Wait, You Don't Mean.... Amnesty International, LIES?

PittsburghAfterDark

PittsburghAfterDark

CAGiversary!
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Despite highly publicized charges of U.S. mistreatment of prisoners at Guantanamo, the head of the Amnesty International USA said on Sunday the group doesn't "know for sure" that the military is running a "gulag."

Executive Director William Schulz said Amnesty, often cited worldwide for documenting human rights abuses, also had no information about whether Secretary Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld approved severe torture methods such as beatings and starvation.

Schulz recently dubbed Rumsfeld an "apparent high-level architect of torture" in asserting he approved interrogation methods that violated international law.

"It would be fascinating to find out. I have no idea," Schulz told "Fox News Sunday."

A weeks-long dispute has raged since Amnesty compared the prison for foreign terrorism suspects at the U.S. naval base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, to the vast, brutal Soviet gulag system of forced labor camps in which millions of prisoners died.

There have been a number of accusations of American mistreatment of the detainees and of the Koran, the Islamic holy book, at the base.

The U.S. military on Friday released details about five cases in which the Koran was kicked, stepped on and soaked in water. Top officials say they were among 10 such cases reported among more than 28,000 prisoner interrogations.

Schulz said, "We don't know for sure what all is happening at Guantanamo and our whole point is that the United States ought to allow independent human rights organizations to investigate."

He also said he had "absolutely no idea" whether the International Red Cross had been given access to all prisoners and said the group feared others were being held at secret facilities or locations.

President Bush, Vice President Dick Cheney and, most recently, Rumsfeld have repudiated the report with the defense secretary branding it "reprehensible."

The United States holds about 520 men at Guantanamo, where they are denied rights accorded under international law to prisoners of war. Many have been held without charge for more than three years.

Schulz noted that it was Amnesty's headquarters in London that issued the annual report on global human rights, which said Guantanamo Bay "has become the gulag of our times."

Asked about the comparison, Schulz said, "Clearly this is not an exact or a literal analogy."

"... But there are some similarities. The United States is maintaining an archipelago of prisons around the world, many of them secret prisons into which people are being literally disappeared ... And in some cases, at least, we know that they are being mistreated, abused, tortured and even killed."

"And whether the Americans like it or not, it does reflect how the more than 2 million Amnesty members in a hundred countries around the world and indeed the vast majority of those countries feel about the United States' detention policy," he added.
Link

You mean a left wing, America hating group made up claims to further their political agenda with no proof? So, which faxed memo from Dr. Dean did they publish to come to these conclusions?
 
apparent high-level architect of torture
Click to expand...

Last I knew apparent often meant "seems like" but not definate. Also, no one though they meant "gulag" as an exact comparison to soviets, but as more of an emotional term.

Though, we only hate them when they turn on us, we love their reports when they're against saddam, gadaffi etc.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']Last I knew apparent often meant "seems like" but not definate. Also, no one though they meant "gulag" as an exact comparison to soviets, but as more of an emotional term.
[/QUOTE]

Last I knew it wasn't necessary to make a nuanced difference between the US and the old USSR.

Unless you wanter to make that comparison.

But I guess you will be ok with PAD making an "emotional" comment next time about extermist Islam?

After all, PAD doesn't run an international comission on human rights.

He posts on a message board.

Do you see the nuanced distinction I am making?

CTL
 
Q: Mr. Secretary, do you know why is it that there isn't a whole lot of evidence of Iraqis coming out in support of [inaudible]?

Rumsfeld: I do. Uday Hussein, the oldest son of Saddam Hussein heads up an outfit that they call the Fedayeen Saddam. In fact what they are is death squads, enforcers. What they do is, there's probably somewhere between 5,000 and 20,000 of them in the country. They go into the cities and shoot people and threaten people and insist that they not surrender and not rise up. They're vicious. They left somebody in the center of Baghdad not too long ago with his tongue pulled out until he bled to death, cut his tongue out. And they're shooting, executing people in Basra.

