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CAGcast #332: Delete This Show

cagcast podcast wombat shipwreck cheapyd

#31 Octob3rNotic3   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   60 Posts   Joined 8.9 Years Ago  

Octob3rNotic3

Posted 27 July 2013 - 03:28 AM

Here's some show feedback and a comment for the podcast thread. 

Since Wombat is always complaining that not enough people comment on the thread.

 

Well, worked for me, after a few weeks in a row saying there were few active listeners, I'm here to fully support the WPN (wombat podcast network).

 

Anyways, great one this week again guys. Love the show, helps my day at work fly by. 



#32 kklems   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   1682 Posts   Joined 15.7 Years Ago  

Posted 27 July 2013 - 06:41 AM

I have just one thing to say

"It's log."



"What rolls down stairs alone or in pairs
Rolls over your neighbor's dog?
What's great for a snack and fits on your back?
It's Log, Log, Log!

It's Log, Log, it's big, it's heavy, it's wood.
It's Log, Log, it's better than bad, it's good!
Everyone wants a log! You're gonna love it, Log!
Come on and get your log! Everyone needs a Log!"


:)

#33 sikapwach   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   1 Posts   Joined 8.5 Years Ago  

Posted 27 July 2013 - 06:54 AM

I think you guys way underestimate the importance of indie games (however you want to define them.)  Games like State of Decay, Fez, Minecraft, Trials, Castle Crashers, Bastion, Limbo, Braid, Sword & Sworcery, Super Meat Boy, etc. have made MS tons of money and earned the XBLA platform a ton of respect among gamers.  The more barriers MS puts between these games and the audience reduces the chance that the XBox will the platform on which these games have their breakthrough.  Cheapy the chances that there will ever be another Minecraft are slim to none.  He couldn't be more wrong.  The chances that there will be a small, out of nowhere games that does huge numbers in the next generation is pretty much a sure bet, it's just a matter of what platform it will launch on.

 

You also ask why people care about the indie changes, saying well i can understand why this guy who makes games that wrote in cares, but why does anyone else care, but the fact is if something is deterring someone from making a game on the platform that means we won't get to play it.  Apparently people who listen to the show like to play games that the people who make games are making.  What's bad for them is eventually bad for us.



#34 Loonknight   Dirk The Daring CAGiversary!   790 Posts   Joined 13.2 Years Ago  

Loonknight

Posted 27 July 2013 - 08:26 AM

Enjoyed the show, but when Wombat was explaining his reasoning for ordering his Xbox One and keeping it as such felt a bit contrived to me. I will believe he has a strong preference for the Xbox and the controller, but his unwillingness to even consider cancelling his preorder made me feel that this choice was already preordained, but I'm sure I am wrong.

 

I'm honestly glad for people who go off the handle about issues like AngryJoe, who are just so passionate about their hobby that they explode with rage. It's entertaining to be sure, but at the core can bring up valid points that others do care about when it comes to purchases of consoles and video games for that matter.

 

If the Xbox One will truly become a debug machine with the newest changes to polices allowing self-publishing for Indie developers, I'm actually really excited about it and look forward to seeing what I could do personally with the equipment, once the program has been detailed and the hardware is actually released.



#35 Fearbeard   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   236 Posts   Joined 10.8 Years Ago  

Posted 27 July 2013 - 11:32 AM

I think Wombat's idea of what "indie" games are is a bit off.  One problem with the way that Microsoft currently runs Xbox Live is that they require a notable publisher to get your games out on Xbox Live Arcade.  Therefore games that would technically be self funded - self published games are forced to make a publishing deal and split the sales revenue with them.  Hopefully they are getting something out of the deal such as marketing or QA testing but it's still an extra step you have to take.  Naturally the publishers are more likely then not going to try to wrestle as much control away from you as possible since the only way you are getting your game on the marketplace is to make a deal with one of them.  Allowing self publishing means that these companies can get their games on the marketplace without publisher interference or the potential loss of rights to the property and revenue.  For example games like Super Meat Boy, Castle Crashers, Braid, Fez and Retro City Rampage are indie games that were forced to get a publisher to publish on XBLA and are self published on other platforms that allow it like Steam.

