over $34.99



That was exactly my main point. It has nothing to do with production value or rom size.


This having nothing to do with charging $40. Full price for a DS game from other publishers are $29.99-34.99[/QUOTE]

A quick scan produced a few exceptions. One, an upcoming Tony Hawk includes a tilt sensor that goes in the GBA slot, IIRC, and so its price is easily explained.

The other, Luminous Arc 2 from Atlas, is another $40 game but the most likely explanation one that was common in the SNES days: small production run. Unlike optical media, producing small runs of carts is more costly. This mainly due to the cost for initiating the mask. The more carts you produce the more spread out that cost can be. Companies like Koei had very pricey SNES games due to this rather than the amount of ROM capacity used.

Atlus' site for the game indicates they're doing a deluxe package with lots of extras like a soundtrack CD, so the fans will be unlikely to complain much.

It beats the old days, when Square abandoned the US market rather than offer their games at any price. FFV was fully translate and ready for production when they pulled the plug. Later, after FFVI had done fairly well, they said they were thinking about releasing FFV as a non-FF game to avoid confusion over it being an obviously less sophisticated product. But it never happened. We instead had to wait for FFV to finally appear many years later on the PS1, by which point it held much less interest as a console item.
 
Their pricing still isn't justified. You can argue for Nintendo, but what about Gamecock and Tecmo? Ninja Gaiden DS and Dementium were both much more graphically sophisticated games than say, FFTA2 which reused sprites from a GBA game.

Luminous Arc 2 comes with a free soundtrack. That's why Atlus is charging more.
 
[quote name='epobirs']

Sidetrack: One reason I didn't think it a necessarily bad thing that the original XBLA requirements were so restrictive on size is that there was an inspirational challenge for developers to work within those limits.[/QUOTE]


The XBLA limit was okay in the beginning as they were mostly small games. However to over come the limit the developer had to cut out stuff, such as Castlevnia's movies. With games like SF HD the since limit will just hinder what developers can do. Now it made less sense when 1. Xbox Originals are several GB. 2. Sony does not have any size limit.

[quote name='epobirs']A quick scan produced a few exceptions. One, an upcoming Tony Hawk includes a tilt sensor that goes in the GBA slot, IIRC, and so its price is easily explained.

The other, Luminous Arc 2 from Atlas, is another $40 game but the most likely explanation one that was common in the SNES days: small production run. Unlike optical media, producing small runs of carts is more costly. This mainly due to the cost for initiating the mask. The more carts you produce the more spread out that cost can be. Companies like Koei had very pricey SNES games due to this rather than the amount of ROM capacity used.

Atlus' site for the game indicates they're doing a deluxe package with lots of extras like a soundtrack CD, so the fans will be unlikely to complain much.

It beats the old days, when Square abandoned the US market rather than offer their games at any price. FFV was fully translate and ready for production when they pulled the plug. Later, after FFVI had done fairly well, they said they were thinking about releasing FFV as a non-FF game to avoid confusion over it being an obviously less sophisticated product. But it never happened. We instead had to wait for FFV to finally appear many years later on the PS1, by which point it held much less interest as a console item.[/QUOTE]

That really doesnt explain why Sega was able to released Bleach DS, a 128 MB rom card game, at $29.99. None of the Squaresoft games use a bigger card than that. So far the only game that even uses the 256mb card is nintendo with the upcoming ASH. Manufacturing cost is not the reason for the higher price.

Square is a lot better at releasing games but a lot of people would wish they release the final mix/international version of KH and FF
 
[quote name='62t']
That really doesnt explain why Sega was able to released Bleach DS, a 128 MB rom card game, at $29.99. None of the Squaresoft games use a bigger card than that. [/QUOTE]

If you really think the development costs for a fighting game are the same for RPGs, then no one can help you escape. No one.
 
[quote name='Strell']If you really think the development costs for a fighting game are the same for RPGs, then no one can help you escape. No one.[/QUOTE]

Um we were talking about the manufacturing cost, which I explained shouldnt be a factor in the higher cost.

Even if you do you want to talking developing cost for Bleach DS, it is made by Treasure, one of the most respected developer (at least a bigger name than Jupiter for TWEWY and Matrix for FFIV). Also there is the licensing fees, anime voice acting, etc. The game also has high quality sprites that take a lot of time to make.
 
Oh, so this is one of those things where we discard certain elements to make a point for less significant one?

You don't think those RPGs have a lot more artistic material to use? Every enemy, every item, every spell, every animation, every little thing that has an incredible amount of detail and time and attention attributed to them? Easily trumps a fighting game in terms of production costs. Isn't TWEWY sprite based? Sure looks like it to me.

Not to mention the whole....having to make everything up instead of having an entire universe already handed to you to work with. Sure that'll bring licensing fees, but those still don't hold candles.
 
Sprite - the sprites in a fighting game is bigger more detail than RPG. Plus a lot of sprite get use multiple times in a RPG.
Story - the director/Event direction do that for square. More work maybe but the salary of those people are not going to be more expensive than an established license.

Funny you changed from the subject of manufacturing cost to development cost to amount of work involved. I am not here to go into debate the development cost but to point out Bleach DS wasnt a cheap game due to licensing fee and Treasure's involvement.

I brought up Bleach DS not because development cost or amount of work involved but about manufacturing cost which was used to explain why SE's game cost $10 more.
 
I never said a thing about manufacturing costs. You have me confused with someone else. I can't change the subject when I've only had one to begin with.

You're the one throwing out various factors in how much a game costs for the sake of "oh gee the size of the carts is what really matters here."

How do you know manufacturing costs don't go down as time passes on? Memory gets cheaper every day. You can buy USB drives of X size for Y price, and in a month it's 10% cheaper. DS cards from waht I know are based on SD cards, and if that's the case, then doubling the memory between cards wouldn't make the price skyrocket. This would effectively make the manufacturing cost associated with memory size almost negligible over time. Seems like a pretty weak reason to base an entire argument on.
 
[quote name='DQT']To the people that tell us to stop buying: We've stopped.[/QUOTE]
QFT. TWEWY was the last S-E DS game I bought at full price, and if they keep up their $40-even-for-ports pricing scheme, I won't be buying any more. I have more than enough games in my backlog to wait for sales/price drops on FFTA2 and the like.

[quote name='DQT']I want to bitch because their output is so darn good.[/QUOTE]
Then do so. Hasn't stopped me ;)
 
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