Q: [inaudible]

Rumsfeld: Who knows? I don't know how many there are now. Why would I have an expectation?

Q: Well they are having a larger effect --

Rumsfeld: I don't know that they're having a larger effect. We know that it's a repressive regime. Everyone in the world knows that. It's been that way for decades.

Anyone who has read Amnesty International or any of the human rights organizations about how the regime of Saddam Hussein treats his people, heck he used chemicals on his own people as well as on his neighbors. So why would anyone be surprised or find it more repressive than expected? I wouldn't think so.
Click to expand...

From http://www.dod.gov/transcripts/2003/t03282003_t0327sdcjcs.html

myke.
...well, they aren't always reprehensible, I suppose. However, there is just something fucking ridiculous about criticizing AI for using hyperbole; most well-known right-wing organizations that can make coherent statements without it (except perhaps "think tanks," who produce shitty research with shitty data, and aren't the kind of thing that the public consistently interacts with).
 
[quote name='CTLesq']Last I knew it wasn't necessary to make a nuanced difference between the US and the old USSR.

Unless you wanter to make that comparison.

But I guess you will be ok with PAD making an "emotional" comment next time about extermist Islam?

After all, PAD doesn't run an international comission on human rights.

He posts on a message board.

Do you see the nuanced distinction I am making?

CTL[/QUOTE]

I don't when he doesn't go into blanket generalizations of islam. Amnesty used the term "gulag" to refer to guantanamo (not even generalized to refer to all u.s. run detention centers), if PAD wants to use an emotional term to emphasize a specific point then no one would say much, if he wants to use a term (ie. terrorist) to refer to the overwhelming majority of a religion, then that is different.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']From http://www.dod.gov/transcripts/2003/t03282003_t0327sdcjcs.html

myke.
...well, they aren't always reprehensible, I suppose. However, there is just something fucking ridiculous about criticizing AI for using hyperbole; most well-known right-wing organizations that can make coherent statements without it (except perhaps "think tanks," who produce shitty research with shitty data, and aren't the kind of thing that the public consistently interacts with).[/QUOTE]

Yes and we understand when well know right wing organizations use such hyperbole.

If you read Thomas Friedman's editorial in the NYT's last week he said the single best reason to close Guantamo was for PR reasons, so I think you can understand the value of Amnesty's PR.

The question is do you want the world's pre-eminient human rights organization to become a tool for Al-Queda's propoganda?

Its yes or no.


CTL
 
[quote name='CTLesq']The question is do you want the world's pre-eminient human rights organization to become a tool for Al-Queda's propoganda?

Its yes or no.[/QUOTE]

Option 3, of course, is to not give the world's pre-eminient human rights organization CAUSE to become a tool for Al-Queda's propoganda. You know, treat prisoners with respect and dignity, not hold people indefinitely without charges, not 'disappear' people, not use planes owned by shell corporations to transport prisoners to secret prisons in foreign countries where torture is performed, not use any excuse, no matter how shallow and technical, to claim that the Geneva Conventions don't apply, etc, etc. In other words, actually be good people who can be held up to the world as a worth rolemodel instead of doing whatever the hell we want and labeling anyone who disagrees with us as terrorist sympethisers.
 
Just to add a little fuel to the partisan fire here, in the same interview Schulz admitted to giving the maximum $2,000 to John Kerry's presidential campaign, while denying it had anything to do with Amnesty International. He also gave money to Ted Kennedy's reelection campaign.
 
[quote name='CTLesq']Yes and we understand when well know right wing organizations use such hyperbole.

If you read Thomas Friedman's editorial in the NYT's last week he said the single best reason to close Guantamo was for PR reasons, so I think you can understand the value of Amnesty's PR.

The question is do you want the world's pre-eminient human rights organization to become a tool for Al-Queda's propoganda?

Its yes or no.


