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Knoell

Member Since 07 Oct 2009
Offline Last Active Nov 24 2018 01:49 PM
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Posts I've Made

In Topic: Black Teen Shot, Killed By Neighborhood Watch

26 July 2013 - 07:24 PM

Well on what notion do people presume he tried to detain him?

 

This guy said in a call to cops about someone else suspicious ''I don't want to approach him''  

When following to give instructions, he kept a fair distance.

He PASSED a lie detector test about the incident

It wouldn't look good if you were told by cops to stop following and you then tried to illegally detain someone

 

It just doesn't add up.  It's possible but certainly not proven he tried to find out where this guy had gone. But detain him?  Especially somebody quite taller than him?  It's simply people's imagination running wild.

 

On the same notion that you presume that Martin attacked him. You don't know, therefore it could have happened like that.

 

If you can't see that the fight could have occurred because Zimmerman tried to hold him up, then you need to take a step back because you are assuming just like the people that assumed Zimmerman followed him to shoot him.


In Topic: Black Teen Shot, Killed By Neighborhood Watch

26 July 2013 - 06:34 PM

I wasn't aware the courts used Webster's Dictionary for charging people with crimes. All these years of law school they taught me to rely on statutory and common law, are you telling me they were wrong?!?!

Even someone with half a brain would realize there's a problem with your definition. PREMEDITATION is not the only element of the crime of murder. In most jurisdictions it's not even a required element for first degree murder provided that the murder occurred during the commission of a violent felony. The defining characteristic of 2nd degree murder in most jurisdictions is that it is a murder that occurs without the element of premeditation. So please, by all means regale us with your broad knowledge of copying and pasting dictionary definitions as a debate tactic instead of perhaps deferring to someone who has actual law training. Thanks for arguing for the sake of arguing.

 

I wasn't aware that the person you were responding to was even referring to court definitions in particular.

 

I believe he was trying to make a point about the negative connotations of murderer, and that he was trying to get around to the fact that unless you are convicted of the crime of murder as defined by the law, then you are not a murderer. People knowingly use the term, because they like the negative aspect of it.

 

I don't think we disagree here, I was just being snippy because you were being snippy with him.

 

But for the hell of it let's just ask you one time: Post verdict, is Zimmerman a murderer? The answer is technically No. Dictionary not required.


In Topic: Black Teen Shot, Killed By Neighborhood Watch

26 July 2013 - 09:13 AM

Technically speaking, yes.  By pleading self-defense you're making a justification defense which means you're effectively saying that you did kill the person but you were justified in doing so.

 

But please, by all means, go on with whatever point you plan on making instead of beating around the bush.

 

mur·der  
/ˈmərdər/
 
Noun
The unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another.
 
Verb
Kill (someone) unlawfully and with premeditation.

 

Technically no, especially when you are acquitted of all charges. He did not murder, he killed in self defense. Who needs words and their definitions though. Murderer sounds much worse!

 

But regardless all that is pointless, the people who think that Zimmerman started something with Martin all believe Zimmerman is a murderer, and the people who think that Martin attacked Zimmerman all believe that Zimmerman acted in self defense.

 

Did Zimmerman deserve to get jumped? Probably not. Did Martin deserve to be detained? Absolutely not. Could both have happened? Could neither have happened? With all the evidence the Prosecution presented, you still cannot possibly say you know what happened, which is why he was acquitted.

 

It is as simple as that. People need to start moving on.


In Topic: Black Teen Shot, Killed By Neighborhood Watch

25 July 2013 - 07:27 PM

Hey remember that story from awhile back about the mother who claimed that two black teenagers shot her infant dead in an attempted robbery? Remember how all the usual suspects here on CAG and most of right-wing media were claiming that this wasn't getting nearly enough media attention as the TM/GZ shooting and that the story was being covered up by the "liberal media"? Remember how everyone was calling for the heads of the two teenagers who carried out this heinous crime? Weeeeeeeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllllllllll:

 

http://www.addicting...wo-black-teens/

 

Nope but I do remember when I brought up a more comparable story where the alleged "murderer" was not even touched when he defended himself and he was still acquitted.

 

There is a glaring difference where the white kid was actually doing something wrong in the first place. But I didn't see anyone jumping to his aid that he didn't deserve to die for breaking into cars. No marches in the street saying that the "murderer" should have waited in the house until police came. No speech from Obama saying "that could have been him".

 

http://www.decodedsc...of-murder/33569

 

New York: Tougher gun laws, tougher self defense laws. Still acquitted.

 


In Topic: Black Teen Shot, Killed By Neighborhood Watch

23 July 2013 - 02:41 AM

You know what I find odd? The fact that no one here made that argument. Cause...you know...maybe you should address that point with those that did.

 

"Child" or not, you're still putting the burden on a 17 year old kid to be more responsible than a 29 year old adult with MMA and CCW training. Facts are a bitch like that.

 

Actually they did make that argument.

 

Your post further underlines that Zimmerman should have been quite responsible. So where is the X factor? All of the evidence does not seem as if he were looking to kill someone, it looks as if he was trying to aid police. So what happened? Did he try to detain Martin? Did Martin attack him? Only he knows and there was only evidence to reinforce his claims, therefore he was acquitted.

 

We are going in circles though. I am starting to wonder if they should lock this thread? Or have the moderators completely abandoned VS?