Arrested for Rapping in Public?

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Rap Rap For Florida Man
Arrested for singing profane lyrics within earshot of children

FEBRUARY 5--A 19-year-old man was arrested Sunday night for singing the lyrics to a profane rap song as he walked on a Florida street. Christopher Holder was nabbed after a woman complained to police that her two children (ages five and 14) heard Holder repeatedly reciting the words "mother fucker," according to a Hernando County Sheriff's Office report, a copy of which you'll find here. When questioned by deputies, Holder "immediately began arguing that he did nothing wrong," and explained that he was merely covering a song by Louisiana rapper Lil' Boosie, whose most recent album, "Bad Azz," includes cuts like "My $$$$a" and "fuck You." But Holder, pictured in the below mug shot, added that he "agreed that he did not believe children needed to hear language such as that being hollered down the road." Holder was charged with disorderly conduct, a misdemeanor.
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Really? Ok, even if it's distasteful to say 'bad' words around kids (which I think is total BS), did he really need to get arrested for it? Geez, it's not like he intentfully waited for the woman & her kids to show up just to shout profanities at them. He was in a public street. Discuss amongst yourselves. I'm feeling ver-klempt.

bb95a612wq1.jpg
 
This reminds me of the time I was at a restaurant with one of my more.....sociopathic friends. He was swearing quite a bit, and we were sitting right near a mother and her six children, ages 4-7. I kept getting dirty looks from her, so I finally said to my friend, "Easy on the cursing, alright, there's a ton of little kids next to you." He looked at me akwardly, then turned to the table of children and yelled "fuck SHIT BITCH ASS BASTARD MOTHERfuckER!" Then he continued eating like nothing happened.

I don't see him much anymore.
 
Hmm...

I really don't like 'Lil Boosie, but I don't see the point of the guy getting arrested. Chances are, both of the kids have heard those words tons of times before. I think the parent bitching had more to do with the arrest than the actual act.

The fact that they heard it has nothing to do with the guy, you are obviously a bad parent. You should've been there to cover their ears . :roll:
 
[quote name='Sofa King Kool']This reminds me of the time I was at a restaurant with one of my more.....sociopathic friends. He was swearing quite a bit, and we were sitting right near a mother and her six children, ages 4-7. I kept getting dirty looks from her, so I finally said to my friend, "Easy on the cursing, alright, there's a ton of little kids next to you." He looked at me akwardly, then turned to the table of children and yelled "fuck SHIT BITCH ASS BASTARD MOTHERfuckER!" Then he continued eating like nothing happened.

I don't see him much anymore.[/quote]

:rofl: That story is all sorts of win and also sig worthy.

Also I think the man should have been asked to stop, but not nessecarially arrested.
 
Seriously though...you shouldn't be swearing in front of children. I wouldn't want my 5 year old hearing that shit...
 
[quote name='Sofa King Kool']This reminds me of the time I was at a restaurant with one of my more.....sociopathic friends. He was swearing quite a bit, and we were sitting right near a mother and her six children, ages 4-7. I kept getting dirty looks from her, so I finally said to my friend, "Easy on the cursing, alright, there's a ton of little kids next to you." He looked at me akwardly, then turned to the table of children and yelled "fuck SHIT BITCH ASS BASTARD MOTHERfuckER!" Then he continued eating like nothing happened.

I don't see him much anymore.[/QUOTE]
How does that make your friend a sociopath?

It sounds like he has objective-defiant disorder.
 
I think context plays a part.

I mean if this guy was acting like a thug like the gangsta rappers do in the rap videos and agressively staring ppl down while he yelled offensive things at them, I don't think he can duck behind the whole "it's just a song" defense when the police show up. A threat is a threat.

If the guy was just mumbling lyrics to himself though - is it such a big deal? It's the price of a free society, I mean, I've got to deal with all that crappy christmas music at least once a year.
 
[quote name='camoor']I think context plays a part.

