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Retail reports indicate Nintendo DS pricing, launch date, software

Rob Fahey 16:18 14/07/2004

November 4th, 19,000 Yen (140 Euro), with five to six launch titles and 11 by 2005

Unconfirmed reports from Japanese retail sources suggest that Nintendo is planning to roll out the DS handheld on November 4th priced at 19,000 Yen (140 Euro), followed by a US launch on November 11th at $179.95 (145 Euro).

The same sources indicate that the Japanese launch of the handheld will be accompanied by five to six software titles, with Nintendo aiming to have 11 titles on the market by the end of 2004.

Nintendo reportedly aims to sell three million units of the Nintendo DS worldwide by the end of fiscal 2005 next March - a period which should encompass both the Japanese and US launches before Christmas, and the European launch in early 2005.

While these figures certainly seem plausible, it should be noted that Nintendo has issued no official confirmation of the launch date, price or software support for the Nintendo DS as yet; in fact, we're still not even sure what the DS will be called at retail, since Nintendo DS is still officially a codename, not a final product name.

The retail prices suggested in this report would almost certainly make the NDS significantly cheaper than the PlayStation Portable, which is expected to cost well over 30,000 Yen (220 Euro) when it arrives in Japan later this year, ahead of a US and European launch in 2005.

Earlier this week, a Nintendo spokesperson criticised the PSP in an interview with Japanese newspaper Asahi Shimbun, arguing that the handheld could not be classified as a true video game system because of its integration of music and movie playback functions.

From http://gamesindustry.biz
 
I'm actually starting to agree with Nintendo about Sony adding all that extra crap. I dont want to pay double the price for something I'll use once or twice. If I wanted a movie/MP3 player then I'd buy one! If the PS3 costs more cause it has all this Tivo crap on it then I will NOT be buying it.
 
• Animal Crossing
• Mario Kart
• Super Mario Bros.
• Viewtiful Joe
• Warioware, Inc.
• Final Fantasy: CC

One can only hope. *sigh*
 
[quote name='isaac']• Animal Crossing
• Mario Kart
• Super Mario Bros.
• Viewtiful Joe
• Warioware, Inc.
• Final Fantasy: CC

One can only hope. *sigh*[/quote]

Hah a lineup wiht no original games, yup, that sounds like Nintendo alright.
 
Mario 64x4
Metroid
Warioware
and possibly 2 3rd party games like Sonic as well as a couple of high profile GBA games to capitalize on it's compatability.

Frankly the fact that the PSP is a media player should be a comfort to Nint because it means they definatly arnt competing with them, unfortunatly the PSP is to the DS was the PS2 was to the GC, one plays more than games and the other JUST games so they'd need to really have games people want to play. People who want a media player with games will buy it and peope who want a portable game system will by this.... or a GBA. :)
 
[quote name='Mr Unoriginal'][quote name='isaac']• Animal Crossing
• Mario Kart
• Super Mario Bros.
• Viewtiful Joe
• Warioware, Inc.
• Final Fantasy: CC

One can only hope. *sigh*[/quote]

Hah a lineup wiht no original games, yup, that sounds like Nintendo alright.[/quote]

You know, unlike the GT and Metal Gear and FF:AC which are completely original..
 
Guyver has a good point I wonder if it will be competing with Halo 2. If this is true Nov. 11 will be a truly crazy day. 6 titles at launch seem a bit low and I heard the other day that the psp may cost $250. Also hopefully Nintendo will supe up the design a little. I am not trying to bash Nintendo, but they can't take the psp litely. I for one will by the Ds and that's it as far a portables.
 
The more I think about it, the less I want a new gen of systems. Think about it, no cheap (and good) games for months....
 
