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Looking for a new HDTV - any suggestions where to go?


#1 Ultimate_Joe   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   54 Posts   Joined 8.9 Years Ago  

Ultimate_Joe

Posted 20 July 2009 - 03:55 AM

I'm still using an old 36" CRT and I really need to upgrade my TV.

I've been looking on Craigslist lately, and a lot of people in my area seem to be selling +60" DLP TVs for around $600-$700, which seems like an awesome idea to me. I know DLP is a little bigger than LCD/etc but I've heard that they really work wonderfully as gaming TVs. Hard to pass up a TV twice the size of an LCD for half the price.

On the other hand though, if you guys have any hidden gems on great cheap places to fing HDTV's - I'd love to hear about it.
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#2 Furashu   CAG Mercenary CAGiversary!   3654 Posts   Joined 12.1 Years Ago  

Posted 20 July 2009 - 05:47 AM

avsforums

or blu-ray.com/forums

:)


#3 doubledown   Funky Daddy CAGiversary!   11757 Posts   Joined 14.3 Years Ago  

Posted 20 July 2009 - 11:55 PM

I have a Sony 60A2020 (I believe that is the model offhand) and I love it. The picture is pretty darn nice and you definetely get a LOT more TV for the money. If space is not really an issue, I would recommend one. I also have a 32" LCD and I'll admint the picture is pretty nice on that, but you would be hard pressed to find anything in 50" LCD for under $1000.

Mitsubishi seems to be the main company selling Rear Projection TV's, and they do make a quality product. I have a huge RPTV (the big ass box one) and it was great....then I needed more space and sold it for the 60"

#4 willardhaven   Thief of Life CAGiversary!   7086 Posts   Joined 14.3 Years Ago  

willardhaven

Posted 21 July 2009 - 12:15 AM

Panasonic 42" Plasma, I think they go for about $600 for 720p and $800 for 1080p.

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#5 mission42   To start, press any key CAGiversary!   1561 Posts   Joined 9.7 Years Ago  

Posted 21 July 2009 - 12:51 AM

I bought a 47" Philips LCD awhile ago and love it. I think I paid around $900 for it and that was about 6 months ago.
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#6 sweetjunks   CAG Veteran CAG Veteran   19 Posts   Joined 10.3 Years Ago  

sweetjunks

Posted 21 July 2009 - 12:53 AM

Samsung you just can't beat the price for the performance and they are real cheap at best buy right now.

#7 Ultimate_Joe   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   54 Posts   Joined 8.9 Years Ago  

Ultimate_Joe

Posted 23 July 2009 - 01:38 AM

Thanks for the tips guys. That AVSForums site is awesome. Samsung does seem a good contender at this point.
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#8 willardhaven   Thief of Life CAGiversary!   7086 Posts   Joined 14.3 Years Ago  

willardhaven

Posted 23 July 2009 - 01:42 AM

Just stick to a plasma, LCDs are not as good for gaming.

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#9 squishface   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   1799 Posts   Joined 9.4 Years Ago  

squishface

Posted 23 July 2009 - 01:47 AM

Samsung you just can't beat the price for the performance and they are real cheap at best buy right now.



I agree, You can't beat samsung on their tvs and lcds right now. Sony is trying but they are not there yet. Sams club and sears has some good deals on samsungs right now. Amazon has decent deals to if you want to buy your tv online.
"I do whatever my Rice Krispies tell me to!"

#10 jaso   Requiesce in pace CAGiversary!   1873 Posts   Joined 14.8 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 01:51 AM

Just stick to a plasma, LCDs are not as good for gaming.


I would advise exactly the opposite. While color reproduction is often better with plasmas, you'll want an LCD if you plan on gaming on it.

I own a Samsung PN50A450 50-inch plasma (2008 model), and I love it. But anyone who says burn-in/image retention is a thing of the past is wrong. I'm broken-in now, but I had to be very careful not to play games with HUDS in the first 6 months, because I'd get image retention very easy. And that was keeping the brightness turned down on movie mode.

Go LCD. Maybe even DLP if size is an issue.