I mean if this guy was acting like a thug like the gangsta rappers do in the rap videos and agressively staring ppl down while he yelled offensive things at them, I don't think he can duck behind the whole "it's just a song" defense when the police show up. A threat is a threat.

If the guy was just mumbling lyrics to himself though - is it such a big deal? It's the price of a free society, I mean, I've got to deal with all that crappy christmas music at least once a year.[/quote]

That second paragraph sums up my feelings exactly. If I find Christmas Music offensive can I then call the cops on people singing it? Of Course I can't.
 
[quote name='Brak']How does that make your friend a sociopath?

It sounds like he has objective-defiant disorder.[/quote]

He probably has both. I wouldn't be surprised at all. He's a pretty strange person; always has been.

I'm looking at the diagnostic criteria for both sociopathy and objective-defiant disorder right now. He fits both descriptions almost flawlessly.
 
[quote name='camoor']I think context plays a part.

I mean if this guy was acting like a thug like the gangsta rappers do in the rap videos and agressively staring ppl down while he yelled offensive things at them, I don't think he can duck behind the whole "it's just a song" defense when the police show up. A threat is a threat.

If the guy was just mumbling lyrics to himself though - is it such a big deal? It's the price of a free society, I mean, I've got to deal with all that crappy christmas music at least once a year.[/quote]

Agreed. And, as mykevermin pointed out, it sets a really messed up precedent.
 
Wow. Talk about a Constitutional Rights violation. I agree, he shouldn't be saying those words in front of children but he does have the right to speak. An apology should have sufficed.
 
Here's another one, Abercrombie & Fitch ads seized from a Virginia store for allegedly violating "obscenity laws". Of course after the public outroar, all charges were dropped.

Posters of scantily clad youths that were seized by police at an Abercrombie & Fitch store in a Virginia mall this weekend may be inappropriate for young children, but they are not obscene, according to legal experts.
Virginia Beach police apparently have agreed. On Monday, they dropped charges against the clothing company that markets to prep chic teens through sexually charged imagery.
The window displays went up in 363 stores across the country in mid-January, including the Lynnhaven Mall in Virginia Beach.
One of the posters showed three shirtless young men, one with his upper buttocks revealed. The second one revealed a woman's breast with all but the nipples.
Was the police response to the store an overreaction? Yes, according to legal experts. Though local laws can vary, courts require that the image show sexual activity or a "lewd display" of genitals, says Lawrence Walters, an Orlando, Fla., lawyer and First Amendment specialist.
"There is not a chance any jury in America would find the photo obscene under these standards," he said.
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http://www.abcnews.go.com/Business/IndustryInfo/story?id=4240514&page=1

Here's an idea - if you don't like the ads, don't go in the store and buy tshirts that cost 60 dollars.
 
[quote name='Xevious']Seriously though...you shouldn't be swearing in front of children. I wouldn't want my 5 year old hearing that shit...[/quote]
And by the way, your kids will know all the curse words by the time they're in second grade. Get over it. And besides, having them hear a curse word is not going to make your kid any less of a good person. That's just a misinterpretation of reality on your part so can continue to say, 'Awww my kid is just so gosh darn innocent.'

Do I swear in front of my younger brother? No. If someone else on the street is doing it, well the world is what it is and by trampling on someone else's freedom of speech "in the name of the children" might just make you an asshole.
 
[quote name='camoor']Here's another one, Abercrombie & Fitch ads seized from a Virginia store for allegedly violating "obscenity laws". Of course after the public outroar, all charges were dropped.



http://www.abcnews.go.com/Business/IndustryInfo/story?id=4240514&page=1

Here's an idea - if you don't like the ads, don't go in the store and buy tshirts that cost 60 dollars.[/quote]

That is funny because I live in this area. Before this happened, my wife and I were in a mall in Norfolk and saw the exact Abercrombie ads that were the subject of the complaint in Virginia Beach. I turned to my wife and said, "Someone is going to complain about these things" and not two days later the story about the Lynnhaven Mall complaints came out.