[quote name='guyver2077']well they better start announcing some real quality games....

and are they trying to compete with halo??[/quote]

i forget what mag it was in, but it was recent....i read that they were making a halo game for ds or psp...also forget which one....i know, im very helpful
 
[quote name='trustcompany1013'][quote name='guyver2077']well they better start announcing some real quality games....

and are they trying to compete with halo??[/quote]

i forget what mag it was in, but it was recent....i read that they were making a halo game for ds or psp...also forget which one....i know, im very helpful[/quote]
i think it's for GBA
 
[quote name='ex0'][quote name='trustcompany1013'][quote name='guyver2077']well they better start announcing some real quality games....

and are they trying to compete with halo??[/quote]

i forget what mag it was in, but it was recent....i read that they were making a halo game for ds or psp...also forget which one....i know, im very helpful[/quote]
i think it's for GBA[/quote]

Hmm, that is interesting... And the DS competing with Halo 2? I don't know what to say about that. I wonder when Microsoft is going to announce a portable system.
 
[quote name='scdoanintendo']...6 titles at launch seem a bit low...[/quote]

Seems like more launch titles than any other Nintendo system in recent memory /only slight sarcasm

[quote name='rabbit']I wonder when Microsoft is going to announce a portable system.
[/quote]

What do you mean? They already have a portable... Just hook up a 19" TV to your Xbox, and you can take it with you wherever you go. I like to play Halo while cycling. /extreme sarcasm
 
One thing I remember reading, tell me if you saw this....I read somewhere that the DS is backwards compatible as far as playing GBA carts but that it wouldn't qualify as a GBA if you wanted to use it in a GC link for say Four Swords. And also might not work linking up with a GBA for a 2 player GBA game. Anyone know if that's true?
 
I won't be purchasing the DS for that price. There are few games that interest me and until its library is built up and the price drops I see little reason to invest in it where I could buy more games for the the consoles I already own.
 
[quote name='Wshakspear']You know, unlike the GT and Metal Gear and FF:AC which are completely original..[/quote]

I just hope that PSP doesn't turn into a lot of mediocre or bad PS2 ports, but thats what it looks to be shaping into to me.
DS won't have many new franchises to start with, that's pretty much a given. PS2 didn't exactly have a lot of original titles when it was launched. However, I think that having WarioWare, the new Mario game, and a few other titles that were mentioned before at launch would be instrumental.
 
[quote name='jshorr']One thing I remember reading, tell me if you saw this....I read somewhere that the DS is backwards compatible as far as playing GBA carts but that it wouldn't qualify as a GBA if you wanted to use it in a GC link for say Four Swords. And also might not work linking up with a GBA for a 2 player GBA game. Anyone know if that's true?[/quote]

I hadn't read that, but I wouldn't be too surprised. I read that it is backwards compatible with GBA games, but not GBC or GB games.
 
well I will still get one, I wanted a 150 price but I can still swing 180. Since I don't own a DS, I will be spending lots of time playing my GBA games with a nice light. Plus I'm sure some of the DS games will turn out good.
 
Doh! I forgot Metroid.

Anyway, I'll confirm that backwards compatibility is available for GBA games, but not GBC or GB games.

Hopefully the screen's not going to be too dark. A DS SP would be a bit much in terms of battery life, I'm guessing.
 
If it launches with Animal Crossing, I will buy it. A better game for the commute does not exist [though Fire Emblem gives it a good run for it's money]. Not to mention the fact that we will FINALLY be able to visit someone else's town with the other player actually IN THE TOWN AT THE SAME TIME.

Hallelujah!
 
The DS seems like such a waste to me.

Unless humans suddenly grow a second pair of eyes before it launches, there's no way to focus on two screens at the same time. What that means is one screen is going to have to remain inactive and serve as something simple like a map. Apparently it was too hard to push start and go into the menu to look at a map, they need a whole second screen for it. Sony may be wrong to be adding all this extra stuff in the PSP (UMD is going to be the next memory stick or minidisc - completely worthless), but at least they got the one giant screen thing right.

And the stylus? Phft. PDAs have been around for YEARS, how much gaming innovation have you seen on those things? If developers wanted gamers to use stylus pens they would've been working on PDAs a long time ago. Not to mention all the scratches the screen will get with a stylus rubbing all over it, plus the fact that stylus pens are easy to lose. Not only that but the thing doesn't look small enough for a normal person to hold with one hand while they drag a stylus around the screen.

I think the DS is just more gimmick crap from Nintendo (like those E-Reader cards, whooo boy did those sure take off!) and will wind up being Virtua Boy 2004.
 
