CAGcast #450: Great Vision!

CheapyD

Head Cheap Ass
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A vicious gang of Overwatch trolls invade the show, Uncharted 4 is enjoyed, Lionhead and Disney Infinity are autopsied,  and poop, in various forms, is discussed.

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https://audioboom.com/boos/4561835-cagcast-450-great-vision

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Show Linkage/Notes:
Intro -   Madison Mars - Milky Way

Outro - Doom commerial
 

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I guess you can listen to Wombat's other podcast, Uninformed Opinions.



 
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I took my 5 year old son and 10 year old daughter to Captain America.  Both loved it.  It really depends on your kids.  I wouldn't generalize about whether the movie is appropriate for a specific age.  Some kids can handle more intense stuff than others.  My oldest who is 12 1/2 didn't come because he really doesn't like violent movies.  Parents need to make their own decisions because they're the ones who know their kids. 

 
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I took my 5 year old son and 10 year old daughter to Captain America. Both loved it. It really depends on your kids. I wouldn't generalize about whether the movie is appropriate for a specific age. Some kids can handle more intense stuff than others. My oldest who is 12 1/2 didn't come because he really doesn't like violent movies. Parents need to make their own decisions because they're the ones who know their kids.
I disagree, I feel that I should make everyone's parenting decisions for them. For now on your kids shall only watch reruns of Three's Company & their bedtime is 7:15.

 
I disagree, I feel that I should make everyone's parenting decisions for them. For now on your kids shall only watch reruns of Three's Company & their bedtime is 7:15.
That would be better than the Full House reruns they seem to watch every day. Even worse my 5 year old is obsessed with Fuller House which is the brutally bad Netflix sequel. At least with Three's Company I could teach them about forgotten art of sexual innuendo. That's just not part of Full House and they are really missing out.

 
So are you saying Disney extrapolated demand to Infinity?!?!?! 

I guess they forgot that it was all a gimmick.  People had a little fun and then were done.  

IT feels similar to the plastic instrument craze.  They kept making more crap and releasing stuff more often until the customer said "No Mas.  No mas. "

My oldest kid was 7 when I took him to Iron Man.  And I regretted it because I could tell he was a little shellshocked afterwards.   Part of it was the theatre experience being so loud and overwhelming compared to tv at home.  He didn't have a huge desire to see a movie in a theatre after that at least for a few years.  Might have taken him to a Pixar movie and stuff along those lines, but I remember him not wanting to go to a few shows after Iron Man.  

Now he's 15 though and in  the past few weeks he saw Batman vs Superman and Capt America.  Took a date too.  

 
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Wombat, kids these days don't have the same experience with Simpsons like you and the millenials do. I grew up watching classic Simpsons everyday twice a day, and was confined to the first six or seven seasons in syndication. Sabrina shouldn't like the Simpsons of today anyway, but you should try to ease her into it by putting the old episodes in regular rotation if there is a function on the Netflix. I listen to the Talking Simpsons podcast and am astounded by how many jokes flew over my tiny mind, and yet the series kept many kids my age so entertained and thinking. If Sabrina loathes those classic episodes:

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I must have the same gene Mrs Cheapie has because I am struggling with Uncharted 4 so far.   I  turned it off during a long stretch of cutscenes around chapter 5.  My eyes were glazing over.

The first real gun part  gives off that "it doesn't matter what you do, we'll get you to where you need to go" feel to it.  

 
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I'm surprised you guys didn't talk about the Disney Infinity 4.0 plans revealed in that article. The main campaign would be open to all figures. Good! They were also planning big $45 figures. Bad!

Also, not really discussed but if Disney Interactive is folding does that mean all those mobile games are going away too?
 
Here's how you get Disney's money back.

Step 1: Toss Hulk into to a landfill.

Step 2: Wait 30 years.

Step 3: Dig up toys and sell them for a huge profit.

It worked for E.T. on 2600. People are weird.