While I don't agree that the A&F ads are obscene in any way, they do this shit on purpose just to get the free publicity. Just like their catalog a few years ago that had caused such an uproar.
 
[quote name='Zen Davis']And by the way, your kids will know all the curse words by the time they're in second grade. Get over it. And besides, having them hear a curse word is not going to make your kid any less of a good person. That's just a misinterpretation of reality on your part so can continue to say, 'Awww my kid is just so gosh darn innocent.'

Do I swear in front of my younger brother? No. If someone else on the street is doing it, well the world is what it is and by trampling on someone else's freedom of speech "in the name of the children" might just make you an asshole.[/QUOTE]

well if that makes him an asshole, than consider me one as well. it is more of a respect issue to me than anything, i wouldn't go as far as calling the police on someone cursing in the street or anything, but if you see small children around, i think you should watch what you say. young children are prone to saying stuff they hear like this since they dont know what it means. i know when i was in 1st grade i had someone tell me some words like this and i said them without knowing what they meant and offended people. yes i curse, and i do it a lot, but out in public it is a little difficult for parents, especially of multiple children to keep all of them from hearing it. what should they do? keep them at home all the time and home school them? once they learn a little better when they are older, if they hear it and still feel the need to say it, so be it. when they are young like that though, i do not feel they should be subjected to that kind of language and the parents should not be forced to keep them at home so that the children dont hear and repeat it.
 
My god, if all the people who sung profane rap lyrics in NYC were arrested, the train would be nearly empty on my way home.

And I've never understood why cursing is so horrible. It can't be in the meaning. fuck means to have sex with, no? Is sex so frowned upon? Okay, given, a 5 year old shouldn't be all too educated about sex, but still...
 
LOL at all the people talking about this being a freedom of speech issue. FYI, the first amendment has limits. It is not there to protect your right to drop f-bombs in public. Many local governments have laws against swearing in public and generally these laws are NOT found to be unconstitutional.

Usually I side with people who say parents should do a better job raising their kids but in this case, I gotta say that people should show a little respect for others. How hard is it to shut your mouth and not swear when little kids are around? Sure, they're going to learn the words eventually but preschoolers swearing like drunken sailors isn't cute, its just sad and depressing.
 
[quote name='linkpwns']My god, if all the people who sung profane rap lyrics in NYC were arrested, the train would be nearly empty on my way home.

And I've never understood why cursing is so horrible. It can't be in the meaning. fuck means to have sex with, no? Is sex so frowned upon? Okay, given, a 5 year old shouldn't be all too educated about sex, but still...[/quote]

That is only a more recent useage of the word. If I remember correctly it was just made up to be a rebelious word that was put on T-shirts for some protest and it took off.
 
[quote name='darthbudge']That is only a more recent useage of the word. If I remember correctly it was just made up to be a rebelious word that was put on T-shirts for some protest and it took off.[/quote]

More power to my point then, eh?
 
[quote name='IAmTheBiggestInuyashaFan']well if that makes him an asshole, than consider me one as well. it is more of a respect issue to me than anything, i wouldn't go as far as calling the police on someone cursing in the street or anything, but if you see small children around, i think you should watch what you say. young children are prone to saying stuff they hear like this since they dont know what it means. i know when i was in 1st grade i had someone tell me some words like this and i said them without knowing what they meant and offended people. yes i curse, and i do it a lot, but out in public it is a little difficult for parents, especially of multiple children to keep all of them from hearing it. what should they do? keep them at home all the time and home school them? once they learn a little better when they are older, if they hear it and still feel the need to say it, so be it. when they are young like that though, i do not feel they should be subjected to that kind of language and the parents should not be forced to keep them at home so that the children dont hear and repeat it.[/quote]
I read the first sentence and then stopped. You apparently have no idea that 'protecting the children' should be no excuse for deteriorating the rights of the spoken word when in all reality, all it does is use children as an excuse for low-key fascism.

