Xbox 360 Backwards Compatibility - By the Numbers

CheapyD

CheapyD

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With the latest backwards compatibility update occuring this week, I thought it might be interesting to see how many of the best reviewed Xbox games are backwards compatible on the Xbox 360.

I took the 300 best reviewed Xbox games as scored by Metacritic (a website that collates reviews) and then checked to see which games are backwards compatible on the Xbox 360.

Of the top 300 reviewed Xbox games, 82 (or 27%) are backwards compatible.
Of the 21 new additions to the the bc list, 8 are in the top 300 best reviewed list.

Below, I have crunched the numbers a bit further.
Look, it's a chart!

360bcchart.jpg


Top 300
BC: 82 (27% BC)
Not BC: 218


Top 250
BC: 67 (27% BC )
Not BC: 183


Top 100
BC: 32 (32% BC)
Not BC: 68


Top 50
BC: 21 (42% BC)
Not BC: 29


Top 25
BC: 14 (56% BC)
Not BC: 11


Top 10
BC: 8 (80% BC)
Not BC: 2

Clearly, it must be no small undertaking to make Xbox games BC on the 360.
Of the top 100 reviewed Xbox games, Microsoft has only been able to make 32 backwards compatible.

I think CAG epobirs summed it up best when he said,
[quote name='epobirs']Seriously, if it were just a matter of wanting it, Microsoft would have every Xbox title ever release running on the 360 with enhancements. This is not a trivial undertaking and the testing involved for the games is very time intensive. They're recreating much of the playtesting cycle these games already passed through before they were originally released.

The more desirable recent Xbox titles are the result of develoeprs who've been honing their Xbox skills for five years. The likelihood of those games containing the kind of coding techniques that make for the most difficult items to make run under emulation is very high. As more and more of the older titles become compatible the probability a newer titem will pass the testing phase is increased. But there is no getting around the laborious testing process.[/quote] I wonder if Microsoft is wishing it never promised backwards compatibility in the first place.

Digg this story!
 
Oh snap, we're doing charts now. I'll be all over this mind-blowing, macro-writing Excel skills. :)

So it looks as though roughly 30% of the top 100 are BC. Coincidently, that's close to the same percentage of games (29%) that are BC from the entire US Xbox catalog.
 
Now that Cheapy is a "video game consultant" he has to do these things to stay legit. ;) Hey, what's better for Cheapy is better for us. Where's the Kool Aid!?!

Seriously, this is an interesting breakdown. No doubt we'll see the story lifted word for word on Kotaku or Joystiq in a day or two - with no reference or credit, mind you.

Thanks for the stats, Cheapy!

Jeremy
 
Great/interesting post, the last sentence really makes you think. Microsoft was definately put under pressure to include backwards compatibility, I'd say it's comparable to Sony's tilt-sensors.
 
I'd rather they choose BC by review scores than sales numbers .

I don't want to play 50 Cent Bulletproof , or any other crap like that .
 
[quote name='Richlough']I'd rather they choose BC by review scores than sales numbers.[/quote] I'm sure it has more to do with what the Microsoft team is able to do technically, than either of those two factors.

[quote name='jrutz'] No doubt we'll see the story lifted word for word on Kotaku or Joystiq in a day or two - with no reference or credit, mind you.[/quote] Nah, those are two sites you never have to worry about getting credit for a story. They are really good about that stuff.
 
[quote name='CheapyD'] Fancy chart.[/quote]

Between this and Bloomberg, I'm beginning to think you are the smartest man alive.
 
Interesting stuff. Precisely the reason I bought a backup Xbox for my Xbox games, I'm not going to rely on the 360 to be able to play all of them.
 
[quote name='CheapyD']I wonder if Microsoft is wishing it never promised backwards compatibility in the first place.[/QUOTE]
I know I wish they never said it...although I probably wouldn't have bought a 360 as soon as I did - which shows why they did say it in the first place.

Nah, those are two sites you never have to worry about getting credit for a story.
Click to expand...
I've only had a 50% success rate getting stuff I submitted credited...although I've only sent two things.



Anyway...

I know it's "difficult" to get certain games working with BC. You'll have to forgive me if I don't sympathize and come rushing to the defense of one of the largest companies in the world that has near limitless resources.
 
[quote name='KaneRobot']I know it's "difficult" to get certain games working with BC. You'll have to forgive me if I don't sympathize and come rushing to the defense of one of the largest companies in the world that has near limitless resources.[/QUOTE]

Snap.

I agree with Zewone though. Buy an Xbox 360 for 360 games. If you don't think they warrant buying a 360 on it's own, then hold off for a year or so until the 360 library gets built up. Be wary if Microsoft starts boasting of the 360's library due to backward compatibility... that's what Atari and others did before the big crash.
 