Here's a Slickdeals thread for a 40-inch 1080P Samsung LCD + HDMI cable + 200 Dell gift card for $900 with free shipping. Pretty decent:
http://forums.slickd...d.php?t=1461425

Here was a similar-spec Toshiba LCD that was going for $600 shipped outright, which was a good price - and Toshiba makes nice LCDs:
http://forums.slickd...05970&t=1458443

#11 willardhaven   Thief of Life CAGiversary!   7086 Posts   Joined 14.3 Years Ago  

willardhaven

Posted 23 July 2009 - 02:08 AM

Just my personal experience, the best thing to do is try the tvs yourself.

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#12 Ultimate_Joe   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   54 Posts   Joined 8.9 Years Ago  

Ultimate_Joe

Posted 23 July 2009 - 02:16 AM

I want to stay away from Plasma, because I live in Colorado, and I've read that the high altitude can make them burn out faster due to the low air pressure.
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#13 HeadRusch   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   1290 Posts   Joined 13.7 Years Ago  

HeadRusch

Posted 23 July 2009 - 02:27 AM

If you buy a DLP off craigslist remember that DLP's run on bulbs, and those bulbs need to be replaced if they blow out...and those bulbs can be $200-$400 a pop. On the other hand, you can get a brand new 60" DLP from Tigerdirect for like 1200 bucks now. My 65" Mitsubishi CRT 1080i set still works great, but its better as a movie display than a gaming display because games just seem to look better on digital displays.......

DLP is dead for anything except Front Projection at this point........thats why almost nobody makes them anymore.

The standard 60hz LCD is now a dinosaur as 120Hz and 240Hz models, along with LED backlighting take center stage, making deals on 60Hz panels tasty right now...but usually not by much, depending on the brand.

I dont like Plasmas because they use too much power and yes, if you plan on doing lots of gaming, image retention is a problem.


PS: To the poster above, Brightness has nothing to do with image retention....its Contrast that causes burn in/image retention........if you want to save your display you have to lower the contrast settings.

#14 seen   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   2503 Posts   Joined 10.9 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 07:54 AM

I need some help here regarding this topic....

I'm torn between a LCD and Plasma because I am a cheapass about spending money on electricity. Can anyone tell from the info below if there is much of a cost difference between using the LCD vs plasma?

Taken from Panasonic's website comparing a 37" LCD(I wish they made them larger) and a 42" Plasma

Rated Power Consumption Plasma-286W LCD-176W
Standby Power Consumption Plasma-.3W LCD-.6W
On Mode Average Power Consumption Plasma-155W LCD-119W

#15 ilivas   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   147 Posts   Joined 9.4 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 08:02 AM

Plasma uses much more electricity, but however plasma is superior when it comes to input lag, black levels, and overall picture quality.

Best perfomance for the money has got to be a panasonic plasma. I own a samsung plasma now, and it's a decent set, but not as good as a panny. I also use a benq 1080p dlp projector on a 120" screen, and lag is unbearable if you're really into it for competitive gaming. For casual gamers, it's probably fine.

#16 ilivas   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   147 Posts   Joined 9.4 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 08:06 AM

I would advise exactly the opposite. While color reproduction is often better with plasmas, you'll want an LCD if you plan on gaming on it.

I own a Samsung PN50A450 50-inch plasma (2008 model), and I love it. But anyone who says burn-in/image retention is a thing of the past is wrong. I'm broken-in now, but I had to be very careful not to play games with HUDS in the first 6 months, because I'd get image retention very easy. And that was keeping the brightness turned down on movie mode.

Go LCD. Maybe even DLP if size is an issue.

Here's a Slickdeals thread for a 40-inch 1080P Samsung LCD + HDMI cable + 200 Dell gift card for $900 with free shipping. Pretty decent:
http://forums.slickd...d.php?t=1461425

Here was a similar-spec Toshiba LCD that was going for $600 shipped outright, which was a good price - and Toshiba makes nice LCDs:
http://forums.slickd...05970&t=1458443


Image retention is always there, but it normally goes away in a few minutes. Permanent burn-in rarely happens. It's really only noticeable during solid black screens.

#17 seen   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   2503 Posts   Joined 10.9 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 09:48 AM

I just found an online calculator to give me an estimate of the difference involved; only a mere $30, looks like I maybe getting a Plasma after-all. The most I estimated I would use it per day would be 12 hours.

