Counterfeit products with Google Checkout?

So, this website was advertising "6 x NINTENDO LOGO SNES SUPER NES CONTROLLER NEW-SEALED" for a mere $20. Crazy good price and I knew something was up. I figured, what the heck, and bit anyway (I was ordering something else from them, so I figured it was worth the $20 to check it out as shipping didn't increase too much.

http://joystores.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=108_47&products_id=228

Anywhoo, I got the items some time ago. Sure enough, they were counterfeit. But they were pretty decent counterfeits - if someone wasn't closely familiar with SNES controllers, they might not notice.

So, giving the seller the benefit of the doubt, I e-mailed them to let them know they were counterfeit. Their reply was: "Thanks for the tips. I will go back to my vendors and see what they say about it. No wonder I got good deal on it." They also offered me a refund if I shipped them back the controllers (they never mentioned if I had to eat the shipping cost back to them).

That was about a month and a half ago. I've never heard anything else from them and they're still selling the counterfeit controllers on their website.

I'm wondering, since I purchased these with Google Checkout, can I file a claim through Google Checkout and get my money back? Anyone familiar with Google Checkout's policies in such a situation?

Google Checkout was very helpful to me when a former CAG ripped me off. I got responses within hours (this was during business days, not sure how they are during the weekends).

As for the seller, I'm guessing he knows they're bootlegs. He's just playing dumb so that you don't report him or anything. I'd contact Nintendo about this... Nintendo probably won't help you directly or anything but they could probably get the seller in trouble.

you can tell in the pic they're fake...the middle of the controller should have the SNES logo

This controlers aare everywhere on the net, even my local fleamarket, $5 a pop, why complain? I dont think you can even buy legit SNES controlers from Nintendo anymore can you?

[quote name='breakingcustoms']you can tell in the pic they're fake...the middle of the controller should have the SNES logo[/QUOTE]

Not necessarily. Original SNES controllers (model SNS-005) have the Super Nintendo logo printed on them. Later controllers (released with the SNES-Mini and sold in the package pictured in this auction) have the Nintendo logo "engraved" into the plastic (SNS-102).

Do the controllers work? Do they feel cheap? If you answered yes and no respectively to those questions, then I don't see the problem. As long as they work and aren't total pieces of crap, why cause so much grief to the seller, unless you planned on reselling them yourself and don't want someone else coming back at you for selling a bootleg controller.

If they're just for your personal use, look at it like you picked up six controllers for $3.33 each.

I wasn't interested in causing grief to the seller - until they've continued to sell the counterfeit items on their website without putting any kind of note on there.

To me, as long as the items work, I don't care if they're fake or not, as long as I get them cheaply(like you did). The only counterfeit I would report someone on is counterfeit money.

Otherwise, you're taking away someones livelihood by reporting them for selling those controllers. Think of it that way, how would you like if someone came to your place of work and got you fired for something?

Wow. If I were doing something illegal at work, then got fired for it, I'd feel bad, but I got what I deserved, didn't I?

[quote name='UncleBob']I wasn't interested in causing grief to the seller - until they've continued to sell the counterfeit items on their website without putting any kind of note on there.[/QUOTE]

They never claimed they were official. Hell, saying "Nintendo Logo Controllers" almost explicitly states counterfeit. Even so, you got a good price and you said yourself that they are high quality.

Like everyone else, I don't see what you're complaining about...

I think the seller should have reacted a little differently, maybe more professional then just oh, my bad, must be the guy I got it from, you want your money back? blah, he should have asked what you wanted to do, if you were just informing, or if you wanted to return them and how they were going to handle shipping. just seems shady to me. but that is just my opinion

Umm... I never said they were high quality.

Since when did CheapAssGamers start thinking that selling counterfeit items were okay? What happened the CAGers who would stand by each other when an eBay seller ripped off someone on CAG with fake merchandise? What happened to the hate for GameStop/EBGames for buying/reselling bootleg GBA carts without a care? Hell, at least GameQuestDirect was actually selling official product.

I've bought numerous 'off-brand' items before and I'm sure some of the legit looking 'first party' controllers I've bought from various stores have been bootlegs.

To me, if there's NO difference in quality, WHO CARES!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Now, if the things work for an hour and then each stop working completely, THEN you have a serious issue.

Otherwise, I don't see the major problem, you got some SNES controllers(albeit 'counterfeit')for CHEAP and now you're going to rat out the seller for selling 'counterfeits'.

Some people would be happy enough to get spare controllers for cheap, is all some of us are trying to say.

If a seller wants to sell off-brand controllers, that's great. I have no problems with that. But they shouldn't try to pass them off as official product, with the official Nintendo seal and what not.

