CAGcast #411: Good For Yu - E3 2015 Premium Edition

CheapyD

CheapyD

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The crew talks E3 2015, Batman Arkham Knight, Destiny and Shenmue 3 controversies and so much more!
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The iTunes/RSS version of the show contains all the E3 audioboos, pushing the show over 4.5 hours.
The embed does not contain the E3 Audiobooms. You can access them below:

https://audioboom.com/boos/3318679-cagcast-411-good-for-yu-e3-2015-standard-edition
 

[audioboo]1281598-e3-2015-live-from-los-angeles[/audioboo]
 
 

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I guess you can listen to Wombat's other podcast, Uninformed Opinions.

 
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I haven't listened to the cast yet but I am disappointed with Arkham Knight, the Batmobile missions are very frustrating and it feels like they added them and took out the fighting with big gangs I liked in Arkham City  and replaced them with awkward fighting against tanks. It just hasn't felt like a Batman Arkham gang yet

 
Wombat could you post the link about modifying Batmobile controls? I wasnt really interested in the game, but the Best Buy deal was too good.

So far the main difference from the previous games is that in previous games, at least they gave lip service to the idea that Bats shouldn't kill people. Sure, he left them with crushed windpipes, broken spines, shattered hips and left them paralyzed, but they were alive (maybe). In the new game, there's no doubt. He shoots'em with a tank and then drives over them.
 
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Boy, the Shenmue 3 Kickstarter haterade is strong on this week's show. I gave it money minutes after it was announced. No regrets.
 
Come on guys with the Destiny bull....  Cheapy this is not a mobile hook in the way Candy Crush is.  We get it, you don't like or want to play the game but at the same time I don't want to buy crappy systems or electronics that will be thrown away, or old systems/cartridges that people get "addicted" to collecting, or stupid Amibos.  At the same time, if that's what you guys are into great.... not my bag.

- Destiny players have an option to purchase that cosmetic DLC if they want.

- The Collector's Edition has gone back on sale at Gamestop.

- If you don't care for those things, you can simply purchase the Taken King for $40.00 like any other DLC offerred to mankind.

The arguments are completely blown out.  Yes, I think the cost of the DLC is a rip off.  I hate the fact really good content is paywalled behind Sony when I choose to play on Xbox with my friends.  I don't really agree with tying a quest to the Red Bull promotion.  But I do choose to play the game, and have a great time with my friends at the same time.

Another great show, but we need more Wombat harmonizing.

 
The negative bitterness is still going strong. I don't think Cheapy even plays games anymore, he just lives to complain. He has literally become an old jewish lady before our ears. It's time to pack it up and get out of the game, the passion is gone. At least stop talking like you are some sort of game authority while barely having a clue about actual current games. You should get some blood work done, I think you have an estrogen imbalance.

 
Agree with you guys totally about the Gamestop Retro thing. From a business standpoint, it makes sense, I guess. But as a consumer, I can't imagine why you'd buy from them, with questions of condition and packaging and premium prices, or sell to them, because I'm sure their TIV are nowhere near competitive. 

Also, for the Shenmue Kickstarter, I'll admit, I gave them my money as soon as I found out about it. Sony's involvement didn't come as a surprise for the fact that I couldn't believe Sega would just give out a license to a truly independent team, even if they were headed by the game's creator. That said, I share some of the cynicism towards Kickstarter as it functions today. It started out as an interesting concept, where individuals could essentially play very small time venture capitalists for small time projects that otherwise wouldn't see the light of day. Now, it's turned into a system for preordering products, with no guarantee of actually receiving them and limited actual accountability, and some sort of market research for products that could easily be funded through traditional means. The involvement of Sony (and, on other products, other massive companies or rich individuals who could easily fund the project themselves) seems to me to be contrary to the original spirit of Kickstarter, but I suppose if the people running Kickstarter had a problem with it, they'd do something about it.

(Sidetone, I'll be very interested to see how that first Kickstarter related lawsuit shakes down. Up to now, Kickstarter themselves have always just shrugged their shoulders when projects go Vaporware and left it up to the backers and creators to work it out. Since they're allowing people to treat it as a preorder, I'll be curious to see if they start putting any more steps for accountability in, depending on how the suit goes. Of the three projects I've backed that met goal, two delivered and one half delivered. I consider myself pretty lucky, but I also treat Kickstarter same as gambling and the first rule of gambling is never put in more than you can afford to lose.)

 
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really enjoyed the kickstarter shit talk. fun stuff.

especially when cheapy was talking about how the pitch video was disingenuous and bull shit.

and this is coming from someone who imported shenmue 2 european for dreamcast at launch.