Great post, Cheapy. I wonder where the rest of the BC games rank. It would be interesting to break down the average rating range and the number of BC games in that range. I wish I had the time.
 
[quote name='zewone']I really don't think they care, which is fine, because I don't either.

I bought a 360 to play 360 games.[/QUOTE]


But I own something like 100 Xbox games (many never played :whistle2:( ).

My big problem is space . . . I don't want to add a 360 to my Xbox, PS2, and GC . . . the PS3 and Wii can just replace my current system.

I may end up with a 360 but it has to be much cheaper and the library needs to shine.

For now, I will stand with my current systems. I might get a Wii -- only because it will be cheaper and my kids will love the games.
 
I think that my collection falls in line with the chart. That means that I have to keep a big ass system that I would like to get rid of. I do have the space, it's just that I would like to get rid of my xbox just like I got rid of my Playstation and my GBA SP. Kind of in those lines.
 
[quote name='MaskedPlague']I wonder where the rest of the BC games rank.[/QUOTE]

His chart lists 224 BC games out of ~240. Those last 16 must be what we call 'outliers.' Those games that didn't stand a chance in hell of being intentionally made BC, but were circumstantially so due to the similarity in code compared with other BC games. Barbie's Horse Adventures, for instance. I think it uses the "Doom 3" engine.

Of course, I think someone already pointed out that high reviews don't mean high sales. I'd like to see how a similar chart stacks up using sales as an independent variable instead.
 
The reason i bought the 360 was cause i was hoping to have most of the games i own and play them on the 360. What about Panzer Dragoon Orta, Sudeki, Soul Calibur 2, Kingdom under fire 1, 2, samurai showdown v. I have the space but also I don't want two systems from the same company in my tv. Also they have such deep pockets.
 
[quote name='schultzed']But I own something like 100 Xbox games (many never played :whistle2:( ).

My big problem is space . . . I don't want to add a 360 to my Xbox, PS2, and GC . . . the PS3 and Wii can just replace my current system.

I may end up with a 360 but it has to be much cheaper and the library needs to shine.

For now, I will stand with my current systems. I might get a Wii -- only because it will be cheaper and my kids will love the games.[/quote] This is exactly how I feel. Well, I plan on having fun with the Wii too, but other than that, word for word.
 
typical empty MS hype promise. Imagine what the sales of the 360 would be had they announced what the real numbers of BC games would be. Those top 100 numbers are just flat out insulting.
 
When I bought a 360 I had no intention of ever getting rid of my original XBox anyway, so this doesn't bother me. As far as the "limitless resources" argument goes, it's not really a matter of money, but time. In epobirs post, he states that the playtesting process has to be completed again for each individual game; BC isn't something we can expect overnight.
 
I wonder if MS would ever consider enlisting the aid of gamers at large in BC'ing games. Making whatever tools available as neccessary or just soliciting manhours for whatever the more time-intensive tasks are.
I am not suggesting opening the floodgates to hackers, but I am sure there are a lot of talented people out there (and not just in the hs/college bracket) with the time and desire to help out if they were given the chance.
 
That is one green chart. I think we should temper our expectations about BC. All of the games are not going to be BC in a day. Its going to take some time.
 
I want to see more backwards compatibility. I just bought a 360 and sole my old xbox... I don't need/play half the games I had for it, but I would like to get some good games for cheap for the original xbox ocassionaly and have some fun. (While playing it on the 360 of course)
 
I'm one of them who did not sold and did not plan to sell my Xbox after getting the Xbox 360, so the BC problem don't have any effect on me.
 
80% for the Top 10 isn't bad, but it's amazing how quickly the numbers slip to a pathetic HALF for the Top 25.
 
The oddest thing about this chart is that there is no difference between the percentage of top 250 and top 300 games. Does that mean that # 250-300 of the top ranked games are all backwards compatible or did CheapyD screw up when making this chart?
 
Buy an Xbox 360 for 360 games.
Click to expand...

There's a big problem with this logic- one that I've only discovered by recently buying my first PS2.

There are a great many games that were on the PS1 that were the first in a series (MGS being a prime example). If the PS2 didn't have BC, then I would have never been able to play it and really understand the characters. Additionally, there are great classics from the PS1 (Chrono Trigger comes to mind) that I would never have experienced without BC? Is your response 'You should buy a PS1 or Super Nintendo if you want to play the old games?'

If Nintendo and Sony can figure out BC, why can't MS?
 
The big problem with any logic that accepts this is that it gives Microsoft permission to abandon any other promises it made prior to the launch of the 360. If they can reneg on BC, why not anything else?
 
I don't know if anyone reads my blog, but I wrote a story on BC a couple of weeks ago. Here are some hot points why BC is a good idea:

But unlike my older consoles, where I can pull them out of storage and hook them up to the front AV input of my TV, the Xbox is much more involved. Like I said before - component cables, optical audio, ethernet - means it’s a pain in the ass to hook up.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah - there’s a small little fact that the 360 has spoiled me. Wireless controllers, power-up or dashboard from the controller.
Click to expand...