 

What Wombat seems to think will happen is that all the large amount of crap that is on the Xbox Indie games channel will suddenly get top billing in the new Microsoft "games are games" store.  This is not the case.  The Microsoft games store is the only place where you currently do not require a publisher and in fact Microsoft does very little monitoring of the games that are put on there.  The games are tested and rated for content by the community of XNA creators and then released on the channel.  This program has been eliminated and will not be present in Xbox One.  

 

Allowing self publishing does mean you will be overrun with crap.  There will still be an approval process run by Microsoft that you will need to go through to get your game on the marketplace.  It just means that now game creators will be allowed to maintain complete control of the game as well as a larger cut of the revenue.  

 

The Xbox One allowing self publishing is nothing but good for the platform. 



#36 AriesDog   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   780 Posts   Joined 13.0 Years Ago  

AriesDog

Posted 27 July 2013 - 11:54 AM

I laughed out loud when Wombat said his computer was dying and Cheapy told him to get cheapest MacBook Air. "What is it, like $1000?" Like a grand for a computer is no big thing. Way to live that Cheap Ass Gamer lifestyle. Wombat, for half that you can get some excellent touchscreen laptops that don't have that expensive Apple logo.

http://www.microsoft...goryID.62685400



#37 just-joe   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   134 Posts   Joined 10.5 Years Ago  

just-joe

Posted 27 July 2013 - 11:59 AM

Wombat, you got it all wrong. The bear on the little car is the ballet.



#38 Tankcore   Unmotivated CAG CAG in Training   10 Posts   Joined 7.4 Years Ago  

Tankcore

Posted 27 July 2013 - 04:15 PM

I thought the show was great, guys.   My only slight complaint would be to skip anything dealing with the gun control debate, or politics in general. Unless it's video game related, like Australia's changes to their game ratings.

 

As for the CAG commenters, guns are a deterrent of tyranny.  The idea that 70 to 100 million people are armed to the teeth weighs, in some part, on the minds of our congressional members and senators.  This is why guns will never be banned, besides, banning them doesn't mean they're vaporized, it just means that everyone who keeps their gun is a criminal.  A super trust-worthy criminal....

 

Oh, and we do have realistic airsoft guns,  even 1:1 scale replicas, but they generally have the little orange tip on the barrel. 

 

Lastly, $1000 can buy a lot of computing power, assuming it doesn't have an Apple logo on it.  Keep up the good work, gentlemen!


  • kaw likes this

#39 firstadopter   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   22 Posts   Joined 10.4 Years Ago  

firstadopter

Posted 27 July 2013 - 06:50 PM

Hey guys,

 

I think Wombat should do a Kickstarter or at least have CAG put up a PayPal donation link. I don't know what the problem is. You guys keep making fun of this idea in the past with PennyArcade doing a Kickstarter, but let's be real here.

 

It's obvious Wombat isn't as financially "well-off" as Shipwreck or CheapyD or PennyArcade. What is wrong with Wombat fans giving money to Wombat for the YEARS of quality free entertainment.

 

I pay over $100 a month for generally crap TV entertainment to my local cable TV company. Wombat is my favorite online personality and he is the main reason I think the CAGcast is the best hour of entertainment I consume EVERY WEEK.  

 

What's wrong with fans donating money to show our appreciation and paying for the hundreds of hours Wombat has entertained us over the years? This isn't Communist Russia, this is capitalism. People should get paid for quality great work vs. working for free.

 

I'm generally the cheapest guy around, looking to find the best deals/coupons, but I would go out of my way to give Wombat money for all the entertainment he has given me.  I'm sure there are hundreds if not thousands of Wombat fans willing to do the same.

 

So please get off your high horse and let us PAY HIM in a small way for all the time and effort over the past few years he has entertained us.  It's obvious Wombat could use the money, CheapyD needs to get off his high horse and let us do it.



#40 firstadopter   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   22 Posts   Joined 10.4 Years Ago  

firstadopter

Posted 27 July 2013 - 07:19 PM

At the very least we should set up a Wombat Fan Appreciation Kickstarter, even with a modest goal of $2,000 so he can buy a new faster laptop. That would make a quality difference in Wombat's daily life and I'm sure he would appreciate it.

 

If Wombat is too sheepish to set it up himself (he should NOT BE), I'd be willing to set it up.  CheapyD should really do it however for all the years Wombat has given in service to this site.