CTL[/QUOTE]

Of course not. In a time where legitimacy is critical, it was AI's fault to use the term "gulag," as it did place question on their loyalties. However, if, by presenting information that our administration does not like, they are accused of being propagandists, that is not something I will complain about. Given Newsweek's capitulation when pressured by the government, and the subsequent realization that the Koran has been abused (though the method they claim has not been proven), pardon me if I'm skeptical of what comes out of Scott McClellan et al.'s mouths.

myke.
...how is Amnesty International propagandizing Al-Qaeda anyway? I doubt they have access to Gitmo or Abu Ghraib. Are they interviewing released detainees? If so, I would hope the fuck that our government was not releasing Al Qaeda, don't you?
 
They don't have access to Gitmo or AbuGhraib, the International Red Cross does though. They were on Fox News Sunday openly questioning whether or not the IRC was objective enough in their reviews of conditions.

I've NEVER heard the Red Cross questioned on their integrety, until today.
 
[quote name='PittsburghAfterDark']They don't have access to Gitmo or AbuGhraib, the International Red Cross does though. They were on Fox News Sunday openly questioning whether or not the IRC was objective enough in their reviews of conditions.

I've NEVER heard the Red Cross questioned on their integrety, until today.[/QUOTE]

I'm jaded enough that I'm incapable of finding any form of finger-pointing surprising anymore (except for Peggy Noonan's assertion that Mark Felt was responsible for Pol Pot's rise to power).

Is a transcript of today's FNS available yet? The first article you posted seemed to indicate that Schulz wasn't certain how much access the IRC had, which seems to be different from questioning the IRC's objectivity. I'd like to see what you were talking about.

myke.
...woke up with a hangover, just in time for Meet The Press, and all I found was the fucking French Open tennis finals. That should amuse at least one person out there.
 
[quote name='elprincipe']Just to add a little fuel to the partisan fire here, in the same interview Schulz admitted to giving the maximum $2,000 to John Kerry's presidential campaign, while denying it had anything to do with Amnesty International. He also gave money to Ted Kennedy's reelection campaign.[/QUOTE]

a non-issue

As a person who is for human-rights it would seem logical to give money to the candidates who would best further that cause..

Did you expect he would give money to Bush or the GOP who has a platform of death penalty support (a key issue for AI). Get real
 
[quote name='PittsburghAfterDark']

I've NEVER heard the Red Cross questioned on their integrety, until today.[/QUOTE]

Funny I didn't hear the Bush Administration question AI until this report.
 
[quote name='Drocket']Option 3, of course, is to not give the world's pre-eminient human rights organization CAUSE to become a tool for Al-Queda's propoganda. You know, treat prisoners with respect and dignity, not hold people indefinitely without charges, not 'disappear' people, not use planes owned by shell corporations to transport prisoners to secret prisons in foreign countries where torture is performed, not use any excuse, no matter how shallow and technical, to claim that the Geneva Conventions don't apply, etc, etc. In other words, actually be good people who can be held up to the world as a worth rolemodel instead of doing whatever the hell we want and labeling anyone who disagrees with us as terrorist sympethisers.[/QUOTE]

Just one response to your above comments:

How precisely does the Geneva Convention apply to unlawful enemy combatants?

Please. Make the case.

CTL
 
[quote name='CTLesq']Just one response to your above comments:

How precisely does the Geneva Convention apply to unlawful enemy combatants?

Please. Make the case.

CTL[/QUOTE]

So that phrase makes torture okay, but only when the US does it.

Makes a lot of sense.
 
[quote name='Quackzilla']So that phrase makes torture okay, but only when the US does it.

Makes a lot of sense.[/QUOTE]

Nonsense. Just continue to throw words like "torture" around to appear credible.

But then again, since you have no legal basis to treat unlawful enemy combatants under the the GC, I suppose the only thing you have left is demagougery.

CTL
 
The Geneva Convention was brought about to protect OUR troops from torture and inhumane treatment. So when flush the GC down the toilet, why do we expect any more from the insurgents?
 
[quote name='E-Z-B']The Geneva Convention was brought about to protect OUR troops from torture and inhumane treatment. So when flush the GC down the toilet, why do we expect any more from the insurgents?[/QUOTE]

Tell that to Steven Maupin. Our to the warrant officer executed after his helicopter was shot down in Afghanistan.