[quote name='guessed'][quote name='jshorr']One thing I remember reading, tell me if you saw this....I read somewhere that the DS is backwards compatible as far as playing GBA carts but that it wouldn't qualify as a GBA if you wanted to use it in a GC link for say Four Swords. And also might not work linking up with a GBA for a 2 player GBA game. Anyone know if that's true?[/quote]

I hadn't read that, but I wouldn't be too surprised. I read that it is backwards compatible with GBA games, but not GBC or GB games.[/quote]

That seems unlikely to me. Once you have GBA compatibility handling GBC/GB code is trivial. The GBa does it largely in software on the ARM CPU and the DS is using ARM also.

As for linking, so long as it has the needed port I can't imagine why this should be a problem. Again, once you can run GBA code this is a minor addition to the function set.
 
They will probably could sacrifice GBC compatability simply because having a GB cart sticking out of a GBA already looks stupid and how many people are really still willing to buy GBC games when they're practically rerelasing everything worth playing as a GBA upgrade?

issac - I can confirm for you that the screen was brilliant and easy to view, it's backlit now as opposed to front lit like the SP is. This means it will probably have a shorter battery life than the GBA though but maybe they've gotten better engineering in the last couple of years to get more time out of it.

I do have to agree that the stylus screen is going to get some serious abuse, scratch wise. it's got to ship with a plastic scratch cover on the glass, and I'm sure 3rd parties are going to go ape comming up with replacement protectors just like they did for the original GBA. The one good thing though is that you really could just play it with you finger as long as you dont mine a sligt decrease in accuracy.

Also the DS has that wireless networking ability I dont see why they wouldnt try to make it compatable with the up comming wireless multiplayer GBA link device.
 
I'll wait. Got lots of GBA games I need to finish before I start another system. I'll probably buy the games just in case some go out of print early.
 
[quote name='Thunderscope']They better give me a free game if its gonna be $180![/quote]

if can almost promise you that the success of the DS will very well come down to this.

think about it....
they want to launch a new system with a new gameplay ideas at a price almost twice as large as that of their console.

if a 30-50 title were to be tacked on to that... that they'd be dead in the water.

its gonna have to be launching ina bundle for $180 with the first mario game. Mario 64x4.

that way... everyone that gets one... gets a game... more importantly... they'd be getting the same game at launch.

this allows users more of a chance to experience its wireless multiplayer capability. its a done deal with the free game... that or i promise you... as cool as the DS is... it'll be, commercially, dead on arrival.
 
So a PSP at $250 (167% of the current PS2 price) won't be DOA?

****

I do like the idea of a bundled game to feature the multiplayer aspect of the DS. I have many GBA games that require multi-cart to for multiplayer, and consequently NOT played multiplayer because of it. Making sure lots of people have the game would be a great way of pushing the wireless MP gaming. A solid line of logic there all around.

****

If this rumor of $180 started at Nintendo, I can see them using it to gauge interest at a certain price. NOA reps check busy boards like IGN every now and then to see what the buzz is, so this could be like an extended focus group exercise.
 
[quote name='mmn']The DS seems like such a waste to me.

Unless humans suddenly grow a second pair of eyes before it launches, there's no way to focus on two screens at the same time. What that means is one screen is going to have to remain inactive and serve as something simple like a map. Apparently it was too hard to push start and go into the menu to look at a map, they need a whole second screen for it. Sony may be wrong to be adding all this extra stuff in the PSP (UMD is going to be the next memory stick or minidisc - completely worthless), but at least they got the one giant screen thing right.

And the stylus? Phft. PDAs have been around for YEARS, how much gaming innovation have you seen on those things? If developers wanted gamers to use stylus pens they would've been working on PDAs a long time ago. Not to mention all the scratches the screen will get with a stylus rubbing all over it, plus the fact that stylus pens are easy to lose. Not only that but the thing doesn't look small enough for a normal person to hold with one hand while they drag a stylus around the screen.

I think the DS is just more gimmick crap from Nintendo (like those E-Reader cards, whooo boy did those sure take off!) and will wind up being Virtua Boy 2004.[/quote]

You seem very determined to deliver a negative review of a product you haven't actually seen. I spent some time hands-on at E3 and came away impressed in the implementation.