What about my investment in premium downloadable content on the original Xbox? Even if the game was compatible with the 360, my premium content doesn’t follow it. Which means I’d have to rebuy or do without - or just stick with what’s already on my Xbox hard drive. That is the biggest miss by Microsoft.
Click to expand...

And wouldn’t it be nice to be able to move saved games from the Xbox to the Xbox 360? Sony was smart with the PS2 in that the memory cards were backwards compatible as well, which allowed people to carry forth their saved games as well as their favorite titles. With the Xbox, for most people these are stuck to the Xbox’s internal hard drive.
Click to expand...

Jeremy
 
I'd agree with all of those points, but my major reason for wanting BC is pretty simple: The Xbox is fucking huge. I don't have the room for a ton of systems and needing the Xbox 1 to play those games isn't exactly a convenience. I realize the Xbox can go in the closet, but it's really just a pain to have that behemoth lying around when MS' competitors have systems that replace their previous consoles.
 
All I know is when i play the hardest game ever (ninja gaiden black on hardest setting) its BC but I HAVE TO SIGN OUT of Xbox LIVE and any FMV scenes dont look to great...the upscaling in game is excellent however but id rather use an original xbox (where my save is for the game so I dont have to play everything AGAIN) for 30-60 bucks to play my BC stuff with no "problems"
 
[quote name='Graystone']I think the pick what games are the simplest to make BC and then they do those. People three words Barbie Horse adventure[/QUOTE]

Excellent game for little girls.

Plus it keeps the eBay market for that game more viable by making it playable on 360. In fact, I think a few members of the backwards compatible team had several copies of it stored away and figured they'd attack that one first so that it would make the game more appealing when they put their games up for auction.

Truthfully, they've already got all the emulation done for games like Marvel Vs. Capcom 2, but since no one on the team currently owns that game, they are hoping that, eventually the price will drop because people won't be able to play it on the 360. Once the price drops, and they have their games, then they'll add them to the backwards compatibility list.
 
[quote name='Daddy']All I know is when i play the hardest game ever (ninja gaiden black on hardest setting) its BC but I HAVE TO SIGN OUT of Xbox LIVE and any FMV scenes dont look to great...the upscaling in game is excellent however but id rather use an original xbox (where my save is for the game so I dont have to play everything AGAIN) for 30-60 bucks to play my BC stuff with no "problems"[/quote]

The 360 enhances original Xbox games?

Sorry for the ignorant question, I don't know much about it.
 
[quote name='Vegan']The 360 enhances original Xbox games?

Sorry for the ignorant question, I don't know much about it.[/QUOTE]
Yes. Upscaled to 720p and with the newest update, you can play custom soundtracks on Xbox 1 games that don't support the feature (in a round-about way).
 
No matter where you fall on this (eyes a-rollin') 'hot button' (the 'Guide' button on the 360 controller?) issue, I think way too many people are investing way too much energy and emotion in it. I'm almost waiting for Senator McCain to chime in, taking a stance somewhat contrary to party lines. I almost expect some footage of Peter Moore to be "Your Moment of Zen" on tonight's The Daily Show.

360 Backwards Compatibility: It could be worse right now, it could be better, but either way, I'm assuming it's still a work in progress. Ergo, patience and perspective, Padawans.
 
Check out the big brain on Cheapy!

By the way I just heard Gates says he'll step away from MS two years from today.
 
Isn't the ps3 Backward compatibility supposed to be avalible overnight, due to a ps2 chip built into the ps3?
I read the recent article on gamespot RE: backwards compatibility, which seemed to be a lot less pointed than this article - it showed screenshots and how many of the games not on the official MS list worked anyway, but I certainly do find this article more filfilling in that it addresses the real issue: Gamers want the games we play to work, not crap games from the EB clearance bin. Once all of the xbox games I own are BC, then I will buy a 360, with part of the proceeds from the sale of my origional xbox.
 
[quote name='sying']That is one green chart. I think we should temper our expectations about BC. All of the games are not going to be BC in a day. Its going to take some time.[/QUOTE]

we're coming up on a year, MS *promised* all the "populare" titles would be BC, we knew that was BS but they claimed the impossible

They failed to live up to their OWN promise, as usual for MS
 
I love how much the 360 backwards compatibility improves old games. I actually have a collection of Xbox games I'm waiting for backwards compatibility to play on Xbox 360.

In a way Xbox 360 backwards compatibility is better than any previous console because of how much it improves the old games. Still I think they've really disappointed on the quantity of games which are backwards compatible. When they initially unveiled that list of 200+ games that were backwards compatible I thought we would be getting huge lists like that every few months. Instead we are getting only a small handful of games every few months. At the current rate they are going it will take 5 years just to get 50% backwards compatibility.