And the notion that a kid can someone how manage to be 'subjected' to cursing is asinine, as if it some horrible burden placed onto them. You can subject kids to violence and bullying, but you can't subject them to random cursing on the street that isn't aimed at them in the first place.

As an example and role model, I don't curse in front of my brother. But that won't stop me from throwing on Stand By Me for him, even with all the cursing that film because you can't bubble wrap kids.

How would you like it if you stubbed your toe or shin against something in the mall and said, "Shit", and the next thing you know mall security is waiting for the cops to arrest you for disorderly conduct because a kid and his mom heard you say the curse word? Essentially this was the same thing.

[MEDIA]http://youtube.com/watch?v=ORrnnb-FlOw[/MEDIA]
[MEDIA]http://youtube.com/watch?v=Mg7u33y45W8[/MEDIA]
 
[quote name='Machine']LOL at all the people talking about this being a freedom of speech issue. FYI, the first amendment has limits. It is not there to protect your right to drop f-bombs in public. Many local governments have laws against swearing in public and generally these laws are NOT found to be unconstitutional.

Usually I side with people who say parents should do a better job raising their kids but in this case, I gotta say that people should show a little respect for others. How hard is it to shut your mouth and not swear when little kids are around? Sure, they're going to learn the words eventually but preschoolers swearing like drunken sailors isn't cute, its just sad and depressing.[/quote]

I basically agree with Zen Davis on this, especially his line about using children as an excuse for low-key fascism.

They arrested the man. It doesn't take much to realize that being arrested is a humiliating and degrading experience, and this kind of escalation by state representatives should not be taken lightly. In DC they have arrested people for eating a candybar on the metro or talking too loud on the cellphone. These are all instances where a stern warning or at the most a stiff fine would have sufficed.

I agree that there is an issue of basic manners here. But as a free society we shouldn't legislate manners, it's unconstitutional and besides it would likely backfire in a spectacular manner.
 
The cop would of let him off easy if the individual apologized and shown remorse. If his "intent" was to curse and cuss in front of other children, then he deserved to be arrested without a doubt. He was cursing in public, obviously he was bound to run into children listening to his foul language.

If I was the cop, I would of arrested his ass too. Why teach kids bad words, its not like the society is getting any better.
 
[quote name='beguile']The cop would of let him off easy if the individual apologized and shown remorse. If his "intent" was to curse and cuss in front of other children, then he deserved to be arrested without a doubt. He was cursing in public, obviously he was bound to run into children listening to his foul language.

If I was the cop, I would of arrested his ass too. Why teach kids bad words, its not like the society is getting any better.[/quote]

Teach kids bad words? Hell they are going to learn them in a few years anyways, whether it be by accident or someone tells them on purpose. I rather have my kid (when it comes to that day) say a couple of bad words then pick up a gun or so. Damn people act like the world is perfect and teach their kids that if they don't do this this or this nothing bad will ever happen. The world is a place that is not perfect, words are not the problem but actions are.

This is a clear violation of first amendment rights, and day by day our rights are being protected, thanks to all of those who are doing so, but at the same time we have people who say we can't hear or see this and that. As if they don't exsist out there. Why lie about this stuff just to find out that they all learn it anyways. Parents need to enforce what they think is good and bad to their own kids, to ignore some things and accept others, but at the same time teach them it all.

I hope all the people who say this isn't a violation of rights get arrested for something similar to this, when it comes to freedom of speech and such. That way they'll know how it feels.
 
My daughter is 3 and she says "shit" everytime she drops something or if something does not go her way. I blame her mother...hehe
Kids will learn curse words from other kids, parents slip-ups and even TV. I dont think we need grown-ups swearing down the street. I like Lil Boosie (and DJ Drama) but I wouldnt play it in my car with my family. The guy that got arrested probably rang his mouth to the cops or disrespected the mother. He even said he thought it wasn't right to do in front of kids.
 