Bottom line: nice rehtoric, but zero legal basis for your argument.

I would however support a new GC document to cover terrorists. But as it is currently written they aren't protected by GC III or IV.

Did you even know there was a III or IV?

CTL

The Koranic Excesses


335 words
6 June 2005
The Wall Street Journal
A10
English
(Copyright (c) 2005, Dow Jones & Company, Inc.)
So the Pentagon has now released the unhorrifying details of its inquiry into the mishandling of the Koran at the Guantanamo Bay detention facility. It found only five cases, including one in which a detainee complained that his Koran had been kicked, and another in which urine from a guard relieving himself accidentally blew into an air vent and onto a Koran below.

That's it. With hundreds of different guards watching as many as 600 prisoners and some 28,000 interrogations over three years, that's what the hullabaloo prompted by Newsweek's false report about Koran abuse comes down to. In the case of the wayward urine, the report says the detainee was issued a new Koran and a fresh uniform, while the guard was reprimanded and kept away from prisoners for the rest of his Guantanamo duty. It should be noted that the prisoners only have Korans in the first place because the U.S. military has provided them -- some 1,600 in all.

These facts won't end the political jihad against Guantanamo, because the opposition to detaining prisoners there has little to do the Koran, or with concern about the U.S. "image" in the Muslim world. The campaign is all about repudiating the Bush Administration's approach to the war on terror.

The critics have never accepted that the mass murder of civilians by non-uniformed combatants requires special detention or military-justice practices. The Pentagon could close Guantanamo tomorrow, and the critics would quickly find other anti-terror policies to deplore: military commissions, or the "rendition" of terror suspects to third countries, or interrogation techniques, or something else. Their goal is to accord terrorists the same legal protections as everyday criminals.

Someone in the Administration ought to point out that these measures are designed to prevent the next terror attack -- which, if it ever comes, could prompt a bipartisan crackdown on civil liberties that would make Guantanamo look like summer camp.
 
It found only five cases, including one in which a detainee complained that his Koran had been kicked, and another in which urine from a guard relieving himself accidentally blew into an air vent and onto a Koran below.
Click to expand...

Does anyone else find this to be the most ludicrous explanation ever? Somehow a guard takes a whizz and it's close enough to an air vent to get sucked in and blown into the prisoner's cell onto him and his Koran? Pull the other one! What kind of super-powered air vents do they have and what government moron installed them so close to a toilet? There is no way this happened as reported.
 
[quote name='MrBadExample']Does anyone else find this to be the most ludicrous explanation ever? Somehow a guard takes a whizz and it's close enough to an air vent to get sucked in and blown into the prisoner's cell onto him and his Koran? Pull the other one! What kind of super-powered air vents do they have and what government moron installed them so close to a toilet? There is no way this happened as reported.[/QUOTE]

I keep forgetting how many prisons and military installations you have designed let alone visited.

CTL
 
[quote name='CTLesq']I keep forgetting how many prisons and military installations you have designed let alone visited.

CTL[/QUOTE]

Well I am an architect (mainly health clubs) but that explanation doesn't fly. The guard would pretty much have to take piss directly in the heating system's blower.

Also anything with negative pressure (i.e. air intakes or plenums) are not located on the floor or low on a wall.
 
[quote name='usickenme']Well I am an architect (mainly health clubs) but that explanation doesn't fly. The guard would pretty much have to take piss directly in the heating system's blower. [/quote]

Funny. I recall you questioning someone else about his credibility on a previous subject, but whatever.

You presume there was alot of urine with that explanation.

[quote name='usickenme']Also anything with negative pressure (i.e. air intakes or plenums) are not located on the floor or low on a wall.[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't have the vaguest idea.

More to the point, I think the focus on this one isolated example shows just how far you people will attempt to go discredit the war on terror.

I also think it shows what a mockery the mantra "I support the troops, but not the war" really is. Sure you will support the troops, until you can take a single action and use it to attack an entire policy.

