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2012 MLB Discussion


#391 CaseyRyback   Your New Nightmare! Super Moderators   24095 Posts   Joined 11.5 Years Ago  

CaseyRyback

Posted 05 August 2012 - 12:15 AM

It's nice to see Scott Feldman put it together after his early season struggles. He has earned the right to stay in the rotation.

#392 Icegaryen   Stuart and the Ave CAGiversary!   575 Posts   Joined 4.4 Years Ago  

Posted 05 August 2012 - 01:27 AM

Felix is the best pitcher in baseball. He better get an award this year.

#393 Feeding the Abscess   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   2716 Posts   Joined 5.8 Years Ago   Has been playing Diablo III: Ultimate Evil Edition
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Feeding the Abscess

Posted 05 August 2012 - 05:34 AM

He's had 4 straight years of 20+ HR an solid BA AVG and is on pace to do it again this year. Judges love that longetivity. He is a solid player but not 14 mill worthy in my opinion. Knowing Sabean who did not persue Bay, Holiday, Beltran when they were available, I wouldn't be surprised to see him get traded.

fWAR is very flawed for figuring out the value of players in terms of salary.

Brett Gardner

2010: $24.6
2011: $23.1

Was Gardner really twice as valuable as Pence in 2010?


Perhaps not twice as valuable, but he was certainly more valuable than Pence. He had a 58 point advantage in OBP, was a better baserunner, and is an elite defensive OF. Even if you regress his 24.9 UZR to more closely resemble his 2009 mark of 9.3, he'd have been worth around $18.5 million in 2010 dollars.

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#394 DestroVega   Life is short... stunt it CAGiversary!   7108 Posts   Joined 7.7 Years Ago  

DestroVega

Posted 05 August 2012 - 02:58 PM

Felix is the best pitcher in baseball. He better get an award this year.


Um. He did last year.

#395 Icegaryen   Stuart and the Ave CAGiversary!   575 Posts   Joined 4.4 Years Ago  

Posted 05 August 2012 - 06:03 PM

Perhaps not twice as valuable, but he was certainly more valuable than Pence. He had a 58 point advantage in OBP, was a better baserunner, and is an elite defensive OF. Even if you regress his 24.9 UZR to more closely resemble his 2009 mark of 9.3, he'd have been worth around $18.5 million in 2010 dollars.


Fair enough but I don not like the emphasis of UZR on WAR. UZR is a very flaawed stat and is given too much of a value when figuring out a player' worth in my opinion.

Um. He did last year.

He won the Cy in 2010 not last year.

#396 DestroVega   Life is short... stunt it CAGiversary!   7108 Posts   Joined 7.7 Years Ago  

DestroVega

Posted 05 August 2012 - 09:46 PM

Oh yeah. My bad. Verlander won it last year.

#397 Icegaryen   Stuart and the Ave CAGiversary!   575 Posts   Joined 4.4 Years Ago  

Posted 15 August 2012 - 02:32 AM

Kuroda needs some recognition, shut out the best offense in baseball with only 2 hits allowed.

#398 GhostShark   The Drunken Whaler CAGiversary!   3143 Posts   Joined 5.2 Years Ago  

GhostShark

Posted 15 August 2012 - 04:39 AM

Let's not get this Twisted, Kuroda did indeed pitch well, and has all season (Curse me for dropping him early on Fantasy), but the Rangers killed themselves tonight. They go up there waving at the first pitch they say. They've hardly worked counts in the two games in NY so far.

Washington needs change the line-up. Mike Olt should be playing over Mike Young (the worst player in baseball based on WAR) and Craig Gentry being delegated to a bench position is just maddening. Back to Mike Young, the man hasn't hit a homer in nearly 2 months, and has just 6 XBH in the past month or so. He's declined, and he's declined quick. And Ron Washington refusing to bench him is just mind-boggling.
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#399 Icegaryen   Stuart and the Ave CAGiversary!   575 Posts   Joined 4.4 Years Ago  

Posted 15 August 2012 - 06:51 PM

Now we know how Melky went from being the worst player in baseball in Atlanta to a star...

#400 JJSP   Beyond economical repair. CAGiversary!   9859 Posts   Joined 8.6 Years Ago  

Posted 15 August 2012 - 07:12 PM

Melky missing the rest of the year means this pennant race in the NL West is going to get very interesting.

#401 n8rockerasu   Shhh...I'm Invisible CAGiversary!   15128 Posts   Joined 8.6 Years Ago  

n8rockerasu

Posted 15 August 2012 - 07:51 PM

What's weird though is that he only had 11 home runs this year...but was hitting an incredible .346. PEDs don't help your hand eye coordination or your bat speed. At first, I wanted to say "Ha...that explains it!" too considering all the below average years he spent in NY/ATL/KC. But really, if you look at his numbers, it doesn't make much sense. I really don't even see what benefit he could have been getting from them. Melky has always been mentally deficient though, so this could very easily be a case of "I think they're helping me...so they must be!" Just Melky being Melky.