The dual screen arrangement is nothing like having two TV or PC monitors. Keep in mind these are the very small screens of a handheld device. They both fit within your field of vision just fine. As for focus, this is no different from a full size screen display more than one type of information at the same time. The big advantage of the dual screens is to get more effective use of the small area available. Sheer size, not just resolution is a big handicap for handhelds when trying to produce comparable screen layouts to what is common on consoles.

If you want to understand the DS better, don't think of it as two screens. Think of it as one much larger screen with a hinge in the middle to make it fit in a clamshell design of the right size for convenient portability. Thus the DS provides a much larger screen and total resolution without sacrificing the need to conform to an existing form factor for successful handheld game systems. When you reorient your thinking this way the DS doesn't seem like such an oddbll concept anymore and instead one that is much more in tune with existing successes than Sony's approach.

Your take on the stylus being of no value because PDAs aren't a large game market is simply thoughtless. Computers existed for decades before they became widely used as entertainment devices. It wasn't until systems with the right function set and price became common that a large number of people could pursue employment as game developers. The total PDA market is much smaller than the installed base of the SNES andincludes no less than four major operating systems with no binary compatibility. As well, the early generations were black and white with screens that handled animation poorly and little in the way of hardware support for gaming graphics either. When you actually narrow things down to those PDAs that offered a decent game development platform you're talking about models with installed bases measured in the mere hundreds of thousands. As well, gaming is not those devices primary application so the number of highly capable developers pursuing that market has been miniscule.

That hasn't stopped people from trying, though, and some very nifty things have been done using stylus control in games. Once you've become accustomed to a gesture based input system applying those skills to a game isn't a great leap. The application of the stylus in gaming is still largely unexplored territory due to a lack of a suitable platform. (There have been cute little shareware items for Tablet PCs but that is also a tiny market as yet.) A dedicated gaming platform from a major manaufacturer changes the story. THe DS design doesn't make use of the stylus a requirement but developers looking for something different to do will surely be intrigued.

As for your other complaints, you're only demonstrating your ignorance. I know of plenty of Palms that are still in dialy use after several years of stylus action on their screens. They've proven quite durable. As for losing stylii, they're three for $5 at most office supply stores. I doubt Nintendo will have any difficulty getting game stores like TRU and BB to carry a replacement stylus pack alongside all the other accessories.
 
[quote name='WildWop']So a PSP at $250 (167% of the current PS2 price) won't be DOA?

****

I do like the idea of a bundled game to feature the multiplayer aspect of the DS. I have many GBA games that require multi-cart to for multiplayer, and consequently NOT played multiplayer because of it. Making sure lots of people have the game would be a great way of pushing the wireless MP gaming. A solid line of logic there all around.

****

If this rumor of $180 started at Nintendo, I can see them using it to gauge interest at a certain price. NOA reps check busy boards like IGN every now and then to see what the buzz is, so this could be like an extended focus group exercise.[/quote]


whoa whoa...
don't know if you were refering to me... i never said the PSP wouldn't be DOA... didnt even mention it... only talking about DS.

i try not to get involved arguments... not talking trash... just talking my predictions on that single product.
 
You seem very determined to deliver a negative review of a product you haven't actually seen.
Click to expand...

And you seem determined to talk down to me as though you were my English professor.

If you want to understand the DS better, don't think of it as two screens.
Click to expand...

No, I'll continue to think of it as two screens since that's what NINTENDO wants me to think of it as.

The total PDA market is much smaller than the installed base of the SNES andincludes no less than four major operating systems with no binary compatibility.
Click to expand...

I'd like to see some numbers as proof rather than simply taking your word for it.

Whenever I'm out and about I see more people using PDAs than I do GBAs. Based only on that, I'd assume tons of people have PDAs - moreso than any mobile gaming device. And who cares about the installed base of the SNES?

The PDA market may contain 4 major operating systems, but they've always had a Windows based system, which really leaves no excuses as to why there aren't more games on it. I really don't think the reason companies aren't developing for PDAs is because "there's 4 operating systems out there". There's too many PDAs and too much potential revenue to be made for that to be a valid excuse. They're not in the market because PDA gaming isn't profitable. Having a new 2-screen PDA with the word "Nintendo" on it isn't going to change that overnight.