It's pretty pathetic when you have developers pleading for their games to be made BC on their websites. Microsoft definitely needs to come up with a better/faster way to get the old Xbox games working. They keep saying they have their "top people" working on BC, but I don't think enough people are really working on it. If it's too difficult for MS they should invite outside parties in to help them get more games BC at a faster rate.
 
[quote name='Maddgief']There's a big problem with this logic- one that I've only discovered by recently buying my first PS2.

There are a great many games that were on the PS1 that were the first in a series (MGS being a prime example). If the PS2 didn't have BC, then I would have never been able to play it and really understand the characters. Additionally, there are great classics from the PS1 (Chrono Trigger comes to mind) that I would never have experienced without BC? Is your response 'You should buy a PS1 or Super Nintendo if you want to play the old games?'

If Nintendo and Sony can figure out BC, why can't MS?[/QUOTE]

Give MS the same conditions and they'll do it just fine. Microsoft had no choice but to go to a completely different hardware design to create a machine that wouldn't be plagued by the Xbox's cost issues.

I'd hardly give Nintendo any big credit here. Until Wii they've NEVER produced a backward compatible console. The economics of ROM cartridges worked against it. GameBoys have been backward compatible but the GameBoy Color was the first real upgrade to that platform from a developer's perspective. Earlier models only improved the screen or reduced the bulk. Otherwise it was the same platform for ten years. The GBC was a subtle upgrade that limited itself for the sake of retaining compatibility at low cost. It wasn't until the GBA that Nintendo had to accomodate existing games on an almost completely different machine. Even then, they had full access tot he GameBoy IP, so they could add custom circuitry to help enable the process. By the time the GBA launched the original GameBoy was almost 12 years old and emulating it was not a big deal, anymore than it for MAME to run 1981 arcade games on a 1996 era PC.

It's a far different thing for the xbox 360 to run Xbox software. The Xbox is a far most complex machine and not that out of date compared to many emulation targets. A lot of emulators benefit from sheer CPU brute force to make up the load of converting the binary to compatible instructions in real-time. This would be impossible on the Xbox-Xbox 360 combination. The games have to operate at the spec of the Xbox, not a slowish PC as was acceptable for VirtualPC on the Mac.

So part of the process is to translate as much of the code in advance and use that file to make the game somewhat native to the 360. This is why each Xbox game requires an individual download the first time it is run on the 360. If Microsoft's task was to run games from a machine that launched a decade or longer ago, like the N64 or SNES, no problem. If you want to do the PS2, GameCube, or Xbox in software, you're talking about a much harder goal.

Actually, it would easier for MS if it was the PS2 or GameCube games they were trying to run. The PS2 is more resource limited and uses much lower clock rates all around. While it doesn't lack for complexity those issues would still make it an easier emulation target. The GameCube, being PPC-based, would potentially be doable in real-time on the Xbox 360. But obvious issues of ownership insure that will never happen.
 
[quote name='expane']we're coming up on a year, MS *promised* all the "populare" titles would be BC, we knew that was BS but they claimed the impossible

They failed to live up to their OWN promise, as usual for MS[/QUOTE]

I don't recall them offering a completion date for that goal. It's been a bit over seven months since launch. Plenty can happen over the next year.
 
[quote name='cool8man']The oddest thing about this chart is that there is no difference between the percentage of top 250 and top 300 games. Does that mean that # 250-300 of the top ranked games are all backwards compatible or did CheapyD screw up when making this chart?[/quote]

Not an error...just a coincidence

Top 300
BC: 82 (27% BC)
Not BC: 218


Top 250
BC: 67 (27% BC)
Not BC: 183
 
I think the issue is that MS made it difficult for themselves by promising BC on a console that was going to be signifigantly different from it's predecessor. The chose to pick hardware structure that was going to make the feature damn near impossible to fully implement and then promised it anyway just because they knew Sony and Nintendo were on that track and that it helped sell systems for them. Kutaragi promised bacwards compatability from the begining of the PS1 and made good on it within 98% instantly, People saw how cool it could be to play PS one PS2 and dump their old/malfunctioning systems for new hardware which helped sell it to the masses now they clearly aim to do it again on the PS3 and with the Wii and it's massive library of over 20 years of games the 360 will get left in the dust without it. I have no sympathy they made the job hard for themselves knowing what they were up against... "I say, let 'em crash!"

Also while Nintendo hasn't officially offered real BC on anything but the GBA up to this point there are still the converters that have been made for each of their cart based systems that have instantly doubled the size of each systems library, whether it be GB, GBA or NES games it's still been possible to play games from other platforms over the years (infact I think before the Gamecube and it's disk format the only cart adapter that didnt get made by nintendo or some other unofficial third party was NES/SNES to N64).
 
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