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need hdtv lcd flat panel help


#31 superstevedogg   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   142 Posts   Joined 14.0 Years Ago  

superstevedogg

Posted 23 September 2007 - 07:50 AM

People seem to enjoy their Regzas.

Honestly you could've ordered a Sharp Aquos 42" 2007 model with the improved blacks and other improvement over the '06 model still being sold in Best Buy for $1500, but that is the difference between ordering a TV online and buying in store.


"""

the 64 series trumps the 62 series by a ton. Price to quality it's probably one of the best values on the market right now. Especially around $1400. CC was selling it at $1299 a few weeks ago, just an insane deal.

#32 SkiDragon   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   57 Posts   Joined 13.3 Years Ago  

SkiDragon

Posted 23 September 2007 - 09:59 AM

Today I went into Best Buy and compared several TVs. I heard that Samsung LCDs are the pretty good for video games, especially for their low input lag. I actually brought my Gamecube into the store along with a game I am pretty familiar with, Super Smash Bros. Melee (SSBM). I feel I am familiar enough with the game to be able to notice small levels of lag, and I have no more scientific method available. Here are the TVs I tested and the notes I took for each.

1. LG LCD 37" 720p $1100 37LC7D
2. LG LCD 42" 720p $1150 42LC7D
3. Westinghouse LCD 42" 1080p $1200 TX-42H430S
4. Philips LCD 42" 720p $1300 42PFL5332D
5. Samsung LCD 40" 1080p $1800 LNT4061F

1. I only tested this TV in 480i, S-video. I noticed a bit of lag, more than I would want on a TV. I couldn't find a game mode, but I thought I heard that labeling the input as "game" would put some TVs into game mode, so I tried that, but I don't think it really helped. I would probably want a screen larger than this, but it was in a convenient place to test and I figure the lag would be the same on a larger model.

2. I tried hooking up to this TV with S-video, but it did not detect the input. I was not able to try composite.

3. This is the TV I tested most extensively. I initially tried 480i S-video on SSBM, and noticed a small bit of lag. It was more than I was looking for but not all that terrible. I then switched to 480p and the lag was almost un-noticeable. It may have been gone entirely. On this TV I tried two other games, Ikaruga and the Zelda collectors disc (to imitate an older game system's graphics). I still did not notice the lag in Ikaruga, and did more or less as well as I normally would at the game. I then tried out Zelda 1 and Zelda 2 on the collector's disc. 2D games like this always look questionable on HDTVs. When I ran the games at 480p they looked OK, about as good as I could expect. However, when I switched to 480i the games showed some strange effects. When a graphic scrolls on the screen (including the background in Zelda 2, it tends to "vibrate". I think this is due to the de-interlacing. It's hard to explain, but I think most people would notice it. It may have done a milder form of this in 480p mode; I don't remember. This is a pretty good price for a 1080p TV so I wouldn't quite count it out yet.

4. To be honest I am forgetting exactly what I thought of some of these TVs. The Philips was pretty decent, when in game mode, but not the greatest. Probably similar to the Westinghouse. This might have been another TV that did not like the S-video input, or maybe not.

5. This was my favorite. I know it's the most expensive - I was interested in the 720p Samsung above it but it was out of reach. I am assuming (hoping) that the 720p model would have no more lag than this model. This model, when in game mode, and running a 480i S-video signal, had such a small amount of lag that it was hard to notice it. It wasn't perfect, and probably wasn't as good as the 480p on the Westinghouse, but it was definitely playable. At this point, by the way, I was under the assumption that no TV would lag more running a 480p signal than it would running a 480i signal. So, this TV confirmed what I heard initially about the good quality, at least in terms of lag, of the Samsung.


Tomorrow I will try to narrow down my choices some, but I would definitely appreciate any input that people could provide.
Thanks.

#33 superstevedogg   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   142 Posts   Joined 14.0 Years Ago  

superstevedogg

Posted 23 September 2007 - 12:58 PM

5. Samsung LCD 40" 1080p $1800 LNT4061F

This has sold for around 1300 before, so if you want to get it I would wait until it gets to that range again.