 

Note it's not the actual dollar amount or the laptop that matters, I know CheapyD has been generous in past to Wombat giving him gifts like the PS3, but the real thing is giving Wombat fans the opportunity to show their appreciation.



#41 Bluesilo   Movie/Game Reviewer CAGiversary!   106 Posts   Joined 13.8 Years Ago  

Posted 27 July 2013 - 07:45 PM

Hey guys,

 

Any interest in the Indie Game: The Movie DLC? I just downloaded it and its a nice addition to the package. After this week's episode, I'm sure Wombat would love it. 



#42 Bluesilo   Movie/Game Reviewer CAGiversary!   106 Posts   Joined 13.8 Years Ago  

Posted 27 July 2013 - 07:50 PM

At the very least we should set up a Wombat Fan Appreciation Kickstarter, even with a modest goal of $2,000 so he can buy a new faster laptop. That would make a quality difference in Wombat's daily life and I'm sure he would appreciate it.

 

If Wombat is too sheepish to set it up himself (he should NOT BE), I'd be willing to set it up.  CheapyD should really do it however for all the years Wombat has given in service to this site.

 

Note it's not the actual dollar amount or the laptop that matters, I know CheapyD has been generous in past to Wombat giving him gifts like the PS3, but the real thing is giving Wombat fans the opportunity to show their appreciation.

 

The only problem I could see with all this is that other gaming journalists/personalities would start using in as a crux to get new recording equipment. That or, they would look down at CAG for going through with something like that in general. Of course I'm just speculating here, but that's what I could imagine it could turn into. 

 

As far as giving Wombat money...I would easily be willing to donate some funds. I listen to both his shows weekly and his time is worth something. It's just unfortunate that the way it would be looked at by other communities is begging for money. 



#43 MattZack   Virtue for the virtuous, signaling for others. CAGiversary!   1324 Posts   Joined 13.8 Years Ago  

Posted 27 July 2013 - 08:05 PM

Cheapy, not all gun control stories are as nice as it has turned out in Japan:

 

Turkey - From 1915 - 1917 there were 1.5 million Armenians killed after gun control enacted in 1911

 

Soviet Union - 1929 - 1953 there were 20 million dissidents killed after gun control enacted in 1929.  Same in China from 1948 - 1952 after gun control started in 1935.

 

Uganda - From 1971 to 1979 there were 300,000 Christians were killed after gun control enacted in 1970.

 

Cambodia - From 1975 to 1977 there were 1 million educated people killed after gun control enacted in 1956.

 

The US government is set up with a system of checks and balances - the right to keep and bear arms is the final check and balance.  It is to ensure that a tyrannical ruler does not impose his/her will on the masses.

 

Quit whining about the fact that you have to have a orange tip on a gun.  There are replica airsoft guns here too, but they have the orange tip so that cops don't kill the kids pointing the gun at them.  Boo Hoo, what a pathetic excuse for a complaint.

 

You say that you were in a bar and drinking, but don't mention how alcohol adversely affects society - why?



#44 firstadopter   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   22 Posts   Joined 10.4 Years Ago  

firstadopter

Posted 27 July 2013 - 08:11 PM

The only problem I could see with all this is that other gaming journalists/personalities would start using in as a crux to get new recording equipment. That or, they would look down at CAG for going through with something like that in general. Of course I'm just speculating here, but that's what I could imagine it could turn into. 

 

As far as giving Wombat money...I would easily be willing to donate some funds. I listen to both his shows weekly and his time is worth something. It's just unfortunate that the way it would be looked at by other communities is begging for money. 

 

Why is it begging for money? It's "Wombat Fan appreciation" for the hundreds of hours he worked for free entertaining us over the past decade. 

 

It's unfair really, you can tell Wombat could use the money, while CheapyD and Shipwreck talk about buying $400-500 remote controls they don't need and Shipwreck having so many "rooms" in his mansion he doesn't even use.  Those two are like "nah let's not get paid.. it's beneath us"

 

Let us donate money to Wombat. Let us show our appreciation. Let us do it. Come on!



#45 firstadopter   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   22 Posts   Joined 10.4 Years Ago  

firstadopter

Posted 27 July 2013 - 08:17 PM

I think the difference is I'm not saying we should set this up for him to get a new computer to work on the podcast.

