Unfair Negative Feedback

I think I have unjustly gotten negative feedback. It reads:
"Poor communication, shipped slow, water damaged box art, wouldn't trade again!"

However the water damaged box art is not my fault and is probably the shipping company's if anything. Also I have written in the first post of my list that "It is your duty to find out additional details, as I cannot know what you want to know about the items.". Additionally, I was the one shipping first so I don't know why I should be criticized for shipping slow especially due to me moving from several different locations. Similarly with poor communication, I have only sent messages when needed even when my package was in limbo.

After reading admiralvic's extended comments he left with the feedback, it seems like he was pretty justified in leaving the negative. If all the stuff he says is true, I'd be pretty pissed as well.

What were the extended comments? Or is that something that I should not be seeing?

Extended comment: While I did get my game in the end, dealing with Zahlzeit was more work than it was worth. This all started about a month ago when he wanted some of my games and I wanted his Gundam Extreme VS. He made me an offer of Gundam 0081 + Yakuza 4 for Gundam Extreme VS, which I accepted. He asked for my shipping information and everything was fine... a day later he backs out of the deal telling me he found another copy of Yakuza 4, but he would be okay with making a new deal. I said okay and he asked for 0081 + Catherine, which I declined due to me not wanting to break up the CE if I didn't have to. (as I got the preorder / CE contents) He then asked for 0081 + Anarchy Reigns, which I again decided because of how lop sided the trade was and ultimately told him that I didn't want to trade. Being a nice guy he lowered the offer to 0081 for Extreme VS, which I naturally accepted and yet again gave him my shipping information on 12/05/12 at 2:25 pm. At this point I wasn't sure what was going on, since he mentioned 2 trades on his trade page, but didn't list my trade. I also didn't hear anything from him till 12/17/12 at 1:44 am, which was a message to confirm the trade was still on?! So here we're 12 days after accepting a new offer and he STILL hadn't event mailed the thing? I confirmed I was still interested if he was and he said he would ship it. Finally on 12/21/12 at 7:04 pm (yes another 4 days later) he confirmed the item had been shipped (no tracking number given) and asked when would I ship. I explain to him that it went against the rules and more importantly I am not dealing with the Xmas people over his package. After finally getting his package (with a sticky / water damaged box art =.=), I send him a message asking where I should send his and what to do. He told me to wait and later said whenever as long as it gets to him after Wednesday. To avoid complications I shipped the package on Wednesday and sent him the tracking number. After seeing the package got to him, but didn't hear him confirm delivery, I quickly asked him what was going on. He THEN revealed to me that he wasn't home yet and that he wouldn't know till Sunday. Apparently something happened with the package, which resulted in him not getting it and ultimately required him to file a report. Most of these things were revealed to me after I asked him to know (over him telling me) and he even had the audacity to say I didn't have to send another game to him (like any of these problems were MY fault and he was doing me a favor). Finally yesterday he revealed to me that he got the package, but was apparently too lazy to leave feedback for me. Needless to say, I can not justify giving him good feedback (even if I got my game and it worked) and really these were too many problems for a neutral feedback. Since I can see him reporting this claim or giving me negative as an act of revenge, I included this story here and have all of our original PM's if need be. Thank you for reading! Vic.

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He also sent me the PMs between you two to back this up.

[quote name='Zahlzeit']I think I have unjustly gotten negative feedback. It reads:
"Poor communication, shipped slow, water damaged box art, wouldn't trade again!"

However the water damaged box art is not my fault and is probably the shipping company's if anything. Also I have written in the first post of my list that "It is your duty to find out additional details, as I cannot know what you want to know about the items.". Additionally, I was the one shipping first so I don't know why I should be criticized for shipping slow especially due to me moving from several different locations. Similarly with poor communication, I have only sent messages when needed even when my package was in limbo.[/QUOTE]

I hate to but in, but as a buyer, I honestly wouldn't care why you didn't ship or communicate. Bottom line is that you didn't. You could have shipped if you were moving. There are post offices everywhere. Or at least communicated that you were going to be delayed. I've brought items on vacation with me so I could ship them on time and I've gone out of my way to communicate with people I'm trading with to keep them updated.

Bottom line is that you didn't ship on time, didn't tell him you weren't going to ship on time, and then he got a damaged item. It doesn't matter if the damaged item was your fault or not. The other trader had a crappy experience and your rating is going to reflect that.

And I'm only saying this because I've been in this position once or twice. I only have good feedback because I went out of my way to rectify the matter and return all items/money. If you want positive (or at least not negative) feedback, make the other trader happy.