 
I didn't think wombat would like overwatch but ouch he was a little harsh. Games like titanfall, team fortress 2, battlefront, etc show that people like multiplayer only games. It's better than having it as a tacked on mode in a single player game.

Though I do understand that it doesn't seem like much for $60 but at $40 on PC, it's a good price for me.

 
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Listening to the conversation about overwatch... "This is a specific experience... It's not for you!... They are focusing on a certain type of game play!" While they dump on Evolve was very enlightening.

Also, education: I work in product development, and 90% of new products fail. So simply dumping on everything will make you statistically look like a genius, but in reality the true insight comes from calling both the hits And misses.
 
Man Wombat, every time I start to like you, you have to go say something ignorant. I feel like you didn't even give the game (Overwatch) a chance. I'm not even into multiplayer games but this one really grabbed my attention. All the characters play and feel completely different. Every time I pick a character I say to my self, this is the character I mainly want to play. But then I try another character, I say no this is the one I want to main. All the characters are really fun to play as and are so unique. There are the characters who have fast movements, that can run on walls, climb walls, or even fly. You shit oh Overwatch but besides the lack of game modes, they put a large effort on making every character different and be very useful in different roles. Hell, it's the only game I have actually had fun and felt I was being useful healing and buffing my teammates and not just going for kills. I don't understand how you can praise Halo and Titanfall's (Titanfall being mp only as well) competitive multiplayer when they seem to be doing nothing spectacular and that Overwatch is killing the gaming industry. Of course this is all IMO but damn it Wombat, like what I like!!! Sorry for the rant :(
 
Its odd when parents take really small kids into movies with ratings like PG-13 and R. There are some kids who can handle the intense action sequences but I feel like parents are ignoring the MPAA film rating system. I think one way to judge if a child should see it is compare the film rating to a video game rating. With E being the same as G, E+10 being the same as PG, teen being the same as PG-13 and mature being the same as R.

I usually don't think about it when seeing a movie but when Deadpool came out the theater I was in had at least two children probably late elementary school age. I would think some of the violence in there would give any kids nightmares.

You guys should have just waited until ship was home to start, the show would have flown better. Cheapy and Wombat are fantastic but it's nice to hear Ship's opinion on Cheapy's life events.

Great show as always!
 
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You guys should definitely try the multiplayer. It has a good tutorial and then trials you can play against bots, so you're not forced to learn the game by getting destroyed by other people.
 
Phil Spencer was the head of Microsoft Studios at the Fable Legends time Wombat was talking about but the "games as a platform" philosophy sounds more like former Xbox head Don Mattrick. The guy loved Zynga's business model and that's why all the first party Xbox One launch games were lousy with microtransactions. He left to actually run Zynga and now it's all but dead. That man did more damage to the Xbox brand than the Red Rings of Death.
 
Once I got thru the long stretch of cutscenes in UC4 up into Chapter 5, the "real" game kicked in and I got hooked and got to Chapter 9 late last night.  I love the sneaking around in the bushes and taking enemies down silently.   More fun than shooting them.  

 
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Enjoyed the show! Was funny to hear the old man ignorance on Overwatch. I used to play DOTA when it was a Warcraft 3 custom game and now play a lot of Smite so those games make sense to me. Overwatch will find its group of loyal players I'm sure, a lot will depend on the balance of the Heroes, once ppl have enough time to run the heroes and write guides then it will show which are OP and they will patch it. The thing a game like that needs is lots of support and updates which I'm sure Blizzard will give it.

I would argue though that Overwatch is not a single player killer since I think it's draw will be from ppl that liked Smite, League, DOTA, Titanfall, CoD and other multiplayer games. I don't think this eats up the demand for single player. I'm impressed that Blizzard got such a refined game out of the code for the cancelled MMO. Good on them for not letting all those Dev costs go to waste.
 
Congrats on making it to 450 episodes.  To nitpick Wombat's nitpick even in the comic Falcon doesn't make his own suit.   I really hate when people bring little kid to the movies.  That is why you get a big screen tv so they can watch movies at home.