 

I'm saying we should do this as "fan appreciation", so he can use the money for whatever he wants. Even if it is just $2,000. That make sense?



#46 louiedog   20 minutes into the future CAGiversary!   5646 Posts   Joined 13.1 Years Ago  

Posted 27 July 2013 - 09:40 PM

If we knock out Bastion for the WB ties, there would be few games XBLA that could be considered indie. Microsoft requires a publishing partner to get on the service. To the best of my knowledge, Bastion's development was independently funded and WB came in very late on the project and was just there for the distribution and any marketing (PAX booth, bandana swag, etc).



#47 crazyad8   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   6 Posts   Joined 12.0 Years Ago  

crazyad8

Posted 28 July 2013 - 12:00 AM

Indie games are games developed by a single person or small team of developers. They tend to be more abstract and creative, possibly because that person or small team is able to focus and implement that unified vision of the game better. Games with dozens of designers, artists, programmers and writers are no way able to communicate with each other as efficiently and no way able to all have that unified vision of what the game will be. 



#48 Sonne   The U CAGiversary!   862 Posts   Joined 9.4 Years Ago  

Posted 28 July 2013 - 01:04 AM

Hey Shipwreck, I was just listening to the latest Giant Bombcast and they spent the first 40 minutes or so just talking about GI Joe, Transformers and baseball cards. I immediately thought you would get a kick out of that combination. They also brought up a critical question...

 

Zartan: Hair or Hood?



#49 painkillah   Black Sheep CAGiversary!   99 Posts   Joined 14.1 Years Ago  

painkillah

Posted 28 July 2013 - 02:01 AM

Haha, the 2nd amendment is meant to arm militias not every American citizen. It was also written at a time when most weapons were created equal. Nowadays the most well armed civilians couldn't stand toe to toe with the ATF, i.e. Wako, must less a military force. It wasn't long ago you could bitch slap Barney Fife and run him off your property. Present day Barney would come back with SWAT and turn you home into swiss cheese. A closer comparison of gun control in a Democratic union like America would be with Australia. If your gun entitlement helps you sleep at night that's OK. In reality, if Monsanto or Exxon took control of our government, no militia or country for that matter would have enough power and resources to do anything about it. We have the greatest military might in the world. It dwarfs all formidable forces combined. Not in numbers but in capabilities. 



#50 shipwreck   CAG Reviews Editor Super Moderators   7578 Posts   Joined 16.8 Years Ago  

Posted 28 July 2013 - 02:23 AM

Hey Shipwreck, I was just listening to the latest Giant Bombcast and they spent the first 40 minutes or so just talking about GI Joe, Transformers and baseball cards. I immediately thought you would get a kick out of that combination. They also brought up a critical question...

 

Zartan: Hair or Hood?

 

I need to listen still. Zartan wears a hood in his classic style. Crappy Zartan has a mohawk.



#51 F8X   CAG app for the Android!! CAGiversary!   270 Posts   Joined 13.6 Years Ago  

Posted 28 July 2013 - 02:33 AM

Great episode this week.

 

I really enjoyed the discussion of what is an indie game. I feel like the indie games that get promoted by games media tend to have friends in media.



#52 MattZack   Virtue for the virtuous, signaling for others. CAGiversary!   1324 Posts   Joined 13.8 Years Ago  

Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:23 AM

The text of the 2nd amendment reads:  

 

" A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."  

 

I think that "people" means citizens of the USA.  If you don't, please tell me what "people" it is referring to.  For the record, the Supreme Court ruled that it applies to an individual's right whether they are associated with a militia or not.  See District of Columbia vs. Heller.

 

Also, do you understand what a militia is?  It is a group of civilians who also act as soldiers or who are called upon in an emergency.  I do agree that the 2nd amendment is meant to arm a militia and I think the militia would be formed of US citizens.  

 

It is not an entitlement - the government is not giving me a gun, it is a right.  Like the right of free speech, not the entitlement of free speech. 

 

As for Monsanto, they already have more control of the government than I want them to have.  I am not a fan of a law that dictates that you can't sue a company if they produce a product that harms people.



#53 KurbStomped   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   14 Posts   Joined 15.2 Years Ago  

KurbStomped

Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:48 AM

Good show as usual guys, but I wanted to just mention that when you were speaking about the controversies with the Xbox One launch vs the 360 and how there were none back then, I think you guys forgot all about the Arcade vs Pro controversy. I remember all sorts of discussion about not including the hard drive with every Xbox 360.