Nice TV.


Look at the Sharp LC42D64U
Normally around 1800, but drops into the 1399 range.

#34 chex20   ....Marisa Miller CAGiversary!   320 Posts   Joined 11.7 Years Ago  

Posted 23 September 2007 - 07:33 PM

If you don't mind going the refurbished way, then secondact.com is a great place to go. Got my Sharp Aquos (the newest series) there at half the price, and the thing is pristine condition, no dents nor scratches. The website has gotten great reviews and the products, even though they say refurbished, are great. It's up to you though.

#35 SkiDragon   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   57 Posts   Joined 13.3 Years Ago  

SkiDragon

Posted 24 September 2007 - 02:55 AM

Today I went into Circuit City and did the same thing. I'll spare all the details this time but I'll mention the two TVs that had the lowest level of lag, in my estimation.
First is another Samsung, the LNT4042H. This is a 40", 720p LCD for $1350. This performed about as good as the other Samsung from Best Buy in my 480i lag test with SSBM. This TV was 720p, and thus cheaper than the 1080p from Best Buy.
Second is a cheap TV, a Vizio VX37LHDTV10A. This is a 37", 720p LCD for $800. The lag on this was about as good as the Samsung. I couldn't really tell if it was quite as good, or better, but it was close. Unfortunately, I don't think there was an option to display in 4:3 ratio, so I couldn't reccomend it to anybody who cares about that, like I do.
Third is a Toshiba 42HL67. This is a 42", 720p LCD for $1400. I believe this was the best of all. I really could not notice any lag whatsoever in game mode, whereas in the Samsung I may have noticed a minute amount. I was really impressed.

I will probably look into buying that model or a similar model Toshiba. I reccomend that anyone else looking for a low lag TV to look into it also. I was hoping to find a better deal on the TV though. Does anybody know of any good deals on this or a similar model? I also heard that some stores will bargain the price down, including Circuit City. I will also probably go back and do some more extensive testing on the TV, in 480p and 720p modes.

Thanks.

#36 chex20   ....Marisa Miller CAGiversary!   320 Posts   Joined 11.7 Years Ago  

Posted 24 September 2007 - 03:18 AM

Ski, the thing you want to ask (an employee. Though, not sure if they will tell you the truth or even know for that matter), if your worried about ghosting (what you referred to as lag), is "What is the response time?" For gaming, you should go for 8ms or lower. I've rarely see anything under 6ms. Sharp Aquos, for one, has 6ms response time, and I know that most Samsungs have 8ms. Anything above 8ms, is where gaming gets rough, as for ghosting.

As for any deals, I can't really thing of any places that have current deals on HDTV. They should be a ton of them shortly, mainly because of the holiday rush/season, that is if you can wait. I do know that if you ask an department manager (in this case, electronics) they can knock off 10% of the original asking price, if you give them a good reason too and your polite (meaning, they like you). Anything above that, they need permission from an assistant manager to lower the price after the 10% reduction. I've rarely seen my manager (who works with me in electronics) give a person the 10% reduction on new tvs, but it is always worth a shot.

#37 M_H   CAG Veteran CAG Veteran   24 Posts   Joined 10.3 Years Ago  

Posted 24 September 2007 - 03:37 AM

The Samsung:
http://shop3.outpost...CH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

The Toshiba:
http://shop3.outpost...CH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

Both are under $1000.

#38 SkiDragon   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   57 Posts   Joined 13.3 Years Ago  

SkiDragon

Posted 24 September 2007 - 03:56 AM

I've looked into this quite a bit. The "response time" measure how fast a pixel can change color. This really has nothing to do with the lag I am talking about. It would still be nice to have a low response time, but that is not the main concern. It would be nice to know the response time on the Toshiba.

Thanks for those links! Those are really good prices. However, I am kind of in a hurry to get the TV, because there is a game coming out Tuesday that I want to play on it. Fry's is actually somewhat local to me (i.e. withing 2 hours), and since Best Buy and Circuit City both claim to match prices, do you think I could get them to match these prices? Thanks a bunch.

