well eldad9 i guess I had a few of your very very rare DC's I should have Ebayed them , I went through a 3-4 of them before I got the black one I have now, there in fact were tons of DC's that were problematic with Backups, mainly because the lenses sucked, so far the black one's have the best track record, as far as the other DC's the R7 & HK are the 2 most highly sought after, the one's you mentioned faded into the sunset,along with a few other models...