 
The funny thing is that I don't think I was negative or bitter at all, just realistic. Maybe someone can point out specifics?
 
If Gamestop is sitting on warehouses of this stuff, it doesn't make sense for them to match the eBay price when there are hundreds of sellers out there. They should at least be doing 20% off average eBay price.

Disappointed that it's 2015, and Batman Arkham Knight still has tiny text.

Guys why aren't you watching Hannibal and talking about it? The opening of last night's episode? Pure Art.

 
CheapyD said:
The funny thing is that I don't think I was negative or bitter at all, just realistic. Maybe someone can point out specifics?
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Yeah, I don't get it, either. I'm guessing people are referring to how the Shenmue Kickstarter didn't sit well with all of you. I'm noticing a lot of people in general are confused in how kickstarter works. The Castlevania successor, "Bloodstained", raised a few million on Kickstarter, but that's not the only revenue the game is receiving. So when I heard Shenmue was doing the same, I wasn't surprised or upset by the news.

Other than that, I'm glad to hear you and Wombat are enjoying Arkham Knight. I'll purchase it eventually.

I had fun seeing you guys at SpinLA. Although my ping pong skills were lacking.

 
CheapyD said:
The funny thing is that I don't think I was negative or bitter at all, just realistic. Maybe someone can point out specifics?
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I listened to the show a second time after reading that. You weren't being negative. You were realistic about the chances of VR and Shenmue, I'm guessing that was interpreted as negative.
 
I disagree with the other cags who say the show was negative. I think this was one of the better shows in a long while. This show reminded me of the old cagcasts before shipwreck was on. I could hear the genuine excitement when you guys were talking about the games. Keep it up!
 
CheapyD said:
The funny thing is that I don't think I was negative or bitter at all, just realistic. Maybe someone can point out specifics?
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I don't think you were being bitter or negative. I think some people just can't handle it when you have an opinion contrary to theirs about a video game.

 
I'm not sure why MS deserves so much credit for focusing on "2015"  at E3 when all they've really done is packed an entire year of releases into the same two month period that's also delivering the best third party lineup in a very long time. They've left the first 9 month of the year vacant while Sony has shipped big games like Bloodborne, The Show, and The Order and they still have Until Dawn, Tearaway and remasters of Uncharted 1-3 and God of War 3 to come. And that's without mentioning their digital only lineup this year or all the third party PlayStation exclusives out of Japan coming this fall like Persona 5 and Dragon Quest Heroes.

 
BradGrenz said:
I'm not sure why MS deserves so much credit for focusing on "2015" at E3 when all they've really done is packed an entire year of releases into the same two month period that's also delivering the best third party lineup in a very long time. They've left the first 9 month of the year vacant while Sony has shipped big games like Bloodborne, The Show, and The Order and they still have Until Dawn, Tearaway and remasters of Uncharted 1-3 and God of War 3 to come. And that's without mentioning their digital only lineup this year or all the third party PlayStation exclusives out of Japan coming this fall like Persona 5 and Dragon Quest Heroes.
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I'm with you right up to the comma after The Show. After that you have a game that was s disappointment, a former Move game from a studio that has only done Move or Wonderbook games, an expanded Vita port, and the remastered. Persona 5 looks cool, I have no interest in another Dynasty Warriors game and neither of these games was part of Sony's press conference or booth which was the basis of what our conversations were about.
 
apathylad said:
Yeah, I don't get it, either. I'm guessing people are referring to how the Shenmue Kickstarter didn't sit well with all of you. I'm noticing a lot of people in general are confused in how kickstarter works. The Castlevania successor, "Bloodstained", raised a few million on Kickstarter, but that's not the only revenue the game is receiving. So when I heard Shenmue was doing the same, I wasn't surprised or upset by the news.
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Nobody should be upset by it. Shenmue fans are going to get to see the next part of the story, which is what they've wanted for more than a decade. People who aren't Shenmue fans (like me) aren't affected. There's nothing on Kickstarter which says only the money received there is allowed to be used for the production of a game.

What Sony are doing with Shenmue 3 is not much different to when Paradox came on as publisher for Pillars of Eternity, another game which made about $4m on KS.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/obsidian/project-eternity/description

http://www.obsidian.net/press/eternity/obsidian-partnership-with-paradox

Obsidian Entertainment, the developer of Fallout: New Vegas and South Park: The Stick of Truth, today announced that they are entering into a partnership with Paradox Interactive to launch their upcoming role-playing game (RPG), Pillars of Eternity.