But then again, if I was arguing for the legal standing of unlawful enemy combatants and didn't have a leg to stand on based on the GC or any other recognized international law I suppose I would be reduced to debating how someone could have urinated on a Koran and making that the issue.

If I only had a brain....Oh thats right, I have a point.

CTL
 
[quote name='CTLesq']More to the point, I think the focus on this one isolated example shows just how far you people will attempt to go discredit the war on terror.

If I only had a brain....Oh thats right, I have a point.

CTL[/QUOTE]

WASHINGTON - The Pentagon on Friday confirmed for the first time that a U.S. soldier deliberately kicked a Guantanamo Bay prisoner's Muslim holy book in violation of the military's rules for handling the Quran.

In other confirmed incidents, prison guards threw water balloons in a cell block, causing an unspecified number of Qurans to get wet; a guard's urine splashed on a detainee and his Quran; an interrogator stepped on a Quran during an interrogation; and a two-word obscenity was written in English on the inside cover of a Quran.

The findings are among the results of an investigation last month by Brig. Gen. Jay Hood, the commander of the detention center in Cuba, that was triggered by a Newsweek magazine report -- later retracted -- that a U.S. soldier had flushed one Guantanamo Bay detainee's Quran down a toilet

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050603/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/guantanamo_bay_quran_1

And Newsweek was lying? Where there's smoke, there's fire. This is more than "one isolated incident". It goes back to Rumsfeld saying that there are other forms of torture to bypass the GC like sleep deprivation, stripping, using attack dogs, etc.
 
well you see there. I know what interweb is all about and quite frankly, I could care less if you question my credibility.

by the way, if it was a single action I would be okay with it. But it is not. When you hundreds of "single actions" it stop being "single actions". Those actions are harming not helping our troops. Futhermore, unlike the republicans who seemingly only want to punished low-level people, we need to see get rid of this policy from the top down.


Still no brain, still no point. Scarecrow.
 
I'm going to start posting some of the more humorous Koran destruction videos I've seen recently. I've seen burnings, an attempted flushing demonstration (Using various toilets from home to the super powered commercial flushers.) I saw one with a guy lining his cat box with pages, another using one for target practice. It seems that all this talk has lead to one thing, a whole lotta people making videos of them desecrating the Koran.
 
There's also a video (or pic?) out there where some guy is flusing the bible. Funny stuff, right?
 
[quote name='E-Z-B']WASHINGTON - The Pentagon on Friday confirmed for the first time that a U.S. soldier deliberately kicked a Guantanamo Bay prisoner's Muslim holy book in violation of the military's rules for handling the Quran.

In other confirmed incidents, prison guards threw water balloons in a cell block, causing an unspecified number of Qurans to get wet; a guard's urine splashed on a detainee and his Quran; an interrogator stepped on a Quran during an interrogation; and a two-word obscenity was written in English on the inside cover of a Quran.

The findings are among the results of an investigation last month by Brig. Gen. Jay Hood, the commander of the detention center in Cuba, that was triggered by a Newsweek magazine report -- later retracted -- that a U.S. soldier had flushed one Guantanamo Bay detainee's Quran down a toilet

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050603/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/guantanamo_bay_quran_1

And Newsweek was lying? Where there's smoke, there's fire. This is more than "one isolated incident". It goes back to Rumsfeld saying that there are other forms of torture to bypass the GC like sleep deprivation, stripping, using attack dogs, etc.[/QUOTE]

From a WSJ editorial I posted earlier in the thread which none of you had a response for:

It found only five cases, including one in which a detainee complained that his Koran had been kicked, and another in which urine from a guard relieving himself accidentally blew into an air vent and onto a Koran below.


That's it. With hundreds of different guards watching as many as 600 prisoners and some 28,000 interrogations over three years, that's what the hullabaloo prompted by Newsweek's false report about Koran abuse comes down to. In the case of the wayward urine, the report says the detainee was issued a new Koran and a fresh uniform, while the guard was reprimanded and kept away from prisoners for the rest of his Guantanamo duty.