[quote name='IAmTheCheapestGamer']I've bought numerous 'off-brand' items before and I'm sure some of the legit looking 'first party' controllers I've bought from various stores have been bootlegs.

To me, if there's NO difference in quality, WHO CARES!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Now, if the things work for an hour and then each stop working completely, THEN you have a serious issue.

Otherwise, I don't see the major problem, you got some SNES controllers(albeit 'counterfeit')for CHEAP and now you're going to rat out the seller for selling 'counterfeits'.

Some people would be happy enough to get spare controllers for cheap, is all some of us are trying to say.[/quote] Sure, but he should still say if they're counterfeit...

[quote name='UncleBob']If a seller wants to sell off-brand controllers, that's great. I have no problems with that. But they shouldn't try to pass them off as official product, with the official Nintendo seal and what not.[/quote]

I agree with you.

For me, it comes down to the fact that you should be supporting the legit business, not the counterfeiter. It's the same reason I won't buy anime boxsets from Hong Kong, or even download games/music/movies from the internet. If you're too cheap to rent then check your local library.

[quote name='darkslime']Sure, but he should still say if they're counterfeit...[/quote]
He implicitly said they were counterfeit by stating "Nintendo Brand Logo," instead of stating "Official Nintendo Product" or something along those lines. If he wants to return them that is his prerogative, but in my opinion the seller is not passing off his goods as official Nintendo merchandise.

Edit: Here is an example of what a legitimate controller advertisement looks like:
http://www.nintendorepairshop.com/shopexd.asp?id=70

who cares? Arent these the superior quality imitations?

[quote name='ejgarc']He implicitly said they were counterfeit by stating "Nintendo Brand Logo," instead of stating "Official Nintendo Product" or something along those lines.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, the official Nintendo Seal of Quality that notates the product as an "Official Nintendo Product" that's shown in the picture on the product page (twice) must have clouded my judgment.

[quote name='BasketCase1080']who cares? Arent these the superior quality imitations?[/QUOTE]

I can assure you, they are not superior quality in any way, shape or form. They're "useable", yes. But I wouldn't want to be depending on one if I was in some kind of Super Mario Kart death match were the loser gets killed. And you never know when that might happen.

If Nintendo doesn't offer/sell First-party ones anymore, who really cares? There is a limit to how many *official* ones are still out there, so yea, this happens. I mean, look at the amount of NES clones/controllers/etc. since the copytraderightmarkthingy expired. If Nintendo can't supply, others will. I mean, if Nintendo still does sell them by all means complain, but I can't say I've seen a real SNES controller new and unopened in years. At that price you should know to.

"Too good to be true." CAG or not.

Snitches get stitches.

[quote name='UncleBob']Sorry, the official Nintendo Seal of Quality that notates the product as an "Official Nintendo Product" that's shown in the picture on the product page (twice) must have clouded my judgment.[/quote]
I did not see a picture on the product page with the Nintendo Seal of Quality. All I saw was a Super Nintendo controller packaging with Yoshi and Mario on the front.

Edit: Also the merchant offered you a refund. If it was such a problem you should have contacted the merchant again and asked them to pay for the return shipping if you were unsure about the product.

You saw Mario on the front of the package, but didn't see the Nintendo Seal of Quality that's on top of him?

It's not about the refund. It's the fact that the seller is knowingly ripping off customers. I gave this seller the benefit of the doubt and contacted them to let the know the product was fake. A month and a half later, they are still selling the products with no disclaimer that they're third party/counterfeit controllers.

It's sad that, here we have a merchant that's ripping off customers and people here on CAG are actually supporting them.

Again, I don't care that they're 'third party' - but this site shouldn't be passing them off as the real thing. And don't try to defend them that they're not doing this. For example:
http://joystores.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=108_47&products_id=261

Clearly states in the description of the item "Not made by Nintendo". If they weren't trying to pass these off as official merchandise, they could remove them from the fake package that has the Nintendo Seal of Quality and put that simple line on the sales page.

"Snitches get stitches."

Replies like this make me wish Cheapy was serious about the April Fool's joke.

Sorry, but I'm with the TC on this one. Sure, the pad may feel good at first (or not), but I'll be damned if it works as well and for as long as official product. Most counterfeits are inferior to the real things, and I'd expect these to be as well. I'm not against 3rd parties making controllers like this, I just don't like that they pass it off as "the real thing."

"Snitches get stitches."
^ I hope your mother gets murdered by a repeat offender that someone didn't "snitch" on.

[quote name='UncleBob']You saw Mario on the front of the package, but didn't see the Nintendo Seal of Quality that's on top of him?

It's not about the refund. It's the fact that the seller is knowingly ripping off customers. I gave this seller the benefit of the doubt and contacted them to let the know the product was fake. A month and a half later, they are still selling the products with no disclaimer that they're third party/counterfeit controllers.