Pillars of Eternity, an RPG inspired by classic titles such as Baldur’s Gate, Icewind Dale, and Planescape: Torment, was funded via Kickstarter in late 2012, raising $4.5 million through both backer pledges on Kickstarter and Obsidian’s own website. Feargus Urquhart, CEO of Obsidian Entertainment, stated that every dollar raised through the crowdfunding campaign will be spent solely on the game’s development.

“This game would not have happened if not for the passion and generosity of our backers, and their faith in us to create the game they wanted,” said Urquhart. “How we are developing Pillars of Eternity has not, and will not be, changed; we will deliver the game we promised to our backers, and we will deliver it this year. Having Paradox as a partner, with their expertise in independent games like Pillars of Eternity, lets us put all of our focus on making an incredible game.”

Paradox will assume key marketing and distribution responsibilities for the title, which will support Obsidian by allowing them to concentrate entirely on development.
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Only part way through this week's CAGcast but once again it's entertaining to me. Looking forward to hearing the E3 thoughts while working this week.
 
shipwreck said:
I'm with you right up to the comma after The Show. After that you have a game that was s disappointment, a former Move game from a studio that has only done Move or Wonderbook games, an expanded Vita port, and the remastered. Persona 5 looks cool, I have no interest in another Dynasty Warriors game and neither of these games was part of Sony's press conference or booth which was the basis of what our conversations were about.
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Oh, we are judging on game quality then? I happened to really like The Order so I don't understand why it should be discounted, and Microsoft's releases are all TBD at this point since, you know, they haven't shipped anything since last November.

If we are talking solely about conferences, there is nothing that exciting to me about seeing more of games like Forza, Halo and Tomb Raider, all of which were known quantities. The actual "reveals" Microsoft had in their conference, ReCore, Sea of Thieves and Gears 4, were 2016 (or later) games just like Sony showed.

 
This kickstarter thing is out of hand. If MS had announced a kickstarter during it's show they would be the laughing stock of the industry and it would probably spawn a  new E3-based meme. And I completely agree with Cheapy, there is no way this is going to be the game that people expect. Shenmue was good for it's time but now we live in a world where GTA is the new benchmark. There is no way they are going create that level of quality if they have to KS a game just to show to publishers that there is a desire for it. 

 
SerOnionKnight said:
This kickstarter thing is out of hand. If MS had announced a kickstarter during it's show they would be the laughing stock of the industry and it would probably spawn a new E3-based meme. And I completely agree with Cheapy, there is no way this is going to be the game that people expect. Shenmue was good for it's time but now we live in a world where GTA is the new benchmark. There is no way they are going create that level of quality if they have to KS a game just to show to publishers that there is a desire for it.
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I think a lot of people look at Shenmue through rose colored glasses. I loved the original game on the Dreamcast and at the time it was something new and revolutionary. Like you said though since then the gaming world has changed quite a bit and a game like Shenmue just doesn't hold up as well as some other games from that time period. Really by the time the Shenmue 2 port hit the original Xbox that style of game was stale and we were in a post GTA 3 world.

Don't get me wrong I am excited for Shenmue 3 and I think it will be a good game, I also think it will have a lengthy development circle and make plenty of money to a huge game. I don't think it will set the world on fire though and it will more than likely include some sort of story refresher like Shenmue 2 did for the first game. I don't expect to see this game until 2017 at the earliest.

 
How can you guys hate the Shenmue III kickstarter? For $29 you are basically helping to pay for the game and you get a digital copy of the game. Nothing wrong with that for fans of the series.

 
Sigma said:
I think a lot of people look at Shenmue through rose colored glasses. I loved the original game on the Dreamcast and at the time it was something new and revolutionary. Like you said though since then the gaming world has changed quite a bit and a game like Shenmue just doesn't hold up as well as some other games from that time period. Really by the time the Shenmue 2 port hit the original Xbox that style of game was stale and we were in a post GTA 3 world.

Don't get me wrong I am excited for Shenmue 3 and I think it will be a good game, I also think it will have a lengthy development circle and make plenty of money to a huge game. I don't think it will set the world on fire though and it will more than likely include some sort of story refresher like Shenmue 2 did for the first game. I don't expect to see this game until 2017 at the earliest.
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Games haven't really changed all that much. There are many people who prefer old style games. A lot of people are burned out on AAA shooters and GTA style games. Some Shenmue, even Dreamcast style, will be a breath of fresh air.