[quote name='Trakan']He also sent me the PMs between you two to back this up.[/QUOTE]
Did you also get the PMs where I defended myself? Access_Denied is right, admittingly, but a lot of the things I did was because I misunderstood him.

If that's still a no go, well, then I guess I'll just be quiet and take the negative feedback.

[quote name='Zahlzeit']Did you also get the PMs where I defended myself? Access_Denied is right, admittingly, but a lot of the things I did was because I misunderstood him.

If that's still a no go, well, then I guess I'll just be quiet and take the negative feedback.[/QUOTE]

Since I've already commented indirectly, I will also comment directly.

The simple fact you use the term "defended" in response to this proves my point. Like you handled a lot of the situations poorly and you received feedback that reflected that. Lets actually look at what happened.

You ACCEPTED a trade with me for 0081 + Yakuza 4 for Gundam. I mention this, you don't claim it's untrue (which indirectly confirms it as true) and I submitted proof of this already. Now you accepted this trade on 12-03-2012, 10:58 PM and got my address on 12-04-2012 (I don't have my reply time, but I got the PM at 01:22 PM) and ultimately backed out on 12-05-2012, 11:13 AM. Now I can understand having multiple offers going or having something pending, but you could / should have indicated that over asking / accepting my shipping information. I doubt anyone on this site would disagree with me here...

Moving onto your poor shipping time, none of your messages imply / mention a delay till much later on. I wouldn't have minded it if you said "I got finals and am moving at the moment, but I'll ship it out asap!", but you instead mentioned it after the fact, which many would agree is poor communication. I also think we can agree that poor communication like this and taking a week or more to ship the item is slow.

Now lets look at the damage in question... I am not sure how to define it, but me and another CAG agree that it looks like grease or something was poured on it. I went with water damage since an explanation of it might be a little confusing, which you can check out for yourself here.

Anyway, I thought I was pretty fair with my feedback. I didn't mention him backing out of the trade, since he did resolve that problem and took a loss (over merely asking for both games and trading the dupe of Yakuza 4), so I felt it would be unfair to hold against him (which is far more damning than anything I said). Thus far your comments and phrasing are JUSTIFYING the poor communication / slow shipping, so clearly there is some truth to the claim. Not a whole lot more to say here, hopefully you will reflect on this and improve your "problems" in the future.

[quote name='admiralvic']Since I've already commented indirectly, I will also comment directly.

The simple fact you use the term "defended" in response to this proves my point. Like you handled a lot of the situations poorly and you received feedback that reflected that. Lets actually look at what happened.

You ACCEPTED a trade with me for 0081 + Yakuza 4 for Gundam. I mention this, you don't claim it's untrue (which indirectly confirms it as true) and I submitted proof of this already. Now you accepted this trade on 12-03-2012, 10:58 PM and got my address on 12-04-2012 (I don't have my reply time, but I got the PM at 01:22 PM) and ultimately backed out on 12-05-2012, 11:13 AM. Now I can understand having multiple offers going or having something pending, but you could / should have indicated that over asking / accepting my shipping information. I doubt anyone on this site would disagree with me here...

Moving onto your poor shipping time, none of your messages imply / mention a delay till much later on. I wouldn't have minded it if you said "I got finals and am moving at the moment, but I'll ship it out asap!", but you instead mentioned it after the fact, which many would agree is poor communication. I also think we can agree that poor communication like this and taking a week or more to ship the item is slow.

Now lets look at the damage in question... I am not sure how to define it, but me and another CAG agree that it looks like grease or something was poured on it. I went with water damage since an explanation of it might be a little confusing, which you can check out for yourself here.

Anyway, I thought I was pretty fair with my feedback. I didn't mention him backing out of the trade, since he did resolve that problem and took a loss (over merely asking for both games and trading the dupe of Yakuza 4), so I felt it would be unfair to hold against him (which is far more damning than anything I said). Thus far your comments and phrasing are JUSTIFYING the poor communication / slow shipping, so clearly there is some truth to the claim. Not a whole lot more to say here, hopefully you will reflect on this and improve your "problems" in the future.[/QUOTE]
I used the word, defend, because I thought there was an misunderstanding and I wanted to clear it up, which there was. Multiple ones. Like when you had messaged me even though my package already arrived to you, I couldn't understand why because from my point of view the only thing you were lacking from the trade was feedback. Also yes I didn't claim that I accepted that trade to be untrue because I never found it wrong that I wanted to change it or drop it if no actual shipping was done. And I'm sorry but I still don't understand why you are up in arms about me not going through with the first trade or ultimately dropping it, again because no shipping or payments have been made. I'd still like to add that that damage wasn't from me.. although admittingly I have no proof.