[quote name='strikeratt']Teach kids bad words? Hell they are going to learn them in a few years anyways, whether it be by accident or someone tells them on purpose. I rather have my kid (when it comes to that day) say a couple of bad words then pick up a gun or so.
[/quote]

Woah, back up a bit. Where the fuck is cursing related to the kids using a gun?

I agree, wholeheartedly, that this is a violation of our rights by the First Amendment, but really?

That's a bit extreme, no?
 
[quote name='daphatty']Wow. Talk about a Constitutional Rights violation. I agree, he shouldn't be saying those words in front of children but he does have the right to speak. An apology should have sufficed.[/quote]

You don't have the right to engage in disorderly conduct though. I would imagine that overrides his "right" to curse in public.

That being said, I don't think an arrest was necessary unless he continued to be beligerent.
 
[quote name='GuilewasNK']You don't have the right to engage in disorderly conduct though, I would imagine that overrides his right to curse in public.

That being said, I don't think an arrest was necessary unless he continued to be beligerent.[/quote]

Yes, probably the best way to put it. If he was told to stop, and his response was "fuck That!" then yes, an Arrest would have been necessary.
 
i dont think the cursing is as bad if the parents know how to handle it. my parents let me see R-rated movies with plenty of cursing but they always told me to never use those words. Guess what? In front of them, i never did. You cant shield your kids from everything but you can at least set some boundaries.
 
Good. Not only do I not want to hear your overdriven music coming from your headphones, I certainly don't want to hear you singing along to it.
 
[quote name='CocheseUGA']Good. Not only do I not want to hear your overdriven music coming from your headphones, I certainly don't want to hear you singing along to it.[/QUOTE]


Thank you. Keep that crap away from kids and keep it someplace where people want to hear that garbage.

I have the foulest mouth that I know but I don't have the right to subject other peoples kids to it. I don't care if they hear it other places or not. It's not my right to make that call.
 
[quote name='Blitz']I have the foulest mouth that I know but I don't have the right to subject other peoples kids to it. I don't care if they hear it other places or not. It's not my right to make that call.[/quote]

Thank you for being logical and thoughtful about the situation. All it takes is a little tact and that isn't much to ask. Most everyone drops an f-bomb from time to time, we all are human, but time and place make a difference. Some people just don't see the difference between watching the game with friends at home and the checkout line at McDonalds. All they think about is themselves and using freedom of speech in the most ass way possible.
 
And what about the argument that videogames should be censored because they may contain things that kid shouldn't see? You all ought to agree with that notion then if you agree that people shouldn't curse out in public since kids could hear and people should be arrested over it.

The Mass Effect thing on Fox News is right down the same alley as this line of thinking.
 
Zen,

There is a difference here. A video game can be labled mature, and then its the parents responsibilty to make the call. Same with porn, same with other movies.

I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to swear. I'm not going to comment on the guy getting arrested (though, my gut says he shouldn't).

When I was 21, I was one of those guys who swore everywhere. Now, 8 years later, I think it's sort of stupid. You should be able to go out and be a decent member of society in places where kids frequent. It isn't that they have never heard the words before, it's just that it's decent for society. I'd like to be able to go places and not have to listen to fuck you everywhere I go. If you stub your toe, that's one thing. I'm talking about the jackass walking down the street every other work being fuck, for no logical reason other than its cool.

Let's be honest. There are things that have their place. We all masterbate. But, if I see a hot chick at the mall, I can't just rip it out right there, i have to wait to get home. Drinking beer is perfectly legal (if your 21), but you usually don't walk around the mall cracking a 12 pack.

There is a time and a place. I think it applies to swearing as well.
 
[quote name='Zen Davis']And what about the argument that videogames should be censored because they may contain things that kid shouldn't see? You all ought to agree with that notion then if you agree that people shouldn't curse out in public since kids could hear and people should be arrested over it.

The Mass Effect thing on Fox News is right down the same alley as this line of thinking.[/quote]

The only problem is this...

