Wal-Mart has spent $2M fighting $7,000 fine

IAmTheCheapestGamer

IAmTheCheapestGamer

Banned
I don't know if anyone remembers the trampling death that occured on Black Friday 2008 at a Wal-Mart up in Valley Stream, NY. But apparently Wal-Mart has spent about $2M to fight a $7,000 fine from OSHA for the trampling death of Jdimytai Damour, a temporary worker.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/07/07/walmart-reportedly-spendi_n_637504.html

Walmart has decided that it can't live with a $7,000 fine for the death of an employee in a 2008 trampling incident in Long Island, New York, the Steven Greenhouse at The New York Times reports this morning.
And, the paper notes, the Occupational Health and Safety Administration (OSHA) estimates the company has spent more than $2 million in legal fees to battle the fine.
Walmart drew the ire of unions and workers rights groups after the 2008 Black Friday death of 34-year-old temporary worker Jdimytai Damour, calling the incident preventable.
Walmart, according to Federal officials reached by the NYT, has been steadfast in fighting the fine, despite reaching a settlement in 2009 with Nassau County prosecutors in which it agreed to improve safety measures, offer large charitable donations and create $400,000 fund to help customers injured at the store.
As a part of the settlement, Nassau County prosecutors agreed to suspend its criminal investigation into the incident and Walmart admitted no wrongdoing, ABC 7 reported. Of the settlement, county District Attorney Kathleen Rice said:
"No prosecution could have achieved what we have been able to do with this agreement. Rather than bringing the world's largest retailer to court and imposing a small fine against them, I felt it was important to require significant safety changes that will affect the whole state. We are able to get expedient compensation for these victims and also get jobs for our community and more than a million dollars in funding for crucial social service programs that will help our local economy and our youth."​
But Walmart's current legal battle against the $7,000 fine has a much less positive effect on Federal agencies. Here's Greenhouse:
"The dispute [over the fine] has become so heated -- and Walmart's defense so vigorous -- that officials at OSHA, an arm of the Labor Department, complain that they have had to devote huge numbers of staff time to the case, including 4,725 hours of work by employees in the legal office." ​
What do you think? Has Walmart gone too far?
Click to expand...
 
They probably feel that paying the fine would be like admitting guilt. They'd rather spend millions and win than pay the fine and look bad.
 
By them paying that 2million dollars in the long run is alot cheaper. If they admit fault and pay that fine then that opens the doors for tons of other lawsuits from others and it will publicly look they are admitting it was their fault. Once you lose a lawsuit when your a major company then all your doing it setting yourself up for others to follow.

Has walmart gone to far? Nope, they are just doing what they have to in order to protect themselves.
 
Question:
There were several people that day who used their feet as a deadly weapon, crushing the life out of an individual.

How much have those people been fined and how much have they paid?
 
Exactly what I was going to say gargus. Sometimes you have to lose the battle to win the war. And besides, something good came out of it, so it's better that it happened this way. Besides, even $2M is like a drop in the bucket for Walmart.
 
[quote name='IAmTheCheapestGamer']I don't know if anyone remembers the trampling death that occured on Black Friday 2008 at a Wal-Mart up in Valley Stream, NY. But apparently Wal-Mart has spent about $2M to fight a $7,000 fine from OSHA for the trampling death of Jdimytai Damour, a temporary worker.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/07/07/walmart-reportedly-spendi_n_637504.html

[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

lol i spent the first few years of my life in Valley Stream!

ahhh the memories!
 
[quote name='gomikeoh']Two million to walmart is like blinking; they are just fighting to protect their integrity.[/QUOTE]
Wal-Mart has integrity? Since when?
 
When someone get's trampled, it's usually good to show your integrity by not paying up, and furthermore, fighting a payment.

It's a fine from OHSA, so they're fighting a fine from OHSA with 2 mill in the sink already? That's like getting caught stealing a cookie, being sentenced to timeout, and then crying and refusing to go to timeout. Am I going to have to take my belt off?
 
We must protect the profits of faceless corporations who allow employees to die when they create potentially deadly situations, as this is worth more than life itself.

I like how refusing to pay a fine to a regulatory organization is somehow analogous to frivolous lawsuits.

I mean, it's just hilarious. I hope some of you guys are writing Hallmark cards. "Sounds like Walmart rolled back the price of life!" Or other such chestnuts.
 
Paying a fine is an admission of guilt. That's why they fight it. That's also why they likely keep lawyers on retainer and are not actually paying anything extra out of pocket. That's how big corporations win in court. Their lawyers are on the payroll. Yours is just on lease.
 
Man, I sure wish I could kill someone, then have 100% of the blame put onto the owners of the property where it happened. It's like legalized manslaughter!
 
[quote name='UncleBob']Man, I sure wish I could kill someone, then have 100% of the blame put onto the owners of the property where it happened. It's like legalized manslaughter![/QUOTE]
That post was legalized manslaughter against nuance.
 