***

As for the flushing of the Koran EZB, don't get too excited, that was confirmed as detainees doing that.

CTL
 
[quote name='usickenme']well you see there. I know what interweb is all about and quite frankly, I could care less if you question my credibility.

by the way, if it was a single action I would be okay with it. But it is not. When you hundreds of "single actions" it stop being "single actions". Those actions are harming not helping our troops. Futhermore, unlike the republicans who seemingly only want to punished low-level people, we need to see get rid of this policy from the top down.


Still no brain, still no point. Scarecrow.[/QUOTE]

The report found FIVE, not hundreds.

Keep baiting. Eventually you will get lucky and just get something right merely because of your number of tries.

CTL
 
[quote name='CTLesq']From a WSJ editorial I posted earlier in the thread which none of you had a response for:

It found only five cases, including one in which a detainee complained that his Koran had been kicked, and another in which urine from a guard relieving himself accidentally blew into an air vent and onto a Koran below.


That's it. With hundreds of different guards watching as many as 600 prisoners and some 28,000 interrogations over three years, that's what the hullabaloo prompted by Newsweek's false report about Koran abuse comes down to. In the case of the wayward urine, the report says the detainee was issued a new Koran and a fresh uniform, while the guard was reprimanded and kept away from prisoners for the rest of his Guantanamo duty.

***

As for the flushing of the Koran EZB, don't get too excited, that was confirmed as detainees doing that.

CTL[/QUOTE]

Again, where there's smoke, there's fire. It goes back to Rumsfeld saying that there are other forms of torture to bypass the GC like sleep deprivation, stripping, using attack dogs, etc. Just because the WSJ confirmed five, doesn't mean that it's not more systematic. Don't think the pentagon isn't in the business of covering it's ass.
 
[quote name='CTLesq']The report found FIVE, not hundreds.


CTL[/QUOTE]

Five in this report, dozens more in Iraq, more in Afghanistan, over 100 prisoners dead in our custody, our policy of rendition plus whatever is undocumented.. (if unconfirmed is okay for your Zarqawi thread it is okay here)

but it's only five.
 
[quote name='usickenme']Five in this report, dozens more in Iraq, more in Afghanistan, over 100 prisoners dead in our custody, our policy of rendition plus whatever is undocumented.. (if unconfirmed is okay for your Zarqawi thread it is okay here)

but it's only five.[/QUOTE]

I am citing the Pentagon report:

LA Times

WASHINGTON —
The Pentagon late Friday confirmed five incidents of Koran desecration at the prison for detainees at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, wrapping up a high-priority investigation.

Perhaps you can cite to something other than your opinion?

You have yet to post anything to suggest AMZ wasn't wounded.

Really, you are just grasping.

CTL
 
[quote name='CTLesq']I am citing the Pentagon report:

LA Times

WASHINGTON —
The Pentagon late Friday confirmed five incidents of Koran desecration at the prison for detainees at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, wrapping up a high-priority investigation.

Perhaps you can cite to something other than your opinion?

You have yet to post anything to suggest AMZ wasn't wounded.

Really, you are just grasping.

CTL[/QUOTE]

You're really drinking the kool-aid if you think that after 28,000 interrogations, there was only FIVE incidents where they desecrated the Koran. If they conducted naked pyramid piles, simulated sex acts, rape, and murder, I'm betting they've desecrated the Koran more than 5 times.
 
[quote name='PittsburghAfterDark']I'm going to start posting some of the more humorous Koran destruction videos I've seen recently. [/QUOTE]

Wow, you are just getting worse and worse.

I still can't believe a shit like you was allowed in the military, they must have been desperate.
 
Glad to see CTL is so trusting in a internal government investigation that would have negative PR effects. What do you think would have happened if they came out and said the report in newsweek was essentially correct? I'm not saying it is, but it would make them think twice about releasing anything close to that.
 
[quote name='Quackzilla']Wow, you are just getting worse and worse.