So in the end the price difference is not great; does anyone disagree, if so why?

#18 HeadRusch   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   1290 Posts   Joined 13.7 Years Ago  

HeadRusch

Posted 23 July 2009 - 12:32 PM

I love the statement above..."Its really only noticible during solid black screens". You're screwing up your set, and somehow justifying it by saying its 'not so bad'.

If you're playing another game and see ghosting from some other game's health bar or whatever, or you're seeing it during a movie, you've just thrown away $800+ for "less input lag". Deeper blacks don't even factor into the equation much either......

Get an LCD with a game mode (which almost all of them have). If you are an..."ahem"....competetive player, stick with CRT.

The lowest power consuming sets these days are LED sets............they draw minimal power and can save a few bucks a year and dont throw off the heat that a plasma will do.

#19 jpw21683   Welcome to the gun show. CAGiversary!   160 Posts   Joined 11.6 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 01:30 PM

I love the statement above..."Its really only noticible during solid black screens". You're screwing up your set, and somehow justifying it by saying its 'not so bad'.

If you're playing another game and see ghosting from some other game's health bar or whatever, or you're seeing it during a movie, you've just thrown away $800+ for "less input lag". Deeper blacks don't even factor into the equation much either......

How is it "screwing up your set"? It's not permanent and goes away after regular use. Once the TV has been broken-in, image retention is even less of an issue. Finally, most newer plasmas have a anti-image retention menu option you can run manually to remove the retention, if it's that huge of a deal.

Contrast ratio (i.e. "deeper blacks") IS a huge deal for movies AND gaming. If you're playing a dark game (the FEAR & Condemned games come to mind), you need a good contrast ratio...otherwise everything will look like a gray, washed-out blob.

To the OP, I would recommend a plasma. They are more affordable than comparably-sized LCDs, and the picture quality/contrast ratio cannot be beaten for the price. I purchased the Panasonic TC-P50X1 50" 720p in April for ~$1000 and have not been disappointed. I use it for Blu-ray & gaming, and it performs phenominally.

Finally, regarding power consumption for plasmas...Crutchfield has a helpful article where they compared REAL-WORLD power consumption of many TV models. My Panny is the most energy-efficient 50" plasma they tested, and very close to LCDs of comparable size.

#20 ilivas   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   147 Posts   Joined 9.4 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 01:34 PM

I love the statement above..."Its really only noticible during solid black screens". You're screwing up your set, and somehow justifying it by saying its 'not so bad'.

If you're playing another game and see ghosting from some other game's health bar or whatever, or you're seeing it during a movie, you've just thrown away $800+ for "less input lag". Deeper blacks don't even factor into the equation much either......

Get an LCD with a game mode (which almost all of them have). If you are an..."ahem"....competetive player, stick with CRT.

The lowest power consuming sets these days are LED sets............they draw minimal power and can save a few bucks a year and dont throw off the heat that a plasma will do.


How am I screwing up my set if it goes away after time? I've owned my plasma for 2 years now, which I only use for gaming in my man cave. There is no hint of permanent burn-in whatsoever. Myself, and many others game on plasmas without any issues, with the benefits of picture quality as well. I can game for hours, and then I'll only see IR when the screen turns black. I can then turn on a movie, and it's gone. It rarely happens now that I've had the set for a while, as it gets more broken in.

I used to own a CRT, but it's inpractical to have something as ugly, and heavy as a 60" CRT. My girlfriend would never allow it in our house anyways. It's nice to have a plasma on the wall.

Why don't deeper blacks factor into the equation... Black levels should be a very important factor when choosing a set for picture quality. They also normally provide greater contrast, and no motion blur. LCD keeps coming out with new tech, which is just trying to close the gap between LCD, and plasma.

LED tv's are still LCDs at heart, and I wouldn't use it for gaming.

I'm one of those people that switch AV equipment out very frequently. I've owned several LCDs in my home in the past couple years. I no longer own any LCDs. Although, I'm considering one for my bedroom since the plasma in my bedroom, like you said puts out a lot of heat. Paired with an xbox 360, it gets hot in the room. We only use that display to watch tv, movies, and play scene-it with my girlfriend. The picture quality of a plasma is just too good when calibrated. LCD doesn't compare.