All I'm saying is that it concerns me that none of the individuals who actually caused any of the injuries to this man that lead to his death have been charged with any sort of crime.

I'm not saying Walmart should be off the hook.
 
[quote name='Strell']We must protect the profits of faceless corporations who allow employees to die when they create potentially deadly situations, as this is worth more than life itself.

I like how refusing to pay a fine to a regulatory organization is somehow analogous to frivolous lawsuits.

I mean, it's just hilarious. I hope some of you guys are writing Hallmark cards. "Sounds like Walmart rolled back the price of life!" Or other such chestnuts.[/QUOTE]

But they did create a $400,000 fun for employees who are hurt at the store. That's better than paying some stupid $7,000 fine. And also, if I remember correctly, isn't this the guy who was trampled just after unlocking the door? What could Walmart have done about it besides not open the doors? If anything, I'd blame the ten million jackasses that trampled over the guy. Those are the assholes that took his life so they could save $20 on their fucking PS3s.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']All I'm saying is that it concerns me that none of the individuals who actually caused any of the injuries to this man that lead to his death have been charged with any sort of crime.

I'm not saying Walmart should be off the hook.[/QUOTE]

its not people's faults, its the big evil corporations. if there were more regulations the people would never have died! stupid bush and his deregulation of walmart.
 
[quote name='Access_Denied']But they did create a $400,000 fun for employees who are hurt at the store. That's better than paying some stupid $7,000 fine. And also, if I remember correctly, isn't this the guy who was trampled just after unlocking the door? What could Walmart have done about it besides not open the doors? If anything, I'd blame the ten million jackasses that trampled over the guy. Those are the assholes that took his life so they could save $20 on their fucking PS3s.[/QUOTE]

They could have setup a line the night before to make sure people entered in an orderly fashion. They could also hire more security, or request police presence.

There are many things they should have done to avoid this situation.

I wonder if you even have a job, being that you don't understand simplistic business liabilities.
 
[quote name='camoor']They could have setup a line the night before to make sure people entered in an orderly fashion. They could also hire more security, or request police presence.

There are many things they should have done to avoid this situation.

I wonder if you even have a job, being that you don't understand simplistic business liabilities.[/QUOTE]

Have you ever gone to a black friday sale? People don't give a fuck about security, lines, or anything like that. They just want to get their own, end of story.
 
[quote name='perdition(troy']Have you ever gone to a black friday sale? People don't give a fuck about security, lines, or anything like that. They just want to get their own, end of story.[/QUOTE]

People are just going to get trampled and killed by crowds on Black Friday, and there's nothing we can do about it? Walmart shouldn't even be fined a ridiculously paltry amount of money because this type of tragedy is just a fact of life in America?

Is that the best you can do? Really?
 
No offense but both sides are to blame. People should act with some caution and not rush forth like a horde of Wildebeasts and Wal-Mart had a history of this shit on Black Friday and could've taken appropriate precautions.
Let us not forget that the reasons Corporations were allowed to exist was for the "Public Good" and I frankly refuse to see this interpretation as being so narrow as for shareholder's profits at the expense of everything else.
 
[quote name='camoor']They could have setup a line the night before to make sure people entered in an orderly fashion. They could also hire more security, or request police presence.[/QUOTE]

If they had hired private security, there would have been cries of the Walmart Police Force acting beyond their authority.

If they had requested more police presence (and even paid for it), there would have been cries of Walmart taking officers away from their duties and using them as a private police force.

I've seen both sides of that argument.
 
[quote name='62t']to Walmart 7k and 2 million are nothing.[/QUOTE]

This tells you that is not about the money.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']If they had hired private security, there would have been cries of the Walmart Police Force acting beyond their authority.

If they had requested more police presence (and even paid for it), there would have been cries of Walmart taking officers away from their duties and using them as a private police force.

I've seen both sides of that argument.[/QUOTE]

UB already out of his hypothetical question phase and grasping at straws, and we're not even to three pages yet. A new record?
 
[quote name='Sarang01']No offense but both sides are to blame. People should act with some caution and not rush forth like a horde of Wildebeasts and Wal-Mart had a history of this shit on Black Friday and could've taken appropriate precautions.
Let us not forget that the reasons Corporations were allowed to exist was for the "Public Good" and I frankly refuse to see this interpretation as being so narrow as for shareholder's profits at the expense of everything else.[/QUOTE]

We all know that black friday at walmart resembles that scene in dawn of the dead when the zombies finally break through the glass doors of the mall. The only difference is that the zombies were likely a few points higher in the IQ department.
 
[quote name='camoor']They could have setup a line the night before to make sure people entered in an orderly fashion. They could also hire more security, or request police presence.

There are many things they should have done to avoid this situation.