Although regarding the other points, having explained yourself in this post I get where you're coming from from the other points and I ultimately concede and apologize once again. I'm really sorry for bothering you.

Was there damage/markings to the outer packaging that might explain the water/oil damage? It seems like that'd make it pretty clear whether it was damaged in shipment, or prior to being shipped (if there was no outer damage).

Either way, when you do a trade you need to ship asap or at least communicate that it may take you a while to actually ship anything. A week is a long time without communicating.

Also, the line about it being the other persons duty to find out about additional details is bullshit imo. As a seller on ebay I can assure you I would receive negative feedback if I did not accurately describe an item. If that were to happen it would be my own fault, not the buyers fault for not asking. If something is not mint and complete you should be describing anything wrong with it.

Of course the buyer should ask to make damn sure they're getting what they pay for, but still the point remains.

[quote name='ShockandAww']Also, the line about it being the other persons duty to find out about additional details is bullshit imo. As a seller on ebay I can assure you I would receive negative feedback if I did not accurately describe an item. If that were to happen it would be my own fault, not the buyers fault for not asking. If something is not mint and complete you should be describing anything wrong with it.

Of course the buyer should ask to make damn sure they're getting what they pay for, but still the point remains.[/QUOTE]

I've had this problem before with a user who is banned now, I wonder why. In there TL they said everything was mint unless noted then I see pictures of the items and the games had stickers and marker writing all over them. Then the shit bag wouldn't leave me alone for 2 weeks and threatened to leave me negative feedback.

so dumb question: regular users can't see extended comments? Or is it only the people who did the trade?


btw, that looks like Goo Gone spill.

[quote name='confoosious']so dumb question: regular users can't see extended comments? Or is it only the people who did the trade?


btw, that looks like Goo Gone spill.[/QUOTE]

Extended comments are for you and moderators / admin only. Its main use is to include additional information you might not leave for feedback (like him backing out of our trade for me), but would like to remember in the future. The other use is for things like this, since I can further justify my stance for the feedback without any problems and save the mods some time.

[quote name='ShockandAww']Was there damage/markings to the outer packaging that might explain the water/oil damage? It seems like that'd make it pretty clear whether it was damaged in shipment, or prior to being shipped (if there was no outer damage).

Either way, when you do a trade you need to ship asap or at least communicate that it may take you a while to actually ship anything. A week is a long time without communicating.

Also, the line about it being the other persons duty to find out about additional details is bullshit imo. As a seller on ebay I can assure you I would receive negative feedback if I did not accurately describe an item. If that were to happen it would be my own fault, not the buyers fault for not asking. If something is not mint and complete you should be describing anything wrong with it.

Of course the buyer should ask to make damn sure they're getting what they pay for, but still the point remains.[/QUOTE]

http://imgur.com/eUJeE,OJC1N,GUJL1,uUUHG,csPrU,j8qoP#0

I covered up the shipping information, but this is the packaging (will post proof of that being his name if need be) and it looks fine to me.

As far as looking into it myself, I can see either side and if this had been a quick transaction, then I wouldn't have mentioned it past a PM. Since I was already going to leave the negative over the shipping speed / quality of communication, I felt I might as well mention it, since that WILL alert others to ask about the quality of the item. However, I would also like to note that he apparently owns 2 copies of the game, so this most likely was the "bad copy" and he has the good one. Obviously I can't say 100%, but naturally it seems a little worse when you know he could pick which one you get.

OP wouldn't it have been easier to just accept the negative feedback (which was easily warranted) and move on?

Now not only have you drawn public attention to yourself, but enabled anyone that wants to search for background information on your trade history that may easily deter them form wanting to trade with you.

Granted, this is coming from someone that hasn't traded here in a while... but all experiences were pleasant when I did.


Edit: "It is your duty to find out additional details, as I cannot know what you want to know about the items." This line screams sketchy used car salesman...

[quote name='Steggy']


Edit: "It is your duty to find out additional details, as I cannot know what you want to know about the items." This line screams sketchy used car salesman...[/QUOTE]

No kidding. "You never asked if I had smashed the game disc with a hammer before mailing it to you, its your own fault you didnt ask me if I had done such a thing!"

Thanks to OP for posting this thread, now everyone will know to avoid him.