I would recommend the latest Doctor Strange comic for the kind of story Wombat talked about.

 
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Great episode as usual, though the Overwatch discussion from Shipwreck and Wombat was pretty silly (but they probably know that). The idea that a well-made Blizzard game on PC will be played for a week or so from Wombat was especially silly. It'll sell more and last a hell of a lot longer than something like Titanfall.

 
I never thought I'd see Disney Interactive pull a uDraw, let alone hear Cheapy be sad about it.  I remember him being righteously against Disney Infinity back when it was first announced, and it seemed like the logical stance at the time!  Clearly they've done something right over the course of three games to have thawed his heart.  You guys have talked me into a gently used, dirt cheap Starter Pack and the Zootopia figures I've been eyeing for a while now.  We'll see what happens!

 
I know wombat was trying to rub salt about overwatch but he just kind of sounds like a buffoon saying it's bad for the industry and "has no content". The game is not for you, I get it, but being condescending towards those who do isn't doing anyone any good.

I think the stupid content argument is so meaningless. A fun game can last you a hundred hours regardless of its "content" and a game with 100 hours of "content" can get boring after 10 hours. Plenty of dads and people with "no time" hop on a multiplayer game for 30-60 minutes a night and play and get hundreds of hours out of a single game over the years that way. Not all the people playing DOTA and CS:GO are kids, you know.

The fun is in the situations the game creates and the variety in the heroes. Every hero is so different and its fun to learn their quirks and how to use them best. That's what kept me coming back to the beta. I had a lot of fun trying to build the best team to counter the enemy team and make a comeback.

I do agree with the criticism of taking too long to run back to the point from spawn but that's going to be any objective game. They can't have the offense start close to the objective because it's an advantage for the defenders. The offense needs to try to stay alive as much as possible for that reason. Every defensive kill is a huge advantage to the defenders. Having the DJ character speed up a group of heroes or symmetra create a teleporter helps with this.

I'd love to hear shipwreck elaborate more about why he feels uncharted doesn't control well. I've enjoyed the way you can leap from cover to cover and the mobility you have while in a gunfight. Maybe next week you'll have finished the auction house chapter - I thought that the ending escape was really tense and fun in that fight and liked being able to flank the groups of enemies and use blindfire.

 
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Now on Chapter 14 of the Walking Simulator (UC4.)  My interest has come and gone in a few waves.  They gave me a vehicle  a few chapters ago and yet for the most part it was kind of boring to use it.  Driving wasn't really any different than walking.   Exceptions to the one big action sequence involving vehicles.  That was great fun.  

Climbing.  Oh so much climbing.  I like it but not this much.  It's  was getting to the point where I was doing the same thing over and over.  But then, to their credit, they introduce a new mechanic to climbing and it perks up a bit.

I'm still loving each new sneak/shoot bad guy set piece.  I did find myself wishing  I could have the option of quickly hitting a button to repeat each set piece again in order to try out other tactics.  I'm never quite sure  with what I can get away with as far as sneaking around goes.  And there's always new weapons to use or after you're done you notice a few barrels you could have blown up.  I also always feel like I could have "done better."  But what great fun choking out enemies in the tall grass undetected or whatever your guy does to them.  (I will probably go back at the end and repeat a few of these if the game lets me.)

A downer was  a stretch of 3 or 4 puzzles in a row which all together required 1 brain cell but ate up way too much time.  I could be figuring out how to repair the hole I accidentally put in my basement wall  instead.  If they could somehow substitute real world low-level problem solving for in-game puzzles I think it would be a win-win.  

Overall fun, but game could have been cut a few hours shorter so far.  I know they want to pace the exciting parts.  But I feel like I could have done that by sleeping instead. 

 
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The Overwatch beta convinced me to pre-order the game and that hasn't happened to me in quite some time! I was surprised to hear Wombat and Shipwreck ripping on it.