I wonder if you even have a job, being that you don't understand simplistic business liabilities.[/QUOTE]

Right, setting up those fancy red posts in a line fashion will definitely keep the Black Friday shoppers in their place. :roll:

And yes, I have a job, but since I don't work for a business, I wouldn't know about business liabilities. Maybe you want to enlighten me?
 
[quote name='camoor']UB already out of his hypothetical question phase and grasping at straws, and we're not even to three pages yet. A new record?[/QUOTE]

So, are you saying that isn't what would happen?

Because there are plenty of opinion pieces that would disagree. You can start at TheWritingontheWal.net, a favorite spot of mine.

I'm sorry that your first set of solutions already fell flat.

Maybe when you are in control of a multi-billion dollar international business that employees millions of people you'll be able to come up with and implement better plans than "more security".

It's a sad state when we need "more security" at a frickin' department store because cheap plastic crap from China is on sale. And then when some guy gets the life crushed out of him, we blame the store while the people who's feet actually killed the guy get to skip away, free and clear.

"More security". Yeah, that's the answer.
 
Durrrrrrrrrrrrr, nothing will work, so why come us let's no do nothing! Duuuuuurrrrrrrrrrr!

How about a lottery system? An hour before the store opens, go out and give everyone a ticket. Call out the winning numbers matching the inventory in the store. Take these people aside and let them get the items in question in a safe, orderly manner.

Hire more security. It boggles my mind that we are totally okay with a frenzied day of massive shopping and give no regard to making sure it runs in an orderly fashion. You can hire private contractors or give police overtime. Stimulating the economy while saving your own ass. I guarantee you that $2 million would buy a lot of man hours, coffee, and donuts. You're about to make massive profits - so much so that you don't give a shit if a few people DIE on the way in - that you could afford some motherfucking security, idiots.

Have more entrances. Set up lines. Rope sections off. Have more inventory. Stop allowing a massive crowd to flood through like cattle.

There's dozens of solutions, but you guys just want to stamp your feet and take your ball home because derp, it's a corporation, WHY IS OBAMOSHA HATINGS TEHMS?

It's not like this hasn't happened before in other venues and SHIT WAS CHANGED to accomodate for it. Look up the Who tragedy. Here, let me do it for you.
 
5 years from now: cyber trampling. It's much safer.

about 15 or so years ago AC/DC came to my home town. A teenager was trampled to death. Net result: AC/DC gets banned for life from Utah. WTF?

This is like Walmart deciding to stop selling $15 dvd players on black Friday to deal with their problems.
 
[quote name='Strell']I prefer cyber tramping. It's sexier.[/QUOTE]

only if it is compatible with wii (get it, wii) motion plus
 
[quote name='Strell']Durrrrrrrrrrrrr, nothing will work, so why come us let's no do nothing! Duuuuuurrrrrrrrrrr![/QUOTE]

Strell, the Arizona/Illegal Immigration thread is over there....
 
[quote name='UncleBob']So, are you saying that isn't what would happen?

Because there are plenty of opinion pieces that would disagree. You can start at TheWritingontheWal.net, a favorite spot of mine.

I'm sorry that your first set of solutions already fell flat.

Maybe when you are in control of a multi-billion dollar international business that employees millions of people you'll be able to come up with and implement better plans than "more security".

It's a sad state when we need "more security" at a frickin' department store because cheap plastic crap from China is on sale. And then when some guy gets the life crushed out of him, we blame the store while the people who's feet actually killed the guy get to skip away, free and clear.

"More security". Yeah, that's the answer.[/QUOTE]

You're kidding right? Did you even READ my comment for crying out loud?!

Also those millions of jobs are mostly low quality and pay shit, i.e. NOT a living wage. They suck the wealth out of communities like a vacuum or the life out of a being like a parasite pretty much.
They're also the ultimate in short term. You'd think, with all that money, that they would invest just a little in the long term. They could make those buildings self-sustainable considering the fact they get most of those buildings for close to free or free.
They also spend such a high amount against Unions that it's counter productive in my opinion. With the good grace Wal-Mart could cultivate by allowing them as well as trying NOT to cheat people out of overtime pay. Wal-Mart wants to expand their market but there's a chance they won't grow out of being low class without fixing things like this.
It's really too bad Sam Walton is dead. At least when he was alive you'd see that American flag on the outside of the trucks and you knew their brand had stuff made in the U.S., if not most of it.
 
Reminds me of that scene from the (horrible) movie Jingle All the Way, where Arnold gets trampled in the mall trying to get that stupid doll. People probably thought that was just a joke, that it doesn't happen, but ask any parent who's tried to get the hottest Christmas toy for their kid if it's just a joke. Kills me that they'll spend millions fighting this, but no money to try and prevent things like this.

Hell, Best Buy always has people go out in the line and give people vouchers for stuff, then you just walk in and go to the desk and get it.
 
All I read was Jingle All The Way. My mother recently watched that and a week later, told me how awful it was.
Back on topic....
 
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