It's sad that, here we have a merchant that's ripping off customers and people here on CAG are actually supporting them.

Again, I don't care that they're 'third party' - but this site shouldn't be passing them off as the real thing. And don't try to defend them that they're not doing this. For example:
http://joystores.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=108_47&products_id=261

Clearly states in the description of the item "Not made by Nintendo". If they weren't trying to pass these off as official merchandise, they could remove them from the fake package that has the Nintendo Seal of Quality and put that simple line on the sales page.

"Snitches get stitches."

Replies like this make me wish Cheapy was serious about the April Fool's joke.[/quote]

So, you're annoyed by them putting them in those packages and the fact that they didn't put a big flashing disclaimer on it saying they're 'not official Nintendo products'.

You know how many knockoffs use similar packaging and designs to the originals? Around here, there's a flea market where the one person is selling "PopStations", which were designed to look like a PSP. They're in a box similar to the original PSP boxes and people should know they're not actually Playstation Portables. However, I'm sure some idiots still buy them just because they LOOK like the real thing.

If people do their own homework and become INFORMED consumers, there will be NO NEED for ratting out sellers for selling 'offbrand' or 'counterfeit' merchandise. But, people are lazy and expect things to be as advertised. This is why CC and BB get SO MANY with their bait and switch tactics.

I'm not saying you're lazy, TC, however the price should've been a dead giveaway that these weren't exactly original controllers.

Oh and what is this 'April Fool's joke' from Cheapy?

cheapy did an april fools joke saying that CAG was switching to a payed service reading:


In an effort to create a more tightly-knit community and to cover escalating server costs, I'm excited to announce our new Premium Insider Membership Program. I believe this move will help eliminate some of our less-desirable members and bring the community closer together. The program will kick-off next week.

Accessing the site will still be free for all, but we will now have different tiers of membership.

Guest (Free)

• Can read the site, create one topic, one post, and one private message per day
• Private message box limited to 10 messages

Silver ($10/year)

• Can create unlimited topics, posts, and private messages
• Private message box limit raised to 250

Gold ($50/year)

• Can create unlimited topics, posts, and private messages
• Private message box limit raised to 500
• Can upload and attach images to posts
• Can have avatar and signature
• Site is advertisement free

Platinum ($100/year)
All Gold benefits, plus:

• Private message box limit raised to 1000
• Private deals and coupons from your favorite retailers
• Custom avatar drawn by WhipSmartBanky
• Immunity from infractions/bannings (some limitations apply)
• Be a Forum Guide in the forum of your choosing (optional)
• Can download CAGcast 2 days early
• Access to private forum for Platinum members only
• CheapyD autographed photo
• 1 day tour of Tokyo w/CheapyD (airfare and accommodations not included, scheduling conflicts may occur)

Platinum memberships will be limited, so please contact us to reserve your spot. No deposit is required at this time.


So basically the guy that thought that he could actually get six original controllers would rather pay a good amount of money so that he doesn't have to be bothered by all of us "trolls" that disagree with him

I just saw that April Fool's joke and while I would probably gladly pay the $10 a year myself if it were true, the CAG in me would be PMing Cheapy to ask if there were some sort of coupon code I could input to get a percentage off.

Of course, if the $100 Platinum level included no banning for being my usual argumentative self, then that would be a STEAL for me.

I do think we need to clear something up right now - these controllers are not "Off Brand" - they are *counterfeit*. These two things are nothing alike.

"You know how many knockoffs use similar packaging and designs to the originals?"

This isn't a "similar" package. It's an exact copy (I still have an original box). World of difference.

"there will be NO NEED for ratting out sellers for selling 'offbrand' or 'counterfeit' merchandise."

One could argue that if sellers wouldn't sell counterfeit merchandise and properly advertise the merchandise they are selling, there'd be no need to "rat" them out either. If I had to pick between blaming a consumer for believing an advertisement or the seller for lying in their advertisement, I'm going to go with blaming the seller.
"But, people are lazy and expect things to be as advertised."

Damn those people who want truth in advertising.

"pay a good amount of money so that he doesn't have to be bothered by all of us "trolls" that disagree with him"

That's not at all what I said. I don't have an issue with people who have a different opinion than me - it's ignorant people who post crap like "snitches get stitches" that I take issue with and would gladly pay to be rid of.

I researched a bit and found I support UncleBob even more now. The box listed on the site is a dead ringer for the official one.
Compare:
http://joystores.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=108_47&products_id=228
http://cgi.ebay.com/OFFICIAL-SNES-S...ameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting

Also, the item description says that the controllers are "limited," which would be the case for old, still-boxed Nintendo controllers, but I doubt counterfeits are in any kind of shortage.