#402 Viol8tor   Go Lakers! CAGiversary!   703 Posts   Joined 8.3 Years Ago  

Posted 15 August 2012 - 07:58 PM

50 game suspension. 45 games left in the regular season. :-#


Lets go Dodgers!
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#403 DestroVega   Life is short... stunt it CAGiversary!   7108 Posts   Joined 7.7 Years Ago  

DestroVega

Posted 15 August 2012 - 08:21 PM

What's weird though is that he only had 11 home runs this year...but was hitting an incredible .346. PEDs don't help your hand eye coordination or your bat speed. At first, I wanted to say "Ha...that explains it!" too considering all the below average years he spent in NY/ATL/KC. But really, if you look at his numbers, it doesn't make much sense. I really don't even see what benefit he could have been getting from them. Melky has always been mentally deficient though, so this could very easily be a case of "I think they're helping me...so they must be!" Just Melky being Melky.


But they can help your bat speed in the sense they make your muscles recover quicker and fatigue over a season can wear you down.

#404 pitfallharry219   Salty milk & pennies CAGiversary!   11752 Posts   Joined 8.8 Years Ago  

pitfallharry219

Posted 15 August 2012 - 08:38 PM

I wonder if they'll take that ASG MVP car away from him. :lol:

#405 tcrash247   ghosts.nin.com CAGiversary!   3592 Posts   Joined 11.5 Years Ago  

Posted 15 August 2012 - 10:15 PM

King Felix with the perfecto.

#406 pitfallharry219   Salty milk & pennies CAGiversary!   11752 Posts   Joined 8.8 Years Ago  

pitfallharry219

Posted 15 August 2012 - 10:19 PM

Out of the last six perfect games, three of them have been against Tampa Bay.

#407 n8rockerasu   Shhh...I'm Invisible CAGiversary!   15128 Posts   Joined 8.6 Years Ago  

n8rockerasu

Posted 15 August 2012 - 10:45 PM

But they can help your bat speed in the sense they make your muscles recover quicker and fatigue over a season can wear you down.


Yeah, but so could "less partying", which is something Melky also had a problem with.

#408 GhostShark   The Drunken Whaler CAGiversary!   3143 Posts   Joined 5.2 Years Ago  

GhostShark

Posted 15 August 2012 - 11:19 PM

There have been 4 no-hitters against Tampa Bay in the last 3-4 years, as well. I wonder if the Rays fans come to expect it now.
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#409 Icegaryen   Stuart and the Ave CAGiversary!   575 Posts   Joined 4.4 Years Ago  

Posted 16 August 2012 - 02:07 AM

There have been 4 no-hitters against Tampa Bay in the last 3-4 years, as well. I wonder if the Rays fans come to expect it now.

Ahahaha Rays fans..good one.

Tampa realizes that there is a team a few miles away from the city when Rays make the post season.

#410 CaseyRyback   Your New Nightmare! Super Moderators   24095 Posts   Joined 11.5 Years Ago  

CaseyRyback

Posted 16 August 2012 - 02:23 AM

What's weird though is that he only had 11 home runs this year...but was hitting an incredible .346. PEDs don't help your hand eye coordination or your bat speed. At first, I wanted to say "Ha...that explains it!" too considering all the below average years he spent in NY/ATL/KC. But really, if you look at his numbers, it doesn't make much sense. I really don't even see what benefit he could have been getting from them. Melky has always been mentally deficient though, so this could very easily be a case of "I think they're helping me...so they must be!" Just Melky being Melky.


Bond's average went through the roof when he started hitting the juice. He went from being 1A/1B with Griffey as far as best player of his generation to being the third best hitter of all time.

#411 dmaul1114   Banned Banned   24688 Posts   Joined 10.3 Years Ago  

dmaul1114

Posted 17 August 2012 - 02:14 PM

Braves continue to play well--20 games over .500 now. Just can't make up ground in the NL East as the Nats keep wining and have the best record in baseball.

Kind of cool that Chipper hit two homers last night as it was his bobblehead giveaway night. Strong outing from Medlen with a 5 hit complete game shutout. Him, Maholm and Sheets have sured up the rotation and pretty much negated losing Beachy for the year and Jurrjens sucking this year.

#412 CaseyRyback   Your New Nightmare! Super Moderators   24095 Posts   Joined 11.5 Years Ago  

CaseyRyback

Posted 17 August 2012 - 11:10 PM

http://deadspin.com/...brera-a-new-one

This is part of the reason I love the Crime Dog. Best nickname, best commercial, and the fact that steroid users make his numbers look pedestrian is ridiculous. He needs to get into the HOF with that damn Tom Emanski hat on his bust.