 

Also, I feel that Wombat was, as usual, playing the devils advocate in the indie discussion. There is NO way that he thinks that Valve is indie or makes indie games. I think he just needs to actually say hes playing devils advocate, as some listeners are... slow.



#54 ten bob dylan   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   3 Posts   Joined 11.5 Years Ago  

ten bob dylan

Posted 28 July 2013 - 07:26 AM

great cast guys keep up the good work.

 

all this talk of ram is bull.

at the moment its not the type of ram that's every one is up in arms about its the amount of free ram for games devs.

 

well it's like this a while back every one was knocking the xbox one because there is around 5 gigs of free ram out of the 8gb of ram in the system (3gb is used by the oparating system) thats free for devs to use.

 

now it turns out that the ps4 only has 4.5 gigs free. the xbox one runs 3 diffrent operating system at once so the ram useage is understandable but the ps4 only run one and does less than the xbox one. so people are asking why this is the case.

 

well it's like this Microsoft main business is operating systems ,they have been make operating systems since 1983 that's 30 years.

now although sony would of course had to make software to run there products ,there experance of programming operating system is very small. no disrespect to sony but when it comes to operating systems and networking and running online services Microsoft are just better at this.



#55 Curufinwe   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   1084 Posts   Joined 11.3 Years Ago  

Posted 28 July 2013 - 01:21 PM

I thought the show was great, guys.   My only slight complaint would be to skip anything dealing with the gun control debate, or politics in general. Unless it's video game related, like Australia's changes to their game ratings.

 

As the CAG commenters, guns are a deterrent of tyranny. 

 

There is no tyranny in other developed countries like Japan and Australia where guns are properly regulated.  Just a lot less gun deaths.



#56 spid   CAGiversary! CAGiversary!   128 Posts   Joined 15.4 Years Ago  

Posted 28 July 2013 - 01:38 PM

I agree with much of what you guys sayd about Microsoft, self publishing, and the media.  There were a lot of gaming sites that took a dodge/non-answer and made it into a definitive "no". I disagree with Ship in that I think they always were planning this all along, but they have rightly or wrongly stuck to their marketing plan.  I think they always planned on rolling this stuff out at Gamescon.  Despite the internet furror Gamescon is only three months after the announcement of the console.  Three months is not that long especially for a feature announcement that will not be ready at launch.

 

I grew up on the original Transformer's cartoon, and I like the movies. 

 

PS. 

 

Thanks for answering my Memphis question last week Ship.



#57 Cokomon   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   20 Posts   Joined 10.8 Years Ago  

Posted 28 July 2013 - 06:05 PM

I am wondering if a fan fund to get Wombat a new PC (desktop or laptop) would be a good idea, both for Wombat and the show.  That way he could join Cheapy and Shipwreck in discussing a lot of the games they've been playing recently, as well as being better informed about the indie game scene.  I know it would be a departure from his Mac, but Cheapy and Shipwreck seem have dealt with that just fine.

 

Although I guess he needs a new computer for actual work, and not just faffing about.



#58 Eleven8Eighty3   Art Director CAGiversary!   415 Posts   Joined 11.7 Years Ago  

Eleven8Eighty3

Posted 28 July 2013 - 08:27 PM

Cheapy, Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox is excellent. Thanks for the recommendation. Please be sure to talk a bit about it in the next podcast.



#59 shogunieyasu   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   12 Posts   Joined 9.9 Years Ago  

shogunieyasu

Posted 29 July 2013 - 02:08 AM

This was the return of the old Wombat, huh? Telling us he hates indies, and then unable to define what the term means. I found it sort of frustrating because so much of the innovation, new energy, and bright ideas come from smaller developers or even one- or two-person teams. I think Wombat is compelling when talking about topics he understands and has experience with--recently that's been the Xbox dashboard issue. But this extended rant of deliberate ignorance was hard to listen to. C'mon Wombat, raise your game!

#60 codenamelenny   CAG Veteran CAGiversary!   200 Posts   Joined 11.5 Years Ago  

codenamelenny

Posted 29 July 2013 - 04:34 AM

I should mention it was a good show as usual.