Games clearly have their content listed and labeled according to content. People can gravitate to away from them based on the ratings.

People do not have ratings. You don't know who or what you are dealing with until they open their mouths.
 
[quote name='GuilewasNK']The only problem is this...

Games clearly have their content listed and labeled according to content. People can gravitate to away from them based on the ratings.

People do not have ratings. You don't know who or what you are dealing with until they open their mouths.[/quote]
That doesn't make the fact that people rate games as being for kids by default any less ignorant than what you guys are talking about. You're fitting snugly on the same road as them, even if you don't live in the same house.

The bottom line is not whether the guy should say curses in front of kids (and I personally don't curse in front of kids), it's whether the guy should have been arrested.

And the fact is that he shouldn't have. The 'think of the children' argument is bullshit and has been since the beginning of time.

[quote name='lordxixor101']I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to swear. I'm not going to comment on the guy getting arrested (though, my gut says he shouldn't).
[/quote]
I just think it's a bad standard to start deciding what people can say and what they can't, regardless of whether children are in the room and goes in further eroding the liberties of our country. It gets worse if people start getting thrown in jail over it. People should be allowed to express themselves with whatever words they want, regardless of how tactless or stupid you and I think it is. This isn't Iran and this isn't communist Russia. Over there the notion of religion is used to block language and ideas that shouldn't be discussed. Over here, it's the idea of protecting the children.

Seriously, what are you protecting them from? I keep hearing that kids don't need to be hearing that kind of language and I ask why not as long as the parents are willing to set boundries for them in what they can and cannot say at home. I'm sure each and every single one of you cursed and kids and now you guys can't handle it anymore.
 
[quote name='Zen Davis']The bottom line is not whether the guy should say curses in front of kids (and I personally don't curse in front of kids), it's whether the guy should have been arrested.

And the fact is that he shouldn't have. [/quote]

If that is all you are saying, I said that myself a few posts back. I don't think getting the law involved in every little thing is in the best interests of anyone.
 
As a 22-year-old with a pretty filthy mouth, I agree with everyone who said this guy should not have been doing this knowing there were kids around. It's just how it is, whether you think the kids know the words or not. What gives you the right to teach kids cuss words that their parents probably don't want them knowing?

Also, obviously, the guy should not have been arrested.
 
[quote name='GuilewasNK'] I don't think getting the law involved in every little thing is in the best interests of anyone.[/quote]

But....but.....think of the lawyers!! :cry: :cry: :cry:

Seriously though, it does set a dangerious precedent. Other than clear and present danger (Yelling "FIRE" in a crowded theatre where people could get hurt) exception, I find little value in carving out more, including hate speech.

It reminds me of that Jewish lawyer who defended the KKK guy when he got arrested for hate speech. People asked him how he could defend such a racist prick and he pretty much responded that by protecting this racist Asshole's freedom of speech, he is protecting everyone's. This is very true, though a bit too lofty for many to understand.

Regarding obscenity, the USSC uses a "I know it when I see it" approach, which is VERY VERY anti-free speech, leaves too much room for discretion and cuts against western ideals of civil liberty.

NOTE: Just the opinions of a looney left liberal.
 
I never understood why certain syllables when spoken together to create a word that society, for whatever reason, has deemed it a curse word, can be inherintly bad for children? ZOMG wont someone think of the children!
 
Stupid.

And to your friend who yelled that stuff at the kids behind you?

I have a similar story. At a restaurant, a family with 2 kids was sitting behind me and a friend. The kids would keep kicking the seat, standing up in it. I asked, nicely, for the mother to tell the kids to stop. Well she didn't do anything, so every time I felt a hit on the back of my seat, I'd say fuck. After awhile, I heard the kids start making a sort of song out of fuck and I knew my work was done.

Enjoy that one, parents.
 
[quote name='rabbitt']I'm more concerned with exposing kids to shitty music at such a young age.[/QUOTE]

:lol: I was just about to post something similar.
 
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