I still can't believe a shit like you was allowed in the military, they must have been desperate.[/QUOTE]

MEOW MEOW join Army MEOW MEOW, MEOW MEOW no more kill kittens MEOW MEOW.
 
[quote name='E-Z-B']There's also a video (or pic?) out there where some guy is flusing the bible. Funny stuff, right?[/QUOTE]

I could care less what someone does to A BOOK regardless of what the title is.

Funny? No, not to me. I don't find it offensive to the point where I'd riot, kill, burn things, hurl stones or even care enough to write a letter to the editor.
 
Quackzilla's Dead Kitten said:
MEOW MEOW join Army MEOW MEOW, MEOW MEOW no more kill kittens MEOW MEOW.
Click to expand...

PAD, your conversation is very intellectual. You brought up a good point there.

I see now how having alternate accounts for the sole purpose of spamming is incredibly annoying.
 
[quote name='PittsburghAfterDark']I could care less what someone does to A BOOK regardless of what the title is.

Funny? No, not to me. I don't find it offensive to the point where I'd riot, kill, burn things, hurl stones or even care enough to write a letter to the editor.[/QUOTE]

Then why would you post "humorous Koran destruction videos" you've seen recently? That's not any funnier than people desescrating the bible or even the American flag.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']Glad to see CTL is so trusting in a internal government investigation that would have negative PR effects. What do you think would have happened if they came out and said the report in newsweek was essentially correct? I'm not saying it is, but it would make them think twice about releasing anything close to that.[/QUOTE]

And it can't be trusted because it didn't support your view of detainee treatment at Guantamo?

Maybe because the Newsweek article was based off faulty intellignece? And YOU won't even go so far as to say the article was correct!

EZB: you misinterpretted PAD's comment soley to be argumentative.

The bottom line people is that Amnesty isn't doing itself any favors with these absurd, outlandish claims.

CTL
 
[quote name='Quackzilla']PAD, your conversation is very intellectual. You brought up a good point there.

I see now how having alternate accounts for the sole purpose of spamming is incredibly annoying.[/QUOTE]

You're just mad because I found a way to piss you off daily and you haven't come close to doing the same thing to me.

Admit it, you're my bitch.
 
[quote name='E-Z-B']Then why would you post "humorous Koran destruction videos" you've seen recently? That's not any funnier than people desescrating the bible or even the American flag.[/QUOTE]

Did you ever see the video where the kids were dragging a Game Cube behind a car? Then set it up to work? Then they burned it for a few seconds, set it up and it worked? Dropped it from a high spot, set it up and it worked? That was funny.

Just setting a Koran on fire and going HAWR HAWR HAWR isn't funny. Putting in a video where you claim to be seeing if God will strike you dead for descecrating his word? Yeah, that can be funny. It's all in context, not just wanton destruction.
 
[quote name='CTLesq']The bottom line people is that Amnesty isn't doing itself any favors with these absurd, outlandish claims.

CTL[/QUOTE]

Yes, naked pyramid piles, electroshocks, and simulate sex acts are one thing, but it's "absurd" to think that they were flushing korans down toilets and urinating on inmates.
 
You actually think you have pissed me off?

Who is the one who went out of their way to write a short story, make an alternate account, and use that alternate account to spam topics I posted in?

lol, who's the bitch?
 
[quote name='CTLesq']In the case of the wayward urine, the report says the detainee was issued a new Koran and a fresh uniform, while the guard was reprimanded and kept away from prisoners for the rest of his Guantanamo duty.[/QUOTE]

So his superiors apparently think this guard did something wrong. Did he whizz in an unauthorized fashion? Was this some non-regulation lizard draining? Did the dew shake off his lily in an improper manner? If this was just some sort of accident that turned him into a human Super Soaker I'm not sure why he would be reprimanded.
 
[quote name='PittsburghAfterDark']You're just mad because I found a way to piss you off daily and you haven't come close to doing the same thing to me.

Admit it, you're my bitch.[/QUOTE]

Using this logic, 99.25% of America is CarrotTop's bitch.
 
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