#39 SkiDragon   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   57 Posts   Joined 13.3 Years Ago  

SkiDragon

Posted 25 September 2007 - 01:03 AM

I don't mean to be annoying, but I am wondering if anybody thinks a store will price match those prices for Fry's.

I'm also interested in more opinions on those TVs. Remember, I am concerned mostly about lag when upscaling a 480i/p input, and I am wondering if anybody has any experience with this. Thanks.

#40 M_H   CAG Veteran CAG Veteran   24 Posts   Joined 10.3 Years Ago  

Posted 25 September 2007 - 01:32 AM

I have no idea about the price match; just call them up and ask.

#41 SkiDragon   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   57 Posts   Joined 13.3 Years Ago  

SkiDragon

Posted 25 September 2007 - 05:57 AM

Here's the deal. Neither Best Buy nor Circuit City would price match. Circuit City claimed that Fry's was "not local". The nearest one is about an hour away. Best Buy was going to price match, but Fry's price was lower than the amount Best Buy bought the TV for, supposedly, and they wouldn't let me. Then I decided to try Sears. Unfortunately, they did not have either of the TVs I was looking for. They had several Samsungs, but since I decided Toshiba was a little better I looked at those. They did not have the 42HL67, but they did have the 42HL167, which is just the 1080p version. Fry's sells it for $1250, and Sears was going to match the price and give me an additional 10%, for a total of $1205. I tested the TV, and it performed pretty well, but I don't think it was quite as responsive as the 720p model. It could just be my imagination, and either way it was still pretty good. It did not seem to lag at all in 480p. Then the salesman told me that if I signed up for a Sears credit card, I would get an additional $150 off. I decided to bite at that price. Unfortunately, when he tried to apply the additional $150 off, the register would not accept it. He talked to his manager and discovered that the two discounts could not be stacked. So the price would still be $1205. Now, I am sure this is a good price, but the lost deal there made me second guess my decision, and I did not get the TV. I can always go back and get it later if I decide to.
My question: do you think that price is a good enough deal to go through with?

Also, are the prices on Frys.com the same as in an actual Fry's store? I may drive to the nearest one and try to get the 780p model if so.

Thanks.

#42 M_H   CAG Veteran CAG Veteran   24 Posts   Joined 10.3 Years Ago  

Posted 26 September 2007 - 12:11 AM

Man, I would have fought Best Buy on that one. :P
If you can afford it, and you think the 1080p is worth it, I'd go for that. It is a pretty decent deal. I personally fell 1080p is a pretty great selling point, but I can't bring myself to drop another 200 for it. Your decision entirely.
As for Fry's, I strongly encourage you to call them before you drive out there. Even if the price is the same, they might not have the model in stock.

#43 superstevedogg   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   142 Posts   Joined 14.0 Years Ago  

superstevedogg

Posted 26 September 2007 - 01:49 AM

Yeah, I can match almost anywhere at Sears within reason, but I can't match and then also take 150 off. He could have matched and gave you 18month financing on the sears card, however.

Best buy should have honored that price, I'd go to a different one if you have to.

I don't particularly think hl167 is all that nice, it just doesn't have as good of colors as similar models.

#44 classact   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   432 Posts   Joined 10.7 Years Ago  

Posted 26 September 2007 - 11:42 PM

Im a complete noob to this stuff, Im going to be getting something around 30 inches, and Ive read that anything under 40 you cant really tell the diffrence between 1080I and 720, just wondering if anyone has any more input, as id rather save 100 or so if thats true, I will be using it mainly for 360 and watchin games in hd.

#45 fsecreast   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   450 Posts   Joined 10.8 Years Ago  

Posted 27 September 2007 - 03:38 PM

I'm looking into buying a LCD as well. I'll be using it for 360 and watching cable TV mostly. I'm looking for probably a 37 in. I might be willing to drop down to 32 though. I'm also looking to spend around 1000.

I'm going to be just using it in my bedroom though, do you think 40" might be too big for a bedroom? I plan on wall-mounting it also.