 
StrangeBrew said:
The negative bitterness is still going strong. I don't think Cheapy even plays games anymore, he just lives to complain. He has literally become an old jewish lady before our ears. It's time to pack it up and get out of the game, the passion is gone. At least stop talking like you are some sort of game authority while barely having a clue about actual current games. You should get some blood work done, I think you have an estrogen imbalance.
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I agree. Cheapy hardly plays games anymore, he'll play and complete 1-2 games per year on Xbox/PlayStation. The rest of the time he'll mess with the resolution on his PC games instead of playing the game.

Shenmue III is worthwhile... here's why. Shenmue II ended on a cliffhanger. There are many people who want to see the story completed and after 15+ years it's finally going to happen. Yes, it had a hand in dooming the Dreamcast, the style of game is from a previous era, and it wasn't a mainstream success (it still sold a lot of copies). But so what? It's still a classic series and I'll buy it day one.

 
Harvey Pitnik said:
Games haven't really changed all that much. There are many people who prefer old style games. A lot of people are burned out on AAA shooters and GTA style games. Some Shenmue, even Dreamcast style, will be a breath of fresh air.
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I agree with that and I personally absolutely love old-school game design. What I was trying to say is that the style of game that Shenmue and Shenmue 2 are just don't hold up as well today as some other classic titles do. I don't want them to reinvent the wheel and lose what made the first two games so great, but I would hope they plan on modernizing the series, it's been over a decade since Shenmue 2. I'll buy Shenmue 3 for sure when it comes out, no doubt about that.

I would contribute to the Kickstarter as well, but I want a physical copy for PS4 and a digital copy for $29 just doesn't do it for me though.

 
While I appreciate that you love Shenmue, Harvey, saying it sold a lot of copies is just wrong. The first game only broke about 1 million copies worldwide which didn't even cover production costs & Shenmue II only sold about a third as many units as the first game.
 
shipwreck said:
While I appreciate that you love Shenmue, Harvey, saying it sold a lot of copies is just wrong. The first game only broke about 1 million copies worldwide which didn't even cover production costs & Shenmue II only sold about a third as many units as the first game.
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Shenmue 2 for Dreamcast also was never released in the United States and was only available on the Xbox and it also sold poorly. The series just doesn't click with the mainstream audience, which is why they have to use Kickstarter to not only help fund the game, but generate interest before it releases so they can hopefully turn a profit this time around.

 
If Shenmue would've been a lot more successful...people would've played Shenmue III years ago, possibly on a console made by Sega themselves.

 
Sigma said:
I agree with that and I personally absolutely love old-school game design. What I was trying to say is that the style of game that Shenmue and Shenmue 2 are just don't hold up as well today as some other classic titles do. I don't want them to reinvent the wheel and lose what made the first two games so great, but I would hope they plan on modernizing the series, it's been over a decade since Shenmue 2. I'll buy Shenmue 3 for sure when it comes out, no doubt about that.

I would contribute to the Kickstarter as well, but I want a physical copy for PS4 and a digital copy for $29 just doesn't do it for me though.
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Yeah maybe you're right. I enjoyed the game for just walking around and exploring and didn't mind the slow pace. I enjoyed the experience.

 
What the hell even happened in Shenmue 1 & 2? Shenmue 1 I remember the motorcycle ride with your girlfriend, the 100 man battle and then the crazy guy jumping and stealing something from you. You take off on a ship. Shenmue 2 all I remember is the opening with the motorcycle butt rock song, a transexual guy chasing you with your friend (would love to read the countless Polygon/IGN social justice warrior articles about this today!), fighting a huge fat guy on a roof while Lan Di watches from a helicopter, and then that relaxing part where you walk around with the girl.

I gotta either buy a PS4 or get a good PC to play part 3 (I only have a 360/One/Wii U).

 
shipwreck said:
While I appreciate that you love Shenmue, Harvey, saying it sold a lot of copies is just wrong. The first game only broke about 1 million copies worldwide which didn't even cover production costs & Shenmue II only sold about a third as many units as the first game.
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1 million copies worldwide is a lot for any game. It just cost too much to make since the development went back as far as Sega Saturn. And Shenmue II didn't sell as well because it never had a USA release on Dreamcast (I had the Euro version) and then came out for Xbox which had a low userbase and the Sega fans had scattered between PS2, (upcoming?) Gamecube, and Xbox. Plus it came out the same day as one of the GTA games. I was standing in line at Gamestop (or EB Games) and every one there was buying the GTA game and I bought Shenmue. Hardcore.

 
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Thanks for reading my comment Wombat. You butchered my name though So I edited it slightly. Surprised that you didn't seem to recognize 412 as the Area code for Pittsburgh though. 

 
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