If you think the Nintendo name in itself is going to move product you haven't been paying much attention to gaming since 2001.

A dedicated gaming platform from a major manaufacturer changes the story. THe DS design doesn't make use of the stylus a requirement but developers looking for something different to do will surely be intrigued.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm sure they'll be intrigued, just like they were with the E-Reader cards. We'll get 3 total games that use the stylus and 2 of them will suck. Developers will then realize that people don't want to use a friggin stylus to play video games, even if it is a portable.

As for your other complaints, you're only demonstrating your ignorance. I know of plenty of Palms that are still in dialy use after several years of stylus action on their screens. They've proven quite durable. As for losing stylii, they're three for $5 at most office supply stores.
Click to expand...

If I'm ignorant, you're a pompous asshole. I never said the thing would BREAK, I said the screen would get scratched up, and that IS a problem and it WILL happen. I have never seen a PDA more than 3 months old that didn't have some scratches on the screen from using the stylus. Using your own logic, it doesn't matter with PDAs because they're not meant for gaming - when you have a gaming system it's much different and will effect gameplay.

Sure, there will be aftermarket replacement screens, but it will be a hassle to install them. People don't like hassles.

And again, it's going to be inconvienient to have to go to the store to buy a new stylus if you lose your DS one, no matter what the cost. Sure, Nintendo will put out spare stylus packs, but if you really think they'll be three for $5 you're naive. They'll charge no less than $10 per stylus, at best.

Now, when you reply to this, try toning it down and realizing we're all on the same level here. And please don't talk down to me anymore because I'm having a negative view of a MACHINE. Thanks.
 
I was really hoping for a 149$ price tag, I would have gotten it at launch for that. Now it looks like I'll be waiting for a price drop. They also damn well better include that picto chat program for free, If they don't it looks like I'll be waiting for a 99$ price point before I buy. I also wish they would have included an analog stick, thats the one and only thing I like about the psp. If they included an analog stick, I'd gladly pay 149-179 for the DS.
 
The E-Reader was a peripheral, not a function of the base unit (available to ALL people who own the GBA). The touch screen will be available by default, so developers can use that feature more freely without worrying about narrowing their potential sales base.

It is the same reason that most developers do not make four-player PS2 games -- because they cannot be sure that you have the necessary peripheral.
 
[quote name='mmn']

Now, when you reply to this, try toning it down and realizing we're all on the same level here. And please don't talk down to me anymore because I'm having a negative view of a MACHINE. Thanks.[/quote]

You really need to work on those insecurities, lad. If you think you're being spoken down to just because I choose to write effectively places the problem on your end. You made wild inaccurate statements and they were refuted. Get over it.

You really do not understand the PDA market and just how tiny it is compared to just the GBA, never mind all the previous GameBoy models. Even narrowing it down to the segment with WinCE doesn't help much since that still went through stages of B&W and then limited color along with no less than three supported CPU architectures until fairly recently. The number of PDAs that offer a distinct platform cumulatively add up to well under the installed bease of the GBA within its first quarter of launch in terms of offering a stable platform rather than a highly variable platform akin to the PC. As well, the PDA market doesn't have the equivalent publisher support and marketing when it comes to games. By and large games on PDAs are treated as a little garage operation that sprouted up with largely benign neglect by the manufacturers.

You're truly being silly on the stylus issue. If Nintendo is so unwise as to seriously overcharge for replacement stylii, what would stop anyone from buyin the cheap replacements that already exist? Companies like Belking who have a long standing in the PC laptop and portable electronics accessory markets have made inroads into the console field. Repackaging their existing stylus replacement pack for the game section of stores is not something that would take more than a day to design a package for a new SKU.

Yes, Nintendo has emphasized the two screens of the DS. What else would you expect? Market is always promoting aspects of a product that help distinguish it even if that isn't necessarily the best way to treat the product. That won't matter once the demonstration centers are in stores and the general public can see for themselves how it actually works.