Edited by ilivas, 23 July 2009 - 01:47 PM.


#21 ilivas   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   147 Posts   Joined 9.4 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 01:38 PM

How is it "screwing up your set"? It's not permanent and goes away after regular use. Once the TV has been broken-in, image retention is even less of an issue. Finally, most newer plasmas have a anti-image retention menu option you can run manually to remove the retention, if it's that huge of a deal.

Contrast ratio (i.e. "deeper blacks") IS a huge deal for movies AND gaming. If you're playing a dark game (the FEAR & Condemned games come to mind), you need a good contrast ratio...otherwise everything will look like a gray, washed-out blob.

To the OP, I would recommend a plasma. They are more affordable than comparably-sized LCDs, and the picture quality/contrast ratio cannot be beaten for the price. I purchased the Panasonic TC-P50X1 50" 720p in April for ~$1000 and have not been disappointed. I use it for Blu-ray & gaming, and it performs phenominally.

Finally, regarding power consumption for plasmas...Crutchfield has a helpful article where they compared REAL-WORLD power consumption of many TV models. My Panny is the most energy-efficient 50" plasma they tested, and very close to LCDs of comparable size.


I agree... I would rather have a nice 768p panasonic plasma than pretty much any of the 1080p consumer level LCDs.

My buddy has a 768p pioneer kuro, and I've never seen ANY LCD look close to as good as this plasma, the 1080p version is just in another league.

#22 HeadRusch   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   1290 Posts   Joined 13.7 Years Ago  

HeadRusch

Posted 23 July 2009 - 01:48 PM

Image Retention is the pretty Plasma-fied term people use because Burn-In was scaring people off. Broken in just means your set is dimming. My gripe is when people claim Image Retention isn't permanent...because it can be, and frankly to tell people its always temporary is a lie. The net is clogged with people even today with health-bars, channel logos and stuff that never goes away. "oh but my set pixel shifts!"....meh, surprise.

My gripe is when people say "Yeah it usually goes away after a few hours"......to me that few hours I have to look at a ghosted image is unacceptable if I'm watching a movie, or playing some brand new game.....

The absolute black levels of Plasmas today are about what a decent mid-tier LCD is going to run you, not a sharp with 10,000:1 ratio....but the Sonys, Samsungs..some of the LG's.....

Buy what you like, I wouldn't game with a plasma regularly unless I was prepared to screw it up......

#23 ilivas   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   147 Posts   Joined 9.4 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 02:01 PM

Image Retention is the pretty Plasma-fied term people use because Burn-In was scaring people off. Broken in just means your set is dimming. My gripe is when people claim Image Retention isn't permanent...because it can be, and frankly to tell people its always temporary is a lie. The net is clogged with people even today with health-bars, channel logos and stuff that never goes away. "oh but my set pixel shifts!"....meh, surprise.

My gripe is when people say "Yeah it usually goes away after a few hours"......to me that few hours I have to look at a ghosted image is unacceptable if I'm watching a movie, or playing some brand new game.....

The absolute black levels of Plasmas today are about what a decent mid-tier LCD is going to run you, not a sharp with 10,000:1 ratio....but the Sonys, Samsungs..some of the LG's.....

Buy what you like, I wouldn't game with a plasma regularly unless I was prepared to screw it up......


Permanent Burn-in does happen, but it's very rare. I'd say that the same amount of people have failing LCDs, as people that have permanent burn-in on plasma displays.


Ghosting is gone very quickly. It actually goes away in minutes when watching regular broadcast tv or a movie. You won't hardly even see it when you switch to broadcast tv because it only shows up with black screen, and in a few minutes you won't see it at all. Ghosting really only appears after playing games with white huds. It never happens with broadcast tv logos, since they're normally low contrast logos.

The black levels of todays plasmas are still superior to top tier LCDs of today. I've never seen any LCD come close to the black levels of last generation's kuro. Panasonic plasmas are slowly catching up, and may eventually surpass kuro black levels, and contrast.