Either way, you still bought what looked like SNES controllers for cheap. You later on found out they weren't legit ones and now you're making a capital case out of it. Unless you planned on reselling them for profit, I don't see what the problem with getting cheap controllers is.

Yes, they looked like they were advertised as the real thing, so if that's your main gripe get a refund and be done with it.

The problem with them is (provided he plans on using them) is that they probably aren't as reliable as the real thing because they were probably made in a sweatshop (or equivalent). He has also said that his main gripe isn't that he didn't have recourse (he could've gotten a refund if he so chose), but that the company lied about being ignorant of the fact that they were bootlegs and continued representing them on the site as the real thing.

Counterfeits, most of the time, are of a lesser quality than the real thing (or their licensed, tested equivilents), so it DOES matter that it is a fake rather than real.

Well, like I said, there must be another reason why the OP was so infuriated with them. Many would simply move on already and stop focusing on it or ended up getting a refund like the OP WAS OFFERED, but they must've planned on reselling them, which is why they wanna get the seller in trouble for it. Either way, if you think that other products aren't made in sweatshops or worse anymore, you're sadly mistaken.

If people being paid a good wage actually made some of the stuff we buy today, we might not have items which fail or begin to fail within a year or two(the Xbox 360, for one).

It's all about getting stuff made as cheaply as possible to up the profit potential for those selling them.

If people being paid a good wage actually made some of the stuff we buy today, we might not have items which fail or begin to fail within a year or two(the Xbox 360, for one).

The 360s aren't failing because they were made in sweatshops, they are failing because of a design flaw.

Well, for whatever reason they're failing, but I also meant that many other products are also made in sweatshops and many of them don't last as long as they should. So, should we go and rat out every company selling us sneakers, toys and so on that don't last?

Or should we be more informed consumers and simply ask for a refund if something is not to our liking and then buy from a company we know and trust.

But, snitching on the seller is taking away their livelihood. Would you like it if someone ratted you out if you were to sell something that they said was 'counterfeit'? What if it were your ONLY source of income?

I'm sure 90% of the people buying these 'fake' controllers just wanted exactly what they got, that being cheap SNES controllers.

while i think the OP should have been more prudent and not so gullible, IAmTheCheapestGamer, while in most cases buyers of the fake controllers probably don't give a shit, 10% such as UncleBob do, and I can't deny that the online store webpage is somewhat deceptive (yeah, more informed consumers wouldn't be so dumb, but what about grandmas and the like??)

>"Well, like I said, there must be another reason why the OP was so infuriated with them. "

I thought I made it pretty clear, but apparently I haven't. My issue with the site isn't that they sold me counterfeit merchandise - it's that they sold counterfeit merchandise *knowing* it was counterfeit and making no move to prevent others from buying the counterfeit merchandise without telling them it was counterfeit.

I have no plans to resell the merchandise. I own two SNES units and a 5-Player multi-tap that I get out on occasion to play 4-Player Bomberman. While I have SNES controllers, I wanted a few back-ups and I thought this was a good deal.

Again, my "gripe" isn't that they sold me counterfeit merchandise - it's that they sold me counterfeit merchandise, represented it to be the real stuff, then continue to sell it with no disclaimers after being notified that it is counterfeit.

If I really wanted to be a pain about it, I could always contact the postal service and see about mail fraud charges.

[quote name='blaked569']while i think the OP should have been more prudent and not so gullible, IAmTheCheapestGamer, while in most cases buyers of the fake controllers probably don't give a shit, 10% such as UncleBob do, and I can't deny that the online store webpage is somewhat deceptive (yeah, more informed consumers wouldn't be so dumb, but what about grandmas and the like??)[/quote]

Did the OP REALLY think they had struck a gold mine to find original SNES controllers for $3 and change each? I certainly hope not, unless they researched it and the site they went to was listed as an authorized reseller.

As for the grannies, unless they're educated on these matters, they may think like the OP did, that they got a great deal and that whoever they may be giving them to will enjoy them.

I'm sure 90% of their business goes to those who ARE uninformed who won't nitpick over getting something like the OP did, since they don't know what the original controllers looked like.

Anyway, I'm done trying to preach to the self righteous choir, but think of it this way. What if the reseller selling these items is a small time businessperson just trying to eke out a living selling stuff online. What if you take food out of their kids mouths by threatening to 'rat them out' to Google or whoever? Can you live with possibly starving a family trying to make a name for themselves online selling what they may have believed to be legit items?

Sure, they didn't respond to you, but did you ever think they may be swamped with e-mails and orders and will get back to you eventually?

Even if they don't, they offered you a refund, which means they were trying to 'make things right', but by no means should they have to kotow to your demand of putting a disclaimer on THEIR webpage.

Take the refund and consider it a lesson learned to simply look for sites which are authorized Nintendo resellers.