I mentioned the SNES installed base to make a point that apparently flew right past you without danger of interception. The SNES, as an example of a highly successful game development target, very soon after its launch offered developers a large set of absolutely identical machines to use as their target for publishing games. There is simply nothing remotely like that in the PDA world. Starting with the Apple Newton, the many PalmOS devices, the myriad of WinCE systems across no less than eight incompatible CPU architectures to date, Psion and the Symbian offshoots, the handful of othe rvariants running Linux and lesser known operating systems, add them all together and you don't have the number of one major game system. Take them separately and you have something truly lacking in the numbers required to attract the interest of major publishers.

Of all these products only one, the Tapwave Zodiac, is specifically targeting gamers. They've sold, oh, hundreds so far. For most purposes it only amounts to a small subset of the PalmOS market.

What you accustomed to seeing on a daily basis is meaningless and anecdotal at best. The actual hard sales numbers are what matter to developers. If you're Electronic Arts there is high confidence in Nintendo selling enough DS units to merit support. Meanwhile EA hasn't seen any one PDA platform offer a similar opportunity. Instead they've let smaller companies liense EA properties for a lump sum and royalties. EA has nothing to lose under those circumstances. So far, those licensees equipped with major EA brands, haven't generated enough revenue to make EA get serious about taking a direct role in PDA gaming. If you look you'll find that EA has a page for PalmOS Tiger woods Golf but does not treat PalmOS or PocketPC as supported platforms on the main page.

The PDA world is simply no basis for making pronouncements on the usefulness of a touch-sensitive screen as an input device for gaming. In any case, the success or failure of the Ds hardly hinges on the wide acceptance of stylus input. The unit isn't lacking for more conventional inputs and the stylus will still see use in the cecondary community functions of the system such as tapping out messages. Those who have no use for either stylus games or the non-game uses of it will simply leave it at home or packed away with other accessories in a carrying case. The product's ultimate deiciding point will be the availability of games that are highly accessible to the existing audience. From what I saw at E3 the DS is more than capable of delivering in that respect. The other features are just icing on the cake.
 
[quote name='CaptainObviousXl']i think they are gonna include pictochat because i dont think that would sell good seperatly[/quote]

Alternately, they might treat it like the original Mario Bros. on GBA and build it into several games as a bonus so that inevitably everyone ends up having at least one game that includes it.
 
[quote name='CaptainObviousXl']or they could just make pictochat built in[/quote]
I would not be supprised if Nintendo did build pictochat into the DS.
Im waiting until the DS is around $100-130 to pick one up. I also want to wait and make sure we dont get a DS SP before I run out and buy one.
 
I saw a quick spec write-up from one of the game magazines, don't remember which....so of course I did take it with a grain of salt....but it basically had for the DS GBA Compatibility: YES GC Linkable: No. So I dunno.

Just a side question, can you use two GBA's to link up 2 regular GB/GBC multiplayer games? Like tetris DX multiplayer on 2 GBA's?

[quote name='epobirs'][quote name='guessed'][quote name='jshorr']One thing I remember reading, tell me if you saw this....I read somewhere that the DS is backwards compatible as far as playing GBA carts but that it wouldn't qualify as a GBA if you wanted to use it in a GC link for say Four Swords. And also might not work linking up with a GBA for a 2 player GBA game. Anyone know if that's true?[/quote]

I hadn't read that, but I wouldn't be too surprised. I read that it is backwards compatible with GBA games, but not GBC or GB games.[/quote]

That seems unlikely to me. Once you have GBA compatibility handling GBC/GB code is trivial. The GBa does it largely in software on the ARM CPU and the DS is using ARM also.

As for linking, so long as it has the needed port I can't imagine why this should be a problem. Again, once you can run GBA code this is a minor addition to the function set.[/quote]
 
[quote name='jshorr'] Just a side question, can you use two GBA's to link up 2 regular GB/GBC multiplayer games? Like tetris DX multiplayer on 2 GBA's?[/quote]

I know for sure you can't link Tetris DX. I was rather upset about that as a friend and I used to battle relentlessly in the GBC days. I do believe however, that other titles work but there are some that don't.
 
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