#413 Feeding the Abscess   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   2716 Posts   Joined 5.8 Years Ago   Has been playing Diablo III: Ultimate Evil Edition
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Feeding the Abscess

Posted 17 August 2012 - 11:28 PM

Bond's average went through the roof when he started hitting the juice. He went from being 1A/1B with Griffey as far as best player of his generation to being the third best hitter of all time.


http://www.fangraphs...layers=1109,327

Bonds had him by over 50 points in OBP, 200 SB, and in 230 fewer AB, had 7 fewer HR. Bonds bested Griffey in wOBA by 32 points (about the difference between Andrew McCutchen and Austin Jackson this season) and wRC+ by 27 points (difference between Ryan Braun and Alex Rios this season). Bonds played most of his home games in Candlestick, with Griffey playing in homer happy Kingdome.

It's not 1A/1B, Bonds is the clear winner of the 90s.

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#414 bigdaddybruce44   Murders & Executions CAGiversary!   13288 Posts   Joined 7.5 Years Ago  

bigdaddybruce44

Posted 20 August 2012 - 01:27 PM

Going into 1990, Bonds already had 4 full seasons under his belt and was 25 years old. Griffey was a rookie in '89 and 20 years old going into the season. Comparing the two guys purely on the stats they accumulated during that 10 year stretch doesn't tell the whole story. Also, Griffey was one of the best defensive center fielders of his generation. Now, of course, in his prime, Bonds was a great outfielder, too, but at the end of the day, a great center fielder is better than a great left fielder.

Also, in '99, if you asked 100 baseball fans who was more likely to break Hank Aaron's record, all 100 would have said Griffey. At the point, it was basically a foregone conclusion in everyone's mind that Griffey was going to be the homerun king.

http://deadspin.com/...brera-a-new-one

This is part of the reason I love the Crime Dog. Best nickname, best commercial, and the fact that steroid users make his numbers look pedestrian is ridiculous. He needs to get into the HOF with that damn Tom Emanski hat on his bust.


McGriff needs to start getting the same consideration that Jim Rice got. Just like Rice, McGriff was FEARED in the '90s. I remember he scared the balls off of me everytime he got up in the '96 series against the Yankees.

#415 CaseyRyback   Your New Nightmare! Super Moderators   24095 Posts   Joined 11.5 Years Ago  

CaseyRyback

Posted 20 August 2012 - 04:24 PM

Bruce is right. Don't let this century taint how you view the kid. Griffey in his prime was unreal.

This is coming from a Bonds fan so it isn't like I am discounting Bonds at all. He did more to carry his team and had a far worse supporting cast.

#416 bigdaddybruce44   Murders & Executions CAGiversary!   13288 Posts   Joined 7.5 Years Ago  

bigdaddybruce44

Posted 20 August 2012 - 06:54 PM

Growing up, I hated Griffey, especially after he completely owned the Yankees in the '95 ALDS. But the man was beyond freakin' electric. He didn't run...he simply glided...and his swing was a thing of beauty. Such a shame that injuries did him in.

#417 GhostShark   The Drunken Whaler CAGiversary!   3143 Posts   Joined 5.2 Years Ago  

GhostShark

Posted 20 August 2012 - 07:21 PM

Being a Rangers fan since the I first started loving baseball as a kid, I could never hate Ken Griffey Jr. (mostly because his name was on all my gloves) despite him being a divisional rival for so many years. The way he played inspired an entire generation of youngsters to play the game. And I was among the crowd that thought he would break the home run record, then he went to Cinci and became a walking injury.
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#418 bigdaddybruce44   Murders & Executions CAGiversary!   13288 Posts   Joined 7.5 Years Ago  

bigdaddybruce44

Posted 21 August 2012 - 05:57 PM

Apparently, Nick Swisher thinks he deserves a contract like Jayson Werth got from the Nationals...

#419 Jodou   Infamous CAGiversary!   11499 Posts   Joined 6.4 Years Ago   Has been playing Final Fantasy XIV Online: A Realm Reborn
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Posted 21 August 2012 - 06:35 PM

Lol, that dude is garbage and doesn't deserve the ring he's got.

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#420 DestroVega   Life is short... stunt it CAGiversary!   7108 Posts   Joined 7.7 Years Ago  

DestroVega

Posted 21 August 2012 - 07:05 PM

Lol, that dude is garbage and doesn't deserve the ring he's got.


False. He was vital to the 09 team winning the World Series. Yankees aren't paying him like Werth though. Even Werth doesn't deserve that deal lol.