I think the thing to remember about a game like Overwatch is that it isn't just what you get in the box here. Similar to Team Fortress 2 or even Diablo 3, it's also what the game will potentially become in the future. You're sort of buying into a long term experience.

At the moment, the game is a lot of fun but to some it may not seem like much. However, Blizzard has a great track record of supporting their games and Overwatch could be double the game it is now in two years with community feedback and whatever else they have planned to add in.

 
What did you guys think of Chapter 16 (old lady's house) in UC4?  As good as an Ambien?

 
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Just some comments with regards to Overwatch and just competitive games in general.  I agree with Wombat that there can be very little perceived value in a game with only multiplayer component but, in my opinion, that seems to be the case for individuals who look to play a game with a move "on to the next one" mentality.  I think the appeal of a solid multiplayer component is to keep you coming back for an interactive experience with opponents who don't have a limited number of scripted processes (AI) long after release and continuously.  If it doesn't hook the player then yeah its poor value. If it does, then I think it stands to reason that it could be played for years and can consistently evolve. Games like World of Warcraft, Starcraft, Team Fortress, Halo , CoD, fighting games...etc I think serve as examples of games that provide their value over the long haul. Especially if you love the game's mechanics and would like to try it out in different scenarios with some opponents who may be a step above a whack a mole game. I understand Wombats apprehension about "buying games on promises" but I don't think that the worth of a competitive game is in some of the things that make or break other games.

I may be incorrect in my deduction but Wombat and Ship do not strike me as individuals that really dig cooperative-competitive online video games (not speaking about high scores type arcade games) in general to the point of returning to them consistently for 6 months to a year. Or, at least, nothing has grabbed them enough to do so like an MMO or something. As a result perceived value is quite low. Obviously there's nothing wrong with that if you like/prefer single player games or don't have the time to devote to "getting good" at a multi-player game. Not to bring it back up from the dead but Wombat played a fair share of Destiny which shares a lot of its roots in the MMO space. He seemingly enjoyed the pursuit of loot and shaders but I don't recall if he was thumbs up or thumbs down onto the whole grouping up aspect for certain missions.

I played the Overwatch beta, and personally, found it rather fun. It is definitely built for team play so I can see if someone is playing in random groups and not with friends how it is an immediate turn off especially if lifestyle doesn't allow.  Is it worth $40/60? I can't answer that for others but for me I can see myself spending $40 since I typically sit on one online shooter to scratch that niche itch in between 60+hr rpgs or clever platforming games for a long time. I dunno, if a game has cool gameplay mechanics I like to really dig in there and enjoy them. Mass Effect 3 comes to mind.  It goes without saying but just in case, value is subjective.

Which brings me to the topic of Uncharted. Lemme start by saying I have NOT played this 4th iteration. Which I tend to get the same vibe of low value due to my perception of it being "style/production values over substance" especially this far into the series. If I got it at a Wombat hack price then that could change. Sure, the games are pretty. Sure, the VA-ing and mo cap is well done. But more times than not I hear "the gameplay is ok" or "melee is blegh" or "shooting...works" or something of the like. I love a story as much as I do a great game play experience but that doesn't mean I am going to slog through some ho hum tedium of un-interactive invisible wall laden, albiet pretty, environments to suffer unsatisfying gun play. I could just watch a movie and save my fingers the effort. I can take the reverse (bad story good gameplay) in this medium but sometimes the other way around is much more difficult. Then again that just speaks volumes to the world and characters that are present in Uncharted that, in spite of these general complaints, it is still favorably received. Naughty Dogs latest titles of Uncharted and The Last of Us are probably just not for me.

Not hating, just putting my thoughts out there. Keep up the work guys and I enjoy what you guys (Cheapy, Wombat, Ship)  provide to the gaming community on a daily basis.

 
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I was cracking up over the whole Overwatch thing... First Cheapy practically begs Wombat & Ship to try it, then acts all butthurt when they don't like the game at all. Classic.

To everyone acting all upset that they didn't like it, it's perfectly fine. That's the thing about opinions, if we all liked the same things life would suck.
 
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