Like I said, gaming successully on a plasma is not uncommon, there are countless amounts of satisfied users. I'd rather play on a superior display, even if it means ghosting for a few minutes during the occasional black screens after playing a video game.

#24 HeadRusch   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   1290 Posts   Joined 13.7 Years Ago  

HeadRusch

Posted 23 July 2009 - 02:06 PM

Buy what you like, everyone has an opinion.....

#25 jaso   Requiesce in pace CAGiversary!   1873 Posts   Joined 14.8 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 03:36 PM

Image Retention is the pretty Plasma-fied term people use because Burn-In was scaring people off. Broken in just means your set is dimming. My gripe is when people claim Image Retention isn't permanent...because it can be, and frankly to tell people its always temporary is a lie. The net is clogged with people even today with health-bars, channel logos and stuff that never goes away. "oh but my set pixel shifts!"....meh, surprise.

My gripe is when people say "Yeah it usually goes away after a few hours"......to me that few hours I have to look at a ghosted image is unacceptable if I'm watching a movie, or playing some brand new game.....

The absolute black levels of Plasmas today are about what a decent mid-tier LCD is going to run you, not a sharp with 10,000:1 ratio....but the Sonys, Samsungs..some of the LG's.....

Buy what you like, I wouldn't game with a plasma regularly unless I was prepared to screw it up......


This sums up exactly how I feel.

#26 Koggit   almost sorry CAGiversary!   3886 Posts   Joined 14.5 Years Ago  

Posted 23 July 2009 - 05:10 PM

I had a 56" 720p Samsung DLP and loved it, sold it on Craigslist for $500 a couple years after paying $2200, they got a kickass deal, the only drawbacks really are that you gotta change the bulb (mine had about 10,000 hours on it on the first bulb but it was getting dim & replacement is $100+) and the viewing angle sorta sucked from below

#27 seen   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   2503 Posts   Joined 10.9 Years Ago  

Posted 02 August 2009 - 04:51 AM

Needing some help here as I am torn between a 42" Panasonic Plasma or a 50" for roughly $200 more. I will be buying a 720p set as I won't be watching much 1080 content.

The distance from my couch to the area the tv would be is about 11 feet; the wall area behind the tv is about 6 feet wide. I've read a few articles online already and no one has a perfect answer and I respect preference but input does help. From what I understand I might be best off getting a 42" as I am concerned about the angle.

Help anyone?

#28 ilivas   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   147 Posts   Joined 9.4 Years Ago  

Posted 02 August 2009 - 07:48 AM

Needing some help here as I am torn between a 42" Panasonic Plasma or a 50" for roughly $200 more. I will be buying a 720p set as I won't be watching much 1080 content.

The distance from my couch to the area the tv would be is about 11 feet; the wall area behind the tv is about 6 feet wide. I've read a few articles online already and no one has a perfect answer and I respect preference but input does help. From what I understand I might be best off getting a 42" as I am concerned about the angle.

Help anyone?


One strength of plasmas are that, they have near 180 degree viewing angles... so angle shouldnt be a problem.

I think $200 is worth an extra 8 inches on the tv.

#29 lolwut?   Thank you BasedGod CAGiversary!   4373 Posts   Joined 10.0 Years Ago  

Posted 02 August 2009 - 08:10 AM

Needing some help here as I am torn between a 42" Panasonic Plasma or a 50" for roughly $200 more. I will be buying a 720p set as I won't be watching much 1080 content.

The distance from my couch to the area the tv would be is about 11 feet; the wall area behind the tv is about 6 feet wide. I've read a few articles online already and no one has a perfect answer and I respect preference but input does help. From what I understand I might be best off getting a 42" as I am concerned about the angle.

Help anyone?


I'd go with the 50" at least; 11 feet is pretty far away (edit: Well it looks like I lay about 10 feet away from mine, so it's not as bad as I thought. Then again I have a 52", so that helps :D). Like the guy above me said, $200 is worth it for 8 extra inches.


#30 HeadRusch   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   1290 Posts   Joined 13.7 Years Ago  

HeadRusch

Posted 02 August 2009 - 04:00 PM

If you want a 720p plasma, Newegg has several at 50" for 799....which is dirt cheap.